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Neo Air

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  • skypilots5
    I ll 2nd the glories of the neo air. Best new product out last year. I combined mine with my Big Agnes Mystic - slid ii into the pad sleeve, and never took it
    Message 1 of 9 , Feb 1, 2010
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      I'll 2nd the glories of the neo air. Best new product out last year.
      I combined mine with my Big Agnes Mystic - slid ii into the pad sleeve, and never took it out. Just rolled up the pad along with the sleeping bag. reduced clutter in my pack, and it stayed extra protected.
    • Barb
      How about durability? It sure seems thin and subject to easy puncture. Thoughts? Sent from my iPhone
      Message 2 of 9 , Feb 1, 2010
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        How about durability? It sure seems thin and subject to easy puncture. Thoughts?

        Sent from my iPhone

        On Feb 1, 2010, at 9:00 PM, "skypilots5" <skypilots5@...> wrote:

         

        I'll 2nd the glories of the neo air. Best new product out last year.
        I combined mine with my Big Agnes Mystic - slid ii into the pad sleeve, and never took it out. Just rolled up the pad along with the sleeping bag. reduced clutter in my pack, and it stayed extra protected.

        =
      • Curtis
        It s actually quite durable as long as you aren t careless. Clear your sleeping area, and use a tarp under it and it should be good to go
        Message 3 of 9 , Feb 1, 2010
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          It's actually quite durable as long as you aren't careless. Clear your sleeping area, and use a tarp under it and it should be good to go
        • ed_rodriguez52@yahoo.com
          That true with any thermo-rest but I always carry a patch kit. I make sure my tent has a foot print so far haven t had one leak on me. Sent on the Sprint® Now
          Message 4 of 9 , Feb 1, 2010
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            That true with any thermo-rest but I always carry a patch kit. I make sure my tent has a foot print so far haven't had one leak on me.

            Sent on the Sprint® Now Network from my BlackBerry®


            From: Barb <bgomoll@...>
            Date: Mon, 1 Feb 2010 21:06:52 -0500
            To: johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com<johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com>
            Subject: Re: [John Muir Trail] Neo Air

             

            How about durability? It sure seems thin and subject to easy puncture. Thoughts?

            Sent from my iPhone

            On Feb 1, 2010, at 9:00 PM, "skypilots5" <skypilots5@yahoo. com> wrote:

             

            I'll 2nd the glories of the neo air. Best new product out last year.
            I combined mine with my Big Agnes Mystic - slid ii into the pad sleeve, and never took it out. Just rolled up the pad along with the sleeping bag. reduced clutter in my pack, and it stayed extra protected.

            =
          • John Ladd
            I share Barb s concern about the durability of the Neo Air, but I nevertheless love it. I find it extremely comfortable. I need to be on my side to fall
            Message 5 of 9 , Feb 2, 2010
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              I share Barb's concern about the durability of the Neo Air, but I nevertheless love it.  I find it extremely comfortable.  I need to be on my side to fall asleep, so it works much better for me than a regular ThermaRest ProLite or closed cell pad (which are OK for back sleepers but hard on side sleepers.)

              So far I've only used it as an addtitional pad on top of a closed cell pad like a Ridge Crest

              I put the closed cell pad on the ground in lieu of a groundsheet, then my bivy and the Neo Air in the bivy.  I always carry the neoAir in it's stuffsack and I baby it a lot.  Under these circumstances, it's worked OK for me, but I don't have enough of a "history" with it to fully trust it.  Three trips over the last 9 months for a total of about 20 days without a problem.

              It doesn't insulate you from the cold underneath you as well as a ProLite type pad, but it does give some insulation.  I recently took it for several nights down to 15 degrees and it was fine combined with the closed cell pad. (These conditions generally require two pads.) I was expecting to have to combine the closed-cell pad with the ProLite, but the  closed cell and the NeoAir worked just fine.

              I talked to the most experienced staffer at my local SF REI and he said that they had some returns of delaminated or punctured NeoAirs since they started selling them this summer.  But he says he thinks that the product may have been misused.  He's cautiously recommending it, if used with great care.

              I think I'm ready to carry it without the closed-cell.  The problem I'm worried about is that it looks fragile, and if it springs a leak, it will provide almost no insulation value from the ground cold.  Something like a ProLite would have at least some insulation value even if it springs a leak, but not the NeoAir.

              Therm-A-Rest does supply a field repair kit, but REI doesn't stock it.  It's called "Fast & Light" repair kit.  If you Google-shopping "Thermarest fast light repair" (without the quotes) you will find places where you can order it online for about $8 plus shipping.  I don't think I'd be willing to carry the NeoAir as my exclusive protection from loss of heat to the ground unless I carried a repair kit.

              Here's a description of the repair kit:

              "This kit includes all you need to make fast, permanent repairs to your Therm-a-Rest mattress in the field. It features as assortment of pre-cut nylon patches, an applicator, and the same HotBond adhesive that we use in our repair shop. Best of all, the adhesive works in cold and wet conditions and cures very quickly, so your mattress is ready to use again in just 10 minutes."

              One site selling the kit is:

              http://www.sunnysports.com/prod/TARRKFL.html?ci_src=14110944&ci_sku=TARRKFL

              Note:  I have no experience with this vendor.

              Therm-A-Rest has a good FAQ page which includes information on how to repair its products:

              http://www.cascadedesigns.com/Therm-A-Rest/FAQ

              Related info for those of you considering the NeoAIr

              From the Thermarest site:

              The NeoAir mattress is one of only 18 products awarded in 2009 in “one of the strongest groups ever” with the prestigious Backpacker Magazine Editors’ Choice Award for outstanding innovation in design, materials and performance.

              The NeoAir sleeping mattress and technology was awarded the American Alpine Institute’s Guide’s Choice seal in 2009 after extensive field testing. The seal recognizes products that are outstanding in their class and distinguished by their design and workmanship.

              R-value: 2.5 (better than most air-filled, but less than closed-cell or foam-filled inflatables like the ProLite series)

              weight: 9 oz. and up, depending on size (availabel in small, medium, regular and large sizes)

              size when packed: a roll as small as 9 inches long by 3.3 inch diameter, depending on size of mat - about the size of a 1-liter Nalgene water bottle

              http://www.cascadedesigns.com/Therm-A-Rest/Mattresses/Fast-And-Light/NeoAir/product

              John Curran Ladd
              1616 Castro Street
              San Francisco, CA  94114-3707
              415-648-9279



            • First L
              I have the Big Agnes Insulated Pad. This Neo would shave a full pound off my load and money is not a problem. Is the Agnes a better or worse insulator and is
              Message 6 of 9 , Feb 2, 2010
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                I have the Big Agnes Insulated Pad. This Neo would shave a full pound off my load and money is not a problem. Is the Agnes a better or worse insulator and is it more puncture proof?

                --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, John Ladd <johnladd@...> wrote:
                >
                > I share Barb's concern about the durability of the Neo Air, but I
                > nevertheless love it. I find it extremely comfortable. I need to be on my
                > side to fall asleep, so it works much better for me than a regular
                > ThermaRest ProLite or closed cell pad (which are OK for back sleepers but
                > hard on side sleepers.)
                >
                > So far I've only used it as an addtitional pad on top of a closed cell pad
                > like a Ridge Crest
                >
                > I put the closed cell pad on the ground in lieu of a groundsheet, then my
                > bivy and the Neo Air in the bivy. I always carry the neoAir in it's
                > stuffsack and I baby it a lot. Under these circumstances, it's worked OK
                > for me, but I don't have enough of a "history" with it to fully trust it.
                > Three trips over the last 9 months for a total of about 20 days without a
                > problem.
                >
                > It doesn't insulate you from the cold underneath you as well as a ProLite
                > type pad, but it does give some insulation. I recently took it for several
                > nights down to 15 degrees and it was fine combined with the closed cell pad.
                > (These conditions generally require two pads.) I was expecting to have to
                > combine the closed-cell pad with the ProLite, but the closed cell and the
                > NeoAir worked just fine.
                >
                > I talked to the most experienced staffer at my local SF REI and he said that
                > they had some returns of delaminated or punctured NeoAirs since they started
                > selling them this summer. But he says he thinks that the product may have
                > been misused. He's cautiously recommending it, if used with great care.
                >
                > I think I'm ready to carry it without the closed-cell. The problem I'm
                > worried about is that it looks fragile, and if it springs a leak, it will
                > provide almost no insulation value from the ground cold. Something like a
                > ProLite would have at least some insulation value even if it springs a leak,
                > but not the NeoAir.
                >
                > Therm-A-Rest does supply a field repair kit, but REI doesn't stock it. It's
                > called "Fast & Light" repair kit. If you Google-shopping "Thermarest fast
                > light repair" (without the quotes) you will find places where you can order
                > it online for about $8 plus shipping. I don't think I'd be willing to carry
                > the NeoAir as my exclusive protection from loss of heat to the ground unless
                > I carried a repair kit.
                >
                > Here's a description of the repair kit:
                >
                > "This kit includes all you need to make fast, permanent repairs to your
                > Therm-a-Rest mattress in the field. It features as assortment of pre-cut
                > nylon patches, an applicator, and the same HotBond adhesive that we use in
                > our repair shop. Best of all, the adhesive works in cold and wet conditions
                > and cures very quickly, so your mattress is ready to use again in just 10
                > minutes."
                >
                > One site selling the kit is:
                >
                > http://www.sunnysports.com/prod/TARRKFL.html?ci_src=14110944&ci_sku=TARRKFL
                >
                > Note: I have no experience with this vendor.
                >
                > Therm-A-Rest has a good FAQ page which includes information on how to repair
                > its products:
                >
                > http://www.cascadedesigns.com/Therm-A-Rest/FAQ
                >
                > Related info for those of you considering the NeoAIr
                >
                > From the Thermarest site:
                >
                > The NeoAir mattress is one of only 18 products awarded in 2009 in "one of
                > the strongest groups ever" with the prestigious *Backpacker* Magazine
                > Editors' Choice Award for outstanding innovation in design, materials and
                > performance.
                >
                > The NeoAir sleeping mattress and technology was awarded the American Alpine
                > Institute's Guide's Choice seal in 2009 after extensive field testing. The
                > seal recognizes products that are outstanding in their class and
                > distinguished by their design and workmanship.
                >
                > R-value: 2.5 (better than most air-filled, but less than closed-cell or
                > foam-filled inflatables like the ProLite series)
                >
                > weight: 9 oz. and up, depending on size (availabel in small, medium, regular
                > and large sizes)
                >
                > size when packed: a roll as small as 9 inches long by 3.3 inch diameter,
                > depending on size of mat - about the size of a 1-liter Nalgene water bottle
                >
                > http://www.cascadedesigns.com/Therm-A-Rest/Mattresses/Fast-And-Light/NeoAir/product
                >
                > John Curran Ladd
                > 1616 Castro Street
                > San Francisco, CA 94114-3707
                > 415-648-9279
                >
              • Roleigh Martin
                I tried the Neo Air for 2 months on the trail and did not like it anywhere as well as the Montbell 1 5 long sleeping pad with their tog-attachable pillow.
                Message 7 of 9 , Feb 2, 2010
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                  I tried the Neo Air for 2 months on the trail and did not like it anywhere as well as the Montbell 1" 5' long sleeping pad with their tog-attachable pillow.  It is an extra 3 oz (without the pillow which does weigh 2.4 oz), but I get a much better sleep.  So my advice, if you try the Neo Air, get it at REI, as they are really good about customer satisfaction guaranteed.  I wanted to like the Neo Air though.  Just could not get used to it.
                   
                   
                • John Ladd
                  ... my load and | money is not a problem. Is the Agnes a better or worse insulator and is it more puncture | proof? REI claims that the Big Agnes Insulated Pad
                  Message 8 of 9 , Feb 2, 2010
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                    On Tue, Feb 2, 2010 at 3:06 PM, First L <dawgbronco@...> wrote:
                     

                    |  I have the Big Agnes Insulated Pad. This Neo would shave a full pound off my load and | money is not a problem. Is the Agnes a better or worse insulator and is it more puncture | proof?


                    REI claims that the Big Agnes Insulated Pad (at least the two versions that I looked at) has an R-value of 4.1 and it says the NeoAir is 2.5.  If they are right, you give up 40% of the insulation value with the NeoAir.  And since the Big Agnes has some foam included, a leak in a Big Agnes probably causes less of a problem than a leak in a NeoAir.

                    I don't have an opinion on relative durability.  I know a lot of people who like the Big Agnes.


                    See

                    http://www.rei.com/product/763914

                    http://www.rei.com/product/781096

                    Click on "specs" at each URL (for a Big Agnes and a NeoAir).

                    Here's a decent-looking discussin of defferent kinds of pads (apparenlty written before the NeoAir became available)

                    http://friends.backcountry.net/m_factor/pad.html

                    My personal impression: for July-Sept travel on the JMT, the difference in R-values of the NeoAir vs. Big Agnes doesn't make all that much difference, unless you tend to sleep cold.  But I don't know that I'd rush out to buy one if you are happy with the Big Agnes.  You could give the Neo Air another year to get better information on reliability in the field.

                    John Curran Ladd
                    1616 Castro Street
                    San Francisco, CA  94114-3707
                    415-648-9279


                    On Tue, Feb 2, 2010 at 3:06 PM, First L <dawgbronco@...> wrote:
                     

                    I have the Big Agnes Insulated Pad. This Neo would shave a full pound off my load and money is not a problem. Is the Agnes a better or worse insulator and is it more puncture proof?



                    --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, John Ladd <johnladd@...> wrote:
                    >
                    > I share Barb's concern about the durability of the Neo Air, but I
                    > nevertheless love it. I find it extremely comfortable. I need to be on my
                    > side to fall asleep, so it works much better for me than a regular
                    > ThermaRest ProLite or closed cell pad (which are OK for back sleepers but
                    > hard on side sleepers.)
                    >
                    > So far I've only used it as an addtitional pad on top of a closed cell pad
                    > like a Ridge Crest
                    >
                    > I put the closed cell pad on the ground in lieu of a groundsheet, then my
                    > bivy and the Neo Air in the bivy. I always carry the neoAir in it's
                    > stuffsack and I baby it a lot. Under these circumstances, it's worked OK
                    > for me, but I don't have enough of a "history" with it to fully trust it.
                    > Three trips over the last 9 months for a total of about 20 days without a
                    > problem.
                    >
                    > It doesn't insulate you from the cold underneath you as well as a ProLite
                    > type pad, but it does give some insulation. I recently took it for several
                    > nights down to 15 degrees and it was fine combined with the closed cell pad.
                    > (These conditions generally require two pads.) I was expecting to have to
                    > combine the closed-cell pad with the ProLite, but the closed cell and the
                    > NeoAir worked just fine.
                    >
                    > I talked to the most experienced staffer at my local SF REI and he said that
                    > they had some returns of delaminated or punctured NeoAirs since they started
                    > selling them this summer. But he says he thinks that the product may have
                    > been misused. He's cautiously recommending it, if used with great care.
                    >
                    > I think I'm ready to carry it without the closed-cell. The problem I'm
                    > worried about is that it looks fragile, and if it springs a leak, it will
                    > provide almost no insulation value from the ground cold. Something like a
                    > ProLite would have at least some insulation value even if it springs a leak,
                    > but not the NeoAir.
                    >
                    > Therm-A-Rest does supply a field repair kit, but REI doesn't stock it. It's
                    > called "Fast & Light" repair kit. If you Google-shopping "Thermarest fast
                    > light repair" (without the quotes) you will find places where you can order
                    > it online for about $8 plus shipping. I don't think I'd be willing to carry
                    > the NeoAir as my exclusive protection from loss of heat to the ground unless
                    > I carried a repair kit.
                    >
                    > Here's a description of the repair kit:
                    >
                    > "This kit includes all you need to make fast, permanent repairs to your
                    > Therm-a-Rest mattress in the field. It features as assortment of pre-cut
                    > nylon patches, an applicator, and the same HotBond adhesive that we use in
                    > our repair shop. Best of all, the adhesive works in cold and wet conditions
                    > and cures very quickly, so your mattress is ready to use again in just 10
                    > minutes."
                    >
                    > One site selling the kit is:
                    >
                    > http://www.sunnysports.com/prod/TARRKFL.html?ci_src=14110944&ci_sku=TARRKFL
                    >
                    > Note: I have no experience with this vendor.
                    >
                    > Therm-A-Rest has a good FAQ page which includes information on how to repair
                    > its products:
                    >
                    > http://www.cascadedesigns.com/Therm-A-Rest/FAQ
                    >
                    > Related info for those of you considering the NeoAIr
                    >
                    > From the Thermarest site:
                    >
                    > The NeoAir mattress is one of only 18 products awarded in 2009 in "one of
                    > the strongest groups ever" with the prestigious *Backpacker* Magazine
                    > Editors' Choice Award for outstanding innovation in design, materials and
                    > performance.
                    >
                    > The NeoAir sleeping mattress and technology was awarded the American Alpine
                    > Institute's Guide's Choice seal in 2009 after extensive field testing. The
                    > seal recognizes products that are outstanding in their class and
                    > distinguished by their design and workmanship.
                    >
                    > R-value: 2.5 (better than most air-filled, but less than closed-cell or
                    > foam-filled inflatables like the ProLite series)
                    >
                    > weight: 9 oz. and up, depending on size (availabel in small, medium, regular
                    > and large sizes)
                    >
                    > size when packed: a roll as small as 9 inches long by 3.3 inch diameter,
                    > depending on size of mat - about the size of a 1-liter Nalgene water bottle
                    >
                    > http://www.cascadedesigns.com/Therm-A-Rest/Mattresses/Fast-And-Light/NeoAir/product
                    >
                    > John Curran Ladd
                    > 1616 Castro Street
                    > San Francisco, CA 94114-3707
                    > 415-648-9279
                    >


                  • judy
                    I took a NeoAir on the length of the trail in Jul-Aug last year and found it quite warm and comfy and not noisy in use. I too put a closed cell pad on the
                    Message 9 of 9 , Feb 3, 2010
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                      I took a NeoAir on the length of the trail in Jul-Aug last year and found it quite warm and comfy and not noisy in use. I too put a closed cell pad on the ground, then my tent (Shires tarp tent), and then the NeoAir over where the pad was. I carried the repair kit, but thankfully didn't need to use it. My biggest concern was the dried pine needles that seem to enter the tent in wooded areas! I just roll up my tent with the deflated air mattress inside--saves a step and a stuff bag, and seems to protect it well.
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