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Question about cost and time

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  • Jonathan
    Hey all, so I m trying to get an average idea of how much it ll cost me to do the entire trip. I have all my own gear (or access to that which I don t own),
    Message 1 of 24 , Dec 6, 2009
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      Hey all, so I'm trying to get an average idea of how much it'll cost me to do the entire trip. I have all my own gear (or access to that which I don't own), but am on a tight (college student) budget. Does anyone have any suggestions for ways that I can save a few bucks here and there, and a rough estimate as to how much it'll end up costing? I know it's important to get good, healthy meals while on the trail, but I'm not sure I can afford all the prepackaged, dehydrated meals. A few per leg of the trail is fine, but other than that...

      One last question: Due to me going to college and needing time to repack before heading out again, I was planning on going from Happy Isles to Whitney July 13-August 6 or 8. Should I anticipate more temperamental weather during that time, or are my dates fairly solid?

      Thanks to all ahead of time for your helpful guidance!
    • Shawn A
      I think this is plenty of time unless you re way out of shape. The weather should be fine but you will definitely hit some ice/snow on the summits. Just pay
      Message 2 of 24 , Dec 6, 2009
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        I think this is plenty of time unless you're way out of shape. The weather should be fine but you will definitely hit some ice/snow on the summits. Just pay attention to the weather patterns in the Sierras starting in May.

        As far as food goes, you're on the right track with limiting yourself from those freeze dried packages. Those are nice, but are costly and are loaded with sodium. I took a mix between freeze dried, rice, oatmeal, salami, trail mix, cliff bars, peanut butter, powdered Gatoraid, dried beans, and dried soup mix. If you're on a real tight budget, cut out cliff bars and bring more peanut butter. If you have all of the gear, food shouldn't cost you more than $200-$250 max. Hope this helps.

        --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, "Jonathan" <jonnyboy9543@...> wrote:
        >
        > Hey all, so I'm trying to get an average idea of how much it'll cost me to do the entire trip. I have all my own gear (or access to that which I don't own), but am on a tight (college student) budget. Does anyone have any suggestions for ways that I can save a few bucks here and there, and a rough estimate as to how much it'll end up costing? I know it's important to get good, healthy meals while on the trail, but I'm not sure I can afford all the prepackaged, dehydrated meals. A few per leg of the trail is fine, but other than that...
        >
        > One last question: Due to me going to college and needing time to repack before heading out again, I was planning on going from Happy Isles to Whitney July 13-August 6 or 8. Should I anticipate more temperamental weather during that time, or are my dates fairly solid?
        >
        > Thanks to all ahead of time for your helpful guidance!
        >
      • ed_rodriguez52@yahoo.com
        Hi Jonathan, at REI if you buy 12 food item such as your dinners, power bar at time you get 10 per cent off. You can go to the store and buy rice or noodle
        Message 3 of 24 , Dec 6, 2009
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          Hi Jonathan, at REI if you buy 12 food item such as your dinners, power bar at time you get 10 per cent off. You can go to the store and buy rice or noodle ronie dinner. Cost for me as far as food is 2 power bars per day for 27 days is $81. Freeze dry inners $176 fuel $25. Snacks $60. If you can spread what you buy over the next 6 months. Need to take into account in shipping cost. Plan out your menu how much store bought food you can get. But remember space in your bear vault, I started to get food and loading up my bear vault only to find out that I ran out of room of the stuff that I did had (only had 1 freeze dry dinner and 3 lunch items. So back to drawing board for me. Good luck hope to see you on the trail.

          Sent on the Sprint® Now Network from my BlackBerry®


          From: "Jonathan" <jonnyboy9543@...>
          Date: Mon, 07 Dec 2009 03:33:59 -0000
          To: <johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com>
          Subject: [John Muir Trail] Question about cost and time

           

          Hey all, so I'm trying to get an average idea of how much it'll cost me to do the entire trip. I have all my own gear (or access to that which I don't own), but am on a tight (college student) budget. Does anyone have any suggestions for ways that I can save a few bucks here and there, and a rough estimate as to how much it'll end up costing? I know it's important to get good, healthy meals while on the trail, but I'm not sure I can afford all the prepackaged, dehydrated meals. A few per leg of the trail is fine, but other than that...

          One last question: Due to me going to college and needing time to repack before heading out again, I was planning on going from Happy Isles to Whitney July 13-August 6 or 8. Should I anticipate more temperamental weather during that time, or are my dates fairly solid?

          Thanks to all ahead of time for your helpful guidance!

        • robert shattuck
          Think mosquitos––that s one thing you ll be dealing with, within those dates. They sort of magically vanish after mid-august . . . Are your dates solid
          Message 4 of 24 , Dec 7, 2009
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            Think mosquitos––that's one thing you'll be dealing with, within those dates. They sort of magically vanish after mid-august . . . Are your dates "solid"  . . . are they? Do you mean, by solid, that you'll have enough time? Yes, unless you're a schlubb dump college kid––just plan an average of 10-12 miles a day, with one or two that might hit 13-17 depending. 

            By the time you start hitting the real passes . . . Mather and beyond, you should be doing a pass a day . . . get up below mather, go over in the morning and get up below Pinchot and so on. 

            don't bother with expensive (or do) freeze-dried––it's not cheap and it's not always what it says on the package, if you know what I mean. Since this sounds like your first big long distance trip, you probably have no idea how your body functions in such circumstances and what your ultimate caloric intake will  need to be. Some people get out for three weeks and they are ravenous the entire time. have to eat three power bars a day and hit all their meals. 

            Other people seem to lose their appetite, which is no excuse to stop eating (on the contrary) but you may need a lot less to keep your engine running. Your best bet is trial and error and this time around you should certainly suffer the lessons and take as much as you can–– always better to have more than you need than not. 

            Trader Joe's is a great place to buy food. I go crazy, not worrying about the weight of my food. I buy sardines and oysters, which I usually put in my food drop, so that by the time I get to Vermilion, I'll not only be in better shape, but certainly starved for the fat.  I buy the wet indian meals and the somewhat bulky tortellini junk. I think I usually spend about $120-50 on food. (I also take jerky, corn nuts, sea weed, miso-soup)

            Of course if you can cook and like mixing stuff up, go for it and you might get away spending less, but make sure you know what you're taking. do a test kitchen to at least make sure you like your concoctions . . . if I didn't have to use a bear canister, I'd probably still be eating two ramen packets a night––such healthy goodness. 

            Snow? let's hope there's some snow, but things being as they are, you might be lucky and find it on a few of the passes, but it will be nothing that should thwart your getting over them. 

            Weather in general, in the sierra, is usually pretty pleasant and if anything, visibly predictable––rain and thunder are always possible, but often fickle––might only last a few hours, or might bog you down for a day––the best advice again is just to be prepared with the right gear and a little bit of knowledge, such as what to do in the event of thunder and lightning. 

            bob
            http://www.summitpost.org/plans/view_activity.php?post_id=6480






            To: johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com
            From: jonnyboy9543@...
            Date: Mon, 7 Dec 2009 03:33:59 +0000
            Subject: [John Muir Trail] Question about cost and time

             
            Hey all, so I'm trying to get an average idea of how much it'll cost me to do the entire trip. I have all my own gear (or access to that which I don't own), but am on a tight (college student) budget. Does anyone have any suggestions for ways that I can save a few bucks here and there, and a rough estimate as to how much it'll end up costing? I know it's important to get good, healthy meals while on the trail, but I'm not sure I can afford all the prepackaged, dehydrated meals. A few per leg of the trail is fine, but other than that...

            One last question: Due to me going to college and needing time to repack before heading out again, I was planning on going from Happy Isles to Whitney July 13-August 6 or 8. Should I anticipate more temperamental weather during that time, or are my dates fairly solid?

            Thanks to all ahead of time for your helpful guidance!




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          • robert shattuck
            I almost forget (and it s only 320 a.m.) aside from food, while on the trail, there s also the incidental stuff . . . backpackers camp in the valley is five a
            Message 5 of 24 , Dec 7, 2009
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              I almost forget (and it's only 320 a.m.) aside from food, while on the trail, there's also the incidental stuff . . . backpackers camp in the valley is five a night . . . Tuolomne is also five a night. 

              Red's varies, depending on how many in camp, but you could end up spending $9-10 just for the night . . . don't forget $10-15 for burger and what not. 

              Vermilion is a nice place to stop for the night, but you can end up paying $90 and up once you pay for, say, round-trip on the boat, package pick-up, shower, laundry, $20-25 per (dinner, b-fast) meal . . . beers, junk food, phone call, internet time and the BIG pisser––ALL the tent cabins used to be free the first night, but now, or this past summer, only one was free and the others, well, we had to pay, I think it was $52 . . . luckily there were four of us. 

              Muir trail ranch won't cost you a thing unless you pick up a drop there, or buy fuel for a few dollars. 

              once you come off whitney, you might be tempted to buy a burger at the portal and beers?

              or get a motel room down in Lone Pine ($55) 

              and then there's that getting home thing . . . 



              sparklefart.blogspot.com
              http://www.summitpost.org/plans/view_activity.php?post_id=6480






              To: johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com
              From: jonnyboy9543@...
              Date: Mon, 7 Dec 2009 03:33:59 +0000
              Subject: [John Muir Trail] Question about cost and time

               
              Hey all, so I'm trying to get an average idea of how much it'll cost me to do the entire trip. I have all my own gear (or access to that which I don't own), but am on a tight (college student) budget. Does anyone have any suggestions for ways that I can save a few bucks here and there, and a rough estimate as to how much it'll end up costing? I know it's important to get good, healthy meals while on the trail, but I'm not sure I can afford all the prepackaged, dehydrated meals. A few per leg of the trail is fine, but other than that...

              One last question: Due to me going to college and needing time to repack before heading out again, I was planning on going from Happy Isles to Whitney July 13-August 6 or 8. Should I anticipate more temperamental weather during that time, or are my dates fairly solid?

              Thanks to all ahead of time for your helpful guidance!




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            • Maxim
              Cost, time & weight - is related parameters. You can safe some $ by using public transportation/hitchhiking at start/end, but this options can add few days to
              Message 6 of 24 , Dec 7, 2009
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                Cost, time & weight - is related parameters. You can safe some $ by using public transportation/hitchhiking at start/end, but this options can add few days to the trip.

                About food it is really depend from you personal pref. 2/3 of my died was ramen soup and instant oatmeal, both items are light and extremely cheap.

                Also it depend from time you spend on trail.... More time on trail => you need more food => heavy backpack => even more time on trail ;)

                So, it is all related. I think you cost will be minimized if you can spend ~ 2x2 days approach and ~ 12 days on the trail. In this case you can use only one resupply, and public transportation.

                --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, "Jonathan" <jonnyboy9543@...> wrote:
                >
                > Hey all, so I'm trying to get an average idea of how much it'll cost me to do the entire trip. I have all my own gear (or access to that which I don't own), but am on a tight (college student) budget. Does anyone have any suggestions for ways that I can save a few bucks here and there, and a rough estimate as to how much it'll end up costing? I know it's important to get good, healthy meals while on the trail, but I'm not sure I can afford all the prepackaged, dehydrated meals. A few per leg of the trail is fine, but other than that...
                >
                > One last question: Due to me going to college and needing time to repack before heading out again, I was planning on going from Happy Isles to Whitney July 13-August 6 or 8. Should I anticipate more temperamental weather during that time, or are my dates fairly solid?
                >
                > Thanks to all ahead of time for your helpful guidance!
                >
              • Barbara Karagosian
                Hi Jonathan - Dates look good - agree with what Bob said - mosquitoes could be bad - you ll likely need a headnet, and I presprayed my clothes with permethrin
                Message 7 of 24 , Dec 7, 2009
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                  Hi Jonathan – Dates look good – agree with what Bob said – mosquitoes could be bad – you’ll likely need a headnet, and I presprayed my clothes with permethrin – some people use Deet too – others dislike it.  Weather – should be good, but be prepared – there was a snow storm warning around Aug 7 or 8  this year!  (didn’t happen tho).  I’ve heard rumors of an El Nino winter which means wetter than its been the last few years –this would in turn translate to snow at passes and deeper/faster stream crossings in places.  Also concur with making allowance for time getting to and from the trail – and for getting your permit, if you’re not nagging it in advance.  If you’re getting it in advance, then fax in your written request at a nano second past midnight, 24 weeks ahead of your trail entry date. Food etc.  You can rent a bear canister from Wild Ideas.com – either the Weekender or the Expedition.  They are $50 flat rate rental fee if you tell them you’re doing the JMT.  Check their site for sizes and rental form.  Add to that the cost of mailing it back to them when you’re done.  Food – well it has to fit in your canister, other than what you’re eating that day or for dinner that night.  This includes smelly toiletries etc.  Figure out everything you need, and premeasured it out to reduce weight and waste. Food – go for the dense high calorie stuff.  I’ve used the prepackaged dehydrated stuff but it gets old very quickly (to the taste buds). Also tortillas, bean paste, salami, PB.   Good luck - Barbara

                   


                  From: johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com [mailto: johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com ] On Behalf Of Jonathan
                  Sent: Sunday, December 06, 2009 7:34 PM
                  To: johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com
                  Subject: [John Muir Trail] Question about cost and time

                   

                   

                  Hey all, so I'm trying to get an average idea of how much it'll cost me to do the entire trip. I have all my own gear (or access to that which I don't own), but am on a tight (college student) budget. Does anyone have any suggestions for ways that I can save a few bucks here and there, and a rough estimate as to how much it'll end up costing? I know it's important to get good, healthy meals while on the trail, but I'm not sure I can afford all the prepackaged, dehydrated meals. A few per leg of the trail is fine, but other than that...

                  One last question: Due to me going to college and needing time to repack before heading out again, I was planning on going from Happy Isles to Whitney July 13-August 6 or 8. Should I anticipate more temperamental weather during that time, or are my dates fairly solid?

                  Thanks to all ahead of time for your helpful guidance!

                • hmdsierra
                  I ve never used the freeze dried meals. All my meals were homemade from what is available from the supermarket for most of it. Noodles & Sauce, Rice and
                  Message 8 of 24 , Dec 7, 2009
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                    I've never used the freeze dried meals. All my meals were homemade from what is available from the supermarket for most of it. Noodles & Sauce, Rice and Sauce, etc. I use soy meat that you can get at health food stores and the some supermarkets. Thia does require you to cook and you would need a few more pots. There are lots of almost instant foods available. For bread I make biscuit mix or one could use Bisquick. Complete pancake mix works well but you will need a frypan.

                    That time frame will intersect the summer monsoon but will usually only last an hour or so.

                    --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, "Jonathan" <jonnyboy9543@...> wrote:
                    >
                    > Hey all, so I'm trying to get an average idea of how much it'll cost me to do the entire trip. I have all my own gear (or access to that which I don't own), but am on a tight (college student) budget. Does anyone have any suggestions for ways that I can save a few bucks here and there, and a rough estimate as to how much it'll end up costing? I know it's important to get good, healthy meals while on the trail, but I'm not sure I can afford all the prepackaged, dehydrated meals. A few per leg of the trail is fine, but other than that...
                    >
                    > One last question: Due to me going to college and needing time to repack before heading out again, I was planning on going from Happy Isles to Whitney July 13-August 6 or 8. Should I anticipate more temperamental weather during that time, or are my dates fairly solid?
                    >
                    > Thanks to all ahead of time for your helpful guidance!
                    >
                  • John
                    ... from what is available from the supermarket for most of it. Noodles & Sauce, Rice and Sauce, etc. I use soy meat that you can get at health food stores
                    Message 9 of 24 , Dec 7, 2009
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                      --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, hmdsierra <no_reply@...> wrote:
                      >
                      > I've never used the freeze dried meals. All my meals were homemade
                      from what is available from the supermarket for most of it. Noodles &
                      Sauce, Rice and Sauce, etc. I use soy meat that you can get at health
                      food stores and the some supermarkets. Thia does require you to cook
                      and you would need a few more pots. There are lots of almost instant
                      foods available. For bread I make biscuit mix or one could use
                      Bisquick. Complete pancake mix works well but you will need a frypan.
                      >
                      > That time frame will intersect the summer monsoon but will usually
                      only last an hour or so.
                      >
                      > --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, "Jonathan" jonnyboy9543@ wrote:
                      > >
                      > > Hey all, so I'm trying to get an average idea of how much it'll cost
                      me to do the entire trip. I have all my own gear (or access to that
                      which I don't own), but am on a tight (college student) budget. Does
                      anyone have any suggestions for ways that I can save a few bucks here
                      and there, and a rough estimate as to how much it'll end up costing? I
                      know it's important to get good, healthy meals while on the trail, but
                      I'm not sure I can afford all the prepackaged, dehydrated meals. A few
                      per leg of the trail is fine, but other than that...
                      > >
                      > > One last question: Due to me going to college and needing time to
                      repack before heading out again, I was planning on going from Happy
                      Isles to Whitney July 13-August 6 or 8. Should I anticipate more
                      temperamental weather during that time, or are my dates fairly solid?
                      > >
                      > > Thanks to all ahead of time for your helpful guidance!
                      > >
                      >
                    • jeff.hester
                      Out of curiosity (and slightly off-topic), why do you recommend faxing your permit app in versus doing it online?
                      Message 10 of 24 , Dec 7, 2009
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                        Out of curiosity (and slightly off-topic), why do you recommend faxing your permit app in versus doing it online?

                        --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, "Barbara Karagosian" <barbara@...> wrote:
                        >
                        > Hi Jonathan - Dates look good - agree with what Bob said - mosquitoes could
                        > be bad - you'll likely need a headnet, and I presprayed my clothes with
                        > permethrin - some people use Deet too - others dislike it. Weather - should
                        > be good, but be prepared - there was a snow storm warning around Aug 7 or 8
                        > this year! (didn't happen tho). I've heard rumors of an El Nino winter
                        > which means wetter than its been the last few years -this would in turn
                        > translate to snow at passes and deeper/faster stream crossings in places.
                        > Also concur with making allowance for time getting to and from the trail -
                        > and for getting your permit, if you're not nagging it in advance. If you're
                        > getting it in advance, then fax in your written request at a nano second
                        > past midnight, 24 weeks ahead of your trail entry date. Food etc. You can
                        > rent a bear canister from Wild Ideas.com - either the Weekender or the
                        > Expedition. They are $50 flat rate rental fee if you tell them you're doing
                        > the JMT. Check their site for sizes and rental form. Add to that the cost
                        > of mailing it back to them when you're done. Food - well it has to fit in
                        > your canister, other than what you're eating that day or for dinner that
                        > night. This includes smelly toiletries etc. Figure out everything you
                        > need, and premeasured it out to reduce weight and waste. Food - go for the
                        > dense high calorie stuff. I've used the prepackaged dehydrated stuff but it
                        > gets old very quickly (to the taste buds). Also tortillas, bean paste,
                        > salami, PB. Good luck - Barbara
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        > _____
                        >
                        > From: johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com [mailto:johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com]
                        > On Behalf Of Jonathan
                        > Sent: Sunday, December 06, 2009 7:34 PM
                        > To: johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com
                        > Subject: [John Muir Trail] Question about cost and time
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        >
                        > Hey all, so I'm trying to get an average idea of how much it'll cost me to
                        > do the entire trip. I have all my own gear (or access to that which I don't
                        > own), but am on a tight (college student) budget. Does anyone have any
                        > suggestions for ways that I can save a few bucks here and there, and a rough
                        > estimate as to how much it'll end up costing? I know it's important to get
                        > good, healthy meals while on the trail, but I'm not sure I can afford all
                        > the prepackaged, dehydrated meals. A few per leg of the trail is fine, but
                        > other than that...
                        >
                        > One last question: Due to me going to college and needing time to repack
                        > before heading out again, I was planning on going from Happy Isles to
                        > Whitney July 13-August 6 or 8. Should I anticipate more temperamental
                        > weather during that time, or are my dates fairly solid?
                        >
                        > Thanks to all ahead of time for your helpful guidance!
                        >
                      • ed_rodriguez52@yahoo.com
                        Its my understand that you fill the form out on line but they ask you either to fax it or mail the form Sent on the Sprint® Now Network from my BlackBerry®
                        Message 11 of 24 , Dec 7, 2009
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                          Its my understand that you fill the form out on line but they ask you either to fax it or mail the form

                          Sent on the Sprint® Now Network from my BlackBerry®


                          From: jeff.hester <no_reply@yahoogroups.com>
                          Date: Tue, 08 Dec 2009 01:52:20 -0000
                          To: <johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com>
                          Subject: Re: [John Muir Trail] Question about cost and time

                           

                          Out of curiosity (and slightly off-topic), why do you recommend faxing your permit app in versus doing it online?

                          --- In johnmuirtrail@ yahoogroups. com, "Barbara Karagosian" <barbara@... > wrote:
                          >
                          > Hi Jonathan - Dates look good - agree with what Bob said - mosquitoes could
                          > be bad - you'll likely need a headnet, and I presprayed my clothes with
                          > permethrin - some people use Deet too - others dislike it. Weather - should
                          > be good, but be prepared - there was a snow storm warning around Aug 7 or 8
                          > this year! (didn't happen tho). I've heard rumors of an El Nino winter
                          > which means wetter than its been the last few years -this would in turn
                          > translate to snow at passes and deeper/faster stream crossings in places.
                          > Also concur with making allowance for time getting to and from the trail -
                          > and for getting your permit, if you're not nagging it in advance. If you're
                          > getting it in advance, then fax in your written request at a nano second
                          > past midnight, 24 weeks ahead of your trail entry date. Food etc. You can
                          > rent a bear canister from Wild Ideas.com - either the Weekender or the
                          > Expedition. They are $50 flat rate rental fee if you tell them you're doing
                          > the JMT. Check their site for sizes and rental form. Add to that the cost
                          > of mailing it back to them when you're done. Food - well it has to fit in
                          > your canister, other than what you're eating that day or for dinner that
                          > night. This includes smelly toiletries etc. Figure out everything you
                          > need, and premeasured it out to reduce weight and waste. Food - go for the
                          > dense high calorie stuff. I've used the prepackaged dehydrated stuff but it
                          > gets old very quickly (to the taste buds). Also tortillas, bean paste,
                          > salami, PB. Good luck - Barbara
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          > _____
                          >
                          > From: johnmuirtrail@ yahoogroups. com [mailto:johnmuirtrail@ yahoogroups. com]
                          > On Behalf Of Jonathan
                          > Sent: Sunday, December 06, 2009 7:34 PM
                          > To: johnmuirtrail@ yahoogroups. com
                          > Subject: [John Muir Trail] Question about cost and time
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          >
                          > Hey all, so I'm trying to get an average idea of how much it'll cost me to
                          > do the entire trip. I have all my own gear (or access to that which I don't
                          > own), but am on a tight (college student) budget. Does anyone have any
                          > suggestions for ways that I can save a few bucks here and there, and a rough
                          > estimate as to how much it'll end up costing? I know it's important to get
                          > good, healthy meals while on the trail, but I'm not sure I can afford all
                          > the prepackaged, dehydrated meals. A few per leg of the trail is fine, but
                          > other than that...
                          >
                          > One last question: Due to me going to college and needing time to repack
                          > before heading out again, I was planning on going from Happy Isles to
                          > Whitney July 13-August 6 or 8. Should I anticipate more temperamental
                          > weather during that time, or are my dates fairly solid?
                          >
                          > Thanks to all ahead of time for your helpful guidance!
                          >

                        • Barbara Karagosian
                          Re permit - faxing it cos for the last couple of years at least you couldn t fo it online, and phones don t open til 8am at which time they give 1st options to
                          Message 12 of 24 , Dec 7, 2009
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                            Re permit - faxing it cos for the last couple of years at least you couldn't fo it online, and phones don't open til 8am at which time they give 1st options to the faxes that came in first after midnight!

                            Barbara

                            On Dec 7, 2009, at 5:52 PM, jeff.hester <no_reply@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

                             

                            Out of curiosity (and slightly off-topic), why do you recommend faxing your permit app in versus doing it online?

                            --- In johnmuirtrail@ yahoogroups. com, "Barbara Karagosian" <barbara@... > wrote:
                            >
                            > Hi Jonathan - Dates look good - agree with what Bob said - mosquitoes could
                            > be bad - you'll likely need a headnet, and I presprayed my clothes with
                            > permethrin - some people use Deet too - others dislike it. Weather - should
                            > be good, but be prepared - there was a snow storm warning around Aug 7 or 8
                            > this year! (didn't happen tho). I've heard rumors of an El Nino winter
                            > which means wetter than its been the last few years -this would in turn
                            > translate to snow at passes and deeper/faster stream crossings in places.
                            > Also concur with making allowance for time getting to and from the trail -
                            > and for getting your permit, if you're not nagging it in advance. If you're
                            > getting it in advance, then fax in your written request at a nano second
                            > past midnight, 24 weeks ahead of your trail entry date. Food etc. You can
                            > rent a bear canister from Wild Ideas.com - either the Weekender or the
                            > Expedition. They are $50 flat rate rental fee if you tell them you're doing
                            > the JMT. Check their site for sizes and rental form. Add to that the cost
                            > of mailing it back to them when you're done. Food - well it has to fit in
                            > your canister, other than what you're eating that day or for dinner that
                            > night. This includes smelly toiletries etc. Figure out everything you
                            > need, and premeasured it out to reduce weight and waste. Food - go for the
                            > dense high calorie stuff. I've used the prepackaged dehydrated stuff but it
                            > gets old very quickly (to the taste buds). Also tortillas, bean paste,
                            > salami, PB. Good luck - Barbara
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            > _____
                            >
                            > From: johnmuirtrail@ yahoogroups. com [mailto:johnmuirtrail@ yahoogroups. com]
                            > On Behalf Of Jonathan
                            > Sent: Sunday, December 06, 2009 7:34 PM
                            > To: johnmuirtrail@ yahoogroups. com
                            > Subject: [John Muir Trail] Question about cost and time
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            >
                            > Hey all, so I'm trying to get an average idea of how much it'll cost me to
                            > do the entire trip. I have all my own gear (or access to that which I don't
                            > own), but am on a tight (college student) budget. Does anyone have any
                            > suggestions for ways that I can save a few bucks here and there, and a rough
                            > estimate as to how much it'll end up costing? I know it's important to get
                            > good, healthy meals while on the trail, but I'm not sure I can afford all
                            > the prepackaged, dehydrated meals. A few per leg of the trail is fine, but
                            > other than that...
                            >
                            > One last question: Due to me going to college and needing time to repack
                            > before heading out again, I was planning on going from Happy Isles to
                            > Whitney July 13-August 6 or 8. Should I anticipate more temperamental
                            > weather during that time, or are my dates fairly solid?
                            >
                            > Thanks to all ahead of time for your helpful guidance!
                            >

                          • Shawn A
                            FYI-I phoned my permit request last year with no problems. I also changed permit dates later on over the phone with no problems as well...
                            Message 13 of 24 , Dec 7, 2009
                            • 0 Attachment
                              FYI-I phoned my permit request last year with no problems. I also changed permit dates later on over the phone with no problems as well...

                              --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, "Jonathan" <jonnyboy9543@...> wrote:
                              >
                              > Hey all, so I'm trying to get an average idea of how much it'll cost me to do the entire trip. I have all my own gear (or access to that which I don't own), but am on a tight (college student) budget. Does anyone have any suggestions for ways that I can save a few bucks here and there, and a rough estimate as to how much it'll end up costing? I know it's important to get good, healthy meals while on the trail, but I'm not sure I can afford all the prepackaged, dehydrated meals. A few per leg of the trail is fine, but other than that...
                              >
                              > One last question: Due to me going to college and needing time to repack before heading out again, I was planning on going from Happy Isles to Whitney July 13-August 6 or 8. Should I anticipate more temperamental weather during that time, or are my dates fairly solid?
                              >
                              > Thanks to all ahead of time for your helpful guidance!
                              >
                            • robert shattuck
                              If you ve got the time, don t even bother trying to get a permit ahead of time––just show up. As many times as I ve done it I ve never had a problem
                              Message 14 of 24 , Dec 8, 2009
                              • 0 Attachment
                                If you've got the time, don't even bother trying to get a permit ahead of time––just show up. As many times as I've done it I've never had a problem getting a permit as soon as I got off the bus, but I am also never in a hurry, so the inconvenience of waiting maybe a day, has never bothered me. 

                                if you live far away and need to make all sorts of to-the-second plans, so you can leave your desk one day, hop on the trail the next, hike twenty days and then be home on the twenty-first day, then getting your permit ahead of time might be a good idea, but if you're a college student with some time to kill and life to ponder. take your time. 

                                if you're going to rent a bear canister for $50 bucks, you might as well buy one for another ten or so bucks . . . but you can also just rent them from the ranger stations in yosemite for roughly five or six bucks, for the entire length of your trip––just remember to send it back if you are not going to be returning through the valley. 

                                bob


                                http://www.summitpost.org/plans/view_activity.php?post_id=6480






                                To: johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com
                                From: ed_rodriguez52@...
                                Date: Tue, 8 Dec 2009 01:56:15 +0000
                                Subject: Re: [John Muir Trail] Question about cost and time

                                 
                                Its my understand that you fill the form out on line but they ask you either to fax it or mail the form
                                Sent on the Sprint® Now Network from my BlackBerry®

                                From: jeff.hester <no_reply@yahoogroup s.com>
                                Date: Tue, 08 Dec 2009 01:52:20 -0000
                                To: <johnmuirtrail@ yahoogroups. com>
                                Subject: Re: [John Muir Trail] Question about cost and time

                                 
                                Out of curiosity (and slightly off-topic), why do you recommend faxing your permit app in versus doing it online?

                                --- In johnmuirtrail@ yahoogroups. com, "Barbara Karagosian" <barbara@... > wrote:
                                >
                                > Hi Jonathan - Dates look good - agree with what Bob said - mosquitoes could
                                > be bad - you'll likely need a headnet, and I presprayed my clothes with
                                > permethrin - some people use Deet too - others dislike it. Weather - should
                                > be good, but be prepared - there was a snow storm warning around Aug 7 or 8
                                > this year! (didn't happen tho). I've heard rumors of an El Nino winter
                                > which means wetter than its been the last few years -this would in turn
                                > translate to snow at passes and deeper/faster stream crossings in places.
                                > Also concur with making allowance for time getting to and from the trail -
                                > and for getting your permit, if you're not nagging it in advance. If you're
                                > getting it in advance, then fax in your written request at a nano second
                                > past midnight, 24 weeks ahead of your trail entry date. Food etc. You can
                                > rent a bear canister from Wild Ideas.com - either the Weekender or the
                                > Expedition. They are $50 flat rate rental fee if you tell them you're doing
                                > the JMT. Check their site for sizes and rental form. Add to that the cost
                                > of mailing it back to them when you're done. Food - well it has to fit in
                                > your canister, other than what you're eating that day or for dinner that
                                > night. This includes smelly toiletries etc. Figure out everything you
                                > need, and premeasured it out to reduce weight and waste. Food - go for the
                                > dense high calorie stuff. I've used the prepackaged dehydrated stuff but it
                                > gets old very quickly (to the taste buds). Also tortillas, bean paste,
                                > salami, PB. Good luck - Barbara
                                >
                                >
                                >
                                > _____
                                >
                                > From: johnmuirtrail@ yahoogroups. com [mailto:johnmuirtrail@ yahoogroups. com]
                                > On Behalf Of Jonathan
                                > Sent: Sunday, December 06, 2009 7:34 PM
                                > To: johnmuirtrail@ yahoogroups. com
                                > Subject: [John Muir Trail] Question about cost and time
                                >
                                >
                                >
                                >
                                >
                                > Hey all, so I'm trying to get an average idea of how much it'll cost me to
                                > do the entire trip. I have all my own gear (or access to that which I don't
                                > own), but am on a tight (college student) budget. Does anyone have any
                                > suggestions for ways that I can save a few bucks here and there, and a rough
                                > estimate as to how much it'll end up costing? I know it's important to get
                                > good, healthy meals while on the trail, but I'm not sure I can afford all
                                > the prepackaged, dehydrated meals. A few per leg of the trail is fine, but
                                > other than that...
                                >
                                > One last question: Due to me going to college and needing time to repack
                                > before heading out again, I was planning on going from Happy Isles to
                                > Whitney July 13-August 6 or 8. Should I anticipate more temperamental
                                > weather during that time, or are my dates fairly solid?
                                >
                                > Thanks to all ahead of time for your helpful guidance!
                                >





                                Get gifts for them and cashback for you. Try Bing now.
                              • skdupre
                                Jonathan, If your dates are solid, it s likely I ll see you on the trail. I will be starting at Happy Isles on July 12 with a finish date at Whitney Portal of
                                Message 15 of 24 , Dec 8, 2009
                                • 0 Attachment
                                  Jonathan,

                                  If your dates are solid, it's likely I'll see you on the trail. I will be starting at Happy Isles on July 12 with a finish date at Whitney Portal of Aug. 4 (I've already bought my plane tickets). I'll be faxing in my permit request, but if I don't get my dates then I'll show up at the office early. It's a little awkward being on a Monday because I can't pick up the permit the day before and hit the trail early so looks like I'll be getting a late start. I am also going to the Post Office in Yosemite that morning to mail my extras to Lone Pine. Hope to see you on the trail. I'll be the one with the Big Bend NP patch on my hat.

                                  skd

                                  --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, "Jonathan" <jonnyboy9543@...> wrote:
                                  >
                                  > Hey all, so I'm trying to get an average idea of how much it'll cost me to do the entire trip. I have all my own gear (or access to that which I don't own), but am on a tight (college student) budget. Does anyone have any suggestions for ways that I can save a few bucks here and there, and a rough estimate as to how much it'll end up costing? I know it's important to get good, healthy meals while on the trail, but I'm not sure I can afford all the prepackaged, dehydrated meals. A few per leg of the trail is fine, but other than that...
                                  >
                                  > One last question: Due to me going to college and needing time to repack before heading out again, I was planning on going from Happy Isles to Whitney July 13-August 6 or 8. Should I anticipate more temperamental weather during that time, or are my dates fairly solid?
                                  >
                                  > Thanks to all ahead of time for your helpful guidance!
                                  >
                                • Sim Ong
                                  Hi Jonathan, I agree with John that preparing your own homemade food can save you money from having to purchase freeze dried prepackaged food.  I tried out a
                                  Message 16 of 24 , Dec 8, 2009
                                  • 0 Attachment
                                    Hi Jonathan,
                                     
                                    I agree with John that preparing your own homemade food can save you money from having to purchase freeze dried prepackaged food.  I tried out a few recipies and it worked out fine.  I have dehydrated ground beef, spaghetti sause, tomato paste, sweet corn, potatoes, and carrots.  My dinners are pasta with spaghetti sauce, sheppard pie with mesh potatoes, sloppy joes with pita bread and mixed in a few freeze dried dinners in between.  Miso soup was delicious before every dinner.  Lunches are beef jerky, pork jerky, some crackers, dried fruit and mixed nuts.
                                     
                                    Although, it took me some time to dehydrate my homemade food, it not only save money, I get to eat relatively healthy.  My only advise is to experiment at home to determine the food you like and the proportions for eat meal.  Check online for all kinds of dehydrated recepies.
                                     
                                    Sim


                                    From: John <shop@...>
                                    To: johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com
                                    Sent: Mon, December 7, 2009 5:48:01 PM
                                    Subject: [John Muir Trail] Re: Question about cost and time

                                     


                                    --- In johnmuirtrail@ yahoogroups. com, hmdsierra <no_reply@.. .> wrote:
                                    >
                                    > I've never used the freeze dried meals. All my meals were homemade
                                    from what is available from the supermarket for most of it. Noodles &
                                    Sauce, Rice and Sauce, etc. I use soy meat that you can get at health
                                    food stores and the some supermarkets. Thia does require you to cook
                                    and you would need a few more pots. There are lots of almost instant
                                    foods available. For bread I make biscuit mix or one could use
                                    Bisquick. Complete pancake mix works well but you will need a frypan.
                                    >
                                    > That time frame will intersect the summer monsoon but will usually
                                    only last an hour or so.
                                    >
                                    > --- In johnmuirtrail@ yahoogroups. com, "Jonathan" jonnyboy9543@ wrote:
                                    > >
                                    > > Hey all, so I'm trying to get an average idea of how much it'll cost
                                    me to do the entire trip. I have all my own gear (or access to that
                                    which I don't own), but am on a tight (college student) budget. Does
                                    anyone have any suggestions for ways that I can save a few bucks here
                                    and there, and a rough estimate as to how much it'll end up costing? I
                                    know it's important to get good, healthy meals while on the trail, but
                                    I'm not sure I can afford all the prepackaged, dehydrated meals. A few
                                    per leg of the trail is fine, but other than that...
                                    > >
                                    > > One last question: Due to me going to college and needing time to
                                    repack before heading out again, I was planning on going from Happy
                                    Isles to Whitney July 13-August 6 or 8. Should I anticipate more
                                    temperamental weather during that time, or are my dates fairly solid?
                                    > >
                                    > > Thanks to all ahead of time for your helpful guidance!
                                    > >
                                    >

                                  • Kevin
                                    This last summer, a spot on the backpacker s section of Reds Meadow Campground was $20/night. You can fit at least 2 tents in each spot so you can save money
                                    Message 17 of 24 , Dec 8, 2009
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                                      This last summer, a spot on the backpacker's section of Reds Meadow Campground was $20/night. You can fit at least 2 tents in each spot so you can save money by sharing with other backpackers.

                                      I got to Lone Pine on September 7, there was only 1 motel with vacancy and I had to pay over $90 for the night.

                                      --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, robert shattuck <bobolonius@...> wrote:
                                      >
                                      >
                                      > I almost forget (and it's only 320 a.m.) aside from food, while on the trail, there's also the incidental stuff . . . backpackers camp in the valley is five a night . . . Tuolomne is also five a night.
                                      > Red's varies, depending on how many in camp, but you could end up spending $9-10 just for the night . . . don't forget $10-15 for burger and what not.
                                      > Vermilion is a nice place to stop for the night, but you can end up paying $90 and up once you pay for, say, round-trip on the boat, package pick-up, shower, laundry, $20-25 per (dinner, b-fast) meal . . . beers, junk food, phone call, internet time and the BIG pisser––ALL the tent cabins used to be free the first night, but now, or this past summer, only one was free and the others, well, we had to pay, I think it was $52 . . . luckily there were four of us.
                                      > Muir trail ranch won't cost you a thing unless you pick up a drop there, or buy fuel for a few dollars.
                                      > once you come off whitney, you might be tempted to buy a burger at the portal and beers?
                                      > or get a motel room down in Lone Pine ($55)
                                      > and then there's that getting home thing . . .
                                      >
                                      >
                                      > sparklefart.blogspot.com
                                      > http://www.summitpost.org/plans/view_activity.php?post_id=6480
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      > To: johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com
                                      > From: jonnyboy9543@...
                                      > Date: Mon, 7 Dec 2009 03:33:59 +0000
                                      > Subject: [John Muir Trail] Question about cost and time
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      > Hey all, so I'm trying to get an average idea of how much it'll cost me to do the entire trip. I have all my own gear (or access to that which I don't own), but am on a tight (college student) budget. Does anyone have any suggestions for ways that I can save a few bucks here and there, and a rough estimate as to how much it'll end up costing? I know it's important to get good, healthy meals while on the trail, but I'm not sure I can afford all the prepackaged, dehydrated meals. A few per leg of the trail is fine, but other than that...
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      > One last question: Due to me going to college and needing time to repack before heading out again, I was planning on going from Happy Isles to Whitney July 13-August 6 or 8. Should I anticipate more temperamental weather during that time, or are my dates fairly solid?
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      > Thanks to all ahead of time for your helpful guidance!
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      > _________________________________________________________________
                                      > Windows Live Hotmail is faster and more secure than ever.
                                      > http://www.microsoft.com/windows/windowslive/hotmail_bl1/hotmail_bl1.aspx?ocid=PID23879::T:WLMTAGL:ON:WL:en-ww:WM_IMHM_1:092009
                                      >
                                    • Eric
                                      First, your dates should be good depending on the snow fall for the year. Check out http://cdec.water.ca.gov/cgi-progs/snow/PLOT_SWC for a plot of the snow
                                      Message 18 of 24 , Dec 9, 2009
                                      • 0 Attachment
                                        First, your dates should be good depending on the snow fall for the year. Check out

                                        http://cdec.water.ca.gov/cgi-progs/snow/PLOT_SWC

                                        for a plot of the snow course for the year. In a light snow year to average snow year, you'll have no trouble with snow or river crossings at that time. In a really heavy year, you may have to make some plans for snow. Mosquitos generally reach there peak of awful about three weeks after the snow melts away at a given elevation so if it is an average year plan on mosquitoes. Those light weight head nets can be really helpful to keep them out of your face when you are cooking.

                                        On the food topic, you can pack in more calories for less weight, volume, and $ making up your own meals. There are number of great recipes on line. Search on packbag paella to start. If you are going to buy "inflata-meals" I think Adventure Foods has the best tasting. Hiking the JMT is way more energy intensive than backpacking almost any other trail in the US so don't short yourself on calories. Shoot to come back the same weight you left. Pair back on weight in other categories before you cut back on food. Plan on 1.5 to 2 pounds per day of food weight depending on how big you are and your metabolism.

                                        On weather, the weather is usually great in the Sierra's that time of year. The thunderstorms are usually most frequent in the north around Yosemite and tend to be more frequent in August rather than July. It is likely that you will go all three weeks and never have a drop on your head. It is also possible, but unlikely, that you will have sleet and sub freezing temperatures. Be prepared. Storms don't tend to last long in the Sierras so I tend to focus on having a very waterproof tent and a warm sleeping bag to hide out in in case of a storm and minimize weight on rain gear. Use a heavy duty plastic garbage bag with two holes in it for a pack cover.

                                        The best way I have found to get to the start of the JMT on a budget is to take the train from the Bay Area. The train leaves from Emeryville, stops in Merced and then a bus takes you the rest of the way to Yosemite valley. If you have a permit you can camp in the backpackers campground next to the Awahenee for free and its a short walk to Happy Isles from there. This is an awesome spot to camp and there are no reservations needed. Getting home can be tricky but involves hitch hiking from Whitney Portal down to Lone Pine (easy) bussing it up to Toulomne Meadows and then down into the valley and reversing from there. The buses are a pain in the neck but it is the cheap way to go short of yo-yoing.

                                        One other point of advice, do use all your resupply options. It is so much more pleasent to carry less wight and resupply more frequently. My recommendations are to resupply at Red's Meadow and the Muir Trail Ranch at the very least.

                                        Eric

                                        --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, "skdupre" <duprelufkin@...> wrote:
                                        >
                                        > Jonathan,
                                        >
                                        > If your dates are solid, it's likely I'll see you on the trail. I will be starting at Happy Isles on July 12 with a finish date at Whitney Portal of Aug. 4 (I've already bought my plane tickets). I'll be faxing in my permit request, but if I don't get my dates then I'll show up at the office early. It's a little awkward being on a Monday because I can't pick up the permit the day before and hit the trail early so looks like I'll be getting a late start. I am also going to the Post Office in Yosemite that morning to mail my extras to Lone Pine. Hope to see you on the trail. I'll be the one with the Big Bend NP patch on my hat.
                                        >
                                        > skd
                                        >
                                        > --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, "Jonathan" <jonnyboy9543@> wrote:
                                        > >
                                        > > Hey all, so I'm trying to get an average idea of how much it'll cost me to do the entire trip. I have all my own gear (or access to that which I don't own), but am on a tight (college student) budget. Does anyone have any suggestions for ways that I can save a few bucks here and there, and a rough estimate as to how much it'll end up costing? I know it's important to get good, healthy meals while on the trail, but I'm not sure I can afford all the prepackaged, dehydrated meals. A few per leg of the trail is fine, but other than that...
                                        > >
                                        > > One last question: Due to me going to college and needing time to repack before heading out again, I was planning on going from Happy Isles to Whitney July 13-August 6 or 8. Should I anticipate more temperamental weather during that time, or are my dates fairly solid?
                                        > >
                                        > > Thanks to all ahead of time for your helpful guidance!
                                        > >
                                        >
                                      • Jonathan
                                        So, basically, this is what I m hearing: PACK YOUR OWN FOOD. That seems to be a big one in terms of save space, weight and money. Good thing to know. Seems
                                        Message 19 of 24 , Dec 9, 2009
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                                          So, basically, this is what I'm hearing:

                                          PACK YOUR OWN FOOD. That seems to be a big one in terms of save space, weight and money. Good thing to know.

                                          Seems like the dates I have planned out are going to be mid-mosquito season. Time to whip out the Deet.

                                          People have also mentioned public transportation. I'm in Sacramento, so basically a little ways farther up on the train route. But it'll cost me $70 there and back, not including and shuttle rides or anything like that. I guess I should be looking at about and additional $50 to cover costs for taking public transportation from Whitney back up, correct?

                                          So as far as total cost goes, should I be looking at a price somewhere around about $400-$500? That's the total that I kinda estimated in my head by factoring in cost of food, the cost of shipping stuff to drop points, transportation, and a little extra in case something goes wrong. Is that about right?

                                          --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, "Eric" <egerber@...> wrote:
                                          >
                                          > First, your dates should be good depending on the snow fall for the year. Check out
                                          >
                                          > http://cdec.water.ca.gov/cgi-progs/snow/PLOT_SWC
                                          >
                                          > for a plot of the snow course for the year. In a light snow year to average snow year, you'll have no trouble with snow or river crossings at that time. In a really heavy year, you may have to make some plans for snow. Mosquitos generally reach there peak of awful about three weeks after the snow melts away at a given elevation so if it is an average year plan on mosquitoes. Those light weight head nets can be really helpful to keep them out of your face when you are cooking.
                                          >
                                          > On the food topic, you can pack in more calories for less weight, volume, and $ making up your own meals. There are number of great recipes on line. Search on packbag paella to start. If you are going to buy "inflata-meals" I think Adventure Foods has the best tasting. Hiking the JMT is way more energy intensive than backpacking almost any other trail in the US so don't short yourself on calories. Shoot to come back the same weight you left. Pair back on weight in other categories before you cut back on food. Plan on 1.5 to 2 pounds per day of food weight depending on how big you are and your metabolism.
                                          >
                                          > On weather, the weather is usually great in the Sierra's that time of year. The thunderstorms are usually most frequent in the north around Yosemite and tend to be more frequent in August rather than July. It is likely that you will go all three weeks and never have a drop on your head. It is also possible, but unlikely, that you will have sleet and sub freezing temperatures. Be prepared. Storms don't tend to last long in the Sierras so I tend to focus on having a very waterproof tent and a warm sleeping bag to hide out in in case of a storm and minimize weight on rain gear. Use a heavy duty plastic garbage bag with two holes in it for a pack cover.
                                          >
                                          > The best way I have found to get to the start of the JMT on a budget is to take the train from the Bay Area. The train leaves from Emeryville, stops in Merced and then a bus takes you the rest of the way to Yosemite valley. If you have a permit you can camp in the backpackers campground next to the Awahenee for free and its a short walk to Happy Isles from there. This is an awesome spot to camp and there are no reservations needed. Getting home can be tricky but involves hitch hiking from Whitney Portal down to Lone Pine (easy) bussing it up to Toulomne Meadows and then down into the valley and reversing from there. The buses are a pain in the neck but it is the cheap way to go short of yo-yoing.
                                          >
                                          > One other point of advice, do use all your resupply options. It is so much more pleasent to carry less wight and resupply more frequently. My recommendations are to resupply at Red's Meadow and the Muir Trail Ranch at the very least.
                                          >
                                          > Eric
                                          >
                                          > --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, "skdupre" <duprelufkin@> wrote:
                                          > >
                                          > > Jonathan,
                                          > >
                                          > > If your dates are solid, it's likely I'll see you on the trail. I will be starting at Happy Isles on July 12 with a finish date at Whitney Portal of Aug. 4 (I've already bought my plane tickets). I'll be faxing in my permit request, but if I don't get my dates then I'll show up at the office early. It's a little awkward being on a Monday because I can't pick up the permit the day before and hit the trail early so looks like I'll be getting a late start. I am also going to the Post Office in Yosemite that morning to mail my extras to Lone Pine. Hope to see you on the trail. I'll be the one with the Big Bend NP patch on my hat.
                                          > >
                                          > > skd
                                          > >
                                          > > --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, "Jonathan" <jonnyboy9543@> wrote:
                                          > > >
                                          > > > Hey all, so I'm trying to get an average idea of how much it'll cost me to do the entire trip. I have all my own gear (or access to that which I don't own), but am on a tight (college student) budget. Does anyone have any suggestions for ways that I can save a few bucks here and there, and a rough estimate as to how much it'll end up costing? I know it's important to get good, healthy meals while on the trail, but I'm not sure I can afford all the prepackaged, dehydrated meals. A few per leg of the trail is fine, but other than that...
                                          > > >
                                          > > > One last question: Due to me going to college and needing time to repack before heading out again, I was planning on going from Happy Isles to Whitney July 13-August 6 or 8. Should I anticipate more temperamental weather during that time, or are my dates fairly solid?
                                          > > >
                                          > > > Thanks to all ahead of time for your helpful guidance!
                                          > > >
                                          > >
                                          >
                                        • Bgibson
                                          I figured about the same amount of money as you are, and came back with a bit left over.  I also repacked everything, took only a couple of the prepared
                                          Message 20 of 24 , Dec 9, 2009
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                                            I figured about the same amount of money as you are, and came back with a bit left over.  I also repacked everything, took only a couple of the prepared meals, used lots of the beef jerky I made, along with couscous and other such meals one can easily find in most grocery stores. I mailed a food drop to Muir Trail Ranch, picked up a couple of small things at Reds Meadows and VVR and was comfortable with my food supplies.  It's a wonderful hike, so take your time and enjoy it.
                                            Bob


                                            --- On Wed, 12/9/09, Jonathan <jonnyboy9543@...> wrote:

                                            From: Jonathan <jonnyboy9543@...>
                                            Subject: [John Muir Trail] Re: Question about cost and time
                                            To: johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com
                                            Date: Wednesday, December 9, 2009, 7:19 PM

                                             
                                            So, basically, this is what I'm hearing:

                                            PACK YOUR OWN FOOD. That seems to be a big one in terms of save space, weight and money. Good thing to know.

                                            Seems like the dates I have planned out are going to be mid-mosquito season. Time to whip out the Deet.

                                            People have also mentioned public transportation. I'm in Sacramento, so basically a little ways farther up on the train route. But it'll cost me $70 there and back, not including and shuttle rides or anything like that. I guess I should be looking at about and additional $50 to cover costs for taking public transportation from Whitney back up, correct?

                                            So as far as total cost goes, should I be looking at a price somewhere around about $400-$500? That's the total that I kinda estimated in my head by factoring in cost of food, the cost of shipping stuff to drop points, transportation, and a little extra in case something goes wrong. Is that about right?

                                            --- In johnmuirtrail@ yahoogroups. com, "Eric" <egerber@... > wrote:
                                            >
                                            > First, your dates should be good depending on the snow fall for the year. Check out
                                            >
                                            > http://cdec. water.ca. gov/cgi-progs/ snow/PLOT_ SWC
                                            >
                                            > for a plot of the snow course for the year. In a light snow year to average snow year, you'll have no trouble with snow or river crossings at that time. In a really heavy year, you may have to make some plans for snow. Mosquitos generally reach there peak of awful about three weeks after the snow melts away at a given elevation so if it is an average year plan on mosquitoes. Those light weight head nets can be really helpful to keep them out of your face when you are cooking.
                                            >
                                            > On the food topic, you can pack in more calories for less weight, volume, and $ making up your own meals. There are number of great recipes on line. Search on packbag paella to start. If you are going to buy "inflata-meals" I think Adventure Foods has the best tasting. Hiking the JMT is way more energy intensive than backpacking almost any other trail in the US so don't short yourself on calories. Shoot to come back the same weight you left. Pair back on weight in other categories before you cut back on food. Plan on 1.5 to 2 pounds per day of food weight depending on how big you are and your metabolism.
                                            >
                                            > On weather, the weather is usually great in the Sierra's that time of year. The thunderstorms are usually most frequent in the north around Yosemite and tend to be more frequent in August rather than July. It is likely that you will go all three weeks and never have a drop on your head. It is also possible, but unlikely, that you will have sleet and sub freezing temperatures. Be prepared. Storms don't tend to last long in the Sierras so I tend to focus on having a very waterproof tent and a warm sleeping bag to hide out in in case of a storm and minimize weight on rain gear. Use a heavy duty plastic garbage bag with two holes in it for a pack cover.
                                            >
                                            > The best way I have found to get to the start of the JMT on a budget is to take the train from the Bay Area. The train leaves from Emeryville, stops in Merced and then a bus takes you the rest of the way to Yosemite valley. If you have a permit you can camp in the backpackers campground next to the Awahenee for free and its a short walk to Happy Isles from there. This is an awesome spot to camp and there are no reservations needed. Getting home can be tricky but involves hitch hiking from Whitney Portal down to Lone Pine (easy) bussing it up to Toulomne Meadows and then down into the valley and reversing from there. The buses are a pain in the neck but it is the cheap way to go short of yo-yoing.
                                            >
                                            > One other point of advice, do use all your resupply options. It is so much more pleasent to carry less wight and resupply more frequently. My recommendations are to resupply at Red's Meadow and the Muir Trail Ranch at the very least.
                                            >
                                            > Eric
                                            >
                                            > --- In johnmuirtrail@ yahoogroups. com, "skdupre" <duprelufkin@ > wrote:
                                            > >
                                            > > Jonathan,
                                            > >
                                            > > If your dates are solid, it's likely I'll see you on the trail. I will be starting at Happy Isles on July 12 with a finish date at Whitney Portal of Aug. 4 (I've already bought my plane tickets). I'll be faxing in my permit request, but if I don't get my dates then I'll show up at the office early. It's a little awkward being on a Monday because I can't pick up the permit the day before and hit the trail early so looks like I'll be getting a late start. I am also going to the Post Office in Yosemite that morning to mail my extras to Lone Pine. Hope to see you on the trail. I'll be the one with the Big Bend NP patch on my hat.
                                            > >
                                            > > skd
                                            > >
                                            > > --- In johnmuirtrail@ yahoogroups. com, "Jonathan" <jonnyboy9543@ > wrote:
                                            > > >
                                            > > > Hey all, so I'm trying to get an average idea of how much it'll cost me to do the entire trip. I have all my own gear (or access to that which I don't own), but am on a tight (college student) budget. Does anyone have any suggestions for ways that I can save a few bucks here and there, and a rough estimate as to how much it'll end up costing? I know it's important to get good, healthy meals while on the trail, but I'm not sure I can afford all the prepackaged, dehydrated meals. A few per leg of the trail is fine, but other than that...
                                            > > >
                                            > > > One last question: Due to me going to college and needing time to repack before heading out again, I was planning on going from Happy Isles to Whitney July 13-August 6 or 8. Should I anticipate more temperamental weather during that time, or are my dates fairly solid?
                                            > > >
                                            > > > Thanks to all ahead of time for your helpful guidance!
                                            > > >
                                            > >
                                            >


                                          • ed_rodriguez52@yahoo.com
                                            Hi Jonathan, I also live in Sac if a family member could not give me a ride to YV was planning to take the Grayhound bus(8002132222) to Mercer then take YRATS
                                            Message 21 of 24 , Dec 9, 2009
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                                              Hi Jonathan, I also live in Sac if a family member could not give me a ride to YV was planning to take the Grayhound bus(8002132222) to Mercer then take YRATS (8779892787)to YV at the end going to take TAST (8009221930)to Reno and then the grayhound Sac.

                                              Sent on the Sprint® Now Network from my BlackBerry®


                                              From: "Jonathan" <jonnyboy9543@...>
                                              Date: Thu, 10 Dec 2009 00:19:58 -0000
                                              To: <johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com>
                                              Subject: [John Muir Trail] Re: Question about cost and time

                                               

                                              So, basically, this is what I'm hearing:

                                              PACK YOUR OWN FOOD. That seems to be a big one in terms of save space, weight and money. Good thing to know.

                                              Seems like the dates I have planned out are going to be mid-mosquito season. Time to whip out the Deet.

                                              People have also mentioned public transportation. I'm in Sacramento, so basically a little ways farther up on the train route. But it'll cost me $70 there and back, not including and shuttle rides or anything like that. I guess I should be looking at about and additional $50 to cover costs for taking public transportation from Whitney back up, correct?

                                              So as far as total cost goes, should I be looking at a price somewhere around about $400-$500? That's the total that I kinda estimated in my head by factoring in cost of food, the cost of shipping stuff to drop points, transportation, and a little extra in case something goes wrong. Is that about right?

                                              --- In johnmuirtrail@ yahoogroups. com, "Eric" <egerber@... > wrote:
                                              >
                                              > First, your dates should be good depending on the snow fall for the year. Check out
                                              >
                                              > http://cdec. water.ca. gov/cgi-progs/ snow/PLOT_ SWC
                                              >
                                              > for a plot of the snow course for the year. In a light snow year to average snow year, you'll have no trouble with snow or river crossings at that time. In a really heavy year, you may have to make some plans for snow. Mosquitos generally reach there peak of awful about three weeks after the snow melts away at a given elevation so if it is an average year plan on mosquitoes. Those light weight head nets can be really helpful to keep them out of your face when you are cooking.
                                              >
                                              > On the food topic, you can pack in more calories for less weight, volume, and $ making up your own meals. There are number of great recipes on line. Search on packbag paella to start. If you are going to buy "inflata-meals" I think Adventure Foods has the best tasting. Hiking the JMT is way more energy intensive than backpacking almost any other trail in the US so don't short yourself on calories. Shoot to come back the same weight you left. Pair back on weight in other categories before you cut back on food. Plan on 1.5 to 2 pounds per day of food weight depending on how big you are and your metabolism.
                                              >
                                              > On weather, the weather is usually great in the Sierra's that time of year. The thunderstorms are usually most frequent in the north around Yosemite and tend to be more frequent in August rather than July. It is likely that you will go all three weeks and never have a drop on your head. It is also possible, but unlikely, that you will have sleet and sub freezing temperatures. Be prepared. Storms don't tend to last long in the Sierras so I tend to focus on having a very waterproof tent and a warm sleeping bag to hide out in in case of a storm and minimize weight on rain gear. Use a heavy duty plastic garbage bag with two holes in it for a pack cover.
                                              >
                                              > The best way I have found to get to the start of the JMT on a budget is to take the train from the Bay Area. The train leaves from Emeryville, stops in Merced and then a bus takes you the rest of the way to Yosemite valley. If you have a permit you can camp in the backpackers campground next to the Awahenee for free and its a short walk to Happy Isles from there. This is an awesome spot to camp and there are no reservations needed. Getting home can be tricky but involves hitch hiking from Whitney Portal down to Lone Pine (easy) bussing it up to Toulomne Meadows and then down into the valley and reversing from there. The buses are a pain in the neck but it is the cheap way to go short of yo-yoing.
                                              >
                                              > One other point of advice, do use all your resupply options. It is so much more pleasent to carry less wight and resupply more frequently. My recommendations are to resupply at Red's Meadow and the Muir Trail Ranch at the very least.
                                              >
                                              > Eric
                                              >
                                              > --- In johnmuirtrail@ yahoogroups. com, "skdupre" <duprelufkin@ > wrote:
                                              > >
                                              > > Jonathan,
                                              > >
                                              > > If your dates are solid, it's likely I'll see you on the trail. I will be starting at Happy Isles on July 12 with a finish date at Whitney Portal of Aug. 4 (I've already bought my plane tickets). I'll be faxing in my permit request, but if I don't get my dates then I'll show up at the office early. It's a little awkward being on a Monday because I can't pick up the permit the day before and hit the trail early so looks like I'll be getting a late start. I am also going to the Post Office in Yosemite that morning to mail my extras to Lone Pine. Hope to see you on the trail. I'll be the one with the Big Bend NP patch on my hat.
                                              > >
                                              > > skd
                                              > >
                                              > > --- In johnmuirtrail@ yahoogroups. com, "Jonathan" <jonnyboy9543@ > wrote:
                                              > > >
                                              > > > Hey all, so I'm trying to get an average idea of how much it'll cost me to do the entire trip. I have all my own gear (or access to that which I don't own), but am on a tight (college student) budget. Does anyone have any suggestions for ways that I can save a few bucks here and there, and a rough estimate as to how much it'll end up costing? I know it's important to get good, healthy meals while on the trail, but I'm not sure I can afford all the prepackaged, dehydrated meals. A few per leg of the trail is fine, but other than that...
                                              > > >
                                              > > > One last question: Due to me going to college and needing time to repack before heading out again, I was planning on going from Happy Isles to Whitney July 13-August 6 or 8. Should I anticipate more temperamental weather during that time, or are my dates fairly solid?
                                              > > >
                                              > > > Thanks to all ahead of time for your helpful guidance!
                                              > > >
                                              > >
                                              >

                                            • robert shattuck
                                              Sacramento . . . there s the missing link. Yep, as has been mentioned, you should just do AMTRAK. they might be even cheaper this year––in years past I ve
                                              Message 22 of 24 , Dec 9, 2009
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                                                Sacramento . . . there's the missing link. Yep, as has been mentioned, you should just do AMTRAK. they might be even cheaper this year––in years past I've paid roughly $50 for one way from SF . . . last summer it was only $35. 

                                                Thumbing from Lone Pine isn't too big a deal and although I head back into the valley, You could easily stay on 395 all the way to Reno and from there, catch the greyhound to SAC. 

                                                No doubt you could do it in one day. It would be good to know when the bus leaves from Reno to Sac, so that it isn't a mystery and you don't end up sitting in Reno all night. 

                                                Again though, if you've got more time than cash, I'd do a little research and see what's between Lee Vining and Reno. You might want to just take an extra day, get a cheap motel, or a camp spot and enjoy. 

                                                The best place to stay in Lone Pine, is the Dow Villa. You can get what I call, "the backpacker special" for about $55-60 . . . two beds (or ask for one double) and a sink. Toilet and showers down the hall. Very clean. Best thing though is the HOT TUB. Perfect place to spend the night after coming off the trail. 

                                                sparklefart.blogspot.com
                                                http://www.summitpost.org/plans/view_activity.php?post_id=6480






                                                To: johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com
                                                From: jonnyboy9543@...
                                                Date: Thu, 10 Dec 2009 00:19:58 +0000
                                                Subject: [John Muir Trail] Re: Question about cost and time

                                                 
                                                So, basically, this is what I'm hearing:

                                                PACK YOUR OWN FOOD. That seems to be a big one in terms of save space, weight and money. Good thing to know.

                                                Seems like the dates I have planned out are going to be mid-mosquito season. Time to whip out the Deet.

                                                People have also mentioned public transportation. I'm in Sacramento, so basically a little ways farther up on the train route. But it'll cost me $70 there and back, not including and shuttle rides or anything like that. I guess I should be looking at about and additional $50 to cover costs for taking public transportation from Whitney back up, correct?

                                                So as far as total cost goes, should I be looking at a price somewhere around about $400-$500? That's the total that I kinda estimated in my head by factoring in cost of food, the cost of shipping stuff to drop points, transportation, and a little extra in case something goes wrong. Is that about right?

                                                --- In johnmuirtrail@ yahoogroups. com, "Eric" <egerber@... > wrote:
                                                >
                                                > First, your dates should be good depending on the snow fall for the year. Check out
                                                >
                                                > http://cdec. water.ca. gov/cgi-progs/ snow/PLOT_ SWC
                                                >
                                                > for a plot of the snow course for the year. In a light snow year to average snow year, you'll have no trouble with snow or river crossings at that time. In a really heavy year, you may have to make some plans for snow. Mosquitos generally reach there peak of awful about three weeks after the snow melts away at a given elevation so if it is an average year plan on mosquitoes. Those light weight head nets can be really helpful to keep them out of your face when you are cooking.
                                                >
                                                > On the food topic, you can pack in more calories for less weight, volume, and $ making up your own meals. There are number of great recipes on line. Search on packbag paella to start. If you are going to buy "inflata-meals" I think Adventure Foods has the best tasting. Hiking the JMT is way more energy intensive than backpacking almost any other trail in the US so don't short yourself on calories. Shoot to come back the same weight you left. Pair back on weight in other categories before you cut back on food. Plan on 1.5 to 2 pounds per day of food weight depending on how big you are and your metabolism.
                                                >
                                                > On weather, the weather is usually great in the Sierra's that time of year. The thunderstorms are usually most frequent in the north around Yosemite and tend to be more frequent in August rather than July. It is likely that you will go all three weeks and never have a drop on your head. It is also possible, but unlikely, that you will have sleet and sub freezing temperatures. Be prepared. Storms don't tend to last long in the Sierras so I tend to focus on having a very waterproof tent and a warm sleeping bag to hide out in in case of a storm and minimize weight on rain gear. Use a heavy duty plastic garbage bag with two holes in it for a pack cover.
                                                >
                                                > The best way I have found to get to the start of the JMT on a budget is to take the train from the Bay Area. The train leaves from Emeryville, stops in Merced and then a bus takes you the rest of the way to Yosemite valley. If you have a permit you can camp in the backpackers campground next to the Awahenee for free and its a short walk to Happy Isles from there. This is an awesome spot to camp and there are no reservations needed. Getting home can be tricky but involves hitch hiking from Whitney Portal down to Lone Pine (easy) bussing it up to Toulomne Meadows and then down into the valley and reversing from there. The buses are a pain in the neck but it is the cheap way to go short of yo-yoing.
                                                >
                                                > One other point of advice, do use all your resupply options. It is so much more pleasent to carry less wight and resupply more frequently. My recommendations are to resupply at Red's Meadow and the Muir Trail Ranch at the very least.
                                                >
                                                > Eric
                                                >
                                                > --- In johnmuirtrail@ yahoogroups. com, "skdupre" <duprelufkin@ > wrote:
                                                >>
                                                >> Jonathan,
                                                >>
                                                >> If your dates are solid, it's likely I'll see you on the trail. I will be starting at Happy Isles on July 12 with a finish date at Whitney Portal of Aug. 4 (I've already bought my plane tickets). I'll be faxing in my permit request, but if I don't get my dates then I'll show up at the office early. It's a little awkward being on a Monday because I can't pick up the permit the day before and hit the trail early so looks like I'll be getting a late start. I am also going to the Post Office in Yosemite that morning to mail my extras to Lone Pine. Hope to see you on the trail. I'll be the one with the Big Bend NP patch on my hat.
                                                >>
                                                >> skd
                                                >>
                                                >> --- In johnmuirtrail@ yahoogroups. com, "Jonathan" <jonnyboy9543@ > wrote:
                                                >>>
                                                >>> Hey all, so I'm trying to get an average idea of how much it'll cost me to do the entire trip. I have all my own gear (or access to that which I don't own), but am on a tight (college student) budget. Does anyone have any suggestions for ways that I can save a few bucks here and there, and a rough estimate as to how much it'll end up costing? I know it's important to get good, healthy meals while on the trail, but I'm not sure I can afford all the prepackaged, dehydrated meals. A few per leg of the trail is fine, but other than that...
                                                >>>
                                                >>> One last question: Due to me going to college and needing time to repack before heading out again, I was planning on going from Happy Isles to Whitney July 13-August 6 or 8. Should I anticipate more temperamental weather during that time, or are my dates fairly solid?
                                                >>>
                                                >>> Thanks to all ahead of time for your helpful guidance!
                                                >>>
                                                >>
                                                >




                                                Get gifts for them and cashback for you. Try Bing now.
                                              • Eric
                                                Per the prior post, the Dow Villa is great and I d second that recommendation. One other potential financial burden that you may not be accounting for is the
                                                Message 23 of 24 , Dec 19, 2009
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                                                  Per the prior post, the Dow Villa is great and I'd second that recommendation. One other potential financial burden that you may not be accounting for is the VVR. The Vermillion Valley Resort is close to the trail and the last easy supply (but not resupply) stop headed south located on Lake Edison. No matter how much food you pack you will almost certainly burn more calories than you take in. The VVR is an important chance to load up on (not freeze dried) calories before the difficult second half of the trail. The problem is that the place charges an arm and a leg and it is difficult to get out of there for less than $100. They offer showers and laundry (although the facilities are marginal and seem to be slipping over the years). The VVR is a mixed blessing and most people get surprised by how much money they blow there when they go to settle up. The pie is fabulous but be prepared. Also plan on some similar but not quite as steep costs at Red's Meadow if you stop there.

                                                  Eric



                                                  --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, "Jonathan" <jonnyboy9543@...> wrote:
                                                  >
                                                  > Hey all, so I'm trying to get an average idea of how much it'll cost me to do the entire trip. I have all my own gear (or access to that which I don't own), but am on a tight (college student) budget. Does anyone have any suggestions for ways that I can save a few bucks here and there, and a rough estimate as to how much it'll end up costing? I know it's important to get good, healthy meals while on the trail, but I'm not sure I can afford all the prepackaged, dehydrated meals. A few per leg of the trail is fine, but other than that...
                                                  >
                                                  > One last question: Due to me going to college and needing time to repack before heading out again, I was planning on going from Happy Isles to Whitney July 13-August 6 or 8. Should I anticipate more temperamental weather during that time, or are my dates fairly solid?
                                                  >
                                                  > Thanks to all ahead of time for your helpful guidance!
                                                  >
                                                • John Ladd
                                                  Sorry - I keep wanting to do a long posting of thoughts about JMT on the cheap, but I keep putting it off. So here s a shorter version that turned out to be
                                                  Message 24 of 24 , Dec 19, 2009
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                                                    Sorry - I keep wanting to do a long posting of thoughts about JMT on the cheap, but I keep putting it off.  So here's a shorter version that turned out to be not-so-short once I got going.

                                                    1) As others have noted, there are acceptable hitchhike plus public transit options.

                                                    2) Freeze dried food is a poor choice - expensive and hard to get anywhere enough of it into a bearcan.

                                                    3) Resupplies are expensive.  But you can do the MTR on a single resupply at the midway point of the trip - Muir Trail Ranch.  You need to be careful about your food selection and be willing to carry 10-20 lbs of food as you start and when you leave MTR.  You need a good sturdy pack for this weight and a stove that will cook food efficiently.  The weight will push you in the direction of boots rather than trail runners.

                                                    Each 5-gal plastic paint can at MTR will cost you about $75 (cost of the can, postage and the $50 MTR fee to bring it from the nearest post office). You can squeeze up to 25 lbs of food into a single paint can if you chose your foods carefully enough.  There are places where the resupply charges are somewhat less, but MTR is the only place where you can do the whole trip on  a single resupply.

                                                    Note also that resupplies south of MTR are either VERY expensive (pay a mule team hundreds to pack food in to you) or take you WAY out of your way (Kearsarge Pass, Onion Valley Trailhead and Independence).  So you may well be forced to use MTR even on a multi-resupply plan.  So pay MTR the $50 fee and don't complain about it - they do a lot of work for their $50.

                                                    You need to calculate your caloric needs carefully.  For me, experience tells me that I can afford to lose 1-2 lbs per week of travel without adverse consequences (like being really cold at night) or undue hunger, which means that I can burn 500-1,000 calories per day less than I eat.  (Figure 1 lb lost for every 3500 calories of shortfall).  I typically seem to burn about 2800-3000 daily calories on a trip and eat about 2000-2250). Your needs will be higher - one of the benefits of age is that we old guys use calories more efficiently than the young and you may be too skinny to afford the weight loss.  Lots of stuff on the web on calculating calories (some of it wildly inaccurate)

                                                    Then figure the weight you are willing to carry to get the desired energy density of your food.  I go with very energy-dense foods (lots of oils and fats), so I can get by on about a lb. per day of food (2250 calories with 16 oz. of food at 140 calories per oz.)  If you are willing to carry 2 lbs per day, but need more calories, you might be something like 32 oz. at 120 cal/oz for 3,840 calories per day.  Most people would chose somewhere in between these.

                                                    Chose energy-dense food (lots of calories per unit weight).  Due to the basic biochemistry of food, protein and carbohydrates are always less than 110 calories per oz. even with all water removed.  Fats are about 220 calories per gram.  So chose low-water-content foods which naturally have fats (hard cheese, pepperoni, nuts, peanut butter) or chose food where you can field-mix oils and fats into carbs or proteins.  E.g., buy dried Hummus powder or dried Tabouleh and field mix them with lots of olive oil.  My favorite food like this is my standard breakfast of 5-minute polenta mixed 50-50 with almond meal and cooked with an ungodly amount of butter oil (butter with the water simmered out and the solids skimmed off - surprisingly stable) sweetened with Splenda and a little maple sugar.

                                                    To fit 10+ days of food into a bearcan imposes additional constraints - you need physically dense foods (calories per unit volume).  This pretty much rules out freeze dried.  The process essentially takes the water out of pre-cooked foods but leaves air voids in the food (where the water used to me) making them fluffy.  It also (sadly) rules out minute rice.

                                                    I'm working on a little essay of how to cook in the field, which will include more on calorie-counting, a trail-food philosophy and a number of suggested recipes that are both energy-dense and physically-dense.  I'll post it in the group's files area and let you know when it's there.  I suspect the cost of the food would be under $4 per day if you chose some of the cheaper alternatives.  (I will also suggests some higher end alternatives if you can afford them - like using hazelnut oil sometime rather than olive oil or the wonderful-but-pricey prosciutto blanco rather than pepperoni)

                                                    So you can get total food plus resupply costs down to about $80 for the food and $75 for the resupply = $155.  For another $80 you can eat pretty well.

                                                    John Curran Ladd
                                                    1616 Castro Street
                                                    San Francisco, CA  94114-3707
                                                    415-648-9279


                                                    On Sun, Dec 6, 2009 at 7:33 PM, Jonathan <jonnyboy9543@...> wrote:
                                                     

                                                    Hey all, so I'm trying to get an average idea of how much it'll cost me to do the entire trip. I have all my own gear (or access to that which I don't own), but am on a tight (college student) budget. Does anyone have any suggestions for ways that I can save a few bucks here and there, and a rough estimate as to how much it'll end up costing? I know it's important to get good, healthy meals while on the trail, but I'm not sure I can afford all the prepackaged, dehydrated meals. A few per leg of the trail is fine, but other than that...


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