201Re: i and y in Quenya: two phonemes or one?
- Aug 10, 2002--- Ales Bican wrote:
> **I am convinced that _heru_ plus a patronymic ending _-ion_Well, I agree in part. A compound *_heru-yon_ (of the same type as
> would produce *_heruion_, because we have _Eruion_ "son of
> god" (VT44:12). And whether we can have *_heruyon_, I am
> not sure, I think such a form would become *_heruion_.
_Elda-lambe_) might exist for some time however, perhaps
distinguishing some special lord-son or in some other case like when
the relationship is stressed, or something like that. I don't think
*_heru-yon_ is impossible, nor for that matter other words with the
same structure. All of this is quite irrelevant however if there are
no [i] between vowels and for that see below.
> As for _heruion_ itself, it depends on how it was pronounced. TheI think I might have been fooled by the morphemes here. On closer
> morpheme boundary is evidently between _u_ and _i_, so it might
> be pronounced as [he-ru-i-on]. If this was the case, the [i] may
> then occur between vowels and be distinct to [y]. However, if it
> was, and I believe it was, pronounced as [he-rui-on], then it is
> parallel to _haia_/_haiya_.
thought I agree with your interpretation of ui as a diphtong. Now if
we assume that ai, oi and ui always are diphtongs the only possible
places for syllabic /i/ between vowels is after /e/. A quick search
on Ardalambion's corpus wordlist (by no means all Q. words but all I
can do a quick digital search on) reveals no such [i]. And I think
Hans mentioned word initial /i+V/ some posts ago in this thread,
again with negative results. Therefore one might ...
> [...] wonder whether the pair _heruion_ "of lords" /And this is what it all comes down to, isn't it? Lacking natives to
> *_heruion_ "son of lord" was distinguished in speech. I would say
> no, though I cannot prove or disprove it.
describe it's hard to do good descriptive linguistics, no? ;) Still,
I think your reasoning has much to it and I like /y/=/i/ more the
more I think on it.
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