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Re: [liturgy-l] non-Christians and Church services

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  • +Magdalen/Thomas
    This is a common practice on Guam [and the Commonwealth of Micronesia]. For about one year (in the early nineties) the Episcopalian Priests conducted these
    Message 1 of 13 , Sep 1, 2004
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      This is a common practice on Guam [and the Commonwealth of Micronesia]. For
      about one year (in the early nineties) the Episcopalian Priests conducted
      these weddings in our churches there
      [3 ECUSA**] and then with some sanity and moral re-grouping decided to only
      conduct them in the many Five Star Hotel Chapels. And then the Bishop for
      the Armed Forces, with oversight of unincorporated territories, decided to
      but a stop to the practice; thus ended ECUSA's participation. Now pastors
      with cracker box ordinations (Universalist Life et.al.) have a lucrative
      business.

      It rather makes a mockery of all things Christian; as to entertainment and
      dramatic presentation... it isn't liturgy and it's bad acting.

      [**The fees were placed in a Mission & Building funds > the "independents"
      pay their mortgages and take long vacations in Bali or Manila.]

      +Thomas


      "There is only one Christ, Jesus, one faith.
      All else is a dispute over trifles."
      HM Queen Elizabeth I
      ================================
      ================================
      ----- Original Message -----
      From: Thomas R. Jackson <thomas@...>
      To: <liturgy-l@yahoogroups.com>
      Sent: Wednesday, September 01, 2004 11:11 AM
      Subject: [liturgy-l] non-Christians and Church services


      > though not related to anything we're talking about recently, in the past
      we
      > we have talked about who should receive Christian liturgies. This came to
      > mind today when I heard a radio report on weddings in Japan. Although
      only
      > 1% pf the population is Christian, this report claimed that 60% of the
      > weddings were in Churches. Apparently it is part of the Japanese
      continued
      > fascination with all things Western. The report went on to say that this
      > is a big business in Japan, and commercial wedding chapels will go to the
      > trouble of importing all the furnishings, pews, bibles and all, of English
      > churches to give the right ambience. Apparently some have also gone to
      the
      > trouble of hiring Anglican priests to conduct the services. The one they
      > interviewed said he considered this a form of missionary work.
      >
      > Just passing the information on. Perhaps others know more on the topic.
      >
      > Thomas R. Jackson.
    • cantor03@aol.com
      In a message dated 8/31/04 11:12:12 PM Eastern Daylight Time, thomas@laudasion.org writes: Just passing the information on. Perhaps others know more on the
      Message 2 of 13 , Sep 1, 2004
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        In a message dated 8/31/04 11:12:12 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
        thomas@... writes:
        Just passing the information on. Perhaps others know more on the topic.

        Thomas R. Jackson.

        When I was in Japan a few years ago, I was told that the Japanese use a
        cafeteria approach to religious events. I think the majority are
        simultaneously
        Shinto, with its strong ancestor worship aspects, AND Buddhist, so they are
        quite used to this dual membership idea already. Thus, infant rites may be
        at the Shinto Shrine, and, say, funerals at the Buddhist Temple. The craze
        for
        Western weddings was obvious, and the white bridal gown industry was already
        big business.

        One surprising aspect of all of this was a surprisingly evangelistic Buddhism.
        For example, the major Buddhist Shrines in Kyoto, the old Imperial Capital,
        were dubbed for Western tourists "Westminster" and "Eastminster." While
        they were each spectacular examples of Japanese architecture, my little
        Western tour group was stunned by the rather aggressive invitations at both
        complexes to return the next morning for their Buddhist services, which to
        make them palatable to Westerners they called a "Mass."

        However, from what I learned then and have read, the Japanese really
        worship Japan: the culture, the people, the arts, the wildlife, the landscape,
        etc., etc. Formal religion is secondary to this patriophilia. They are very
        xenophobic. In the end it must be very difficult for Western missionaries
        to break through this.

        David Strang.


        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • James Morgan
        Ah, Jerome the curmudgeon! Love that guy! Rdr.James Olympia, WA ... From: Christian McConnell [mailto:cdmcconnell@yahoo.com] Sent: Tuesday, August 31, 2004
        Message 3 of 13 , Sep 1, 2004
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          Ah, Jerome the curmudgeon! Love that guy!

          Rdr.James
          Olympia, WA

          -----Original Message-----
          From: Christian McConnell [mailto:cdmcconnell@...]
          Sent: Tuesday, August 31, 2004 7:55 PM
          To: liturgy-l@yahoogroups.com
          Subject: [liturgy-l] luxury was Re: SBH

          --- In liturgy-l@yahoogroups.com, "James Morgan" <rdrjames@c...> wrote:
          > Dear Scott:
          >
          > Makes you think, huh?
          >
          > And why do some Orthodeox bishops (they know who they are!) require
          mansions
          > and gold plated dinnerware, while some other Orthodox bishops live in
          > apartments and get plain stuff? And frequently cook their own meals?
          >
          > But I won't air our laundry in public anymore! Makes me wonder about
          > priorities, however.

          'Twas ever thus. I recall coming across an anecdote in my research --
          I wish I could recall where -- which a Spanish early Church writer
          told. Apparently there was a bishop who was fond of luxury, and took
          not one, but two baths every day. When asked why, he said "Because
          you people don't leave me enough time for three."

          And issues like this are when Jerome's the most fun to read ...

          Chris
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