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[ksurf] Re: RSVP: Kite or Board

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  • Raphaël
    Actually both... Raphael Baruch www.Kitesurf.com ... eGroup home: http://www.eGroups.com/list/kitesurf Free Web-based e-mail groups by eGroups.com
    Message 1 of 16 , Mar 3 4:49 AM
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      Actually both...

      Raphael Baruch
      www.Kitesurf.com

      > -----Original Message-----
      > From: henning.carstens@... [mailto:henning.carstens@...]
      > Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 1999 6:44 AM
      > To: kitesurf@egroups.com
      > Subject: [ksurf] RSVP: Kite or Board
      >
      >
      > Which design has to be pushed?
      > Kiteboard or Kite
      >
      > ----
      >
      > Please select one of the following:
      >
      > o Kiteboard
      > o Kite
      >
      >
      > by going to the following Web form:
      >
      > http://www.egroups.com/vote?id=920461459736
      >
      > Thank you!
      >
      > ------------------------------------------------------------------------
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    • Debra Smith and Paul Watson
      ... Although I have voted for boards, I only think that this is a short term priority. I think that we should work out whether we might be able to sail upwind
      Message 2 of 16 , Mar 3 6:36 PM
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        >> Which design has to be pushed?
        >> Kiteboard or Kite

        Although I have voted for boards, I only think that this is a short term
        priority. I think that we should work out whether we might be able to sail
        upwind on fins rather than rails (i.e. is this a question of board design or
        the mechanics of surfing with a kite?). In the longer term we need to work
        on kites in order to achieve consistent water relaunching a la windsurfing.
        Although the Wipika works very well, one kite does not a sport make! We will
        need to adequately assess the quad versus dual line issue as well as the
        winch versus auto relaunch issue. Who knows what may come in terms of
        development? One thing is for sure, parafoils are a short term option.
        Although I am considering making a "water relaunchable" version of one of my
        stable of personal parafoil designs, I think that this will not be anything
        other than a short term answer (although I think we can still improve
        parafoils a few degrees). I think that inflatable tubes and single surface
        still loom large on the list of necessary characteristics.

        Smooth Winds,

        Paul



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      • Ian Young
        ... Kiteboard or Kite ... Please select one of the following: o Kiteboard o Kite ... I believe that we will see significant developments in both, however I
        Message 3 of 16 , Mar 4 4:04 AM
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          Which design has to be pushed?
          Kiteboard or Kite
          
          ----
          
          Please select one of the following:
          
             o Kiteboard
             o Kite
          I believe that we will see significant developments in both, however I believe that the kite systems (including control bar/ 2vs 4 line, etc) have far more room for improvement in the following areas:
          • re-launchability from the water
          • ease of control/ stability when no pilot input
          • rapid turning response with pilot input
          • safety/ ease of unassisted take-off and landings on the beach
          • ability for variable de-power ie 100% - 75% - 50% - 25%
          Cheers for now,
          Ian

          WinDesigns Australia - Australia's first Kite Ski&Surfing School
          9 Oliver St, Scarborough, WA, AUSTRALIA, 6019
          Phone/Fax:    +61 8 9245 4657
          Mobile:       0414 716 812
          Email:        IanYoung@...
          Webpage:      http://www.iinet.net.au/~ianyoung/
           


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        • CKirks@aol.com
          In a message dated 3/3/99 11:11:30 PM Pacific Standard Time, algen@netexcel.net.au writes:
          Message 4 of 16 , Mar 4 1:53 PM
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            In a message dated 3/3/99 11:11:30 PM Pacific Standard Time,
            algen@... writes:

            << I think that inflatable tubes and single surface still loom large on the
            list of necessary characteristics. >>

            Your "single surface" reminded me that while I was flying my loaner Wipika 3.5
            the other day, a fellow board sailor mentioned that it should improve the
            aerodynamics to simply add a short lower surface near the leading edge like
            some sailboard sails have (wide luff sleeve on race sails). In other words,
            streamline the leading edge tube with a piece of cloth from it's lower side to
            the kite body about a foot back or so.

            Tom
            Captain Kirk's

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          • Alex Gillan
            Yea ... I thought the same Alex Gillan ... From: CKirks@aol.com To: kitesurf@egroups.com Date: Friday, 5 March 1999
            Message 5 of 16 , Mar 4 2:07 PM
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              Yea ... I thought the same


              Alex Gillan


              -----Original Message-----
              From: CKirks@... <CKirks@...>
              To: kitesurf@egroups.com <kitesurf@egroups.com>
              Date: Friday, 5 March 1999 8:54
              Subject: [ksurf] Re: RSVP: Kite or Board


              >In a message dated 3/3/99 11:11:30 PM Pacific Standard Time,
              >algen@... writes:
              >
              ><< I think that inflatable tubes and single surface still loom large on the
              >list of necessary characteristics. >>
              >
              >Your "single surface" reminded me that while I was flying my loaner Wipika
              3.5
              >the other day, a fellow board sailor mentioned that it should improve the
              >aerodynamics to simply add a short lower surface near the leading edge like
              >some sailboard sails have (wide luff sleeve on race sails). In other
              words,
              >streamline the leading edge tube with a piece of cloth from it's lower side
              to
              >the kite body about a foot back or so.
              >
              >Tom
              >Captain Kirk's
              >
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            • CKirks@aol.com
              In a message dated 3/3/99 3:45:06 AM Pacific Standard Time, henning.carstens@hdw.de writes:
              Message 6 of 16 , Mar 8 5:45 PM
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                In a message dated 3/3/99 3:45:06 AM Pacific Standard Time,
                henning.carstens@... writes:

                << Which design has to be pushed? Kiteboard or Kite- Please select one by
                going to the following Web form: http://www.egroups.com/vote?id=920461459736
                >>

                Well, I decided to finally register my vote for "BOARD" (now that my
                speed/upwind-on-fin suspicions have been confirmed by srosso@...) but
                could not get the full form at the above address.

                Tom
                Captain Kirk's

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              • F.ONE
                Hi your guys , I m just back from the kitesurfing event in Cabo Verde . The event will run one more week but I could not stay so long , too much work ! Flash
                Message 7 of 16 , Mar 9 3:18 AM
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                  Hi your guys ,
                  I'm just back from the kitesurfing event in Cabo Verde .
                  The event will run one more week but I could not stay so long , too much
                  work !

                  Flash was sick in bed for all the week so he could not sail , too bad !

                  We did some long distance races with down wind and up wind .
                  And it was a good experience to test all kind of combination .
                  I could see that the board is really important as a point where a guy with a
                  really good parafoil wing could finish behind a Wipika if is using the wrong
                  board !
                  Also between the racers using the same Wipika they where big differences in
                  the results , depending the board they use .

                  As I'm today one of the only one to shape my boards and co-design my kite ,
                  I will say that the kite is really important because this is the engine but
                  what is a good engine without a good board ?
                  We had the same discution in windsurfing and I will say that boards should
                  be abble to follow the performances of the rig .

                  So boards are as important as the kites and only the perfect combination
                  will give you the best result .

                  We can use the same kite for different activity but with different boards :
                  surfboard type , wakeboard , longboard , water ski , snowboard , buggy
                  ......
                  Today we have to work on all these differents way to use the power of a kite
                  on the water , sand or snow .
                  So we a lot of work on the boards .

                  See you on water
                  Raphaël Salles




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                • Michel Montmigny
                  ... eGroup home: http://www.eGroups.com/list/kitesurf Free Web-based e-mail groups by eGroups.com
                  Message 8 of 16 , Mar 9 6:59 AM
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                    henning.carstens@... wrote:
                    >
                    > Which design has to be pushed?
                    >
                    > Kiteboard or Kite
                    >
                    > ----
                    >
                    > Please select one of the following:
                    >
                    > **o Kiteboard
                    > o Kite
                    >
                    > by going to the following Web form:
                    >
                    > http://www.egroups.com/vote?id=920461459736
                    >
                    > Thank you!
                    >
                    > ----------------------------------------------------------------------
                    > [Image]
                    >
                    > eGroup home: http://www.eGroups.com/list/kitesurf
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                  • stefano.rosso@iname.com
                    ... Hello Raphael, Please let us know more about the event when it ends...and maybe pictures !! I agree with your comments... a wipika with a GOOD board can go
                    Message 9 of 16 , Mar 9 7:05 AM
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                      > So boards are as important as the kites and only the perfect combination
                      > will give you the best result .
                      >
                      > We can use the same kite for different activity but with different boards :
                      > surfboard type , wakeboard , longboard , water ski , snowboard , buggy
                      > ......
                      > Today we have to work on all these differents way to use the power of a kite
                      > on the water , sand or snow .
                      > So we a lot of work on the boards .
                      >
                      > See you on water
                      > Rapha�l Salles
                      >

                      Hello Raphael,

                      Please let us know more about the event when it ends...and maybe pictures !!

                      I agree with your comments... a wipika with a GOOD board can go upwind better than a higher upwind kite on a bad board...

                      Please tell us more about what boards and kites where being used !

                      Stefano

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                    • Kukanii@aol.com
                      Hi Raphiel Good to here from you cant wate to get on the water . Verry interesting what you are saying about the boards ? Hopr to see you next week. Darron ...
                      Message 10 of 16 , Mar 9 7:08 AM
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                        Hi Raphiel

                        Good to here from you cant wate to get on the water .
                        Verry interesting what you are saying about the boards ?
                        Hopr to see you next week.

                        Darron

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                      • F.ONE
                        ... Hi Stephano , For kites : Wipika , Concept Air and F.one where present . For boards : Wipika protoypes , MGO , Manu Bertin prototypes , F.one . We where
                        Message 11 of 16 , Mar 9 11:12 AM
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                          >Please tell us more about what boards and kites where being used !
                          >
                          >Stefano


                          Hi Stephano ,
                          For kites : Wipika , Concept Air and F.one where present .
                          For boards : Wipika protoypes , MGO , Manu Bertin prototypes , F.one .

                          We where only 8 racers and 2 or 3 where sick in bed so we could not make any
                          wave event .

                          We did 2 long distances with down and up wind :
                          I was first in the 2 long distances by far , my time was 20 mm and second
                          place was 30 mm .
                          I use my new 212 prototype in waves and long distance .

                          See you on water
                          Raphaël Salles



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                        • srosso@bunge.com.br
                          I use my new 212 prototype in waves and long distance . Raphael What kites size were used and what wind conditions were there ?? Will there be pictures ?
                          Message 12 of 16 , Mar 9 1:21 PM
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                            I use my new 212 prototype in waves and long distance .

                            Raphael

                            What kites size were used and what wind conditions were there ?? Will
                            there be pictures ? Video ?



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                          • F.ONE
                            ... Hi , Condition where 25 knots with 1.5 to 2 m waves and then dropping the last days to 10 to 15 knots . I use my 5.0 m² and my 6.5m² . Depending on
                            Message 13 of 16 , Mar 10 1:28 AM
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                              >What kites size were used and what wind conditions were there ?? Will
                              >there be pictures ? Video ?


                              Hi ,
                              Condition where 25 knots with 1.5 to 2 m waves and then dropping the last
                              days to 10 to 15 knots .
                              I use my 5.0 m² and my 6.5m² .
                              Depending on weight of racers 3.5m² to 8.5m² wipika and 3.3m² to 6m² Concept
                              Air where used .

                              My board and kite combination allow me to have a much bigger wind range ,
                              where I use 2 sizes other racers need 3 different surfaces .

                              The first goal of this was to make pictures and video so we had one
                              photografer and 3 cameras . a special video will be made on this event .

                              See you on water
                              Raphaël Salles


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                            • Ian Young
                              G day Raphael, ... What distances? ... Give us some specifics. Cheers for now, Ian WinDesigns Australia - Australia s first Kite Ski&Surfing School 9 Oliver
                              Message 14 of 16 , Mar 10 3:52 AM
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                                G'day Raphael,
                                 
                                >We did some long distance races with down wind and up wind .
                                What distances?

                                >I could see that the board is really important as a point where a guy

                                with a
                                >really good parafoil wing could finish behind a Wipika if is using the
                                wrong
                                >board !

                                Give us some specifics.

                                Cheers for now,
                                Ian

                                WinDesigns Australia - Australia's first Kite Ski&Surfing School
                                9 Oliver St, Scarborough, WA, AUSTRALIA, 6019
                                Phone/Fax:    +61 8 9245 4657
                                Mobile:       0414 716 812
                                Email:        IanYoung@...
                                Webpage:      http://www.iinet.net.au/~ianyoung/
                                 


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                              • F.ONE
                                G day Ian , What distances? We count it in time , I do not know the exact distance , my time was 20mm but was 40 mm for the last racer and we where only 6
                                Message 15 of 16 , Mar 10 7:57 AM
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                                  G'day Ian , 
                                  What distances?
                                  We count it in time , I do not know the exact distance , my time was 20mm but was 40 mm for the last racer and we where only 6 racers . This will be the problem if we want to do some long distance races , specialy with upwind . Down wind the differences where smaller .
                                  About boards , they where big differences with the boards . It was easy to see because racers where changing boards in each races . Also in between the Wipika racers using different boards , result where differents .
                                  I think that racing is also experience and not only equipment . 
                                  See you on water
                                  Raphaël Salles 

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