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Re: [ksurf] More 2002 Co2 testing

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  • Kitesurf Sixty Six
    Dwight, I have read your comments and some others on the CO2 testing. I hope I don t sound rude, but either knowingly or unknowingly, the report just seems to
    Message 1 of 10 , Nov 29, 2001
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      Dwight,
      I have read your comments and some others on the CO2 testing. I
      hope I don't sound rude, but either knowingly or unknowingly, the report
      just seems to be some "marketing help" for kites that did not turn out to be
      too good in 2001. I am a bit suspicious that the Cabrinha team let you have
      a kite out of their own kindness. You are a very vocal person in this news
      group, and your opinions on Wipikas really brought some business to them in
      2001 because people really listen to you. If I were the guys from Cabrinha
      kites, I would definitely would give a kite to you so that the same could be
      done. As I said, forgive me if my impression is totally distorted, but it
      looks like that. To me, if Cabrinha wants to make their kites the number 1
      kite in the market, they should start by receiving the old ones as trade-ins
      for the new ones. This would be make it right for all those that were the
      guinea pigs this year, and spent their time fixing kites, instead of flying
      them. Right now, I feel that the opinion of many on the matter counts more
      that just that of a few. So far, I will only believe what I find when I
      try, and even then, it most likely only makes sense for me and not to
      everybody by extension.

      JC
    • callum@dr.com
      JC, Does it matter why cabrinah gave dwight a pre-release kite? All that matters is dwight gives his honest feed back about said kite. Perhaps Cabrnah wanted
      Message 2 of 10 , Nov 29, 2001
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        JC,

        Does it matter why cabrinah gave dwight a pre-release kite?
        All that matters is dwight gives his honest feed back about said
        kite. Perhaps Cabrnah wanted feed back from some non team riders
        before releasing (I'm sure dwights not the only one out there with a
        2002 cabrinah - there was on at the mambo last weekend and I don't
        think dwight was in australia....), who knows perhaps cabrinah did do
        it so dwight could talk them up, but then that would be at the risk
        of dwight bagging them as well if he didn't like the kite. Unless
        Cabrinah has a some sort of deal with dwight to ensure he says only
        good things, but dwight seams like he has more integrity than that,
        and I'm sure he's also aware of the quidline of the group to let it
        be known any ties you have to manufactureres etc etc and I can't
        remember seeing a "I'm on cabrinahs payroll" message fromd dwight.

        1 hour to go before I can get back on the water on my lovely dinner
        tray again!!

        Later
        Callum
      • Kitesurf Sixty Six
        To all interested reader, I am not accusing Dwight of anything! I have always respected his opinion, but after all the bad things with Wipika and Cabrinha
        Message 3 of 10 , Nov 29, 2001
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          To all interested reader, I am not accusing Dwight of
          anything! I have always respected his opinion, but
          after all the bad things with Wipika and Cabrinha (and
          any others I don't know about or remember) this year,
          I am a bit hesitant to take opinions just like that.
          I am sure he is giving his honest view, but as anybody
          with a brand new toy, the excitement can be bigger
          than the reality. Excuse me for being so doubtful,
          but this year my pocket is aiming at the right thing,
          so I am trying to look beyond the marketing. When
          Cabrinhas came out, I was very excited about them. I
          was dying to get one. Luckly I waited, and after the
          bladder problems, and the disappointment in their
          performance, I got Wipikas and Liquid Force. I read
          bad reviews of Liquid Force kites in this news group,
          and most were of the comments were: somebody told me
          or somebody said. I have 2, and none of the problems
          mentioned here happened to me. My kid brother has one
          of them now, and he has abused it, and it is still
          holding up. I digress, so again, don't take it wrong,
          I am not accusing Dwight of any wrong doing, just
          being doubtful and maybe a devil's advocate on this
          topic.

          JC

          --- callum@... wrote:
          > JC,
          >
          > Does it matter why cabrinah gave dwight a
          > pre-release kite?
          > All that matters is dwight gives his honest feed
          > back about said
          > kite. Perhaps Cabrnah wanted feed back from some non
          > team riders
          > before releasing (I'm sure dwights not the only one
          > out there with a
          > 2002 cabrinah - there was on at the mambo last
          > weekend and I don't
          > think dwight was in australia....), who knows
          > perhaps cabrinah did do
          > it so dwight could talk them up, but then that would
          > be at the risk
          > of dwight bagging them as well if he didn't like the
          > kite. Unless
          > Cabrinah has a some sort of deal with dwight to
          > ensure he says only
          > good things, but dwight seams like he has more
          > integrity than that,
          > and I'm sure he's also aware of the quidline of the
          > group to let it
          > be known any ties you have to manufactureres etc etc
          > and I can't
          > remember seeing a "I'm on cabrinahs payroll" message
          > fromd dwight.
          >
          > 1 hour to go before I can get back on the water on
          > my lovely dinner
          > tray again!!
          >
          > Later
          > Callum
          >
          >
          > Support your local kitesurf association !
          >
          >
          > <<<to unsubscribe send a message to
          > kitesurf-unsubscribe@egroups.com>>>
          >
          > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
          > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
          >
          >


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        • Kitesurf Sixty Six
          ... Raul, I don t intent for this to become a we are really the good buys, we did this. People have a different view of things. Mine is simple, taking the
          Message 4 of 10 , Nov 29, 2001
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            --- Raul F Argilagos <offdalip@...> wrote:
            > JC,
            > correct me if I'm wrong but
            > I believe Cabrinha already offered to recieve all
            > the old bladders
            > as trade-ins for the new ones so they have made it
            > right by
            > standing behind their product as a kite company
            > should.
            >

            Raul,
            I don't intent for this to become a "we are really
            the good buys, we did this." People have a different
            view of things. Mine is simple, taking the bladders
            back is not such a big deal to me because I would
            expect it when the product is not doing too well.
            Taking the kite as a trade-in would be the thing that
            nobody would do, and would put you guys over the top.
            I was really interested in your kites when they came
            out. Unfortunately, the problems the plagued the
            kites and my "perception" of poor performance turned
            me off. Believe me, I really hope for a better year
            for Cabrinha. If your kites have the innovation and
            performance that is claimed so far, you will have my
            business.

            JC

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          • loco4viento@yahoo.com
            JC: Nice points...I m willing to let Dwight speak for himself and let us know the deal...free kites, sweetheart deal with Cabrinha, discounts, team rider
            Message 5 of 10 , Nov 29, 2001
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              JC: Nice points...I'm willing to let Dwight speak for himself and let
              us know the deal...free kites, sweetheart deal with Cabrinha,
              discounts, "team rider" status, incentives, or just a good customer who
              paid top dollar for his kites and is sharing useful info with all of us
              cuz he's so stoked out of his mind he can't stand to let us miss out.
              It took some pulling to get one of our boys from a very very very gusty
              kelp-filled dangerous gusty gusty very gusty Southern California
              horrible launch site to fess up and tell us where he's coming from in
              the business...a few good guys hooked up with Cabrinha put lots of
              secret "nonCOMs" on for their compadres...all cool with me if I know
              where they're coming from. JC and Dwight both seem cool to me...I like
              to hear fro each of them...John

              --- In kitesurf@y..., "Kitesurf Sixty Six" <kitesurf66@y...> wrote:
              > Dwight,
              > I have read your comments and some others on the CO2 testing. I
              > hope I don't sound rude, but either knowingly or unknowingly, the report
              > just seems to be some "marketing help" for kites that did not turn out to be
              > too good in 2001. I am a bit suspicious that the Cabrinha team let you have
              > a kite out of their own kindness. You are a very vocal person in this news
              > group, and your opinions on Wipikas really brought some business to them in
              > 2001 because people really listen to you. If I were the guys from Cabrinha
              > kites, I would definitely would give a kite to you so that the same could be
              > done. As I said, forgive me if my impression is totally distorted, but it
              > looks like that. To me, if Cabrinha wants to make their kites the number 1
              > kite in the market, they should start by receiving the old ones as trade-ins
              > for the new ones. This would be make it right for all those that were the
              > guinea pigs this year, and spent their time fixing kites, instead of flying
              > them. Right now, I feel that the opinion of many on the matter counts more
              > that just that of a few. So far, I will only believe what I find when I
              > try, and even then, it most likely only makes sense for me and not to
              > everybody by extension.
              >
              > JC
            • Dwight & Jacky
              No problem, I understand your position. I am cautiously optomistic about my new kite. Believe me, I am worried too, and am doing what I can to make sure it
              Message 6 of 10 , Nov 30, 2001
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                No problem, I understand your position. I am cautiously optomistic about my new kite. Believe me, I
                am worried too, and am doing what I can to make sure it will hold up.

                As for how I got the kites. I was at the Hatteras contest, not to compete, but to watch. I was told
                by our local kite shop we could demo the 2002 Cabrinha kites the team riders had. Conditions the day
                before the contest started, didn't allow it. It was fun looking at all the new kites.

                I talked to Brad Duffy and Dave Loop about the new Wipika kites. When they told me they were putting
                the Mylar material in the ribs, but turned inside, I decided I didn't want any more Wipika kites. I
                was growing tired of all the little nagging problems with leaking bladders due to poor seam sealing
                anyway.

                I looked over the Slingshot kites and their construction looked great and they looked good in the
                air. I just don't like their graphics and colors. They don't have the look of a polished
                professionally finished product. None of my friends agree with me on this. The local kite store
                owner ordered those kites for himself and I hope to fly one today.

                I talked to Kent MarinKovic of Cabrinha about the Co2. I liked the look of that kite the best. I
                asked when they would be available and he said they 54 kites due in next week that were destined for
                team riders, but he could probably let me have one. I'm sure Kent had no idea who I was. I had the
                kite shop call Raul and relay the story and Raul said OK he'd ship me a kite.

                I am not sponsored by anybody, but I've looked into it. Not because I'm any good, but because me and
                my friends saw amateur bozo's getting sponsorship at these contests. I call them bozo's because we
                are of similar skills and I still consider myself a bozo. Well my friend had the balls to ask for
                sponsorship and walla he got it. I guess I could get it too, but not from Cabrinha. They are not
                handing out sponsorships like candy, like some others are right now.

                So I pay good money for my kites, but I do get good deals because I waste way too much money at the
                local kite store on this addition I equate to heroin.

                Dwight

                > Dwight,
                > I have read your comments and some others on the CO2 testing. I
                > hope I don't sound rude, but either knowingly or unknowingly, the report
                > just seems to be some "marketing help" for kites that did not turn out to be
                > too good in 2001. I am a bit suspicious that the Cabrinha team let you have
                > a kite out of their own kindness. You are a very vocal person in this news
                > group, and your opinions on Wipikas really brought some business to them in
                > 2001 because people really listen to you. If I were the guys from Cabrinha
                > kites, I would definitely would give a kite to you so that the same could be
                > done. As I said, forgive me if my impression is totally distorted, but it
                > looks like that. To me, if Cabrinha wants to make their kites the number 1
                > kite in the market, they should start by receiving the old ones as trade-ins
                > for the new ones. This would be make it right for all those that were the
                > guinea pigs this year, and spent their time fixing kites, instead of flying
                > them. Right now, I feel that the opinion of many on the matter counts more
                > that just that of a few. So far, I will only believe what I find when I
                > try, and even then, it most likely only makes sense for me and not to
                > everybody by extension.
                >
                > JC
                >
                >
                > Support your local kitesurf association !
                >
                >
                > <<<to unsubscribe send a message to kitesurf-unsubscribe@egroups.com>>>
                >
                > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                >
                >
                >
              • loco4viento@yahoo.com
                ... Similar addiction, but kitesurfing is far worse. Lots of heroin addicts lead normal lives and are not found out for quite some time. Many people have
                Message 7 of 10 , Nov 30, 2001
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                  --- In kitesurf@y..., "Dwight & Jacky" <fishersfort@a...> wrote:
                  >but I do get good deals because I waste way too much money at the
                  > local kite store on this addition I equate to heroin.

                  Similar addiction, but kitesurfing is far worse. Lots of heroin addicts
                  lead normal lives and are not "found out" for quite some time. Many
                  people have successfully kicked the heroin habit. Some heroin addicts
                  area able to pursue other many other interests, such as crack, crystal,
                  angel dust or prostitution.

                  Kitesurfers on the other hand, can't keep the addiction a secret, can't
                  kick the habit until we get hurt, and find flashbacks/hallucinations/
                  intrusive kitesurfing thoughts to invade every part of our lives. It's
                  a real killer.

                  John
                • Rudy de Groot
                  Stoked4Life, RudyG. ... From:
                  Message 8 of 10 , Nov 30, 2001
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                    <applause> <standing ovation>

                    Stoked4Life, RudyG.

                    ----- Original Message -----
                    From: <loco4viento@...>


                    > --- In kitesurf@y..., "Dwight & Jacky" <fishersfort@a...> wrote:
                    > >but I do get good deals because I waste way too much money at the
                    > > local kite store on this addition I equate to heroin.
                    >
                    > Similar addiction, but kitesurfing is far worse. Lots of heroin addicts
                    > lead normal lives and are not "found out" for quite some time. Many
                    > people have successfully kicked the heroin habit. Some heroin addicts
                    > area able to pursue other many other interests, such as crack, crystal,
                    > angel dust or prostitution.
                    >
                    > Kitesurfers on the other hand, can't keep the addiction a secret, can't
                    > kick the habit until we get hurt, and find flashbacks/hallucinations/
                    > intrusive kitesurfing thoughts to invade every part of our lives. It's
                    > a real killer.
                    >
                    > John
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > Support your local kitesurf association !
                    >
                    >
                    > <<<to unsubscribe send a message to kitesurf-unsubscribe@egroups.com>>>
                    >
                    > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                    >
                    >
                    >
                  • Kitesurf Sixty Six
                    ... From: Dwight & Jacky To: Sent: Friday, November 30, 2001 7:38 AM Subject: Re: [ksurf] More 2002
                    Message 9 of 10 , Dec 2, 2001
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                      ----- Original Message -----
                      From: "Dwight & Jacky" <fishersfort@...>
                      To: <kitesurf@yahoogroups.com>
                      Sent: Friday, November 30, 2001 7:38 AM
                      Subject: Re: [ksurf] More 2002 Co2 testing


                      > No problem, I understand your position. I am cautiously optomistic about
                      my new kite. Believe me, I
                      > am worried too, and am doing what I can to make sure it will hold up.
                      >

                      Dwight,
                      I guess this is the reason I think you are really cool. You did
                      not misintrepret my message, but actually addressed my concerns!

                      > As for how I got the kites. I was at the Hatteras contest, not to compete,
                      but to watch. I was told
                      > by our local kite shop we could demo the 2002 Cabrinha kites the team
                      riders had. Conditions the day
                      > before the contest started, didn't allow it. It was fun looking at all the
                      new kites.
                      >
                      > I talked to Brad Duffy and Dave Loop about the new Wipika kites. When they
                      told me they were putting
                      > the Mylar material in the ribs, but turned inside, I decided I didn't want
                      any more Wipika kites. I
                      > was growing tired of all the little nagging problems with leaking bladders
                      due to poor seam sealing
                      > anyway.
                      >

                      I have to admit that this year I felt a bit adventurous, and sold one of my
                      Wipikas and bought a North 12 to see if I could do better. I have been
                      very happy with it so far, but also I have not been able to fly it too much
                      to say that it is awesome.

                      > I looked over the Slingshot kites and their construction looked great and
                      they looked good in the
                      > air. I just don't like their graphics and colors. They don't have the look
                      of a polished
                      > professionally finished product. None of my friends agree with me on this.
                      The local kite store
                      > owner ordered those kites for himself and I hope to fly one today.
                      >
                      > I talked to Kent MarinKovic of Cabrinha about the Co2. I liked the look of
                      that kite the best. I
                      > asked when they would be available and he said they 54 kites due in next
                      week that were destined for
                      > team riders, but he could probably let me have one. I'm sure Kent had no
                      idea who I was. I had the
                      > kite shop call Raul and relay the story and Raul said OK he'd ship me a
                      kite.
                      >

                      That's cool, I appreciate your honesty.

                      > I am not sponsored by anybody, but I've looked into it. Not because I'm
                      any good, but because me and
                      > my friends saw amateur bozo's getting sponsorship at these contests. I
                      call them bozo's because we
                      > are of similar skills and I still consider myself a bozo. Well my friend
                      had the balls to ask for
                      > sponsorship and walla he got it. I guess I could get it too, but not from
                      Cabrinha. They are not
                      > handing out sponsorships like candy, like some others are right now.
                      >

                      I have read the messages where offer advice, and I would say that most times
                      you seem to be right on the money, so I don't think that you could be a
                      bozo. I have seen this sponsorship thing around here, too, and I believe
                      that now a days, it is not doing too good a service to some companies since
                      some of the "team riders" are not that good. It makes you say some time,
                      "if they cannot ride it well, imagine how much harder it will be for me that
                      I am not a team rider" :-).

                      > So I pay good money for my kites, but I do get good deals because I waste
                      way too much money at the
                      > dlocal kite store on this addition I equate to heroin.
                      >

                      Well, I would love to be able to do this, but having gone through the
                      windsurfing early days, I am a bit skeptical now about kiting. I already
                      spent a fortune in windsurfing gear with all the "changes and improvements"
                      on sails, boards, masts, booms, etc. I am not willing to pay for this
                      "revolution" in the kiting arena. I think I will let the brave one do this,
                      and I will sit back and collect on the good experiences. Thanks again for
                      your honesty and for also understanding my arguments.

                      JC
                    • Raul F Argilagos
                      JC, correct me if I m wrong but I believe Cabrinha already offered to recieve all the old bladders as trade-ins for the new ones so they have made it right by
                      Message 10 of 10 , Dec 30, 2001
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                        JC,
                        correct me if I'm wrong but
                        I believe Cabrinha already offered to recieve all the old bladders
                        as trade-ins for the new ones so they have made it right by
                        standing behind their product as a kite company should.

                        Raul


                        >As I said, forgive me if my impression is totally distorted,
                        > but it
                        > looks like that. To me, if Cabrinha wants to make their kites the
                        > number 1
                        > kite in the market, they should start by receiving the old ones as
                        > trade-ins
                        > for the new ones. This would be make it right for all those that
                        > were the
                        > guinea pigs this year, and spent their time fixing kites, instead of
                        > flying
                        > them. Right now, I feel that the opinion of many on the matter
                        > counts more
                        > that just that of a few. So far, I will only believe what I find
                        > when I
                        > try, and even then, it most likely only makes sense for me and not
                        > to
                        > everybody by extension.
                        >
                        > JC
                        >
                        >
                        > Support your local kitesurf association !
                        >
                        >
                        > <<<to unsubscribe send a message to
                        > kitesurf-unsubscribe@egroups.com>>>
                        >
                        > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
                        > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                        >
                        >
                        >
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