RE: [liturgy-l] Baptism then Confirmation
- At 5/4/2003 -0400 12:17 PM, Art Hebbeler wrote:
>SteveYes, they were linked, indeed we're told that they were the same sacrament;
>Perhaps, but if memory serves me, weren't the two linked in the early
>church, and not divided until many centuries of Christendom, when
>bishops weren't at every church?
>I'm probably wrong here, but that's what popped into my mind first
that's what bothers me. These girls were baptized and christmated at the
first liturgy and then confirmed at the second. Why separate them?
Oremus -- Daily Prayer, Hymnal and Liturgical Resources since 1993
- Dn. Ormonde wrote:
> But not all bishops believe this craziness. I recently heard onestate that
> baptism with chrismation, even if by a presbyter, constitutesconfirmation
> for those of all ages.And this is the attitude of many RC's. One of the historical prayers
for confirmation is the prayer that accompanies the chrismation in
the Roman baptismal liturgy. It was understood that the sealing
which was accompanied by laying on of hands, was de facto what we
understand to be confirmation: an act of the whole church praying
for the impartation of the Holy Spirit.
Note that the postbaptismal anointing (and its accompanying prayer)
is omitted when adults are baptized and then immediately confirmed
(such as at the Easter Vigil).
The prayer which accompanies the action prays that the effect of
baptism be confirmed or ratified: "God the Father of our Lord Jesus
Christ has freed you from sin and given you a new birth by water and
the Holy Spirit, and has welcomed you into his holy people. He now
anoints with the chrism of salvation. As Christ was anointed Priest,
Prophet, and King, so may you live always as a member of His body,
sharing everlasting life. Amen." or "The God of power and Father of
our Lord Jesus Christ has freed you from sin and brought you to new
life through water and the Holy Spirit. He now anoints you with the
chrism of salvation, so that, united with his people, you may remain
for ever a member of Christ who is Priest, Prophet and King. Amen."
(Both translations are used interchangably, though the first appears
in the Rite for Infant Baptism, and the second in the Rite for Adult
Baptism apart from Confirmation.)
The point of the omission in the combined adult rite seems to be that
it would constitute a redundancy. Which makes one wonder. . . .
The flip score to Steve's conundrum is that these adolescents may
have been catechized in a class setting and the intent of the pastor
was to keep the class together. The baptisms were, hypothetically,
separated to maintain soldiarity. "Hey, why does she get to be
baptized and I don't?"
I think that it would have been increddibly instructive to link the
two rites in the same liturgy, but sometimes we overlook teachable
moments in the interest of time or other 'pastoral' concerns.