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Re: [ksurfschool] Digest Number 1195

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  • Chris Cowart
    Steve, I learned the positive and negative steering terms from watching the KITES DVD. www.kiteboardcenter.com. Negative steering - pulling on one side of the
    Message 1 of 2 , Jan 20, 2005
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      Steve,

      I learned the positive and negative steering terms from watching the
      KITES DVD. www.kiteboardcenter.com.

      Negative steering - pulling on one side of the bar
      Positive steering - pushing on one side of the bar

      I hadn't heard those terms either.

      Chris

      On Jan 14, 2005, at 5:41 PM, ksurfschool@yahoogroups.com wrote:

      >
      >
      > There is 1 message in this issue.
      >
      > Topics in this digest:
      >
      > 1. Re: Digest Number 1193
      > From: "Kitepower \(Sydney\)" <sydney@...>
      >
      >
      > _______________________________________________________________________
      > _
      > _______________________________________________________________________
      > _
      >
      > Message: 1
      > Date: Sat, 15 Jan 2005 11:15:29 +1100
      > From: "Kitepower \(Sydney\)" <sydney@...>
      > Subject: Re: Digest Number 1193
      >
      > Hi Chris
      > I have been involved in teraching people to fly kites and kitesurfing
      > instruction for around 12 years, I have never heard of positive or
      > negative steering?
      > What do you mean by this?
      > Did someone teach you about positive or negative steering?
      >
      > I suspect that your terminology is out of whack with what is commonly
      > used, thats all.
      >
      > Most people refer to pulling the bar towards you as sheeting in, and
      > pushing it away as sheeting out. This is not steering the kite though
      > it is just adjusting the kites angle of attack by altering the
      > relative lengths of the front to rear lines.
      >
      > You are not really "Bringing the kite backwards" either, unless the
      > kite is so baldy tuned that you can actually fly it backwards?
      >
      > As George said, pull in on the bar as the kite flies towards the water
      > or down, then release that pressure just before the bottom of the down
      > stroke and turn the kite upwards, tightly, and then push the bar away
      > until the kite is accelerating upwards, as it speeds up you can pull
      > back on the bar a bit more, getting ready to turn the kite tightly to
      > make another downstroke.
      >
      > Point the board downwind until you are fully planing
      >
      > Practice going out in a bit more wind?
      >
      >
      > Cya and
      > Goodwinds
      > Steve McCormack
      > www.kitepower.com.au
      >
      > ----- Original Message -----
      > From: Chris Cowart
      > To: ksurfschool@yahoogroups.com
      > Sent: Friday, January 14, 2005 4:55 AM
      > Subject: Re: [ksurfschool] Digest Number 1193
      >
      >
      > George,
      >
      > Thanks for the summary and tips. To some extent, I have experimented
      > with each of those factors.
      >
      > When I try to bring the kite backwards to start, I dive it
      > aggressively, but have two bad habits:
      > - i tend to dive too low and bring it up, killing power
      > - i will try to head the board upwind too quickly rather than getting
      > fully planing before trimming upwind
      >
      > On diving, do you use positive, negative steering, or both?
      >
      > Can't wait to get back in the water here in SF bay.
      >
      > Thanks, Chris
      >
      > On Jan 12, 2005, at 6:55 PM, ksurfschool@yahoogroups.com wrote:
      >
      >>
      >>
      >> There is 1 message in this issue.
      >>
      >> Topics in this digest:
      >>
      >> 1. Re: How to fly the kite in the correct position
      >> From: George Sarris <jakefarley2000@...>
      >>
      >>
      >> ______________________________________________________________________
      >> _
      >> _
      >> ______________________________________________________________________
      >> _
      >> _
      >>
      >> Message: 1
      >> Date: Wed, 12 Jan 2005 12:26:37 -0800 (PST)
      >> From: George Sarris <jakefarley2000@...>
      >> Subject: Re: How to fly the kite in the correct position
      >>
      >> The following factors apply:
      >>
      >> 1. wind speed
      >> 2. kite size
      >> 3. board size
      >> 4. rider/kiter weight
      >>
      >> Any one can result in an underpowered situation which
      >> can be frustrating. If you have sufficient power to
      >> stay upwind, albeit slow, you are doing fine. If you
      >> want more speed or power, you need an increase in #1
      >> or #2 above or bear off and go downwind. With regard
      >> to water starting in lighter winds, I usually start
      >> off in the chicken loop and bring the kite backwards
      >> 20 degrees off zenith (2 o-clock if you are going to
      >> your left) and then dive the kite while aiming my
      >> board downwind. I pull in on the bar after diving the
      >> kite to increase the angle of attack producing more
      >> power. Once I have sufficient power, I ease out the
      >> bar to get the kite the the edge of the window and
      >> edge the board so I can stay upwind. I usually never
      >> hook into the harness lines on the bar, only the
      >> chicken loop. The kite will fly upwind faster on the
      >> front lines which produces more power with faster
      >> turning.
      >>
      >> Hope this helps,
      >> George
      >> --- Chris Cowart <cowartc@...> wrote:
      >>
      >>> This question applies to water start and normal
      >>> flying...
      >>>
      >>> I use a Naish bar with chicken hook and harness
      >>> line. I often dive the
      >>> kite [in the chicken loop only] unhooked from the
      >>> harness loop put with
      >>> hand pressure on the bar. Even if I start the dive
      >>> with a turn
      >>> backwards, it seems that the kite ends up too close
      >>> the wind window
      >>> edge and with not much initial power. On the plus
      >>> side, it seems to
      >>> put me in a setup that I go upwind, but not
      >>> superfast.
      >>>
      >>> I've tried:
      >>> - diving in both harness loop and chicken loop
      >>> - slight backward move before diving
      >>>
      >>> Any thoughts to get me more on a plane and more
      >>> power?
      >>>
      >>>
      >>
      >>
      >>
      >>
      >> __________________________________
      >> Do you Yahoo!?
      >> Meet the all-new My Yahoo! - Try it today!
      >> http://my.yahoo.com
      >>
      >>
      >>
      >>
      >> ______________________________________________________________________
      >> _
      >> _
      >> ______________________________________________________________________
      >> _
      >> _
      >>
      >>
      >> If you are new to kitesurfing, please visit
      >> http://www.KitesurfingSchool.org/faqs.htm for the answers
      >> to the most frequently asked questions.
      >>
      >> To unsubscribe, please send an email to
      >> ksurfschool-unsubscribe@egroups.com
      >> To subscribe, please send an email to
      >> ksurfschool-subscribe@egroups.com
      >>
      >> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
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      >>
      >>
      >>
      >> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
      >> -
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      >>
      >>
      >
      >
      >
      > If you are new to kitesurfing, please visit
      > http://www.KitesurfingSchool.org/faqs.htm for the answers
      > to the most frequently asked questions.
      >
      > To unsubscribe, please send an email to
      > ksurfschool-unsubscribe@egroups.com
      > To subscribe, please send an email to
      > ksurfschool-subscribe@egroups.com
      >
      >
      >
      >
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      >
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      >
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      >
      > c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of
      > Service.
      >
      >
      >
      > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      >
      >
      >
      > _______________________________________________________________________
      > _
      > _______________________________________________________________________
      > _
      >
      >
      > If you are new to kitesurfing, please visit
      > http://www.KitesurfingSchool.org/faqs.htm for the answers
      > to the most frequently asked questions.
      >
      > To unsubscribe, please send an email to
      > ksurfschool-unsubscribe@egroups.com
      > To subscribe, please send an email to ksurfschool-subscribe@egroups.com
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    • Kitepower (Sydney)
      Oh that explains it, John Holzall the creator of the KITES System and DVD is a great instructor, but he sure has some interesting terminology. The kite
      Message 2 of 2 , Jan 20, 2005
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        Oh that explains it, John Holzall the creator of the KITES System and DVD is a great instructor, but he sure has some interesting terminology. The kite industry has used the term push or pull turns for the last 20+ years, but John did not come to kiteboarding from the kite industry.
        Stick with pull turning the kite most of the time, when you can comfortably control the kite experiment with push turning, push turning is the opposite of pull turning, but the kite only understands one command turn in the direction of the tightest line.
        So if you push left, the kite turns right and vice versa, understand?


        Cya and
        Goodwinds
        Steve McCormack
        www.kitepower.com.au




        ----- Original Message -----
        From: Chris Cowart
        To: ksurfschool@yahoogroups.com
        Sent: Friday, January 21, 2005 2:11 PM
        Subject: Re: [ksurfschool] Digest Number 1195


        Steve,

        I learned the positive and negative steering terms from watching the
        KITES DVD. www.kiteboardcenter.com.

        Negative steering - pulling on one side of the bar
        Positive steering - pushing on one side of the bar

        I hadn't heard those terms either.

        Chris

        On Jan 14, 2005, at 5:41 PM, ksurfschool@yahoogroups.com wrote:

        >
        >
        > There is 1 message in this issue.
        >
        > Topics in this digest:
        >
        > 1. Re: Digest Number 1193
        > From: "Kitepower \(Sydney\)" <sydney@...>
        >
        >
        > _______________________________________________________________________
        > _
        > _______________________________________________________________________
        > _
        >
        > Message: 1
        > Date: Sat, 15 Jan 2005 11:15:29 +1100
        > From: "Kitepower \(Sydney\)" <sydney@...>
        > Subject: Re: Digest Number 1193
        >
        > Hi Chris
        > I have been involved in teraching people to fly kites and kitesurfing
        > instruction for around 12 years, I have never heard of positive or
        > negative steering?
        > What do you mean by this?
        > Did someone teach you about positive or negative steering?
        >
        > I suspect that your terminology is out of whack with what is commonly
        > used, thats all.
        >
        > Most people refer to pulling the bar towards you as sheeting in, and
        > pushing it away as sheeting out. This is not steering the kite though
        > it is just adjusting the kites angle of attack by altering the
        > relative lengths of the front to rear lines.
        >
        > You are not really "Bringing the kite backwards" either, unless the
        > kite is so baldy tuned that you can actually fly it backwards?
        >
        > As George said, pull in on the bar as the kite flies towards the water
        > or down, then release that pressure just before the bottom of the down
        > stroke and turn the kite upwards, tightly, and then push the bar away
        > until the kite is accelerating upwards, as it speeds up you can pull
        > back on the bar a bit more, getting ready to turn the kite tightly to
        > make another downstroke.
        >
        > Point the board downwind until you are fully planing
        >
        > Practice going out in a bit more wind?
        >
        >
        > Cya and
        > Goodwinds
        > Steve McCormack
        > www.kitepower.com.au
        >
        > ----- Original Message -----
        > From: Chris Cowart
        > To: ksurfschool@yahoogroups.com
        > Sent: Friday, January 14, 2005 4:55 AM
        > Subject: Re: [ksurfschool] Digest Number 1193
        >
        >
        > George,
        >
        > Thanks for the summary and tips. To some extent, I have experimented
        > with each of those factors.
        >
        > When I try to bring the kite backwards to start, I dive it
        > aggressively, but have two bad habits:
        > - i tend to dive too low and bring it up, killing power
        > - i will try to head the board upwind too quickly rather than getting
        > fully planing before trimming upwind
        >
        > On diving, do you use positive, negative steering, or both?
        >
        > Can't wait to get back in the water here in SF bay.
        >
        > Thanks, Chris
        >
        > On Jan 12, 2005, at 6:55 PM, ksurfschool@yahoogroups.com wrote:
        >
        >>
        >>
        >> There is 1 message in this issue.
        >>
        >> Topics in this digest:
        >>
        >> 1. Re: How to fly the kite in the correct position
        >> From: George Sarris <jakefarley2000@...>
        >>
        >>
        >> ______________________________________________________________________
        >> _
        >> _
        >> ______________________________________________________________________
        >> _
        >> _
        >>
        >> Message: 1
        >> Date: Wed, 12 Jan 2005 12:26:37 -0800 (PST)
        >> From: George Sarris <jakefarley2000@...>
        >> Subject: Re: How to fly the kite in the correct position
        >>
        >> The following factors apply:
        >>
        >> 1. wind speed
        >> 2. kite size
        >> 3. board size
        >> 4. rider/kiter weight
        >>
        >> Any one can result in an underpowered situation which
        >> can be frustrating. If you have sufficient power to
        >> stay upwind, albeit slow, you are doing fine. If you
        >> want more speed or power, you need an increase in #1
        >> or #2 above or bear off and go downwind. With regard
        >> to water starting in lighter winds, I usually start
        >> off in the chicken loop and bring the kite backwards
        >> 20 degrees off zenith (2 o-clock if you are going to
        >> your left) and then dive the kite while aiming my
        >> board downwind. I pull in on the bar after diving the
        >> kite to increase the angle of attack producing more
        >> power. Once I have sufficient power, I ease out the
        >> bar to get the kite the the edge of the window and
        >> edge the board so I can stay upwind. I usually never
        >> hook into the harness lines on the bar, only the
        >> chicken loop. The kite will fly upwind faster on the
        >> front lines which produces more power with faster
        >> turning.
        >>
        >> Hope this helps,
        >> George
        >> --- Chris Cowart <cowartc@...> wrote:
        >>
        >>> This question applies to water start and normal
        >>> flying...
        >>>
        >>> I use a Naish bar with chicken hook and harness
        >>> line. I often dive the
        >>> kite [in the chicken loop only] unhooked from the
        >>> harness loop put with
        >>> hand pressure on the bar. Even if I start the dive
        >>> with a turn
        >>> backwards, it seems that the kite ends up too close
        >>> the wind window
        >>> edge and with not much initial power. On the plus
        >>> side, it seems to
        >>> put me in a setup that I go upwind, but not
        >>> superfast.
        >>>
        >>> I've tried:
        >>> - diving in both harness loop and chicken loop
        >>> - slight backward move before diving
        >>>
        >>> Any thoughts to get me more on a plane and more
        >>> power?
        >>>
        >>>
        >>
        >>
        >>
        >>
        >> __________________________________
        >> Do you Yahoo!?
        >> Meet the all-new My Yahoo! - Try it today!
        >> http://my.yahoo.com
        >>
        >>
        >>
        >>
        >> ______________________________________________________________________
        >> _
        >> _
        >> ______________________________________________________________________
        >> _
        >> _
        >>
        >>
        >> If you are new to kitesurfing, please visit
        >> http://www.KitesurfingSchool.org/faqs.htm for the answers
        >> to the most frequently asked questions.
        >>
        >> To unsubscribe, please send an email to
        >> ksurfschool-unsubscribe@egroups.com
        >> To subscribe, please send an email to
        >> ksurfschool-subscribe@egroups.com
        >>
        >> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
        >> -
        >> -
        >> Yahoo! Groups Links
        >>
        >>
        >>
        >>
        >> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
        >> -
        >> -
        >>
        >>
        >>
        >>
        >
        >
        >
        > If you are new to kitesurfing, please visit
        > http://www.KitesurfingSchool.org/faqs.htm for the answers
        > to the most frequently asked questions.
        >
        > To unsubscribe, please send an email to
        > ksurfschool-unsubscribe@egroups.com
        > To subscribe, please send an email to
        > ksurfschool-subscribe@egroups.com
        >
        >
        >
        >
        > -----------------------------------------------------------------------
        > -------
        > Yahoo! Groups Links
        >
        > a.. To visit your group on the web, go to:
        > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ksurfschool/
        >
        > b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
        > ksurfschool-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
        >
        > c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of
        > Service.
        >
        >
        >
        > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        >
        >
        >
        > _______________________________________________________________________
        > _
        > _______________________________________________________________________
        > _
        >
        >
        > If you are new to kitesurfing, please visit
        > http://www.KitesurfingSchool.org/faqs.htm for the answers
        > to the most frequently asked questions.
        >
        > To unsubscribe, please send an email to
        > ksurfschool-unsubscribe@egroups.com
        > To subscribe, please send an email to ksurfschool-subscribe@egroups.com
        >
        > -----------------------------------------------------------------------
        > -
        > Yahoo! Groups Links
        >
        >
        >
        >
        > -----------------------------------------------------------------------
        > -
        >
        >
        >
        >



        If you are new to kitesurfing, please visit
        http://www.KitesurfingSchool.org/faqs.htm for the answers
        to the most frequently asked questions.

        To unsubscribe, please send an email to ksurfschool-unsubscribe@egroups.com
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