Loading ...
Sorry, an error occurred while loading the content.

Re: [json] Re: json date format 2006-12-03T13:56:21

Expand Messages
  • Kevin Prichard
    ... Keep in mind that the Javascript date class/objects have methods for setting and getting time in milliseconds (and new Date() constructors can also
    Message 1 of 12 , Dec 4, 2006
    View Source
    • 0 Attachment
      On 12/4/06, Jon Meyer <jonmeyer@...> wrote:
      > Milliseconds don't seem that critical

      Keep in mind that the Javascript date class/objects have methods for setting
      and getting time in milliseconds (and 'new Date()' constructors can also
      assigns milliseconds.) Excluding milliseconds might be, for some
      applications, the equivalent of truncating floats to ints.

      On 12/4/06, Jon Meyer <jonmeyer@...> wrote:
      >
      > Milliseconds don't seem that critical, but what about generating UTC
      > and appending a "Z"? i.e.
      >
      > return '"' + x.getFullYearUTC() + '-' +
      > f(x.getMonthUTC() + 1) + '-' +
      > f(x.getDateUTC()) + 'T' +
      > f(x.getHoursUTC()) + ':' +
      > f(x.getMinutesUTC()) + ':' +
      > "Z"
      >
      > How would the server know what the time means otherwise?
      >
      > Cheers
      >
      > Jon
      >
      >


      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • Peter Michaux
      ... This is what I was thinking. Milliseconds could be important at times and seems unfortunate to throw them out if there is no reason. Peter
      Message 2 of 12 , Dec 4, 2006
      View Source
      • 0 Attachment
        On 12/4/06, Kevin Prichard <kprichard@...> wrote:
        >
        > On 12/4/06, Jon Meyer <jonmeyer@...> wrote:
        > > Milliseconds don't seem that critical
        >
        > Keep in mind that the Javascript date class/objects have methods for setting
        > and getting time in milliseconds (and 'new Date()' constructors can also
        > assigns milliseconds.) Excluding milliseconds might be, for some
        > applications, the equivalent of truncating floats to ints.
        >

        This is what I was thinking. Milliseconds could be important at times
        and seems unfortunate to throw them out if there is no reason.

        Peter
      • Gaetano Giunta
        afaik, jsonrpc uses a variant of ISO without millliseconds. also, for most databases, the standard date and time fields omit milliseconds (a timestamp value is
        Message 3 of 12 , Dec 5, 2006
        View Source
        • 0 Attachment
          afaik, jsonrpc uses a variant of ISO without millliseconds.
          also, for most databases, the standard date and time fields omit milliseconds (a timestamp value is used for that)


          -----Original Message-----
          From: json@yahoogroups.com [mailto:json@yahoogroups.com]On Behalf Of Peter Michaux
          Sent: Sunday, December 03, 2006 11:38 PM
          To: json@yahoogroups.com
          Subject: Re: [json] json date format 2006-12-03T13:56:21


          Hi Martin,

          On 12/3/06, Martin Cooper <mfncooper@...> wrote:
          >
          > On 12/3/06, Peter Michaux <petermichaux@...> wrote:

          > >
          > > A date object is converted to the following format
          > >
          > > 2006-12-03T13:56:21
          > >
          > > Is this an international standard time representation?
          >
          > Yep. It's defined by ISO 8601. There's a summary of that here:
          >
          > http://www.iso.org/iso/en/prods-services/popstds/datesandtime.html

          Thanks for the link

          > I don't think it has a provision for milliseconds, but I could be wrong.

          It looks like it does. From that link

          The standard has provisions for:
          (1) the omission of components representing smaller units
          (seconds, minutes), where such precision is not needed,
          (2) the addition of a decimal fraction to the smallest time unit
          where higher precision is needed.

          Perhaps the Json code could be changed to

          return '"' + x.getFullYear() + '-' +
          f(x.getMonth() + 1) + '-' +
          f(x.getDate()) + 'T' +
          f(x.getHours()) + ':' +
          f(x.getMinutes()) + ':' +
          f(x.getSeconds()) + '.' +
          f(x.getMilliseconds()) + '"';

          There could be other reasons for excluding the milliseconds. Perhaps
          some of the systems with which json is intended to facilitate data
          transmission cannot handle milliseconds?

          Thanks,
          Peter




          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • Peter Michaux
          ... Douglas, is there a particular reason for not including milliseconds in json.js? Thanks, Peter -- Fork JavaScript: http://forkjavascript.org
          Message 4 of 12 , Jan 6, 2007
          View Source
          • 0 Attachment
            On 12/4/06, Peter Michaux <petermichaux@...> wrote:
            >
            > This is what I was thinking. Milliseconds could be important at times
            > and seems unfortunate to throw them out if there is no reason.

            Douglas, is there a particular reason for not including milliseconds in json.js?

            Thanks,
            Peter
            --
            Fork JavaScript: http://forkjavascript.org
          • Douglas Crockford
            ... in json.js? You have the source, you can put them in any time you want to. But first, let me ask you a question: How confident that your system s clock has
            Message 5 of 12 , Jan 6, 2007
            View Source
            • 0 Attachment
              > Douglas, is there a particular reason for not including milliseconds
              in json.js?

              You have the source, you can put them in any time you want to. But
              first, let me ask you a question: How confident that your system's
              clock has millisecond accuracy? And that the latency of the OS +
              Browser + JavaScript will not cause significant drift by the time it
              is delivered to your application? How meaningful will the milliseconds
              be when you put them on the wire and send them to your server, whose
              clock is not in sync with yours? Milliseconds are a waste of time.

              There are applications, such as video editing, where subsecond
              accuracy is important. If you have such an application, then you would
              want to tack on frames or fractional seconds. If you don't really need
              it, then it is better to not deceive yourself with false precision.
            • Peter Michaux
              ... I m sorry for bothering you, sir. Thank you for your answer. I ll go back to my corner now. Peter
              Message 6 of 12 , Jan 6, 2007
              View Source
              • 0 Attachment
                On 1/6/07, Douglas Crockford <douglas@...> wrote:
                >
                > > Douglas, is there a particular reason for not including milliseconds
                > in json.js?
                >
                > You have the source, you can put them in any time you want to. But
                > first, let me ask you a question: How confident that your system's
                > clock has millisecond accuracy? And that the latency of the OS +
                > Browser + JavaScript will not cause significant drift by the time it
                > is delivered to your application? How meaningful will the milliseconds
                > be when you put them on the wire and send them to your server, whose
                > clock is not in sync with yours? Milliseconds are a waste of time.

                I'm sorry for bothering you, sir. Thank you for your answer. I'll go
                back to my corner now.

                Peter
              • Peter Michaux
                ... A date object is not necessarily constructed with no arguments sent to the Date constructor. It could very well be that in some applications the
                Message 7 of 12 , Jan 10, 2007
                View Source
                • 0 Attachment
                  On 1/6/07, Douglas Crockford <douglas@...> wrote:
                  >
                  > > Douglas, is there a particular reason for not including milliseconds
                  > in json.js?
                  >
                  > You have the source, you can put them in any time you want to. But
                  > first, let me ask you a question: How confident that your system's
                  > clock has millisecond accuracy? And that the latency of the OS +
                  > Browser + JavaScript will not cause significant drift by the time it
                  > is delivered to your application? How meaningful will the milliseconds
                  > be when you put them on the wire and send them to your server, whose
                  > clock is not in sync with yours? Milliseconds are a waste of time.

                  A date object is not necessarily constructed with no arguments sent to
                  the Date constructor. It could very well be that in some applications
                  the construction of the Date object could use date data from a user
                  input which has very accurate and critical milliseconds information
                  from another very accurate system.

                  Peter
                • geoffreyk00
                  ... milliseconds ... But ... system s ... time it ... milliseconds ... whose ... time. ... sent to ... applications ... The date object may be historical data
                  Message 8 of 12 , Jan 11, 2007
                  View Source
                  • 0 Attachment
                    --- In json@yahoogroups.com, "Peter Michaux" <petermichaux@...>
                    wrote:
                    >
                    > On 1/6/07, Douglas Crockford <douglas@...> wrote:
                    > >
                    > > > Douglas, is there a particular reason for not including
                    milliseconds
                    > > in json.js?
                    > >
                    > > You have the source, you can put them in any time you want to.
                    But
                    > > first, let me ask you a question: How confident that your
                    system's
                    > > clock has millisecond accuracy? And that the latency of the OS +
                    > > Browser + JavaScript will not cause significant drift by the
                    time it
                    > > is delivered to your application? How meaningful will the
                    milliseconds
                    > > be when you put them on the wire and send them to your server,
                    whose
                    > > clock is not in sync with yours? Milliseconds are a waste of
                    time.
                    >
                    > A date object is not necessarily constructed with no arguments
                    sent to
                    > the Date constructor. It could very well be that in some
                    applications
                    > the construction of the Date object could use date data from a user
                    > input which has very accurate and critical milliseconds information
                    > from another very accurate system.
                    >
                    > Peter
                    >

                    The date object may be historical data that truly is millisecond-
                    accurate. The object does not have to be constructed when the
                    dataset is created or by the server that is delivering the dataset.
                    I more likely will have been created long before, with many date
                    objects that do need this level of accuracy.

                    I can see no reason to not to include milliseconds, and many reasons
                    to keep them.
                  Your message has been successfully submitted and would be delivered to recipients shortly.