Loading ...
Sorry, an error occurred while loading the content.

Re: [kitesurf] Kite performance - ridgid vs inflatable

Expand Messages
  • Raul F Argilagos
    Hi! By the way, did anybody find out what the outcome was for the kitesurf portion of the Pistol river wave bash last week? Raul
    Message 1 of 16 , Jul 2, 1998
    • 0 Attachment
      Hi!
      By the way, did anybody find out what the outcome was for the
      kitesurf portion of the Pistol river wave bash last week?
      Raul

      _____________________________________________________________________
      You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail.
      Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com
      Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866]


      ----
      Read this list on the Web at http://www.FindMail.com/list/kitesurf/
      To unsubscribe, email to kitesurf-unsubscribe@...
      To subscribe, email to kitesurf-subscribe@...
      --
      Start a FREE E-Mail List at http://makelist.com !
    • Ian Young
      ... Bruno, I m afraid I disagree with you on several counts. Firstly although I distribute KiteSki in Australia I feel that I am very impartial - as you may
      Message 2 of 16 , Jul 2, 1998
      • 0 Attachment
        > Please don't worry but I think this mail list is not for manufacturers and
        > distributors to make their promotion and specially to talk about
        > competition. You never heard me talking on the net about Kiteski nor
        > comparing these different kites and you will never hear about.
        > Please let us users discussing together.

        Bruno,

        I'm afraid I disagree with you on several counts. Firstly although I
        distribute KiteSki in Australia I feel that I am very impartial - as you
        may recall I also offered to be your agent in Australia but you were the
        one who declined because I also deal in KiteSki!

        I believe that this sport has a great future and I am very keen to see
        it develop through an open discussion of the technical strengths and
        weaknesses of all options within the sport. As I have never had the
        opportunity to try a Wipika I was keen to hear from those who have.

        Although I admire your impressive achievements with Wipika's and
        buggies, my primary interest (and that of this discussion group) is to
        learn through sharing our common interest in kite surfing/ skiing.

        One of my pursuits is to try and make the sport as easy to learn and as
        attractive as possible to a wide audience. The two key components to
        achieving this I believe are to minimise the time spent re-launching the
        kite in deep water and the ability to get back to the point on the beach
        from where you started - hence my questions.

        I hope I do not offend you, but I am still keen to hear the opinions of
        others in this group.

        Cheers,
        Ian

        WinDesigns Australia:
        9 Oliver St, Scarborough, WA, AUSTRALIA, 6019
        Phone/Fax: +61 8 9245 4657
        Mobile: 0414 716 812
        Email: IanYoung@...
        Webpage: http://www.iinet.net.au/~ianyoung/


        ----
        Read this list on the Web at http://www.FindMail.com/list/kitesurf/
        To unsubscribe, email to kitesurf-unsubscribe@...
        To subscribe, email to kitesurf-subscribe@...
        --
        Start a FREE E-Mail List at http://makelist.com !
      • Bruno Legaignoux
        ... OK, I think the Mail Manager and subscribers have to decide. Please guys, tell what you think. Personally it is not my idea of the Internet. People which
        Message 3 of 16 , Jul 2, 1998
        • 0 Attachment
          Terese Roeseler wrote:

          > Bruno wrote:

          > >I think this mail list is not for manufacturers and
          > >distributors to make their promotion and specially to talk about
          > >competition.
          >
          > I disagree Bruno. I think this new ring-thing and makelist.com deal is
          > super, and we should use it in any and every way possible to send get
          > information to the corners of the world via internet.

          OK, I think the Mail Manager and subscribers have to decide. Please
          guys, tell
          what you think.
          Personally it is not my idea of the Internet. People which want
          information
          about my products can visit my site. They are free to go or not.
          I don't want to worry so, promised, this is my last reply about these
          kinds of
          things.

          > I have been trying to organize open kiteski
          > kitesurf competitions since '95 when we met at the ESPN Extreme games where
          > you courageously entered with a Wipika powered sit-ski and unofficially
          > placed 4th behind 3 Kiteskis in very light wind.

          Old memory, isn't it ! Sure that the rule which forbade floating
          boards/boats
          didn't give me the possibility to really compete (not more than 5 liters
          or
          something else)
          Anyhow, this race allowed my first visit of the USA and I made it almost
          freely
          thanks to the price money. Cool!
          As I didn't want to ski (and was not trained), I designed and built a
          seat-ski 3
          weeks before coming.
          Yeah, really a good memory! Thanks for your invitation and welcome.

          > With a soft kite you are left with that mushy feel that wants to pull
          > down-wind. ...on the water.

          Please don't say these kind of things now just from the few experiences
          you had.
          Races will give the answer.
          If we compare paragliders and hang-gliders which are very similar to
          soft kites
          and rigid spar kites: the difference is smaller and smaller between
          them, and
          even when the difference was large, paragliders had a lot more success
          than
          hang-gliders. It doesn't need one quality to make a good product but as
          many
          qualities as possible.

          > We should all acknowledge, however, that Flash won the World Championship
          > Wave-sailing event last year with a 4 line Sky Tiger and a strap surf board.
          > He won it with spirit and vigor, so the specifications of his equipment were
          > meaningless.

          Now he only uses Wipika wings, as Mike Waltze, Sierra Emori, Rush Randle
          and 95%
          of the Hawaiian boys. I met him in May at Maui. He stays on the same
          spot for 2
          hours making tricks and jumps on the waves then going upwind. The jumps
          he makes
          are unbelievable (I will not tell the height because nobody will believe
          me!)
          We are more and more numerous going upwind and I feel the progresses we
          have to
          make are more on the boards than on the kites.
          It is easy to explain why: when I use a parakart (buggy) or a dinghy or
          a trifoiler or any other boat with a good hull and a good centerboard, I
          go upwind just like with any classic dinghy (around 45° on each side of
          the wind - I dinghy raced for 10 years).
          However, the usual Wipika wings are a basic model, very stable and easy
          to fly
          because 99% of the users are entering the sport. Twelve years ago we
          made high
          aspect ratio Wipika type wings and we'll make new ones when the market
          will ask
          for them.

          Best regards
          Bruno

          ========================================================
          WIPIKA - Dominique & Bruno Legaignoux
          26, rue Eugene Boudin - 29000 QUIMPER - FRANCE
          Phone : (33) 2 9890 8379 Fax : (33) 2 9852 1618
          http://www.wipika.com e-mail : wipika@...
          =========================================================




          ----
          Read this list on the Web at http://www.FindMail.com/list/kitesurf/
          To unsubscribe, email to kitesurf-unsubscribe@...
          To subscribe, email to kitesurf-subscribe@...
          --
          Start a FREE E-Mail List at http://makelist.com !
        • Cory Roeseler
          ... You are right. I should get more time on the water with a Wipika wing. Perhaps after the competition on Maui. I was expanding on comments made by Mr.
          Message 4 of 16 , Jul 2, 1998
          • 0 Attachment
            Bruno wrote:
            >Please don't say these kind of things now just from the few experiences
            >you had.

            You are right. I should get more time on the water with a Wipika wing.
            Perhaps after the competition on Maui. I was expanding on comments made by
            Mr. Ness, the star of your instruction video, who responded to the question
            of rigid kite vs inflatable by saying the Wipika is:

            "Not as good you need good sailing technique"

            Bruno wrote:
            >Races will give the answer.

            I agree 100%.

            Bruno wrote:
            >It doesn't need one quality to make a good product but as
            >many
            >qualities as possible.


            Yes!
            >
            >> We should all acknowledge, however, that Flash won the World Championship
            >> Wave-sailing event last year with a 4 line Sky Tiger and a strap surf
            board.
            >> He won it with spirit and vigor, so the specifications of his equipment
            were
            >> meaningless.


            The jumps
            >he makes
            >are unbelievable (I will not tell the height because nobody will believe
            >me!)

            I believe you! Aren't kites great?

            >We are more and more numerous going upwind and I feel the progresses we
            >have to
            >make are more on the boards than on the kites.

            Yes, let's invite the board builders to participate in this discussion.

            Bruno, I hope you are not offended by the points I make. I enjoy a healthy
            debate, and I only engage with those who have earned my respect. You have
            an excellent product and a very impressive list of achievements. Keep up
            the good work and keep the dialogue open.

            Warmest regards,

            Cory



            ----
            Read this list on the Web at http://www.FindMail.com/list/kitesurf/
            To unsubscribe, email to kitesurf-unsubscribe@...
            To subscribe, email to kitesurf-subscribe@...
            --
            Start a FREE E-Mail List at http://makelist.com !
          • Laurent Ness - Axel'Air
            Hello everybody, I think I have to intoduce myself also ! I manage my flysurf kite-shop down south of France. I began flysurfing completely on my own with
            Message 5 of 16 , Jul 3, 1998
            • 0 Attachment
              Hello everybody,

              I think I have to intoduce myself also !
              I manage my flysurf kite-shop down south of France.
              I began flysurfing completely on my own with large delta kites 6 years ago going
              down wind.
              Saw an article in american kite a few years ago and bought the kiteski package.
              I found it too difficult in my wind (too gusty or too light ) and gave up ! I
              used a lot the kiteski mono-board with the deltas.
              Won the 97 french buggy championship and made second at the euro championship.

              I work with Raphael Salles (windsurf champion) on developping special flysurf
              boards since 96.
              3 models available.
              I sell wipika. Maybe the best french retailer. Am I wrong Bruno ?

              If you want to put a face on this lines, have a look at the wipika kite.

              To Ian
              One of my pursuits is to try and make the sport as easy to learn and as

              > attractive as possible to a wide audience. The two key components to
              > achieving this I believe are to minimise the time spent re-launching the
              > kite in deep water and the ability to get back to the point on the beach
              > from where you started - hence my questions.

              Maybe best to send me an e-mail on my private -mail so we talk about all
              that..--
              ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
              Laurent Ness Axel'Air Champion de France 97
              Specialiste Char, Flysurf, Traction...
              rue St Clair 34280 Carnon Ouest
              tel 04 67 50 62 60 fax 04 67 68 54 25
              e-mail: axelair@...
              et bientot .... axelair.com
              ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~




              ----
              Read this list on the Web at http://www.FindMail.com/list/kitesurf/
              To unsubscribe, email to kitesurf-unsubscribe@...
              To subscribe, email to kitesurf-subscribe@...
              --
              Start a FREE E-Mail List at http://makelist.com !
            • Laurent Ness - Axel'Air
              ... PLease let me know, I will believe you ! ... -- ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Laurent Ness Axel Air Champion de France
              Message 6 of 16 , Jul 3, 1998
              • 0 Attachment
                > The jumps
                > >he makes
                > >are unbelievable (I will not tell the height because nobody will believe
                > >me!)

                PLease let me know, I will believe you !

                > Laurent



                --
                ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
                Laurent Ness Axel'Air Champion de France 97
                Specialiste Char, Flysurf, Traction...
                rue St Clair 34280 Carnon Ouest
                tel 04 67 50 62 60 fax 04 67 68 54 25
                e-mail: axelair@...
                et bientot .... axelair.com
                ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~




                ----
                Read this list on the Web at http://www.FindMail.com/list/kitesurf/
                To unsubscribe, email to kitesurf-unsubscribe@...
                To subscribe, email to kitesurf-subscribe@...
                --
                Start a FREE E-Mail List at http://makelist.com !
              • Cory Roeseler
                Laurent, Tell me about your jibe footwork. I noticed in the Wipika video that (in flat water) you walk through the jibe like a windsurfer. Is this the
                Message 7 of 16 , Jul 3, 1998
                • 0 Attachment
                  Laurent,

                  Tell me about your jibe footwork. I noticed in the Wipika video that (in
                  flat water) you "walk" through the jibe like a windsurfer. Is this the
                  technique that you teach to new flysurfers?

                  Cory


                  -----Original Message-----
                  From: Laurent Ness - Axel'Air <axelair@...>
                  To: kitesurf@... <kitesurf@...>
                  Date: Friday, July 03, 1998 1:31 AM
                  Subject: Re: [kitesurf] Kite performance - ridgid vs inflatable


                  >Hello everybody,
                  >
                  >I think I have to intoduce myself also !
                  >I manage my flysurf kite-shop down south of France.
                  >I began flysurfing completely on my own with large delta kites 6 years ago
                  going
                  >down wind.
                  >Saw an article in american kite a few years ago and bought the kiteski
                  package.
                  >I found it too difficult in my wind (too gusty or too light ) and gave up !
                  I
                  >used a lot the kiteski mono-board with the deltas.
                  >Won the 97 french buggy championship and made second at the euro
                  championship.
                  >
                  >I work with Raphael Salles (windsurf champion) on developping special
                  flysurf
                  >boards since 96.
                  >3 models available.
                  >I sell wipika. Maybe the best french retailer. Am I wrong Bruno ?
                  >
                  >If you want to put a face on this lines, have a look at the wipika kite.
                  >
                  >To Ian
                  >One of my pursuits is to try and make the sport as easy to learn and as
                  >
                  >> attractive as possible to a wide audience. The two key components to
                  >> achieving this I believe are to minimise the time spent re-launching the
                  >> kite in deep water and the ability to get back to the point on the beach
                  >> from where you started - hence my questions.
                  >
                  >Maybe best to send me an e-mail on my private -mail so we talk about all
                  >that..--
                  >~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
                  > Laurent Ness Axel'Air Champion de France 97
                  > Specialiste Char, Flysurf, Traction...
                  > rue St Clair 34280 Carnon Ouest
                  > tel 04 67 50 62 60 fax 04 67 68 54 25
                  > e-mail: axelair@...
                  > et bientot .... axelair.com
                  >~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  >----
                  >Read this list on the Web at http://www.FindMail.com/list/kitesurf/
                  >To unsubscribe, email to kitesurf-unsubscribe@...
                  >To subscribe, email to kitesurf-subscribe@...
                  >--
                  >Start a FREE E-Mail List at http://makelist.com !



                  ----
                  Read this list on the Web at http://www.FindMail.com/list/kitesurf/
                  To unsubscribe, email to kitesurf-unsubscribe@...
                  To subscribe, email to kitesurf-subscribe@...
                  --
                  Start a FREE E-Mail List at http://makelist.com !
                • Rolf V. Oestergaard
                  Hi, Don t forget to support the new web index NewHoo at www.newhoo.com with comments and sugestions. They now have a growing kitesailing subject under sports.
                  Message 8 of 16 , Jul 3, 1998
                  • 0 Attachment
                    Hi,

                    Don't forget to support the new web index NewHoo at www.newhoo.com with
                    comments and sugestions. They now have a growing kitesailing subject under
                    sports.

                    Have fun,

                    -=-=-
                    Rolf V. Østergaard, Stockholmsgade 21.2.th, DK-2100 Kbh. Ø, Denmark
                    mailto:rolf@... http://www.godset.dk/kiteski Tel: +45 3525 1330




                    ----
                    Read this list on the Web at http://www.FindMail.com/list/kitesurf/
                    To unsubscribe, email to kitesurf-unsubscribe@...
                    To subscribe, email to kitesurf-subscribe@...
                    --
                    Start a FREE E-Mail List at http://makelist.com !
                  • Laurent Ness - Axel'Air
                    ... First you take the back footstrap out, second you push on your toesThen you jibe and when you are backside you can make a small jump or walk. Either
                    Message 9 of 16 , Jul 3, 1998
                    • 0 Attachment
                      Cory Roeseler wrote:

                      > Laurent,
                      >
                      > Tell me about your jibe footwork. I noticed in the Wipika video that (in
                      > flat water) you "walk" through the jibe like a windsurfer. Is this the
                      > technique that you teach to new flysurfers?
                      >
                      > Cory
                      >
                      > ---

                      First you take the back footstrap out, second you push on your toesThen you jibe
                      and when you are backside you can make a small jump or walk. Either technique
                      works.
                      ~~~~~~~~
                      Laurent
                      Today 20 knots but I go for lessons can't sail too much
                      myself~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~




                      ----
                      Read this list on the Web at http://www.FindMail.com/list/kitesurf/
                      To unsubscribe, email to kitesurf-unsubscribe@...
                      To subscribe, email to kitesurf-subscribe@...
                      --
                      Start a FREE E-Mail List at http://makelist.com !
                    • drpearce@bigpond.com
                      I started off using action foils, and i found that they were very hard to land in the water even when you do eat shit. I fyou have good control when you go
                      Message 10 of 16 , Nov 3, 2000
                      • 0 Attachment
                        I started off using action foils, and i found that they were very
                        hard to land in the water even when you do eat shit. I fyou have
                        good control when you go down, they seem to sit up there and follow
                        you. To right though when they hit the water, hard to get up, unless
                        you actually act quick and no waves present. I now fly cquads and
                        they are great, water relaunching is not easy. Once again, if it
                        goes straight in top or bottom pretty easy. But i still find through
                        reading and watching, not many kites are easyto relaunch from water,
                        actually none are. Until we get some science in realuanching with a
                        bitton, we shall just have to fly much more efficient, and dont
                        forget everyone eats shit at some time.....












                        --- In kitesurf@egroups.com, Ian Young <IanYoung@i...> wrote:
                        > How have people found the comparitive upwind performance of kites
                        with
                        > inflatable leading edges such as the "Wipika" compared with
                        > ridgid frame kites?
                        >
                        > How much success have people had relaunching inflatable kites from
                        the
                        > water, particularly if they are two line kites?
                        >
                        > Cheers,
                        > Ian Young
                        >
                        > WinDesigns Australia:
                        > 9 Oliver St, Scarborough, WA, AUSTRALIA, 6019
                        > Phone/Fax: +61 8 9245 4657
                        > Mobile: 0414 716 812
                        > Email: IanYoung@i...
                        > Webpage: http://www.iinet.net.au/~ianyoung/
                        >
                        > Army:
                        > Phone: +61 8 9383 0660
                        > Fax: +61 8 9383 0593
                        >
                        >
                        > ----
                        > Read this list on the Web at http://www.FindMail.com/list/kitesurf/
                        > To unsubscribe, email to kitesurf-unsubscribe@...
                        > To subscribe, email to kitesurf-subscribe@...
                        > --
                        > Start a FREE E-Mail List at http://makelist.com !
                      Your message has been successfully submitted and would be delivered to recipients shortly.