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Re: [linuxham] Slightly off-topic -- WSJT / JT65?

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  • pfbram@comcast.net
    My Dell hardware is about 5-7 years old and the WSJT .deb installed without much trouble (though it dumped the directory into the system root). I did need to
    Message 1 of 17 , Jun 1, 2012
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      My Dell hardware is about 5-7 years old and the WSJT .deb installed without much trouble (though it dumped the directory into the system root).  I did need to bring down this package: libfftw3-3 (to handle the FFT work).  I don't see any reason to custom compile (not yet, anyway).  My Ubuntu 10.04 LTS is fully patched with updates, kernel and otherwise, and I prefer the interface and performance over Unity.  I'll likely switch to Debian in the not-distant future.

      I'm not at home right now, so can't go into the settings in-detail, but everything else about the sound on that machine works fine -- including fldigi.  Fldigi is using "USB Audio CODEC hw:2,0" for capture + playback, /dev/ttyUSB0.

      If this doesn't present any trouble for fldigi or any other of my applications, I'm inclined to think it isn't a problem with my hardware or linux distro.  It's either with my settings for WSJT or WSJT itself.  For example, I don't see any mechanism for rigcat or hamlib, so how does it communicate in general with the rig?

      Paul Bramscher / KD0KZE


      From: "Rick Kunath" <k9ao@...>
      To: linuxham@yahoogroups.com
      Sent: Friday, June 1, 2012 10:51:53 AM
      Subject: Re: [linuxham] Slightly off-topic -- WSJT / JT65?

       

      On 06/01/2012 11:44 AM, pfbram wrote:
      > I'm curious if anyone has tried to get WSJT working, and what success
      > they had. I'm running Ubuntu 10.04 LTS and a Kenwood TS-590S (via
      > USB port) and have had very good luck with fldigi. I tried similar
      > settings for sound device, etc. with WSJT and just couldn't get it
      > working.
      >
      > So I present two questions to the group--
      >
      > 1. Has anyone gotten it to work? 2. Have the developers of fldigi
      > considered adding JT65 as another mode?

      Yes, I have had WSJT and WSPR working natively in Linux for years.
      Currently using it on Mandriva 2011 and OpenSUSE 12.1. JT65-HF also runs
      in Mandriva but the Pulseaudio device detection fails on OpenSUSE with a
      properly configured and working Pulse setup.

      How bad is the Pulseaudio implementation on that old distro?

      And how well do you have Pulseaudio ALSA emulation setup, if you are
      trying to use that?

      Can you even compile WSJT?

      How far into this have you gotten? What Fortran compilers have you tried?

      Rick Kunath, k9ao

    • Rick Kunath
      Comments inline... ... Yes. Fully patched to the bugfixed old versions of various apps, Pulseaudio being one of them. You do not have more stable and enhanced
      Message 2 of 17 , Jun 1, 2012
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        Comments inline...

        On 06/01/2012 12:25 PM, pfbram@... wrote:
        > My Dell hardware is about 5-7 years old and the WSJT .deb installed
        > without much trouble (though it dumped the directory into the system
        > root). I did need to bring down this package: libfftw3-3 (to handle the
        > FFT work). I don't see any reason to custom compile (not yet, anyway).
        > My Ubuntu 10.04 LTS is fully patched with updates, kernel and otherwise,
        > and I prefer the interface and performance over Unity. I'll likely
        > switch to Debian in the not-distant future.

        Yes. Fully patched to the bugfixed old versions of various apps,
        Pulseaudio being one of them. You do not have more stable and enhanced
        versions of the various apps and libs on that release, that newer
        releases do. Fully patched does not mean upgraded to the latest app or
        lib release. There have been an awful lot of improvements since the
        versions that you are running.

        > I'm not at home right now, so can't go into the settings in-detail, but
        > everything else about the sound on that machine works fine -- including
        > fldigi. Fldigi is using "USB Audio CODEC hw:2,0" for capture + playback,
        > /dev/ttyUSB0.

        That is an ALSA device so you must be running ALSA emulation run through
        the local Pulseaudio server. You should be running Pulse directly,
        including for Fldigi.

        > If this doesn't present any trouble for fldigi or any other of my
        > applications, I'm inclined to think it isn't a problem with my hardware
        > or linux distro.

        Does direct Pulseaudio sound I/O not work on that box?

        > It's either with my settings for WSJT or WSJT itself.
        > For example, I don't see any mechanism for rigcat or hamlib, so how does
        > it communicate in general with the rig?

        WSJT just gives you PTT via a serial port, WSPR has some rig control
        built in. JT65-HF has PTT via a serial port.

        So no hamlib rig control on WSJT.

        What's your problem with WSJT so far?

        Rick Kunath
      • pfbram@comcast.net
        When I get home, I ll take a look at the audio settings. Generally, I just let the OS pick the drivers it needs and if I hear audio -- that s good enough for
        Message 3 of 17 , Jun 1, 2012
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          When I get home, I'll take a look at the audio settings.  Generally, I just let the OS pick the drivers it needs and if I hear audio -- that's good enough for me (don't fix it if it's not broken).  I don't think I've had sound issues on any other app.  Linux philosophy is usually forgiving to its past.  For example, people are still free to use 'vi' and old Fortran libraries for FFT if they so desire.

          PTT via serial would be an issue already (no serial ports on my PC).  My PC is old, granted, but not that old.  So is it possible to run it with a USB-to-serial adapter, or do you actually need to install a serial port card, and run a (second) legacy cable from the rig to the PC?

          -Paul Bramscher



          From: "Rick Kunath" <k9ao@...>
          To: linuxham@yahoogroups.com
          Sent: Friday, June 1, 2012 11:42:05 AM
          Subject: Re: [linuxham] Slightly off-topic -- WSJT / JT65?

           

          Comments inline...

          On 06/01/2012 12:25 PM, pfbram@... wrote:
          > My Dell hardware is about 5-7 years old and the WSJT .deb installed
          > without much trouble (though it dumped the directory into the system
          > root). I did need to bring down this package: libfftw3-3 (to handle the
          > FFT work). I don't see any reason to custom compile (not yet, anyway).
          > My Ubuntu 10.04 LTS is fully patched with updates, kernel and otherwise,
          > and I prefer the interface and performance over Unity. I'll likely
          > switch to Debian in the not-distant future.

          Yes. Fully patched to the bugfixed old versions of various apps,
          Pulseaudio being one of them. You do not have more stable and enhanced
          versions of the various apps and libs on that release, that newer
          releases do. Fully patched does not mean upgraded to the latest app or
          lib release. There have been an awful lot of improvements since the
          versions that you are running.

          > I'm not at home right now, so can't go into the settings in-detail, but
          > everything else about the sound on that machine works fine -- including
          > fldigi. Fldigi is using "USB Audio CODEC hw:2,0" for capture + playback,
          > /dev/ttyUSB0.

          That is an ALSA device so you must be running ALSA emulation run through
          the local Pulseaudio server. You should be running Pulse directly,
          including for Fldigi.

          > If this doesn't present any trouble for fldigi or any other of my
          > applications, I'm inclined to think it isn't a problem with my hardware
          > or linux distro.

          Does direct Pulseaudio sound I/O not work on that box?

          > It's either with my settings for WSJT or WSJT itself.
          > For example, I don't see any mechanism for rigcat or hamlib, so how does
          > it communicate in general with the rig?

          WSJT just gives you PTT via a serial port, WSPR has some rig control
          built in. JT65-HF has PTT via a serial port.

          So no hamlib rig control on WSJT.

          What's your problem with WSJT so far?

          Rick Kunath

        • Creede Lambard
          1. Yep. I ran WSJT 9.0 for about a month before I got JT65-HF working. I m much happier with JT65-HF for several reasons, but there are things that WSJT does
          Message 4 of 17 , Jun 1, 2012
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            1. Yep. I ran WSJT 9.0 for about a month before I got JT65-HF working. I'm much happier with JT65-HF for several reasons, but there are things that WSJT does better, especially if you're ever going to consider EME or meteor scatter or other weak-signal work up above the HF bands. If you build from source, which I recommend if you're familiar and comfortable with building from source on Linux, you will probably have to install the development packages for fftw3, pulseaudio, possibly gfortran3 and maybe a couple of others (I don't have my notes with me). Just keep track of the output from running .config and install any missing -dev packages. You will also want to install pavucontrol. It's the easiest way to keep track of your audio level in any jt65 application (indeed, any digital modes application) - important to keep from overdriving your audio, incoming or outgoing.

            2. Dave can speak for himself on this one, but I remember seeing somewhere that he wasn't interested in putting jt65 into fldigi because it's not a keyboard-to-keyboard mode like the other modes fldigi supports. IMO JT65 and its kin are sufficiently different from, say, BPSK31 or even CW that you'd have to do a major redesign to get fldigi to handle jt65. (Just one example: checking arbitrary text messages to see if the message is too long to send or if it contains illegal characters. JT65-HF does this automatically.) It'd be nice to have one program that would handle both JT65 and the more interactive modes, but hey, I'm happy I've got two good programs to use rather than none at all, which is all too often what happens with Linux.

            73, Creede

            On 06/01/2012 08:44 AM, pfbram wrote:
             

            I'm curious if anyone has tried to get WSJT working, and what success they had. I'm running Ubuntu 10.04 LTS and a Kenwood TS-590S (via USB port) and have had very good luck with fldigi. I tried similar settings for sound device, etc. with WSJT and just couldn't get it working.

            So I present two questions to the group--

            1. Has anyone gotten it to work?
            2. Have the developers of fldigi considered adding JT65 as another mode?

            Thanks in advance & 73
            KD0KZE
            Paul Bramscher
            Circle Pines, MN


          • Creede Lambard
            Ha. I have an older machine than yours and I think it has serial ports. Can t remember, it s been so long since I used em. :-) I m running both fldigi and
            Message 5 of 17 , Jun 1, 2012
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              Ha. I have an older machine than yours and I think it has serial ports. Can't remember, it's been so long since I used 'em. :-)

              I'm running both fldigi and jt65-hf with a USB CAT cable for my FT-857, and they both work fine. The real question is what kind of cable your rig requires. If it requires an RS-232 cable, that's what you'll need to use. If it can handle CAT control via a USB adapter like mine does, that's the way to go.

              73, Creede

              On 06/01/2012 01:01 PM, pfbram@... wrote:  
              When I get home, I'll take a look at the audio settings.  Generally, I just let the OS pick the drivers it needs and if I hear audio -- that's good enough for me (don't fix it if it's not broken).  I don't think I've had sound issues on any other app.  Linux philosophy is usually forgiving to its past.  For example, people are still free to use 'vi' and old Fortran libraries for FFT if they so desire.

              PTT via serial would be an issue already (no serial ports on my PC).  My PC is old, granted, but not that old.  So is it possible to run it with a USB-to-serial adapter, or do you actually need to install a serial port card, and run a (second) legacy cable from the rig to the PC?

              -Paul Bramscher


            • w1hkj
              ... Correct Creede. I ve also avoided adding things like SSTV and several other requests. On the other hand one of the developers has added both WEFAX and
              Message 6 of 17 , Jun 1, 2012
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                > 2. Dave can speak for himself on this one, but I remember seeing
                > somewhere that he wasn't interested in putting jt65 into fldigi
                > because it's not a keyboard-to-keyboard mode like the other modes
                > fldigi supports.
                Correct Creede. I've also avoided adding things like SSTV and several
                other requests. On the other hand one of the developers has added both
                WEFAX and SITOR capability to the experimental branch. If someone
                provided me with a working jt65 implementation for fldigi I would
                consider integrating the work into the production code.

                Dave
              • Creede Lambard
                That makes sense Dave. I would think it d be kind of tough to implement jt-65 because there are so many things that are different about it - the time
                Message 7 of 17 , Jun 1, 2012
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                  That makes sense Dave. I would think it'd be kind of tough to implement jt-65 because there are so many things that are different about it - the time synchronization, the strict protocol requirements, etc.

                  On the other hand, if anyone ever does put a jt-65 implementation together, I'll be more than happy to alpha test it.

                  73, Creede

                  On 06/01/2012 01:19 PM, w1hkj wrote:
                   


                  > 2. Dave can speak for himself on this one, but I remember seeing
                  > somewhere that he wasn't interested in putting jt65 into fldigi
                  > because it's not a keyboard-to-keyboard mode like the other modes
                  > fldigi supports.
                  Correct Creede. I've also avoided adding things like SSTV and several
                  other requests. On the other hand one of the developers has added both
                  WEFAX and SITOR capability to the experimental branch. If someone
                  provided me with a working jt65 implementation for fldigi I would
                  consider integrating the work into the production code.

                  Dave


                • Paul Bramscher
                  My rig has both USB and RS-232 serial outputs, though if I recall correctly you need to specify in a somewhat buried menu which output it will utilize at one
                  Message 8 of 17 , Jun 1, 2012
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                    My rig has both USB and RS-232 serial outputs, though if I recall
                    correctly you need to specify in a somewhat buried menu which output it
                    will utilize at one time (not both).

                    Is there a Linux port of JT65-HF? If not, I do have older computers
                    around. I imagine I could install Windows XP on one, and run a separate
                    serial cable to that computer -- but that arrangement would require a
                    hitting the menu on the rig in order to switch between PC's. Would be
                    kind of interesting, though, to drive two PC's with the same rig.

                    (I feel like a bit like a Luddite with XP and Ubuntu 10.04, but I'm
                    trying to avoid the Metro/Unity thing like the plague -- and I know I'm
                    not alone there.)

                    73's
                    --Paul

                    On 6/1/2012 3:12 PM, Creede Lambard wrote:
                    >
                    >
                    > Ha. I have an older machine than yours and I think it has serial ports.
                    > Can't remember, it's been so long since I used 'em. :-)
                    >
                    > I'm running both fldigi and jt65-hf with a USB CAT cable for my FT-857,
                    > and they both work fine. The real question is what kind of cable your
                    > rig requires. If it requires an RS-232 cable, that's what you'll need to
                    > use. If it can handle CAT control via a USB adapter like mine does,
                    > that's the way to go.
                    >
                    > 73, Creede
                    >
                    > On 06/01/2012 01:01 PM, pfbram@... wrote:
                    >
                    >>
                    >> When I get home, I'll take a look at the audio settings. Generally, I
                    >> just let the OS pick the drivers it needs and if I hear audio --
                    >> that's good enough for me (don't fix it if it's not broken). I don't
                    >> think I've had sound issues on any other app. Linux philosophy is
                    >> usually forgiving to its past. For example, people are still free to
                    >> use 'vi' and old Fortran libraries for FFT if they so desire.
                    >>
                    >> PTT via serial would be an issue already (no serial ports on my PC).
                    >> My PC is old, granted, but not that old. So is it possible to run it
                    >> with a USB-to-serial adapter, or do you actually need to install a
                    >> serial port card, and run a (second) legacy cable from the rig to the PC?
                    >>
                    >> -Paul Bramscher
                    >>
                    >
                    >
                  • Rick Kunath
                    ... Yes there is. It needs a working Pulseaudio, though JT65-HS s detection of that is broke on OpenSUSE. Mandriva works fine. ... Hence my using Mandriva for
                    Message 9 of 17 , Jun 1, 2012
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                      On Friday, June 01, 2012 07:24:51 PM you wrote:

                      > Is there a Linux port of JT65-HF? If not, I do have older computers
                      > around. I imagine I could install Windows XP on one, and run a separate
                      > serial cable to that computer -- but that arrangement would require a
                      > hitting the menu on the rig in order to switch between PC's. Would be
                      > kind of interesting, though, to drive two PC's with the same rig.

                      Yes there is.

                      It needs a working Pulseaudio, though JT65-HS's detection of that is broke on
                      OpenSUSE. Mandriva works fine.

                      >
                      > (I feel like a bit like a Luddite with XP and Ubuntu 10.04, but I'm
                      > trying to avoid the Metro/Unity thing like the plague -- and I know I'm
                      > not alone there.)

                      Hence my using Mandriva for years and now moving to OpenSUSE. Nice, standard,
                      stable, and as close or as far from the cutting edge as you want to take it.
                      KDE 4.3.2 here.

                      Rick Kunath, k9ao
                    • D.J.J. Ring, Jr.
                      j65-hf is available here: http://jt65.w6cqz.org/doc/jt65-hf.1.0.9.2.tar.gz It says in the pdf file in the tar.gz archive that it needs these files: fftw3
                      Message 10 of 17 , Jun 1, 2012
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                        j65-hf is available here:
                        http://jt65.w6cqz.org/doc/jt65-hf.1.0.9.2.tar.gz

                        It says in the pdf file in the tar.gz archive that it needs these files:

                        fftw3
                        portaudio2
                        libgfortran3

                        It also says it may need a font.

                        The file says it works with Ubuntu and "should" work with other distros.
                        For some reason this application "expires" in December 2012.

                        73

                        David N1EA
                      • Rick Kunath
                        Er, KDE 4.8.3 here... Tired fingers. Rick
                        Message 11 of 17 , Jun 1, 2012
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                          Er, KDE 4.8.3 here...

                          Tired fingers.

                          Rick
                        • Sergey UB9OAF
                          On Fri, 1 Jun 2012 20:46:34 -0400 ... Which version of Ubuntu are you using? It doesn t work on my 12.04. Just open the main window and freezes without any
                          Message 12 of 17 , Jun 1, 2012
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                            On Fri, 1 Jun 2012 20:46:34 -0400
                            "D.J.J. Ring, Jr." <n1ea@...> wrote:

                            > The file says it works with Ubuntu and "should" work with other distros.

                            Which version of Ubuntu are you using? It doesn't work on my 12.04. Just open the main window and freezes without any controls


                            --
                            Sergey UB9OAF <ub9oaf@...>
                          • Rick Kunath
                            ... What does? WSJT or JT65-HF? Rick Kunath, k9ao
                            Message 13 of 17 , Jun 1, 2012
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                              On Saturday, June 02, 2012 12:17:19 PM you wrote:
                              > On Fri, 1 Jun 2012 20:46:34 -0400
                              >
                              > "D.J.J. Ring, Jr." <n1ea@...> wrote:
                              > > The file says it works with Ubuntu and "should" work with other distros.
                              >
                              > Which version of Ubuntu are you using? It doesn't work on my 12.04. Just
                              > open the main window and freezes without any controls

                              What does?

                              WSJT or JT65-HF?

                              Rick Kunath, k9ao
                            • Creede Lambard
                              My guess is he s talking about JT65-HF, because (1) I can run WSJT 9.0 (built from scratch) on Ubuntu 12.04LTS with no problems whatsoever, and (2) when I try
                              Message 14 of 17 , Jun 2, 2012
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                                My guess is he's talking about JT65-HF, because (1) I can run WSJT 9.0 (built from scratch) on Ubuntu 12.04LTS with no problems whatsoever, and (2) when I try to run JT65-HF on the same machine I get exactly the symptoms he describes. (To be specific, if I run it under strace it draws the main frame with no text or controls and freezes waiting for a futex() call that never finishes. And no, beyond what I found in Wikipedia I don't know how futexes work.)

                                73, Creede

                                On 06/01/2012 11:06 PM, Rick Kunath wrote:
                                 

                                On Saturday, June 02, 2012 12:17:19 PM you wrote:
                                > On Fri, 1 Jun 2012 20:46:34 -0400
                                >
                                > "D.J.J. Ring, Jr." <n1ea@...> wrote:
                                > > The file says it works with Ubuntu and "should" work with other distros.
                                >
                                > Which version of Ubuntu are you using? It doesn't work on my 12.04. Just
                                > open the main window and freezes without any controls

                                What does?

                                WSJT or JT65-HF?

                                Rick Kunath, k9ao


                              • Sergey UB9OAF
                                On Sat, 02 Jun 2012 02:06:33 -0400 ... jt65-hf -- Sergey UB9OAF
                                Message 15 of 17 , Jun 2, 2012
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                                  On Sat, 02 Jun 2012 02:06:33 -0400
                                  Rick Kunath <k9ao@...> wrote:

                                  > On Saturday, June 02, 2012 12:17:19 PM you wrote:
                                  > > On Fri, 1 Jun 2012 20:46:34 -0400
                                  > >
                                  > > "D.J.J. Ring, Jr." <n1ea@...> wrote:
                                  > > > The file says it works with Ubuntu and "should" work with other distros.
                                  > >
                                  > > Which version of Ubuntu are you using? It doesn't work on my 12.04. Just
                                  > > open the main window and freezes without any controls
                                  >
                                  > What does?
                                  >
                                  > WSJT or JT65-HF?

                                  jt65-hf

                                  --
                                  Sergey UB9OAF <ub9oaf@...>
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