Re: The Ethical and the Moral and a sense of FOUNDNESS
- I'm not going to 'call you' anything at this time, because I don't
REALLY know you, and you DON'T really know me. Sola
--- In firstname.lastname@example.org, "signal to noise"
> If we are 'sourced' in GOD, we are sourced in THE ETERNAL, we came
> DIRECTLY, not indirectly, from THE CREATOR. It is our 'perceptual'
> distance from Him that causes us problems. We are distracted
> by 'where we are' and so, because of subjectivity, we confuse 'where
> we are' with who we are. In a word, we are lost, and BEING ALWAYS
> SOUGHT BY AND FOUND AGAIN by God. Amazing Grace, how sweet the
> that saved a wretch like me, I once was lost but now I'm found, wasus
> blind but now I see.........what a hymn! That is what poetry and
> music can elicit.......a SENSE of 'foundness' in God. Beauty makes
> remember! I will give to you AN ADVOCATE......that advocate is THEseriously,
> HOLY SPIRIT.......the Holy Spirit is what we need to TUNE INTO, to
> draw us away from our lostness in subjectivity; time and place. The
> Holy Spirit will lead our high natures toward our returning to our
> source, and then we will no longer 'feel' lost.
> another point where SK and me diverge...he takes the bible so
> literallyis into
> my 'leap' is riddled with doubt and uncertainty, but then, my leap
> the indefinable and irreducible thing that is God...the church, thebible,
> has nothing at all to do with itand no
> jesus was one hell of a radical, but he was just a man
> the holy spirit: a metaphor
> God is God is God...only one...it needs no worship, no mediation,
> all it wants from me is my attention, as in 'pay attention, stupid!'
> call me deist it you like...i can live with it
> thing is: i'm not a wretch...not a 'sinner'...not lost and looking
> salvation...i am exactly what and where i'm supposed to beyour your
> either i'm right or i'm wrong (either/or...HA!) but YOU gotta make
> choices...they define you...i choose to walk, not crawl...i chooseto face
> God, not bow in submissionHotmail.
> how's that for hubris?
> Catch suspicious messages before you open themwith Windows Live
- --- In email@example.com, "James Rovira"
Jim R., Don't understand what you mean that "freedom is posible".
God is decidely not a paradox self-consciously given. We would have
to understand what freedom is prior to claiming it exists. Our
understanding of God is something willed that is a change in
ourselves, and not the other way around. There isn't a change in
ourselves that creates our understanding of God, or a sense of our
understanding of freedom. Bill
As Kierkegaard writes, there is
"passion for a paradox not a search for understanding that inspires
that leap" (Philosophical Fragments, p. 37 ff)".
As I've written before, I don't think you understand what Kierkegaard
is about, since you lack any experience of what he describing. Bill
> Bill -- I don't think the incarnation moves us toward understandingthe
> totality of what God has created so much as brought God down to ourfinitude
> so that we can comprehend what we need to know of him, and so thatfreedom
> is possible -- rather than just being overwhelmed with a Divinevision.
> Kierkegaard --or at least Climacus in CUP -- makes quite a bit deal
> fact that we never escape our own finitude, that our understandingof "it
> all" is always from within it all and not above it all. So we never40yahoogroups.com>,
> comprehend any totality. That is reserved for God.
> Jim R
> On 6/9/07, Bill <billybob98103@...> wrote:
> > --- In firstname.lastname@example.org<kierkegaardians%
> > "James Rovira"could
> > <jamesrovira@> wrote:
> > Jim R., I'm a bit confused, since if God becomes human then we
> > believe that God gives us the will to understand him, and that hehas
> > no needs because he created for himself our understanding of him?In
> > fact, the idea of being forgiven for sin is possibly his attemptto
> > relieve us of the burden of our own limited understanding.that
> > Of course this belief in our ability to understand the totality of
> > what God created is dependent on the idea of freedom. It is this
> > gives us the ability to decide what it is that God created.what
> > Otherwise, why would we as Kierkegaard describe our existence as
> > we "strive" to understand? Thanks for your helpful insights, asthey
> > usually are.
> > Bill