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Re: Nurn and the Sea of Núrnen / Nûrnen

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  • Wayne G. Hammond
    ... In the copies of the first edition on our shelves, the name is printed in the text _Núrnen_, with an acute accent, not with a circumflex. It has no accent
    Message 1 of 10 , Nov 21, 2005
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      Edouard wrote:

      > In the first edition of LOTR, the name is spelt _Nûrnen_ in Book 6,
      > Ch. V. However, on the general map it is "Sea of Nurnen". "Sea of
      > Núrnen" appears on the general map in the second edition. Who put
      > in the accent? J.R.R. Tolkien? C. Tolkien?

      In the copies of the first edition on our shelves, the name is
      printed in the text _Núrnen_, with an acute accent, not with a
      circumflex. It has no accent on the map, but Christopher followed the
      usage on his father's working maps, which (according to Christopher's
      redrawings and comments in _The History of Middle-earth_) themselves
      had _Nurnen_, without accent. _Nurnen_ is still without an accent on
      the second edition map; I haven't followed this through every Allen &
      Unwin printing in our collection, but a quick look suggests that the
      accent wasn't added until Christopher redrew the general map for
      _Unfinished Tales_ and took the opportunity to correct some errors
      and omissions. (On maps, see RC:lv-lxvii.)

      > (A question to W. Hammond): Did Tolkien state in his index that
      > _Nurn_ and _Nûrnen/Núrnen_ are Elvish place-names?

      _Nurn_ is not in the unfinished index; it appears only on the general
      map. _Núrnen_ in the index (so spelt) is not said to be in any
      particular language.

      Pat wrote:

      > So S./N. *_nûr_ (or perhaps *_nûrn_) in _Núrnen_ 'Sad Water' is
      > apparently 'sad' in the sense 'bewailing, lamenting, complaining,
      > grumbling', no doubt a reference to the general mood of the
      > hapless laborers in "the great slave-worked fields" beside the
      > lake. -- PHW]

      Our own note on this (RC:457) reads: "An old definition of _sad_
      is 'dark-coloured', in particular referring to an unpleasant colour;
      but by the waters of Núrnen were the great fields of Mordor worked by
      slaves, and in that context may be recalled the plight of the Hebrew
      slaves expressed in Psalm 137: 'By the rivers of Babylon, there we
      sat down, yea, we wept, when we remembered Zion.'"

      Wayne
    • ejk@free.fr
      ... Sorry about the ref. but I was referring to _Nûrnen_ as printed in the chapter The Black Gate is Closed , first edition, p. 244 (my copy 11th printing).
      Message 2 of 10 , Nov 21, 2005
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        "Wayne G. Hammond" wrote :

        > Edouard wrote:
        >
        > > In the first edition of LOTR, the name is spelt _Nûrnen_ in Book 6,
        > > Ch. V. However, on the general map it is "Sea of Nurnen". "Sea of
        > > Núrnen" appears on the general map in the second edition. Who put
        > > in the accent? J.R.R. Tolkien? C. Tolkien?
        >
        > In the copies of the first edition on our shelves, the name is
        > printed in the text _Núrnen_, with an acute accent, not with a
        > circumflex.

        Sorry about the ref. but I was referring to _Nûrnen_ as printed in the
        chapter "The Black Gate is Closed", first edition, p. 244 (my copy 11th
        printing).

        > It has no accent on the map, but Christopher followed the
        > usage on his father's working maps, which (according to Christopher's
        > redrawings and comments in _The History of Middle-earth_) themselves
        > had _Nurnen_, without accent.

        The original map by J.R.R. Tolkien has _Nûrnen_ (either with a circumflex
        or a macron, it is not clear). And in VIII:127, n. 5 there is _Nûrnen_.

        Thanks for your answer.

        So the mystery still remains... :-)

        elfiquement vôtre,

        Edouard Kloczko
      • Wayne G. Hammond
        ... Ah, yes, there it had a circumflex. This carried over from the first edition into the first printing of the second edition (1966), but was changed to an
        Message 3 of 10 , Nov 21, 2005
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          Edouard wrote:

          > Sorry about the ref. but I was referring to _Nûrnen_ as printed in
          > the chapter "The Black Gate is Closed", first edition, p. 244 (my
          > copy 11th printing).

          Ah, yes, there it had a circumflex. This carried over from the first
          edition into the first printing of the second edition (1966), but was
          changed to an acute accent in the second edition, second printing
          (1967). This was one of many changes made at Tolkien's direction in
          the 1967 printing: see notes to _J.R.R. Tolkien: A Descriptive
          Bibliography_ A5e.

          Wayne
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