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Snow .vs. water

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  • Hung Vu
    Having kited on them for a number of years here are my 10 observations: 1- Kiting on snow is safer than on water (it sounds strange but it s true as you have
    Message 1 of 8 , Feb 21, 2004
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      Having kited on them for a number of years here are my 10 observations:

      1- Kiting on snow is safer than on water (it sounds strange but it's
      true as you have no one and nothing around to make the situation
      dangerous).
      2- They are almost identical if you want them to be and very different
      if you want them to be (kitesurfing and kitesnowboarding is mostly about
      jumps&tricks and kiteskiing is mostly about speed)
      3- It's much more convenience to teach and learn on snow than on water
      (a student can go upwind and jump on the second day - MY STUDENTS HAVE
      DONE IT).
      4- Learning on snow first reduce the learning curve drastically.
      5- You can jump almost as high on snow as on water and still not
      endanger yourself.
      6- Foils are more convenience on snow but inflatables can also work on
      both. Inflatables are likely to dominate the kiting scence (except for
      some high speed situations) unless the the foil companies (including
      Arc) can team up and do something...
      7- If you want to go fast (80 km and up), use foil on snow (and you can
      LAUGH that the fastest kiter on water, mostly LEIs, still go slower than
      80 km/hr - I am trying to experiment the concept that some modern LEIs,
      such as the GlobeRider Lift, can go as fast as or faster than foils on
      snow)
      8- If you want to jump high easily, use inflatables (modern inflatables
      can jump high easier than foils).
      9- If you use inflatable, use a 5th line. The 5th line adds a quite a
      bit more safety and ease of relaunchability for both snow and water
      (actually, the 5th line make LEIs as convenience as foils on snow and
      make LEIs as convenience on water as on snow).
      10- Snow is more convenience but water is still more enchanting...

      P.S., Kiting is such a wonderful sport for colder climate as it is the
      ONLY 4 season outdoor sport as I know of except for jogging...

      Hung.
    • mmillerpw
      Aloha Hung, Those seem to be good observations. I would like to add a couple things. I use Ozone Frenzy s and a Naish inflatable, and while I like the
      Message 2 of 8 , Feb 21, 2004
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        Aloha Hung,

        Those seem to be good observations.

        I would like to add a couple things.

        I use Ozone Frenzy's and a Naish inflatable, and while I like the inflatable quite a lot -
        I love my Ozone's. I also find that here in Wyoming, where it's very cold more often
        than not, the added ease of the foil, ie not having to pump and pinch makes a world
        of difference, especially with my two young boys.

        Also, when the wind dies and you are out in the middle of a field, it is a lot easier to
        pack up the Frenzy and shove it into your pack than the LEI...

        Good post.

        J-Hole Michael
      • john tanyeri
        Hung or anyone What changes or transitions need to be made from Snow to water. For example, I would think that you would have to dig your heels in more and
        Message 3 of 8 , Feb 26, 2004
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          Hung or anyone

          What changes or transitions need to be made from Snow to water. For example, I would think that you would have to dig your heels in more and ride the rail more on water..Any other tips to make the transition from snow to water easier.

          Thanks
          JT

          Hung Vu <hungvu2000@...> wrote:
          Having kited on them for a number of years here are my 10 observations:

          1- Kiting on snow is safer than on water (it sounds strange but it's
          true as you have no one and nothing around to make the situation
          dangerous).
          2- They are almost identical if you want them to be and very different
          if you want them to be (kitesurfing and kitesnowboarding is mostly about
          jumps&tricks and kiteskiing is mostly about speed)
          3- It's much more convenience to teach and learn on snow than on water
          (a student can go upwind and jump on the second day - MY STUDENTS HAVE
          DONE IT).
          4- Learning on snow first reduce the learning curve drastically.
          5- You can jump almost as high on snow as on water and still not
          endanger yourself.
          6- Foils are more convenience on snow but inflatables can also work on
          both. Inflatables are likely to dominate the kiting scence (except for
          some high speed situations) unless the the foil companies (including
          Arc) can team up and do something...
          7- If you want to go fast (80 km and up), use foil on snow (and you can
          LAUGH that the fastest kiter on water, mostly LEIs, still go slower than
          80 km/hr - I am trying to experiment the concept that some modern LEIs,
          such as the GlobeRider Lift, can go as fast as or faster than foils on
          snow)
          8- If you want to jump high easily, use inflatables (modern inflatables
          can jump high easier than foils).
          9- If you use inflatable, use a 5th line. The 5th line adds a quite a
          bit more safety and ease of relaunchability for both snow and water
          (actually, the 5th line make LEIs as convenience as foils on snow and
          make LEIs as convenience on water as on snow).
          10- Snow is more convenience but water is still more enchanting...

          P.S., Kiting is such a wonderful sport for colder climate as it is the
          ONLY 4 season outdoor sport as I know of except for jogging...

          Hung.




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        • kennywek@aol.com
          Hi Hung, I am new to kite boarding and just on the verge of getting started. Can you please explain how a 5th line works on a LEI for a water re-launch. How
          Message 4 of 8 , Feb 26, 2004
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            Hi Hung,

            I am new to kite boarding and just on the verge of getting started. Can
            you please explain how a "5th line" works on a LEI for a water re-launch. How
            is the "5th line" attached to the kite gear? How does the "5th line" affect
            safety?


            Thank you,

            Bill Kenny
            kennywek@...


            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          • hungvuatnetcomdotca
            ... started. Can ... re-launch. How ... affect ... Check http://www.usakite.com/5thline.htm Hung.
            Message 5 of 8 , Feb 26, 2004
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              --- In kitesurf@yahoogroups.com, kennywek@a... wrote:
              > Hi Hung,
              >
              > I am new to kite boarding and just on the verge of getting
              started. Can
              > you please explain how a "5th line" works on a LEI for a water
              re-launch. How
              > is the "5th line" attached to the kite gear? How does the "5th line"
              affect
              > safety?

              Check http://www.usakite.com/5thline.htm

              Hung.
            • hungvuatnetcomdotca
              If you kitesnowboard, the transition from kitesnowboarding to kitesurfing is almost natural and automatic (except for some small issues here and there). Of
              Message 6 of 8 , Feb 26, 2004
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                If you kitesnowboard, the transition from kitesnowboarding to
                kitesurfing is almost natural and automatic (except for some small
                issues here and there). Of course, you'll need more constant power
                from the kite and more balance on the water but after a whole winter
                of kitesnowboarding, it should become automatic.

                Even after you can go upwind kitesnowboarding, you still need a couple
                sessions before you can kitesurf upwind (for some, it's automatic).

                Hung.

                --- In kitesurf@yahoogroups.com, john tanyeri <john_tanyeri@y...> wrote:
                > Hung or anyone
                >
                > What changes or transitions need to be made from Snow to water. For
                example, I would think that you would have to dig your heels in more
                and ride the rail more on water..Any other tips to make the transition
                from snow to water easier.
                >
                > Thanks
                > JT
                >
                > Hung Vu <hungvu2000@r...> wrote:
                > Having kited on them for a number of years here are my 10 observations:
                >
                > 1- Kiting on snow is safer than on water (it sounds strange but it's
                > true as you have no one and nothing around to make the situation
                > dangerous).
                > 2- They are almost identical if you want them to be and very different
                > if you want them to be (kitesurfing and kitesnowboarding is mostly
                about
                > jumps&tricks and kiteskiing is mostly about speed)
                > 3- It's much more convenience to teach and learn on snow than on water
                > (a student can go upwind and jump on the second day - MY STUDENTS HAVE
                > DONE IT).
                > 4- Learning on snow first reduce the learning curve drastically.
                > 5- You can jump almost as high on snow as on water and still not
                > endanger yourself.
                > 6- Foils are more convenience on snow but inflatables can also work on
                > both. Inflatables are likely to dominate the kiting scence (except for
                > some high speed situations) unless the the foil companies (including
                > Arc) can team up and do something...
                > 7- If you want to go fast (80 km and up), use foil on snow (and you can
                > LAUGH that the fastest kiter on water, mostly LEIs, still go slower
                than
                > 80 km/hr - I am trying to experiment the concept that some modern LEIs,
                > such as the GlobeRider Lift, can go as fast as or faster than foils on
                > snow)
                > 8- If you want to jump high easily, use inflatables (modern inflatables
                > can jump high easier than foils).
                > 9- If you use inflatable, use a 5th line. The 5th line adds a quite a
                > bit more safety and ease of relaunchability for both snow and water
                > (actually, the 5th line make LEIs as convenience as foils on snow and
                > make LEIs as convenience on water as on snow).
                > 10- Snow is more convenience but water is still more enchanting...
                >
                > P.S., Kiting is such a wonderful sport for colder climate as it is the
                > ONLY 4 season outdoor sport as I know of except for jogging...
                >
                > Hung.
                >
                >
                >
                >
                > This group is sponsored by KiteHIGH.com Kitesurfing
                >
                > http://www.KiteHIGH.com
                > ph: 1 866 646 7835 Toll Free USA or
                > ph: 1 808 637 KITE (5483)
                > Em: support@k...
                >
                > == to unsubscribe send an email to
                kitesurf-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com or go to
                www.yahoogroups.com/group/kitesurf ==
                > Yahoo! Groups Links
                >
                >
                >
                >
                >
                >
                > ---------------------------------
                > Do you Yahoo!?
                > Get better spam protection with Yahoo! Mail
                >
                > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              • Paul Matousek
                I m a newbie to snowkiting and have found the 5th line invaluable to self-launching. So far I ve tried two ways of installing one. 1) Bridle to the outside
                Message 7 of 8 , Mar 4, 2004
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                  I'm a newbie to snowkiting and have found the 5th line invaluable to
                  self-launching. So far I've tried two ways of installing one.

                  1) Bridle to the outside struts (my Airush Trio 12M has sewn in loops).
                  I just tied a fig 8 loop slightly off centre and attached some 150 lb
                  kite line to a short leader line on the bar. Works great.

                  2) No bridle just a line to only one strut. This is simpler and works
                  with stronger winds and does not mess up the kite as much when it stalls
                  and floats downward. However, in really light wind the bridle system
                  seems to be easier to re-launch as both struts can be pulled to lift the
                  kite off of the snow.


                  Ideally, I'd like to mod the kite so no 5th is required. Alex Petersen
                  has a great design which I saw at this weekend's KiteFreeze in Minnesota
                  but it involves quite a mod to the kite and would probably void any
                  warranty.
                  I'll post some details when I find the link.



                  Paul Matousek
                  www.windplay.ca


                  -----Original Message-----
                  From: kennywek@... [mailto:kennywek@...]
                  Sent: Thursday, February 26, 2004 9:30 AM
                  To: kitesurf@yahoogroups.com
                  Subject: Re: [ksurf] Transition from Snow to water

                  Hi Hung,

                  I am new to kite boarding and just on the verge of getting started.
                  Can
                  you please explain how a "5th line" works on a LEI for a water
                  re-launch. How
                  is the "5th line" attached to the kite gear? How does the "5th line"
                  affect
                  safety?


                  Thank you,

                  Bill Kenny
                  kennywek@...


                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



                  This group is sponsored by KiteHIGH.com Kitesurfing

                  http://www.KiteHIGH.com
                  ph: 1 866 646 7835 Toll Free USA or
                  ph: 1 808 637 KITE (5483)
                  Em: support@...

                  == to unsubscribe send an email to kitesurf-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                  or go to www.yahoogroups.com/group/kitesurf ==
                  Yahoo! Groups Links
                • Paul Matousek
                  Just thought I d post this for all you snowkiters: The Results are as Follows: KiteSkiing (1) Alex Peterson, Team USSNOWKITE, Wipika (2) Joe Levins, Team
                  Message 8 of 8 , Mar 4, 2004
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                    Just thought I'd post this for all you snowkiters:

                    The Results are as Follows:

                    KiteSkiing
                    (1) Alex Peterson, Team USSNOWKITE, Wipika
                    (2) Joe Levins, Team USSNOWKITE, Slingshot
                    (3) Vojta Cervenka, Naish

                    Kitesnowboarding
                    (1) Aaron Sales, Team USSNOWKITE, Windwing
                    (2) Mika, Airrush
                    (3) Mike Brockwell, Slingshot

                    Womens:
                    (1) Renee Hanks, Team USSNOWKITE, Wipika

                    Juniors:
                    (1)Weston Will-14, Slingshot
                    (1)Hunter Wells-11, Slingshot
                    (1) Jeremy Jones-8, Ozone
                    (1) Jacob Jones-10, Ozone
                    (1) Justin Specht-15, Ozone

                    Photos:
                    From Mark Kedrowski: http//www.usa35.com/gallery/FridayKitefreeze/

                    From Professional Sports Photographer John Pederson;
                    http://www.photoreflect.com/scripts/prsm.dll?EventFrame?event=30DD000Y
                    http://www.photoreflect.com/scripts/prsm.dll?eventframe?event=30DD000Z&start
                    =0000&r=0
                    http://www.photoreflect.com/scripts/prsm.dll?eventframe?event=30DD0010&start
                    =0000&r=0

                    From Denis Foo Kune:
                    http://www.windancing.com/temp/Denisphotos/Desktop.html



                    Pavel
                    www.windplay.ca
                    Sioux Lookout, ON Canada



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