Loading ...
Sorry, an error occurred while loading the content.

Cloths List

Expand Messages
  • mick.parker997tt
    It seems like there is always lots of discussion about the big 3 , but interesting for me my cloths are the category that weighs the most ( beside food/water
    Message 1 of 28 , Dec 22, 2013
    View Source
    • 0 Attachment
      It seems like there is always lots of discussion about the "big 3", but interesting for me my cloths are the category that weighs the most ( beside food/water ).  I would like to get some input on my planned cloths.  My hike is planned for the mid August time frame and I will be wearing REI convertible pants/shorts, dri-fit t-shirt, ball cap, bandana, Champion UW, Wigwam socks, rei liners, salomon trail runners.  Rain Gear not included is Frogg Togg top no bottoms.   My cloths to carry are:

      1.  Montbell Wind Shirt: 2.5oz

      2. Wigwam Socks:  2.7oz
      3. REI Sock Liner: 1.9oz
      4. Champion UW: 3.4oz
      5. Nike Gym Shorts: 6.4oz
      6. Dri-fit Short Sleeve T-Shirt: 6.5oz
      7. Heat32 Long Sleeve T-Shirt:  5.0oz
      8.  REI Long Sleeve Button Up Shirt: 8.5oz
      9. Terramar Long UW: 6.2oz
      10. Zpack Fleece Beanie: 1.0oz
      11. Head Gloves: 2.3oz
      12. Sierra Design Gnar Lite Down Jacket: 11.4oz
      13.  S2S Ultradaypack Stuff Sack: 3.0 ( will use to summit Mt. Whitney ).
      Total Weight: 72.8oz

    • John Ladd
      I d leave the pants at home. Wear the gym shorts most of the time. Bring rain pants for whenever the gym shorts are insufficient (rain, cold, town) I d bring
      Message 2 of 28 , Dec 22, 2013
      View Source
      • 0 Attachment
        I'd leave the pants at home. Wear the gym shorts most of the time. Bring rain pants for whenever the gym shorts are insufficient (rain, cold, town)

        I'd bring at least 2 sock changes in addition to whatever you are wearing. You'll probably want to wash socks occasionally or swap out socks to wick out wet footwear.

        I'd add at least minimalist rain mitts. It's miserable when your gloves get wet.

        John Curran Ladd
        1616 Castro Street
        San Francisco, CA  94114-3707
        415-648-9279


        On Sun, Dec 22, 2013 at 1:19 PM, <mick.parker997tt@...> wrote:
         

        It seems like there is always lots of discussion about the "big 3", but interesting for me my cloths are the category that weighs the most ( beside food/water ).  I would like to get some input on my planned cloths.  My hike is planned for the mid August time frame and I will be wearing REI convertible pants/shorts, dri-fit t-shirt, ball cap, bandana, Champion UW, Wigwam socks, rei liners, salomon trail runners.  Rain Gear not included is Frogg Togg top no bottoms.   My cloths to carry are:


        1.  Montbell Wind Shirt: 2.5oz

        2. Wigwam Socks:  2.7oz
        3. REI Sock Liner: 1.9oz
        4. Champion UW: 3.4oz
        5. Nike Gym Shorts: 6.4oz
        6. Dri-fit Short Sleeve T-Shirt: 6.5oz
        7. Heat32 Long Sleeve T-Shirt:  5.0oz
        8.  REI Long Sleeve Button Up Shirt: 8.5oz
        9. Terramar Long UW: 6.2oz
        10. Zpack Fleece Beanie: 1.0oz
        11. Head Gloves: 2.3oz
        12. Sierra Design Gnar Lite Down Jacket: 11.4oz
        13.  S2S Ultradaypack Stuff Sack: 3.0 ( will use to summit Mt. Whitney ).
        Total Weight: 72.8oz


      • Frank Dumville
        I prefer to hike in long pants for sun and bug protection so I wouldn t take the gym shorts. It seems like you have quite a few lightweight shirts. I carry a
        Message 3 of 28 , Dec 22, 2013
        View Source
        • 0 Attachment
           
          I prefer to hike in long pants for sun and bug protection so I wouldn't take the gym shorts.
           
          It seems like you have quite a few lightweight shirts. I carry a single primary lightweight hiking shirt and a second heavier insulating top like a mid-weight underwear or 100 weight fleece top to use for hiking during colder days. I find my puffy jacket too warm to hike in.
           
          I use the similar Dri-Ducks for rain gear and have always carried the pants for rain and colder days. Another lightweight alternate would be a rain shirt.
           
          For rain gloves I carry extra large surgical gloves that will fit over my lightweight insulating gloves. I also carry a some plastic bags that I can use over my hand or socks in an emergency.
           
          Snap
        • mick.parker997tt
          I forgot to include in the 72.8 oz a pair of Crock Knock off camp shoes 11.9oz!
          Message 4 of 28 , Dec 22, 2013
          View Source
          • 0 Attachment

            I forgot to include in the 72.8 oz a pair of Crock Knock off camp shoes 11.9oz!

          • cehauser1
            Mick: If you are trying to lighten the amount of clothes you are carrying, it seems like there is a lot of redundancy you could reduce. If you are trying to
            Message 5 of 28 , Dec 23, 2013
            View Source
            • 0 Attachment

              Mick:

              If you are trying to lighten the amount of clothes you are carrying, it seems like there is a lot of redundancy you could reduce.  If you are trying to go lightweight, imagine yourself in a situation where you would need to wear ALL your clothes at the same time to stay warm and safe and comfortable.  If there are any that you couldn't wear in any situation, then seriously consider removing those items from your list.


              Socks:  Despite what I just wrote, socks are one area where you want redundancy.  This summer, I took 3 pairs:  I rotated between 2 pairs of 2oz synthetic hiking socks (always kept one pair clean and dry), and 1 pair of 2oz wool non-hiking socks (to wear at night, to use as gloves and to use as a pot holder).  If you don't need both the socks and the liners, or if you don't need the second pair of liners (they are easy to wash and dry) you could cut some weight there.


              UW:  Like socks, I liked always having a spare pair of underwear.


              Shirts:  As Frank suggests, chose one hiking shirt and delete the rest.  I hike in a long-sleeve button-front cotton shirt, but my advice would be to take one of the type of shirt you normally hike in (I assume that's the dri-fit t-shirt).  Wash it daily, and you won't need to carry a replacement.  Of course, you'll need to have other layers for insulation and wind/rain protection, but you really only need one hiking shirt.


              Pants versus Shorts:  Why do you have both shorts and convertible pants?  You only need one or the other.  I prefer hiking in convertible pants for sun protection, with the knees zipped open for ventilation when it is warm.


              Camp Shoes:  I would leave the crocks at home... they weigh almost a pound and they are the heaviest item you have listed.  When you stop at the end of the day, you can take off your shoes and socks and let everything dry out.  Maybe wash your feet in cold water at the end of the day, or wear your shoes very loosely laced in camp, and your feet will feel great.  I actually hike with my shoes very loosely laced and my feet feel great at the end of the day.


              Wind Shirt/ Rain Shirt:  I'm not very familiar with wind shirts and Frogg Toggs, but I was just wondering if you need both.  Or perhaps there is a third lightweight item that can fill the needs of both.


              So... here's what I'd consider deleting from your list:

              1. Montbell Wind Shirt: 2.5oz

              3. REI Sock Liner: 1.9oz
              5. Nike Gym Shorts: 6.4oz
              6. Dri-fit Short Sleeve T-Shirt: 6.5oz
              7. Heat32 Long Sleeve T-Shirt:  5.0oz
              8.  REI Long Sleeve Button Up Shirt: 8.5oz  
              11. Head Gloves: 2.3oz  
              Crock Knock Offs 11.9oz
              Total Weight Reduction: 45oz, almost 3 pounds.



              Cheers!


              Chris.





              ---In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, <mick.parker997tt@...> wrote:

              I forgot to include in the 72.8 oz a pair of Crock Knock off camp shoes 11.9oz!

            • Robert
              Chris nailed it on his recommendations! I also echo his sentiments on socks. It is one area of clothing I don t like to scrimp on, as happy feet are ones that
              Message 6 of 28 , Dec 23, 2013
              View Source
              • 0 Attachment
                Chris nailed it on his recommendations! I also echo his sentiments on socks. It is one area of clothing I don't like to scrimp on, as happy feet are ones that will take you the distance! Wind shirts are tough, either you love them or think they are a waste. I know people like them for stopping at passes and use around camp, but in a Sierra style rainstorm, they would soak out quickly. I would stick to the Frogg Toggs as well, but watch for wear as they get leaks as well. Have a great hike this summer!

                --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, <cehauser1@...> wrote:
                >
                > Mick:
                >
                > If you are trying to lighten the amount of clothes you are carrying, it seems like there is a lot of redundancy you could reduce. If you are trying to go lightweight, imagine yourself in a situation where you would need to wear ALL your clothes at the same time to stay warm and safe and comfortable. If there are any that you couldn't wear in any situation, then seriously consider removing those items from your list.
                >
                >
                > Socks: Despite what I just wrote, socks are one area where you want redundancy. This summer, I took 3 pairs: I rotated between 2 pairs of 2oz synthetic hiking socks (always kept one pair clean and dry), and 1 pair of 2oz wool non-hiking socks (to wear at night, to use as gloves and to use as a pot holder). If you don't need both the socks and the liners, or if you don't need the second pair of liners (they are easy to wash and dry) you could cut some weight there.
                >
                >
                >
                > UW: Like socks, I liked always having a spare pair of underwear.
                >
                >
                > Shirts: As Frank suggests, chose one hiking shirt and delete the rest. I hike in a long-sleeve button-front cotton shirt, but my advice would be to take one of the type of shirt you normally hike in (I assume that's the dri-fit t-shirt). Wash it daily, and you won't need to carry a replacement. Of course, you'll need to have other layers for insulation and wind/rain protection, but you really only need one hiking shirt.
                >
                >
                > Pants versus Shorts: Why do you have both shorts and convertible pants? You only need one or the other. I prefer hiking in convertible pants for sun protection, with the knees zipped open for ventilation when it is warm.
                >
                >
                > Camp Shoes: I would leave the crocks at home... they weigh almost a pound and they are the heaviest item you have listed. When you stop at the end of the day, you can take off your shoes and socks and let everything dry out. Maybe wash your feet in cold water at the end of the day, or wear your shoes very loosely laced in camp, and your feet will feel great. I actually hike with my shoes very loosely laced and my feet feel great at the end of the day.
                >
                >
                > Wind Shirt/ Rain Shirt: I'm not very familiar with wind shirts and Frogg Toggs, but I was just wondering if you need both. Or perhaps there is a third lightweight item that can fill the needs of both.
                >
                >
                > So... here's what I'd consider deleting from your list:
                >
                > 1. Montbell Wind Shirt: 2.5oz
                >
                >
                > 3. REI Sock Liner: 1.9oz
                >
                > 5. Nike Gym Shorts: 6.4oz
                >
                > 6. Dri-fit Short Sleeve T-Shirt: 6.5oz
                > 7. Heat32 Long Sleeve T-Shirt: 5.0oz
                > 8. REI Long Sleeve Button Up Shirt: 8.5oz
                > 11. Head Gloves: 2.3oz
                > Crock Knock Offs 11.9oz
                > Total Weight Reduction: 45oz, almost 3 pounds.
                >
                >
                >
                >
                > Cheers!
                >
                >
                > Chris.
                >
                >
                >
                >
                >
                >
                > ---In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, <mick.parker997tt@> wrote:
                >
                > I forgot to include in the 72.8 oz a pair of Crock Knock off camp shoes 11.9oz!
                >
              • mick.parker997tt
                Thanks for all the input. I am considering some of these reccomendations. Below are my thoughts. 1. Chris, I m afraid I can t go quite as minimalist as you
                Message 7 of 28 , Dec 23, 2013
                View Source
                • 0 Attachment

                  Thanks for all the input.  I am considering some of these reccomendations.  Below are my thoughts.


                  1. Chris, I'm afraid I can't go quite as minimalist as you can!  I would only have the cloths I'm hiking in plus two pair of socks, a pair of UW, a pair of long UW and a jacket?  I want to have a little more flexibility.

                  2. Utilizing the Frogg Togg for a wind shirt?  I've tried that and it's just a little too much for rest periods or lunch breaks if I've been hiking hard...too hot/clammy?   2.5oz may be worth the weight penalty?

                  3. Rain Mitts...great idea!  I'm interested in feedback about using surgical gloves over lightwieght hiking gloves?  Certainly not breathable but maybe in a pinch?  ZPack and MLD have some nice very light weight mitts but very expensive.


                • Louis Brooks
                  For gloves/rain mitts I have been using these for a while and really like them: http://sectionhiker.com/outdoor-research-versaliner-gloves/ Light and very
                  Message 8 of 28 , Dec 23, 2013
                  View Source
                  • 0 Attachment
                    For gloves/rain mitts I have been using these for a while and really like them: http://sectionhiker.com/outdoor-research-versaliner-gloves/ Light and very warm.

                    I couldn't give up my Houdini windshirt. Light, small enough to store in a pocket and just the right amount of protection for hiking or taking a break so I stay warm without overheating. 

                    Thanks,

                    --louis


                    On Monday, December 23, 2013 9:52 AM, "mick.parker997tt@..." <mick.parker997tt@...> wrote:
                     
                    Thanks for all the input.  I am considering some of these reccomendations.  Below are my thoughts.

                    1. Chris, I'm afraid I can't go quite as minimalist as you can!  I would only have the cloths I'm hiking in plus two pair of socks, a pair of UW, a pair of long UW and a jacket?  I want to have a little more flexibility.
                    2. Utilizing the Frogg Togg for a wind shirt?  I've tried that and it's just a little too much for rest periods or lunch breaks if I've been hiking hard...too hot/clammy?   2.5oz may be worth the weight penalty?
                    3. Rain Mitts...great idea!  I'm interested in feedback about using surgical gloves over lightwieght hiking gloves?  Certainly not breathable but maybe in a pinch?  ZPack and MLD have some nice very light weight mitts but very expensive.



                  • Frank Dumville
                    I suggested the surgical gloves. I use the waterproof gloves on cold wet days to keep my insulating gloves dry. This keeps my hands cool, not warm.
                    Message 9 of 28 , Dec 23, 2013
                    View Source
                    • 0 Attachment
                      I suggested the surgical gloves.
                       
                      I use the waterproof gloves on cold wet days to keep my insulating gloves dry. This keeps my hands cool, not warm. Breathablility isn't a problem.
                       
                      Get the largest gloves you can. They are designed for a snug fit, but you want a loose fit. If they are snug they will make your hands colder and will be hard to get on and off. I suggested surgical gloves because they are a little tougher and I have access to them. Any sort of plastic type glove available at the hardware store should work. I have also used plastic newspaper bags to do the same thing but with less dexterity. They are cheap and light enough you can even carry spares or send extra in a resupply box.
                       
                      This approach is a trade off. It provides a way to cover my hands while minimizing the weight of something that may not be used at all. The chance of getting all day rain for multiple days in the Sierra in summer is pretty low. You'll most likely be dealing with thunderstorms and rain showers for a few hours.
                       
                      I'm sure the lightweight glove options would work better and I may buy a pair someday but that hasn't been a priority for me.
                       
                      Snap


                       
                      On Mon, Dec 23, 2013 at 6:52 AM, <mick.parker997tt@...> wrote:
                        3. Rain Mitts...great idea!  I'm interested in feedback about using surgical gloves over lightwieght hiking gloves?  Certainly not breathable but maybe in a pinch?  ZPack and MLD have some nice very light weight mitts but very expensive.


                    • dana geary
                      Perhaps we were unusual, but my daughter and i were really cold on the trail last summer (late July-mid August).  Daytime hiking was fine, but evenings and
                      Message 10 of 28 , Dec 23, 2013
                      View Source
                      • 0 Attachment
                        Perhaps we were unusual, but my daughter and i were really cold on the trail last summer (late July-mid August).  Daytime hiking was fine, but evenings and mornings were super chilly.  In those camp-times, we each wore everything we had: REI zip-leg pants with legs on of course, funky tyvek pants from US Plastics that we brought as rain pants but never had to put to the test (incredibly light, not much warmth at all), long underwear-type long sleeve shirt, Montbell UL down jacket, GoLite rain jacket.  At VVR we each bought some yoga-like pants to supplement (huge help), plus beanie-type hats.  Next year we're planning to bring fleece pants and an additional layer for the top.  We also were cold while sleeping (me in GoLite 30degree quilt plus silk liner; daughter in SubKilo 20 degree bag - we're upgrading these to Zpacks bags next year).  I don't remember being cold at all in extended Sierra trips as a teenager, so I was a little surprised by the chill!
                        Reply via web post Reply to sender Reply to group Start a New Topic Messages in this topic (9)
                        Please strip out replied-to text if not necessary to your reply.  Just select the unnecessary text and delete it. Failure to strip makes it hard for our Daily Digest members to find the new postings among the repeats. For the crib sheet to take on JMT: http://tinyurl.com/JMT-Crib - Prints on 1 sheet all the essential phone numbers/addresses you&#39;ll want for all services needed on or off the trail. We encourage all to join the JohnMuirTrail_Sidebar Yahoo Group, just send a blank email to:
                        JohnMuirTrail_Sidebar-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
                        .



                      • Barbara Karagosian
                        It can get very chilly, and if you re in a depression or valley, meadow or by water, even more so. I often wore my beanie to bed, it was a great help. I have
                        Message 11 of 28 , Dec 23, 2013
                        View Source
                        • 0 Attachment
                          It can get very chilly, and if you're in a depression or valley, meadow or by water, even more so.  I often wore my beanie to bed, it was a great help.  I have a 15 degree bag plus a high  R rating pad.  I'd sleep in long underwear and a Capilene 3 top.  There's various things to do at night to keep warm - such as dry sleeping clothes that aren't used during the day, sleeping sox, maybe fleece ones, hat, heat up some water and put it in a Nalgene and use as a hot water bottle, eat some carbs or a hot drink before bed, jumping jacks before bed (so people say - I've never resorted to that).




                          On Dec 23, 2013, at 8:34 PM, dana geary <dana.mkat@...> wrote:

                           

                          Perhaps we were unusual, but my daughter and i were really cold on the trail last summer (late July-mid August).  Daytime hiking was fine, but evenings and mornings were super chilly.  In those camp-times, we each wore everything we had: REI zip-leg pants with legs on of course, funky tyvek pants from US Plastics that we brought as rain pants but never had to put to the test (incredibly light, not much warmth at all), long underwear-type long sleeve shirt, Montbell UL down jacket, GoLite rain jacket.  At VVR we each bought some yoga-like pants to supplement (huge help), plus beanie-type hats.  Next year we're planning to bring fleece pants and an additional layer for the top.  We also were cold while sleeping (me in GoLite 30degree quilt plus silk liner; daughter in SubKilo 20 degree bag - we're upgrading these to Zpacks bags next year).  I don't remember being cold at all in extended Sierra trips as a teenager, so I was a little surprised by the chill!
                          Reply via web post Reply to sender Reply to group Start a New Topic Messages in this topic (9)
                          Please strip out replied-to text if not necessary to your reply.  Just select the unnecessary text and delete it. Failure to strip makes it hard for our Daily Digest members to find the new postings among the repeats. For the crib sheet to take on JMT: http://tinyurl.com/JMT-Crib - Prints on 1 sheet all the essential phone numbers/addresses you&#39;ll want for all services needed on or off the trail. We encourage all to join the JohnMuirTrail_Sidebar Yahoo Group, just send a blank email to:
                          JohnMuirTrail_Sidebar-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
                          .



                        • Inga Aksamit
                          After a decade of summer backpacking trips in the Sierra Dana s experience mirrors mine. I get cold in the Sierra nights when I m not moving around so I often
                          Message 12 of 28 , Dec 24, 2013
                          View Source
                          • 0 Attachment



                            After a decade of summer backpacking trips in the Sierra Dana's experience mirrors mine. I get cold in the Sierra nights when I'm not moving around so I often sleep in a fleece beanie hat and light-weight spring-skiing gloves--no matter how light I go those 2 things are always in my pack. I usually hike in shorts, therefore my zip off pants are clean so I often start off the night in pants and socks but usually end up kicking off parts of this get-up as I warm up in my bag (Marmot Angel Fire -probably not the lightest but it keeps me warm so it's worth its weight in gold--as I go lighter on absolutely everything else it's essential that I have a rock solid option for warmth. If I'm cold in the evening that means it's time to go to bed.). Fleece pants might be overkill--maybe long underwear bottoms would be lighter and less bulky?


                            Mon Dec 23, 2013 8:37 pm (PST) . Posted by:

                            "dana geary" dana.mkat

                            Perhaps we were unusual, but my daughter and i were really cold on the trail last summer (late July-mid August).  Daytime hiking was fine, but evenings and mornings were super chilly.  In those camp-times, we each wore everything we had: REI zip-leg pants with legs on of course, funky tyvek pants from US Plastics that we brought as rain pants but never had to put to the test (incredibly light, not much warmth at all), long underwear-type long sleeve shirt, Montbell UL down jacket, GoLite rain jacket.  At VVR we each bought some yoga-like pants to supplement (huge help), plus beanie-type hats.  Next year we're planning to bring fleece pants and an additional layer for the top.  We also were cold while sleeping (me in GoLite 30degree quilt plus silk liner; daughter in SubKilo 20 degree bag - we're upgrading these to Zpacks bags next year).  I don't remember being cold at all in extended Sierra trips as a teenager, so I was a little surprised by the
                            chill!



                            Inga Aksamit
                            Mobile: 415-470-1812
                            Email: Iaksamit@...
                            Twitter.com/IngaAksamit
                            About Me: about.me/IngasAdventures
                          • herbstroh
                            To add to Barbara s tips: as soon as you get to camp get out of damp clothes and layer up. Don t wait until you feel cold-- it is much harder to warm up again.
                            Message 13 of 28 , Dec 24, 2013
                            View Source
                            • 0 Attachment

                              To add to Barbara's tips: as soon as you get to camp get out of damp clothes and layer up. Don't wait until you feel cold-- it is much harder to warm up again. As noted, campsite selection impacts night time temps, so avoid low spots near the water on cold nights and look for sheltered camping in trees.


                              Other strategies to consider if you are willing to experiment with different hiking styles: instead of shivering through breakfast, pack up and start hiking first thing. As the day warms, stop somewhere and have breakfast. Rather than planning for extended time at your camp site, hike longer during the day. Take an extended lunch and longer breaks at interesting locations during the day. Have dinner early along the trail or at a creek, filter the next day's water, and hike till twilight. When you get to camp most evening chores are done so you can hop in the bag and watch the stars come out. This hiking style allows you to maximize the warmest part of the day and puts you into your snug bag just when temperatures drop.


                              Herb

                              ---In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, <barbara@...> wrote:

                              It can get very chilly, and if you're in a depression or valley, meadow or by water, even more so.  I often wore my beanie to bed, it was a great help.  I have a 15 degree bag plus a high  R rating pad.  I'd sleep in long underwear and a Capilene 3 top.  There's various things to do at night to keep warm - such as dry sleeping clothes that aren't used during the day, sleeping sox, maybe fleece ones, hat, heat up some water and put it in a Nalgene and use as a hot water bottle, eat some carbs or a hot drink before bed, jumping jacks before bed (so people say - I've never resorted to that).



                               



                            • John Ladd
                              My experience is similar to Dana s. I prefer a slightly under-warm-for-me bag (manufacturer rated at 20, but probably equivalent to a 35 EN-rated bag) that I
                              Message 14 of 28 , Dec 24, 2013
                              View Source
                              • 0 Attachment
                                My experience is similar to Dana's.

                                I prefer a slightly under-warm-for-me bag (manufacturer rated at 20, but probably equivalent to a 35 EN-rated bag)  that I can supplement with generous insulation layers (mostly with Polartec fabrics) inside the bag. That way the insulation layers do double duty keeping me warm in the bag at night but also allowing me to get out of the bag before dawn and stay warm while I pack up or stay out of the bag late at night to watch the stars.  

                                Tops: I usually bring 2-3 silkweight baselayer tops (one mostly day, one night only, occasionally wear up to all 3 at night - they are sized slightly differently so they layer OK) plus a fleece top (either expedition weight baselayer or a fleece jacket).

                                Bottoms My legs get really cold if I don't have equal insulation for my bottoms so usually wear one silkweight baselayer plus an expedition weight layer in the bag. 

                                Occasionally supplement these with rain gear (usually just the pants) inside the bag on unusually cold nights (say, low 30s). The vapor barrier created by the rain gear makes things feel a bit clammy, but very warm. 

                                Plus warm socks (sometimes the neoprene ones), a beanie, a thin balaclava and liner gloves. Occasionly have brought down booties.

                                Often, of course, don't wear them all. By adding to subtracting layers, I can be comfortable in a variety of conditions.

                                I also agree that you can adjust campsite selection and hiking hours to address the issue.

                                John Curran Ladd
                                1616 Castro Street
                                San Francisco, CA  94114-3707
                                415-648-9279


                                On Mon, Dec 23, 2013 at 8:34 PM, dana geary <dana.mkat@...> wrote:
                                 

                                Perhaps we were unusual, but my daughter and i were really cold on the trail last summer (late July-mid August).  Daytime hiking was fine, but evenings and mornings were super chilly.  In those camp-times, we each wore everything we had: REI zip-leg pants with legs on of course, funky tyvek pants from US Plastics that we brought as rain pants but never had to put to the test (incredibly light, not much warmth at all), long underwear-type long sleeve shirt, Montbell UL down jacket, GoLite rain jacket.  At VVR we each bought some yoga-like pants to supplement (huge help), plus beanie-type hats.  Next year we're planning to bring fleece pants and an additional layer for the top.  We also were cold while sleeping (me in GoLite 30degree quilt plus silk liner; daughter in SubKilo 20 degree bag - we're upgrading these to Zpacks bags next year).  I don't remember being cold at all in extended Sierra trips as a teenager, so I was a little surprised by the chill!

                                Reply via web post Reply to sender Reply to group Start a New TopicMessages in this topic (9)
                                Please strip out replied-to text if not necessary to your reply.  Just select the unnecessary text and delete it. Failure to strip makes it hard for our Daily Digest members to find the new postings among the repeats. For the crib sheet to take on JMT: http://tinyurl.com/JMT-Crib - Prints on 1 sheet all the essential phone numbers/addresses you&#39;ll want for all services needed on or off the trail. We encourage all to join the JohnMuirTrail_Sidebar Yahoo Group, just send a blank email to:
                                JohnMuirTrail_Sidebar-subscribe@yahoogroups.com
                                .




                              • berdomb
                                I bring: The clothes on my back (shorts, long sleeve shirt) + midweight baselayer LS top UL thing baselayer bottoms lightweight puffy fleece beanie 1 pr extra
                                Message 15 of 28 , Dec 24, 2013
                                View Source
                                • 0 Attachment
                                  I bring:

                                  The clothes on my back (shorts, long sleeve shirt) +

                                  midweight baselayer LS top
                                  UL  thing baselayer bottoms
                                  lightweight puffy
                                  fleece beanie
                                  1 pr extra socks
                                  glove liners

                                  rainjacket/rain skirt

                                  Pretty much it.
                                  You dont need as much extra stuff as you think.
                                  Your clothes will dry fast if damp with sweat
                                  You can rinse them out, put them on, and be dry in 30 minutes
                                • cehauser1
                                  Mick: For my whole life I had been a traditional backpacker, with a pack ranging from 30-50 pounds... for trips ranging from 3-5 days. This summer was the
                                  Message 16 of 28 , Dec 25, 2013
                                  View Source
                                  • 0 Attachment

                                    Mick:

                                    For my whole life I had been a traditional backpacker, with a pack ranging from 30-50 pounds... for trips ranging from 3-5 days.  This summer was the first time I would be hiking longer than 5 days, and I realized if I was going to hike all the sections of trail that I wanted to see, in the amount of time I had available, I needed to seriously re-think backpacking, especially as I am entering the second half of my life and I don't consider myself to be very athletic.  So for the first time in my life, I went lightweight, and it was a real game-changer for me.  A light-weight backpack allowed me to hike long hours and long miles, and really enjoy my time.  I rarely felt the weight of the backpack (ranging from 18 - 22 pounds total), and for the first time I felt like I really enjoyed my time on the trail.


                                    I firmly believe that everyone has their own unique set of needs, comfort levels, desired margin of safety, athletic ability, etc, so I totally respect your desire to have more flexibility.  However, let me ask you you explore two ideas:  First, try to not mentally categorize your clothes as either what you will wear on the trail, or what you will carry in the pack... instead, try to think of what you will need to wear to be safe, warm, and comfortable during the range of expected weather conditions you will likely face on the JMT... some of the items you will wear on the trail every day, and some items you might only wear under extreme conditions.  Second, carefully consider the balance between the comfort provided by having lots of items with you, versus the comforted provided by having a lightweight backpack.  I respect that everyone has unique needs and desires while backpacking, but I now believe that carrying a light weight pack is something that would be helpful to almost everyone out on the trail.

                                    Based on what I learned on the JMT this summer, here's what I will be taking on a similar Sierra trip next summer:  1 pair basic hiking shoes, 2 pairs synthetic socks, 1 pair wool socks, 1 convertible pants, 1 synthetic long johns, 2 pairs underwear, 1 long-sleeve synthetic under-shirt, 1 fleece zipper sweatshirt, 1 synthetic outer shell, 1 long-sleeve cotton hiking shirt, 1 balaklava, 1 sun hat, 1 poncho-tarp.  In this list, everything works together, and I can imagine wearing nearly everything during a cold/rainy/windy Sierra day, with nothing redundant and nothing missing. 

                                    Best of luck preparing for your trip, and happy holidays!

                                    Chris.


                                    ---In johnmuirtrail@{{emailDomain}}, <mick.parker997tt@...> wrote:


                                    <snip>

                                    1. Chris, I'm afraid I can't go quite as minimalist as you can!  I would only have the cloths I'm hiking in plus two pair of socks, a pair of UW, a pair of long UW and a jacket?  I want to have a little more flexibility.


                                  • kennethjessett@sbcglobal.net
                                    Chris, good input. Can you list the weights of the Big 3 for the group? Ken.
                                    Message 17 of 28 , Dec 25, 2013
                                    View Source
                                    • 0 Attachment
                                      Chris, good input. Can you list the weights of the 'Big 3' for the group?

                                      Ken.

                                      --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, <cehauser1@...> wrote:
                                      >
                                      > Mick:
                                      >
                                      > For my whole life I had been a traditional backpacker, with a pack ranging from 30-50 pounds... for trips ranging from 3-5 days. This summer was the first time I would be hiking longer than 5 days, and I realized if I was going to hike all the sections of trail that I wanted to see, in the amount of time I had available, I needed to seriously re-think backpacking, especially as I am entering the second half of my life and I don't consider myself to be very athletic. So for the first time in my life, I went lightweight, and it was a real game-changer for me. A light-weight backpack allowed me to hike long hours and long miles, and really enjoy my time. I rarely felt the weight of the backpack (ranging from 18 - 22 pounds total), and for the first time I felt like I really enjoyed my time on the trail.
                                      >
                                      > I firmly believe that everyone has their own unique set of needs, comfort levels, desired margin of safety, athletic ability, etc, so I totally respect your desire to have more flexibility. However, let me ask you you explore two ideas: First, try to not mentally categorize your clothes as either what you will wear on the trail, or what you will carry in the pack... instead, try to think of what you will need to wear to be safe, warm, and comfortable during the range of expected weather conditions you will likely face on the JMT... some of the items you will wear on the trail every day, and some items you might only wear under extreme conditions. Second, carefully consider the balance between the comfort provided by having lots of items with you, versus the comforted provided by having a lightweight backpack. I respect that everyone has unique needs and desires while backpacking, but I now believe that carrying a light weight pack is something that would be helpful to almost everyone out on the trail.
                                      >
                                      >
                                      > Based on what I learned on the JMT this summer, here's what I will be taking on a similar Sierra trip next summer: 1 pair basic hiking shoes, 2 pairs synthetic socks, 1 pair wool socks, 1 convertible pants, 1 synthetic long johns, 2 pairs underwear, 1 long-sleeve synthetic under-shirt, 1 fleece zipper sweatshirt, 1 synthetic outer shell, 1 long-sleeve cotton hiking shirt, 1 balaklava, 1 sun hat, 1 poncho-tarp. In this list, everything works together, and I can imagine wearing nearly everything during a cold/rainy/windy Sierra day, with nothing redundant and nothing missing.
                                      >
                                      > Best of luck preparing for your trip, and happy holidays!
                                      >
                                      >
                                      > Chris.
                                      >
                                      >
                                      > ---In johnmuirtrail@{{emailDomain}}, <mick.parker997tt@> wrote:
                                      >
                                      > <snip>
                                      > 1. Chris, I'm afraid I can't go quite as minimalist as you can! I would only have the cloths I'm hiking in plus two pair of socks, a pair of UW, a pair of long UW and a jacket? I want to have a little more flexibility.
                                      >
                                    • Dittli-Goethals
                                      I ve been following this group for a long time, and that is probably the best description (and rational) I have seen here regarding what to take and why to
                                      Message 18 of 28 , Dec 25, 2013
                                      View Source
                                      • 0 Attachment
                                        I've been following this group for a long time, and that is probably the best description (and rational) I have seen here regarding what to take and why to take it. 

                                        The only thing in your pack that should (Hopefully) go unused is your first-aid supplies. Really, even if there isn't a drop of rain, ideally even your storm gear should be integrated into what you need to stay warm in camp.

                                        Also, just because you will use everything, doesn't mean you NEED everything.

                                        My kit only differs from Chris' in: one pair of undies (I go w/o when/if the other is drying) TMI??? 2 pair of socks (one to wear and one to dry), something for my hands (but I will admit to not always having this). Also, I take a mid weight fleece to hike in the mornings or when it's wet and cold but, I also have a down shirt (or sweater depending on month) that I "never" wear hiking. If it does indeed rain, what you are wearing will get wet/damp. I like the idea for both comfort and safety, of having something dry to put on in camp. But even if it doesn't rain, I layer my fleece, down shirt and rain jacket in camp for warmth.

                                        JD
                                        Walk the Sky: Following the John Muir Trail


                                        On Wed, Dec 25, 2013 at 3:08 AM, <cehauser1@...> wrote:
                                         

                                        Mick:

                                        For my whole life I had been a traditional backpacker, with a pack ranging from 30-50 pounds... for trips ranging from 3-5 days.  This summer was the first time I would be hiking longer than 5 days, and I realized if I was going to hike all the sections of trail that I wanted to see, in the amount of time I had available, I needed to seriously re-think backpacking, especially as I am entering the second half of my life and I don't consider myself to be very athletic.  So for the first time in my life, I went lightweight, and it was a real game-changer for me.  A light-weight backpack allowed me to hike long hours and long miles, and really enjoy my time.  I rarely felt the weight of the backpack (ranging from 18 - 22 pounds total), and for the first time I felt like I really enjoyed my time on the trail.


                                        I firmly believe that everyone has their own unique set of needs, comfort levels, desired margin of safety, athletic ability, etc, so I totally respect your desire to have more flexibility.  However, let me ask you you explore two ideas:  First, try to not mentally categorize your clothes as either what you will wear on the trail, or what you will carry in the pack... instead, try to think of what you will need to wear to be safe, warm, and comfortable during the range of expected weather conditions you will likely face on the JMT... some of the items you will wear on the trail every day, and some items you might only wear under extreme conditions.  Second, carefully consider the balance between the comfort provided by having lots of items with you, versus the comforted provided by having a lightweight backpack.  I respect that everyone has unique needs and desires while backpacking, but I now believe that carrying a light weight pack is something that would be helpful to almost everyone out on the trail.

                                        Based on what I learned on the JMT this summer, here's what I will be taking on a similar Sierra trip next summer:  1 pair basic hiking shoes, 2 pairs synthetic socks, 1 pair wool socks, 1 convertible pants, 1 synthetic long johns, 2 pairs underwear, 1 long-sleeve synthetic under-shirt, 1 fleece zipper sweatshirt, 1 synthetic outer shell, 1 long-sleeve cotton hiking shirt, 1 balaklava, 1 sun hat, 1 poncho-tarp.  In this list, everything works together, and I can imagine wearing nearly everything during a cold/rainy/windy Sierra day, with nothing redundant and nothing missing. 

                                        Best of luck preparing for your trip, and happy holidays!

                                        Chris.


                                        ---In johnmuirtrail@{{emailDomain}}, <mick.parker997tt@...> wrote:


                                        <snip>

                                        1. Chris, I'm afraid I can't go quite as minimalist as you can!  I would only have the cloths I'm hiking in plus two pair of socks, a pair of UW, a pair of long UW and a jacket?  I want to have a little more flexibility.





                                        --
                                        John Dittli/Leslie Goethals
                                        John Dittli Photography
                                        www.johndittli.com
                                        760-934-3505 

                                        Walk the Sky: Following the John Muir Trail
                                        2010  IPPY Gold Medal Award Winner
                                      • Barbara Karagosian
                                        Hi John! And Merry Christmas! Please could you be more specific about your mid weight fleece. There s so much fleece in the stores, I m confused!
                                        Message 19 of 28 , Dec 25, 2013
                                        View Source
                                        • 0 Attachment
                                          Hi John!  And Merry Christmas!  Please could you be more specific about your "mid weight fleece." There's so much "fleece" in the stores, I'm confused! (Doesn't take much).  Thank you. 



                                          On Dec 25, 2013, at 7:47 AM, Dittli-Goethals <johndittli@...> wrote:

                                           

                                          I've been following this group for a long time, and that is probably the best description (and rational) I have seen here regarding what to take and why to take it. 

                                          The only thing in your pack that should (Hopefully) go unused is your first-aid supplies. Really, even if there isn't a drop of rain, ideally even your storm gear should be integrated into what you need to stay warm in camp.

                                          Also, just because you will use everything, doesn't mean you NEED everything.

                                          My kit only differs from Chris' in: one pair of undies (I go w/o when/if the other is drying) TMI??? 2 pair of socks (one to wear and one to dry), something for my hands (but I will admit to not always having this). Also, I take a mid weight fleece to hike in the mornings or when it's wet and cold but, I also have a down shirt (or sweater depending on month) that I "never" wear hiking. If it does indeed rain, what you are wearing will get wet/damp. I like the idea for both comfort and safety, of having something dry to put on in camp. But even if it doesn't rain, I layer my fleece, down shirt and rain jacket in camp for warmth.

                                          JD
                                          Walk the Sky: Following the John Muir Trail


                                          On Wed, Dec 25, 2013 at 3:08 AM, <cehauser1@...> wrote:
                                           

                                          Mick:

                                          For my whole life I had been a traditional backpacker, with a pack ranging from 30-50 pounds... for trips ranging from 3-5 days.  This summer was the first time I would be hiking longer than 5 days, and I realized if I was going to hike all the sections of trail that I wanted to see, in the amount of time I had available, I needed to seriously re-think backpacking, especially as I am entering the second half of my life and I don't consider myself to be very athletic.  So for the first time in my life, I went lightweight, and it was a real game-changer for me.  A light-weight backpack allowed me to hike long hours and long miles, and really enjoy my time.  I rarely felt the weight of the backpack (ranging from 18 - 22 pounds total), and for the first time I felt like I really enjoyed my time on the trail.


                                          I firmly believe that everyone has their own unique set of needs, comfort levels, desired margin of safety, athletic ability, etc, so I totally respect your desire to have more flexibility.  However, let me ask you you explore two ideas:  First, try to not mentally categorize your clothes as either what you will wear on the trail, or what you will carry in the pack... instead, try to think of what you will need to wear to be safe, warm, and comfortable during the range of expected weather conditions you will likely face on the JMT... some of the items you will wear on the trail every day, and some items you might only wear under extreme conditions.  Second, carefully consider the balance between the comfort provided by having lots of items with you, versus the comforted provided by having a lightweight backpack.  I respect that everyone has unique needs and desires while backpacking, but I now believe that carrying a light weight pack is something that would be helpful to almost everyone out on the trail.

                                          Based on what I learned on the JMT this summer, here's what I will be taking on a similar Sierra trip next summer:  1 pair basic hiking shoes, 2 pairs synthetic socks, 1 pair wool socks, 1 convertible pants, 1 synthetic long johns, 2 pairs underwear, 1 long-sleeve synthetic under-shirt, 1 fleece zipper sweatshirt, 1 synthetic outer shell, 1 long-sleeve cotton hiking shirt, 1 balaklava, 1 sun hat, 1 poncho-tarp.  In this list, everything works together, and I can imagine wearing nearly everything during a cold/rainy/windy Sierra day, with nothing redundant and nothing missing. 

                                          Best of luck preparing for your trip, and happy holidays!

                                          Chris.


                                          ---In johnmuirtrail@{{emailDomain}}, <mick.parker997tt@...> wrote:


                                          <snip>

                                          1. Chris, I'm afraid I can't go quite as minimalist as you can!  I would only have the cloths I'm hiking in plus two pair of socks, a pair of UW, a pair of long UW and a jacket?  I want to have a little more flexibility.





                                          --
                                          John Dittli/Leslie Goethals
                                          John Dittli Photography
                                          www.johndittli.com
                                          760-934-3505 

                                          Walk the Sky: Following the John Muir Trail
                                          2010  IPPY Gold Medal Award Winner

                                        • Dittli-Goethals
                                          Hi Barbara, and Merry Christmas to you. Finally got the house clean and the turkey in!! I m not sure how much help I will be, as I don t know current products
                                          Message 20 of 28 , Dec 25, 2013
                                          View Source
                                          • 0 Attachment
                                            Hi Barbara, and Merry Christmas to you. Finally got the house clean and the turkey in!! I'm not sure how much help I will be, as I don't know current products very well. I have a closet full of product that I've shot over the years and I grab what ever "looks" right.

                                            I did just look and weigh the most common "fleece" items that I use in the summer: Patagonia Synchilla pullover hoodie 9.6 oz. Nike 1/2 zip pullover 9.4 oz and a Patagonia crew neck heavy weight Capilene pullover 10.2 oz. These all work well for me when needed, hiking in the morning. If it's exceptionally cold (for the date) I'll pull my rain jacket on over that.

                                            I hope that helps at least a little.

                                            John


                                            On Wed, Dec 25, 2013 at 9:44 AM, Barbara Karagosian <barbara@...> wrote:
                                             

                                            Hi John!  And Merry Christmas!  Please could you be more specific about your "mid weight fleece." There's so much "fleece" in the stores, I'm confused! (Doesn't take much).  Thank you. 



                                            On Dec 25, 2013, at 7:47 AM, Dittli-Goethals <johndittli@...> wrote:

                                             

                                            I've been following this group for a long time, and that is probably the best description (and rational) I have seen here regarding what to take and why to take it. 

                                            The only thing in your pack that should (Hopefully) go unused is your first-aid supplies. Really, even if there isn't a drop of rain, ideally even your storm gear should be integrated into what you need to stay warm in camp.

                                            Also, just because you will use everything, doesn't mean you NEED everything.

                                            My kit only differs from Chris' in: one pair of undies (I go w/o when/if the other is drying) TMI??? 2 pair of socks (one to wear and one to dry), something for my hands (but I will admit to not always having this). Also, I take a mid weight fleece to hike in the mornings or when it's wet and cold but, I also have a down shirt (or sweater depending on month) that I "never" wear hiking. If it does indeed rain, what you are wearing will get wet/damp. I like the idea for both comfort and safety, of having something dry to put on in camp. But even if it doesn't rain, I layer my fleece, down shirt and rain jacket in camp for warmth.

                                            JD
                                            Walk the Sky: Following the John Muir Trail


                                            On Wed, Dec 25, 2013 at 3:08 AM, <cehauser1@...> wrote:
                                             

                                            Mick:

                                            For my whole life I had been a traditional backpacker, with a pack ranging from 30-50 pounds... for trips ranging from 3-5 days.  This summer was the first time I would be hiking longer than 5 days, and I realized if I was going to hike all the sections of trail that I wanted to see, in the amount of time I had available, I needed to seriously re-think backpacking, especially as I am entering the second half of my life and I don't consider myself to be very athletic.  So for the first time in my life, I went lightweight, and it was a real game-changer for me.  A light-weight backpack allowed me to hike long hours and long miles, and really enjoy my time.  I rarely felt the weight of the backpack (ranging from 18 - 22 pounds total), and for the first time I felt like I really enjoyed my time on the trail.


                                            I firmly believe that everyone has their own unique set of needs, comfort levels, desired margin of safety, athletic ability, etc, so I totally respect your desire to have more flexibility.  However, let me ask you you explore two ideas:  First, try to not mentally categorize your clothes as either what you will wear on the trail, or what you will carry in the pack... instead, try to think of what you will need to wear to be safe, warm, and comfortable during the range of expected weather conditions you will likely face on the JMT... some of the items you will wear on the trail every day, and some items you might only wear under extreme conditions.  Second, carefully consider the balance between the comfort provided by having lots of items with you, versus the comforted provided by having a lightweight backpack.  I respect that everyone has unique needs and desires while backpacking, but I now believe that carrying a light weight pack is something that would be helpful to almost everyone out on the trail.

                                            Based on what I learned on the JMT this summer, here's what I will be taking on a similar Sierra trip next summer:  1 pair basic hiking shoes, 2 pairs synthetic socks, 1 pair wool socks, 1 convertible pants, 1 synthetic long johns, 2 pairs underwear, 1 long-sleeve synthetic under-shirt, 1 fleece zipper sweatshirt, 1 synthetic outer shell, 1 long-sleeve cotton hiking shirt, 1 balaklava, 1 sun hat, 1 poncho-tarp.  In this list, everything works together, and I can imagine wearing nearly everything during a cold/rainy/windy Sierra day, with nothing redundant and nothing missing. 

                                            Best of luck preparing for your trip, and happy holidays!

                                            Chris.


                                            ---In johnmuirtrail@{{emailDomain}}, <mick.parker997tt@...> wrote:


                                            <snip>

                                            1. Chris, I'm afraid I can't go quite as minimalist as you can!  I would only have the cloths I'm hiking in plus two pair of socks, a pair of UW, a pair of long UW and a jacket?  I want to have a little more flexibility.





                                            --
                                            John Dittli/Leslie Goethals
                                            John Dittli Photography
                                            www.johndittli.com
                                            760-934-3505 

                                            Walk the Sky: Following the John Muir Trail
                                            2010  IPPY Gold Medal Award Winner




                                            --
                                            John Dittli/Leslie Goethals
                                            John Dittli Photography
                                            www.johndittli.com
                                            760-934-3505 

                                            Walk the Sky: Following the John Muir Trail
                                            2010  IPPY Gold Medal Award Winner
                                          • Barbara Karagosian
                                            Thanks so much John. I have the Synchilla - awesome sweater. Now off to continue the day long grazing - we re at the fruit, banana with peanut butter,
                                            Message 21 of 28 , Dec 25, 2013
                                            View Source
                                            • 0 Attachment
                                              Thanks so much John.  I have the Synchilla - awesome sweater.  Now off to continue the day long grazing - we're at the fruit, banana with peanut butter, peppermint bark, and Cointreau stage - yes it's weird.  Ham and holiday salad followed by fruit ambrosia later....




                                              On Dec 25, 2013, at 2:07 PM, Dittli-Goethals <johndittli@...> wrote:

                                               

                                              Hi Barbara, and Merry Christmas to you. Finally got the house clean and the turkey in!! I'm not sure how much help I will be, as I don't know current products very well. I have a closet full of product that I've shot over the years and I grab what ever "looks" right.

                                              I did just look and weigh the most common "fleece" items that I use in the summer: Patagonia Synchilla pullover hoodie 9.6 oz. Nike 1/2 zip pullover 9.4 oz and a Patagonia crew neck heavy weight Capilene pullover 10.2 oz. These all work well for me when needed, hiking in the morning. If it's exceptionally cold (for the date) I'll pull my rain jacket on over that.

                                              I hope that helps at least a little.

                                              John


                                              On Wed, Dec 25, 2013 at 9:44 AM, Barbara Karagosian <barbara@...> wrote:
                                               

                                              Hi John!  And Merry Christmas!  Please could you be more specific about your "mid weight fleece." There's so much "fleece" in the stores, I'm confused! (Doesn't take much).  Thank you. 



                                              On Dec 25, 2013, at 7:47 AM, Dittli-Goethals <johndittli@...> wrote:

                                               

                                              I've been following this group for a long time, and that is probably the best description (and rational) I have seen here regarding what to take and why to take it. 

                                              The only thing in your pack that should (Hopefully) go unused is your first-aid supplies. Really, even if there isn't a drop of rain, ideally even your storm gear should be integrated into what you need to stay warm in camp.

                                              Also, just because you will use everything, doesn't mean you NEED everything.

                                              My kit only differs from Chris' in: one pair of undies (I go w/o when/if the other is drying) TMI??? 2 pair of socks (one to wear and one to dry), something for my hands (but I will admit to not always having this). Also, I take a mid weight fleece to hike in the mornings or when it's wet and cold but, I also have a down shirt (or sweater depending on month) that I "never" wear hiking. If it does indeed rain, what you are wearing will get wet/damp. I like the idea for both comfort and safety, of having something dry to put on in camp. But even if it doesn't rain, I layer my fleece, down shirt and rain jacket in camp for warmth.

                                              JD
                                              Walk the Sky: Following the John Muir Trail


                                              On Wed, Dec 25, 2013 at 3:08 AM, <cehauser1@...> wrote:
                                               

                                              Mick:

                                              For my whole life I had been a traditional backpacker, with a pack ranging from 30-50 pounds... for trips ranging from 3-5 days.  This summer was the first time I would be hiking longer than 5 days, and I realized if I was going to hike all the sections of trail that I wanted to see, in the amount of time I had available, I needed to seriously re-think backpacking, especially as I am entering the second half of my life and I don't consider myself to be very athletic.  So for the first time in my life, I went lightweight, and it was a real game-changer for me.  A light-weight backpack allowed me to hike long hours and long miles, and really enjoy my time.  I rarely felt the weight of the backpack (ranging from 18 - 22 pounds total), and for the first time I felt like I really enjoyed my time on the trail.


                                              I firmly believe that everyone has their own unique set of needs, comfort levels, desired margin of safety, athletic ability, etc, so I totally respect your desire to have more flexibility.  However, let me ask you you explore two ideas:  First, try to not mentally categorize your clothes as either what you will wear on the trail, or what you will carry in the pack... instead, try to think of what you will need to wear to be safe, warm, and comfortable during the range of expected weather conditions you will likely face on the JMT... some of the items you will wear on the trail every day, and some items you might only wear under extreme conditions.  Second, carefully consider the balance between the comfort provided by having lots of items with you, versus the comforted provided by having a lightweight backpack.  I respect that everyone has unique needs and desires while backpacking, but I now believe that carrying a light weight pack is something that would be helpful to almost everyone out on the trail.

                                              Based on what I learned on the JMT this summer, here's what I will be taking on a similar Sierra trip next summer:  1 pair basic hiking shoes, 2 pairs synthetic socks, 1 pair wool socks, 1 convertible pants, 1 synthetic long johns, 2 pairs underwear, 1 long-sleeve synthetic under-shirt, 1 fleece zipper sweatshirt, 1 synthetic outer shell, 1 long-sleeve cotton hiking shirt, 1 balaklava, 1 sun hat, 1 poncho-tarp.  In this list, everything works together, and I can imagine wearing nearly everything during a cold/rainy/windy Sierra day, with nothing redundant and nothing missing. 

                                              Best of luck preparing for your trip, and happy holidays!

                                              Chris.


                                              ---In johnmuirtrail@{{emailDomain}}, <mick.parker997tt@...> wrote:


                                              <snip>

                                              1. Chris, I'm afraid I can't go quite as minimalist as you can!  I would only have the cloths I'm hiking in plus two pair of socks, a pair of UW, a pair of long UW and a jacket?  I want to have a little more flexibility.





                                              --
                                              John Dittli/Leslie Goethals
                                              John Dittli Photography
                                              www.johndittli.com
                                              760-934-3505 

                                              Walk the Sky: Following the John Muir Trail
                                              2010  IPPY Gold Medal Award Winner




                                              --
                                              John Dittli/Leslie Goethals
                                              John Dittli Photography
                                              www.johndittli.com
                                              760-934-3505 

                                              Walk the Sky: Following the John Muir Trail
                                              2010  IPPY Gold Medal Award Winner

                                            • cehauser1
                                              Herb: Thanks for adding those other strategies. My JMT hike this summer went about as you recommend: I would sleep outside so I would wake up at first light,
                                              Message 22 of 28 , Dec 26, 2013
                                              View Source
                                              • 0 Attachment

                                                Herb:

                                                Thanks for adding those other strategies.  My JMT hike this summer went about as you recommend:  I would sleep outside so I would wake up at first light, then on the trail by 7am, eat a breakfast Snickers as I'm hiking down the trail. I would take several long eating/drinking/bathing breaks throughout the day (including lunch and dinner in those breaks, if possible).  Then I would hike until late in the day (I hiked until 9 or 11pm most nights), then I would lay down and fall asleep.  


                                                I should have included those strategies as part of my response to Mick.  It might help explain why I was able to go so light with my clothes. 


                                                Happy holidays!

                                                Chris.

                                                ---In johnmuirtrail@{{emailDomain}}, <hstroh@...> wrote:

                                                <snip>

                                                Other strategies to consider if you are willing to experiment with different hiking styles: instead of shivering through breakfast, pack up and start hiking first thing. As the day warms, stop somewhere and have breakfast. Rather than planning for extended time at your camp site, hike longer during the day. Take an extended lunch and longer breaks at interesting locations during the day. Have dinner early along the trail or at a creek, filter the next day's water, and hike till twilight. When you get to camp most evening chores are done so you can hop in the bag and watch the stars come out. This hiking style allows you to maximize the warmest part of the day and puts you into your snug bag just when temperatures drop.


                                                Herb
                                              • cehauser1
                                                Thanks John! ... I ve been following this group for a long time, and that is probably the best description (and rational) I have seen here regarding what to
                                                Message 23 of 28 , Dec 26, 2013
                                                View Source
                                                • 0 Attachment

                                                  Thanks John!



                                                  ---In johnmuirtrail@{{emailDomain}}, <johndittli@...> wrote:

                                                  I've been following this group for a long time, and that is probably the best description (and rational) I have seen here regarding what to take and why to take it. 

                                                • cehauser1
                                                  Thanks Ken. The big 3 from my 2013 JMT trip: Sleeping System = 74 ounces, or 4.6 pounds Mountain Hardware Lamina +35 sleeping bag, 45 ounces (no stuff sack)
                                                  Message 24 of 28 , Dec 26, 2013
                                                  View Source
                                                  • 0 Attachment

                                                    Thanks Ken.

                                                     

                                                    The "big 3" from my 2013 JMT trip:

                                                     

                                                    Sleeping System = 74 ounces, or 4.6 pounds

                                                      Mountain Hardware Lamina +35 sleeping bag, 45 ounces (no stuff sack)

                                                      ThermaRest ProLight regular-length sleeping pad, 16 ounces

                                                      StanSport blue closed-cell foam sleeping pad, 9 ounces

                                                      Cocoon Air-Core Ultralight air pillow, 4 ounces

                                                     

                                                    Shelter = 15 ounces, or 0.9 pounds:

                                                      Adventure Medical SOL Escape Bivvy, 8 ounces

                                                      Tyvek cloth 5x9 ground cloth or rain cover, 7 ounces

                                                      mosquito head net, 1 ounce


                                                    Packing = 40 ounces, or 2.5 pounds:

                                                      Osprey Talon 44 backpack, 36 ounces (modified)

                                                      Sea to Summit day pack, 3 ounces

                                                      trash compactor bags (2), 1 ounce


                                                    For next summer's similar-length hike on the PCT, I'd like to lighten my sleeping setup... I'll probably eliminate the ThermaRest sleeping pad (too heavy), the air pillow (leaked after the 3rd night), and the Tyvek tarp (wasn't useful enough for the weight). I don't feel rich enough to purchase a new sleeping bag or backpack, but I know those two items add a lot of weigh.  Also, I'll cut a few more ounces (compression straps) off the Osprey backpack and I'll add a poncho-tarp for better rain protection.


                                                    I'm always open to suggestions...


                                                    Chris.




                                                    ---In johnmuirtrail@{{emailDomain}}, <kenjessett@...> wrote:

                                                    Chris, good input. Can you list the weights of the 'Big 3' for the group?

                                                    Ken.

                                                  • John Ladd
                                                    ... Chris - how durable was the bivy - is it something you could use most nights on a 2-week trip, or something that could be used only on the occasional extra
                                                    Message 25 of 28 , Dec 27, 2013
                                                    View Source
                                                    • 0 Attachment

                                                      On Thu, Dec 26, 2013 at 10:41 PM, <cehauser1@...> wrote:
                                                       Adventure Medical SOL Escape Bivvy, 8 ounces

                                                      Chris - how durable was the bivy - is it something you could use most nights on a 2-week trip, or something that could be used only on the occasional extra cold or wet night?

                                                      John Curran Ladd
                                                      1616 Castro Street
                                                      San Francisco, CA  94114-3707
                                                      415-648-9279
                                                    • cehauser1
                                                      Hi John: The Escape Bivvy is very durable. I used it 17 nights on my JMT/HST trip, outside in the dirt (I roll around a lot, and often slip off my pad into
                                                      Message 26 of 28 , Dec 27, 2013
                                                      View Source
                                                      • 0 Attachment

                                                        Hi John:

                                                        The Escape Bivvy is very durable.  I used it 17 nights on my JMT/HST trip, outside in the dirt (I roll around a lot, and often slip off my pad into the dirt), and it doesn't show any sign of wear... I was planning to use the same one for next summer's trip.  When I bought mine last year, I think they only sold a bright construction orange color, but they now sell it in a nicer forest green color.  I might get a new green one for better "stealth camping", but not because it needs to be replaced.


                                                        Be careful, they sell a number of similar items that are a little confusing:  A year ago, I think they offered 3 items, the "Escape", plus the "Emergency Bivvy", and the "Emergency Blanket" (both were basically single-night use - one was like a standard "pop-tart wrapper" emergency blanket, and the other was like a plastic bag).  Make sure you get the "Escape" which is made out of a breathable Tyvek fabric, and is mylar lined on the inside to reflect body heat.  Now it looks like they also offer several versions of the "Escape", a heavy weight version ("Thermal Bivvy") and a lightweight version ("Escape Lite").  Plus the green version of the standard "Escape", the "Tactical".  Their website makes it only slightly less confusing:  http://www.adventuremedicalkits.com/survival/shelter.html


                                                        Happy new year,


                                                        Chris.



                                                        ---In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, <johnladd@...> wrote:


                                                        On Thu, Dec 26, 2013 at 10:41 PM, <cehauser1@...> wrote:
                                                         Adventure Medical SOL Escape Bivvy, 8 ounces

                                                        Chris - how durable was the bivy - is it something you could use most nights on a 2-week trip, or something that could be used only on the occasional extra cold or wet night?

                                                        John Curran Ladd
                                                        1616 Castro Street
                                                        San Francisco, CA  94114-3707
                                                        415-648-9279
                                                      • Larry Beck
                                                        Chris, In regards to your Big 3 list you posted earlier.   Mountain Hardware Lamina +35 sleeping bag, 45 ounces (no stuff sack) That s just 3 oz short of
                                                        Message 27 of 28 , Dec 28, 2013
                                                        View Source
                                                        • 0 Attachment
                                                          Chris,

                                                          In regards to your "Big 3" list you posted earlier.

                                                           "Mountain Hardware Lamina +35 sleeping bag, 45 ounces (no stuff sack)"

                                                          That's just 3 oz short of 3 lbs.. you should be able to find a sleeping bag in that temperature range that weighs 24 oz. That will save you almost 1.5 lbs.


                                                          Larry
                                                          From: "cehauser1@..." <cehauser1@...>
                                                          To: johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com
                                                          Sent: Friday, December 27, 2013 9:01 PM
                                                          Subject: [John Muir Trail] RE: Cloths List
                                                           
                                                          Hi John:

                                                          The Escape Bivvy is very durable.  I used it 17 nights on my JMT/HST trip, outside in the dirt (I roll around a lot, and often slip off my pad into the dirt), and it doesn't show any sign of wear... I was planning to use the same one for next summer's trip.  When I bought mine last year, I think they only sold a bright construction orange color, but they now sell it in a nicer forest green color.  I might get a new green one for better "stealth camping", but not because it needs to be replaced.

                                                          Be careful, they sell a number of similar items that are a little confusing:  A year ago, I think they offered 3 items, the "Escape", plus the "Emergency Bivvy", and the "Emergency Blanket" (both were basically single-night use - one was like a standard "pop-tart wrapper" emergency blanket, and the other was like a plastic bag).  Make sure you get the "Escape" which is made out of a breathable Tyvek fabric, and is mylar lined on the inside to reflect body heat.  Now it looks like they also offer several versions of the "Escape", a heavy weight version ("Thermal Bivvy") and a lightweight version ("Escape Lite").  Plus the green version of the standard "Escape", the "Tactical".  Their website makes it only slightly less confusing:  http://www.adventuremedicalkits.com/survival/shelter.html

                                                          Happy new year,

                                                          Chris.
                                                          ---In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, <johnladd@...> wrote:

                                                          On Thu, Dec 26, 2013 at 10:41 PM, <cehauser1@...> wrote:
                                                           Adventure Medical SOL Escape Bivvy, 8 ounces

                                                          Chris - how durable was the bivy - is it something you could use most nights on a 2-week trip, or something that could be used only on the occasional extra cold or wet night?

                                                          John Curran Ladd 1616 Castro Street San Francisco, CA  94114-3707 415-648-9279
                                                        • dlink_95670
                                                          The Mont-Bell Super Spiral down hugger #3 bag weighs 22 oz and is rated 30. Love mine, and the elastic stretch in the baffles is very comfortable.
                                                          Message 28 of 28 , Dec 29, 2013
                                                          View Source
                                                          • 0 Attachment

                                                            The Mont-Bell Super Spiral down hugger #3 bag weighs 22 oz and is rated 30. Love mine, and the elastic stretch in the baffles is very comfortable.

                                                          Your message has been successfully submitted and would be delivered to recipients shortly.