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Re: [linuxham] Software incorrect time

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  • Henri Honda
    ... I m using Mint 10. Hank 7J9AAD
    Message 1 of 30 , Jul 30, 2011
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      On 07/31/2011 02:28 PM, Pierfrancesco Caci wrote:  

      what operating system?

      --
       Pierfrancesco Caci, ik5pvx

      I'm using Mint 10.

      Hank 7J9AAD


    • Pierfrancesco Caci
      ... please show the output of the following commands: date cat /proc/driver/rtc Do you dualboot this machine to windows? -- Pierfrancesco Caci, ik5pvx
      Message 2 of 30 , Jul 30, 2011
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        On Sun, Jul 31, 2011 at 07:31, Henri Honda <k6don@...> wrote:


        On 07/31/2011 02:28 PM, Pierfrancesco Caci wrote:  

        what operating system?

        --
         Pierfrancesco Caci, ik5pvx

        I'm using Mint 10.


        please show the output of the following commands:

        date

        cat /proc/driver/rtc


        Do you dualboot this machine to windows?


        --
         Pierfrancesco Caci, ik5pvx
      • Kevin Raper
        ... And What Time Server are you using? The American NIST Time Servers in Colorado have had all sorts of Weird Problems in the past couple of Months. It also
        Message 3 of 30 , Jul 30, 2011
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          On Jul 31, 2011, at 1:28 AM, Pierfrancesco Caci wrote:

          what operating system?

          And What Time Server are you using? The American NIST Time Servers in Colorado have had all sorts of Weird Problems in the past couple of Months. It also does not help that some pranksters and / or Hackers have been attacking them. This has been a real issue trying to keep the Time at the Three Medium Wave Stations I work for synchronized with the Network's Clocks. I have also noticed they have had problems keeping the Show Host's Clocks synced with the Network.

          What a Headache!

          73,
          Kevin Raper
          KJ4HYD
          CE WCKI WQIZ WLTQ

          There is no limitation to the fidelity of AM radio. From a mathematical standpoint, AM does better in frequency response than FM. - Leonard Kahn




        • Pierfrancesco Caci
          ... Well, don t use just one server :-) here s a list of public ntp servers:  http://www.pool.ntp.org/en/ Pick one in your country and one elsewhere, the NTP
          Message 4 of 30 , Jul 30, 2011
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            On Sun, Jul 31, 2011 at 07:39, Kevin Raper <kj4hyd@...> wrote:
            >
            >
            >
            > On Jul 31, 2011, at 1:28 AM, Pierfrancesco Caci wrote:
            >
            > what operating system?
            >
            > And What Time Server are you using? The American NIST Time Servers in Colorado have had all sorts of Weird Problems in the past couple of Months. It also does not help that some pranksters and / or Hackers have been attacking them. This has been a real issue trying to keep the Time at the Three Medium Wave Stations I work for synchronized with the Network's Clocks. I have also noticed they have had problems keeping the Show Host's Clocks synced with the Network.
            > What a Headache!

            Well, don't use just one server :-)

            here's a list of public ntp servers:

             http://www.pool.ntp.org/en/

            Pick one in your country and one elsewhere, the NTP protocol will
            automatically choose the better one.

            --
             Pierfrancesco Caci, ik5pvx
          • Henri Honda
            ... Date was 7/30/11 ... Sorry, I m not very familiar with computerize so I am not sure what the above means. Guess I m a little old (90) to comprehend the
            Message 5 of 30 , Jul 30, 2011
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              On 07/31/2011 02:35 PM, Pierfrancesco Caci wrote:  



              On Sun, Jul 31, 2011 at 07:31, Henri Honda <k6don@...> wrote:


              On 07/31/2011 02:28 PM, Pierfrancesco Caci wrote:  

              what operating system?

              --
               Pierfrancesco Caci, ik5pvx

              I'm using Mint 10.


              please show the output of the following commands:

              date
              Date was 7/30/11

              cat /proc/driver/rtc
              Sorry, I'm not very familiar with computerize so I am not sure what the above means.  Guess I'm
              a little old (90) to comprehend the above.


              Do you dualboot this machine to windows?

              No, I do not have any version of Windows installed.

              Hank, 7J9AAD


              --
               Pierfrancesco Caci, ik5pvx

            • Henri Honda
              On 07/31/2011 02:39 PM, Kevin Raper wrote: Hi Kevin: FYI, I installed the NTS using the synaptic package manager in Mint 10. There s other time servers listed
              Message 6 of 30 , Jul 30, 2011
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                On 07/31/2011 02:39 PM, Kevin Raper wrote:

                Hi Kevin:

                FYI, I installed the NTS using the synaptic package manager in Mint 10.  There's other time
                servers listed in synaptic also.

                73,

                Hank 7J9AAD
                 


                On Jul 31, 2011, at 1:28 AM, Pierfrancesco Caci wrote:

                what operating system?

                And What Time Server are you using? The American NIST Time Servers in Colorado have had all sorts of Weird Problems in the past couple of Months. It also does not help that some pranksters and / or Hackers have been attacking them. This has been a real issue trying to keep the Time at the Three Medium Wave Stations I work for synchronized with the Network's Clocks. I have also noticed they have had problems keeping the Show Host's Clocks synced with the Network.

                What a Headache!

                73,
                Kevin Raper
                KJ4HYD
                CE WCKI WQIZ WLTQ

                There is no limitation to the fidelity of AM radio. From a mathematical standpoint, AM does better in frequency response than FM. - Leonard Kahn





              • Pierfrancesco Caci
                ... Ok Hank, no worries. What I m trying to figure out is if your computer thinks it has to adjust for daylight savings, which are not used in Japan. Open a
                Message 7 of 30 , Jul 30, 2011
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                  > please show the output of the following commands:
                  >
                  > date
                  >
                  > Date was 7/30/11
                  >
                  > cat /proc/driver/rtc
                  >
                  > Sorry, I'm not very familiar with computerize so I am not sure what the above means.  Guess I'm
                  > a little old (90) to comprehend the above.
                  >
                  >
                  > Do you dualboot this machine to windows?
                  >
                  > No, I do not have any version of Windows installed.
                  >

                  Ok Hank, no worries. What I'm trying to figure out is if your computer
                  thinks it has to adjust for daylight savings, which are not used in
                  Japan.
                  Open a terminal window, and type the following commands in it, just as follows:

                  date
                  cat /proc/driver/rtc
                  cat /etc/timezone
                  locale

                  Show me the output of each command.
                  The first command shows what the operating system idea of time and date is
                  The second shows what your motherboard clock thinks about it
                  The third (if the file exists) shows your system-wide setting for the timezone
                  The last one shows whats the language setting for your username.

                  Since you're not using windows, the best thing you can do regarding to
                  time is to keep the motherboard clock to UTC, and let the operating
                  system adjust all the rest.

                  Pf


                  --
                   Pierfrancesco Caci, ik5pvx
                • Henri Honda
                  ... IK5PVX: Okay, this is what I got: ank@mint-computer ~ $ date Sun Jul 31 15:31:36 JST 2011 hank@mint-computer ~ $ cat/proc/driver/rtc bash:
                  Message 8 of 30 , Jul 30, 2011
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                    On 07/31/2011 03:28 PM, Pierfrancesco Caci wrote:  


                    Ok Hank, no worries. What I'm trying to figure out is if your computer
                    thinks it has to adjust for daylight savings, which are not used in
                    Japan.
                    Open a terminal window, and type the following commands in it, just as follows:

                    date
                    cat /proc/driver/rtc
                    cat /etc/timezone
                    locale

                    Show me the output of each command.
                    The first command shows what the operating system idea of time and date is
                    The second shows what your motherboard clock thinks about it
                    The third (if the file exists) shows your system-wide setting for the timezone
                    The last one shows whats the language setting for your username.

                    Since you're not using windows, the best thing you can do regarding to
                    time is to keep the motherboard clock to UTC, and let the operating
                    system adjust all the rest.

                    Pf

                    --
                     Pierfrancesco Caci, ik5pvx

                    IK5PVX:

                    Okay, this is what I got:

                    ank@mint-computer ~ $ date
                    Sun Jul 31 15:31:36 JST 2011
                    hank@mint-computer ~ $ cat/proc/driver/rtc
                    bash: cat/proc/driver/rtc: No such file or directory
                    hank@mint-computer ~ $ cat/etc/timezone
                    bash: cat/etc/timezone: No such file or directory
                    hank@mint-computer ~ $ locale
                    LANG=en_US.UTF-8
                    LC_CTYPE="en_US.UTF-8"
                    LC_NUMERIC="en_US.UTF-8"
                    LC_TIME="en_US.UTF-8"
                    LC_COLLATE="en_US.UTF-8"
                    LC_MONETARY="en_US.UTF-8"
                    LC_MESSAGES="en_US.UTF-8"
                    LC_PAPER="en_US.UTF-8"
                    LC_NAME="en_US.UTF-8"
                    LC_ADDRESS="en_US.UTF-8"
                    LC_TELEPHONE="en_US.UTF-8"
                    LC_MEASUREMENT="en_US.UTF-8"
                    LC_IDENTIFICATION="en_US.UTF-8"
                    LC_ALL=
                    hank@mint-computer ~ $

                    What do you think? Something haywire with my computer??  Should I change the computer time to
                    UTC??

                    Thank you!

                    73
                    Hank 7J9AAD


                  • Pierfrancesco Caci
                    ... Ok, this is correct ... There has to be a space after cat, before the / can you please try these two again? ... I m not sure yet. Rereading your initial
                    Message 9 of 30 , Jul 30, 2011
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                      On Sun, Jul 31, 2011 at 08:38, Henri Honda <k6don@...> wrote:
                      >
                      >
                      > IK5PVX:
                      >
                      > Okay, this is what I got:
                      >
                      > ank@mint-computer ~ $ date
                      > Sun Jul 31 15:31:36 JST 2011

                      Ok, this is correct

                      > hank@mint-computer ~ $ cat/proc/driver/rtc
                      > bash: cat/proc/driver/rtc: No such file or directory
                      > hank@mint-computer ~ $ cat/etc/timezone
                      > bash: cat/etc/timezone: No such file or directory

                      There has to be a space after cat, before the /
                      can you please try these two again?

                      > hank@mint-computer ~ $ locale
                      > LANG=en_US.UTF-8
                      > LC_CTYPE="en_US.UTF-8"
                      > LC_NUMERIC="en_US.UTF-8"
                      > LC_TIME="en_US.UTF-8"
                      > LC_COLLATE="en_US.UTF-8"
                      > LC_MONETARY="en_US.UTF-8"
                      > LC_MESSAGES="en_US.UTF-8"
                      > LC_PAPER="en_US.UTF-8"
                      > LC_NAME="en_US.UTF-8"
                      > LC_ADDRESS="en_US.UTF-8"
                      > LC_TELEPHONE="en_US.UTF-8"
                      > LC_MEASUREMENT="en_US.UTF-8"
                      > LC_IDENTIFICATION="en_US.UTF-8"
                      > LC_ALL=
                      > hank@mint-computer ~ $



                      >
                      > What do you think? Something haywire with my computer??  Should I change the computer time to
                      > UTC??
                      >

                      I'm not sure yet. Rereading your initial mail, I see that you have the
                      same issue with JT65HF, which if I'm not mistaken is a windows-only
                      program. Are you running that in the wine emulator?


                      Pf

                      --
                       Pierfrancesco Caci, ik5pvx
                    • Henri Honda
                      ... Yes, I have wine installed and JT65HF could be running under wine. I have the JT65 icon on the desktop and clicking on it brings up a window with various
                      Message 10 of 30 , Jul 31, 2011
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                        On 07/31/2011 03:45 PM, Pierfrancesco Caci wrote:  

                        On Sun, Jul 31, 2011 at 08:38, Henri Honda <k6don@...> wrote:
                        >
                        >
                        > IK5PVX:
                        >
                        > Okay, this is what I got:
                        >
                        > ank@mint-computer ~ $ date
                        > Sun Jul 31 15:31:36 JST 2011

                        Ok, this is correct

                        There has to be a space after cat, before the /
                        can you please try these two again?

                        Okay, this is what I got:

                        hank@mint-computer ~ $ cat /proc/driver/rtc
                        rtc_time    : 06:52:48
                        rtc_date    : 2011-07-31
                        alrm_time    : 16:23:02
                        alrm_date    : ****-**-**
                        alarm_IRQ    : no
                        alrm_pending    : no
                        24hr        : yes
                        periodic_IRQ    : no
                        update_IRQ    : no
                        HPET_emulated    : yes
                        BCD        : yes
                        DST_enable    : no
                        periodic_freq    : 1024
                        batt_status    : okay
                        hank@mint-computer ~ $ cat /etc/timezone
                        Asia/Tokyo

                        Yes, I have wine installed and JT65HF could be running under wine.  I have the JT65 icon on the
                        desktop and clicking on it brings up a window with various icons and the JT65HF exe. icon which
                        I click and the JT65 screen comes up.

                        I hope this helps you a little!  Thank you!

                        Hank 7J9AAD

                      • Pierfrancesco Caci
                        ... This one is correct as well ... and so is this. It doesn t seem to be a problem of the operating system per se. ... I see. What about fldigi? are you using
                        Message 11 of 30 , Jul 31, 2011
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                          On Sun, Jul 31, 2011 at 09:01, Henri Honda <k6don@...> wrote:
                          >
                          >
                          > On 07/31/2011 03:45 PM, Pierfrancesco Caci wrote:
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          > On Sun, Jul 31, 2011 at 08:38, Henri Honda <k6don@...> wrote:
                          > >
                          > >
                          > > IK5PVX:
                          > >
                          > > Okay, this is what I got:
                          > >
                          > > ank@mint-computer ~ $ date
                          > > Sun Jul 31 15:31:36 JST 2011
                          >
                          > Ok, this is correct
                          >
                          > There has to be a space after cat, before the /
                          > can you please try these two again?
                          >
                          > Okay, this is what I got:
                          >
                          > hank@mint-computer ~ $ cat /proc/driver/rtc
                          > rtc_time    : 06:52:48
                          > rtc_date    : 2011-07-31

                          This one is correct as well

                          > hank@mint-computer ~ $ cat /etc/timezone
                          > Asia/Tokyo

                          and so is this. It doesn't seem to be a problem of the operating
                          system per se.

                          >
                          > Yes, I have wine installed and JT65HF could be running under wine.  I have the JT65 icon on the
                          > desktop and clicking on it brings up a window with various icons and the JT65HF exe. icon which
                          > I click and the JT65 screen comes up.
                          >

                          I see. What about fldigi? are you using the native linux version, or
                          the windows one in wine for that one too?

                          Later today I'll try changing my laptop (running debian) to Asia/Tokio
                          and see how fldigi behaves for me.

                          Pf


                          --
                           Pierfrancesco Caci, ik5pvx
                        • Henri Honda
                          ... No, I m running the native Linux version, Pierfrancesco. Thank you for everything! 73, Hank
                          Message 12 of 30 , Jul 31, 2011
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                            On 07/31/2011 04:48 PM, Pierfrancesco Caci wrote:  


                            I see. What about fldigi? are you using the native linux version, or
                            the windows one in wine for that one too?

                            No, I'm running the native Linux version, Pierfrancesco.

                            Thank you for everything!

                            73,

                            Hank


                            Later today I'll try changing my laptop (running debian) to Asia/Tokio
                            and see how fldigi behaves for me.

                            Pf

                            --
                             Pierfrancesco Caci, ik5pvx


                          • Pierfrancesco Caci
                            ... One more bit of info Hank, what does the following command show on your computer? grep UTC /etc/default/rcS (again, there s a space before and after UTC
                            Message 13 of 30 , Jul 31, 2011
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                              On Sun, Jul 31, 2011 at 09:53, Henri Honda <k6don@...> wrote:
                              >
                              >
                              > On 07/31/2011 04:48 PM, Pierfrancesco Caci wrote:
                              >
                              > I see. What about fldigi? are you using the native linux version, or
                              > the windows one in wine for that one too?
                              >
                              > No, I'm running the native Linux version, Pierfrancesco.
                              >
                              > Thank you for everything!


                              One more bit of info Hank, what does the following command show on
                              your computer?

                              grep UTC /etc/default/rcS

                              (again, there's a space before and after UTC in there)


                              --
                               Pierfrancesco Caci, ik5pvx
                            • Pierfrancesco Caci
                              ... I can t reproduce the problem with Debian Stable. Couldn t also find anything relevant about Mint and timezones, besides an issue with the weather applet.
                              Message 14 of 30 , Jul 31, 2011
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                                On Sun, Jul 31, 2011 at 11:36, Pierfrancesco Caci <ik5pvx@...> wrote:
                                > On Sun, Jul 31, 2011 at 09:53, Henri Honda <k6don@...> wrote:
                                >>
                                >>
                                >> On 07/31/2011 04:48 PM, Pierfrancesco Caci wrote:
                                >>
                                >> I see. What about fldigi? are you using the native linux version, or
                                >> the windows one in wine for that one too?
                                >>
                                >> No, I'm running the native Linux version, Pierfrancesco.
                                >>
                                >> Thank you for everything!
                                >
                                >
                                > One more bit of info Hank, what does the following command show on
                                > your computer?
                                >
                                >  grep UTC  /etc/default/rcS
                                >
                                > (again, there's a space before and after UTC in there)
                                >


                                I can't reproduce the problem with Debian Stable.
                                Couldn't also find anything relevant about Mint and timezones, besides
                                an issue with the weather applet.


                                --
                                 Pierfrancesco Caci, ik5pvx
                              • Henri Honda
                                On 07/31/2011 08:01 PM, Pierfrancesco Caci wrote: One more bit of info Hank, what does the following command show on your computer? ... It shows: YES, UTC
                                Message 15 of 30 , Jul 31, 2011
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                                  On 07/31/2011 08:01 PM, Pierfrancesco Caci wrote:   >>> One more bit of info Hank, what does the following command show on your computer?


                                  >  grep UTC  /etc/default/rcS

                                  It shows:  YES, UTC

                                  that's all it shows, nothing else with that command.

                                  I checked Mint 8 which is also installed on the computer and the time problem is the same.
                                  Perhaps it could be the Mint OS??

                                  73,
                                  Hank 7J9AAD 

                                  >
                                  > (again, there's a space before and after UTC in there)
                                  >

                                  I can't reproduce the problem with Debian Stable.
                                  Couldn't also find anything relevant about Mint and timezones, besides
                                  an issue with the weather applet.

                                  --
                                   Pierfrancesco Caci, ik5pvx


                                • Pierfrancesco Caci
                                  ... Ok that s correct, since you showed earlier that your hardware clock is set to utc as it should be. ... I ve finished my ideas. It could be a problem in
                                  Message 16 of 30 , Jul 31, 2011
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                                    On Sun, Jul 31, 2011 at 13:13, Henri Honda <k6don@...> wrote:
                                    >
                                    >
                                    > On 07/31/2011 08:01 PM, Pierfrancesco Caci wrote:   >>> One more bit of info Hank, what does the following command show on your computer?
                                    >
                                    > >  grep UTC  /etc/default/rcS
                                    >
                                    > It shows:  YES, UTC
                                    >

                                    Ok that's correct, since you showed earlier that your hardware clock
                                    is set to utc as it should be.

                                    > that's all it shows, nothing else with that command.
                                    >
                                    > I checked Mint 8 which is also installed on the computer and the time problem is the same.
                                    > Perhaps it could be the Mint OS??

                                    I've finished my ideas. It could be a problem in one of the standard
                                    libraries, but it's strange that nothing came up when searching about
                                    it. I know there are others on this mailing list using Mint, so if
                                    someone else can try other things it could help.

                                    The fact that it happens in 2 different programs, but not in a third
                                    makes me think it's not something specific to those programs.

                                    Browsing the fldigi sources I find both gmtime and localtime used in
                                    different parts of the source tree.
                                    The two log fields (QSO time on and off) at the top of the main fldigi
                                    window are initialized by a call to gmtime,
                                    which returns UTC. I can't find any easy to understand reason for
                                    fldigi to show the time wrong.



                                    >
                                    > 73,
                                    > Hank 7J9AAD
                                    >
                                    > >
                                    > > (again, there's a space before and after UTC in there)
                                    > >
                                    >
                                    > I can't reproduce the problem with Debian Stable.
                                    > Couldn't also find anything relevant about Mint and timezones, besides
                                    > an issue with the weather applet.
                                    >
                                    > --
                                    >  Pierfrancesco Caci, ik5pvx
                                    >
                                    >
                                    >
                                    >


                                    --
                                     Pierfrancesco Caci, ik5pvx
                                  • Henri Honda
                                    ... Pierfrancesco: Thank you ever so much for all of your help in trying to find the problem. The time spent on my behalf is greatly appreciated! I have a
                                    Message 17 of 30 , Jul 31, 2011
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                                      On 07/31/2011 08:34 PM, Pierfrancesco Caci wrote:  


                                      Pierfrancesco:

                                      Thank you ever so much for all of your help in trying to find the problem.

                                      The time spent on my behalf is greatly appreciated!

                                      I have a sneaking suspicion that it could a problem with the clock in the system.  Could be that this
                                      Asus MB is the culprit???

                                      I'll have to go into it and see if there is anything amiss.

                                      Thanks again for all your help.  Have a great week, have fun and enjoy!!

                                      Best of health to you!

                                      73,

                                      Hank 7J9AAD


                                    • w1hkj
                                      ... I will compare the CQRLOG time implementation with that in fldigi. I ve also asked Petr (CQRLOG author) to do the same. 73, Dave, W1HKJ
                                      Message 18 of 30 , Jul 31, 2011
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                                        > Hi, ya'all!
                                        >
                                        > Has anyone had any problems with the time being incorrect in Fldigi
                                        > and JT65HF??
                                        >
                                        > I noticed last night that the time shown both in Fldigi and JT65HF is off
                                        > by one hour. That is, the time shown is one hour later than the time
                                        > shown in my computer. That is, when the computer shows 9 PM, both of
                                        > the above shows 12:00 UTC. The computer is set for local time here in
                                        > Japan. We are +9 from Greenwich.
                                        >
                                        > Odd, but the time shown in CRLOG is correct: e.i., 9 PM computer time,
                                        > CRLOG shows 13:00 UTC which is the correct offset.
                                        >
                                        > Is there any way to correct this?? I have the NTS installed. Or,
                                        > could it be a computer problem??
                                        >
                                        > Thank you for your comments/suggestions and have a nice one!
                                        >
                                        > Cheers and 73,
                                        >
                                        > Hank 7J9AAD
                                        I will compare the CQRLOG time implementation with that in fldigi. I've
                                        also asked Petr (CQRLOG author) to do the same.

                                        73, Dave, W1HKJ
                                      • Pierfrancesco Caci
                                        ... That could be the case if you see this happen in other programs. But you said Cqrlog doesn t show it. Let s see if someone else using Mint ever saw
                                        Message 19 of 30 , Jul 31, 2011
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                                          On Sun, Jul 31, 2011 at 14:23, Henri Honda <k6don@...> wrote:
                                          >
                                          >
                                          > On 07/31/2011 08:34 PM, Pierfrancesco Caci wrote:
                                          >
                                          >
                                          >
                                          > Pierfrancesco:
                                          >
                                          > Thank you ever so much for all of your help in trying to find the problem.
                                          >
                                          > The time spent on my behalf is greatly appreciated!
                                          >
                                          > I have a sneaking suspicion that it could a problem with the clock in the system.  Could be that this
                                          > Asus MB is the culprit???
                                          >
                                          > I'll have to go into it and see if there is anything amiss.

                                          That could be the case if you see this happen in other programs. But
                                          you said Cqrlog doesn't show it.
                                          Let's see if someone else using Mint ever saw something like this, or
                                          can reproduce the problem by setting his system to Asia/Tokio.



                                          --
                                           Pierfrancesco Caci, ik5pvx
                                        • Henri Honda
                                          ... Thank you, Dave 73, Hank 7J9AAD
                                          Message 20 of 30 , Jul 31, 2011
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                                            On 07/31/2011 10:12 PM, w1hkj wrote:

                                            I will compare the CQRLOG time implementation with that in fldigi. I've
                                            also asked Petr (CQRLOG author) to do the same.

                                            73, Dave, W1HKJ

                                            Thank you, Dave

                                            73,
                                            Hank 7J9AAD



                                          • Deaf Casa
                                            ...   73,Kevin RaperKJ4HYDCE WCKI WQIZ WLTQ There is no limitation to the fidelity of AM radio. From a mathematical standpoint, AM does better in frequency
                                            Message 21 of 30 , Jul 31, 2011
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                                              --- On Sun, 7/31/11, Kevin Raper <kj4hyd@...> wrote:
                                               
                                              73,
                                              Kevin Raper
                                              KJ4HYD
                                              CE WCKI WQIZ WLTQ

                                              There is no limitation to the fidelity of AM radio. From a mathematical standpoint, AM does better in frequency response than FM. - Leonard Kahn

                                              REPLY:

                                              Interesting statement.
                                              Maybe that's why you also hear all the unwanted noise and static as opposed to
                                              clean, quiet FM.
                                              (smile)

                                              72
                                              Ron, wb1hga


                                               
                                            • doc@kd4e.com
                                              Where theory meets real-world application lies the rub ... ... -- Thanks! & 73, KD4E David Colburn http://kd4e.com Have an http://ultrafidian.com day I don t
                                              Message 22 of 30 , Jul 31, 2011
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                                                Where theory meets real-world application lies the rub ...


                                                > There is no limitation to the fidelity of AM radio. From a
                                                > mathematical standpoint, AM does better in frequency response than
                                                > FM. - Leonard Kahn
                                                >
                                                > REPLY:
                                                >
                                                > Interesting statement.
                                                > Maybe that's why you also hear all the unwanted noise and static as
                                                > opposed to
                                                > clean, quiet FM.
                                                > (smile)
                                                >
                                                > 72
                                                > Ron, wb1hga

                                                --

                                                Thanks! & 73, KD4E
                                                David Colburn http://kd4e.com
                                                Have an http://ultrafidian.com day
                                                I don't google I SEARCH! STARTPAGE.com
                                                Shop Freedom-Friendly http://kd4e.com/of.html
                                              • Kevin Raper
                                                ... Listen to an AM Station that is Broadcasting in C-QUAM Stereo with an AMAX Certified AM Radio and you very well may change your mind about AM Forever. Bob
                                                Message 23 of 30 , Jul 31, 2011
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                                                  On Jul 31, 2011, at 2:08 PM, Deaf Casa wrote:

                                                  Maybe that's why you also hear all the unwanted noise and static as opposed to
                                                  clean, quiet FM.
                                                  (smile)

                                                  Listen to an AM Station that is Broadcasting in C-QUAM Stereo with an AMAX Certified AM Radio and you very well may change your mind about AM Forever. Bob Carver (of Carver Electronics fame) used to set up an AM Transmitter playing over his TX-11B Tuners and have Audiophiles do blind A/B Tests between the CD and his Tuner. The ones that could tell a difference chose the AM over the CD! LOL

                                                  Also ask any Ham that works the AM Windows on 75 or 160 Meters, They will tell you AM has the best Fidelity of any other Mode.

                                                  They key to a good sounding AM plant is to have a good Antenna Network and Ground. I will put the Audio of any of My AMs against any other station in their market, AM or FM.

                                                   Ask the GM, I am a fussy SOB about the Audio of my AMs! LOL

                                                  73,
                                                  Kevin Raper
                                                  KJ4HYD
                                                  CE WCKI WQIZ WLTQ

                                                  There is no limitation to the fidelity of AM radio. From a mathematical standpoint, AM does better in frequency response than FM. - Leonard Kahn




                                                • Kevin Raper
                                                  ... When you get a GOOD AM tuner like the CCRadio-EP or the Sangean HDT-1x instead of the cheap junk at Radio Shack, you then lean how GREAT AM Radio can sound
                                                  Message 24 of 30 , Jul 31, 2011
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                                                    On Jul 31, 2011, at 2:10 PM, doc@... wrote:

                                                    Where theory meets real-world application lies the rub ...

                                                    When you get a GOOD AM tuner like the CCRadio-EP or the Sangean HDT-1x instead of the cheap junk at Radio Shack, you then lean how GREAT AM Radio can sound and get mad that you had been jipped for all of these Years.

                                                    73,
                                                    Kevin Raper
                                                    KJ4HYD
                                                    CE WCKI WQIZ WLTQ

                                                    There is no limitation to the fidelity of AM radio. From a mathematical standpoint, AM does better in frequency response than FM. - Leonard Kahn




                                                  • doc@kd4e.com
                                                    I have a Sony XDR F1HD AM/FM tuner. WDYT? ... -- Thanks! & 73,
                                                    Message 25 of 30 , Jul 31, 2011
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                                                      I have a Sony XDR F1HD AM/FM tuner.

                                                      <http://reviews.cnet.com/radio-tuners/sony-xdr-f1hd/4507-7866_7-32987435.html?tag=mncolBtm;rnav>

                                                      WDYT?

                                                      > On Jul 31, 2011, at 2:10 PM, doc@... <mailto:doc@...> wrote:
                                                      >
                                                      >> Where theory meets real-world application lies the rub ...
                                                      >
                                                      > When you get a GOOD AM tuner like the CCRadio-EP or the Sangean HDT-1x
                                                      > instead of the cheap junk at Radio Shack, you then lean how GREAT AM
                                                      > Radio can sound and get mad that you had been jipped for all of these Years.
                                                      >
                                                      > 73,
                                                      > Kevin Raper
                                                      > KJ4HYD
                                                      > CE WCKI WQIZ WLTQ
                                                      >
                                                      > There is no limitation to the fidelity of AM radio. From a mathematical
                                                      > standpoint, AM does better in frequency response than FM. - Leonard Kahn


                                                      --

                                                      Thanks! & 73, KD4E
                                                      David Colburn http://kd4e.com
                                                      Have an http://ultrafidian.com day
                                                      I don't google I SEARCH! STARTPAGE.com
                                                      Shop Freedom-Friendly http://kd4e.com/of.html
                                                    • Kevin Raper
                                                      ... The Sony is much like the Sangean HDT-1 Original Model that cuts off the Analog AM response at 5KHz. It makes the AM on Analog sound the same as a
                                                      Message 26 of 30 , Jul 31, 2011
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                                                        On Jul 31, 2011, at 5:54 PM, doc@... wrote:

                                                        I have a Sony XDR F1HD AM/FM tuner.

                                                        <http://reviews.cnet.com/radio-tuners/sony-xdr-f1hd/4507-7866_7-32987435.html?tag=mncolBtm;rnav>

                                                        WDYT?

                                                        The Sony is much like the Sangean HDT-1 Original Model that cuts off the Analog AM response at 5KHz. It makes the AM on Analog sound the same as a Telephone Call as far as the Audio Quality goes.

                                                        The Sangean HDT-1X Extends the Analog Response to 10 KHz NRSC Standard and makes a BIG difference in Sound Quality.

                                                        For the BEST AM on the market today, the Fanfare FTA-100 is the one to get. They even out perform the legendary and out of Production Carver TX-11b


                                                        73,
                                                        Kevin Raper
                                                        KJ4HYD
                                                        CE WCKI WQIZ WLTQ

                                                        There is no limitation to the fidelity of AM radio. From a mathematical standpoint, AM does better in frequency response than FM. - Leonard Kahn




                                                      • doc@kd4e.com
                                                        Why would Sony do that, please? It seems an arbitrary and unnecessary limitation to impose. Then again, there s not much in the way of AM out here in the
                                                        Message 27 of 30 , Jul 31, 2011
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                                                          Why would Sony do that, please?

                                                          It seems an arbitrary and unnecessary limitation to impose.

                                                          Then again, there's not much in the way of AM out here in
                                                          the country, so little opportunity to take advantage of
                                                          big-city fidelity!

                                                          :-)

                                                          >> I have a Sony XDR F1HD AM/FM tuner.
                                                          >>
                                                          >> <http://reviews.cnet.com/radio-tuners/sony-xdr-f1hd/4507-7866_7-32987435.html?tag=mncolBtm;rnav>
                                                          >>
                                                          >> WDYT?
                                                          >
                                                          > The Sony is much like the Sangean HDT-1 Original Model that cuts off the
                                                          > Analog AM response at 5KHz. It makes the AM on Analog sound the same as
                                                          > a Telephone Call as far as the Audio Quality goes.
                                                          >
                                                          > The Sangean HDT-1X Extends the Analog Response to 10 KHz NRSC Standard
                                                          > and makes a BIG difference in Sound Quality.
                                                          >
                                                          > For the BEST AM on the market today, the Fanfare FTA-100 is the one to
                                                          > get. They even out perform the legendary and out of Production Carver TX-11b
                                                          >
                                                          > http://www.fanfarefm.com/products#!__audtuners
                                                          >
                                                          > 73,
                                                          > Kevin Raper
                                                          > KJ4HYD
                                                          > CE WCKI WQIZ WLTQ
                                                          >
                                                          > There is no limitation to the fidelity of AM radio. From a mathematical
                                                          > standpoint, AM does better in frequency response than FM. - Leonard Kahn

                                                          --

                                                          Thanks! & 73, KD4E
                                                          David Colburn http://kd4e.com
                                                          Have an http://ultrafidian.com day
                                                          I don't google I SEARCH! STARTPAGE.com
                                                          Shop Freedom-Friendly http://kd4e.com/of.html
                                                        • Kevin Raper
                                                          ... It is part of the original HD-Radio Specs than Analog Mode would do that. Sangean really went out on a limb to make a High Fidelity AM Stereo Analog Tuner
                                                          Message 28 of 30 , Jul 31, 2011
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                                                            On Jul 31, 2011, at 6:28 PM, doc@... wrote:

                                                            > Why would Sony do that, please?

                                                            It is part of the original HD-Radio Specs than Analog Mode would do that. Sangean really went out on a limb to make a High Fidelity AM Stereo Analog Tuner in the same box as the AM HD-Radio tuner! It is technically a violation of their Ibiquty HD-Radio license to do that.

                                                            > It seems an arbitrary and unnecessary limitation to impose.

                                                            Agreed!

                                                            > Then again, there's not much in the way of AM out here in
                                                            > the country, so little opportunity to take advantage of
                                                            > big-city fidelity!

                                                            I am in Rural Laurens County, SC, yet we have a Station broadcasting in Full High Fidelity AM Stereo, 1410 WPCC!

                                                            I am good friends with their Engineer and he is nearly as fussy as I am about Audio Quality!

                                                            73,
                                                            Kevin Raper
                                                            KJ4HYD
                                                            CE WCKI WQIZ WLTQ

                                                            There is no limitation to the fidelity of AM radio. From a mathematical standpoint, AM does better in frequency response than FM. - Leonard Kahn
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