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Disabled Tyer

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  • ben_2_go
    I am a beginner at tying.I ve done some simple braids and weaves to make lanyards,bracelets,and necklaces.I would like to use my new found hobby to help make
    Message 1 of 11 , Sep 29, 2013
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      I am a beginner at tying.I've done some simple braids and weaves to make lanyards,bracelets,and necklaces.I would like to use my new found hobby to help make ends meet since my SSD doesn't cover the bills.I would also like to push into more advanced tying.I am not sure where to start with this and how to make a little money doing it.I missed a couple local events that would have been place to show and sell.I have a couple friends that have small arts and crafts type stores.A few friends have small second hand shops.I can also put together a website featuring my work or even advertise on sites like ebay.I just don't know what direction to go in next to advance my skills.I feel that if I hone my skills,my work will sell itself.What are thoughts does the group have on advancing and perfecting skills?Also,should I ask this over on the IKTG?
    • Heather Twist
      Another market you might want to try are the historical re-enactors. Belts, horse bridles, tassels for swords, wrappings for knives. Celtic knots are big too.
      Message 2 of 11 , Sep 30, 2013
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        Another market you might want to try are the historical re-enactors. Belts, horse bridles, tassels for swords, wrappings for knives. Celtic knots are big too.


        On Sun, Sep 29, 2013 at 8:43 PM, <ben2go@...> wrote:


        I am a beginner at tying.I've done some simple braids and weaves to make lanyards,bracelets,and necklaces.I would like to use my new found hobby to help make ends meet since my SSD doesn't cover the bills.I would also like to push into more advanced tying.I am not sure where to start with this and how to make a little money doing it.I missed a couple local events that would have been place to show and sell.I have a couple friends that have small arts and crafts type stores.A few friends have small second hand shops.I can also put together a website featuring my work or even advertise on sites like ebay.I just don't know what direction to go in next to advance my skills.I feel that if I hone my skills,my work will sell itself.What are thoughts does the group have on advancing and perfecting skills?Also,should I ask this over on the IKTG?




        --
        Heather Twist -- Seattle 7B
        http://eatingoffthefoodgrid.blogspot.com/
         
         
      • knotslipstick
        What to tye -- pick something that you like to tye, if you don t like it then you will get bored with it and in my opinion you work will suffer. Start small
        Message 3 of 11 , Sep 30, 2013
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          What to tye -- pick something that you like to tye, if you don't like it then you will get bored with it and in my opinion you work will suffer.  Start small and uncomplicated, work your way up. 


          Work on your process, material, sizes, and pricing.  Keep track on how much cord it takes for each item, what length of waste cord is produced, and how much waste cord you actually need to tie the knot, factor this into your cost work-up.  Keep track of how much time it takes you to prep, and tye each item.  Sell items at cost to see what people's tolerance is.  Go to events and find out what people like, what do they spend the most time looking at.  Price some things low, and others higher to see what the market will bear.  Figure out how what your profit per item is and how much time it took you to tye it.


          == Ideas  =======


          Turks Head bracelets seem to be a good bet.


          Starknot necklaces either single or multi-strand are also good -- you can embed a 'jewel' glass bead in the center.


          Monkey fist and decorative knot key fobs, ...


          Ocean mat coasters...


          Braided belts -- Ron Edward's books are good for that.


          == Consider ====


          The real issue is how to price them.   Most people don't want to pay for the time it takes to make the item.  Some times they don't even want to pay for the material costs...  Many will ohhhh and ahhh over your work, but few will buy if they aren't priced right. 


          === Investment ===


          Once you settle on a product you have to buy enough material to lower its cost per product.  Then you have to have an efficient means of cutting cord, starting and finishing each item so that you don't spend lots of time on each one, and can crank them out.  If you are offering multiple colors you have to have a variety of them.  I prefer solid colors as they show the knots better, or interleave multi-color cord between the solid colors.




          ---In knottyers@yahoogroups.com, <knottyers@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

          I am a beginner at tying.I've done some simple braids and weaves to make lanyards,bracelets,and necklaces.I would like to use my new found hobby to help make ends meet since my SSD doesn't cover the bills.I would also like to push into more advanced tying.I am not sure where to start with this and how to make a little money doing it.I missed a couple local events that would have been place to show and sell.I have a couple friends that have small arts and crafts type stores.A few friends have small second hand shops.I can also put together a website featuring my work or even advertise on sites like ebay.I just don't know what direction to go in next to advance my skills.I feel that if I hone my skills,my work will sell itself.What are thoughts does the group have on advancing and perfecting skills?Also,should I ask this over on the IKTG?
        • ben_2_go
          Thanks for the ideas, but I m not sure I am ready to go from novice to advanced tying. ---In knottyers@yahoogroups.com, wrote: Another
          Message 4 of 11 , Sep 30, 2013
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            Thanks for the ideas, but I'm not sure I am ready to go from novice to advanced tying.



            ---In knottyers@yahoogroups.com, <HeatherTwist@...> wrote:

            Another market you might want to try are the historical re-enactors. Belts, horse bridles, tassels for swords, wrappings for knives. Celtic knots are big too.


            On Sun, Sep 29, 2013 at 8:43 PM, <ben2go@...> wrote:


            I am a beginner at tying.I've done some simple braids and weaves to make lanyards,bracelets,and necklaces.I would like to use my new found hobby to help make ends meet since my SSD doesn't cover the bills.I would also like to push into more advanced tying.I am not sure where to start with this and how to make a little money doing it.I missed a couple local events that would have been place to show and sell.I have a couple friends that have small arts and crafts type stores.A few friends have small second hand shops.I can also put together a website featuring my work or even advertise on sites like ebay.I just don't know what direction to go in next to advance my skills.I feel that if I hone my skills,my work will sell itself.What are thoughts does the group have on advancing and perfecting skills?Also,should I ask this over on the IKTG?




            --
            Heather Twist -- Seattle 7B
            http://eatingoffthefoodgrid.blogspot.com/
             
             
          • knotslipstick
            So what I was really trying to say is think about a business plan! ---In knottyers@yahoogroups.com, wrote: I am a beginner at
            Message 5 of 11 , Sep 30, 2013
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              So what I was really trying to say is think about a business plan!

               



              ---In knottyers@yahoogroups.com, <knottyers@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

              I am a beginner at tying.I've done some simple braids and weaves to make lanyards,bracelets,and necklaces.I would like to use my new found hobby to help make ends meet since my SSD doesn't cover the bills.I would also like to push into more advanced tying.I am not sure where to start with this and how to make a little money doing it.I missed a couple local events that would have been place to show and sell.I have a couple friends that have small arts and crafts type stores.A few friends have small second hand shops.I can also put together a website featuring my work or even advertise on sites like ebay.I just don't know what direction to go in next to advance my skills.I feel that if I hone my skills,my work will sell itself.What are thoughts does the group have on advancing and perfecting skills?Also,should I ask this over on the IKTG?
            • Matt Beaudoin
              Factor in marketing and advertising too.. I spend about 3 hours a day on networking and advertising… I have been SHOCKED at how much you have to talk about
              Message 6 of 11 , Sep 30, 2013
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                Factor in marketing and advertising too.. I spend about 3 hours a day on networking and advertising… I have been SHOCKED at how much you have to talk about knots to get someone to spend $5 on one… J 

                 

                You might consider using another selling outlet once you get rolling.  We’ve been thinking of reaching out for other artisans to help ‘round out’ our site. 

                 

                Make sure you have ‘adult supervision’ or you’ll end up like Jill and I… I have 6 pallets of #48 cotton cord , 1 pallet of #60, and 1 pallet of 108# right now in a storage space I rent…..a knot tying business can get out of control if no one is there to tell you you’re nuts J

                 

                Matt Beaudoin

                Mystic knotwork

                (btw, we are the ONLY returning artisan to the Martha Stewart event in 2 weeks at Grand Central Station)

                 

                From: knottyers@yahoogroups.com [mailto:knottyers@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of knotslipstick
                Sent: Monday, September 30, 2013 6:45 PM
                To: knottyers@yahoogroups.com
                Subject: [KnotTyers] RE: Disabled Tyer

                 



                So what I was really trying to say is think about a business plan!

                 



                ---In knottyers@yahoogroups.com, <knottyers@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

                I am a beginner at tying.I've done some simple braids and weaves to make lanyards,bracelets,and necklaces.I would like to use my new found hobby to help make ends meet since my SSD doesn't cover the bills.I would also like to push into more advanced tying.I am not sure where to start with this and how to make a little money doing it.I missed a couple local events that would have been place to show and sell.I have a couple friends that have small arts and crafts type stores.A few friends have small second hand shops.I can also put together a website featuring my work or even advertise on sites like ebay.I just don't know what direction to go in next to advance my skills.I feel that if I hone my skills,my work will sell itself.What are thoughts does the group have on advancing and perfecting skills?Also,should I ask this over on the IKTG?




              • Kathlean Wolf
                I would say go for it with the supplies you have, see how well it works before you invest more--the great thing about tying is that it is worthwhile in and of
                Message 7 of 11 , Oct 6, 2013
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                  I would say go for it with the supplies you have, see how well it works before you invest more--the great thing about tying is that it is worthwhile in and of itself, so if you make a lot of product because you LOVE it, you've lost nothing, really.  Consignment in friends' shops means very little risk to you. 

                  One suggestion on "marketing" is to put a tiny tag folded with your "story" on it.  Something along the lines of "The art of decorative knotwork has a history almost as ancient as humankind ... blah blah blah ... this knot was originally developed (on Whaling schooners in the 1700's, by weavers in Mesopotamia, by butchers in Germany, etc.,) ... this unique piece was crafted by Ben Knotyer, a disabled local artist ...."  It's like an extra gift to some people, to know that history and your story. 

                  Another weird way to sell things in art-fairs that have a high attendance by hippie-types is to put a "suggested price" on the item.  "Knotwork pieces are labeled with the number of hours spent on their creation.  Please pay the artist what you feel his time and skill is worth."  Try it once--see what happens, I doubt you'd get less than $5 per hour but you also might get much, much more out of the occasional ethics-driven, well-moneyed soul. 

                  If you want to try out Turksheads, which are great napkin-holders and great for putting around the heads of walking-sticks, let me know.  I have a graphic you can tape onto a cardboard tube that basically just tells you how to weave the thing--for me, it was a bit easier than interpretting someone's video tutorial.  However, there are some GREAT tutorials on knotheadsworldwide.net when you want to get into more intricate knots. 

                  Crafts are always a hard sell.  Many times, people walk by and say, "I could make that myself!" (not that they do).  The more complex the knot, however, the more people will marvel, and the faster and neater your work, the more potential to see a bit of income from it--but I wouldn't sink hopes into it, because crafters rarely get much farther than breaking even.  The feedback is the thing ... people loving your stuff enough to buy it, THAT is a wonderful feeling! 

                  Good luck and HAVE FUN! 


                  From: "ben2go@..." <ben2go@...>
                  To: knottyers@yahoogroups.com
                  Sent: Sunday, September 29, 2013 10:43 PM
                  Subject: [KnotTyers] Disabled Tyer

                   
                  I am a beginner at tying.I've done some simple braids and weaves to make lanyards,bracelets,and necklaces.I would like to use my new found hobby to help make ends meet since my SSD doesn't cover the bills.I would also like to push into more advanced tying.I am not sure where to start with this and how to make a little money doing it.I missed a couple local events that would have been place to show and sell.I have a couple friends that have small arts and crafts type stores.A few friends have small second hand shops.I can also put together a website featuring my work or even advertise on sites like ebay.I just don't know what direction to go in next to advance my skills.I feel that if I hone my skills,my work will sell itself.What are thoughts does the group have on advancing and perfecting skills?Also,should I ask this over on the IKTG?


                • ben_2_go
                  Thanks Kathlean Wolf.That s a good way to look at it.It wouldn t be hard to do that,add tags that is.I do have a few people with small retail shops.I will be
                  Message 8 of 11 , Oct 11, 2013
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                    Thanks Kathlean Wolf.That's a good way to look at it.It wouldn't be hard to do that,add tags that is.I do have a few people with small retail shops.I will be keeping those ideas in mind.The weather is starting to turn here,so I'll be doing indoor work along with my daily physical therapy.Hopefully I'll have some work done by turkey day.

                     



                    ---In knottyers@yahoogroups.com, <leafinthesunlight@...> wrote:

                    I would say go for it with the supplies you have, see how well it works before you invest more--the great thing about tying is that it is worthwhile in and of itself, so if you make a lot of product because you LOVE it, you've lost nothing, really.  Consignment in friends' shops means very little risk to you. 

                    One suggestion on "marketing" is to put a tiny tag folded with your "story" on it.  Something along the lines of "The art of decorative knotwork has a history almost as ancient as humankind ... blah blah blah ... this knot was originally developed (on Whaling schooners in the 1700's, by weavers in Mesopotamia, by butchers in Germany, etc.,) ... this unique piece was crafted by Ben Knotyer, a disabled local artist ...."  It's like an extra gift to some people, to know that history and your story. 

                    Another weird way to sell things in art-fairs that have a high attendance by hippie-types is to put a "suggested price" on the item.  "Knotwork pieces are labeled with the number of hours spent on their creation.  Please pay the artist what you feel his time and skill is worth."  Try it once--see what happens, I doubt you'd get less than $5 per hour but you also might get much, much more out of the occasional ethics-driven, well-moneyed soul. 

                    If you want to try out Turksheads, which are great napkin-holders and great for putting around the heads of walking-sticks, let me know.  I have a graphic you can tape onto a cardboard tube that basically just tells you how to weave the thing--for me, it was a bit easier than interpretting someone's video tutorial.  However, there are some GREAT tutorials on knotheadsworldwide.net when you want to get into more intricate knots. 

                    Crafts are always a hard sell.  Many times, people walk by and say, "I could make that myself!" (not that they do).  The more complex the knot, however, the more people will marvel, and the faster and neater your work, the more potential to see a bit of income from it--but I wouldn't sink hopes into it, because crafters rarely get much farther than breaking even.  The feedback is the thing ... people loving your stuff enough to buy it, THAT is a wonderful feeling! 

                    Good luck and HAVE FUN! 


                    From: "ben2go@..." <ben2go@...>
                    To: knottyers@yahoogroups.com
                    Sent: Sunday, September 29, 2013 10:43 PM
                    Subject: [KnotTyers] Disabled Tyer

                     
                    I am a beginner at tying.I've done some simple braids and weaves to make lanyards,bracelets,and necklaces.I would like to use my new found hobby to help make ends meet since my SSD doesn't cover the bills.I would also like to push into more advanced tying.I am not sure where to start with this and how to make a little money doing it.I missed a couple local events that would have been place to show and sell.I have a couple friends that have small arts and crafts type stores.A few friends have small second hand shops.I can also put together a website featuring my work or even advertise on sites like ebay.I just don't know what direction to go in next to advance my skills.I feel that if I hone my skills,my work will sell itself.What are thoughts does the group have on advancing and perfecting skills?Also,should I ask this over on the IKTG?


                  • flutejerry
                    Ask Everyplace! You will get a ton of advice that you ll have to sift through to decide what is useful, then proceed with caution. I d advise looking at Uncle
                    Message 9 of 11 , Oct 20, 2013
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                      Ask Everyplace!  You will get a ton of advice that you'll have to sift through to decide what is useful, then proceed with caution.


                      I'd advise looking at Uncle Vince's sight; "Frayedknots.com."  Can't do better to see new and exciting ideas or to get information on "How To."  Vince is great at the advice stuff too.  One point you need to keep in mind, if you're going to go into the retail side, is that there are a lot of people trying to do such a thing and not many succeeding.


                      Here's the deal.  The first, and most important part of retail is to know your competition.  Look at those who sell the kind of thing you think you can make.  Can you beat their prices?  If you can't, move on.  Craft fairs are good in November and December if you have a quality product you can sell inexpensively.


                      I'd recommend that you have something really nice on display, like a frame, with lots of lanyards and key fobs you actually plan to sell.  People will stop to see the frame, shy away from it's high price but buy the fobs.  Again, November and December.


                      Also, don't even consider a craft fair that doesn't charge admission and ONLY go to the ones that are juryied.  The Jury will insure quality and the admission guarantees that the crowd are buyers.


                      But the biggest issue you need to deal with is YOUR PRODUCT QUALITY.  Learn what you are doing.  Study the tutorials on Vince's site, work out the details and produce something YOU'D be proud to own.  And understand that you'll never get your time out of what you sell.  Make it up by doing quality knotting.  Beyond all that, practice and study.  Lots of reference material to work with and we can all make recommendations.


                      Good luck and stay in touch.


                      Jerry



                      ---In knottyers@yahoogroups.com, <knottyers@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

                      I am a beginner at tying.I've done some simple braids and weaves to make lanyards,bracelets,and necklaces.I would like to use my new found hobby to help make ends meet since my SSD doesn't cover the bills.I would also like to push into more advanced tying.I am not sure where to start with this and how to make a little money doing it.I missed a couple local events that would have been place to show and sell.I have a couple friends that have small arts and crafts type stores.A few friends have small second hand shops.I can also put together a website featuring my work or even advertise on sites like ebay.I just don't know what direction to go in next to advance my skills.I feel that if I hone my skills,my work will sell itself.What are thoughts does the group have on advancing and perfecting skills?Also,should I ask this over on the IKTG?
                    • flutejerry
                      The guild is a great place to be. You ll find that most of them are beyond doing marketing and shows, however. But the skills you can learn from that group
                      Message 10 of 11 , Jan 30, 2014
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                        The guild is a great place to be.  You'll find that most of them are beyond doing marketing and shows, however.  But the skills you can learn from that group will stand you well.  They have a convention coming up in October in Eastern Canada.  If you can get there, you'll have a great time.


                        As far as your other questions go, here's my two cents worth.  I spent a lot of years doing retail crafts and know a few tricks about how to succeed, if you can do such a thing.  Craft Fairs work, but only selectively.  They need to be in the fall, close to Christmas, and NEVER get into one that isn't juried or that does not charge admission.  The jury process controls how many of each type craft are displayed.  Admission keeps the rift raft out.  The only people you'll see are buyers.  Surly you've got some art and craft associations around you.  Find them, join them and attend as a "lurker" before you actually set up a table.


                        When you DO set one up, remember the basic rules of craft fair selling; big items attract attention, small ones pay your table fees.  Do something really remarkable that you'd charge a lot of money for and plan to NEVER sell it.  But, put plenty of smaller pieces out that people will buy after admiring your large work.  Guaranteed to make sales that way, if there are sales to make.


                        eBay is always a crap shoot.  You have to look at your competition there and price accordingly.  Even when the others are making crap, that's what most people will buy because most people don't know the difference.  I can make a Survivor Bracelet using square knots in about five minutes with about three dollars worth of material.  Selling on eBay, I might be able to get ten dollars for it.  But, why bother?  Your competition there will beat you to death with their poor craftsmanship and lower prices.  IF I decided to go the eBay route, I'd make a bracelet using a braid no one had ever seen before, and there's plenty of them to choose from.  I'd make a point of how many feet of cord I'd used so "Survivor People" would know how much cord they have to save their lives; sure hope that never happens, however . . .  I'd price it higher but make sure I place them in consignment shops or on my web site too.  Marketing is a tough game.


                        Where do you live?  There's probably others on board that are close enough to you to give you some help.  I'm along the coast of Maine and am a 100% disabled Veteran.  I do knotting because I like it.  Maybe sometime I'll sell some, but it's not an item of interest to me now.  Too many years doing all that.  However, keep the questions coming.  I'd be glad to pass on some ideas or answer any technical questions you may have.  Some of my work is in the photo section in "Senior Chief's Studies."  That's right next to Skip Hipps magnificent frame.  And, just for the record, Skip is ALWAYS willing to help someone in knot tying.


                        Keep in touch and we'll see you through all this.  Knotting ain't tough to learn; doing it well is the problem.


                        Jerry

                      • E C
                        Jerry:   Thanks for your words. I m needing to figure out sales for May and beyond. I think I ll do a couple of attention grabbers as you suggest and then
                        Message 11 of 11 , Feb 17, 2014
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                          Jerry:
                           
                          Thanks for your words. I'm needing to figure out sales for May and beyond. I think I'll do a couple of attention grabbers as you suggest and then lots of key fobs and such.
                           
                          Enrique
                           
                          Be kinder than necessary, for everyone you meet is fighting some kind of battle.
                          "Health workers have an obligation to address the issue of poverty directly rather than remain content to deal with its effects." D Raphael


                          On Thursday, January 30, 2014 1:02 PM, "revjerry@..." <revjerry@...> wrote:
                           
                          The guild is a great place to be.  You'll find that most of them are beyond doing marketing and shows, however.  But the skills you can learn from that group will stand you well.  They have a convention coming up in October in Eastern Canada.  If you can get there, you'll have a great time.

                          As far as your other questions go, here's my two cents worth.  I spent a lot of years doing retail crafts and know a few tricks about how to succeed, if you can do such a thing.  Craft Fairs work, but only selectively.  They need to be in the fall, close to Christmas, and NEVER get into one that isn't juried or that does not charge admission.  The jury process controls how many of each type craft are displayed.  Admission keeps the rift raft out.  The only people you'll see are buyers.  Surly you've got some art and craft associations around you.  Find them, join them and attend as a "lurker" before you actually set up a table.

                          When you DO set one up, remember the basic rules of craft fair selling; big items attract attention, small ones pay your table fees.  Do something really remarkable that you'd charge a lot of money for and plan to NEVER sell it.  But, put plenty of smaller pieces out that people will buy after admiring your large work.  Guaranteed to make sales that way, if there are sales to make.

                          eBay is always a crap shoot.  You have to look at your competition there and price accordingly.  Even when the others are making crap, that's what most people will buy because most people don't know the difference.  I can make a Survivor Bracelet using square knots in about five minutes with about three dollars worth of material.  Selling on eBay, I might be able to get ten dollars for it.  But, why bother?  Your competition there will beat you to death with their poor craftsmanship and lower prices.  IF I decided to go the eBay route, I'd make a bracelet using a braid no one had ever seen before, and there's plenty of them to choose from.  I'd make a point of how many feet of cord I'd used so "Survivor People" would know how much cord they have to save their lives; sure hope that never happens, however . . .  I'd price it higher but make sure I place them in consignment shops or on my web site too.  Marketing is a tough game.

                          Where do you live?  There's probably others on board that are close enough to you to give you some help.  I'm along the coast of Maine and am a 100% disabled Veteran.  I do knotting because I like it.  Maybe sometime I'll sell some, but it's not an item of interest to me now.  Too many years doing all that.  However, keep the questions coming.  I'd be glad to pass on some ideas or answer any technical questions you may have.  Some of my work is in the photo section in "Senior Chief's Studies."  That's right next to Skip Hipps magnificent frame.  And, just for the record, Skip is ALWAYS willing to help someone in knot tying.

                          Keep in touch and we'll see you through all this.  Knotting ain't tough to learn; doing it well is the problem.

                          Jerry


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