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_Bruinen_ in VT48

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  • hisweloke
    Greetings, I am slightly puzzled by the statement in VT48:32, note 19: In both of the Sindarin forms, _duinen_ and _dannen_, the original C.E. suffix _-mê_
    Message 1 of 1 , Feb 28, 2006
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      Greetings,

      I am slightly puzzled by the statement in VT48:32, note 19:

      "In both of the Sindarin forms, _duinen_ and _dannen_, the original
      C.E. suffix _-mê_ has presumably been replaced by S. _nen_ 'water'
      (e.g. as in _Bruinen_ 'Loudwater', LR:200)."

      I wonder whether the parenthetical comment about _Bruinen_ applies to
      the second part of the sentence only (i.e. that _Bruinen_ 'Loudwater'
      just occurs to end with _nen_ 'water') or rather to the whole sentence
      (i.e. that _Bruinen_ would also possibly be a S. word where an
      original _-mê_ in C.E. was replaced by _nen_ -- thus implying some
      derivation such as _bruinen_ < _nen_ repl. _-me_ < _*bruime_ < *BRUY +
      _-mê_).

      I haven't found any evidence for the latter case, but as the former is
      quite obvious(*) and not really necessary to understand _duinen_ and
      _dannen_ ... So I just asked myself what the editor exactly had in
      mind when he wrote this note. Could he clarify how the note should
      be read?

      Actually, this question interests me as I have never found across my
      readings any satisfying explanation for _bruinen_ (except, perhaps, to
      deduce _*brui_ as a possible adjective 'loud', possibly including S.
      _-ui_ as adjectival ending, from former -*(V)ya_ -- but this would
      still be very hypothetical and inconclusive).

      (*) If the first reading of the note was implied, we know other river
      names ending with _-nen_, which would perhaps have made better examples
      as the first element is less obscure (or is at least interpretable):
      _Carnen_ 'redwater' and _Harnen_ *'south-water', both attested in the
      LR appendices.

      Didier.

      [I cited the form _Bruinen_ 'Loudwater' in note 19 in VT48:32 merely
      to provide an example of S. _nen_ 'water' used as the second element
      in a compound; I did NOT intend to suggest that _nen_ in _Bruinen_
      replaced earlier _-mê_. Evidently my wording of this note was less clear
      than it might have been, and I regret any potential confusion this may
      have caused.

      As Didier notes, the first element in _Bruinen_ might be an adjective
      *_brui_ 'loud', ending in the common Sindarin adj. suffix _-ui_ (see
      VT42:10 for the etymology of this suffix). It seems to me that S.
      *_brui_ is probably related to the second element of Q. _Ulumúri_,
      name of the great horns of Ulmo (S:27, X:202), in which *_múri_ is
      probably 'horns'. The root could be reconstructed as *MUR- (referring
      to loud or low sounds), with CE *_murûya_ (stressed on the _û_) >
      *_m'rûya_ > S. *_brui_ 'loud'. For S. _br-_ < *_mr-_, compare *_morókô_
      'bear' > Q. _morko_, N. _brôg_ (V:374).

      The Goldogrin verb _mul-, mum_ 'low, bellow' (PE11:58), along with
      the related noun _mû_'ox' and its feminine forms _mûs_ 'cow' and _muir_
      'heifer', may be the conceptual antecedents of the root *MUR- proposed
      above. -- PHW]
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