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Large bidirectional .vs. diretional for light wind

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  • Hung Vu
    This time of the year, lightwind rules in our area and everyone is dying to be able to kite. So I took the 169 Litewave for a real light wind test run and
    Message 1 of 6 , Jul 18, 2004
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      This time of the year, lightwind rules in our area and everyone is
      "dying" to be able to kite.

      So I took the 169 Litewave for a real light wind test run and got tons
      of attentions (as usual, when you go extremely fast in such little wind
      compared to the slow-motion of all other wind-powered water crafts)

      Here are my observations:

      - The Litewave 169 is surely a lightwind machine for me, and for
      heavier kiters, I think Dave makes even larger sizes
      - The Litewave 169 tracks very very well (it simply doesn't want to
      get out of its track) even more so when compared to a larger directional
      - The Litewave 169 is much smaller than a large directional (such as
      the FOne 230), but on water it feels very close to one
      - I made some small 5 - 10' jumps ( in 7 to 10 knots) and for sure
      the 169 jumps better than the FOne 230
      - Speed wise, I thought the 169 was going almost as fast as any large
      directional (with better tracking ability)
      - For jibing, I still prefer a directional but many kiters may not
      agree with me due to the difficulty of jibing a directional.
      - Either directional or bidirectional, It simply felt great to be
      able to glide on the water so fast in such a light wind

      So large bidirectionals for sure work well in light wind (at least winth
      the Litewave boards) and jump better but may not jibe as fun as
      directionals...

      P.S., When I got back to the beach, a crowd came over and started asking
      questions - as usual in light wind - as in light wind, there are more
      people on the beach and there isn't anything more exciting out there
      except for a light wind kitesurfer.

      P.P.S., Kiting in light wind is actually a wonderful PR tool for
      kitesurfing as it is much safer and people can appreciate and
      comprehense it more and become less likely to "hate" it when the going
      get tough...

      P.P.P.S., I was using a "small" 16m kite and definitely could go out in
      lighter wind with a larger kite.

      P.P.P.P.S., To promote lightwind kiting, we should have some form of
      lightwind competition when the wind must be 10 knots or less (These
      types of competition will make the beach-goers appreciate kiting more
      and likely to support us at the city councils meetings - that kiters are
      not a bunch of misbehaving guys but a group of "geniuses" who can defy
      the law of light wind sailing).

      Hung.
    • ex_cpe
      ... .........Did anyone weigh you? Hung - how much wet? I m one of the few lightwinds fools in my area but I ve got about 195lbs of mass to extract from
      Message 2 of 6 , Jul 18, 2004
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        --- In ksurfschool@yahoogroups.com, Hung Vu <hungvu2000@r...> wrote:
        > This time of the year, lightwind rules in our area and everyone is
        > "dying" to be able to kite.
        >
        > So I took the 169 Litewave for a real light wind test run and got tons
        > of attentions (as usual, when you go extremely fast in such little wind
        > compared to the slow-motion of all other wind-powered water crafts)
        >
        > Here are my observations:
        >
        > - The Litewave 169 is surely a lightwind machine for me, and for
        > heavier kiters, I think Dave makes even larger sizes
        > - The Litewave 169 tracks very very well (it simply doesn't want to
        > get out of its track) even more so when compared to a larger directional
        > - The Litewave 169 is much smaller than a large directional (such as
        > the FOne 230), but on water it feels very close to one
        > - I made some small 5 - 10' jumps ( in 7 to 10 knots) and for sure
        > the 169 jumps better than the FOne 230
        > - Speed wise, I thought the 169 was going almost as fast as any large
        > directional (with better tracking ability)
        > - For jibing, I still prefer a directional but many kiters may not
        > agree with me due to the difficulty of jibing a directional.
        > - Either directional or bidirectional, It simply felt great to be
        > able to glide on the water so fast in such a light wind
        >
        > So large bidirectionals for sure work well in light wind (at least winth
        > the Litewave boards) and jump better but may not jibe as fun as
        > directionals...
        >
        > P.S., When I got back to the beach, a crowd came over and started asking
        > questions - as usual in light wind - as in light wind, there are more
        > people on the beach and there isn't anything more exciting out there
        > except for a light wind kitesurfer.


        .........Did anyone weigh you? Hung - how much wet? I'm one of the few 'lightwinds fools'
        in my area but I've got about 195lbs of mass to extract from the water. I kept buying
        larger kites: R20..18M ARC with little improvement. The best grunty kite I have now is a
        R16 with a bar that's about 3' long and a spiffy front tube bridle setup.

        I found the big kites were soooo slow that I could not get any AW with them. A 16 for me
        is faster and I can sine the hell out of it on the long bar - then milk the power spikes. My
        rule-of-thumb is: if the kite will go to zenith - I can at least do a downwinder. How's that
        for Jones'n for a kitesurf?

        .....but one of us here has to be able to run the math of how many newtons it takes to get
        my bigass out of the water compared to your lean frame.



        >
        > P.P.S., Kiting in light wind is actually a wonderful PR tool for
        > kitesurfing as it is much safer and people can appreciate and
        > comprehense it more and become less likely to "hate" it when the going
        > get tough...


        ......Au contraire: I'd have a 'student' out with a 5M kite (one I did not care about) in 20kts,
        albeit with plenty of free, shallow water downwind and let them scare themselves a bit:
        "feel the power!". Last thing I want at my local launch is a semi-cocky newbie (you don't
        want to look like a dork in front of 'real' kiters..) in a first time heavy air situation.



        .....I also sold a LW169 and kept a directional. It provides me with needed float in the lulls.
        The LW was oooo-k, but not special enough to keep in the stable. A long directional
        (mine is 6-8) in the ocean is a pain because it 'slaps' the chop, but gim'me some bayside
        flatwater and I can scream across the surface...and that's a whole 'nother sport.

        Kitesurfing is so cool because there are so many ways to come at it and variables within.
        We don't all have to look, act or perform to some 'standard'. The only standard we need to
        adhere to is safety.

        Cheers.

        jim
      • hungvuatnetcomdotca
        ... few lightwinds fools ... water. I kept buying ... kite I have now is a ... setup. ... with them. A 16 for me ... milk the power spikes. My ... a
        Message 3 of 6 , Jul 18, 2004
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          --- In ksurfschool@yahoogroups.com, "ex_cpe" <wetstuff@i...> wrote:
          > .........Did anyone weigh you? Hung - how much wet? I'm one of the
          few 'lightwinds fools'
          > in my area but I've got about 195lbs of mass to extract from the
          water. I kept buying
          > larger kites: R20..18M ARC with little improvement. The best grunty
          kite I have now is a
          > R16 with a bar that's about 3' long and a spiffy front tube bridle
          setup.
          >
          > I found the big kites were soooo slow that I could not get any AW
          with them. A 16 for me
          > is faster and I can sine the hell out of it on the long bar - then
          milk the power spikes. My
          > rule-of-thumb is: if the kite will go to zenith - I can at least do
          a downwinder. How's that
          > for Jones'n for a kitesurf?
          >
          > .....but one of us here has to be able to run the math of how many
          newtons it takes to get
          > my bigass out of the water compared to your lean frame.

          Jim,

          Don't give up hope. I am 125 lbs and used to be "the" lightwind kiter
          around here until one winter day this year I was out with my 16m kite
          and snowboard and was "out run and out jumped" by a heavier kiter (180
          lbs) on a 18m kite and skis. following is his post on our local group:

          "
          After today I realized that you hardly need any wind
          to have a lot of fun kiteskiing or snowboarding, all
          you need is a decent sized kite. I was probably
          getting more hang time today on my 18 than I was last
          Saturday on the 9.8m. I'm beginning to almost look
          forward to these nice light days.
          "

          So it's all about using the right set of equipment (and looking for
          them to). The same kiter who "out ran" me in light wind on that day
          was strugglling the year before with another 19m kite (same set of
          skis I believe).

          Personally I have used a number of 16m kites and only 1 that I prefer
          in light wind.

          Hung.
        • George Sarris
          Hung, I d like to know if you were able to stay upwind. I myself prefer lightwind kiting and at 205lbs. with a 21.5m kite I can stay upwind at 11-12 kts.
          Message 4 of 6 , Jul 18, 2004
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            Hung, I'd like to know if you were able to stay
            upwind. I myself prefer lightwind kiting and at
            205lbs. with a 21.5m kite I can stay upwind at 11-12
            kts. Below that I need to go downwind to stay up even
            with a floaty directional. Similiar to Hung many have
            come up to me after landing and commented about how
            much fun I seemed to have in the light wind. The best
            comment I received was from one man who said he
            expected a 21 year old to come ashore instead of an
            older man.

            Cheers,
            George
            --- ex_cpe <wetstuff@...> wrote:
            > --- In ksurfschool@yahoogroups.com, Hung Vu
            > <hungvu2000@r...> wrote:
            > > This time of the year, lightwind rules in our area
            > and everyone is
            > > "dying" to be able to kite.
            > >
            > > So I took the 169 Litewave for a real light wind
            > test run and got tons
            > > of attentions (as usual, when you go extremely
            > fast in such little wind
            > > compared to the slow-motion of all other
            > wind-powered water crafts)
            > >
            > > Here are my observations:
            > >
            > > - The Litewave 169 is surely a lightwind
            > machine for me, and for
            > > heavier kiters, I think Dave makes even larger
            > sizes
            > > - The Litewave 169 tracks very very well (it
            > simply doesn't want to
            > > get out of its track) even more so when compared
            > to a larger directional
            > > - The Litewave 169 is much smaller than a large
            > directional (such as
            > > the FOne 230), but on water it feels very close to
            > one
            > > - I made some small 5 - 10' jumps ( in 7 to 10
            > knots) and for sure
            > > the 169 jumps better than the FOne 230
            > > - Speed wise, I thought the 169 was going
            > almost as fast as any large
            > > directional (with better tracking ability)
            > > - For jibing, I still prefer a directional but
            > many kiters may not
            > > agree with me due to the difficulty of jibing a
            > directional.
            > > - Either directional or bidirectional, It
            > simply felt great to be
            > > able to glide on the water so fast in such a light
            > wind
            > >
            > > So large bidirectionals for sure work well in
            > light wind (at least winth
            > > the Litewave boards) and jump better but may not
            > jibe as fun as
            > > directionals...
            > >
            > > P.S., When I got back to the beach, a crowd came
            > over and started asking
            > > questions - as usual in light wind - as in light
            > wind, there are more
            > > people on the beach and there isn't anything more
            > exciting out there
            > > except for a light wind kitesurfer.
            >
            >
            > .........Did anyone weigh you? Hung - how much wet?
            > I'm one of the few 'lightwinds fools'
            > in my area but I've got about 195lbs of mass to
            > extract from the water. I kept buying
            > larger kites: R20..18M ARC with little improvement.
            > The best grunty kite I have now is a
            > R16 with a bar that's about 3' long and a spiffy
            > front tube bridle setup.
            >
            > I found the big kites were soooo slow that I could
            > not get any AW with them. A 16 for me
            > is faster and I can sine the hell out of it on the
            > long bar - then milk the power spikes. My
            > rule-of-thumb is: if the kite will go to zenith - I
            > can at least do a downwinder. How's that
            > for Jones'n for a kitesurf?
            >
            > .....but one of us here has to be able to run the
            > math of how many newtons it takes to get
            > my bigass out of the water compared to your lean
            > frame.
            >
            >
            >
            > >
            > > P.P.S., Kiting in light wind is actually a
            > wonderful PR tool for
            > > kitesurfing as it is much safer and people can
            > appreciate and
            > > comprehense it more and become less likely to
            > "hate" it when the going
            > > get tough...
            >
            >
            > ......Au contraire: I'd have a 'student' out with a
            > 5M kite (one I did not care about) in 20kts,
            > albeit with plenty of free, shallow water downwind
            > and let them scare themselves a bit:
            > "feel the power!". Last thing I want at my local
            > launch is a semi-cocky newbie (you don't
            > want to look like a dork in front of 'real'
            > kiters..) in a first time heavy air situation.
            >
            >
            >
            > .....I also sold a LW169 and kept a directional. It
            > provides me with needed float in the lulls.
            > The LW was oooo-k, but not special enough to keep in
            > the stable. A long directional
            > (mine is 6-8) in the ocean is a pain because it
            > 'slaps' the chop, but gim'me some bayside
            > flatwater and I can scream across the surface...and
            > that's a whole 'nother sport.
            >
            > Kitesurfing is so cool because there are so many
            > ways to come at it and variables within.
            > We don't all have to look, act or perform to some
            > 'standard'. The only standard we need to
            > adhere to is safety.
            >
            > Cheers.
            >
            > jim
            >
            >


            __________________________________________________
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          • hungvuatnetcomdotca
            George, I came back to the same beach where I started (actually a few meters downwind but just because I wanted to avoid the crowd). Going upwind and jumping
            Message 5 of 6 , Jul 18, 2004
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              George,

              I came back to the same beach where I started (actually a few meters
              downwind but just because I wanted to avoid the crowd).

              Going upwind and jumping was not an issue at the upper range of the
              wind 9-10 knots. There were times when I was way upwind of the
              launching spot.

              At the lower range of the wind 7-8 knots, I can still somewhat keeping
              not to loose ground.

              You may want to consider adding another 10m to your 21.5m and see the
              differences. Personally, I think all 20m+ kites should be flown with
              40 to 45m lines (buy 2 x 20m or a 20m and a 25m then connect them
              together).

              At 11-12 knots, I start using my 12m so the "kite size is proportional
              to rider's weight" rule is still somewhat valid.

              P.S., Regarding age, as most don't know my real age, they DO think
              that I am 21 - I was frequently asked for ID at the liquor stores in
              Florida ;-)

              P.P.S., The "REAL" purpose of the original post was to encourage the
              "never has and probably never will ride a directional" kiter to get
              into light wind kiting as large bidirectionals also work well in light
              wind...

              Hung.

              --- In ksurfschool@yahoogroups.com, George Sarris
              <jakefarley2000@y...> wrote:
              > Hung, I'd like to know if you were able to stay
              > upwind. I myself prefer lightwind kiting and at
              > 205lbs. with a 21.5m kite I can stay upwind at 11-12
              > kts. Below that I need to go downwind to stay up even
              > with a floaty directional. Similiar to Hung many have
              > come up to me after landing and commented about how
              > much fun I seemed to have in the light wind. The best
              > comment I received was from one man who said he
              > expected a 21 year old to come ashore instead of an
              > older man.
              >
              > Cheers,
              > George
              > --- ex_cpe <wetstuff@i...> wrote:
              > > --- In ksurfschool@yahoogroups.com, Hung Vu
              > > <hungvu2000@r...> wrote:
              > > > This time of the year, lightwind rules in our area
              > > and everyone is
              > > > "dying" to be able to kite.
              > > >
              > > > So I took the 169 Litewave for a real light wind
              > > test run and got tons
              > > > of attentions (as usual, when you go extremely
              > > fast in such little wind
              > > > compared to the slow-motion of all other
              > > wind-powered water crafts)
              > > >
              > > > Here are my observations:
              > > >
              > > > - The Litewave 169 is surely a lightwind
              > > machine for me, and for
              > > > heavier kiters, I think Dave makes even larger
              > > sizes
              > > > - The Litewave 169 tracks very very well (it
              > > simply doesn't want to
              > > > get out of its track) even more so when compared
              > > to a larger directional
              > > > - The Litewave 169 is much smaller than a large
              > > directional (such as
              > > > the FOne 230), but on water it feels very close to
              > > one
              > > > - I made some small 5 - 10' jumps ( in 7 to 10
              > > knots) and for sure
              > > > the 169 jumps better than the FOne 230
              > > > - Speed wise, I thought the 169 was going
              > > almost as fast as any large
              > > > directional (with better tracking ability)
              > > > - For jibing, I still prefer a directional but
              > > many kiters may not
              > > > agree with me due to the difficulty of jibing a
              > > directional.
              > > > - Either directional or bidirectional, It
              > > simply felt great to be
              > > > able to glide on the water so fast in such a light
              > > wind
              > > >
              > > > So large bidirectionals for sure work well in
              > > light wind (at least winth
              > > > the Litewave boards) and jump better but may not
              > > jibe as fun as
              > > > directionals...
              > > >
              > > > P.S., When I got back to the beach, a crowd came
              > > over and started asking
              > > > questions - as usual in light wind - as in light
              > > wind, there are more
              > > > people on the beach and there isn't anything more
              > > exciting out there
              > > > except for a light wind kitesurfer.
              > >
              > >
              > > .........Did anyone weigh you? Hung - how much wet?
              > > I'm one of the few 'lightwinds fools'
              > > in my area but I've got about 195lbs of mass to
              > > extract from the water. I kept buying
              > > larger kites: R20..18M ARC with little improvement.
              > > The best grunty kite I have now is a
              > > R16 with a bar that's about 3' long and a spiffy
              > > front tube bridle setup.
              > >
              > > I found the big kites were soooo slow that I could
              > > not get any AW with them. A 16 for me
              > > is faster and I can sine the hell out of it on the
              > > long bar - then milk the power spikes. My
              > > rule-of-thumb is: if the kite will go to zenith - I
              > > can at least do a downwinder. How's that
              > > for Jones'n for a kitesurf?
              > >
              > > .....but one of us here has to be able to run the
              > > math of how many newtons it takes to get
              > > my bigass out of the water compared to your lean
              > > frame.
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > > >
              > > > P.P.S., Kiting in light wind is actually a
              > > wonderful PR tool for
              > > > kitesurfing as it is much safer and people can
              > > appreciate and
              > > > comprehense it more and become less likely to
              > > "hate" it when the going
              > > > get tough...
              > >
              > >
              > > ......Au contraire: I'd have a 'student' out with a
              > > 5M kite (one I did not care about) in 20kts,
              > > albeit with plenty of free, shallow water downwind
              > > and let them scare themselves a bit:
              > > "feel the power!". Last thing I want at my local
              > > launch is a semi-cocky newbie (you don't
              > > want to look like a dork in front of 'real'
              > > kiters..) in a first time heavy air situation.
              > >
              > >
              > >
              > > .....I also sold a LW169 and kept a directional. It
              > > provides me with needed float in the lulls.
              > > The LW was oooo-k, but not special enough to keep in
              > > the stable. A long directional
              > > (mine is 6-8) in the ocean is a pain because it
              > > 'slaps' the chop, but gim'me some bayside
              > > flatwater and I can scream across the surface...and
              > > that's a whole 'nother sport.
              > >
              > > Kitesurfing is so cool because there are so many
              > > ways to come at it and variables within.
              > > We don't all have to look, act or perform to some
              > > 'standard'. The only standard we need to
              > > adhere to is safety.
              > >
              > > Cheers.
              > >
              > > jim
              > >
              > >
              >
              >
              > __________________________________________________
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            • George Sarris
              Hung, Thanks for reminding me about longer lines. I had read about using longer lines in light winds about a year ago but never did try it. I ll try adding
              Message 6 of 6 , Jul 19, 2004
              • 0 Attachment
                Hung,
                Thanks for reminding me about longer lines. I had
                read about using longer lines in light winds about a
                year ago but never did try it. I'll try adding 10m to
                my existing lines.

                Thanks again,
                George

                --- hungvuatnetcomdotca <hungvu2000@...> wrote:
                > George,
                >
                > I came back to the same beach where I started
                > (actually a few meters
                > downwind but just because I wanted to avoid the
                > crowd).
                >
                > Going upwind and jumping was not an issue at the
                > upper range of the
                > wind 9-10 knots. There were times when I was way
                > upwind of the
                > launching spot.
                >
                > At the lower range of the wind 7-8 knots, I can
                > still somewhat keeping
                > not to loose ground.
                >
                > You may want to consider adding another 10m to your
                > 21.5m and see the
                > differences. Personally, I think all 20m+ kites
                > should be flown with
                > 40 to 45m lines (buy 2 x 20m or a 20m and a 25m then
                > connect them
                > together).
                >
                > At 11-12 knots, I start using my 12m so the "kite
                > size is proportional
                > to rider's weight" rule is still somewhat valid.
                >
                > P.S., Regarding age, as most don't know my real age,
                > they DO think
                > that I am 21 - I was frequently asked for ID at the
                > liquor stores in
                > Florida ;-)
                >
                > P.P.S., The "REAL" purpose of the original post was
                > to encourage the
                > "never has and probably never will ride a
                > directional" kiter to get
                > into light wind kiting as large bidirectionals also
                > work well in light
                > wind...
                >
                > Hung.
                >
                > --- In ksurfschool@yahoogroups.com, George Sarris
                > <jakefarley2000@y...> wrote:
                > > Hung, I'd like to know if you were able to stay
                > > upwind. I myself prefer lightwind kiting and at
                > > 205lbs. with a 21.5m kite I can stay upwind at
                > 11-12
                > > kts. Below that I need to go downwind to stay up
                > even
                > > with a floaty directional. Similiar to Hung many
                > have
                > > come up to me after landing and commented about
                > how
                > > much fun I seemed to have in the light wind. The
                > best
                > > comment I received was from one man who said he
                > > expected a 21 year old to come ashore instead of
                > an
                > > older man.
                > >
                > > Cheers,
                > > George
                > > --- ex_cpe <wetstuff@i...> wrote:
                > > > --- In ksurfschool@yahoogroups.com, Hung Vu
                > > > <hungvu2000@r...> wrote:
                > > > > This time of the year, lightwind rules in our
                > area
                > > > and everyone is
                > > > > "dying" to be able to kite.
                > > > >
                > > > > So I took the 169 Litewave for a real light
                > wind
                > > > test run and got tons
                > > > > of attentions (as usual, when you go extremely
                > > > fast in such little wind
                > > > > compared to the slow-motion of all other
                > > > wind-powered water crafts)
                > > > >
                > > > > Here are my observations:
                > > > >
                > > > > - The Litewave 169 is surely a lightwind
                > > > machine for me, and for
                > > > > heavier kiters, I think Dave makes even larger
                > > > sizes
                > > > > - The Litewave 169 tracks very very well
                > (it
                > > > simply doesn't want to
                > > > > get out of its track) even more so when
                > compared
                > > > to a larger directional
                > > > > - The Litewave 169 is much smaller than a
                > large
                > > > directional (such as
                > > > > the FOne 230), but on water it feels very
                > close to
                > > > one
                > > > > - I made some small 5 - 10' jumps ( in 7 to
                > 10
                > > > knots) and for sure
                > > > > the 169 jumps better than the FOne 230
                > > > > - Speed wise, I thought the 169 was going
                > > > almost as fast as any large
                > > > > directional (with better tracking ability)
                > > > > - For jibing, I still prefer a directional
                > but
                > > > many kiters may not
                > > > > agree with me due to the difficulty of jibing
                > a
                > > > directional.
                > > > > - Either directional or bidirectional, It
                > > > simply felt great to be
                > > > > able to glide on the water so fast in such a
                > light
                > > > wind
                > > > >
                > > > > So large bidirectionals for sure work well in
                > > > light wind (at least winth
                > > > > the Litewave boards) and jump better but may
                > not
                > > > jibe as fun as
                > > > > directionals...
                > > > >
                > > > > P.S., When I got back to the beach, a crowd
                > came
                > > > over and started asking
                > > > > questions - as usual in light wind - as in
                > light
                > > > wind, there are more
                > > > > people on the beach and there isn't anything
                > more
                > > > exciting out there
                > > > > except for a light wind kitesurfer.
                > > >
                > > >
                > > > .........Did anyone weigh you? Hung - how much
                > wet?
                > > > I'm one of the few 'lightwinds fools'
                > > > in my area but I've got about 195lbs of mass to
                > > > extract from the water. I kept buying
                > > > larger kites: R20..18M ARC with little
                > improvement.
                > > > The best grunty kite I have now is a
                > > > R16 with a bar that's about 3' long and a spiffy
                > > > front tube bridle setup.
                > > >
                > > > I found the big kites were soooo slow that I
                > could
                > > > not get any AW with them. A 16 for me
                > > > is faster and I can sine the hell out of it on
                > the
                > > > long bar - then milk the power spikes. My
                > > > rule-of-thumb is: if the kite will go to zenith
                > - I
                > > > can at least do a downwinder. How's that
                > > > for Jones'n for a kitesurf?
                > > >
                > > > .....but one of us here has to be able to run
                > the
                > > > math of how many newtons it takes to get
                > > > my bigass out of the water compared to your lean
                > > > frame.
                > > >
                > > >
                > > >
                > > > >
                > > > > P.P.S., Kiting in light wind is actually a
                > > > wonderful PR tool for
                > > > > kitesurfing as it is much safer and people can
                > > > appreciate and
                > > > > comprehense it more and become less likely to
                > > > "hate" it when the going
                > > > > get tough...
                > > >
                > > >
                > > > ......Au contraire: I'd have a 'student' out
                > with a
                > > > 5M kite (one I did not care about) in 20kts,
                > > > albeit with plenty of free, shallow water
                > downwind
                > > > and let them scare themselves a bit:
                > > > "feel the power!". Last thing I want at my
                > local
                > > > launch is a semi-cocky newbie (you don't
                > > > want to look like a dork in front of 'real'
                > > > kiters..) in a first time heavy air situation.
                > > >
                > > >
                > > >
                > > > .....I also sold a LW169 and kept a directional.
                > It
                > > > provides me with needed float in the lulls.
                > > > The LW was oooo-k, but not special enough to
                > keep in
                > > > the stable. A long directional
                > > > (mine is 6-8) in the ocean is a pain because it
                > > > 'slaps' the chop, but gim'me some bayside
                > > > flatwater and I can scream across the
                > surface...and
                >
                === message truncated ===




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