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Re: Sport of the month[ksurf] Re: Poll Result: Do you think kites are too expensive?

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  • Henryk Majewski
    I agree that this sport has slow down. I still insist the price is the main reason. Very often I have people approaching me on my local beach and asking how
    Message 1 of 21 , May 1, 2002
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      I agree that this sport has slow down. I still insist the price is the main
      reason.
      Very often I have people approaching me on my local beach and asking how
      much the gear costs.
      My answer A$3000 dollar gives them the shock. And obviously this is not a
      full story.
      You need more than one kite and you have to replace it between 1 and 2
      years.
      There is more and more gear on the secondhand market.
      What I here from my friends it is hard to sell kite gear.
      Kitesurfing is going the same path as windsurfing but I predict decline is
      going be faster.

      Kites are not a rocket science. Materials (excluding MACHs and X2s )
      are commonly used in several other industries. Tooling is not very
      sophisticated.
      They are built in countries where labour contents is relatively cheap.
      IMO there is no justification for such high prices.

      Henryk Majewski
      ----- Original Message -----
      From: gregwalshau <Greg.Walsh@...>
      To: <kitesurf@yahoogroups.com>
      Sent: Wednesday, May 01, 2002 5:52 PM
      Subject: Sport of the month[ksurf] Re: Poll Result: Do you think kites are
      too expensive?


      > Hi All.
      >
      > I have an instinctive feeling that the kitesurf hysteria has died
      > down. Everyone was thinking we were going to take over the world and
      > become a mainstream sport. My feeling is that it has reached a
      > plateau and is coming off the boil. I have no real evidence to
      > support this, it's just a feeling.
      >
      > I go into kitesurf shops and they have a bunch of inflatables and a
      > tiny stock of boards.
      >
      > Newsagents have old, out-of-date kitesurf magazines, or no kitesurf
      > magazines at all.
      >
      > What does everybody else think?
      >
      > Greg
      >
      >
      > <<<to unsubscribe send a message to kitesurf-unsubscribe@egroups.com>>>
      >
      > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
      >
      >
      >
    • Suntrax
      Hey Dave (Dr) Guess what! Our newest shipment of Naish kites has come down by about 6%, the manufacturers must be reading this group! ;-) Unfortunately it s
      Message 2 of 21 , May 1, 2002
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        Hey Dave (Dr)

        Guess what! Our newest shipment of Naish kites has come down by about 6%,
        the manufacturers must be reading this group! ;-)

        Unfortunately it's only because our lousy exchange rate has improved, but
        this will make Andy at Kitehigh happier as it pushes up our export prices!

        Kitesurfing is alive and well in Capetown and everybody is complaining about
        the prices of kites and sunglasses and jetskis and televisions and
        windsurfers and motorcars and skateboards and and and and....... but MOSTLY
        A LACK OF WIND!

        Best Regards

        Brian Wilson
        Suntrax
        Tel/fax 027 21 5560044
        cell; 0824656696
        www.suntrax.co.za
        suntrax@...

        -----Original Message-----
        From: drsurfau [mailto:dave@...]
        Sent: Tuesday, April 30, 2002 2:24 PM
        To: kitesurf@yahoogroups.com
        Subject: [ksurf] Re: Poll Result: Do you think kites are too expensive?


        Really Carlo, you are naive.

        Why don't you do a poll on whether people on this forum should get paid
        more in their jobs. Or one for lower taxes for kitesurfers, more
        kitesurf beach access or capital punishment for those that deliberately
        abuse kites :-) Pretty predictable results.

        Yes I'm one of those COM guys you seem to take exception to who
        doesn't, (strangely enough), make a fortune out of kitesurfing sales. I
        can tell you where you can make a lot of money though. Try surf
        clothing especially if you have the right brands, 100% markup; try Real
        Estate; property round my area has increased 100% in the past couple of
        years, (I'm glad I had some) but don't try computer sales, approx 10%
        markup, or kitesurf gear, relatively small market compared to just
        about anything else.

        If you feel so strongly about kite pricing Carlo perhaps you should
        hassle whoever is responsible for your exchange rate compared to the US
        dollar. Or start your own kite manufacturing business and find out how
        easy and inexpensive it is to make it big in the kite industry and sell
        LEI kites for half the normal price;-)

        But you are wasting your time whinging about pricing and kitesurf
        retailers in the same breath. I never stated that I believed that kite
        prices were OK. I live in a country where our dollar is about half that
        of the US dollar. I could whinge too as I buy a considerable amount of
        gear for myself. However it's far more productive to just earn some
        more money, (generally outside the kitesurf industry), by working
        harder, smarter or taking an extra job, (or creating one) than
        complaining.

        Get off it Carlo, global market forces control the the pricing and we
        few retailers don't control much of that. I try to give the best prices
        I can for my customers and give free extra service as well.

        BTW, I think you are located in South Africa, you have a kite
        manufacturer or two in your country, fly their kites, they are
        apparently well priced. Or if you want them to make LEI kites get on
        their case.

        Have fun, Dave (Dr Surf Australia) COM
      • seancmurph@aol.com
        In a message dated 5/1/2002 12:31:12 AM Central Daylight Time, ... I miss TOdd, at least he was humorous while being obnoxious... Sean [Non-text portions of
        Message 3 of 21 , May 1, 2002
        • 0 Attachment
          In a message dated 5/1/2002 12:31:12 AM Central Daylight Time,
          ariraptis@... writes:


          > Angry Ari
          >
          >

          I miss TOdd, at least he was humorous while being obnoxious...

          Sean


          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • drsurfau
          Touché :-)My sentiments exactly.BTW, I went and priced an island today. You know the type, warm, windy, lots of scantily clad women on endless sandy
          Message 4 of 21 , May 1, 2002
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            Touché :-)

            My sentiments exactly.

            BTW, I went and priced an island today. You know the type, warm, windy,
            lots of scantily clad women on endless sandy beaches and no kitesurf
            restrictions etc.

            Well I was outraged, islands are sooo expensive! I reckon it's reached
            the point where only the rich can afford to buy them. Someone should do
            something about it! Are you listening Carlo, Henryk?? How about a poll?
            That'll fix it!

            Moral of the story, kites are cheap compared to islands, expensive
            compared to your average potato. Half the world doesn't even have
            access to clean water and yet some on this group complain about the
            price of everything?!!

            Get your priorities right, go have a kitesurf.

            Now at the moment in Australia wind is scarce, I'll pay, but not too
            much. Any offers of cheap wind?? Anyone?? :-)

            Go on have fun, everyone on this group is fucking privileged to do this
            sport!!

            Dave (Dr Surf Australia) COM

            --- In kitesurf@y..., "Suntrax" <Suntrax@i...> wrote:
            > Hey Dave (Dr)
            >
            > Guess what! Our newest shipment of Naish kites has come down by about 6%,=

            > the manufacturers must be reading this group! ;-)
            >
            > Unfortunately it's only because our lousy exchange rate has improved, but=

            > this will make Andy at Kitehigh happier as it pushes up our export prices=
            !
            >
            > Kitesurfing is alive and well in Capetown and everybody is complaining ab=
            out
            > the prices of kites and sunglasses and jetskis and televisions and
            > windsurfers and motorcars and skateboards and and and and....... but MOST=
            LY
            > A LACK OF WIND!
            >
            > Best Regards
            >
            > Brian Wilson
            > Suntrax
            > Tel/fax 027 21 5560044
            > cell; 0824656696
            > www.suntrax.co.za
            > suntrax@i...
            >
            > -----Original Message-----
            > From: drsurfau [mailto:dave@m...]
            > Sent: Tuesday, April 30, 2002 2:24 PM
            > To: kitesurf@y...
            > Subject: [ksurf] Re: Poll Result: Do you think kites are too expensive?
            >
            >
            > Really Carlo, you are naive.
            >
            > Why don't you do a poll on whether people on this forum should get paid
            > more in their jobs. Or one for lower taxes for kitesurfers, more
            > kitesurf beach access or capital punishment for those that deliberately
            > abuse kites :-) Pretty predictable results.
            >
            > Yes I'm one of those COM guys you seem to take exception to who
            > doesn't, (strangely enough), make a fortune out of kitesurfing sales. I
            > can tell you where you can make a lot of money though. Try surf
            > clothing especially if you have the right brands, 100% markup; try Real
            > Estate; property round my area has increased 100% in the past couple of
            > years, (I'm glad I had some) but don't try computer sales, approx 10%
            > markup, or kitesurf gear, relatively small market compared to just
            > about anything else.
            >
            > If you feel so strongly about kite pricing Carlo perhaps you should
            > hassle whoever is responsible for your exchange rate compared to the US
            > dollar. Or start your own kite manufacturing business and find out how
            > easy and inexpensive it is to make it big in the kite industry and sell
            > LEI kites for half the normal price;-)
            >
            > But you are wasting your time whinging about pricing and kitesurf
            > retailers in the same breath. I never stated that I believed that kite
            > prices were OK. I live in a country where our dollar is about half that
            > of the US dollar. I could whinge too as I buy a considerable amount of
            > gear for myself. However it's far more productive to just earn some
            > more money, (generally outside the kitesurf industry), by working
            > harder, smarter or taking an extra job, (or creating one) than
            > complaining.
            >
            > Get off it Carlo, global market forces control the the pricing and we
            > few retailers don't control much of that. I try to give the best prices
            > I can for my customers and give free extra service as well.
            >
            > BTW, I think you are located in South Africa, you have a kite
            > manufacturer or two in your country, fly their kites, they are
            > apparently well priced. Or if you want them to make LEI kites get on
            > their case.
            >
            > Have fun, Dave (Dr Surf Australia) COM
          • Rodney Lawrence
            I tell ya what I ll put some of my wind in a bottle from perth WA but it will coast ya $$$$$ Cool post though its so true aswell. I just wish my $1000 630 arc
            Message 5 of 21 , May 1, 2002
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              I tell ya what I'll put some of my wind in a bottle from perth WA but it
              will coast ya $$$$$
              Cool post though its so true aswell. I just wish my $1000 630 arc was a
              $1500 1120. Just so I could go for a surf the winds here have been on
              holiday aswell.

              Rod

              LET US ALL PREY TO THE WIND GOD!!
              http://www.perth-kiteboarding.tk/
              ARCS & F-ARCS
              ----- Original Message -----
              From: "drsurfau" <dave@...>
              To: <kitesurf@yahoogroups.com>
              Sent: Wednesday, May 01, 2002 10:10 PM
              Subject: Sport of the month[ksurf] Re: Poll Result: Do you think kites are
              too expensive?


              Touché :-)

              My sentiments exactly.

              BTW, I went and priced an island today. You know the type, warm, windy,
              lots of scantily clad women on endless sandy beaches and no kitesurf
              restrictions etc.

              Well I was outraged, islands are sooo expensive! I reckon it's reached
              the point where only the rich can afford to buy them. Someone should do
              something about it! Are you listening Carlo, Henryk?? How about a poll?
              That'll fix it!

              Moral of the story, kites are cheap compared to islands, expensive
              compared to your average potato. Half the world doesn't even have
              access to clean water and yet some on this group complain about the
              price of everything?!!

              Get your priorities right, go have a kitesurf.

              Now at the moment in Australia wind is scarce, I'll pay, but not too
              much. Any offers of cheap wind?? Anyone?? :-)

              Go on have fun, everyone on this group is fucking privileged to do this
              sport!!

              Dave (Dr Surf Australia) COM

              --- In kitesurf@y..., "Suntrax" <Suntrax@i...> wrote:
              > Hey Dave (Dr)
              >
              > Guess what! Our newest shipment of Naish kites has come down by about 6%,=

              > the manufacturers must be reading this group! ;-)
              >
              > Unfortunately it's only because our lousy exchange rate has improved, but=

              > this will make Andy at Kitehigh happier as it pushes up our export prices=
              !
              >
              > Kitesurfing is alive and well in Capetown and everybody is complaining ab=
              out
              > the prices of kites and sunglasses and jetskis and televisions and
              > windsurfers and motorcars and skateboards and and and and....... but MOST=
              LY
              > A LACK OF WIND!
              >
              > Best Regards
              >
              > Brian Wilson
              > Suntrax
              > Tel/fax 027 21 5560044
              > cell; 0824656696
              > www.suntrax.co.za
              > suntrax@i...
              >
              > -----Original Message-----
              > From: drsurfau [mailto:dave@m...]
              > Sent: Tuesday, April 30, 2002 2:24 PM
              > To: kitesurf@y...
              > Subject: [ksurf] Re: Poll Result: Do you think kites are too expensive?
              >
              >
              > Really Carlo, you are naive.
              >
              > Why don't you do a poll on whether people on this forum should get paid
              > more in their jobs. Or one for lower taxes for kitesurfers, more
              > kitesurf beach access or capital punishment for those that deliberately
              > abuse kites :-) Pretty predictable results.
              >
              > Yes I'm one of those COM guys you seem to take exception to who
              > doesn't, (strangely enough), make a fortune out of kitesurfing sales. I
              > can tell you where you can make a lot of money though. Try surf
              > clothing especially if you have the right brands, 100% markup; try Real
              > Estate; property round my area has increased 100% in the past couple of
              > years, (I'm glad I had some) but don't try computer sales, approx 10%
              > markup, or kitesurf gear, relatively small market compared to just
              > about anything else.
              >
              > If you feel so strongly about kite pricing Carlo perhaps you should
              > hassle whoever is responsible for your exchange rate compared to the US
              > dollar. Or start your own kite manufacturing business and find out how
              > easy and inexpensive it is to make it big in the kite industry and sell
              > LEI kites for half the normal price;-)
              >
              > But you are wasting your time whinging about pricing and kitesurf
              > retailers in the same breath. I never stated that I believed that kite
              > prices were OK. I live in a country where our dollar is about half that
              > of the US dollar. I could whinge too as I buy a considerable amount of
              > gear for myself. However it's far more productive to just earn some
              > more money, (generally outside the kitesurf industry), by working
              > harder, smarter or taking an extra job, (or creating one) than
              > complaining.
              >
              > Get off it Carlo, global market forces control the the pricing and we
              > few retailers don't control much of that. I try to give the best prices
              > I can for my customers and give free extra service as well.
              >
              > BTW, I think you are located in South Africa, you have a kite
              > manufacturer or two in your country, fly their kites, they are
              > apparently well priced. Or if you want them to make LEI kites get on
              > their case.
              >
              > Have fun, Dave (Dr Surf Australia) COM



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            • Marc Munzer
              ... There is also the little fact that if you sell a kite cheaper than other kites then people think that there is something wrong with it and won t buy it...
              Message 6 of 21 , May 1, 2002
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                >you go out of buisiness. I bet you alot of the kite companys that
                >are currently making LEI's started because they thought they could
                >make competitive lei's at a cheaper price. There isn't a single
                >company do this, ask yourself why? If they could of course they
                >would they'd have a huge market share instantly...

                There is also the little fact that if you sell a kite cheaper than other
                kites then people think that there is something wrong with it and won't buy
                it... People complain about high prices but then don't support
                manufacturers who make an effort to drop their prices. Ask yourself if you
                went into your local surf shop and saw a Naish for 1000 and a new brand for
                500, which one would you buy... I would say 90% of people would go for the
                Naish because its obviously better because it is so much more expensive...

                In any case, I don't think that prices will come down for a while. There
                are too many companies on the market at the moment and nobody is making any
                money because they all have high overheads and no turnover. Wait a couple
                of years when half of the companies disappear, then the remaining companies
                will have more sales and they can start dropping their prices. The same
                goes for retailers, if you have 10 different retailers in your area all
                selling different brands then they will all make a little bit of money.
                Whereas if you had only 1 then the retailer could live with making less
                money on each kite because he is selling more.

                Regards,

                Marc
                GoExtreme.dk
              • Carlo
                ... Well said! This is exactly what this whole discussion is about. We are being ripped off.
                Message 7 of 21 , May 1, 2002
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                  >Kites are not a rocket science. Materials (excluding MACHs and X2s )
                  >are commonly used in several other industries. Tooling is not very
                  >sophisticated.
                  >They are built in countries where labour contents is relatively cheap.
                  >IMO there is no justification for such high prices.
                  >
                  >Henryk Majewski

                  Well said! This is exactly what this whole discussion is about. We are being
                  ripped off.
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