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RE: [ksurfschool] Re: Kite for newbie

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  • Mark Pronk
    Hink, Its so that the Frenzy is an open cell foil. Intended for any place but the water. Open cell kites are not relaunchable. So, if Ted s a pro-kitesurfer
    Message 1 of 9 , May 23, 2003
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      Hink,

      Its so that the Frenzy is an open cell foil. Intended for any place but the
      water. Open cell kites are not relaunchable.

      So, if Ted's a pro-kitesurfer he's gonna have lots of fun with it, but if he
      drops it the fun is over.

      Ted, go for something else on the water, not for the Frenzy. Unless you're
      in a spot with shallow waters and no currents.

      Takoon can't be bad, heard lots of good stories about them so if you can
      Ted, go for it ;-)

      Mark

      -----------------------------------------
      Have fun kiting, whatever you fly!
      http://www.foils.nl <http://www.foils.nl/>
      -----------------------------------------

      -----Oorspronkelijk bericht-----
      Van: hink_trent [mailto:hink_trent@...]
      Verzonden: donderdag 22 mei 2003 16:52
      Aan: ksurfschool@yahoogroups.com
      Onderwerp: [ksurfschool] Re: Kite for newbie


      The 9.5 frenzy is equivalent to a 12-13 tube kite so why should he
      get another kite with the same power range? It depends on where you
      live, what you weigh and what the winds are like.

      If you are mountian boarding with a 9.5 foil then you probably live
      in a lightwind area - the 16.5 size is probably fine, possibly even
      on the small side if they are using flat sizing and depending on what
      winds you plan to ride in.

      Sorry, I have never even seen a takoon kite in person so I cna't
      comment on them.

      --- In ksurfschool@yahoogroups.com, jakob Thegerström <jakobjth@y...>
      wrote:
      > For me it seems to be quite a big kite (16.5 square
      > meters if i'm correct?). I think you should begin with
      > something smaller... probably 11-13 square meters for
      > your weight... but the price is nice...
      >
      > // J
      >
      >
      > --- train@g... skrev:
      > ---------------------------------
      > I've been flying Ozone Frenzy 9.5m foil kites with
      > landboard for about 4
      > months (I weigh 83kg). I've got the stage where I can
      > control the kite fairly
      > well and board, but I'd now like to switch to water
      > and thus I'm looking for a
      > water kite and board (possible used) for summer use on
      > big lakes and seaside.
      >
      > Someone has offered me a nearly new Takoon Wook 16.5m
      > for $900US.
      >
      > Any opinions on that kite and whether it might be
      > appropriate for me as a
      > newbie with foil and boarding experience?
      >
      > Ted
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
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    • jakobjth
      Ok maybe I m wrong but the Takkoon 16.5 kite is the largest kite from this mark. It s designed for the windspan 6 to 15 knts ( ~3-7.5 ms). So if the wind speed
      Message 2 of 9 , May 23, 2003
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        Ok maybe I'm wrong but the Takkoon 16.5 kite is the largest kite from
        this mark. It's designed for the windspan 6 to 15 knts ( ~3-7.5 ms).
        So if the wind speed up to 10-11ms 20-22knts you will be in a power
        up condition and that can be dangerous. If you're an experienced kite
        surfer this should not be a problem if you are careful under what
        condition you fly... but if you're a beginner (like I am!) to power
        kiting you should maybe consider a smaller kite...

        correct me if i'm wrong about this information?!

        I found the information about the kite takoon wook on these sites:

        http://www.surfstore.co.uk/acatalog/Takoon.html
        http://www.bilboquet.com/content/12/2/834.html

        // J

        --- In ksurfschool@yahoogroups.com, "hink_trent" <hink_trent@y...>
        wrote:
        > The 9.5 frenzy is equivalent to a 12-13 tube kite so why should he
        > get another kite with the same power range? It depends on where you
        > live, what you weigh and what the winds are like.
        >
        > If you are mountian boarding with a 9.5 foil then you probably live
        > in a lightwind area - the 16.5 size is probably fine, possibly even
        > on the small side if they are using flat sizing and depending on
        what
        > winds you plan to ride in.
        >
        > Sorry, I have never even seen a takoon kite in person so I cna't
        > comment on them.
        >
        > --- In ksurfschool@yahoogroups.com, jakob Thegerström
        <jakobjth@y...>
        > wrote:
        > > For me it seems to be quite a big kite (16.5 square
        > > meters if i'm correct?). I think you should begin with
        > > something smaller... probably 11-13 square meters for
        > > your weight... but the price is nice...
        > >
        > > // J
        > >
        > >
        > > --- train@g... skrev:
        > > ---------------------------------
        > > I've been flying Ozone Frenzy 9.5m foil kites with
        > > landboard for about 4
        > > months (I weigh 83kg). I've got the stage where I can
        > > control the kite fairly
        > > well and board, but I'd now like to switch to water
        > > and thus I'm looking for a
        > > water kite and board (possible used) for summer use on
        > > big lakes and seaside.
        > >
        > > Someone has offered me a nearly new Takoon Wook 16.5m
        > > for $900US.
        > >
        > > Any opinions on that kite and whether it might be
        > > appropriate for me as a
        > > newbie with foil and boarding experience?
        > >
        > > Ted
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > > Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ADVERTISEMENT
        > >
        > > If you are new to kitesurfing, please visit
        > > http://www.KitesurfingSchool.org/faqs.htm for the
        > > answers
        > > to the most frequently asked questions.
        > >
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      • hink_trent
        My point was that the guy has experience with a larger kite and is probably either very heavy or lives in a location with light winds, So a 16 meter LEI will
        Message 3 of 9 , May 23, 2003
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          My point was that the guy has experience with a larger kite and is
          probably either very heavy or lives in a location with light winds,
          So a 16 meter LEI will probably not be to big for him.

          I did not reccomed the frenzy for a beginner on the water, even
          though I got my first rides on the water using my open-celled buggy
          foil. Incidently if you crash one straight down into the water it is
          possible to relaunch them if you are fast on pulling the brake line
          and a little bit lucky.

          When he is more experienced and has some confidence, he'll be able to
          use the frenzy at least for cruising around when it is too windy for
          the 16.5 LEI.

          When I first got into kiting, The local dealer reccomeded I get a 5
          meter naish AR3 since anything else would be "too big" and "too
          dangerous" for learning kitesurfing. I decided to get a 3m foil
          instead and use that in the winter to learn kite skills.

          When I tried the 3m out, it seemed powerful when standing still but I
          was very dissapointed at at the lack of power for getting me moving
          on skis, unless the wind was really blowing hard.

          It makes me sick to think I almost took the dealer's advice and spent
          $700 on a 5 meter LEI. My 3 meter foil probably has about the same
          power and in the last three years there have only been about 3 days
          when It was windy enough to take the 3m on the water, and even on
          those days I did not have enough power to ride upwind. I live in a
          light wind area and most of the time I need a 16 meter foil and often
          that is not enough.

          Sure the reccomended beginner size now is 12m instead of 5. It is
          still way too small for some areas. Ted already has flown a 9.5 foil,
          which has about the same power as a 12meter LEI. He probably realizes
          that the 9.5 is not enough power for him to get on the water so he
          wants something with enough power. Reccomending a 12 meter kite is
          bad - it is essentially the same as what he has already, just a
          little more user friendly on the water.



          --- In ksurfschool@yahoogroups.com, Mark Pronk <mpronk@m...> wrote:
          > Hink,
          >
          > Its so that the Frenzy is an open cell foil. Intended for any place
          but the
          > water. Open cell kites are not relaunchable.
          >
          > So, if Ted's a pro-kitesurfer he's gonna have lots of fun with it,
          but if he
          > drops it the fun is over.
          >
          > Ted, go for something else on the water, not for the Frenzy. Unless
          you're
          > in a spot with shallow waters and no currents.
          >
          > Takoon can't be bad, heard lots of good stories about them so if
          you can
          > Ted, go for it ;-)
          >
          > Mark
          >
          > -----------------------------------------
          > Have fun kiting, whatever you fly!
          > http://www.foils.nl <http://www.foils.nl/>
          > -----------------------------------------
          >
          > -----Oorspronkelijk bericht-----
          > Van: hink_trent [mailto:hink_trent@y...]
          > Verzonden: donderdag 22 mei 2003 16:52
          > Aan: ksurfschool@yahoogroups.com
          > Onderwerp: [ksurfschool] Re: Kite for newbie
          >
          >
          > The 9.5 frenzy is equivalent to a 12-13 tube kite so why should he
          > get another kite with the same power range? It depends on where you
          > live, what you weigh and what the winds are like.
          >
          > If you are mountian boarding with a 9.5 foil then you probably live
          > in a lightwind area - the 16.5 size is probably fine, possibly even
          > on the small side if they are using flat sizing and depending on
          what
          > winds you plan to ride in.
          >
          > Sorry, I have never even seen a takoon kite in person so I cna't
          > comment on them.
          >
          > --- In ksurfschool@yahoogroups.com, jakob Thegerström
          <jakobjth@y...>
          > wrote:
          > > For me it seems to be quite a big kite (16.5 square
          > > meters if i'm correct?). I think you should begin with
          > > something smaller... probably 11-13 square meters for
          > > your weight... but the price is nice...
          > >
          > > // J
          > >
          > >
          > > --- train@g... skrev:
          > > ---------------------------------
          > > I've been flying Ozone Frenzy 9.5m foil kites with
          > > landboard for about 4
          > > months (I weigh 83kg). I've got the stage where I can
          > > control the kite fairly
          > > well and board, but I'd now like to switch to water
          > > and thus I'm looking for a
          > > water kite and board (possible used) for summer use on
          > > big lakes and seaside.
          > >
          > > Someone has offered me a nearly new Takoon Wook 16.5m
          > > for $900US.
          > >
          > > Any opinions on that kite and whether it might be
          > > appropriate for me as a
          > > newbie with foil and boarding experience?
          > >
          > > Ted
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > > Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ADVERTISEMENT
          > >
          > > If you are new to kitesurfing, please visit
          > > http://www.KitesurfingSchool.org/faqs.htm
          > <http://www.KitesurfingSchool.org/faqs.htm> for the
          > > answers
          > > to the most frequently asked questions.
          > >
          > > To unsubscribe, please send an email to
          > > ksurfschool-unsubscribe@egroups.com
          > > To subscribe, please send an email to
          > > ksurfschool-subscribe@egroups.com
          > >
          > >
          > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo!
          > > Terms of Service.
          > >
          > > _____________________________________________________
          > > Gå före i kön och få din sajt värderad på nolltid med Yahoo!
          Express
          > > Se mer på: http://se.docs.yahoo.com/info/express/help/index.html
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        • nhugroups
          Thanks all for replying to my questions about the Takoon 16.5m and kite sizing for my first LEI :). I m comfortable flying my Frenzy 9.5m (open cell
          Message 4 of 9 , May 23, 2003
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            Thanks all for replying to my questions about the Takoon 16.5m
            and kite sizing for my first LEI :).

            I'm comfortable flying my Frenzy 9.5m (open cell de-powerable
            foil) and crash only when there is not enough wind to landboard.
            I weigh 83kgs (going down to 75kg!) and plan to buy and fly my
            first LEI for light wind conditions in Canadian lakes and UK
            seaside - i.e. 8-18 knots (if a kite will span that) - not Maui :(.

            I started with a 7.3M Frenzy, but didn't really crack landboarding
            with it because I needed 14 knots before I could get going. In
            those winds the kite was all over the sky and I only ever got got
            the hang of it when (with knocking knees) I test drove the 12m
            Frenzy. Suddenly I was able to landboard and went out and
            bought the 9.5m straightaway. Things just happened more
            slowly and predictably with those bigger kites which
            paradoxically meant they were easier to learn to board on -
            providing I chose light wind days.

            Question 1: Is this likely to be the same scenario for learning
            with my first LEI?

            I agree with Hink that a larger LEI around 16m would give me the
            option of switching to my 9.5m Frenzy when the wind went above,
            say 15knots. I do appreciate the concern of others about not
            getting in over my head with a large first LEI. So I'd like to hear
            more from those kind peeps.

            Question 2: Perhaps these folks are lighter than me - or fly in
            conditions starting at 14 knots? I'm curious.

            Question 3: I'd like my first LEI to be suitable for 8-15 knots
            kitesurfing and one that could take me to an intermediate level
            with medium floaty jumps. Given all this - I'd appreciate opinions
            on specific kite and board sizes for my situation? Anymore ideas
            on the 16.5m Takoon?

            Ted
          • Kite Power (Sydney)
            G day Mark True the Frenzy is open celled, but it can often be re-launch from water, especially if the bar is let go of, as the kite then will land on the
            Message 5 of 9 , May 23, 2003
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              G'day Mark
              True the Frenzy is open celled, but it can often be re-launch from water, especially if the bar is let go of, as the kite then will land on the waters surface TE down, and can be easily launched.
              If it hits LE first and stays there (because you have not let go of the bar) then release the bar, it will reverse off the water and land on its TE, ready for re-launch. I would estimate the kite will still be launchable after several minutes in this position.

              The Frenzy is designed to be used on land snow and water, the perfect crossover kite!

              Cya and
              Goodwinds
              Steve McCormack
              http://www.kitepower.com.au

              ----- Original Message -----
              From: Mark Pronk
              To: 'ksurfschool@yahoogroups.com'
              Sent: Friday, May 23, 2003 5:45 PM
              Subject: RE: [ksurfschool] Re: Kite for newbie


              Hink,

              Its so that the Frenzy is an open cell foil. Intended for any place but the
              water. Open cell kites are not relaunchable.

              So, if Ted's a pro-kitesurfer he's gonna have lots of fun with it, but if he
              drops it the fun is over.

              Ted, go for something else on the water, not for the Frenzy. Unless you're
              in a spot with shallow waters and no currents.

              Takoon can't be bad, heard lots of good stories about them so if you can
              Ted, go for it ;-)

              Mark

              -----------------------------------------
              Have fun kiting, whatever you fly!
              http://www.foils.nl <http://www.foils.nl/>
              -----------------------------------------

              -----Oorspronkelijk bericht-----
              Van: hink_trent [mailto:hink_trent@...]
              Verzonden: donderdag 22 mei 2003 16:52
              Aan: ksurfschool@yahoogroups.com
              Onderwerp: [ksurfschool] Re: Kite for newbie


              The 9.5 frenzy is equivalent to a 12-13 tube kite so why should he
              get another kite with the same power range? It depends on where you
              live, what you weigh and what the winds are like.

              If you are mountian boarding with a 9.5 foil then you probably live
              in a lightwind area - the 16.5 size is probably fine, possibly even
              on the small side if they are using flat sizing and depending on what
              winds you plan to ride in.

              Sorry, I have never even seen a takoon kite in person so I cna't
              comment on them.

              --- In ksurfschool@yahoogroups.com, jakob Thegerström <jakobjth@y...>
              wrote:
              > For me it seems to be quite a big kite (16.5 square
              > meters if i'm correct?). I think you should begin with
              > something smaller... probably 11-13 square meters for
              > your weight... but the price is nice...
              >
              > // J
              >
              >
              > --- train@g... skrev:
              > ---------------------------------
              > I've been flying Ozone Frenzy 9.5m foil kites with
              > landboard for about 4
              > months (I weigh 83kg). I've got the stage where I can
              > control the kite fairly
              > well and board, but I'd now like to switch to water
              > and thus I'm looking for a
              > water kite and board (possible used) for summer use on
              > big lakes and seaside.
              >
              > Someone has offered me a nearly new Takoon Wook 16.5m
              > for $900US.
              >
              > Any opinions on that kite and whether it might be
              > appropriate for me as a
              > newbie with foil and boarding experience?
              >
              > Ted
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              > Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ADVERTISEMENT
              >
              > If you are new to kitesurfing, please visit
              > http://www.KitesurfingSchool.org/faqs.htm
              <http://www.KitesurfingSchool.org/faqs.htm> for the
              > answers
              > to the most frequently asked questions.
              >
              > To unsubscribe, please send an email to
              > ksurfschool-unsubscribe@egroups.com
              > To subscribe, please send an email to
              > ksurfschool-subscribe@egroups.com
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              > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo!
              > Terms of Service.
              >
              > _____________________________________________________
              > Gå före i kön och få din sajt värderad på nolltid med Yahoo! Express
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            • Kite Power (Sydney)
              G day Ted - i.e. 8-18 knots (if a kite will span that) - not Maui :(. Many 16.0/18.0M inflatable kites will give you this wind range I started with a 7.3M
              Message 6 of 9 , May 24, 2003
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                G'day Ted
                - i.e. 8-18 knots (if a kite will span that) - not Maui :(.
                Many 16.0/18.0M inflatable kites will give you this wind range


                I started with a 7.3M Frenzy, but didn't really crack landboarding
                with it because I needed 14 knots before I could get going. In
                those winds the kite was all over the sky and I only ever got got
                the hang of it when (with knocking knees) I test drove the 12m
                Frenzy. Suddenly I was able to landboard and went out and
                bought the 9.5m straightaway. Things just happened more
                slowly and predictably with those bigger kites which
                paradoxically meant they were easier to learn to board on -
                providing I chose light wind days.

                Question 1: Is this likely to be the same scenario for learning
                with my first LEI?

                So you learned that a certain minimum kite power is needed to actually "do" each sport properly. The amount of power does intimidate people at first, but you get used to it. Getting used to it can lead some people to do dangerous things, mainly due the their inexperience/ignorance of the danger, but it sounds like you are take a more measured approach?

                I agree with Hink that a larger LEI around 16m would give me the
                option of switching to my 9.5m Frenzy when the wind went above,
                say 15knots. I do appreciate the concern of others about not
                getting in over my head with a large first LEI. So I'd like to hear
                more from those kind peeps.

                Its more about not wasting money getting 2 kites that have too much overlap in wind range. You already have a large amount of kte flying experience.

                Question 2: Perhaps these folks are lighter than me - or fly in
                conditions starting at 14 knots? I'm curious.

                Some people will only kiteboard when the wind is strong enough to jump reasonabley high, others will go out with a mal surfboard, 16.0 inflato, when the wind is 5/6knots, there is no rule book about what is fun............is there?

                Question 3: I'd like my first LEI to be suitable for 8-15 knots
                kitesurfing and one that could take me to an intermediate level
                with medium floaty jumps. Given all this - I'd appreciate opinions
                on specific kite and board sizes for my situation? Anymore ideas
                on the 16.5m Takoon?

                Don't know about the new Takoons, but they were very similar to Wipika Airblasts, and GRK kites.
                Any of the new 2002/2003 kites in the 15.0 to 18.0 sizes will do what you want, especially, naish aero 2, naish X3 and X2, North Rhino1 and 2, F-One Mach 1 18.1, and mach 2 16.0, Flexifoil Storm 1, 16.0 Storm2 16.0/18, etc

                Cya and
                Goodwinds
                Steve McCormack
                http://www.kitepower.com.au







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