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Re: [ksurf] Re: Reel-leash idea - almost leashless

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  • Rainer Leuschke
    ... What is it, what is it? A spring loaded mini sail that pops up when you pop off to sail the board downwind faster? 8P R!
    Message 1 of 19 , Nov 1, 2001
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      On Thu, 1 Nov 2001 thorpes@... wrote:
      > Actually my next crazy idea involves a board retreival method with no
      > risk of sling-shot, no retractible garrote attaching you to the board
      > and--if it works--a 92.3% chance of board retreival in all conditions
      > except thick kelp. ;-)

      What is it, what is it? A spring loaded mini sail that pops up when you
      pop off to sail the board downwind faster? 8P

      R!
    • thorpes@arklogic.com
      ... with no ... board ... conditions ... you ... Nope - although that is where my idea started. Obviously that would only have a 43.7% of board retreival
      Message 2 of 19 , Nov 1, 2001
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        --- In kitesurf@y..., Rainer Leuschke <rainer@u...> wrote:
        >
        > On Thu, 1 Nov 2001 thorpes@a... wrote:
        > > Actually my next crazy idea involves a board retreival method
        with no
        > > risk of sling-shot, no retractible garrote attaching you to the
        board
        > > and--if it works--a 92.3% chance of board retreival in all
        conditions
        > > except thick kelp. ;-)
        >
        > What is it, what is it? A spring loaded mini sail that pops up when
        you
        > pop off to sail the board downwind faster? 8P
        >
        > R!

        Nope - although that is where my idea started. Obviously that would
        only have a 43.7% of board retreival though - there would be a 50%
        chance of it landing upsidedown renering the spring loaded sail
        useless then a further 6.3% chance of failure due to other
        circumstances. My new idea would work (theoretically) whichever way
        up the board landed ;-)

        Keep guessing - I'll test it out next time I'm on the water.

        Steve T.
      • Rainer Leuschke
        ... Yeah, that s what I figured too, unless you have a sail on either side and only pop up the top one. Tricky to implement 8) ... How bout a baloon/bladder
        Message 3 of 19 , Nov 1, 2001
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          On Thu, 1 Nov 2001 thorpes@... wrote:
          > only have a 43.7% of board retreival though - there would be a 50%

          Yeah, that's what I figured too, unless you have a sail on either side and
          only pop up the top one. Tricky to implement 8)

          > Keep guessing - I'll test it out next time I'm on the water.

          How 'bout a baloon/bladder inflating when you eject? If it lands upside
          down the bladder could flip it over. Not sure how to
          reset the apparatus though. Getting closer?

          R!
        • thorpes@arklogic.com
          ... side and ... upside ... Much closer - in fact you are too close - try to get a little farther away ;-) Steve T.
          Message 4 of 19 , Nov 1, 2001
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            --- In kitesurf@y..., Rainer Leuschke <rainer@u...> wrote:
            >
            > On Thu, 1 Nov 2001 thorpes@a... wrote:
            > > only have a 43.7% of board retreival though - there would be a 50%
            >
            > Yeah, that's what I figured too, unless you have a sail on either
            side and
            > only pop up the top one. Tricky to implement 8)
            >
            > > Keep guessing - I'll test it out next time I'm on the water.
            >
            > How 'bout a baloon/bladder inflating when you eject? If it lands
            upside
            > down the bladder could flip it over. Not sure how to
            > reset the apparatus though. Getting closer?
            >
            > R!

            Much closer - in fact you are "too close" - try to get a
            little "farther away" ;-)

            Steve T.
          • thorpes@arklogic.com
            ... Okay - here s the idea ... http://groups.yahoo.com/group/kitesurf/files/TinMan/LeashlessBoard.jpg with the right materials this shuold be able to compress
            Message 5 of 19 , Nov 1, 2001
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              --- In kitesurf@y..., Rainer Leuschke <rainer@u...> wrote:

              > How 'bout a baloon/bladder inflating when you eject?...

              > ... Getting closer?


              Okay - here's the idea ...

              http://groups.yahoo.com/group/kitesurf/files/TinMan/LeashlessBoard.jpg

              with the right materials this shuold be able to compress into a
              package no larger than a reel leash - an elastic-necked pouch worn
              neck down, on the ankle.

              So waddaya think?
              How will this one kill me. Carlos? ;-)

              Steve T.
            • c_batalha@clix.pt
              I must say that this system is, at least, original!!! Just to know... How would you retrieve the system again? Carlos PS: Altought this could work fine, I
              Message 6 of 19 , Nov 1, 2001
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                I must say that this system is, at least, original!!!

                Just to know... How would you retrieve the system again?

                Carlos
                PS: Altought this could work fine, I prefer my "old" surfboard leash
                and my helmet when I ride my TT!!

                PS2: Just to know... I rarely have really bad crashs in my TT, cause
                I usually ride wakeboards and just use my TT in very light winds!!


                --- In kitesurf@y..., thorpes@a... wrote:
                > --- In kitesurf@y..., Rainer Leuschke <rainer@u...> wrote:
                >
                > > How 'bout a baloon/bladder inflating when you eject?...
                >
                > > ... Getting closer?
                >
                >
                > Okay - here's the idea ...
                >
                >
                http://groups.yahoo.com/group/kitesurf/files/TinMan/LeashlessBoard.jpg
                >
                > with the right materials this shuold be able to compress into a
                > package no larger than a reel leash - an elastic-necked pouch worn
                > neck down, on the ankle.
                >
                > So waddaya think?
                > How will this one kill me. Carlos? ;-)
                >
                > Steve T.
              • thorpes@arklogic.com
                ... I figured you just sqish it up into a ball and stuff it back in the pouch (which is anchored to your leg or harness) - ready to go again! ... Hey - I m
                Message 7 of 19 , Nov 1, 2001
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                  --- In kitesurf@y..., c_batalha@c... wrote:
                  > I must say that this system is, at least, original!!!
                  >
                  > Just to know... How would you retrieve the system again?

                  I figured you just sqish it up into a ball and stuff it back in the
                  pouch (which is anchored to your leg or harness) - ready to go again!


                  > Carlos
                  > PS: Altought this could work fine, I prefer my "old"
                  > surfboard leash and my helmet when I ride my TT!!

                  Hey - I'm happy with my reel-leash + Gath on my LWD 169
                  but there seemed to be a lot of people who would like to
                  go leashless except for the possibility of loosing a board.

                  PS - even if this idea does not work to retrieve the board
                  something similar could vastly improve the chances of
                  seeing a lost board in the ocean.


                  Steve T.
                • janwcoffey@yahoo.com
                  I m back from Maui, had a greate time. I have the solution. Weare a really short leash, and use a wakeboard. After only having the wakeboard for the whole
                  Message 8 of 19 , Nov 1, 2001
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                    I'm back from Maui, had a greate time.

                    I have the solution. Weare a really short leash, and use a wakeboard.

                    After only having the wakeboard for the whole week, I don't
                    see any reason to ride my twin, just put up a bigger kite.

                    If my girl wasn't interested in learning I would sell the twin.

                    Jan

                    --- In kitesurf@y..., thorpes@a... wrote:
                    > --- In kitesurf@y..., c_batalha@c... wrote:
                    > > I must say that this system is, at least, original!!!
                    > >
                    > > Just to know... How would you retrieve the system again?
                    >
                    > I figured you just sqish it up into a ball and stuff it back in the
                    > pouch (which is anchored to your leg or harness) - ready to go
                    again!
                    >
                    >
                    > > Carlos
                    > > PS: Altought this could work fine, I prefer my "old"
                    > > surfboard leash and my helmet when I ride my TT!!
                    >
                    > Hey - I'm happy with my reel-leash + Gath on my LWD 169
                    > but there seemed to be a lot of people who would like to
                    > go leashless except for the possibility of loosing a board.
                    >
                    > PS - even if this idea does not work to retrieve the board
                    > something similar could vastly improve the chances of
                    > seeing a lost board in the ocean.
                    >
                    >
                    > Steve T.
                  • c_batalha@clix.pt
                    YAHHHH!!! Someone that shares my opinion!!! You can always use a wakeboard... just use more kite!!! And, once my girl doesn t wanna try this sport, I think
                    Message 9 of 19 , Nov 1, 2001
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                      YAHHHH!!!
                      Someone that shares my opinion!!! You can always use a wakeboard...
                      just use more kite!!!

                      And, once my girl doesn't wanna try this sport, I think I'll sell my
                      brunotti mirror 180!

                      Carlos



                      --- In kitesurf@y..., janwcoffey@y... wrote:
                      >
                      > I'm back from Maui, had a greate time.
                      >
                      > I have the solution. Weare a really short leash, and use a
                      wakeboard.
                      >
                      > After only having the wakeboard for the whole week, I don't
                      > see any reason to ride my twin, just put up a bigger kite.
                      >
                      > If my girl wasn't interested in learning I would sell the twin.
                      >
                      > Jan
                      >
                      > --- In kitesurf@y..., thorpes@a... wrote:
                      > > --- In kitesurf@y..., c_batalha@c... wrote:
                      > > > I must say that this system is, at least, original!!!
                      > > >
                      > > > Just to know... How would you retrieve the system again?
                      > >
                      > > I figured you just sqish it up into a ball and stuff it back in
                      the
                      > > pouch (which is anchored to your leg or harness) - ready to go
                      > again!
                      > >
                      > >
                      > > > Carlos
                      > > > PS: Altought this could work fine, I prefer my "old"
                      > > > surfboard leash and my helmet when I ride my TT!!
                      > >
                      > > Hey - I'm happy with my reel-leash + Gath on my LWD 169
                      > > but there seemed to be a lot of people who would like to
                      > > go leashless except for the possibility of loosing a board.
                      > >
                      > > PS - even if this idea does not work to retrieve the board
                      > > something similar could vastly improve the chances of
                      > > seeing a lost board in the ocean.
                      > >
                      > >
                      > > Steve T.
                    • Iain Drummond
                      Tried a 7.wibble Airblast, delaminating quicker than I can peel onions, and an F-One TT of some sort (180ish?) a few months ago and decided it seemed like fun.
                      Message 10 of 19 , Nov 8, 2001
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                        Tried a 7.wibble Airblast, delaminating quicker than I can peel onions,
                        and an F-One TT of some sort (180ish?) a few months ago and decided it
                        seemed like fun. Not much practice later (barely managed to get on top
                        of the board in some light winds) I shelled out for a BT 9.4 and a BIC
                        175. I’ve been buggying for about and fly really bad-tempered 4-liners
                        as well as paragliders, so this seemed like a reasonable choice.
                        Firstly, a few words about the kit…
                        I know what kites are supposed to look like and boy was I impressed with
                        the BT. Excellent build quality, instruction book(?), bar, lines, bag
                        and the new bladders (so I’ve been reassured). It flies extremely well
                        and I found the chicken loop superb, giving about 50-60% depower
                        (although I didn’t exactly measure it). Oh, and I bought a board bag and
                        leash as well – again, excellent quality, etc, etc. Absolutely no
                        complaints about Cabrinha gear that I can’t pin down to my own
                        incompetence.
                        The board looks gorgeous. Seems a shame to go out and trash it. Can’t
                        say yet whether it’s any good (on account of me being really crap), but
                        the quality is high. Cute little set of fins, loop bindings designed for
                        the tropics (lots of padding) rather than Scottish water in winter
                        (heating elements), really nice fold-over stainless bolts. Didn’t get an
                        Allen key, which was a bit of a nuisance, but the graphics are cute and
                        it looks the part.
                        I’m not saying that this stuff is better than anything else, just that I
                        don’t think I’ve been shafted, particularly on the quality issue that
                        seems to be a rather hot topic at the moment. Believe me, I would be
                        moaning along with the rest of you if I thought otherwise.
                        Here are a few simple questions for you gurus out there and a vaguely
                        amusing tale of me trying to kill myself after a series of unfortunate
                        circumstances.

                        1) I can’t reach the trim loop whilst under way – urgently or otherwise.
                        Presumably I just need to shorten all of the leaders until I can reach
                        it. That provided some minutes of amusement for the onlookers.

                        2) When fully depowered (trim right in and lines on long at front and
                        short at back knots) the kite is extremely eager (i.e. seems impossible
                        to actually prevent) to take off from the water. What’s the easiest way
                        of killing the whole thing controllably? I don’t want to throw away the
                        bar ‘cos my lines always seem to get tangled. Flying to the edge of the
                        window is the obvious choice, but that assumes I’m not just recovering
                        from my last ditching which inevitably leaves the kite well in the power
                        zone (usually leaping into the sky just as I get my head above the water
                        again). Slam, glug, slam, glug, etc. You get the picture :-) Is this
                        just because it’s fully depowered, or my incompetence?

                        3) These board leash things, how long do people recon they should be? My
                        board is quite short, does this mean I can get away with less leash and
                        therefore less chance of the damn thing getting wrapped around my legs?
                        I'm not confident enough to contemplate binning the leash unless I'm
                        wearing a pair of fins (but then again, see below...).

                        4) Assuming I’m taking a course to my right, any comments on which foot
                        I should put in the loops first?

                        5) Do people tend to park things like BTs at the top and then put their
                        board on, or dump the kite, get in the board and then relaunch?

                        So you probably get the idea that I’m a bit incompetent, but eager to
                        learn. Learn I did, and hopefully someone else can learn the easy way
                        too.

                        The dodgy scenario…

                        Wind gusting to 22/23mph from 18 (measured on trusty paragliding wind
                        meter). Rigged BT fully depowered then spent about 2hrs body dragging,
                        including almost managing to get upwind. VERY IMPRESSED with kite. I’m
                        using the chicken loop (first thing I did was take the full-power one
                        off the bar). So I went and got the board.
                        Still having severe probs in the gusts trying to get feet in the loops
                        and the board facing the right way. Kite control seems fine, in that I
                        can keep the kite at the top of the window in the centre, but my timing
                        sucks and I keep powering up slightly – enough to spin me round.
                        Eventually get up on board and off I go for all of 10ft. I come off and
                        in the usual submarine escapade manage to spin round. Kite still flying,
                        leash now beautifully wrapped round both legs. Controlling the kite gets
                        a bit trickier as I can’t get my feet down to get any leverage on the
                        bar. That’s when I get the full slam/glug/slam/glug experience. By the
                        time I sort myself out and get the leash off my legs I have gone
                        downwind further than I should have and there is a nasty 100’
                        cliff-thing on my left, about 100yds away. Brain says “keep going
                        downwind and get in the next bay”, which is only about another 100yds.
                        Kite is now sitting in the water a bit further back in the zone than I
                        would really like, bouncing up and down in “I’m gonna launch when you’re
                        not looking” mode. About ½ sec later, off we go again.
                        At this point I am very aware of how close the cliff face is.
                        Unfortunately, my board had managed to sail downwind right in front of
                        me and wedged absolutely perfectly across AND between all 4 lines (bet
                        you can’t do that!). Up goes the kite under full power and I can’t
                        depower it – the board jams the whole thing up solid. I am now well
                        clear of the water. Buggy training comes to the fore and haul back and
                        unhook letting the bar get torn out of my hands. Problem over? I think
                        not. Bar whips out and locks perfectly in full power flying position
                        courtesy of the board. I am now gaining altitude and very aware of the
                        cliffs. The leash (which I am now dangling from) is now forcing in a
                        gentle left turn – exactly what I don’t want. Impact in not very many
                        seconds should be absolutely parallel with the cliff. A few thoughts run
                        through my mind at this point: “lucky I’m wearing that new canoeing
                        helmet”, “pity it won’t make much of a difference”, “maybe I should have
                        sprung for an impact vest”, “boy this will hurt”, “wonder which hospital
                        is nearest”, “why isn’t the kite depowering like it should”, “would you
                        look at that board wedged perfectly across the lines”, “nice the way the
                        fading sun catches the kite”, etc. The leash is the only thing holding
                        me to the kite, so I casually (not!) undo the Velcro and plummet into
                        the water. Never have I been happier to hear the sound of ripping
                        velcro. Kite lands about a foot short of the nasty rocks. Swim in with
                        board and retrieve all the bits, mercifully undamaged. Then I went home
                        shaking my head.
                        Feel free to comment. I can hear John, Colin and Steve laughing from
                        here.
                        Methinks I need some more practice…

                        Iain Drummond
                        Programme Manager
                        Memex Technology Ltd
                        iain.drummond@...
                        013552 33804 - www.memex.com
                      • fishersfort@attglobal.net
                        ... otherwise. ... reach ... front and ... impossible ... This sounds backwards. You kill power by setting the knots to hold the nose lower and let the back
                        Message 11 of 19 , Nov 8, 2001
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                          >1) I can't reach the trim loop whilst under way – urgently or
                          otherwise.
                          >Presumably I just need to shorten all of the leaders until I can
                          reach
                          >it. That provided some minutes of amusement for the onlookers.

                          >2) When fully depowered (trim right in and lines on long at
                          front and
                          >short at back knots) the kite is extremely eager (i.e. seems
                          impossible
                          >to actually prevent) to take off from the water.


                          This sounds backwards. You kill power by setting the knots to hold
                          the nose lower and let the back up.


                          >What's the easiest way
                          >of killing the whole thing controllably? I don't want to throw away
                          the
                          >bar `cos my lines always seem to get tangled. Flying to the edge of
                          the
                          >window is the obvious choice, but that assumes I'm not just
                          recovering
                          >from my last ditching which inevitably leaves the kite well in the
                          power
                          >zone (usually leaping into the sky just as I get my head above the
                          water
                          >again). Slam, glug, slam, glug, etc. You get the picture :-) Is this
                          >just because it's fully depowered, or my incompetence?


                          Kites don't have an eject button. Enjoy the thrashing. Hehehe.


                          >3) These board leash things, how long do people recon they
                          should be? My
                          >board is quite short, does this mean I can get away with less leash
                          and
                          >therefore less chance of the damn thing getting wrapped around my
                          legs?
                          >I'm not confident enough to contemplate binning the leash unless I'm
                          >wearing a pair of fins (but then again, see below...).


                          It will happen with all leashes. Hehehehe.


                          >4) Assuming I'm taking a course to my right, any comments on
                          which foot
                          I should put in the loops first?

                          >5) Do people tend to park things like BTs at the top and then
                          put their
                          board on,

                          YES

                          >or dump the kite, get in the board and then relaunch? NO

                          >Feel free to comment. I can hear John, Colin and Steve laughing from
                          >here.
                          >Methinks I need some more practice…


                          That was a great post! You made me laugh.

                          Dwight


                          Iain Drummond
                          Programme Manager
                          Memex Technology Ltd
                          iain.drummond@m...
                          013552 33804 - www.memex.com
                        • surfsup@ragingbull.com
                          ... the ... the ... recovering ... power ... water ... I m a beginner at this, but if you re looking for a way to get out of the kite completely, you should
                          Message 12 of 19 , Nov 8, 2001
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                            >What's the easiest way
                            >of killing the whole thing controllably? I don't want to throw away
                            the
                            >bar `cos my lines always seem to get tangled. Flying to the edge of
                            the
                            >window is the obvious choice, but that assumes I'm not just
                            recovering
                            >from my last ditching which inevitably leaves the kite well in the
                            power
                            >zone (usually leaping into the sky just as I get my head above the
                            water
                            >again). Slam, glug, slam, glug, etc. You get the picture :-) Is this
                            >just because it's fully depowered, or my incompetence?

                            I'm a beginner at this, but if you're looking for a way to get out of
                            the kite completely, you should have some sort of system devised to
                            allow you to do this. I tend to think of this as the "eject button"
                            that another poster says doesn't exist. It's pretty close to that.
                            Mel has been instrumental in helping me set this safety-system up and
                            it didn't take very long - or much cash. Besides, how much is your
                            life worth thrashed against a 100' cliff? More than some extra rope
                            and shackles...

                            Here's my files that I posted in the file folder to give you an idea
                            of the system:

                            http://groups.yahoo.com/group/kitesurf/files/surfsup/

                            Not only is the system functional, but it makes me feel a lot better
                            about impending danger, or danger you don't see coming...

                            V
                          • deejay@zeta.org.au
                            G Day Iain, I suggest taking a lesson or two with a qualified instructor. The instructor will be able to sort out your rig properly, tune it right and then
                            Message 13 of 19 , Nov 8, 2001
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                              G'Day Iain,

                              I suggest taking a lesson or two with a qualified instructor. The
                              instructor will be able to sort out your rig properly, tune it right
                              and then give you some pointers on how to correct the mistakes you
                              are making.

                              You will be heartened by the knowledge that we have all been through
                              similar difficulties when learning. A single lesson can make the
                              world of difference with the right instructor.

                              Have fun and fly safe,

                              Darren Marshall
                              Australian Kiteboarding School
                              www.australiankiteboardingschool.com



                              --- In kitesurf@y..., "Iain Drummond" <iain.drummond@m...> wrote:
                              > Tried a 7.wibble Airblast, delaminating quicker than I can peel
                              onions,
                              > and an F-One TT of some sort (180ish?) a few months ago and decided
                              it
                              > seemed like fun. Not much practice later (barely managed to get on
                              top
                              > of the board in some light winds) I shelled out for a BT 9.4 and a
                              BIC
                              > 175. I've been buggying for about and fly really bad-tempered 4-
                              liners
                              > as well as paragliders, so this seemed like a reasonable choice.
                              > Firstly, a few words about the kit…
                              > I know what kites are supposed to look like and boy was I impressed
                              with
                              > the BT. Excellent build quality, instruction book(?), bar, lines,
                              bag
                              > and the new bladders (so I've been reassured). It flies extremely
                              well
                              > and I found the chicken loop superb, giving about 50-60% depower
                              > (although I didn't exactly measure it). Oh, and I bought a board
                              bag and
                              > leash as well – again, excellent quality, etc, etc. Absolutely no
                              > complaints about Cabrinha gear that I can't pin down to my own
                              > incompetence.
                              > The board looks gorgeous. Seems a shame to go out and trash it.
                              Can't
                              > say yet whether it's any good (on account of me being really crap),
                              but
                              > the quality is high. Cute little set of fins, loop bindings
                              designed for
                              > the tropics (lots of padding) rather than Scottish water in winter
                              > (heating elements), really nice fold-over stainless bolts. Didn't
                              get an
                              > Allen key, which was a bit of a nuisance, but the graphics are cute
                              and
                              > it looks the part.
                              > I'm not saying that this stuff is better than anything else, just
                              that I
                              > don't think I've been shafted, particularly on the quality issue
                              that
                              > seems to be a rather hot topic at the moment. Believe me, I would be
                              > moaning along with the rest of you if I thought otherwise.
                              > Here are a few simple questions for you gurus out there and a
                              vaguely
                              > amusing tale of me trying to kill myself after a series of
                              unfortunate
                              > circumstances.
                              >
                              > 1) I can't reach the trim loop whilst under way – urgently or
                              otherwise.
                              > Presumably I just need to shorten all of the leaders until I can
                              reach
                              > it. That provided some minutes of amusement for the onlookers.
                              >
                              > 2) When fully depowered (trim right in and lines on long at
                              front and
                              > short at back knots) the kite is extremely eager (i.e. seems
                              impossible
                              > to actually prevent) to take off from the water. What's the easiest
                              way
                              > of killing the whole thing controllably? I don't want to throw away
                              the
                              > bar `cos my lines always seem to get tangled. Flying to the edge of
                              the
                              > window is the obvious choice, but that assumes I'm not just
                              recovering
                              > from my last ditching which inevitably leaves the kite well in the
                              power
                              > zone (usually leaping into the sky just as I get my head above the
                              water
                              > again). Slam, glug, slam, glug, etc. You get the picture :-) Is this
                              > just because it's fully depowered, or my incompetence?
                              >
                              > 3) These board leash things, how long do people recon they
                              should be? My
                              > board is quite short, does this mean I can get away with less leash
                              and
                              > therefore less chance of the damn thing getting wrapped around my
                              legs?
                              > I'm not confident enough to contemplate binning the leash unless I'm
                              > wearing a pair of fins (but then again, see below...).
                              >
                              > 4) Assuming I'm taking a course to my right, any comments on
                              which foot
                              > I should put in the loops first?
                              >
                              > 5) Do people tend to park things like BTs at the top and then
                              put their
                              > board on, or dump the kite, get in the board and then relaunch?
                              >
                              > So you probably get the idea that I'm a bit incompetent, but eager
                              to
                              > learn. Learn I did, and hopefully someone else can learn the easy
                              way
                              > too.
                              >
                              > The dodgy scenario…
                              >
                              > Wind gusting to 22/23mph from 18 (measured on trusty paragliding
                              wind
                              > meter). Rigged BT fully depowered then spent about 2hrs body
                              dragging,
                              > including almost managing to get upwind. VERY IMPRESSED with kite.
                              I'm
                              > using the chicken loop (first thing I did was take the full-power
                              one
                              > off the bar). So I went and got the board.
                              > Still having severe probs in the gusts trying to get feet in the
                              loops
                              > and the board facing the right way. Kite control seems fine, in
                              that I
                              > can keep the kite at the top of the window in the centre, but my
                              timing
                              > sucks and I keep powering up slightly – enough to spin me round.
                              > Eventually get up on board and off I go for all of 10ft. I come off
                              and
                              > in the usual submarine escapade manage to spin round. Kite still
                              flying,
                              > leash now beautifully wrapped round both legs. Controlling the kite
                              gets
                              > a bit trickier as I can't get my feet down to get any leverage on
                              the
                              > bar. That's when I get the full slam/glug/slam/glug experience. By
                              the
                              > time I sort myself out and get the leash off my legs I have gone
                              > downwind further than I should have and there is a nasty 100'
                              > cliff-thing on my left, about 100yds away. Brain says "keep going
                              > downwind and get in the next bay", which is only about another
                              100yds.
                              > Kite is now sitting in the water a bit further back in the zone
                              than I
                              > would really like, bouncing up and down in "I'm gonna launch when
                              you're
                              > not looking" mode. About ½ sec later, off we go again.
                              > At this point I am very aware of how close the cliff face is.
                              > Unfortunately, my board had managed to sail downwind right in front
                              of
                              > me and wedged absolutely perfectly across AND between all 4 lines
                              (bet
                              > you can't do that!). Up goes the kite under full power and I can't
                              > depower it – the board jams the whole thing up solid. I am now well
                              > clear of the water. Buggy training comes to the fore and haul back
                              and
                              > unhook letting the bar get torn out of my hands. Problem over? I
                              think
                              > not. Bar whips out and locks perfectly in full power flying position
                              > courtesy of the board. I am now gaining altitude and very aware of
                              the
                              > cliffs. The leash (which I am now dangling from) is now forcing in a
                              > gentle left turn – exactly what I don't want. Impact in not very
                              many
                              > seconds should be absolutely parallel with the cliff. A few
                              thoughts run
                              > through my mind at this point: "lucky I'm wearing that new canoeing
                              > helmet", "pity it won't make much of a difference", "maybe I should
                              have
                              > sprung for an impact vest", "boy this will hurt", "wonder which
                              hospital
                              > is nearest", "why isn't the kite depowering like it should", "would
                              you
                              > look at that board wedged perfectly across the lines", "nice the
                              way the
                              > fading sun catches the kite", etc. The leash is the only thing
                              holding
                              > me to the kite, so I casually (not!) undo the Velcro and plummet
                              into
                              > the water. Never have I been happier to hear the sound of ripping
                              > velcro. Kite lands about a foot short of the nasty rocks. Swim in
                              with
                              > board and retrieve all the bits, mercifully undamaged. Then I went
                              home
                              > shaking my head.
                              > Feel free to comment. I can hear John, Colin and Steve laughing from
                              > here.
                              > Methinks I need some more practice…
                              >
                              > Iain Drummond
                              > Programme Manager
                              > Memex Technology Ltd
                              > iain.drummond@m...
                              > 013552 33804 - www.memex.com
                            • iclimbtrees@yahoo.com
                              TAKE SOME LESSONS BEFORE YOU KILL YOURSELF/SOMEONE!!!!!! ... onions, ... it ... top ... BIC ... liners ... with ... bag ... well ... bag and ... Can t ... but
                              Message 14 of 19 , Nov 8, 2001
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                                TAKE SOME LESSONS BEFORE YOU KILL YOURSELF/SOMEONE!!!!!!

                                --- In kitesurf@y..., "Iain Drummond" <iain.drummond@m...> wrote:
                                > Tried a 7.wibble Airblast, delaminating quicker than I can peel
                                onions,
                                > and an F-One TT of some sort (180ish?) a few months ago and decided
                                it
                                > seemed like fun. Not much practice later (barely managed to get on
                                top
                                > of the board in some light winds) I shelled out for a BT 9.4 and a
                                BIC
                                > 175. I've been buggying for about and fly really bad-tempered 4-
                                liners
                                > as well as paragliders, so this seemed like a reasonable choice.
                                > Firstly, a few words about the kit…
                                > I know what kites are supposed to look like and boy was I impressed
                                with
                                > the BT. Excellent build quality, instruction book(?), bar, lines,
                                bag
                                > and the new bladders (so I've been reassured). It flies extremely
                                well
                                > and I found the chicken loop superb, giving about 50-60% depower
                                > (although I didn't exactly measure it). Oh, and I bought a board
                                bag and
                                > leash as well – again, excellent quality, etc, etc. Absolutely no
                                > complaints about Cabrinha gear that I can't pin down to my own
                                > incompetence.
                                > The board looks gorgeous. Seems a shame to go out and trash it.
                                Can't
                                > say yet whether it's any good (on account of me being really crap),
                                but
                                > the quality is high. Cute little set of fins, loop bindings
                                designed for
                                > the tropics (lots of padding) rather than Scottish water in winter
                                > (heating elements), really nice fold-over stainless bolts. Didn't
                                get an
                                > Allen key, which was a bit of a nuisance, but the graphics are cute
                                and
                                > it looks the part.
                                > I'm not saying that this stuff is better than anything else, just
                                that I
                                > don't think I've been shafted, particularly on the quality issue
                                that
                                > seems to be a rather hot topic at the moment. Believe me, I would be
                                > moaning along with the rest of you if I thought otherwise.
                                > Here are a few simple questions for you gurus out there and a
                                vaguely
                                > amusing tale of me trying to kill myself after a series of
                                unfortunate
                                > circumstances.
                                >
                                > 1) I can't reach the trim loop whilst under way – urgently or
                                otherwise.
                                > Presumably I just need to shorten all of the leaders until I can
                                reach
                                > it. That provided some minutes of amusement for the onlookers.
                                >
                                > 2) When fully depowered (trim right in and lines on long at
                                front and
                                > short at back knots) the kite is extremely eager (i.e. seems
                                impossible
                                > to actually prevent) to take off from the water. What's the easiest
                                way
                                > of killing the whole thing controllably? I don't want to throw away
                                the
                                > bar `cos my lines always seem to get tangled. Flying to the edge of
                                the
                                > window is the obvious choice, but that assumes I'm not just
                                recovering
                                > from my last ditching which inevitably leaves the kite well in the
                                power
                                > zone (usually leaping into the sky just as I get my head above the
                                water
                                > again). Slam, glug, slam, glug, etc. You get the picture :-) Is this
                                > just because it's fully depowered, or my incompetence?
                                >
                                > 3) These board leash things, how long do people recon they
                                should be? My
                                > board is quite short, does this mean I can get away with less leash
                                and
                                > therefore less chance of the damn thing getting wrapped around my
                                legs?
                                > I'm not confident enough to contemplate binning the leash unless I'm
                                > wearing a pair of fins (but then again, see below...).
                                >
                                > 4) Assuming I'm taking a course to my right, any comments on
                                which foot
                                > I should put in the loops first?
                                >
                                > 5) Do people tend to park things like BTs at the top and then
                                put their
                                > board on, or dump the kite, get in the board and then relaunch?
                                >
                                > So you probably get the idea that I'm a bit incompetent, but eager
                                to
                                > learn. Learn I did, and hopefully someone else can learn the easy
                                way
                                > too.
                                >
                                > The dodgy scenario…
                                >
                                > Wind gusting to 22/23mph from 18 (measured on trusty paragliding
                                wind
                                > meter). Rigged BT fully depowered then spent about 2hrs body
                                dragging,
                                > including almost managing to get upwind. VERY IMPRESSED with kite.
                                I'm
                                > using the chicken loop (first thing I did was take the full-power
                                one
                                > off the bar). So I went and got the board.
                                > Still having severe probs in the gusts trying to get feet in the
                                loops
                                > and the board facing the right way. Kite control seems fine, in
                                that I
                                > can keep the kite at the top of the window in the centre, but my
                                timing
                                > sucks and I keep powering up slightly – enough to spin me round.
                                > Eventually get up on board and off I go for all of 10ft. I come off
                                and
                                > in the usual submarine escapade manage to spin round. Kite still
                                flying,
                                > leash now beautifully wrapped round both legs. Controlling the kite
                                gets
                                > a bit trickier as I can't get my feet down to get any leverage on
                                the
                                > bar. That's when I get the full slam/glug/slam/glug experience. By
                                the
                                > time I sort myself out and get the leash off my legs I have gone
                                > downwind further than I should have and there is a nasty 100'
                                > cliff-thing on my left, about 100yds away. Brain says "keep going
                                > downwind and get in the next bay", which is only about another
                                100yds.
                                > Kite is now sitting in the water a bit further back in the zone
                                than I
                                > would really like, bouncing up and down in "I'm gonna launch when
                                you're
                                > not looking" mode. About ½ sec later, off we go again.
                                > At this point I am very aware of how close the cliff face is.
                                > Unfortunately, my board had managed to sail downwind right in front
                                of
                                > me and wedged absolutely perfectly across AND between all 4 lines
                                (bet
                                > you can't do that!). Up goes the kite under full power and I can't
                                > depower it – the board jams the whole thing up solid. I am now well
                                > clear of the water. Buggy training comes to the fore and haul back
                                and
                                > unhook letting the bar get torn out of my hands. Problem over? I
                                think
                                > not. Bar whips out and locks perfectly in full power flying position
                                > courtesy of the board. I am now gaining altitude and very aware of
                                the
                                > cliffs. The leash (which I am now dangling from) is now forcing in a
                                > gentle left turn – exactly what I don't want. Impact in not very
                                many
                                > seconds should be absolutely parallel with the cliff. A few
                                thoughts run
                                > through my mind at this point: "lucky I'm wearing that new canoeing
                                > helmet", "pity it won't make much of a difference", "maybe I should
                                have
                                > sprung for an impact vest", "boy this will hurt", "wonder which
                                hospital
                                > is nearest", "why isn't the kite depowering like it should", "would
                                you
                                > look at that board wedged perfectly across the lines", "nice the
                                way the
                                > fading sun catches the kite", etc. The leash is the only thing
                                holding
                                > me to the kite, so I casually (not!) undo the Velcro and plummet
                                into
                                > the water. Never have I been happier to hear the sound of ripping
                                > velcro. Kite lands about a foot short of the nasty rocks. Swim in
                                with
                                > board and retrieve all the bits, mercifully undamaged. Then I went
                                home
                                > shaking my head.
                                > Feel free to comment. I can hear John, Colin and Steve laughing from
                                > here.
                                > Methinks I need some more practice…
                                >
                                > Iain Drummond
                                > Programme Manager
                                > Memex Technology Ltd
                                > iain.drummond@m...
                                > 013552 33804 - www.memex.com
                              • Iain Drummond
                                The concensus seems to be split between those that sympathise and those that think I m a liability. Nothing new there! Thanks to all those who posted their
                                Message 15 of 19 , Nov 9, 2001
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                                  The concensus seems to be split between those that sympathise and those
                                  that think I'm a liability.

                                  Nothing new there!

                                  Thanks to all those who posted their advice, all of which looks sane and
                                  reasonable.

                                  Anyone know of any kitesurfing instructors in Scotland?
                                • ichiman1@yahoo.com
                                  Sounds like an average day of kitesurfing to me... Is there any other way to kitesurf??
                                  Message 16 of 19 , Dec 1, 2001
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                                    Sounds like an average day of kitesurfing to me...
                                    Is there any other way to kitesurf??
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