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Re: DAK charm

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  • mikezcnc
    Margaret, I stopped breathing when I saw the art you created, because art it is. Breathtaking. Did you use some illusion in it, too? I cannot tell because the
    Message 1 of 4 , Nov 29, 2004
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      Margaret,

      I stopped breathing when I saw the art you created, because art it is.
      Breathtaking.

      Did you use some illusion in it, too? I cannot tell because the
      pattern is very dynamic. Yes, you guessed me right, I actually
      haven't seen any knitting, never seen a machine before if only
      briefly.

      Thank you for encouragement.

      Can you tell me how long did it take you to:

      modify the pattern in DAK?
      make each arm?
      make front?
      make back?
      assemble all together
      total amount of time?

      I want to have a modern version of PPD and FB100 substituted by a PC.
      Let's say, I can buy a design from you that way I could use my PC to
      download it to a knitting machine, assuming no modificatins are
      neccessary (I can see a big business for people modifying patterns on
      DAK for others and it tells me that DAK could have a version of their
      program just for that purpose).

      Mike






      -- In kminternals@yahoogroups.com, "margaretbheck" <mheck@m...> wrote:
      >
      > Hi Mike,
      > Thought you might like to see an example of what you can do with a
      > knitting machine and DAK. I just uploaded a file to our PHOTOS
      area,
      > called example. I bought the sweater pattern from Dale of Norway,
      > scanned the charts and saved them to my computer, entered them in
      DAK,
      > changed the colors to the ones my husband liked, downloaded the
      pieces
      > to my Brother 970, knit each piece, sewed together by hand and
      > presented to husband. Don't mean to brag....well, maybe I do....
      but
      > this beautiful, intricate design took me about 1/50 of the time to
      > make on the machine as it would by hand. (Yup, I've done that
      too.)
      > Each piece took me about an hour because of the color changes.
      > Otherwise it would have gone faster.
      >
      > I agree that it would be good to learn your machine first, but if
      you
      > are motivated, you can learn fast and eventually produce wonderful
      > garments. There are some other gentlemen on the yahoo machine
      > knitting lists--great to have you!
      >
      > Don't get me wrong, I LOVE LOVE LOVE DAK, but sounds like you might
      be
      > able to create a program too. Nifty to have both programming and
      > knitting skills. Once you do get knitting, these lists are great at
      > helping you get over bumps in the road.
      > M
    • mar heck
      ... Mike, First, I need to re-iterate that I purchased the pattern from Dale of Norway, although I have designed many sweaters myself as well using DAK. I
      Message 2 of 4 , Nov 29, 2004
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        mikezcnc wrote:

        Can you tell me how long did it take you to:

        modify the pattern in DAK?
        make each arm?
        make front?
        make back?
        assemble all together
        total amount of time?

        I want to have a modern version of PPD and FB100 substituted by a PC.
        Let's say, I can buy a design from you that way I could use my PC to
        download it to a knitting machine, assuming no modificatins are
        neccessary (I can see a big business for people modifying patterns on
        DAK for others and it tells me that DAK could have a version of their
        program just for that purpose).

        Mike
        Mike,
        First, I need to re-iterate that I purchased the pattern from Dale of Norway, although I have designed many sweaters myself as well using DAK.  I used this example to show you just one of the things you can do with DAK.  Regarding time it takes (mind you I've been knitting for a few years and if the knitting gods and goddesses are with you on the day of knitting....here are my estimates.)  After scanning the charts and putting them into DAK, about 1/2 hour to do a swatch and figure out rows and stitches per inch.  Measure recipient,  decide how many rows and stitches  needed, do the math, 10 minutes.  Downloading pattern to machine:  3 minutes.  Each sleeve, front, back  1 hour each.  Assembly and running in yarn ends:  4-5 or 6 hours (same as handknitting).   So, maybe 10-15 hrs if all goes well.

         Regarding your entrepreneurial ideas, I dunno.  If a person owns DAK, they can do their own sizing and modifications.  There are so many things DAK can do, we haven't even scratched the surface in this discussion.  Even can estimate for you how much yarn you'll need for a garment, will superimpose a shape onto a design, will grade a pattern into different sizes, will give you a pattern according to your instructions, just to mention a few things.  like any hobby, there is a learning curve.  And to learn to do something well, it takes a bit of practice, a few flops and a few successes.  In my opinion, DAK is worth the big bucks, but I get frustrated that the interface is like pre-windows 95, I think.    Finding a teacher is a good thing, although you can teach yourself through books.

        How did you get interested in machine knitting in the first place?  EBAy purchase?
        M






        -- In kminternals@yahoogroups.com, "margaretbheck" <mheck@m...> wrote:
        >
        > Hi Mike,
        > Thought you might like to see an example of what you can do with a
        > knitting machine and DAK.  I just uploaded a file to our PHOTOS
        area,
        > called example.  I bought the sweater pattern from Dale of Norway,
        > scanned the charts and saved them to my computer, entered them in
        DAK,
        > changed the colors to the ones my husband liked, downloaded the
        pieces
        > to my Brother 970, knit each piece, sewed together by hand and
        > presented to husband.  Don't mean to brag....well, maybe I do....
        but
        > this beautiful, intricate design took me about 1/50 of the time to
        > make on the machine as it would by hand.  (Yup, I've done that
        too.)
        > Each piece took me about an hour because of the color changes.
        > Otherwise it would have gone faster.
        >
        > I agree that it would be good to learn your machine first, but if
        you
        > are motivated, you can learn fast and eventually produce wonderful
        > garments.  There are some other gentlemen on the yahoo machine
        > knitting lists--great to have you!
        >
        > Don't get me wrong, I LOVE LOVE LOVE DAK, but sounds like you might
        be
        > able to create a program too.  Nifty to have both programming and
        > knitting skills.  Once you do get knitting, these lists are great at
        > helping you get over bumps in the road.
        > M





      • mikezcnc
        Margaret, Thank you for explaining me the time involved. It appears like it is almost an instant gratification for what you did: 15 hours? That is a great
        Message 3 of 4 , Nov 29, 2004
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          Margaret,

          Thank you for explaining me the time involved. It appears like it is
          almost an instant gratification for what you did: 15 hours? That is a
          great timing. If it takes 50 times longer to do it by hand then it
          will be 50 days working 15 hours a day!

          Yes, I noticed that DAK can do a lot and the price they want sounds
          sweeter and sweeter, maybe someone will run a Christmas sale?

          My goal is not to have a competing product with DAK, I want to be
          able to control a knitting machine by a computer, that would mean
          only one thing: PC and a communication interface. It would be a
          universal (open) architecture so everybody and his brother could
          write any program to work with it. What is missing right now is that
          we don't know the electrical architecture, interfaces, voltage
          levels, pinout. Such situation allows a cable manufacturer charge
          $100 while as John mentioned, $20 would allow for a hefty profit
          because I can buy a serial cable for $5 and there might be an
          electrical interface built into that cable, hopefully there is one
          because if it is a bare and repinned cable then it would be a joke
          that would get into TV headlines. If someone has that cable maybe the
          lead can be unscred to tell us what's inside? Just don't damage it!

          Once open architecture is established and I believe John is already
          capable of doing some communication, then comes the application part,
          ie what is that program supposed to do. Many people would get
          involved into writing such programs.

          Your observation that DAK has a pre w95 appearance coincides with my
          experience- I could not install it on my w2000 computer because I get
          error messages. While those error messages might signify a missing
          link, I have no problems installing other 2000 programs. Obviously it
          is a small company with limited resources that keeps a strong hold on
          the captive market (what do they care how the interface looks like?
          But if people can make a fabulous sweater they will buy it anyway).
          Such a strategy will work fine until someone comes along with skill
          and interest. Or a major company determines that the market is huge.
          I have no idea if it is a huge market but I know that it is a huge
          country that makes those numbers more appealing. The bad part is that
          Brother machines are orphans and no more new machines are being made.
          That tells me that the marked for DAK-like programs is limited and
          therefore not attractive to anybody.

          My interest in knitting machines is based on my interest in CNC
          machines (computer numeric control, three motors control x, y and z
          and each of them moves according to the program, that's a basic
          idea). CNC hobby market was in dark ages in 1992 but now is very well
          developed, with large amount of programs available. For example
          www.turbocnc.com is a shareware program with sourcecode available for
          $60, which would allow writing own applications. The same program
          from, say, www.mastercam.com costs $20,000. While the two programs
          have diffrent features, many people run their businesses using
          turbocnc.

          With turbocnc it is so that when a cnc machine is connected to the
          turbocnc program, you have to set up parameters of your cnc machine
          (some machines are larger than others). The next step is to see if
          the machine responds to a turbocnc program, ie one can try jogging,
          using cursor keys. Better programs allow using a mouse fo that
          (turbocnc is a DOS program). Once we know that cnc machine moves are
          correspomding with entered values (1" in a program =1" in a machine)
          we can start using that machine for milling under computer control
          (see the resemblance to 'knitting under computer control?'). At that
          point is time to enter a machining code that will do something that
          we want. For example we want a circle milled on a flat surface. A
          board is placed in a machine, a machine code (g-code because it uses
          a letter G and a number, example g91) is written using a SEPARATE
          program that is designed just for that purpose of creating a g-code
          from a drawing). Once that g-code (describing a circle in our case)
          is executed, we will have a nice circle carved in material.

          Now you see a great resemblance of knitting to cnc. It is not complex
          to write an application once we have an interface. I know someone who
          knows how to do just that, who already has several similar products
          under his belt- but it's a long way, we don't have an interface
          specified. I would imagine that Brother would be thrilled to share
          that information but it requires finding the right people.


          There are many ways this group can go forward, I see almost 30 people
          coming to this board in one day and that is good because everybody
          chips in and if nothing comes out of this group project I will have
          at least one sweater, like your lucky husband!

          Mike




          --- In kminternals@yahoogroups.com, mar heck <mheck@m...> wrote:
          > mikezcnc wrote:
          >
          > >
          > > Can you tell me how long did it take you to:
          > >
          > > modify the pattern in DAK?
          > > make each arm?
          > > make front?
          > > make back?
          > > assemble all together
          > > total amount of time?
          > >
          > > I want to have a modern version of PPD and FB100 substituted by a
          PC.
          > > Let's say, I can buy a design from you that way I could use my PC
          to
          > > download it to a knitting machine, assuming no modificatins are
          > > neccessary (I can see a big business for people modifying
          patterns on
          > > DAK for others and it tells me that DAK could have a version of
          their
          > > program just for that purpose).
          > >
          > > Mike
          >
          > Mike,
          > First, I need to re-iterate that I purchased the pattern from Dale
          of
          > Norway, although I have designed many sweaters myself as well using
          > DAK. I used this example to show you just one of the things you
          can do
          > with DAK. Regarding time it takes (mind you I've been knitting for
          a
          > few years and if the knitting gods and goddesses are with you on
          the day
          > of knitting....here are my estimates.) After scanning the charts
          and
          > putting them into DAK, about 1/2 hour to do a swatch and figure out
          rows
          > and stitches per inch. Measure recipient, decide how many rows
          and
          > stitches needed, do the math, 10 minutes. Downloading pattern to
          > machine: 3 minutes. Each sleeve, front, back 1 hour each.
          Assembly
          > and running in yarn ends: 4-5 or 6 hours (same as handknitting).
          So,
          > maybe 10-15 hrs if all goes well.
          >
          > Regarding your entrepreneurial ideas, I dunno. If a person owns
          DAK,
          > they can do their own sizing and modifications. There are so many
          > things DAK can do, we haven't even scratched the surface in this
          > discussion. Even can estimate for you how much yarn you'll need
          for a
          > garment, will superimpose a shape onto a design, will grade a
          pattern
          > into different sizes, will give you a pattern according to your
          > instructions, just to mention a few things. like any hobby, there
          is a
          > learning curve. And to learn to do something well, it takes a bit
          of
          > practice, a few flops and a few successes. In my opinion, DAK is
          worth
          > the big bucks, but I get frustrated that the interface is like
          > pre-windows 95, I think. Finding a teacher is a good thing,
          although
          > you can teach yourself through books.
          >
          > How did you get interested in machine knitting in the first place?
          EBAy
          > purchase?
          > M
          >
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > > -- In kminternals@yahoogroups.com, "margaretbheck" <mheck@m...>
          wrote:
          > > >
          > > > Hi Mike,
          > > > Thought you might like to see an example of what you can do
          with a
          > > > knitting machine and DAK. I just uploaded a file to our PHOTOS
          > > area,
          > > > called example. I bought the sweater pattern from Dale of
          Norway,
          > > > scanned the charts and saved them to my computer, entered them
          in
          > > DAK,
          > > > changed the colors to the ones my husband liked, downloaded the
          > > pieces
          > > > to my Brother 970, knit each piece, sewed together by hand and
          > > > presented to husband. Don't mean to brag....well, maybe I
          do....
          > > but
          > > > this beautiful, intricate design took me about 1/50 of the time
          to
          > > > make on the machine as it would by hand. (Yup, I've done that
          > > too.)
          > > > Each piece took me about an hour because of the color changes.
          > > > Otherwise it would have gone faster.
          > > >
          > > > I agree that it would be good to learn your machine first, but
          if
          > > you
          > > > are motivated, you can learn fast and eventually produce
          wonderful
          > > > garments. There are some other gentlemen on the yahoo machine
          > > > knitting lists--great to have you!
          > > >
          > > > Don't get me wrong, I LOVE LOVE LOVE DAK, but sounds like you
          might
          > > be
          > > > able to create a program too. Nifty to have both programming
          and
          > > > knitting skills. Once you do get knitting, these lists are
          great at
          > > > helping you get over bumps in the road.
          > > > M
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > > Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
          > > ADVERTISEMENT
          > > click here
          > >
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