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Lucas's blog and chickens

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  • Andrius Kulikauskas
    Lucas, I have been reading your blog at our wiki http://www.ourculture.info/wiki.cgi?LucasGonzalezSantaCruz/Blog regarding your work on preparations for a
    Message 1 of 5 , Oct 5, 2006
    • 0 Attachment
      Lucas, I have been reading your blog at our wiki
      http://www.ourculture.info/wiki.cgi?LucasGonzalezSantaCruz/Blog
      regarding your work on preparations for a possible pandemic flu.
      I reply to your working group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/mejoresvias/
      on creative collaboration.

      You probably know, we've started work on a major project
      http://www.myfoodstory.com to start an online resource for the world's
      food supply chain. We'll be featuring one crop each month. I'm drawing
      connections between a crop (such as "fish") and a human value (such as
      "sustainability") and a technology that supports them (such as George
      Chan's integrated farming and waste management).

      I spoke with Pamela McLean as to whether we might think of a crop that
      relates to her key concept of "learning from each other". One idea that
      came up was poultry. Chickens may foster our "learning from each other"
      because of our many different interconnections with them:
      - their life cycle - they yield both eggs and meat - and they
      - they can find some food for themselves, but they also need supplements
      - they are both social and individual, having a hierarchy
      - they have contact with other bird species which opens them up to both
      immunity and disease
      - through such contact they depend on the situation locally
      - they are kept for times indoors and for times outdoors
      - they are a distinct "package", both as eggs and as meat
      - they have significant impact on our nutrition
      - they interact with other farm animals.
      All of this to say that keeping chickens may require a lot of knowledge,
      but especially, a lot of sensitivity to applying that knowledge. I
      think of it as comparable to a parent who needs to watch their child's
      behavior to adjust the dose of a medication that they may need, such as
      for Turett's syndrome, so they don't get too much or too little.
      Similarly, a poultry farmer may need to consistently learn how to
      navigate the risk factors for their chicken. And likewise, consumers of
      chickens might pay more attention to how fresh the birds are, where they
      come from, what they eat, the season in the year, any chemicals they are
      fed, and so on.

      If there is such a connection (perhaps there is?), then we can ask, what
      technology fosters that? One technology which Janet Feldman brought up
      is community radio.

      If we were to organize a poultry team, then we could also have the
      opportunity to do something bird flu related. Lucas, I was wondering if
      you had any thoughts on all this, if you might see some possible
      connections?

      Trying to "find better ways together",

      Andrius

      Andrius Kulikauskas
      Minciu Sodas
      http://www.ms.lt
      ms@...
      +370 (5) 264 5950
      +370 (699) 30003
      Vilnius, Lithuania


      -----------------------------------------------------------------------------
      From Lucas Gonzalez Santa Cruz's blog:

      2006-10-01

      * Why worry:
      o
      http://www.fluwikie.com/pmwiki.php?n=Science.OpinionAboutAFluPandemic
      o
      http://www.fluwikie.com/pmwiki.php?n=Science.GraphOfClusterSizeAndFrequencyOverTime
      o
      http://www.fluwikie2.com/pmwiki.php?n=Forum.ASeverePandemicIsLikelyPart5
      o Helen Branswell writes about poor. Find link.
      * Gotta focus on:
      o
      http://www.fluwikie.com/pmwiki.php?n=Main.PandemicFluAwarenessWeek2006
      o
      http://www.fluwikie.com/pmwiki.php?n=Consequences.RespiratoryPreventionPackage
      o http://www.fluwikie.com/pmwiki.php?n=Brainstorming.SimpleMasks

      Comments

      AndriusKulikauskas: Lucas, Thank you for keeping us posted. We just got
      a request for MinciuSodas to support a proposal for a bird flu disaster
      related project. Also, I think that Pamela McLean might host chicken as
      the crop to feature for learning from each other in our work on
      http://www.myfoodstory.com Do you have thoughts on a related technology,
      especially one that would foster learning from each other?

      LucasGonzalez: Andrius, A bird flu disaster related project? I don't
      know much about birds. My concern is pandemic flu - in humans. But if
      you tell me the details then I may look for some links. (I've been
      looking at how much food comes from what distance. Most here is from far
      away. I need look no deeper for the time being.) Also, "a related
      technology"? I don't know what you mean. I'll get some sleep.

      2006-09-28

      Please, help translate from English into other languages:

      *
      http://www.fluwikie.com/pmwiki.php?n=Main.Es-PandemicFluAwarenessWeek2006
      * http://www.fluwikie.com/pmwiki.php?n=Main.Es-PressRelease

      2006-09-23

      * http://www.fluwikie.com/pmwiki.php?n=Main.PandemicFluAwarenessWeek2006
      * http://www.fluwikie.com/pmwiki.php?n=Main.PressRelease
      * http://www.fluwikie.com/pmwiki.php?n=Opinion.OutlineSummary
      * http://www.worldchanging.com/archives/004975.html
      * Food security, safety, sustainability.
      * Catching up on sleep.

      2006-09-14

      * http://www.breathingearth.net/
      * http://www.birdshot.cc/
      * http://www.fluwikie.com/pmwiki.php?n=Main.PandemicFluAwarenessWeek2006
      * http://www.fluwikie.com/pmwiki.php?n=Main.PressRelease
      * http://www.fluwikie.com/pmwiki.php?n=Opinion.ForumTopics

      2006-09-13

      Conversación con Stella. "Seguridad" alimentaria, proyecto de
      investigación. Bill Morrison. Instituto de Permacultura, red caórdica.
      ¿Proceso gradual? ¿Aprendizaje acelerado?

      2006-09-07

      * Still catching up.
      o Using mindmaps helps me a bit in remapping things for myself
      and others.
      o There's this idea to have sharable mindmaps - we could in
      time have (or rather encourage) a repository of public domain mindmaps -
      in PNG or XML formats.
      o Whatever became of touchgraph?
      * Flu:
      o Folks at fluwikie are thinking about a "pandemic influenza
      awareness week",
      o and also about communication in a pandemic,
      o while avian flu in humans keeps boiling.

      Comments

      Lucas, you may see I have diagrammed our workflow and have started
      sorting our letters accordingly. Perhaps you might be interested to mind
      map, for example, our projects: http://www.ms.lt/?action=Project Or to
      mind map our Bird Flu letters. If you're interested in the latter I
      could try to program a search function that would catch and index all
      our letters that mention the "flu" or "pandemic" or another term. Let me
      know! AndriusKulikauskas September 8, 2006 1:50 CET

      2006-09-03

      * Social distancing will be explored in practice. I wonder about
      different parts of the world. And of course different levels of
      motivation - but believing it would help would be a motivation.
      * New York City is apparently not prepared for a pandemic (not
      surprising). Andrius' "dealing with sudden massive population spread"
      does need further thinking. Lots of it. I wonder how, and who with. :-?

      2006-08-31

      * Blog:

      Ok, glad to be welcomed back - home! Some folks at fluwikie "get it"
      regarding chicken farming. They should be linked to ZERI and friends.
      Worth a read, in time.

      * Conversation:

      AndriusKulikauskas: Lucas, it's great to see you back! Thank you for
      alerting me to FrenchieGirl at FluWiki. I wrote her an invitation to
      join us.

      Heh - you're fast, Andrius! Whether that invitation will work or not is
      up to the future to tell us. We may need to find ways to include or be
      of value to people who can't or won't work with their full names out
      there in the open. Another one for the back-burner.

      And I have some stuff I've been thinking about - I'll be "present" in 10
      more days, I hope. I need to finish off and catch up on a few things.
      Wouldn't mind a summary or two, but that's not possible so I'll just
      catch up slowly.

      Thanks! Lucas
    • Pamela McLean
      Hi Andrius. Regarding chickens and possible input.to http://www.myfoodstory.com As discussed, when it comes to chickens and learning from each other I can only
      Message 2 of 5 , Oct 5, 2006
      • 0 Attachment
        Hi Andrius.

        Regarding chickens and possible input.to http://www.myfoodstory.com

        As discussed, when it comes to chickens and learning from each other I
        can only act as an intermediary - putting you/your team in contact with
        an information source in Nigeria. I am cautious of offering any such
        introduction because I know how difficult it is to establish and
        maintain anything like an effective flow of information from rural
        Nigeria - but if the difficulties are understood and embraced then we
        could try..

        Please be aware that I have not yet asked Kazanka Comfort about her
        possible involvement, because her time online is limited, and I do not
        want to waste it with "perhaps and possibly" emails. If we come up with
        a serious plan then we will put it to her.

        As you know I am currently exploring ways of organising Cawdnet's
        collaborative work through the use of Moodle at "Cawdnet Campus". We are
        already finding it a good fit for managing information in the ways that
        we need to do - and we also like various features that although we have
        yet to apply them, we know will be useful and available to us.

        We think of Cawdnet Campus as a collection of "information cupboards" -
        one for each Special Interest Group. We are trying to make it equally
        suitable for the needs and expectation of two different types of
        contributors/users - one type is "bandwidth rich" the other is
        "bandwidth poor". Our challenge is to find the most effective ways to
        accept, order and present information so that the system is equally
        considerate to the needs of both groups - to get the right balance
        between "info pull" and "info push" to suit different circumstances.. It
        is still very early stages, but we are learning all the time about what
        does, and does not work, in setting up and maintaining an effective SIG
        at Cawdnet Campus.

        If you do want to include input from rural Nigeria, then I suggest that
        link is managed through a new Cawdnet Campus group - even if that group
        only consists of one representative from Nigeria and one from your team
        on the bandwidth rich (BR) side. It would be the responsibility of the
        BR person to make it as easy as possible for the bandwidth poor (BP)
        contributor to be informed and involved, without being faced with too
        much information. I will explain more what I mean if it seems likely to
        happen.

        If it does seem likely to happen then I suggest we ask Comfort if we can
        focus on her turkey farm, and chickens too - that is if it she has her
        poultry work up and running again after the bird flu scare. It is very
        small scale - but close to Internet connectivity - so close that the
        birds scratch around in the area of the Fantsuam Foundation compound
        where the satellite dish for the Internet is located. Nigerians use the
        word "farm" to include large and small enterprises, including things of
        a size that in the UK we would describe as "small-holdings", or
        "allotments", or even "gardens".

        I suggest that we ask Comfort to allocate one of the "volunteers" at
        Fantsuam to collect information from her and contribute it to the
        Cawdnet Campus SIG on poultry farms, set up for the purpose. The term
        "volunteer" at FF covers a wide variety of relationships - but most need
        to earn money, so there could well be someone willing to fill the role
        you want. NB English is unlikely to be the volunteer's first language -
        something else that the BR person needs to bear in mind regarding
        expectations about communication.

        The BR person needs to be prepared for cultural differences too. For
        example - regarding attitudes to time - it seems that the local
        languages have no equivalent for the term "deadline" - as I hear that
        English word dropped into conversations that are otherwise completely
        unintelligible to me ;-) The BR must be prepared for a different pace
        to life....

        These are the kind of issues that make me question if it is appropriate
        for us to be connected with this particular project, which I think is
        time dependent, and requires plenty of communication, and focuses on a
        topic which we does not yet have an active group set up at Cawdnet Campus.

        Pam

        Andrius Kulikauskas wrote:

        >Lucas, I have been reading your blog at our wiki
        >http://www.ourculture.info/wiki.cgi?LucasGonzalezSantaCruz/Blog
        >regarding your work on preparations for a possible pandemic flu.
        >I reply to your working group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/mejoresvias/
        >on creative collaboration.
        >
        >You probably know, we've started work on a major project
        >http://www.myfoodstory.com to start an online resource for the world's
        >food supply chain. We'll be featuring one crop each month. I'm drawing
        >connections between a crop (such as "fish") and a human value (such as
        >"sustainability") and a technology that supports them (such as George
        >Chan's integrated farming and waste management).
        >
        >I spoke with Pamela McLean as to whether we might think of a crop that
        >relates to her key concept of "learning from each other". One idea that
        >came up was poultry. Chickens may foster our "learning from each other"
        >because of our many different interconnections with them:
        >- their life cycle - they yield both eggs and meat - and they
        >- they can find some food for themselves, but they also need supplements
        >- they are both social and individual, having a hierarchy
        >- they have contact with other bird species which opens them up to both
        >immunity and disease
        >- through such contact they depend on the situation locally
        >- they are kept for times indoors and for times outdoors
        >- they are a distinct "package", both as eggs and as meat
        >- they have significant impact on our nutrition
        >- they interact with other farm animals.
        >All of this to say that keeping chickens may require a lot of knowledge,
        >but especially, a lot of sensitivity to applying that knowledge. I
        >think of it as comparable to a parent who needs to watch their child's
        >behavior to adjust the dose of a medication that they may need, such as
        >for Turett's syndrome, so they don't get too much or too little.
        >Similarly, a poultry farmer may need to consistently learn how to
        >navigate the risk factors for their chicken. And likewise, consumers of
        >chickens might pay more attention to how fresh the birds are, where they
        >come from, what they eat, the season in the year, any chemicals they are
        >fed, and so on.
        >
        >If there is such a connection (perhaps there is?), then we can ask, what
        >technology fosters that? One technology which Janet Feldman brought up
        >is community radio.
        >
        >If we were to organize a poultry team, then we could also have the
        >opportunity to do something bird flu related. Lucas, I was wondering if
        >you had any thoughts on all this, if you might see some possible
        >connections?
        >
        >Trying to "find better ways together",
        >
        >Andrius
        >
        >Andrius Kulikauskas
        >Minciu Sodas
        >http://www.ms.lt
        >ms@...
        >+370 (5) 264 5950
        >+370 (699) 30003
        >Vilnius, Lithuania
        >
        >
        >-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
        > From Lucas Gonzalez Santa Cruz's blog:
        >
        >2006-10-01
        >
        > * Why worry:
        > o
        >http://www.fluwikie.com/pmwiki.php?n=Science.OpinionAboutAFluPandemic
        > o
        >http://www.fluwikie.com/pmwiki.php?n=Science.GraphOfClusterSizeAndFrequencyOverTime
        > o
        >http://www.fluwikie2.com/pmwiki.php?n=Forum.ASeverePandemicIsLikelyPart5
        > o Helen Branswell writes about poor. Find link.
        > * Gotta focus on:
        > o
        >http://www.fluwikie.com/pmwiki.php?n=Main.PandemicFluAwarenessWeek2006
        > o
        >http://www.fluwikie.com/pmwiki.php?n=Consequences.RespiratoryPreventionPackage
        > o http://www.fluwikie.com/pmwiki.php?n=Brainstorming.SimpleMasks
        >
        >Comments
        >
        >AndriusKulikauskas: Lucas, Thank you for keeping us posted. We just got
        >a request for MinciuSodas to support a proposal for a bird flu disaster
        >related project. Also, I think that Pamela McLean might host chicken as
        >the crop to feature for learning from each other in our work on
        >http://www.myfoodstory.com Do you have thoughts on a related technology,
        >especially one that would foster learning from each other?
        >
        >LucasGonzalez: Andrius, A bird flu disaster related project? I don't
        >know much about birds. My concern is pandemic flu - in humans. But if
        >you tell me the details then I may look for some links. (I've been
        >looking at how much food comes from what distance. Most here is from far
        >away. I need look no deeper for the time being.) Also, "a related
        >technology"? I don't know what you mean. I'll get some sleep.
        >
        >2006-09-28
        >
        >Please, help translate from English into other languages:
        >
        > *
        >http://www.fluwikie.com/pmwiki.php?n=Main.Es-PandemicFluAwarenessWeek2006
        > * http://www.fluwikie.com/pmwiki.php?n=Main.Es-PressRelease
        >
        >2006-09-23
        >
        > * http://www.fluwikie.com/pmwiki.php?n=Main.PandemicFluAwarenessWeek2006
        > * http://www.fluwikie.com/pmwiki.php?n=Main.PressRelease
        > * http://www.fluwikie.com/pmwiki.php?n=Opinion.OutlineSummary
        > * http://www.worldchanging.com/archives/004975.html
        > * Food security, safety, sustainability.
        > * Catching up on sleep.
        >
        >2006-09-14
        >
        > * http://www.breathingearth.net/
        > * http://www.birdshot.cc/
        > * http://www.fluwikie.com/pmwiki.php?n=Main.PandemicFluAwarenessWeek2006
        > * http://www.fluwikie.com/pmwiki.php?n=Main.PressRelease
        > * http://www.fluwikie.com/pmwiki.php?n=Opinion.ForumTopics
        >
        >2006-09-13
        >
        >Conversación con Stella. "Seguridad" alimentaria, proyecto de
        >investigación. Bill Morrison. Instituto de Permacultura, red caórdica.
        >¿Proceso gradual? ¿Aprendizaje acelerado?
        >
        >2006-09-07
        >
        > * Still catching up.
        > o Using mindmaps helps me a bit in remapping things for myself
        >and others.
        > o There's this idea to have sharable mindmaps - we could in
        >time have (or rather encourage) a repository of public domain mindmaps -
        >in PNG or XML formats.
        > o Whatever became of touchgraph?
        > * Flu:
        > o Folks at fluwikie are thinking about a "pandemic influenza
        >awareness week",
        > o and also about communication in a pandemic,
        > o while avian flu in humans keeps boiling.
        >
        >Comments
        >
        >Lucas, you may see I have diagrammed our workflow and have started
        >sorting our letters accordingly. Perhaps you might be interested to mind
        >map, for example, our projects: http://www.ms.lt/?action=Project Or to
        >mind map our Bird Flu letters. If you're interested in the latter I
        >could try to program a search function that would catch and index all
        >our letters that mention the "flu" or "pandemic" or another term. Let me
        >know! AndriusKulikauskas September 8, 2006 1:50 CET
        >
        >2006-09-03
        >
        > * Social distancing will be explored in practice. I wonder about
        >different parts of the world. And of course different levels of
        >motivation - but believing it would help would be a motivation.
        > * New York City is apparently not prepared for a pandemic (not
        >surprising). Andrius' "dealing with sudden massive population spread"
        >does need further thinking. Lots of it. I wonder how, and who with. :-?
        >
        >2006-08-31
        >
        > * Blog:
        >
        >Ok, glad to be welcomed back - home! Some folks at fluwikie "get it"
        >regarding chicken farming. They should be linked to ZERI and friends.
        >Worth a read, in time.
        >
        > * Conversation:
        >
        >AndriusKulikauskas: Lucas, it's great to see you back! Thank you for
        >alerting me to FrenchieGirl at FluWiki. I wrote her an invitation to
        >join us.
        >
        >Heh - you're fast, Andrius! Whether that invitation will work or not is
        >up to the future to tell us. We may need to find ways to include or be
        >of value to people who can't or won't work with their full names out
        >there in the open. Another one for the back-burner.
        >
        >And I have some stuff I've been thinking about - I'll be "present" in 10
        >more days, I hope. I need to finish off and catch up on a few things.
        >Wouldn't mind a summary or two, but that's not possible so I'll just
        >catch up slowly.
        >
        >Thanks! Lucas
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >Each letter sent to Learning From Each Other enters the PUBLIC DOMAIN unless it explicitly states otherwise http://www.ethicalpublicdomain.org Please be kind to our authors!
        >Yahoo! Groups Links
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
        >
      • Andrius Kulikauskas
        Pamela, Yes, thank you for your thoughtful letter which I share. Indeed, Moodle and other online technologies for managing relationships between bandwidth rich
        Message 3 of 5 , Oct 5, 2006
        • 0 Attachment
          Pamela, Yes, thank you for your thoughtful letter which I share.

          Indeed, Moodle and other online technologies for managing relationships
          between bandwidth rich and poor might be exactly what's relevant here,
          and something that you're definitely interested in. Another such
          technology is TiddlyWiki by Jeremy Ruston, http://www.tiddlywiki.com
          which is a wiki that is based on JavaScript and stores all the data on a
          single HTML page that can be accessed and updated offline. Jeremy is
          working for Greg Wolff's UnaMesa Association and Greg is encouraging us
          to work together. I'm especially interested that he might adapt
          TiddlyWiki further for use offline and then synchronize as you suggest.
          Also, I will be developing a questionnaire-driven interface based on
          Helmut Leitner's ProWiki page formats and perhaps we can exchange data
          with TiddlyWiki, too. Jeremy, I Cc you and I invite you to join our
          Minciu Sodas laboratory's working group
          http://groups.yahoo.com/group/workinginparallel/ (send a blank message
          to workinginparallel-subscribe@yahoogroups.com) which at our lab is the
          best place to work on such technological questions. I look forward to
          writing more and engaging you regarding our lab's work
          http://www.foodstory.com for UnaMesa Association. Jeremy Ruston and
          Pamela McLean http://www.ms.lt/?thinker=Pamela_McLean are both based in
          London.

          Lucas, with your guidance as we develop such a channel for poultry
          people in bandwidth rich and bandwith poor areas to connect, we could
          use that to share information regarding a possible human flu pandemic
          that might arise from bird flu. If you might advise and inspire, I
          could find a team leader and field agents that could bring out such
          connections.

          Andrius

          Andrius Kulikauskas
          Minciu Sodas
          http://www.ms.lt
          ms@...
          +370 (5) 264 5950
          +370 (699) 30003
          skype: minciusodas
          Vilnius, Lithuania

          Pamela McLean wrote:
          > Hi Andrius.
          >
          > Regarding chickens and possible input.to http://www.myfoodstory.com
          >
          > As discussed, when it comes to chickens and learning from each other I
          > can only act as an intermediary - putting you/your team in contact with
          > an information source in Nigeria. I am cautious of offering any such
          > introduction because I know how difficult it is to establish and
          > maintain anything like an effective flow of information from rural
          > Nigeria - but if the difficulties are understood and embraced then we
          > could try..
          >
          > Please be aware that I have not yet asked Kazanka Comfort about her
          > possible involvement, because her time online is limited, and I do not
          > want to waste it with "perhaps and possibly" emails. If we come up with
          > a serious plan then we will put it to her.
          >
          > As you know I am currently exploring ways of organising Cawdnet's
          > collaborative work through the use of Moodle at "Cawdnet Campus". We are
          > already finding it a good fit for managing information in the ways that
          > we need to do - and we also like various features that although we have
          > yet to apply them, we know will be useful and available to us.
          >
          > We think of Cawdnet Campus as a collection of "information cupboards" -
          > one for each Special Interest Group. We are trying to make it equally
          > suitable for the needs and expectation of two different types of
          > contributors/users - one type is "bandwidth rich" the other is
          > "bandwidth poor". Our challenge is to find the most effective ways to
          > accept, order and present information so that the system is equally
          > considerate to the needs of both groups - to get the right balance
          > between "info pull" and "info push" to suit different circumstances.. It
          > is still very early stages, but we are learning all the time about what
          > does, and does not work, in setting up and maintaining an effective SIG
          > at Cawdnet Campus.
          >
          > If you do want to include input from rural Nigeria, then I suggest that
          > link is managed through a new Cawdnet Campus group - even if that group
          > only consists of one representative from Nigeria and one from your team
          > on the bandwidth rich (BR) side. It would be the responsibility of the
          > BR person to make it as easy as possible for the bandwidth poor (BP)
          > contributor to be informed and involved, without being faced with too
          > much information. I will explain more what I mean if it seems likely to
          > happen.
          >
          > If it does seem likely to happen then I suggest we ask Comfort if we can
          > focus on her turkey farm, and chickens too - that is if it she has her
          > poultry work up and running again after the bird flu scare. It is very
          > small scale - but close to Internet connectivity - so close that the
          > birds scratch around in the area of the Fantsuam Foundation compound
          > where the satellite dish for the Internet is located. Nigerians use the
          > word "farm" to include large and small enterprises, including things of
          > a size that in the UK we would describe as "small-holdings", or
          > "allotments", or even "gardens".
          >
          > I suggest that we ask Comfort to allocate one of the "volunteers" at
          > Fantsuam to collect information from her and contribute it to the
          > Cawdnet Campus SIG on poultry farms, set up for the purpose. The term
          > "volunteer" at FF covers a wide variety of relationships - but most need
          > to earn money, so there could well be someone willing to fill the role
          > you want. NB English is unlikely to be the volunteer's first language -
          > something else that the BR person needs to bear in mind regarding
          > expectations about communication.
          >
          > The BR person needs to be prepared for cultural differences too. For
          > example - regarding attitudes to time - it seems that the local
          > languages have no equivalent for the term "deadline" - as I hear that
          > English word dropped into conversations that are otherwise completely
          > unintelligible to me ;-) The BR must be prepared for a different pace
          > to life....
          >
          > These are the kind of issues that make me question if it is appropriate
          > for us to be connected with this particular project, which I think is
          > time dependent, and requires plenty of communication, and focuses on a
          > topic which we does not yet have an active group set up at Cawdnet Campus.
          >
          > Pam
          >
          > Andrius Kulikauskas wrote:
          >
          >
          >> Lucas, I have been reading your blog at our wiki
          >> http://www.ourculture.info/wiki.cgi?LucasGonzalezSantaCruz/Blog
          >> regarding your work on preparations for a possible pandemic flu.
          >> I reply to your working group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/mejoresvias/
          >> on creative collaboration.
          >>
          >> You probably know, we've started work on a major project
          >> http://www.myfoodstory.com to start an online resource for the world's
          >> food supply chain. We'll be featuring one crop each month. I'm drawing
          >> connections between a crop (such as "fish") and a human value (such as
          >> "sustainability") and a technology that supports them (such as George
          >> Chan's integrated farming and waste management).
          >>
          >> I spoke with Pamela McLean as to whether we might think of a crop that
          >> relates to her key concept of "learning from each other". One idea that
          >> came up was poultry. Chickens may foster our "learning from each other"
          >> because of our many different interconnections with them:
          >> - their life cycle - they yield both eggs and meat - and they
          >> - they can find some food for themselves, but they also need supplements
          >> - they are both social and individual, having a hierarchy
          >> - they have contact with other bird species which opens them up to both
          >> immunity and disease
          >> - through such contact they depend on the situation locally
          >> - they are kept for times indoors and for times outdoors
          >> - they are a distinct "package", both as eggs and as meat
          >> - they have significant impact on our nutrition
          >> - they interact with other farm animals.
          >> All of this to say that keeping chickens may require a lot of knowledge,
          >> but especially, a lot of sensitivity to applying that knowledge. I
          >> think of it as comparable to a parent who needs to watch their child's
          >> behavior to adjust the dose of a medication that they may need, such as
          >> for Turett's syndrome, so they don't get too much or too little.
          >> Similarly, a poultry farmer may need to consistently learn how to
          >> navigate the risk factors for their chicken. And likewise, consumers of
          >> chickens might pay more attention to how fresh the birds are, where they
          >> come from, what they eat, the season in the year, any chemicals they are
          >> fed, and so on.
          >>
          >> If there is such a connection (perhaps there is?), then we can ask, what
          >> technology fosters that? One technology which Janet Feldman brought up
          >> is community radio.
          >>
          >> If we were to organize a poultry team, then we could also have the
          >> opportunity to do something bird flu related. Lucas, I was wondering if
          >> you had any thoughts on all this, if you might see some possible
          >> connections?
          >>
          >> Trying to "find better ways together",
          >>
          >> Andrius
          >>
          >> Andrius Kulikauskas
          >> Minciu Sodas
          >> http://www.ms.lt
          >> ms@...
          >> +370 (5) 264 5950
          >> +370 (699) 30003
          >> Vilnius, Lithuania
          >>
          >>
          >> -----------------------------------------------------------------------------
          >> From Lucas Gonzalez Santa Cruz's blog:
          >>
          >> 2006-10-01
          >>
          >> * Why worry:
          >> o
          >> http://www.fluwikie.com/pmwiki.php?n=Science.OpinionAboutAFluPandemic
          >> o
          >> http://www.fluwikie.com/pmwiki.php?n=Science.GraphOfClusterSizeAndFrequencyOverTime
          >> o
          >> http://www.fluwikie2.com/pmwiki.php?n=Forum.ASeverePandemicIsLikelyPart5
          >> o Helen Branswell writes about poor. Find link.
          >> * Gotta focus on:
          >> o
          >> http://www.fluwikie.com/pmwiki.php?n=Main.PandemicFluAwarenessWeek2006
          >> o
          >> http://www.fluwikie.com/pmwiki.php?n=Consequences.RespiratoryPreventionPackage
          >> o http://www.fluwikie.com/pmwiki.php?n=Brainstorming.SimpleMasks
          >>
          >> Comments
          >>
          >> AndriusKulikauskas: Lucas, Thank you for keeping us posted. We just got
          >> a request for MinciuSodas to support a proposal for a bird flu disaster
          >> related project. Also, I think that Pamela McLean might host chicken as
          >> the crop to feature for learning from each other in our work on
          >> http://www.myfoodstory.com Do you have thoughts on a related technology,
          >> especially one that would foster learning from each other?
          >>
          >> LucasGonzalez: Andrius, A bird flu disaster related project? I don't
          >> know much about birds. My concern is pandemic flu - in humans. But if
          >> you tell me the details then I may look for some links. (I've been
          >> looking at how much food comes from what distance. Most here is from far
          >> away. I need look no deeper for the time being.) Also, "a related
          >> technology"? I don't know what you mean. I'll get some sleep.
          >>
          >> 2006-09-28
          >>
          >> Please, help translate from English into other languages:
          >>
          >> *
          >> http://www.fluwikie.com/pmwiki.php?n=Main.Es-PandemicFluAwarenessWeek2006
          >> * http://www.fluwikie.com/pmwiki.php?n=Main.Es-PressRelease
          >>
          >> 2006-09-23
          >>
          >> * http://www.fluwikie.com/pmwiki.php?n=Main.PandemicFluAwarenessWeek2006
          >> * http://www.fluwikie.com/pmwiki.php?n=Main.PressRelease
          >> * http://www.fluwikie.com/pmwiki.php?n=Opinion.OutlineSummary
          >> * http://www.worldchanging.com/archives/004975.html
          >> * Food security, safety, sustainability.
          >> * Catching up on sleep.
          >>
          >> 2006-09-14
          >>
          >> * http://www.breathingearth.net/
          >> * http://www.birdshot.cc/
          >> * http://www.fluwikie.com/pmwiki.php?n=Main.PandemicFluAwarenessWeek2006
          >> * http://www.fluwikie.com/pmwiki.php?n=Main.PressRelease
          >> * http://www.fluwikie.com/pmwiki.php?n=Opinion.ForumTopics
          >>
          >> 2006-09-13
          >>
          >> Conversación con Stella. "Seguridad" alimentaria, proyecto de
          >> investigación. Bill Morrison. Instituto de Permacultura, red caórdica.
          >> ¿Proceso gradual? ¿Aprendizaje acelerado?
          >>
          >> 2006-09-07
          >>
          >> * Still catching up.
          >> o Using mindmaps helps me a bit in remapping things for myself
          >> and others.
          >> o There's this idea to have sharable mindmaps - we could in
          >> time have (or rather encourage) a repository of public domain mindmaps -
          >> in PNG or XML formats.
          >> o Whatever became of touchgraph?
          >> * Flu:
          >> o Folks at fluwikie are thinking about a "pandemic influenza
          >> awareness week",
          >> o and also about communication in a pandemic,
          >> o while avian flu in humans keeps boiling.
          >>
          >> Comments
          >>
          >> Lucas, you may see I have diagrammed our workflow and have started
          >> sorting our letters accordingly. Perhaps you might be interested to mind
          >> map, for example, our projects: http://www.ms.lt/?action=Project Or to
          >> mind map our Bird Flu letters. If you're interested in the latter I
          >> could try to program a search function that would catch and index all
          >> our letters that mention the "flu" or "pandemic" or another term. Let me
          >> know! AndriusKulikauskas September 8, 2006 1:50 CET
          >>
          >> 2006-09-03
          >>
          >> * Social distancing will be explored in practice. I wonder about
          >> different parts of the world. And of course different levels of
          >> motivation - but believing it would help would be a motivation.
          >> * New York City is apparently not prepared for a pandemic (not
          >> surprising). Andrius' "dealing with sudden massive population spread"
          >> does need further thinking. Lots of it. I wonder how, and who with. :-?
          >>
          >> 2006-08-31
          >>
          >> * Blog:
          >>
          >> Ok, glad to be welcomed back - home! Some folks at fluwikie "get it"
          >> regarding chicken farming. They should be linked to ZERI and friends.
          >> Worth a read, in time.
          >>
          >> * Conversation:
          >>
          >> AndriusKulikauskas: Lucas, it's great to see you back! Thank you for
          >> alerting me to FrenchieGirl at FluWiki. I wrote her an invitation to
          >> join us.
          >>
          >> Heh - you're fast, Andrius! Whether that invitation will work or not is
          >> up to the future to tell us. We may need to find ways to include or be
          >> of value to people who can't or won't work with their full names out
          >> there in the open. Another one for the back-burner.
          >>
          >> And I have some stuff I've been thinking about - I'll be "present" in 10
          >> more days, I hope. I need to finish off and catch up on a few things.
          >> Wouldn't mind a summary or two, but that's not possible so I'll just
          >> catch up slowly.
          >>
          >> Thanks! Lucas
          >>
          >>
          >>
          >>
          >>
          >>
          >> Each letter sent to Learning From Each Other enters the PUBLIC DOMAIN unless it explicitly states otherwise http://www.ethicalpublicdomain.org Please be kind to our authors!
          >> Yahoo! Groups Links
          >>
          >>
          >>
          >>
          >>
          >>
          >>
          >>
          >>
          >>
          >>
          >>
          >>
          >>
          >>
          >>
          >
          >
          >
          > Each letter sent to Learning From Each Other enters the PUBLIC DOMAIN unless it explicitly states otherwise http://www.ethicalpublicdomain.org Please be kind to our authors!
          > Yahoo! Groups Links
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
        • samuel kongere
          Dear Andrius, Great to read your comments and all the rest of Information regarding the most highlighted response and a further plan for our extreme MS Lab. I
          Message 4 of 5 , Oct 5, 2006
          • 0 Attachment
            Dear Andrius,
             
             
            Great to read your comments and all the rest of Information regarding the most highlighted response and a further plan for our extreme MS Lab. I tend always to think as an independent thinker and these are the roots which make me what I am, either in community or outside.  I treasure very much most of the inputs we get from you and Janet, for the combined prosperity of our mission of the global villages and the entire Lab of MS. The mail I’m responding to now is from you and the delights needs my in put………….
             
            I will start responding from them. I have to consider working for “My Food Story”
            as one of the 6 team coordinators. That would be extremely helpful and I could not miss to attend this wonderful piece of work included in our livelihood and as Africa mostly needs this input for upgrading the livelihood and her peoples. I am trying to learn something about our
             Tanzanian colleagues and including them in the work of MS Lab. First we must identify their interests. Thanks for looking for other opportunities for our Lab altogether, I am going to work for My FOOD STORY………………….and would be happy to attend the coming  World Social 
            Forum in Nairobi, Kenya, January 20-25, 2007, http://wsf2007.org and represent our Lab and sign up people especially into our working groups. You can go on and plan what our work will be as assistants working online. I will appreciate working as an assistant for our group to help
             others. As I read from Janet she is already putting us in the pioneers of change….pioneers of Change is a better move for us too and we need know all about it..
             
            Regarding my travels to Europe considering what would be most
             
            Effective is vibrant, as you mentioned in your mail having a nomad getting me round is wonderful and touring Lithuania and having a glimpse of what our Lab does is appreciated. It isn’t just a matter of staying there but to stay to help and be helped. You know my weaknesses in IT can also be boosted while I am there as you proposed, this can make a wonderful tour for me and the groups I am working with. Touring
             villages is good for me as I need exchange experiences and would love learning why other communities are what they are and not us.
             
            Surely visiting Europe; Lithuania, Italy and other countries is what I have hoped for. Maria told me about you and always meeting you have been my thought, this have been my hope after I came across you and seeing what you do there for our Lab is a wonderful suggestion.  It will be another added advantage. Although the initial plan was
             to visit Maria in Italy and having you plan for this trip is because it’s destined to be for our MS-Lab.
             
            I have not finished the translation yet but hope to finish it sooner. Inform Helmut I am
             tuning the key words and I will send them to him after completion.
            Otherwise have another prosperous day and remember to send me your Cell phone No I need to SMS sometimes.
             
            Bye
            Samwel


            Andrius Kulikauskas <ms@...> wrote:
            Pamela, Yes, thank you for your thoughtful letter which I share.

            Indeed, Moodle and other online technologies for managing relationships
            between bandwidth rich and poor might be exactly what's relevant here,
            and something that you're definitely interested in. Another such
            technology is TiddlyWiki by Jeremy Ruston, http://www.tiddlywi ki.com
            which is a wiki that is based on JavaScript and stores all the data on a
            single HTML page that can be accessed and updated offline. Jeremy is
            working for Greg Wolff's UnaMesa Association and Greg is encouraging us
            to work together. I'm especially interested that he might adapt
            TiddlyWiki further for use offline and then synchronize as you suggest.
            Also, I will be developing a questionnaire- driven interface based on
            Helmut Leitner's ProWiki page formats and perhaps we can exchange data
            with TiddlyWiki, too. Jeremy, I Cc you and I invite you to join our
            Minciu Sodas laboratory's working group
            http://groups. yahoo.com/ group/workinginp arallel/ (send a blank message
            to workinginparallel- subscribe@ yahoogroups. com) which at our lab is the
            best place to work on such technological questions. I look forward to
            writing more and engaging you regarding our lab's work
            http://www.foodstor y.com for UnaMesa Association. Jeremy Ruston and
            Pamela McLean http://www.ms. lt/?thinker= Pamela_McLean are both based in
            London.

            Lucas, with your guidance as we develop such a channel for poultry
            people in bandwidth rich and bandwith poor areas to connect, we could
            use that to share information regarding a possible human flu pandemic
            that might arise from bird flu. If you might advise and inspire, I
            could find a team leader and field agents that could bring out such
            connections.

            Andrius

            Andrius Kulikauskas
            Minciu Sodas
            http://www.ms. lt
            ms@...
            +370 (5) 264 5950
            +370 (699) 30003
            skype: minciusodas
            Vilnius, Lithuania

            Pamela McLean wrote:
            > Hi Andrius.
            >
            > Regarding chickens and possible input.to http://www.myfoodst ory.com
            >
            > As discussed, when it comes to chickens and learning from each other I
            > can only act as an intermediary - putting you/your team in contact with
            > an information source in Nigeria. I am cautious of offering any such
            > introduction because I know how difficult it is to establish and
            > maintain anything like an effective flow of information from rural
            > Nigeria - but if the difficulties are understood and embraced then we
            > could try..
            >
            > Please be aware that I have not yet asked Kazanka Comfort about her
            > possible involvement, because her time online is limited, and I do not
            > want to waste it with "perhaps and possibly" emails. If we come up with
            > a serious plan then we will put it to her.
            >
            > As you know I am currently exploring ways of organising Cawdnet's
            > collaborative work through the use of Moodle at "Cawdnet Campus". We are
            > already finding it a good fit for managing information in the ways that
            > we need to do - and we also like various features that although we have
            > yet to apply them, we know will be useful and available to us.
            >
            > We think of Cawdnet Campus as a collection of "information cupboards" -
            > one for each Special Interest Group. We are trying to make it equally
            > suitable for the needs and expectation of two different types of
            > contributors/ users - one type is "bandwidth rich" the other is
            > "bandwidth poor". Our challenge is to find the most effective ways to
            > accept, order and present information so that the system is equally
            > considerate to the needs of both groups - to get the right balance
            > between "info pull" and "info push" to suit different circumstances. . It
            > is still very early stages, but we are learning all the time about what
            > does, and does not work, in setting up and maintaining an effective SIG
            > at Cawdnet Campus.
            >
            > If you do want to include input from rural Nigeria, then I suggest that
            > link is managed through a new Cawdnet Campus group - even if that group
            > only consists of one representative from Nigeria and one from your team
            > on the bandwidth rich (BR) side. It would be the responsibility of the
            > BR person to make it as easy as possible for the bandwidth poor (BP)
            > contributor to be informed and involved, without being faced with too
            > much information. I will explain more what I mean if it seems likely to
            > happen.
            >
            > If it does seem likely to happen then I suggest we ask Comfort if we can
            > focus on her turkey farm, and chickens too - that is if it she has her
            > poultry work up and running again after the bird flu scare. It is very
            > small scale - but close to Internet connectivity - so close that the
            > birds scratch around in the area of the Fantsuam Foundation compound
            > where the satellite dish for the Internet is located. Nigerians use the
            > word "farm" to include large and small enterprises, including things of
            > a size that in the UK we would describe as "small-holdings" , or
            > "allotments" , or even "gardens".
            >
            > I suggest that we ask Comfort to allocate one of the "volunteers" at
            > Fantsuam to collect information from her and contribute it to the
            > Cawdnet Campus SIG on poultry farms, set up for the purpose. The term
            > "volunteer" at FF covers a wide variety of relationships - but most need
            > to earn money, so there could well be someone willing to fill the role
            > you want. NB English is unlikely to be the volunteer's first language -
            > something else that the BR person needs to bear in mind regarding
            > expectations about communication.
            >
            > The BR person needs to be prepared for cultural differences too. For
            > example - regarding attitudes to time - it seems that the local
            > languages have no equivalent for the term "deadline" - as I hear that
            > English word dropped into conversations that are otherwise completely
            > unintelligible to me ;-) The BR must be prepared for a different pace
            > to life....
            >
            > These are the kind of issues that make me question if it is appropriate
            > for us to be connected with this particular project, which I think is
            > time dependent, and requires plenty of communication, and focuses on a
            > topic which we does not yet have an active group set up at Cawdnet Campus.
            >
            > Pam
            >
            > Andrius Kulikauskas wrote:
            >
            >
            >> Lucas, I have been reading your blog at our wiki
            >> http://www.ourcultu re.info/wiki. cgi?LucasGonzale zSantaCruz/ Blog
            >> regarding your work on preparations for a possible pandemic flu.
            >> I reply to your working group http://groups. yahoo.com/ group/mejoresvia s/
            >> on creative collaboration.
            >>
            >> You probably know, we've started work on a major project
            >> http://www.myfoodst ory.com to start an online resource for the world's
            >> food supply chain. We'll be featuring one crop each month. I'm drawing
            >> connections between a crop (such as "fish") and a human value (such as
            >> "sustainability" ) and a technology that supports them (such as George
            >> Chan's integrated farming and waste management).
            >>
            >> I spoke with Pamela McLean as to whether we might think of a crop that
            >> relates to her key concept of "learning from each other". One idea that
            >> came up was poultry. Chickens may foster our "learning from each other"
            >> because of our many different interconnections with them:
            >> - their life cycle - they yield both eggs and meat - and they
            >> - they can find some food for themselves, but they also need supplements
            >> - they are both social and individual, having a hierarchy
            >> - they have contact with other bird species which opens them up to both
            >> immunity and disease
            >> - through such contact they depend on the situation locally
            >> - they are kept for times indoors and for times outdoors
            >> - they are a distinct "package", both as eggs and as meat
            >> - they have significant impact on our nutrition
            >> - they interact with other farm animals.
            >> All of this to say that keeping chickens may require a lot of knowledge,
            >> but especially, a lot of sensitivity to applying that knowledge. I
            >> think of it as comparable to a parent who needs to watch their child's
            >> behavior to adjust the dose of a medication that they may need, such as
            >> for Turett's syndrome, so they don't get too much or too little.
            >> Similarly, a poultry farmer may need to consistently learn how to
            >> navigate the risk factors for their chicken. And likewise, consumers of
            >> chickens might pay more attention to how fresh the birds are, where they
            >> come from, what they eat, the season in the year, any chemicals they are
            >> fed, and so on.
            >>
            >> If there is such a connection (perhaps there is?), then we can ask, what
            >> technology fosters that? One technology which Janet Feldman brought up
            >> is community radio.
            >>
            >> If we were to organize a poultry team, then we could also have the
            >> opportunity to do something bird flu related. Lucas, I was wondering if
            >> you had any thoughts on all this, if you might see some possible
            >> connections?
            >>
            >> Trying to "find better ways together",
            >>
            >> Andrius
            >>
            >> Andrius Kulikauskas
            >> Minciu Sodas
            >> http://www.ms. lt
            >> ms@...
            >> +370 (5) 264 5950
            >> +370 (699) 30003
            >> Vilnius, Lithuania
            >>
            >>
            >> ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- -
            >> From Lucas Gonzalez Santa Cruz's blog:
            >>
            >> 2006-10-01
            >>
            >> * Why worry:
            >> o
            >> http://www.fluwikie .com/pmwiki. php?n=Science. OpinionAboutAFlu Pandemic
            >> o
            >> http://www.fluwikie .com/pmwiki. php?n=Science. GraphOfClusterSi zeAndFrequencyOv erTime
            >> o
            >> http://www.fluwikie 2.com/pmwiki. php?n=Forum. ASeverePandemicI sLikelyPart5
            >> o Helen Branswell writes about poor. Find link.
            >> * Gotta focus on:
            >> o
            >> http://www.fluwikie .com/pmwiki. php?n=Main. PandemicFluAware nessWeek2006
            >> o
            >> http://www.fluwikie .com/pmwiki. php?n=Consequenc es.RespiratoryPr eventionPackage
            >> o http://www.fluwikie .com/pmwiki. php?n=Brainstorm ing.SimpleMasks
            >>
            >> Comments
            >>
            >> AndriusKulikauskas: Lucas, Thank you for keeping us posted. We just got
            >> a request for MinciuSodas to support a proposal for a bird flu disaster
            >> related project. Also, I think that Pamela McLean might host chicken as
            >> the crop to feature for learning from each other in our work on
            >> http://www.myfoodst ory.com Do you have thoughts on a related technology,
            >> especially one that would foster learning from each other?
            >>
            >> LucasGonzalez: Andrius, A bird flu disaster related project? I don't
            >> know much about birds. My concern is pandemic flu - in humans. But if
            >> you tell me the details then I may look for some links. (I've been
            >> looking at how much food comes from what distance. Most here is from far
            >> away. I need look no deeper for the time being.) Also, "a related
            >> technology"? I don't know what you mean. I'll get some sleep.
            >>
            >> 2006-09-28
            >>
            >> Please, help translate from English into other languages:
            >>
            >> *
            >> http://www.fluwikie .com/pmwiki. php?n=Main. Es-PandemicFluAw arenessWeek2006
            >> * http://www.fluwikie .com/pmwiki. php?n=Main. Es-PressRelease
            >>
            >> 2006-09-23
            >>
            >> * http://www.fluwikie .com/pmwiki. php?n=Main. PandemicFluAware nessWeek2006
            >> * http://www.fluwikie .com/pmwiki. php?n=Main. PressRelease
            >> * http://www.fluwikie .com/pmwiki. php?n=Opinion. OutlineSummary
            >> * http://www.worldcha nging.com/ archives/ 004975.html
            >> * Food security, safety, sustainability.
            >> * Catching up on sleep.
            >>
            >> 2006-09-14
            >>
            >> * http://www.breathin gearth.net/
            >> * http://www.birdshot .cc/
            >> * http://www.fluwikie .com/pmwiki. php?n=Main. PandemicFluAware nessWeek2006
            >> * http://www.fluwikie .com/pmwiki. php?n=Main. PressRelease
            >> * http://www.fluwikie .com/pmwiki. php?n=Opinion. ForumTopics
            >>
            >> 2006-09-13
            >>
            >> Conversación con Stella. "Seguridad" alimentaria, proyecto de
            >> investigación. Bill Morrison. Instituto de Permacultura, red caórdica.
            >> ¿Proceso gradual? ¿Aprendizaje acelerado?
            >>
            >> 2006-09-07
            >>
            >> * Still catching up.
            >> o Using mindmaps helps me a bit in remapping things for myself
            >> and others.
            >> o There's this idea to have sharable mindmaps - we could in
            >> time have (or rather encourage) a repository of public domain mindmaps -
            >> in PNG or XML formats.
            >> o Whatever became of touchgraph?
            >> * Flu:
            >> o Folks at fluwikie are thinking about a "pandemic influenza
            >> awareness week",
            >> o and also about communication in a pandemic,
            >> o while avian flu in humans keeps boiling.
            >>
            >> Comments
            >>
            >> Lucas, you may see I have diagrammed our workflow and have started
            >> sorting our letters accordingly. Perhaps you might be interested to mind
            >> map, for example, our projects: http://www.ms. lt/?action= Project Or to
            >> mind map our Bird Flu letters. If you're interested in the latter I
            >> could try to program a search function that would catch and index all
            >> our letters that mention the "flu" or "pandemic" or another term. Let me
            >> know! AndriusKulikauskas September 8, 2006 1:50 CET
            >>
            >> 2006-09-03
            >>
            >> * Social distancing will be explored in practice. I wonder about
            >> different parts of the world. And of course different levels of
            >> motivation - but believing it would help would be a motivation.
            >> * New York City is apparently not prepared for a pandemic (not
            >> surprising). Andrius' "dealing with sudden massive population spread"
            >> does need further thinking. Lots of it. I wonder how, and who with. :-?
            >>
            >> 2006-08-31
            >>
            >> * Blog:
            >>
            >> Ok, glad to be welcomed back - home! Some folks at fluwikie "get it"
            >> regarding chicken farming. They should be linked to ZERI and friends.
            >> Worth a read, in time.
            >>
            >> * Conversation:
            >>
            >> AndriusKulikauskas: Lucas, it's great to see you back! Thank you for
            >> alerting me to FrenchieGirl at FluWiki. I wrote her an invitation to
            >> join us.
            >>
            >> Heh - you're fast, Andrius! Whether that invitation will work or not is
            >> up to the future to tell us. We may need to find ways to include or be
            >> of value to people who can't or won't work with their full names out
            >> there in the open. Another one for the back-burner.
            >>
            >> And I have some stuff I've been thinking about - I'll be "present" in 10
            >> more days, I hope. I need to finish off and catch up on a few things.
            >> Wouldn't mind a summary or two, but that's not possible so I'll just
            >> catch up slowly.
            >>
            >> Thanks! Lucas
            >>
            >>
            >>
            >>
            >>
            >>
            >> Each letter sent to Learning From Each Other enters the PUBLIC DOMAIN unless it explicitly states otherwise http://www.ethicalp ublicdomain. org Please be kind to our authors!
            >> Yahoo! Groups Links
            >>
            >>
            >>
            >>
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          • Pamela McLean
            Andrius - thank you. Once again you have clarified my thoughts for me. Ref your posting [learningfromeachother] Moodle, TiddlyWiki and learning from each
            Message 5 of 5 , Oct 5, 2006
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              Andrius - thank you.

              Once again you have clarified my thoughts for me.

              Ref your posting [learningfromeachother] Moodle, TiddlyWiki and
              "learning from each other" about poultry and pandemic flu

              Yes, I am interested in "online technologies for managing relationships
              between bandwidth rich and poor" . I hadn't thought to express it in
              those terms before.

              I'm not sure about the word "managing" - I think I prefer "enabling" -
              but of course my positive or negative feelings about the work
              "management" would depend on the "management style".

              I guess that word "manage" does help to explain why Lorraine and I
              weren't happy with our TT wiki, although it was a great place for
              putting information. With the TT wiki I had a valuable "resource
              cupboard" ready for when I went to present the first TT course - but the
              information "in my cupboard" was not organised in a way that enabled
              the course participants to help themselves. We needed to find a better
              way to manage and offer information.

              After the first TT course Lorraine and I worked with Ross Gardler to
              address this issue of managing information on behalf of the TT
              participants (and other groups we wanted to help)
              We tried various things and had interesting discussions regarding
              "open-ness". Ross, as an open source developer, felt we were being
              restrictive and closed because of the boundaries we wanted to set on who
              was allowed access to what information. We felt that if we could find
              ways to offer only the most relevant information we would in fact
              increase useful access - a case of "less is more". When I discovered
              Moodle all three of us agreed that it seemed appropriate because of the
              way it makes it easy to set up separate groups, and to arrange differing
              levels of access and control of information within those groups, and
              because it is so user friendly in many ways.

              In my imagination I see us with working groups, who address problems
              very actively and practically, who build up new knowledge through the
              way they "rub minds" at Cawdnet Campus, and who do on-the-ground
              practical experimentation ( as happens now with Cawdnetters at Fantsuam,
              Oke-Ogun and elsewhere). The working groups are like the research part
              of Cawdnet Campus.

              As the research starts to produce results that can benefit others -
              these results will get shared - at first the sharing will be a case of
              simply writing things up and inviting guests to read what has been
              written (a bit like a research group publishing its findings).

              Then comes the challenge of making such information easier to access,
              and of practical benefit to other groups and individuals on the ground.
              This is another part of Moodle I look forward to exploring. There are
              all sorts of facilities for tests and quizzes. What I'd like to do is
              use these quizzes to help discover what the visitor already knows and
              wants to know next, so I can make available the information that is most
              likely to fit the need.
              .
              As I see it, a wiki is the information equivalent of a huge supermarket
              or department store - a great resource if you have the time to wander
              around and find what you want. Bandwidth poor people don't have the time
              on-line to wander around. They need the equivalent of a personal shopper
              on hand ready to help. (This in effect is what we had with the TT-online
              support group during the presentation of the course). Ideally it would
              be a personal shopper who already knows their needs and is ready for
              their arrival, so they can make a very quick selection knowing that
              whatever they choose will be fine. In fact, unless they particularly
              want to make their own final selection, they could quite safely send an
              intermediary.

              Obviously we are way off achieving these ideas yet as it is early days,
              and we are more at the stage of recognising what needs to be done than
              doing it. Full implementation will take a lot of resources and
              collaboration. What we are doing is very small scale - trying things out
              and recognising roles, and information flows, and such like - learning
              little things that do/don't seem to work - doing things at Cawdnet
              Campus that we were previously doing in a more fragmented way.

              If other people are investigating systems that would help achieve the
              objective of serving information needs of the bandwidth poor, or
              otherwise enabling communication across the digital divide then we are
              interested in sharing what we are learning.

              If people have interests that overlap the interests of Cawdnet Campus
              working groups they are welcome to explore joining the groups.

              However, at Cawdnet Campus we are way behind regarding sharing
              information, tagging information and so on. We recognise that "further
              down the line" these things should be a natural part of our information
              handling, but now our focus is on other things. For open and organised
              wide discussion it is much better to be here in the lab with Andrius.

              Pam

              >Pamela, Yes, thank you for your thoughtful letter which I share.
              >
              >Indeed, Moodle and other online technologies for managing relationships
              >between bandwidth rich and poor might be exactly what's relevant here,
              >and something that you're definitely interested in. Another such
              >technology is TiddlyWiki by Jeremy Ruston, http://www.tiddlywiki.com
              >which is a wiki that is based on JavaScript and stores all the data on a
              >single HTML page that can be accessed and updated offline. Jeremy is
              >working for Greg Wolff's UnaMesa Association and Greg is encouraging us
              >to work together. I'm especially interested that he might adapt
              >TiddlyWiki further for use offline and then synchronize as you suggest.
              >Also, I will be developing a questionnaire-driven interface based on
              >Helmut Leitner's ProWiki page formats and perhaps we can exchange data
              >with TiddlyWiki, too. Jeremy, I Cc you and I invite you to join our
              >Minciu Sodas laboratory's working group
              >http://groups.yahoo.com/group/workinginparallel/ (send a blank message
              >to workinginparallel-subscribe@yahoogroups.com) which at our lab is the
              >best place to work on such technological questions. I look forward to
              >writing more and engaging you regarding our lab's work
              >http://www.foodstory.com for UnaMesa Association. Jeremy Ruston and
              >Pamela McLean http://www.ms.lt/?thinker=Pamela_McLean are both based in
              >London.
              >
              >Lucas, with your guidance as we develop such a channel for poultry
              >people in bandwidth rich and bandwith poor areas to connect, we could
              >use that to share information regarding a possible human flu pandemic
              >that might arise from bird flu. If you might advise and inspire, I
              >could find a team leader and field agents that could bring out such
              >connections.
              >
              >Andrius
              >
              >Andrius Kulikauskas
              >Minciu Sodas
              >http://www.ms.lt
              >ms@...
              >+370 (5) 264 5950
              >+370 (699) 30003
              >skype: minciusodas
              >Vilnius, Lithuania
              >
              >Pamela McLean wrote:
              >
              >
              >>Hi Andrius.
              >>
              >>Regarding chickens and possible input.to http://www.myfoodstory.com
              >>
              >>As discussed, when it comes to chickens and learning from each other I
              >>can only act as an intermediary - putting you/your team in contact with
              >>an information source in Nigeria. I am cautious of offering any such
              >>introduction because I know how difficult it is to establish and
              >>maintain anything like an effective flow of information from rural
              >>Nigeria - but if the difficulties are understood and embraced then we
              >>could try..
              >>
              >>Please be aware that I have not yet asked Kazanka Comfort about her
              >>possible involvement, because her time online is limited, and I do not
              >>want to waste it with "perhaps and possibly" emails. If we come up with
              >>a serious plan then we will put it to her.
              >>
              >>As you know I am currently exploring ways of organising Cawdnet's
              >>collaborative work through the use of Moodle at "Cawdnet Campus". We are
              >>already finding it a good fit for managing information in the ways that
              >>we need to do - and we also like various features that although we have
              >>yet to apply them, we know will be useful and available to us.
              >>
              >>We think of Cawdnet Campus as a collection of "information cupboards" -
              >>one for each Special Interest Group. We are trying to make it equally
              >>suitable for the needs and expectation of two different types of
              >>contributors/users - one type is "bandwidth rich" the other is
              >>"bandwidth poor". Our challenge is to find the most effective ways to
              >>accept, order and present information so that the system is equally
              >>considerate to the needs of both groups - to get the right balance
              >>between "info pull" and "info push" to suit different circumstances.. It
              >>is still very early stages, but we are learning all the time about what
              >>does, and does not work, in setting up and maintaining an effective SIG
              >>at Cawdnet Campus.
              >>
              >>If you do want to include input from rural Nigeria, then I suggest that
              >>link is managed through a new Cawdnet Campus group - even if that group
              >>only consists of one representative from Nigeria and one from your team
              >>on the bandwidth rich (BR) side. It would be the responsibility of the
              >>BR person to make it as easy as possible for the bandwidth poor (BP)
              >>contributor to be informed and involved, without being faced with too
              >>much information. I will explain more what I mean if it seems likely to
              >>happen.
              >>
              >>If it does seem likely to happen then I suggest we ask Comfort if we can
              >>focus on her turkey farm, and chickens too - that is if it she has her
              >>poultry work up and running again after the bird flu scare. It is very
              >>small scale - but close to Internet connectivity - so close that the
              >>birds scratch around in the area of the Fantsuam Foundation compound
              >>where the satellite dish for the Internet is located. Nigerians use the
              >>word "farm" to include large and small enterprises, including things of
              >>a size that in the UK we would describe as "small-holdings", or
              >>"allotments", or even "gardens".
              >>
              >>I suggest that we ask Comfort to allocate one of the "volunteers" at
              >>Fantsuam to collect information from her and contribute it to the
              >>Cawdnet Campus SIG on poultry farms, set up for the purpose. The term
              >>"volunteer" at FF covers a wide variety of relationships - but most need
              >>to earn money, so there could well be someone willing to fill the role
              >>you want. NB English is unlikely to be the volunteer's first language -
              >>something else that the BR person needs to bear in mind regarding
              >>expectations about communication.
              >>
              >>The BR person needs to be prepared for cultural differences too. For
              >>example - regarding attitudes to time - it seems that the local
              >>languages have no equivalent for the term "deadline" - as I hear that
              >>English word dropped into conversations that are otherwise completely
              >>unintelligible to me ;-) The BR must be prepared for a different pace
              >>to life....
              >>
              >>These are the kind of issues that make me question if it is appropriate
              >>for us to be connected with this particular project, which I think is
              >>time dependent, and requires plenty of communication, and focuses on a
              >>topic which we does not yet have an active group set up at Cawdnet Campus.
              >>
              >>Pam
              >>
              >>Andrius Kulikauskas wrote:
              >>
              >>
              >>
              >>
              >>>Lucas, I have been reading your blog at our wiki
              >>>http://www.ourculture.info/wiki.cgi?LucasGonzalezSantaCruz/Blog
              >>>regarding your work on preparations for a possible pandemic flu.
              >>>I reply to your working group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/mejoresvias/
              >>>on creative collaboration.
              >>>
              >>>You probably know, we've started work on a major project
              >>>http://www.myfoodstory.com to start an online resource for the world's
              >>>food supply chain. We'll be featuring one crop each month. I'm drawing
              >>>connections between a crop (such as "fish") and a human value (such as
              >>>"sustainability") and a technology that supports them (such as George
              >>>Chan's integrated farming and waste management).
              >>>
              >>>I spoke with Pamela McLean as to whether we might think of a crop that
              >>>relates to her key concept of "learning from each other". One idea that
              >>>came up was poultry. Chickens may foster our "learning from each other"
              >>>because of our many different interconnections with them:
              >>>- their life cycle - they yield both eggs and meat - and they
              >>>- they can find some food for themselves, but they also need supplements
              >>>- they are both social and individual, having a hierarchy
              >>>- they have contact with other bird species which opens them up to both
              >>>immunity and disease
              >>>- through such contact they depend on the situation locally
              >>>- they are kept for times indoors and for times outdoors
              >>>- they are a distinct "package", both as eggs and as meat
              >>>- they have significant impact on our nutrition
              >>>- they interact with other farm animals.
              >>>All of this to say that keeping chickens may require a lot of knowledge,
              >>>but especially, a lot of sensitivity to applying that knowledge. I
              >>>think of it as comparable to a parent who needs to watch their child's
              >>>behavior to adjust the dose of a medication that they may need, such as
              >>>for Turett's syndrome, so they don't get too much or too little.
              >>>Similarly, a poultry farmer may need to consistently learn how to
              >>>navigate the risk factors for their chicken. And likewise, consumers of
              >>>chickens might pay more attention to how fresh the birds are, where they
              >>>come from, what they eat, the season in the year, any chemicals they are
              >>>fed, and so on.
              >>>
              >>>If there is such a connection (perhaps there is?), then we can ask, what
              >>>technology fosters that? One technology which Janet Feldman brought up
              >>>is community radio.
              >>>
              >>>If we were to organize a poultry team, then we could also have the
              >>>opportunity to do something bird flu related. Lucas, I was wondering if
              >>>you had any thoughts on all this, if you might see some possible
              >>>connections?
              >>>
              >>>Trying to "find better ways together",
              >>>
              >>>Andrius
              >>>
              >>>Andrius Kulikauskas
              >>>Minciu Sodas
              >>>http://www.ms.lt
              >>>ms@...
              >>>+370 (5) 264 5950
              >>>+370 (699) 30003
              >>>Vilnius, Lithuania
              >>>
              >>>
              >>>-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
              >>>From Lucas Gonzalez Santa Cruz's blog:
              >>>
              >>>2006-10-01
              >>>
              >>> * Why worry:
              >>> o
              >>>http://www.fluwikie.com/pmwiki.php?n=Science.OpinionAboutAFluPandemic
              >>> o
              >>>http://www.fluwikie.com/pmwiki.php?n=Science.GraphOfClusterSizeAndFrequencyOverTime
              >>> o
              >>>http://www.fluwikie2.com/pmwiki.php?n=Forum.ASeverePandemicIsLikelyPart5
              >>> o Helen Branswell writes about poor. Find link.
              >>> * Gotta focus on:
              >>> o
              >>>http://www.fluwikie.com/pmwiki.php?n=Main.PandemicFluAwarenessWeek2006
              >>> o
              >>>http://www.fluwikie.com/pmwiki.php?n=Consequences.RespiratoryPreventionPackage
              >>> o http://www.fluwikie.com/pmwiki.php?n=Brainstorming.SimpleMasks
              >>>
              >>>Comments
              >>>
              >>>AndriusKulikauskas: Lucas, Thank you for keeping us posted. We just got
              >>>a request for MinciuSodas to support a proposal for a bird flu disaster
              >>>related project. Also, I think that Pamela McLean might host chicken as
              >>>the crop to feature for learning from each other in our work on
              >>>http://www.myfoodstory.com Do you have thoughts on a related technology,
              >>>especially one that would foster learning from each other?
              >>>
              >>>LucasGonzalez: Andrius, A bird flu disaster related project? I don't
              >>>know much about birds. My concern is pandemic flu - in humans. But if
              >>>you tell me the details then I may look for some links. (I've been
              >>>looking at how much food comes from what distance. Most here is from far
              >>>away. I need look no deeper for the time being.) Also, "a related
              >>>technology"? I don't know what you mean. I'll get some sleep.
              >>>
              >>>2006-09-28
              >>>
              >>>Please, help translate from English into other languages:
              >>>
              >>> *
              >>>http://www.fluwikie.com/pmwiki.php?n=Main.Es-PandemicFluAwarenessWeek2006
              >>> * http://www.fluwikie.com/pmwiki.php?n=Main.Es-PressRelease
              >>>
              >>>2006-09-23
              >>>
              >>> * http://www.fluwikie.com/pmwiki.php?n=Main.PandemicFluAwarenessWeek2006
              >>> * http://www.fluwikie.com/pmwiki.php?n=Main.PressRelease
              >>> * http://www.fluwikie.com/pmwiki.php?n=Opinion.OutlineSummary
              >>> * http://www.worldchanging.com/archives/004975.html
              >>> * Food security, safety, sustainability.
              >>> * Catching up on sleep.
              >>>
              >>>2006-09-14
              >>>
              >>> * http://www.breathingearth.net/
              >>> * http://www.birdshot.cc/
              >>> * http://www.fluwikie.com/pmwiki.php?n=Main.PandemicFluAwarenessWeek2006
              >>> * http://www.fluwikie.com/pmwiki.php?n=Main.PressRelease
              >>> * http://www.fluwikie.com/pmwiki.php?n=Opinion.ForumTopics
              >>>
              >>>2006-09-13
              >>>
              >>>Conversación con Stella. "Seguridad" alimentaria, proyecto de
              >>>investigación. Bill Morrison. Instituto de Permacultura, red caórdica.
              >>>¿Proceso gradual? ¿Aprendizaje acelerado?
              >>>
              >>>2006-09-07
              >>>
              >>> * Still catching up.
              >>> o Using mindmaps helps me a bit in remapping things for myself
              >>>and others.
              >>> o There's this idea to have sharable mindmaps - we could in
              >>>time have (or rather encourage) a repository of public domain mindmaps -
              >>>in PNG or XML formats.
              >>> o Whatever became of touchgraph?
              >>> * Flu:
              >>> o Folks at fluwikie are thinking about a "pandemic influenza
              >>>awareness week",
              >>> o and also about communication in a pandemic,
              >>> o while avian flu in humans keeps boiling.
              >>>
              >>>Comments
              >>>
              >>>Lucas, you may see I have diagrammed our workflow and have started
              >>>sorting our letters accordingly. Perhaps you might be interested to mind
              >>>map, for example, our projects: http://www.ms.lt/?action=Project Or to
              >>>mind map our Bird Flu letters. If you're interested in the latter I
              >>>could try to program a search function that would catch and index all
              >>>our letters that mention the "flu" or "pandemic" or another term. Let me
              >>>know! AndriusKulikauskas September 8, 2006 1:50 CET
              >>>
              >>>2006-09-03
              >>>
              >>> * Social distancing will be explored in practice. I wonder about
              >>>different parts of the world. And of course different levels of
              >>>motivation - but believing it would help would be a motivation.
              >>> * New York City is apparently not prepared for a pandemic (not
              >>>surprising). Andrius' "dealing with sudden massive population spread"
              >>>does need further thinking. Lots of it. I wonder how, and who with. :-?
              >>>
              >>>2006-08-31
              >>>
              >>> * Blog:
              >>>
              >>>Ok, glad to be welcomed back - home! Some folks at fluwikie "get it"
              >>>regarding chicken farming. They should be linked to ZERI and friends.
              >>>Worth a read, in time.
              >>>
              >>> * Conversation:
              >>>
              >>>AndriusKulikauskas: Lucas, it's great to see you back! Thank you for
              >>>alerting me to FrenchieGirl at FluWiki. I wrote her an invitation to
              >>>join us.
              >>>
              >>>Heh - you're fast, Andrius! Whether that invitation will work or not is
              >>>up to the future to tell us. We may need to find ways to include or be
              >>>of value to people who can't or won't work with their full names out
              >>>there in the open. Another one for the back-burner.
              >>>
              >>>And I have some stuff I've been thinking about - I'll be "present" in 10
              >>>more days, I hope. I need to finish off and catch up on a few things.
              >>>Wouldn't mind a summary or two, but that's not possible so I'll just
              >>>catch up slowly.
              >>>
              >>>Thanks! Lucas
              >>>
              >>>
              >>>
              >>>
              >>>
              >>>
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              >>>
              >>>
              >>>
              >>>
              >>>
              >>>
              >>
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