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Shelter, Sleep System, and Pack under 5 pounds

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  • allison1288
    If anyone is contemplating their gear choices for their big three , here are mine. Total weight is at 4.38 pounds and it looks like my base weight will be
    Message 1 of 20 , Jun 10, 2014

      If anyone is contemplating their gear choices for their "big three", here are mine. Total weight is at 4.38 pounds and it looks like my base weight will be about 12 pounds including toiletries and my BV500. Everything is coming together quite nicely!


      Trail to Summit: The Big Three: Under 5 Pounds



      My JMT page with my other posts for those interested: Trail to Summit: John Muir Trail 2014

       

    • Arla Hile
      That s really strong work since you re not sharing a tent! I m sharing a tent so my Big 3 comes in at 2.54 lbs, which includes a pillow, however I had to save
      Message 2 of 20 , Jun 10, 2014
        That's really strong work since you're not sharing a tent! I'm sharing a tent so my Big 3 comes in at 2.54 lbs, which includes a pillow, however I had to save my pennies for cuben fiber gear from Z packs :)

        Pack
        Z packs Arc Blast w/options18.1
        Sleeping
        Katabatic Alsek 22F quilt20.6
        Thermarest Z-lite sol, trimmed7.75
        Goosefeet down pillow1.7
        Tent - shared item
        Zpacks Hexamid 2 x 50%10.62
        Total40.67




        On Tuesday, June 10, 2014 10:53 AM, "allison.nadler88@... [johnmuirtrail]" <johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com> wrote:


         
        If anyone is contemplating their gear choices for their "big three", here are mine. Total weight is at 4.38 pounds and it looks like my base weight will be about 12 pounds including toiletries and my BV500. Everything is coming together quite nicely!

        Trail to Summit: The Big Three: Under 5 Pounds
        In just over a month, I will be flying into California to begin my John Muir Trail thru hike. I have just about everything I'll need to hike efficiently and com...
        Preview by Yahoo


        My JMT page with my other posts for those interested: Trail to Summit: John Muir Trail 2014
        Trail to Summit: John Muir Trail 2014
        Photo courtesy of The Muir Project In the past couple years I have explored much of the White Mountains as a peak bagger, hiking the highest mountains in the stat...
        Preview by Yahoo
         



        Cheers,
        Arla
      • longritchie
        Arla, you left your pack out of the total. Including that would make it 58.8 oz (3.7 lbs). If you had to carry the other half of the tent the weight would be
        Message 3 of 20 , Jun 10, 2014
          Arla, you left your pack out of the total. Including that would make it 58.8 oz (3.7 lbs). If you had to carry the other half of the tent the weight would be almost identical to Allison's.

          Nice that you have a pillow though!
        • eric moss
          I can t tell if I m going about it all wrong. I m getting a custom pack that s light, but nowhere near that light. Same with tent and bag/pad. It s well over
          Message 4 of 20 , Jun 10, 2014
            I can't tell if I'm going about it all wrong.  I'm getting a custom pack that's light, but nowhere near that light.  Same with tent and bag/pad.  It's well over 10lb.  Talking to some people makes me think I'll die on the Golden Staircase, assuming I even make it that far.  Others say I'll be far more comfortable and well-rested with this stuff than without.  I guess I'll report on the post-hike survey which happened.


            On Tue, Jun 10, 2014 at 2:42 PM, longritchie <no_reply@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
             

            Arla, you left your pack out of the total. Including that would make it 58.8 oz (3.7 lbs). If you had to carry the other half of the tent the weight would be almost identical to Allison's.

            Nice that you have a pillow though!


          • Carolsteveyoung
            That was really interesting with all the pics and details. In 99 (first time on JMT) we had snow on Aug 6. Less than an inch. We were approaching Muir Pass
            Message 5 of 20 , Jun 10, 2014
              That was really interesting with all the pics and details. 

              In '99 (first time on JMT) we had snow on Aug 6. Less than an inch. We were approaching Muir Pass but still in trees (SoBo). We had ice topping our water bottles every morning for about two weeks. Days were sunny and nice with rain just one day.

              Steve Young
              Geneva IL



              On Jun 10, 2014, at 12:53 PM, "allison.nadler88@... [johnmuirtrail]" <johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

               

              If anyone is contemplating their gear choices for their "big three", here are mine. Total weight is at 4.38 pounds and it looks like my base weight will be about 12 pounds including toiletries and my BV500. Everything is coming together quite nicely!


              Trail to Summit: The Big Three: Under 5 Pounds



              My JMT page with my other posts for those interested: Trail to Summit: John Muir Trail 2014

               

              Reply via web post Reply to sender Reply to group Start a New Topic Messages in this topic (1)
            • Arla Hile
              Thanks longritchie! I had not done the math before today so I must have missed the cell in Excel.  When you re a small female this stuff is really important,
              Message 6 of 20 , Jun 10, 2014
                Thanks longritchie! I had not done the math before today so I must have missed the cell in Excel. 

                When you're a small female this stuff is really important, IMO. I can't see where Allison could save any more weight on those items and still be safe and comfortable. 

                Arla


                On Tuesday, June 10, 2014 12:15 PM, "Carolsteveyoung carolsteveyoung@... [johnmuirtrail]" <johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com> wrote:


                 
                That was really interesting with all the pics and details. 

                In '99 (first time on JMT) we had snow on Aug 6. Less than an inch. We were approaching Muir Pass but still in trees (SoBo). We had ice topping our water bottles every morning for about two weeks. Days were sunny and nice with rain just one day.

                Steve Young
                Geneva IL



                On Jun 10, 2014, at 12:53 PM, "allison.nadler88@... [johnmuirtrail]" <johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

                 
                If anyone is contemplating their gear choices for their "big three", here are mine. Total weight is at 4.38 pounds and it looks like my base weight will be about 12 pounds including toiletries and my BV500. Everything is coming together quite nicely!



                My JMT page with my other posts for those interested: Trail to Summit: John Muir Trail 2014
                 
                Reply via web post Reply to sender Reply to group Start a New Topic Messages in this topic (1)


              • Arla Hile
                Allison, I d be curious about the rest of your gear. Also wondering how warm that Klymit pad is. Arla On Tuesday, June 10, 2014 12:15 PM, Carolsteveyoung
                Message 7 of 20 , Jun 10, 2014
                  Allison,
                  I'd be curious about the rest of your gear. Also wondering how warm that Klymit pad is.

                  Arla


                  On Tuesday, June 10, 2014 12:15 PM, "Carolsteveyoung carolsteveyoung@... [johnmuirtrail]" <johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com> wrote:


                   
                  That was really interesting with all the pics and details. 

                  In '99 (first time on JMT) we had snow on Aug 6. Less than an inch. We were approaching Muir Pass but still in trees (SoBo). We had ice topping our water bottles every morning for about two weeks. Days were sunny and nice with rain just one day.

                  Steve Young
                  Geneva IL



                  On Jun 10, 2014, at 12:53 PM, "allison.nadler88@... [johnmuirtrail]" <johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

                   
                  If anyone is contemplating their gear choices for their "big three", here are mine. Total weight is at 4.38 pounds and it looks like my base weight will be about 12 pounds including toiletries and my BV500. Everything is coming together quite nicely!



                  My JMT page with my other posts for those interested: Trail to Summit: John Muir Trail 2014
                   
                  Reply via web post Reply to sender Reply to group Start a New Topic Messages in this topic (1)


                • longritchie
                  When you re a small female this stuff is really important, IMO. It s also important if your knees are wonky. I can t see where Allison could save any more
                  Message 8 of 20 , Jun 10, 2014
                    "When you're a small female this stuff is really important, IMO."

                    It's also important if your knees are wonky.


                    "I can't see where Allison could save any more weight on those items and still be safe and comfortable."

                    Oh, she could. But as you've discovered there's a weight level that's not too hard to get to but harder to push below.


                    I'm actually less interested in the big three than I am in total weight. The last time I walked the JMT I did it without resupply and my pack at Happy Isles was a little over 23 lbs. At the Portal it weighed a little under 12 lbs, including the extra food. There were a lot of miles where it felt like I was carrying a slightly oversized daypack, which was quite nice. And if there's a next time thepack will be a little lighter. The first time I walked the JMT my pack after the MTR resupply weighed close to 60 lbs. I was happy then too.
                  • mtman492000
                    This is a valuable discussion. Last year along the JMT my big three weighed slightly under 3 pounds: ULA Amp, 14.3 ounces Nunatak Arc Specialist w/stuff sack,
                    Message 9 of 20 , Jun 10, 2014
                      This is a valuable discussion. Last year along the JMT my big three weighed slightly under 3 pounds:

                      ULA Amp, 14.3 ounces
                      Nunatak Arc Specialist w/stuff sack, 17.1 ounces
                      BPL Nano Bivy w/stuff sack, 4.85 ounces
                      GG medium ground cloth, 1.6 ounces
                      MLD Patrol tarp w/3mm lines, 5.7 ounces
                      GG Nightlite pad, 3.4 ounces

                      2.93 pounds

                      If I add in the tent stakes I would be at 3.1 pounds. I could shave some of that weight by bringing titanium stakes that are lighter but not very effective when camping in the wind in the alpine zones. 

                      I was extremely agile and comfortable on the trail. I carried a Bare Boxer canister and we resupplied at MTR. Was I comfortable? During the day yes, at night, no. There were several nights I was cold, even with all my clothing on. 

                      In 2005, I had a heavier big three (about 5.5 pounds), was warmer, slept better but could still have used a more comfortable pad especially during the latter 2-3 days of my 10-day thru-hike after I'd lost about ten pounds. While that was only nine years ago, significant improvements have been made in lightweight gear and it is easier, though more expensive, to travel light with a modicum of comfort. 

                      This year, I am opting for a Big Agnes UL Fly Creek 1, a Marmot Plasma 15 and Thermarest NeoAir XLite along with a Granite Gear Crown VC with upgrade. Total slightly under 6.4 pounds. I expect to add to night comfort at the slight expense of my day comfort. Having said that I'm not looking at any 24-27 mile days like I did back in '05.

                      The important element is to match your equipment to your hiking style and the environmental conditions you expect. Carefully consider your options and then hike your own hike. 
                    • John Ladd
                      When talking about total weight, don t forget body weight. For some (not all), it s easier to trim down body weight than base weight and the effect is about
                      Message 10 of 20 , Jun 10, 2014
                        When talking about total weight, don't forget body weight. For some (not all), it's easier to trim down body weight than base weight and the effect is about the same.  My hiking is way easier at a body weight 170 than it was at 225, though it took me a long time and a fair amount of determination to do it. I think it's why a 52 lb pack at the start of a hike doesn't feel like a particularly big deal to me though many would blanch at the thought.

                        And it's almost always cheaper to do reduce body weight than base weight.

                        You people who are already skinny can ignore this. 

                        John Curran Ladd
                        1616 Castro Street
                        San Francisco, CA  94114-3707
                        415-648-9279


                        On Tue, Jun 10, 2014 at 1:57 PM, longritchie <no_reply@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
                         


                        "When you're a small female this stuff is really important, IMO."

                        It's also important if your knees are wonky.


                        "I can't see where Allison could save any more weight on those items and still be safe and comfortable."

                        Oh, she could. But as you've discovered there's a weight level that's not too hard to get to but harder to push below.

                        I'm actually less interested in the big three than I am in total weight. The last time I walked the JMT I did it without resupply and my pack at Happy Isles was a little over 23 lbs. At the Portal it weighed a little under 12 lbs, including the extra food. There were a lot of miles where it felt like I was carrying a slightly oversized daypack, which was quite nice. And if there's a next time thepack will be a little lighter. The first time I walked the JMT my pack after the MTR resupply weighed close to 60 lbs. I was happy then too.


                      • Roleigh Martin
                        Totally agree. When you hike, think of the weight to carry as spine-out, not skin-out. It is your skeletal frame and muscles that are doing the work,
                        Message 11 of 20 , Jun 10, 2014
                          Totally agree.  When you hike, think of the weight to carry as spine-out, not skin-out.  It is your skeletal frame and muscles that are doing the work, everything else is just load.

                          Easiest way, totally easiest way, to lose some weight fast before the hike, is to get the bestseller book written by a top M.D. in England, the FastDiet by Dr. Michael Mosley.


                          Plus the book will help make you live healthier as long as you remain on the diet ( skip it on the JMT though ).


                          -------------------------------------------------
                          Visit my Google Profile (lots of very interesting research links)
                          _



                          On Tue, Jun 10, 2014 at 3:22 PM, John Ladd johnladd@... [johnmuirtrail] <johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
                           

                          When talking about total weight, don't forget body weight. For some (not all), it's easier to trim down body weight than base weight and the effect is about the same.  My hiking is way easier at a body weight 170 than it was at 225, though it took me a long time and a fair amount of determination to do it. I think it's why a 52 lb pack at the start of a hike doesn't feel like a particularly big deal to me though many would blanch at the thought.

                          And it's almost always cheaper to do reduce body weight than base weight.

                          You people who are already skinny can ignore this. 

                          John Curran Ladd
                          1616 Castro Street
                          San Francisco, CA  94114-3707
                          415-648-9279


                          On Tue, Jun 10, 2014 at 1:57 PM, longritchie <no_reply@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
                           


                          "When you're a small female this stuff is really important, IMO."

                          It's also important if your knees are wonky.


                          "I can't see where Allison could save any more weight on those items and still be safe and comfortable."

                          Oh, she could. But as you've discovered there's a weight level that's not too hard to get to but harder to push below.

                          I'm actually less interested in the big three than I am in total weight. The last time I walked the JMT I did it without resupply and my pack at Happy Isles was a little over 23 lbs. At the Portal it weighed a little under 12 lbs, including the extra food. There were a lot of miles where it felt like I was carrying a slightly oversized daypack, which was quite nice. And if there's a next time thepack will be a little lighter. The first time I walked the JMT my pack after the MTR resupply weighed close to 60 lbs. I was happy then too.



                        • dj_ayers
                          Don t sweat it, it just different strokes for different folks. Size makes a good deal of difference. A 6 foot plus 200 lb plus person won t get the same base
                          Message 12 of 20 , Jun 10, 2014
                            Don't sweat it, it just different strokes for different folks.

                            Size makes a good deal of difference.  A 6 foot plus 200 lb plus person won't get the same base weight as a small person.  You need a bigger everything.

                            Some of us can't sleep on a short small pad and want an air mattress.  Some need a rectangular bag to move the legs around or they can't sleep well.  Some want full netting for bug protection.

                            Some like to carry toys like a book, monocular, camera, tripod, booze, HRM, plant/animal guides, etc.

                            I've carried ~50 lbs over the Golden Staircase, my Dad probably carried more.  Where there is a will, there is a way.

                            ---In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, <eric.p.moss@...> wrote :

                            I can't tell if I'm going about it all wrong.  I'm getting a custom pack that's light, but nowhere near that light.  Same with tent and bag/pad.  It's well over 10lb.  Talking to some people makes me think I'll die on the Golden Staircase, assuming I even make it that far.  Others say I'll be far more comfortable and well-rested with this stuff than without.  I guess I'll report on the post-hike survey which happened.
                          • shawnmnold
                            WOW, you all are awesome with those super low weights. I agree with Mr Ladd. I haven t figured my exact weights but I know there are no blue ribbons in this
                            Message 13 of 20 , Jun 10, 2014
                              WOW, you all are awesome with those super low weights.  I agree with Mr Ladd.  I haven't figured my exact weights but I know there are no blue ribbons in this group.  I'm a big guy at 6'2" and 225#'s.  No way I can afford to replace gear I've been using for a while or got at bargain prices.  I'll be hiking with my 16 year old daughter and if needed I'll carry extra weight to make her hike more enjoyable also.  
                              Maybe one day i'll get my base weights close to some of yours.  Very impressive btw
                            • longritchie
                              When talking about total weight, don t forget body weight... You people who are already skinny can ignore this. Glad you added that last line. People are
                              Message 14 of 20 , Jun 10, 2014
                                "When talking about total weight, don't forget body weight... You people who are already skinny can ignore this."

                                Glad you added that last line. People are different so it's hard to make rules of thumb that apply across the board.

                                I've gained about 20 lbs since I first walked the JMT 25 years ago, some of that muscle, some fat. Meanwhile I've reduced my pack weight by about 25 lbs. That's pretty close to a wash. So, age aside, I should feel about the same on the trail today with a 15-20 lb pack that I did back then with a 40-45 lb pack.

                                But the reality is it's not even close. I can walk so much faster and farther with less overall body fatigue when carrying a lighter pack. I think your theory, if it works, only applies to people who have plenty of excess body fat.

                                I do feel lighter when I've lost 5 lbs. My rock climbing really improves. But I'm hungrier when I'm like that. I'd have to carry more food at the start of a trip if I lost weight in advance.
                              • allison1288
                                I m glad this sparked so much good conversation! There are a few adjustments I may make to my gear which will happen after next week s multiday trial hike. I
                                Message 15 of 20 , Jun 10, 2014
                                  I'm glad this sparked so much good conversation! There are a few adjustments I may make to my gear which will happen after next week's multiday trial hike. I will not have the lightest pack on the trail, but it will be far from the heaviest. Once I get everything 100% set (more or less) I'll do a post on my base weight and total pack weight. It is looking to be about 12 pounds including things like bug spray but not food and water. I have a BV500 as I live in NH and can deal with the extra weight over buying/renting a more expensive canister. I will also be taking a point and shoot and my gopro.

                                  Like others have pointed out, it's all about what makes your trip enjoyable and helps you reach your goals.
                                • kennethjessett@sbcglobal.net
                                  I have to add that hiking the trail last year with a full pack - maybe 28 pounds - was a chore, but hiking over to Merced Lake HSC from LYV and back (20 miles
                                  Message 16 of 20 , Jun 10, 2014
                                    I have to add that hiking the trail last year with a full pack - maybe 28 pounds - was a chore, but hiking over to Merced Lake HSC from LYV and back (20 miles or so) with a drawstring day pack was a breeze - same going up Clouds Rest.

                                    I have become a firm believer in going as light as possible, it's just that I have most of my stuff already and am loath to buy new, lighter and much more expensive gear. But for anyone starting out or having way more $$$'s than is good for them, buying light and going light is the more pleasurable way to go.

                                    Ken.
                                  • trailnameskyking
                                    Roleigh suggested the Fast Diet to me back in February. I m down nearly 20 lbs, now-- it s a great feeling. Thanks Roleigh! This diet is something that is
                                    Message 17 of 20 , Jun 10, 2014
                                      Roleigh suggested the Fast Diet to me back in February.  I'm down nearly 20 lbs, now-- it's a great feeling.  Thanks Roleigh!  This diet is something that is simple, sustainable, and doesn't interfere with the rest of my life.
                                    • nancybazilchuk@rocketmail.com
                                      Another great weight loss tool is the many apps that allow you to count calories and monitor mindless eating/nibbling, which has always been my great undoing.
                                      Message 18 of 20 , Jun 10, 2014
                                        Another great weight loss tool is the many apps that allow you to count calories and monitor mindless eating/nibbling, which has always been my great undoing. I used My Fitness Pal on my iPhone starting last June and lost about 33 lbs in 6 months relatively painlessly. Someone else on this group also mentioned it, I am a real believer too. I don't think my joints would have handled the JMT with a pack and all that extra body weight. and now when I put on a 25 or 30 pound pack I think about the fact that I used to walk around all the time carrying weights like these....
                                      • Shawn Peterson
                                        My big three: Zpacks arc blast 18 oz Zpacks duplex 20.5 oz EE 30 deg quilt 16.03 oz Neo air xlite 16 oz 4.4 lbs and total pack weight 11.32 lbs I am 6 3 215
                                        Message 19 of 20 , Jun 10, 2014
                                          My big three:
                                          Zpacks arc blast 18 oz
                                          Zpacks duplex 20.5 oz
                                          EE  30 deg quilt 16.03 oz
                                          Neo air xlite 16 oz

                                          4.4 lbs and total pack weight 11.32 lbs

                                          I am 6'3"  215 lbs.  

                                          On Jun 10, 2014, at 5:01 PM, "allison.nadler88@... [johnmuirtrail]" <johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

                                           

                                          I'm glad this sparked so much good conversation! There are a few adjustments I may make to my gear which will happen after next week's multiday trial hike. I will not have the lightest pack on the trail, but it will be far from the heaviest. Once I get everything 100% set (more or less) I'll do a post on my base weight and total pack weight. It is looking to be about 12 pounds including things like bug spray but not food and water. I have a BV500 as I live in NH and can deal with the extra weight over buying/renting a more expensive canister. I will also be taking a point and shoot and my gopro.

                                          Like others have pointed out, it's all about what makes your trip enjoyable and helps you reach your goals.

                                        • kennethjessett@sbcglobal.net
                                          It is also important and comforting to remember that the more you eat as you hike along the trail, the lighter the pack becomes. Starting off at 26 lbs
                                          Message 20 of 20 , Jun 11, 2014
                                            It is also important and comforting to remember that the more you eat as you hike along the trail, the lighter the pack becomes. Starting off at 26 lbs including H2O I expect it to be close to 14 lbs sans H2O by the time I reach the Muir ranch. But then, loading up with the resupply is going to be a jolt. (O)

                                            Ken.
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