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Re: [liturgy-l] Individual cups

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  • john19@unidial.com
    ... glasses placed in a tray container as one leaves the altar area and then disposed of by the altar guild women. Plastic or glass, and Sr Kati already knows
    Message 1 of 56 , Jul 2, 2004
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      >
      >We have gotten out of the washing with the use of disposable plastic
      glasses placed in a tray container as one leaves the altar area and
      then disposed of by the altar guild women.

      Plastic or glass, and Sr Kati already knows my position on this, they still

      contain remnants of the Blood of Christ and ought be disposed of
      reverently.

      John Dornheim
    • Frank Senn
      What you are saying is, perform (pray) the script as though you feel (believe) it. In acting this is called Method, and its leading practioner just died.
      Message 56 of 56 , Jul 7, 2004
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        What you are saying is, perform (pray) the script as though you feel (believe) it. In acting this is called "Method," and its leading practioner just died. It wouldn't hurt if liturgists paid a little more attention to performance theories. We have avoided it because we have bought into the pietistic anti-ritual bias that "play acting" is hypocritical. But when one has a public role to perform, one's personal feelings at the moment must be suppressed in order to articulate the feelings of the group. A politician can't go before a campaign audience and give his speech in a way that suggests that he's bored with it because he's given it three times already that day. He has to play to the crowd to pump them up for the party's cause. In a similar way, the presider has to offer the Great Thanksgiving playing to God as the assembly's spokesperson and bringing the assembly along. His personal feelings or level of belief at that moment must give way to the feelings required by the
        text and and public belief. This is not being insincere. It is accepting the requirements of holding public office, i.e., exercising the ministry of word and sacraments.- Frank C. Senn

        James O'Regan <oregan@...> wrote:
        Frank wrote and I snipped:

        > I was about to suggest that the "positive" word you were looking for
        > is "extempore" prayer which, in the classical puritan tradition, was
        > the only kind of public prayer allowed. However, the nature of a
        > "canon" is that it regulates.

        Extempore and regulated may not be the only two poles to consider. The
        fetching claim by the writer of the Apostolic Tradition (Hippolytus - sic)
        offers a slightly wider field of options: 1. a bishop can just pray from the
        heart, if he's any good at it, 2. a bishop could pray the words that Hipp.
        sets down, 3. but, if he does, he should do so as if it were from the heart
        and not just memorized.

        Which is to say that extempore can mean, as many have suggested, the
        likelihood of silly diatribes but it can also mean original, yet traditional,
        well spoken and heartfelt prayer, backed up by a life of consideration and
        grace.

        All the regulation of a canon in the world doesn't equate, necessarily, with
        good prayer in liturgy, which is what Hipp was warning against. Be that it
        was written at a time when most spoke extempore and without script but
        when script was beginning to be offered (as in the case of the Apostolic
        Tradition itself), Hipp.'s warning nevertheless speaks to today's highly
        regulated texts.

        What ministers must bring to a canonical text, per Hipp., is the "feel of
        extempore," which is to say the authenticity that a hearer receives when
        spoken to directly by someone who knows whereof he speaks.

        James O'Regan





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