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Re: [linuxham] Is there a reason for no REV button in SitorB mode?

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  • Remi Chateauneu
    Hi Jim, Do you mean in Fldigi ? If this is what you mean, indeed only a couple of modes have the Rev button enabled: $ grep -w CAP_REV src/*/*cxx
    Message 1 of 9 , Mar 10, 2013
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      Hi Jim,

      Do you mean in Fldigi ?

      If this is what you mean, indeed only a couple of modes have the "Rev" button enabled:

      $ grep -w CAP_REV src/*/*cxx
      src/contestia/contestia.cxx:    cap |= CAP_REV;
      src/cw_rtty/rtty.cxx:   cap |= CAP_AFC | CAP_REV;
      src/cw_rtty/view_rtty.cxx:      cap |= CAP_AFC | CAP_REV;
      src/dominoex/dominoex.cxx:      cap |= CAP_REV;
      src/feld/feld.cxx:                      cap |= CAP_REV;
      src/mfsk/mfsk.cxx:      cap |= CAP_AFC | CAP_REV;
      src/olivia/olivia.cxx:  cap |= CAP_REV;
      src/psk/psk.cxx:                cap |= CAP_REV;
      src/thor/thor.cxx:      cap |= CAP_REV;
      src/throb/throb.cxx:    cap |= CAP_AFC | CAP_REV;
      src/wefax/wefax.cxx:    modem::cap |= CAP_AFC | CAP_REV | CAP_IMG ;

      And yes, Sitor and Navtex are not in this list.

      In the file fldigi/src/navtex/navtex.cxx , the member m_reverse is always set to False. We could change if this is necessary. But for Navtex which is a standard, it must not be reverted.

      Hope this helps.

      Remi F4ECW

      Le 10.03.2013 02:12, jhhaynes@... a écrit :
       

      ?

      Jim W6JVE







    • jhaynesatalumni
      ... What I m asking about is a REV button for upside-down FSK, like there is for RTTY.
      Message 2 of 9 , Mar 13, 2013
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        --- In linuxham@yahoogroups.com, "D.J.J. Ring, Jr." <n1ea@...> wrote:
        >
        > Are you serious?
        >
        > You're meaning SiTOR Mode B - which is a interleaved broadcast mode. Can
        > be sent to SELCALL or Group call. What is the purpose of a turn around
        > when there's no pause in the signal?
        >

        What I'm asking about is a REV button for upside-down FSK, like
        there is for RTTY.
      • jhaynesatalumni
        ... Yes ... This is like a certain Microsoft joke which takes too long to tell here. I m asking if there is a reason for not including Sitor/Navtex in the
        Message 3 of 9 , Mar 13, 2013
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          --- In linuxham@yahoogroups.com, Remi Chateauneu <rchateauneu@...> wrote:
          >
          > Hi Jim,
          >
          > Do you mean in Fldigi ?

          Yes

          >
          > If this is what you mean, indeed only a couple of modes have the "Rev"
          > button enabled:
          >
          > $ grep -w CAP_REV src/*/*cxx
          > src/contestia/contestia.cxx: cap |= CAP_REV;
          > src/cw_rtty/rtty.cxx: cap |= CAP_AFC | CAP_REV;
          > src/cw_rtty/view_rtty.cxx: cap |= CAP_AFC | CAP_REV;
          > src/dominoex/dominoex.cxx: cap |= CAP_REV;
          > src/feld/feld.cxx: cap |= CAP_REV;
          > src/mfsk/mfsk.cxx: cap |= CAP_AFC | CAP_REV;
          > src/olivia/olivia.cxx: cap |= CAP_REV;
          > src/psk/psk.cxx: cap |= CAP_REV;
          > src/thor/thor.cxx: cap |= CAP_REV;
          > src/throb/throb.cxx: cap |= CAP_AFC | CAP_REV;
          > src/wefax/wefax.cxx: modem::cap |= CAP_AFC | CAP_REV | CAP_IMG ;
          >
          > And yes, Sitor and Navtex are not in this list.
          >
          This is like a certain Microsoft joke which takes too long to
          tell here. I'm asking if there is a reason for not including
          Sitor/Navtex in the modes that allow reversing for upside-down
          shift.
        • D.J.J. Ring, Jr.
          Sorry, Jim, I thought you meant REVERSE as in going from an ISS (Information Sending Station) to a IRS (Information Receiving Station) either as Master or
          Message 4 of 9 , Mar 13, 2013
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            Sorry, Jim,

            I thought you meant REVERSE as in going from an ISS (Information Sending Station) to a IRS (Information Receiving Station) either as Master or Slave in SiTOR.  Reverse in the direction flow can be done by software command or by keyboard sending +? or other keys - on Baudot keyboard it is plus sign followed by question mark.

            I haven't worked Pactor or SiTOR/AMTOR in years.

            I remember that Pactor and Packet doesn't make any difference if the stations are using USB to LSB.

            I remember that SiTOR has a pairing of mark/space elements plus additional error correcting elements so that the ratios were always uniform. Does also Reverse Tones makes no sense with SiTOR or FEC because of the error correction?

            I guess anyone using AmTOR or SiTOR could work USB to LSB and see if it worked.

            I haven't used it for over 25 years though except maybe for one contact although I was one of the first using it on the ham bands while using N1EA/MM - exotic equipment in use Philips STB-750 Baudot to SiTOR converter :-)

            73

            DR

            On Sun, Mar 10, 2013 at 8:04 AM, Remi Chateauneu <rchateauneu@...> wrote:


            Hi Jim,

            Do you mean in Fldigi ?

            If this is what you mean, indeed only a couple of modes have the "Rev" button enabled:

            $ grep -w CAP_REV src/*/*cxx
            src/contestia/contestia.cxx:    cap |= CAP_REV;
            src/cw_rtty/rtty.cxx:   cap |= CAP_AFC | CAP_REV;
            src/cw_rtty/view_rtty.cxx:      cap |= CAP_AFC | CAP_REV;
            src/dominoex/dominoex.cxx:      cap |= CAP_REV;
            src/feld/feld.cxx:                      cap |= CAP_REV;
            src/mfsk/mfsk.cxx:      cap |= CAP_AFC | CAP_REV;
            src/olivia/olivia.cxx:  cap |= CAP_REV;
            src/psk/psk.cxx:                cap |= CAP_REV;
            src/thor/thor.cxx:      cap |= CAP_REV;
            src/throb/throb.cxx:    cap |= CAP_AFC | CAP_REV;
            src/wefax/wefax.cxx:    modem::cap |= CAP_AFC | CAP_REV | CAP_IMG ;

            And yes, Sitor and Navtex are not in this list.

            In the file fldigi/src/navtex/navtex.cxx , the member m_reverse is always set to False. We could change if this is necessary. But for Navtex which is a standard, it must not be reverted.

            Hope this helps.

            Remi F4ECW

            Le 10.03.2013 02:12, jhhaynes@... a écrit :
             

            ?

            Jim W6JVE










          • rchateauneu
            For NAVTEX, it was not needed because it could receive messages without inversion. It should not be possible I think because it is not in the standard. With
            Message 5 of 9 , Mar 14, 2013
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              For NAVTEX, it was not needed because it could receive messages without inversion. It should not be possible I think because it is not in the standard.

              With SITOR, the code and strictly behaviour to NAVTEX modem apart preamble and a couple of details, but the modems are the same. It is cretainly posible to add this possibility.

              No-one asked for the possiblity ot reversing. If you are interested, I can add taht to SITOR, it will come in the next version (With a couple of small bug fixes to Navtex too).

              PS: What is this Microsoft joke ?

              --- In linuxham@yahoogroups.com, jhhaynes@... wrote:
              >

              > >
              > > And yes, Sitor and Navtex are not in this list.
              > >
              > This is like a certain Microsoft joke which takes too long to
              > tell here. I'm asking if there is a reason for not including
              > Sitor/Navtex in the modes that allow reversing for upside-down
              > shift.
              >
            • jhaynesatalumni
              Just a matter of convenience. I was copying the WLO broadcast and happened to be on the wrong sideband and it would have been easier to punch a REV button
              Message 6 of 9 , Mar 14, 2013
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                Just a matter of convenience. I was copying the WLO broadcast and
                happened to be on the wrong sideband and it would have been easier
                to punch a REV button than to switch sidebands and retune the receiver.

                --- In linuxham@yahoogroups.com, "rchateauneu" <rchateauneu@...> wrote:

                > PS: What is this Microsoft joke ?
                >
                Well, since you asked...

                A guy is flying in a helicopter in the Seattle area and is suddenly
                enveloped in a cloud bank and has no idea where he is. So he yells
                out the window "Where am I?" and he hears a yell back from the
                ground, "You're in a helicopter."

                So the pilot says obviously I am right over Microsoft headquarters,
                because they answered my question with something that is perfectly correct and perfectly useless.
              • D.J.J. Ring, Jr.
                So in mode A is AmTOR / SiTOR independent of LSB/USB ZZor reverse tones? I cannot remember, but I think so. David
                Message 7 of 9 , Mar 14, 2013
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                  So in mode A is AmTOR / SiTOR independent of LSB/USB ZZor reverse tones?  I cannot remember, but I think so.

                  David

                  On Mar 14, 2013 9:37 AM, "rchateauneu" <rchateauneu@...> wrote:
                  For NAVTEX, it was not needed because it could receive messages without inversion. It should not be possible I think because it is not in the standard.

                  With SITOR, the code and strictly behaviour to NAVTEX modem apart preamble and a couple of details, but the modems are the same. It is cretainly posible to add this possibility.

                  No-one asked for the possiblity ot reversing. If you are interested, I can add taht to SITOR, it will come in the next version (With a couple of small bug fixes to Navtex too).

                  PS: What is this Microsoft joke ?

                  --- In linuxham@yahoogroups.com, jhhaynes@... wrote:
                  >

                  > >
                  > > And yes, Sitor and Navtex are not in this list.
                  > >
                  > This is like a certain Microsoft joke which takes too long to
                  > tell here.  I'm asking if there is a reason for not including
                  > Sitor/Navtex in the modes that allow reversing for upside-down
                  > shift.
                  >




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