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are boxers low aspect high performance ??

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  • wyndjunkie2000
    or are they a one size fits all I have a friend that lives in maui and according to him some of the people on the beach that could have the kites of there
    Message 1 of 11 , Nov 27, 2003
      or are they a one size fits all I have a friend that lives in maui
      and according to him some of the people on the beach that could have
      the kites of there choice are in fact choosing and riding
      boxers... could it be that boxers are just like the aero 1 with the
      turning ability of the aero 2. I am just alittle confused as to why
      I might need an x3 or v4 when some of the top riders are riding
      boxers who knows they may just be out of cash this season.
      highly unlikely!. I would love some input from some experienced
      riders that own or have ridden the boxer, maybe compared to other
      naish kites. I have read info on all and have ridden everything
      but the v4 and the boxer. naish has a wonderful way of highlighting
      the kites attributes without ever really telling you anything I
      think the boxer might be a low aspect high performance kite sold at
      a low price point just to attract new blood J
    • wyndjunkie2000
      is there anyone out there that knows anything about the boxer kite,or has seen them from a distance even. seems like there s no one on the other end unless
      Message 2 of 11 , Dec 1, 2003
        is there anyone out there that knows anything about the boxer
        kite,or has seen them from a distance even. seems like there's no
        one on the other end unless your selling some safety idea... leash
        strap or some gimick that won't save people anyway!!! stay away from
        large imovable objects. hows that for a safety system. not trying to
        be rude at all I've flown hanggliders for years and all this safety
        stuff is a mask for good common sense. (IN FLYING)dont do arabatics
        under 1000 ft, it takes 500 feet to realize somthing isn't right.
        200 feet to respond to that, and not much left for the chute to
        deploy. don't kite with any object at least a football field away.
        if you do you are taking your chances, you most likely will not have
        the time or the sense to respond... a shackle with a release ball
        and an o shit loop is hard to beat. only thing better is common
        sense. no disrespect to anyone killed or injured. this(EXTREME)
        sport has risks. (not to say there aren't freak accidents). I have
        lost 3 good friends in flying and again common sense would have
        saved every one of them. this is a high risk sport treat it as
        such... now any one know anything about the boxer kite?? J





        --- In kitesurf@yahoogroups.com, "wyndjunkie2000" <wyndjunkie@m...>
        wrote:
        > or are they a one size fits all I have a friend that lives in
        maui
        > and according to him some of the people on the beach that could
        have
        > the kites of there choice are in fact choosing and riding
        > boxers... could it be that boxers are just like the aero 1 with
        the
        > turning ability of the aero 2. I am just alittle confused as to
        why
        > I might need an x3 or v4 when some of the top riders are riding
        > boxers who knows they may just be out of cash this season.
        > highly unlikely!. I would love some input from some experienced
        > riders that own or have ridden the boxer, maybe compared to other
        > naish kites. I have read info on all and have ridden everything
        > but the v4 and the boxer. naish has a wonderful way of
        highlighting
        > the kites attributes without ever really telling you anything I
        > think the boxer might be a low aspect high performance kite sold
        at
        > a low price point just to attract new blood J
      • Hein van Swaay
        I m interested in the Boxer too. I currently ride SS GTOs and I love a lower aspect kite. The GTO s won t be available in 2004. (big mistake IMO) I ride
        Message 3 of 11 , Dec 1, 2003
          I'm interested in the Boxer too. I currently ride
          SS GTOs and I love a lower aspect kite. The GTO's
          won't be available in 2004. (big mistake IMO)

          I ride unshackled and with my kite low and in the power.
          mostly with a much smaller kite than my bros who
          are scared to death to have their kite swing through
          the power.

          I love to do unhooked moves. It opens up a whole new
          chapter of fun stuff to try.

          I looked at the Cabrinha but the Recon is to complicated
          and prone to failures plus I don't want their power lock
          bar. I saw a guy get lofted when he set up his Recon wrong
          and had the line at the trailing edge partially tensioned.

          Maybe I can talk South Padre Island Kiteboarding into
          letting me try a Boxer. They have some in stock and
          I'll let you know if I get a chance to ride one.

          In regards to your view of kiting safety...

          I agree totally. In fact, all the recent flurry of
          'safety systems' designed by people who aren't even
          real engineers is making this sport 'seem' safe to many
          newbies. They think they can detach when in fact they
          can't. That's been sadly proven by many experienced
          kiters who have died by lofting and/or dragging. I've
          seen many people get lofted and dragged. It only takes
          one hard object to turn these seemingly innocent and
          sometimes even comical incidents into a tragedy.

          Kitesurfing companies need to apply some serious failure
          modes and effects analysis. And do a much better job making
          people aware of the REAL dangers that are related to
          location and wind conditions. I don't think either is
          being done. This is not windsurfing, snowboarding or
          wakeboarding and any analogies made to these sports is only
          further masking the risks. It's more like hang gliding,
          acrobatic flying and parachuting! When two or more things
          go wrong in those sports; you die!

          Your advice about staying away from hard objects is
          right on. I see people hopping up the beach with
          their kite overhead all the time. Many times right
          in front of a variety of solid skull smashing objects.

          When are people going to learn!? I am amazed by the
          way many riders totally ignore or disregard obvious
          dangers.


          -Hein van Swaay



          > -----Original Message-----
          > From: wyndjunkie2000 [mailto:wyndjunkie@...]
          > Sent: Monday, December 01, 2003 4:21 PM
          > To: kitesurf@yahoogroups.com
          > Subject: [ksurf] Re: are boxers low aspect high performance ??
          >
          >
          >
          > is there anyone out there that knows anything about the boxer
          > kite,or has seen them from a distance even. seems like there's no
          > one on the other end unless your selling some safety idea... leash
          > strap or some gimick that won't save people anyway!!! stay away from
          > large imovable objects. hows that for a safety system. not trying to
          > be rude at all I've flown hanggliders for years and all this safety
          > stuff is a mask for good common sense. (IN FLYING)dont do arabatics
          > under 1000 ft, it takes 500 feet to realize somthing isn't right.
          > 200 feet to respond to that, and not much left for the chute to
          > deploy. don't kite with any object at least a football field away.
          > if you do you are taking your chances, you most likely will not have
          > the time or the sense to respond... a shackle with a release ball
          > and an o shit loop is hard to beat. only thing better is common
          > sense. no disrespect to anyone killed or injured. this(EXTREME)
          > sport has risks. (not to say there aren't freak accidents). I have
          > lost 3 good friends in flying and again common sense would have
          > saved every one of them. this is a high risk sport treat it as
          > such... now any one know anything about the boxer kite?? J
          >
          >
          >
          >
          >
          > --- In kitesurf@yahoogroups.com, "wyndjunkie2000" <wyndjunkie@m...>
          > wrote:
          > > or are they a one size fits all I have a friend that lives in
          > maui
          > > and according to him some of the people on the beach that could
          > have
          > > the kites of there choice are in fact choosing and riding
          > > boxers... could it be that boxers are just like the aero 1 with
          > the
          > > turning ability of the aero 2. I am just alittle confused as to
          > why
          > > I might need an x3 or v4 when some of the top riders are riding
          > > boxers who knows they may just be out of cash this season.
          > > highly unlikely!. I would love some input from some experienced
          > > riders that own or have ridden the boxer, maybe compared to other
          > > naish kites. I have read info on all and have ridden everything
          > > but the v4 and the boxer. naish has a wonderful way of
          > highlighting
          > > the kites attributes without ever really telling you anything I
          > > think the boxer might be a low aspect high performance kite sold
          > at
          > > a low price point just to attract new blood J
          >
          >
          > This group is sponsored by KiteHIGH.com Kitesurfing
          >
          http://www.KiteHIGH.com
          ph: 1 866 646 7835 Toll Free USA or
          ph: 1 808 637 KITE (5483)
          Em: support@...

          == to unsubscribe send an email to kitesurf-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
          or go to www.yahoogroups.com/group/kitesurf ==

          Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
          http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
        • woodman_k
          Hein I just got a 14m nitro and had 3 days on it and so far I like the system and kite. The bar and the long center leader bugs me a bit too but once your
          Message 4 of 11 , Dec 1, 2003
            Hein

            I just got a 14m nitro and had 3 days on it and so far I like the
            system and kite. The bar and the long center leader bugs me a bit too
            but once your going it looks as clean as it can be.....spinning
            leash blabla. The velcro release must be always checked preflight as
            that seems a bit sensitive to user error!!!

            Please explain what happened to te guy who set up the recon wrong.
            Was there sand jamming the leaders causing one side to be powered and
            the other fully stalled? I would imagine that would cause havoc on
            launch! I have self launched 3 times now on sand and no probs but I
            am concerned about this part.

            Cheers
            Stan

            PS Where can I get some texalium?

            --- In kitesurf@yahoogroups.com, "Hein van Swaay" <hein@I...> wrote:
            > I'm interested in the Boxer too. I currently ride
            > SS GTOs and I love a lower aspect kite. The GTO's
            > won't be available in 2004. (big mistake IMO)
            >
            > I ride unshackled and with my kite low and in the power.
            > mostly with a much smaller kite than my bros who
            > are scared to death to have their kite swing through
            > the power.
            >
            > I love to do unhooked moves. It opens up a whole new
            > chapter of fun stuff to try.
            >
            > I looked at the Cabrinha but the Recon is to complicated
            > and prone to failures plus I don't want their power lock
            > bar. I saw a guy get lofted when he set up his Recon wrong
            > and had the line at the trailing edge partially tensioned.
            >
            > Maybe I can talk South Padre Island Kiteboarding into
            > letting me try a Boxer. They have some in stock and
            > I'll let you know if I get a chance to ride one.
            >
            > In regards to your view of kiting safety...
            >
            > I agree totally. In fact, all the recent flurry of
            > 'safety systems' designed by people who aren't even
            > real engineers is making this sport 'seem' safe to many
            > newbies. They think they can detach when in fact they
            > can't. That's been sadly proven by many experienced
            > kiters who have died by lofting and/or dragging. I've
            > seen many people get lofted and dragged. It only takes
            > one hard object to turn these seemingly innocent and
            > sometimes even comical incidents into a tragedy.
            >
            > Kitesurfing companies need to apply some serious failure
            > modes and effects analysis. And do a much better job making
            > people aware of the REAL dangers that are related to
            > location and wind conditions. I don't think either is
            > being done. This is not windsurfing, snowboarding or
            > wakeboarding and any analogies made to these sports is only
            > further masking the risks. It's more like hang gliding,
            > acrobatic flying and parachuting! When two or more things
            > go wrong in those sports; you die!
            >
            > Your advice about staying away from hard objects is
            > right on. I see people hopping up the beach with
            > their kite overhead all the time. Many times right
            > in front of a variety of solid skull smashing objects.
            >
            > When are people going to learn!? I am amazed by the
            > way many riders totally ignore or disregard obvious
            > dangers.
            >
            >
            > -Hein van Swaay
            >
            >
            >
            > > -----Original Message-----
            > > From: wyndjunkie2000 [mailto:wyndjunkie@m...]
            > > Sent: Monday, December 01, 2003 4:21 PM
            > > To: kitesurf@yahoogroups.com
            > > Subject: [ksurf] Re: are boxers low aspect high performance ??
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > > is there anyone out there that knows anything about the boxer
            > > kite,or has seen them from a distance even. seems like there's no
            > > one on the other end unless your selling some safety idea...
            leash
            > > strap or some gimick that won't save people anyway!!! stay away
            from
            > > large imovable objects. hows that for a safety system. not trying
            to
            > > be rude at all I've flown hanggliders for years and all this
            safety
            > > stuff is a mask for good common sense. (IN FLYING)dont do
            arabatics
            > > under 1000 ft, it takes 500 feet to realize somthing isn't right.
            > > 200 feet to respond to that, and not much left for the chute to
            > > deploy. don't kite with any object at least a football field
            away.
            > > if you do you are taking your chances, you most likely will not
            have
            > > the time or the sense to respond... a shackle with a release
            ball
            > > and an o shit loop is hard to beat. only thing better is common
            > > sense. no disrespect to anyone killed or injured. this(EXTREME)
            > > sport has risks. (not to say there aren't freak accidents). I
            have
            > > lost 3 good friends in flying and again common sense would have
            > > saved every one of them. this is a high risk sport treat it
            as
            > > such... now any one know anything about the boxer kite?? J
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > > --- In kitesurf@yahoogroups.com, "wyndjunkie2000"
            <wyndjunkie@m...>
            > > wrote:
            > > > or are they a one size fits all I have a friend that lives in
            > > maui
            > > > and according to him some of the people on the beach that could
            > > have
            > > > the kites of there choice are in fact choosing and riding
            > > > boxers... could it be that boxers are just like the aero 1
            with
            > > the
            > > > turning ability of the aero 2. I am just alittle confused as
            to
            > > why
            > > > I might need an x3 or v4 when some of the top riders are riding
            > > > boxers who knows they may just be out of cash this season.
            > > > highly unlikely!. I would love some input from some
            experienced
            > > > riders that own or have ridden the boxer, maybe compared to
            other
            > > > naish kites. I have read info on all and have ridden
            everything
            > > > but the v4 and the boxer. naish has a wonderful way of
            > > highlighting
            > > > the kites attributes without ever really telling you anything
            I
            > > > think the boxer might be a low aspect high performance kite
            sold
            > > at
            > > > a low price point just to attract new blood J
            > >
            > >
            > > This group is sponsored by KiteHIGH.com Kitesurfing
            > >
            > http://www.KiteHIGH.com
            > ph: 1 866 646 7835 Toll Free USA or
            > ph: 1 808 637 KITE (5483)
            > Em: support@k...
            >
            > == to unsubscribe send an email to kitesurf-
            unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
            > or go to www.yahoogroups.com/group/kitesurf ==
            >
            > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
            > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
          • Reinaldo Garcia
            i have a 17m co2 in miami. ive had 2 problems with the recon features: (1) today i was a bit overpowered (20-24kts) dropped the kite. when trying to relaunch
            Message 5 of 11 , Dec 1, 2003
              i have a 17m co2 in miami.
              ive had 2 problems with the recon features:

              (1)
              today i was a bit overpowered (20-24kts)
              dropped the kite. when trying to relaunch with the recon systm i got
              tossed/dragged/thrown around quite a bit untill i realized it the lines on
              one side were somehow shorter.
              by then i had lost sight of my board in the waves and i had to body drag out
              of the water.
              during this time i had a very hard time controlling the kite and almost lost
              my board.

              on land i checked the recon system and found one side had jammed, the recon
              bullet was out of place and had tied up.
              i was lucky i was out in deep water when this happened, far from land and
              "hard objects".

              (2)
              as for self-launching from sand, i once left the kite for about 10 min
              flapping in the wind. when launching, the same thing happened and the kite
              did the "death spin". though that time i blamed myself for not walking the
              lines, i just did a visual check right before launching.

              ----

              the whole experience makes me think the relaunch part of recon is probably a
              bit too complex. (the depower feature ive had no problems)

              conclusion:
              (1) i will avoid using the recon to water relaunch
              (2) always always check the recon system on the side of the kite (bullet,
              etc) make sure it's not tangled by the wind right before launching.

              have fun...
            • Reinaldo Garcia
              i just realized that recon tangled bullet issue may have been the reason why alex s kite suddenly launched off the water. he would have had no time to
              Message 6 of 11 , Dec 1, 2003
                i just realized that recon "tangled bullet" issue may have been the reason
                why alex's kite suddenly launched off the water. he would have had no time
                to realize the lines were shorter, what was going on and how to control the
                kite.

                ( ** it's just a thought because i've only heard couple of rumors about how
                that accident happened)
              • Emilia Naoumova
                Hi Guys, I am looking for a site where where I can download some pictures of the new Slinshot Fuel Splitstrut kite. I have checked already the side of
                Message 7 of 11 , Dec 2, 2003
                  Hi Guys,

                  I am looking for a site where where I can download some pictures of the new Slinshot Fuel Splitstrut kite. I have checked already the side of Slingshot but I can't copie a picture from there. Any help will be greatly appreciated.

                  Thank you
                  Emilia


                  Reinaldo Garcia <rgarcia@...> wrote:
                  i have a 17m co2 in miami.
                  ive had 2 problems with the recon features:

                  (1)
                  today i was a bit overpowered (20-24kts)
                  dropped the kite. when trying to relaunch with the recon systm i got
                  tossed/dragged/thrown around quite a bit untill i realized it the lines on
                  one side were somehow shorter.
                  by then i had lost sight of my board in the waves and i had to body drag out
                  of the water.
                  during this time i had a very hard time controlling the kite and almost lost
                  my board.

                  on land i checked the recon system and found one side had jammed, the recon
                  bullet was out of place and had tied up.
                  i was lucky i was out in deep water when this happened, far from land and
                  "hard objects".

                  (2)
                  as for self-launching from sand, i once left the kite for about 10 min
                  flapping in the wind. when launching, the same thing happened and the kite
                  did the "death spin". though that time i blamed myself for not walking the
                  lines, i just did a visual check right before launching.

                  ----

                  the whole experience makes me think the relaunch part of recon is probably a
                  bit too complex. (the depower feature ive had no problems)

                  conclusion:
                  (1) i will avoid using the recon to water relaunch
                  (2) always always check the recon system on the side of the kite (bullet,
                  etc) make sure it's not tangled by the wind right before launching.

                  have fun...



                  This group is sponsored by KiteHIGH.com Kitesurfing

                  http://www.KiteHIGH.com
                  ph: 1 866 646 7835 Toll Free USA or
                  ph: 1 808 637 KITE (5483)
                  Em: support@...

                  == to unsubscribe send an email to kitesurf-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com or go to www.yahoogroups.com/group/kitesurf ==

                  Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/



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                • whysail
                  I have a 12 and 9 Boxer, and have flown the 16. I too like mid aspect kites and really like the boxers, expecially in the small sizes. They come with 22?
                  Message 8 of 11 , Dec 2, 2003
                    I have a 12 and 9 Boxer, and have flown the 16. I too like mid aspect
                    kites and really like the boxers, expecially in the small sizes. They
                    come with 22? meters of lines, and you won't be able to tell the
                    difference. (I typically fly Fuels with 27m). We sell them as our
                    beginner kites, but my intentions are to get them in the surf. They
                    are stable, turn around them selves(underloop easy)and can be flown
                    overpowered. It is almost impossible to overfly the window. (see why
                    I want it in the surf!)You won't jump as high as an X4, Rhino 4, but
                    you'll stay in the air as long.

                    I love Slingshots, but the Boxer is a way better kite than the GTO
                    imho.

                    I suggest youm try one. You can try one of ours if in Houston, or
                    talk Shane or Cliff in SPI into trying one of theirs. They are
                    hosting the demo in FEB again if you can wait that long, Naish will
                    be there for sure.

                    Charlie
                  • whysail
                    Go to site, open the check out 2004 product . The PDF program will open, go to PIC you want and click on the box at top next to the hand, it will say select
                    Message 9 of 11 , Dec 2, 2003
                      Go to site, open the "check out 2004 product". The PDF program will
                      open, go to PIC you want and click on the box at top next to the
                      hand, it will say select text or select picture, pick picture, click
                      on pic you want and it will be in your clipboard.

                      Have fun, the '04 kites great!
                      Charlie
                    • Kite Power (Sydney)
                      Hi Boxers are by the 2003/2004 standard, medium aspect ratio kites, 1-2 years ago they would have been rated high ar kites! Ar is only one part of a kites
                      Message 10 of 11 , Dec 2, 2003
                        Hi
                        Boxers are by the 2003/2004 standard, medium aspect ratio kites, 1-2 years
                        ago they would have been rated high ar kites!
                        Ar is only one part of a kites design, you should never judge any kite with
                        an ar over 5 to 1 and dismiss it as too high ar.
                        4-5 to 1 is medium, and 1-3 is low, in kites IMO
                        The Boxer is a great all round kite, and Naish have decided to mmke a bit
                        less money from them, to retain market share, thats the truth about them!
                        The kite turns tight with medium to light bar pressure, forward flight speed
                        is not the fastest, but as good or better than many so called high
                        performance/high AR kites from other makers.
                        It has a great safety system, and I would recommend it to anyone, of any
                        skill level.
                        I agree that we need to promote safe kiting much better, too many desperate
                        players in the market now, too many poorly trained, uncaring instructors,
                        too many team riders dumping product on the beaches, often with no real
                        lesson, if it keeps up there will be no-where left to do the sport!
                        Cya and
                        Goodwinds
                        Steve McCormack
                        www.kitepower.com.au
                      • Philip Mann
                        I have been flying the boxers for a few months and am very happy with the performamce. It is important to know what I like to see if this pertains to you. I
                        Message 11 of 11 , Dec 8, 2003
                          I have been flying the boxers for a few months and am very happy with
                          the performamce.
                          It is important to know what I like to see if this pertains to you.
                          I like moderate aspect kites, I like a kite that stays back in the
                          window a bit so i can load up against it quickly. I like a
                          predictable kite as I like to spin and have my eyes off the kite a
                          bit.

                          The Boxer is a high performance kite and it is lower aspect.
                          It jumps surpsingly well.

                          Great kite for aerial transitions, spins and to whip sytle jumps.

                          Hein, I owe you one, so If you want me to send you a kite to try let
                          me know.

                          Philip
                          kitesite.net






                          --- In kitesurf@yahoogroups.com, "wyndjunkie2000" <wyndjunkie@m...>
                          wrote:
                          >
                          > is there anyone out there that knows anything about the boxer
                          > kite,or has seen them from a distance even. seems like there's no
                          > one on the other end unless your selling some safety idea... leash
                          > strap or some gimick that won't save people anyway!!! stay away
                          from
                          > large imovable objects. hows that for a safety system. not trying
                          to
                          > be rude at all I've flown hanggliders for years and all this
                          safety
                          > stuff is a mask for good common sense. (IN FLYING)dont do arabatics
                          > under 1000 ft, it takes 500 feet to realize somthing isn't right.
                          > 200 feet to respond to that, and not much left for the chute to
                          > deploy. don't kite with any object at least a football field away.
                          > if you do you are taking your chances, you most likely will not
                          have
                          > the time or the sense to respond... a shackle with a release ball
                          > and an o shit loop is hard to beat. only thing better is common
                          > sense. no disrespect to anyone killed or injured. this(EXTREME)
                          > sport has risks. (not to say there aren't freak accidents). I have
                          > lost 3 good friends in flying and again common sense would have
                          > saved every one of them. this is a high risk sport treat it as
                          > such... now any one know anything about the boxer kite?? J
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          > --- In kitesurf@yahoogroups.com, "wyndjunkie2000" <wyndjunkie@m...>
                          > wrote:
                          > > or are they a one size fits all I have a friend that lives in
                          > maui
                          > > and according to him some of the people on the beach that could
                          > have
                          > > the kites of there choice are in fact choosing and riding
                          > > boxers... could it be that boxers are just like the aero 1 with
                          > the
                          > > turning ability of the aero 2. I am just alittle confused as to
                          > why
                          > > I might need an x3 or v4 when some of the top riders are riding
                          > > boxers who knows they may just be out of cash this season.
                          > > highly unlikely!. I would love some input from some experienced
                          > > riders that own or have ridden the boxer, maybe compared to other
                          > > naish kites. I have read info on all and have ridden everything
                          > > but the v4 and the boxer. naish has a wonderful way of
                          > highlighting
                          > > the kites attributes without ever really telling you anything I
                          > > think the boxer might be a low aspect high performance kite sold
                          > at
                          > > a low price point just to attract new blood J
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