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Re: [John Muir Trail] resupply questions

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  • Dave Sloan
    Heading north to south, we ve only resupplied at Vermilion. So, we had to head south from Vermilion with 9 days of food and one bear canister. Ouch. We carry
    Message 1 of 30 , Feb 4, 2009
      Heading north to south, we've only resupplied at Vermilion. So, we had to
      head south from Vermilion with 9 days of food and one bear canister.
      Ouch. We carry some extra food outside the bear canister. Two bear
      canisters is just not an option. Too heavy.

      We covered closer to 15-17 miles per day. There are some days when you have
      to go over two passes in one day or you'll get stuck in no man's land.
      Also, I've always found that during the second week we get super hungry
      since our metabolism is fully kicked in. But, you feel much stronger after
      a week of trail shock and can fly along the trail. It's frustrating to
      have to resupply so early, since Vermilion is only about 5 days from
      Yosemite. I would consider the Trail Ranch and Reds Meadow next time. Two
      resupplies for the whole trip would be ideal. That 9 day southern stretch
      to Whitney is pretty remote.

      Also, its really important to have highly nutritious food. We carry corn
      pasta and whole wheat cous-cous/bean soups, salami, salty cheese, etc. We
      met lots of people trying to cover long distances on worthless foods like
      oatmeal and regular spaghetti. They were suffering and couldn't sustain a
      good 8 hours of hiking per day.

      Dave Sloan

      On Wed, Feb 4, 2009 at 9:13 AM, Barbara Karagosian <barbara@...> wrote:

      > Hi there,
      >
      > Re bear canisters, check out the web site for Wild Ideas. They make the
      > Bearikade canisters - the Expedition size holds 9 days of food and other
      > smelly items. You can rent these, and if you tell them you are doing the
      > JMT, the rental is $55 total (plus shipping). They charge you for days on
      > trail, not days spent in the mail to and from. I used one last year and
      > loved it - plus it is actually lighter than the bigger Bear Vault, as well
      > as holding more.
      >
      > http://www.wild-ideas.net/index2.html
      >
      > Re mileage - I'm slow and figure 8 miles a day average, so I am resupplying
      > at VVR and at MTR, and also hiking out to independence over Kearsage Pass
      > to
      > pick up a resupply there (and also have a zero luxury day).
      >
      > Re coming from Ohio - likely by the time you're past VVR, you'll be well
      > acclimatized and have your trail legs. (My trail legs never run to 15 miles
      > per day though, sadly). I'm departing Tuolumne Meadows on July 19, and
      > hiking out from Whitney around Aug 15, so maybe see you there! Barbara
      >
      > _____
      >
      > From: johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com <johnmuirtrail%40yahoogroups.com>[mailto:
      > johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com <johnmuirtrail%40yahoogroups.com>]
      > On Behalf Of Bgibson
      > Sent: Wednesday, February 04, 2009 8:56 AM
      > To: johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com <johnmuirtrail%40yahoogroups.com>
      > Subject: [John Muir Trail] resupply questions
      >
      >
      > Hi everyone,
      >
      > I'm planning a solo JMT hike north to south in late June or early July,
      > starting in Yosemite. I've been poring over Elizabeth Wenk's John Muir
      > Trail
      > and I'm really looking forward to the trip. But I'm a bit uncertain in a
      > couple of areas and thought I'd toss out a question to the experts on this
      > list who keep giving lots of good advice based on their experiences on the
      > trail.
      >
      > I'm looking at the distances in the book that show mileage from the Muir
      > Trail Ranch to Whitney Portal as 111 miles, with no easy access along the
      > trail to resupply in those sections. I'd rather not hike out for
      > resupplies, then hike back in and take two to three days to do that.
      >
      > I'm planning to buy a bear canister, and in looking over the specs, most
      > indicate they have space a six to seven day supply of food. Assuming I
      > carry one day's food outside the canister, I'd be able to plan for a seven
      > to eight days of meals. But I'm not sure how feasible it would be for
      > someone living in Ohio to keep up a 14 to 15 mile-a-day pace over the last
      > 100 or so miles at that altitude. I don't know whether to just plan for an
      > expensive resupply along the way, or buy the larger bear vault. I have done
      > that sort of pace over the AT, but those mountains are not nearly as high.
      >
      > So my question to those who did the last 100 plus miles without resupply --
      > what kind of pace did you maintain, and were you able to pack enough food
      > into your bear canister.
      >
      > Or, should I just make the trip out for supplies a part of my planning and
      > enjoy the side trail, which from what I've read will be wonderful also.
      >
      > thanks,
      >
      > Bob
      >
      >
      > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      >
      > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      >
      >
      >



      --
      Dave Sloan


      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • jim.ennis
      Bob: Remember that by the time you reach Muir Ranch, you ll already have a week or more under your belt and should have long since acclimated to the
      Message 2 of 30 , Feb 4, 2009
        Bob:
        Remember that by the time you reach Muir Ranch, you'll already have a
        week or more under your belt and should have long since acclimated to
        the elevations. If you keep your meals calorie-packed, but light, and
        repackage all items to their smallest size, you should be able to pack
        10+ days worth of food in your canister. You should be able to
        maintain your 15-mile days by this point and therefore you would
        finish on the seventh day out of Muir Ranch.
        Jim

        --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, Bgibson <doyle6767@...> wrote:
        >
        >
        >
        > Hi everyone,
        >  
        > I'm planning a solo JMT hike north to south in late June or early
        July, starting in Yosemite. I've been poring over Elizabeth Wenk's
        John Muir Trail and I'm really looking forward to the trip.  But I'm a
        bit uncertain in a couple of areas and thought I'd toss out a question
        to the experts on this list who keep giving lots of good advice based
        on their experiences on the trail.
        >  
        > I'm looking at the distances in the book that show mileage from the
        Muir Trail Ranch to Whitney Portal as 111 miles, with no easy
        access along the trail to resupply in those sections.  I'd rather not
        hike out for resupplies, then hike back in and take two to three days
        to do that. 
        >  
        > I'm planning to buy a bear canister, and in looking over the specs,
        most indicate they have space  a six to seven day supply of food. 
        Assuming I carry one day's food outside the canister, I'd be able to
        plan for a seven to eight days of meals.  But I'm not sure how
        feasible it would be for someone living in Ohio to keep up a 14 to 15
        mile-a-day pace over the last 100 or so miles at that altitude.  I
        don't know whether to just plan for an expensive resupply along the
        way, or buy the larger bear vault.  I have done that sort of pace over
        the AT, but those mountains are not nearly as high.
        >  
        > So my question to those who did the last 100 plus miles without
        resupply -- what kind of pace did you maintain, and were you able to
        pack enough food into your bear canister.
        >  
        > Or, should I just make the trip out for supplies a part of my
        planning and enjoy the side trail, which from what I've read will be
        wonderful also.
        >  
        > thanks,
        >  
        > Bob
        >  
        >
        >
        >
        >
        > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        >
      • Ima Person
        Hi Bob,  Last year I hiked the JMT north to south during the timeframe you are talking about, starting on June 24, ending July 7.  Resupplied once at
        Message 3 of 30 , Feb 4, 2009
          Hi Bob,  Last year I hiked the JMT north to south during the timeframe you are talking about, starting on June 24, ending July 7.  Resupplied once at Vermillion.  I found it to be a tight pack in my Garcia bear can for the days between Vermillion and Whitney Portal but doable.   I do, however, probably eat a bit light in comparison to other people so you have to plan for your own needs.  I eat "worthless foods" like oatmeal and freeze dried spaghetti and found them nutritionally adequate.  Getting the bigger can would make the packing less stressful for sure, without a huge increase in weight and maybe allow for a bit of reserve.   For me, going out to civilization to resupply was not appealing at all.

          You should get stronger as you go along so don't discount that in regards to the mileage you will be capable of doing during the second part of your trip.  I will admit, the 14-16 mile days I did during the beginning part were tough, more due to altitude adjustment than anything else.  Snow was not a problem, but it is unpredictable.  Last minute weather systems can dump a pile and make your life very difficult but thats the mountains.  If the current drought continues, high elevation snow may not be an issue.  Last year, I really didn't feel confidant of the snow situation until about 3 weeks before I started.  I kept in touch with several PCT hikers who were doing trail reports as they moved north.  These reports were invaluable.

          The post recommending creating a "test" can would be a great way to determine where you stand with respect to supplies.

          Al




          ________________________________
          From: Bgibson <doyle6767@...>
          To: johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com
          Sent: Wednesday, February 4, 2009 8:56:10 AM
          Subject: [John Muir Trail] resupply questions




          Hi everyone,
           
          I'm planning a solo JMT hike north to south in late June or early July, starting in Yosemite. I've been poring over Elizabeth Wenk's John Muir Trail and I'm really looking forward to the trip.  But I'm a bit uncertain in a couple of areas and thought I'd toss out a question to the experts on this list who keep giving lots of good advice based on their experiences on the trail.
           
          I'm looking at the distances in the book that show mileage from the Muir Trail Ranch to Whitney Portal as 111 miles, with no easy access along the trail to resupply in those sections.  I'd rather not hike out for resupplies, then hike back in and take two to three days to do that. 
           
          I'm planning to buy a bear canister, and in looking over the specs, most indicate they have space  a six to seven day supply of food.  Assuming I carry one day's food outside the canister, I'd be able to plan for a seven to eight days of meals.  But I'm not sure how feasible it would be for someone living in Ohio to keep up a 14 to 15 mile-a-day pace over the last 100 or so miles at that altitude.  I don't know whether to just plan for an expensive resupply along the way, or buy the larger bear vault.  I have done that sort of pace over the AT, but those mountains are not nearly as high.
           
          So my question to those who did the last 100 plus miles without resupply -- what kind of pace did you maintain, and were you able to pack enough food into your bear canister.
           
          Or, should I just make the trip out for supplies a part of my planning and enjoy the side trail, which from what I've read will be wonderful also.
           
          thanks,
           
          Bob
           

          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]






          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • Bgibson
          Thanks to all for your answers.   I think I ll take the advice and wait until July to get started.  I can t push my finish date too far into August. I like
          Message 4 of 30 , Feb 4, 2009
            Thanks to all for your answers.
             
            I think I'll take the advice and wait until July to get started.  I can't push my finish date too far into August. I like the looks and specs on the bearkaide, but the cost is a bit up there and if I rent, I'd still be reaching close to a purchase price by counting transportation time for me (unless one can have it delivered to a starting point). I think, though this may change, I'm going to drive out and leave the vehicle at Whitney Portal.  I want to see some relatives in Denver, and though I like the idea of Amtrak, my experience has been that their estimated time is off considerably, especially out West.
             
            I'm leaning toward just hiking out for supplies, and just count the journey there and back as part of my trip and enjoy the hike. 
             
            I probably see just how much good food I can cram into a canister and make more plans from there.
             
            As I continue planning, I'll probably post more questions since the responses were so quick and helpful.
             
            Thanks again, and hope to see some of you on the trail in July.
             
            Bob
             


            ---




            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          • richfax
            Bob, last year we went from Tuolumne to Whitney Portal in less than 13 days (average of 15 miles/day) with one resupply at Muir Trail Ranch.  We were able
            Message 5 of 30 , Feb 4, 2009
              Bob, last year we went from Tuolumne to Whitney Portal in less than 13 days (average of 15 miles/day) with one resupply at Muir Trail Ranch.  We were able to get 7 days of food to fit in a BearVault BV500, but more than that would be problematic.   We ate dry granola for breakfast, Clifbars for lunch and a Mountain House ProPak for dinner along with snacks in between. I'm glad we didn't bring more food because we just weren't that hungry and had a hard time eating all of our food.  We're from Texas at 60 feet elevation and did it, so being from Ohio shouldn't be an issue..  
               
              Rich

              --- On Wed, 2/4/09, Bgibson <doyle6767@...> wrote:

              From: Bgibson <doyle6767@...>
              Subject: [John Muir Trail] resupply questions
              To: johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com
              Date: Wednesday, February 4, 2009, 10:56 AM








              Hi everyone,
               
              I'm planning a solo JMT hike north to south in late June or early July, starting in Yosemite. I've been poring over Elizabeth Wenk's John Muir Trail and I'm really looking forward to the trip.  But I'm a bit uncertain in a couple of areas and thought I'd toss out a question to the experts on this list who keep giving lots of good advice based on their experiences on the trail.
               
              I'm looking at the distances in the book that show mileage from the Muir Trail Ranch to Whitney Portal as 111 miles, with no easy access along the trail to resupply in those sections.  I'd rather not hike out for resupplies, then hike back in and take two to three days to do that. 
               
              I'm planning to buy a bear canister, and in looking over the specs, most indicate they have space  a six to seven day supply of food.  Assuming I carry one day's food outside the canister, I'd be able to plan for a seven to eight days of meals.  But I'm not sure how feasible it would be for someone living in Ohio to keep up a 14 to 15 mile-a-day pace over the last 100 or so miles at that altitude.  I don't know whether to just plan for an expensive resupply along the way, or buy the larger bear vault.  I have done that sort of pace over the AT, but those mountains are not nearly as high.
               
              So my question to those who did the last 100 plus miles without resupply -- what kind of pace did you maintain, and were you able to pack enough food into your bear canister.
               
              Or, should I just make the trip out for supplies a part of my planning and enjoy the side trail, which from what I've read will be wonderful also.
               
              thanks,
               
              Bob
               

              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


















              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            • David Carbiener
              Bob, I hiked the JMT last August with a small group and we took 10 days from MTR to WP. I used a Bear Vault BV500 and got all my food and smellies in it.
              Message 6 of 30 , Feb 4, 2009
                Bob,
                I hiked the JMT last August with a small group and we took 10 days from MTR to WP. I used a Bear Vault BV500 and got all my food and smellies in it. Repackage everything down to as small as possible. For breakfast I did eat oatmeal, powerbar, and coffee. Lunches were granola bars, salmon, tuna fish, chicken, beef jerky, dried fruit, etc. Dinners were repackaged dehydrated 2 person meals. There is fish that can be caught along the way to help supplement dinners too. My group really did not have any problems carrying everything we needed during those 10 days in Bear Vaults.
                Good luck, Dave

                ----- Original Message -----
                From: Bgibson
                To: johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com
                Sent: Wednesday, February 04, 2009 8:56 AM
                Subject: [John Muir Trail] resupply questions




                Hi everyone,

                I'm planning a solo JMT hike north to south in late June or early July, starting in Yosemite. I've been poring over Elizabeth Wenk's John Muir Trail and I'm really looking forward to the trip. But I'm a bit uncertain in a couple of areas and thought I'd toss out a question to the experts on this list who keep giving lots of good advice based on their experiences on the trail.

                I'm looking at the distances in the book that show mileage from the Muir Trail Ranch to Whitney Portal as 111 miles, with no easy access along the trail to resupply in those sections. I'd rather not hike out for resupplies, then hike back in and take two to three days to do that.

                I'm planning to buy a bear canister, and in looking over the specs, most indicate they have space a six to seven day supply of food. Assuming I carry one day's food outside the canister, I'd be able to plan for a seven to eight days of meals. But I'm not sure how feasible it would be for someone living in Ohio to keep up a 14 to 15 mile-a-day pace over the last 100 or so miles at that altitude. I don't know whether to just plan for an expensive resupply along the way, or buy the larger bear vault. I have done that sort of pace over the AT, but those mountains are not nearly as high.

                So my question to those who did the last 100 plus miles without resupply -- what kind of pace did you maintain, and were you able to pack enough food into your bear canister.

                Or, should I just make the trip out for supplies a part of my planning and enjoy the side trail, which from what I've read will be wonderful also.

                thanks,

                Bob


                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              • Matt Ruby
                Bob, You can easily fit 10+ days of food in a garcia or a BV 500. Although to do so you must pack smart. I ate highest possible calorie granola with 2
                Message 7 of 30 , Feb 4, 2009
                  Bob,
                  You can easily fit 10+ days of food in a garcia or a BV 500. Although to do so you must pack smart. I ate highest possible calorie granola with 2 tablespoons of protein powder for breakfast each day. 2 or 3 clif bars for lunch, nuts and dried fruit for a snack and 3/4 cup small pasta (orzo or cous cous) with beef jerky for dinner. My food was spartan, but I ate for 15 days out of one BV 500. Make sure you pig out at any eateries along the way: VVR, Reds, TM. People often overestimate how much food they will eat or need, try to avoid this. good luck.
                  Matt




                  ________________________________
                  From: David Carbiener <davecarb@...>
                  To: johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com
                  Sent: Wednesday, February 4, 2009 3:37:29 PM
                  Subject: Re: [John Muir Trail] resupply questions


                  Bob,
                  I hiked the JMT last August with a small group and we took 10 days from MTR to WP. I used a Bear Vault BV500 and got all my food and smellies in it. Repackage everything down to as small as possible. For breakfast I did eat oatmeal, powerbar, and coffee. Lunches were granola bars, salmon, tuna fish, chicken, beef jerky, dried fruit, etc. Dinners were repackaged dehydrated 2 person meals. There is fish that can be caught along the way to help supplement dinners too. My group really did not have any problems carrying everything we needed during those 10 days in Bear Vaults.
                  Good luck, Dave

                  ----- Original Message -----
                  From: Bgibson
                  To: johnmuirtrail@ yahoogroups. com
                  Sent: Wednesday, February 04, 2009 8:56 AM
                  Subject: [John Muir Trail] resupply questions

                  Hi everyone,

                  I'm planning a solo JMT hike north to south in late June or early July, starting in Yosemite. I've been poring over Elizabeth Wenk's John Muir Trail and I'm really looking forward to the trip. But I'm a bit uncertain in a couple of areas and thought I'd toss out a question to the experts on this list who keep giving lots of good advice based on their experiences on the trail.

                  I'm looking at the distances in the book that show mileage from the Muir Trail Ranch to Whitney Portal as 111 miles, with no easy access along the trail to resupply in those sections. I'd rather not hike out for resupplies, then hike back in and take two to three days to do that.

                  I'm planning to buy a bear canister, and in looking over the specs, most indicate they have space a six to seven day supply of food. Assuming I carry one day's food outside the canister, I'd be able to plan for a seven to eight days of meals. But I'm not sure how feasible it would be for someone living in Ohio to keep up a 14 to 15 mile-a-day pace over the last 100 or so miles at that altitude. I don't know whether to just plan for an expensive resupply along the way, or buy the larger bear vault. I have done that sort of pace over the AT, but those mountains are not nearly as high.

                  So my question to those who did the last 100 plus miles without resupply -- what kind of pace did you maintain, and were you able to pack enough food into your bear canister.

                  Or, should I just make the trip out for supplies a part of my planning and enjoy the side trail, which from what I've read will be wonderful also.

                  thanks,

                  Bob


                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]







                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                • Bgibson
                  I as already leaning toward the BV500, and the comments I ve received so far confirm my choice. thanks   bob ... From: Matt Ruby Subject:
                  Message 8 of 30 , Feb 4, 2009
                    I as already leaning toward the BV500, and the comments I've received so far confirm my choice.
                    thanks
                     
                    bob


                    --- On Wed, 2/4/09, Matt Ruby <mattruby@...> wrote:

                    From: Matt Ruby <mattruby@...>
                    Subject: Re: [John Muir Trail] resupply questions
                    To: johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com
                    Date: Wednesday, February 4, 2009, 7:59 PM






                    Bob,
                    You can easily fit 10+ days of food in a garcia or a BV 500. Although to do so you must pack smart. I ate highest possible calorie granola with 2 tablespoons of protein powder for breakfast each day. 2 or 3 clif bars for lunch, nuts and dried fruit for a snack and 3/4 cup small pasta (orzo or cous cous) with beef jerky for dinner. My food was spartan, but I ate for 15 days out of one BV 500. Make sure you pig out at any eateries along the way: VVR, Reds, TM. People often overestimate how much food they will eat or need, try to avoid this. good luck.
                    Matt

                    ____________ _________ _________ __
                    From: David Carbiener <davecarb@sbcglobal. net>
                    To: johnmuirtrail@ yahoogroups. com
                    Sent: Wednesday, February 4, 2009 3:37:29 PM
                    Subject: Re: [John Muir Trail] resupply questions

                    Bob,
                    I hiked the JMT last August with a small group and we took 10 days from MTR to WP. I used a Bear Vault BV500 and got all my food and smellies in it. Repackage everything down to as small as possible. For breakfast I did eat oatmeal, powerbar, and coffee. Lunches were granola bars, salmon, tuna fish, chicken, beef jerky, dried fruit, etc. Dinners were repackaged dehydrated 2 person meals. There is fish that can be caught along the way to help supplement dinners too. My group really did not have any problems carrying everything we needed during those 10 days in Bear Vaults.
                    Good luck, Dave

                    ----- Original Message -----
                    From: Bgibson
                    To: johnmuirtrail@ yahoogroups. com
                    Sent: Wednesday, February 04, 2009 8:56 AM
                    Subject: [John Muir Trail] resupply questions

                    Hi everyone,

                    I'm planning a solo JMT hike north to south in late June or early July, starting in Yosemite. I've been poring over Elizabeth Wenk's John Muir Trail and I'm really looking forward to the trip. But I'm a bit uncertain in a couple of areas and thought I'd toss out a question to the experts on this list who keep giving lots of good advice based on their experiences on the trail.

                    I'm looking at the distances in the book that show mileage from the Muir Trail Ranch to Whitney Portal as 111 miles, with no easy access along the trail to resupply in those sections. I'd rather not hike out for resupplies, then hike back in and take two to three days to do that.

                    I'm planning to buy a bear canister, and in looking over the specs, most indicate they have space a six to seven day supply of food. Assuming I carry one day's food outside the canister, I'd be able to plan for a seven to eight days of meals. But I'm not sure how feasible it would be for someone living in Ohio to keep up a 14 to 15 mile-a-day pace over the last 100 or so miles at that altitude. I don't know whether to just plan for an expensive resupply along the way, or buy the larger bear vault. I have done that sort of pace over the AT, but those mountains are not nearly as high.

                    So my question to those who did the last 100 plus miles without resupply -- what kind of pace did you maintain, and were you able to pack enough food into your bear canister.

                    Or, should I just make the trip out for supplies a part of my planning and enjoy the side trail, which from what I've read will be wonderful also.

                    thanks,

                    Bob

                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



















                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                  • song95139@sbcglobal.net
                    Bob, I hiked the whole JMT from YV to Mt Whitney in 17 days.  Within the 17 days, I had 1.5 days total worth of time not hiking.  Those time were spent on
                    Message 9 of 30 , Feb 4, 2009
                      Bob,

                      I hiked the whole JMT from YV to Mt Whitney in 17 days.  Within the 17 days, I had 1.5 days total worth of time not hiking.  Those time were spent on doing laundry at resorts, packing resupply, and pigging at resorts.

                      I carried a BV500.  Resupplying only at MTR to complete the southern half of JMT, my initial concern was similar to yours.  Can I pack enough food to last the distance?  I made it with easilly and with food left to spare.  I even ate one of my dinner for lunch. 

                      After about 3 days of hiking, I got use to a certain pace or 10-12 miles of hiking.  After 7 days of hiking, I was confortable with 15 miles a day. I got stronger and felt more comfortable hiking.

                      To answer your question, it can be done with a BV500.  I repacked my dehydrated food in a zip lock bag for easy packing at MTR.  I wrote down the meal and the water ratio needed with a sharpie on the zip lock. 

                      My daily meals are oatmeal and coffee for breakfast, nuts, dried fruits, and jerky for lunch, and dehydrated meals for dinner.  Drink sweetner and assortment of cereal bars for snacks.

                      Enjoy planning and enjoy you hike..

                      Sim
                      --- On Wed, 2/4/09, Bgibson <doyle6767@...> wrote:
                      From: Bgibson <doyle6767@...>
                      Subject: [John Muir Trail] resupply questions
                      To: johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com
                      Date: Wednesday, February 4, 2009, 8:56 AM















                      Hi everyone,

                       

                      I'm planning a solo JMT hike north to south in late June or early July, starting in Yosemite. I've been poring over Elizabeth Wenk's John Muir Trail and I'm really looking forward to the trip.  But I'm a bit uncertain in a couple of areas and thought I'd toss out a question to the experts on this list who keep giving lots of good advice based on their experiences on the trail.

                       

                      I'm looking at the distances in the book that show mileage from the Muir Trail Ranch to Whitney Portal as 111 miles, with no easy access along the trail to resupply in those sections.  I'd rather not hike out for resupplies, then hike back in and take two to three days to do that. 

                       

                      I'm planning to buy a bear canister, and in looking over the specs, most indicate they have space  a six to seven day supply of food.  Assuming I carry one day's food outside the canister, I'd be able to plan for a seven to eight days of meals.  But I'm not sure how feasible it would be for someone living in Ohio to keep up a 14 to 15 mile-a-day pace over the last 100 or so miles at that altitude.  I don't know whether to just plan for an expensive resupply along the way, or buy the larger bear vault.  I have done that sort of pace over the AT, but those mountains are not nearly as high.

                       

                      So my question to those who did the last 100 plus miles without resupply -- what kind of pace did you maintain, and were you able to pack enough food into your bear canister.

                       

                      Or, should I just make the trip out for supplies a part of my planning and enjoy the side trail, which from what I've read will be wonderful also.

                       

                      thanks,

                       

                      Bob

                       



                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


























                      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                    • Ralph Alcorn
                      This topic came up recently on the pct-l forum. I don t think Ken Powers would mind if I reposted his post on the subject. KM is Kennedy Meadows, which is
                      Message 10 of 30 , Feb 5, 2009
                        This topic came up recently on the pct-l forum. I don't think Ken Powers
                        would mind if I reposted his post on the subject. KM is Kennedy Meadows,
                        which is south of Mt. Whitney:

                        Okay Ken, "fess up", what did you guys do on your last thru the Sierra?
                        Please...

                        Ok, I was asked.
                        We planned for 10 days from KM to VVR. We carried the first 2+ days outside
                        the Garcia canister. I think we entered the restricted zone with some bars
                        and maybe part of a bag of potato chips outside the canister, plus that
                        nights meal. Not much as I recall.

                        We removed all the packaging that we could from the food. We smashed the
                        food into the canister at home and mailed it to KM. When loading the
                        canister we try to keep food we need the first few days higher in the
                        canister. We do not want to unload any food and have to put it back in the
                        canister. We don't plan on carrying as many calories as we burn in the high
                        sierra or other long carries. But we eat well when we arrive at a re-supply.

                        Here's what I remember about our food:

                        Dinners - Packed dehydrated black beans in one of those grocery store
                        vegetable bags. Packed instant brown rice and dehydrated salsa in another
                        vegetable bag. We measured both out for 10 days. We had hot chocolate
                        (dumped the contents out of the packets into another bag)

                        Lunches - We carried 2 packages of 8-inch tortillas. One at the bottom of
                        the canister and the other high so we could easily get it out. Must have had
                        2 packages of sliced cheese (total 20 slices?). We used Gatorade powder at
                        half strength for lunch and afternoon snack.

                        Breakfast was our usual - 2 pop tarts, 1 tea bag and 1 hot chocolate from
                        the bag above.

                        Snacks - we carried 2-3 bars per person per day. I think we had a bag of
                        chips or chex mix that was pretty smashed. We probably ate it with a spoon.


                        That's it - 8 days food for 2 people in a Garcia.

                        I carried the Garcia upright in my ULA Circuit. Stuffed clothing and tent
                        around the canister to help pad it. We arrived at VVR on the morning shuttle
                        of our 10th day. Darn, carried that extra food all the way to VVR. We didn't
                        eat black beans and brown rice for a few days after VVR.

                        Ken
                        www GottaWalk com

                        --
                        Ralph Alcorn
                        http://www.backpack45.com/pct.html
                        http://timecheck00.blogspot.com


                        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                      • Sheri
                        Hi folks, I just was able to get real time off in July. Obviously, I don t have a permit for the JMT and am hoping to secure one of the first come permits.
                        Message 11 of 30 , Jun 2, 2013
                          Hi folks,

                          I just was able to get real time off in July. Obviously, I don't have a permit for the JMT and am hoping to secure one of the first come permits. I'm coming from Arizona and want to be pretty sure to get one. Any suggestions on how early I should be at the Wilderness Center? However early I need, I will be there. Thoughts?

                          many thanks,

                          craig
                        • robert shattuck
                          It s not how early you are willing to show up, but how long you are willing to wait around. I ve shown up many a time after one in the afternoon and got just
                          Message 12 of 30 , Jun 2, 2013
                            It's not how early you are willing to show up, but how long you are willing to wait around. 

                            I've shown up many a time after one in the afternoon and got just the permit I wanted . . . But just in case you don't, make sure your vacation time has some padding of at least 2-3 days, so you won't end up either having to move too fast, or end up bailing. 

                            if you get in line early in the morning, there are two (or so) ways it could go--11a.m rolls around and you get a permit to leave that very afternoon. Or you get a permit to leave the next day. Or . . .you could get no permit at all and end up spending another long night waiting in line for 11 a.m., to roll around.

                            You also have trailhead quotas, so you have about four options from the valley, none if which will be that much of an inconvenience---they will usually be able to give you some sort of options, " you can leave from happy isles right now, or you can leave from Glacier point in the morning ( or the opposite of this) ..... Ultimately it is just very wise to have the extra days I. Your schedule for whatever inconvenience comes your way.

                            Bob



                            Sent from my iPhone

                            On Jun 2, 2013, at 7:53 PM, "Sheri" <flagstaffbiker@...> wrote:

                             

                            Hi folks,

                            I just was able to get real time off in July. Obviously, I don't have a permit for the JMT and am hoping to secure one of the first come permits. I'm coming from Arizona and want to be pretty sure to get one. Any suggestions on how early I should be at the Wilderness Center? However early I need, I will be there. Thoughts?

                            many thanks,

                            craig

                          • casey
                            If you aren t a Purist and don t mind missing the H.I. to Toulumne Mdws. portion of the trail (do it later as a separate hike?) and want to get a permit in
                            Message 13 of 30 , Jun 3, 2013
                              If you aren't a Purist and don't mind missing the H.I. to Toulumne Mdws. portion of the trail (do it later as a separate hike?) and want to get a permit in advance. Permits for a start from Virginia Lakes are probably still available from the Forest Service office in Bridgeport. Virgina Lakes in on the north border of Yosemite, 24 trail miles from Toulumne Meadows, and is accessed from Highway 395 north of Lee Vining. This would allow you to plan your trip knowing your starting date and trail head.
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              > Sent from my iPhone
                              >
                              > On Jun 2, 2013, at 7:53 PM, "Sheri" <flagstaffbiker@...> wrote:
                              >
                              > > Hi folks,
                              > >
                              > > I just was able to get real time off in July. Obviously, I don't have a permit for the JMT and am hoping to secure one of the first come permits. I'm coming from Arizona and want to be pretty sure to get one. Any suggestions on how early I should be at the Wilderness Center? However early I need, I will be there. Thoughts?
                              > >
                              > > many thanks,
                              > >
                              > > craig
                              > >
                              > >
                              >
                            • Roleigh Martin
                              There are around 8 ways to get a JMT permit starting from the valley. See http://groups.yahoo.com/group/johnmuirtrail/files/Permit%20Trailhead%20Options/ ...
                              Message 14 of 30 , Jun 3, 2013
                                There are around 8 ways to get a JMT permit starting from the valley.  See http://groups.yahoo.com/group/johnmuirtrail/files/Permit%20Trailhead%20Options/
                                -------------------------------------------------
                                Visit my Google Profile (lots of very interesting research links)
                                _


                              • treeve17
                                Question for those who have experience with resupply drops. I m starting off 8/2, and I ve opted for 4 resupplies (TM, Reds, MTR, Woods Creek) to keep max
                                Message 15 of 30 , Jun 21, 2013
                                  Question for those who have experience with resupply drops. I'm starting off 8/2, and I've opted for 4 resupplies (TM, Reds, MTR, Woods Creek) to keep max food carried to low weight and volume. So, are there leakage issues with shipping olive oil? Would like to ship the EVOO in original store container and transfer to a small nalgene at the resupply point. I can envision an oily mess if there's leakage -- that could ruin a resupply pretty quick. I'm thinking of the pressure differential between sea level and higher elevations. I could also be over thinking the issue. Thoughts? Thanks in advance.
                                • cjoslyn99
                                  If it is unopened from the store, I don t see this as an issue - especially for glass bottles b/c it s the pressure on the walls of the container that create
                                  Message 16 of 30 , Jun 21, 2013
                                    If it is unopened from the store, I don't see this as an issue -
                                    especially for glass bottles b/c it's the pressure on the walls of the
                                    container that create the mess. I put a 20 oz mountain dew (plastic
                                    bottle) in my bucket and had no problems. Seal it in a ziploc and place
                                    it in your supply bucket upright for extra security.

                                    --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, "treeve17" wrote:
                                    >
                                    > Question for those who have experience with resupply drops. I'm
                                    starting off 8/2, and I've opted for 4 resupplies (TM, Reds, MTR, Woods
                                    Creek) to keep max food carried to low weight and volume. So, are there
                                    leakage issues with shipping olive oil? Would like to ship the EVOO in
                                    original store container and transfer to a small nalgene at the resupply
                                    point. I can envision an oily mess if there's leakage -- that could ruin
                                    a resupply pretty quick. I'm thinking of the pressure differential
                                    between sea level and higher elevations. I could also be over thinking
                                    the issue. Thoughts? Thanks in advance.
                                    >
                                  • John Ladd
                                    I agree with cjoslyn99. You should have no problem either with original packaging or brand-name Nalgenes for Olive Oil. It does want to leak in marginal
                                    Message 17 of 30 , Jun 21, 2013
                                      I agree with cjoslyn99. You should have no problem either with original packaging or brand-name Nalgenes for Olive Oil. It does want to leak in marginal packaging, but both of those should work.

                                      John L

                                      On Fri, Jun 21, 2013 at 5:22 PM, cjoslyn99 <cjoslyn99@...> wrote:
                                       


                                      If it is unopened from the store, I don't see this as an issue -
                                      especially for glass bottles b/c it's the pressure on the walls of the
                                      container that create the mess. I put a 20 oz mountain dew (plastic
                                      bottle) in my bucket and had no problems. Seal it in a ziploc and place
                                      it in your supply bucket upright for extra security.



                                      --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, "treeve17" wrote:
                                      >
                                      > Question for those who have experience with resupply drops. I'm
                                      starting off 8/2, and I've opted for 4 resupplies (TM, Reds, MTR, Woods
                                      Creek) to keep max food carried to low weight and volume. So, are there
                                      leakage issues with shipping olive oil? Would like to ship the EVOO in
                                      original store container and transfer to a small nalgene at the resupply
                                      point. I can envision an oily mess if there's leakage -- that could ruin
                                      a resupply pretty quick. I'm thinking of the pressure differential
                                      between sea level and higher elevations. I could also be over thinking
                                      the issue. Thoughts? Thanks in advance.
                                      >


                                    • treeve17
                                      Thanks John and cjoslyn99 (and Wendy for off board reply). I suppose I should have worded my question a little better -- I ve had chip bags and sleeves of
                                      Message 18 of 30 , Jun 22, 2013
                                        Thanks John and cjoslyn99 (and Wendy for off board reply). I suppose I should have worded my question a little better -- I've had chip bags and sleeves of coffee burst by driving to 9000' or above from the bay, so I was concerned about an oily mess. Also didn't want to end up lugging 3 or 4 of those 4 oz Nalgenes. I'm looking for a couple really small, recyclable bottles of EVOO that I can mail -- just wanted the reassurance that would work. As always, the JMT group comes through with timely, accurate info.

                                        --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, John Ladd <johnladd@...> wrote:
                                        >
                                        > I agree with cjoslyn99. You should have no problem either with original
                                        > packaging or brand-name Nalgenes for Olive Oil. It does want to leak in
                                        > marginal packaging, but both of those should work.
                                        >
                                        > John L
                                        >
                                        > On Fri, Jun 21, 2013 at 5:22 PM, cjoslyn99 <cjoslyn99@...> wrote:
                                        >
                                        > > **
                                        > >
                                        > >
                                        > >
                                        > > If it is unopened from the store, I don't see this as an issue -
                                        > > especially for glass bottles b/c it's the pressure on the walls of the
                                        > > container that create the mess. I put a 20 oz mountain dew (plastic
                                        > > bottle) in my bucket and had no problems. Seal it in a ziploc and place
                                        > > it in your supply bucket upright for extra security.
                                        > >
                                        > >
                                        > > --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, "treeve17" wrote:
                                        > > >
                                        > > > Question for those who have experience with resupply drops. I'm
                                        > > starting off 8/2, and I've opted for 4 resupplies (TM, Reds, MTR, Woods
                                        > > Creek) to keep max food carried to low weight and volume. So, are there
                                        > > leakage issues with shipping olive oil? Would like to ship the EVOO in
                                        > > original store container and transfer to a small nalgene at the resupply
                                        > > point. I can envision an oily mess if there's leakage -- that could ruin
                                        > > a resupply pretty quick. I'm thinking of the pressure differential
                                        > > between sea level and higher elevations. I could also be over thinking
                                        > > the issue. Thoughts? Thanks in advance.
                                        > > >
                                        > >
                                        > >
                                        > >
                                        >
                                      • Don Amundson
                                        Try Minimus.com I ve always used the .5 oz packets and just put one in each of my individual plastic dinner bags. Minimus also carries small plastic
                                        Message 19 of 30 , Jun 22, 2013
                                          Try Minimus.com   I've always used the .5 oz packets and just put one in each of my individual plastic dinner bags.  Minimus also carries small  plastic bottles of olive oil. 



                                          To: johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com
                                          From: treeve17@...
                                          Date: Sat, 22 Jun 2013 17:31:52 +0000
                                          Subject: [John Muir Trail] Re: resupply questions

                                           
                                          Thanks John and cjoslyn99 (and Wendy for off board reply). I suppose I should have worded my question a little better -- I've had chip bags and sleeves of coffee burst by driving to 9000' or above from the bay, so I was concerned about an oily mess. Also didn't want to end up lugging 3 or 4 of those 4 oz Nalgenes. I'm looking for a couple really small, recyclable bottles of EVOO that I can mail -- just wanted the reassurance that would work. As always, the JMT group comes through with timely, accurate info.

                                          --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, John Ladd <johnladd@...> wrote:
                                          >
                                          > I agree with cjoslyn99. You should have no problem either with original
                                          > packaging or brand-name Nalgenes for Olive Oil. It does want to leak in
                                          > marginal packaging, but both of those should work.
                                          >
                                          > John L
                                          >
                                          > On Fri, Jun 21, 2013 at 5:22 PM, cjoslyn99 <cjoslyn99@...> wrote:
                                          >
                                          > > **
                                          > >
                                          > >
                                          > >
                                          > > If it is unopened from the store, I don't see this as an issue -
                                          > > especially for glass bottles b/c it's the pressure on the walls of the
                                          > > container that create the mess. I put a 20 oz mountain dew (plastic
                                          > > bottle) in my bucket and had no problems. Seal it in a ziploc and place
                                          > > it in your supply bucket upright for extra security.
                                          > >
                                          > >
                                          > > --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, "treeve17" wrote:
                                          > > >
                                          > > > Question for those who have experience with resupply drops. I'm
                                          > > starting off 8/2, and I've opted for 4 resupplies (TM, Reds, MTR, Woods
                                          > > Creek) to keep max food carried to low weight and volume. So, are there
                                          > > leakage issues with shipping olive oil? Would like to ship the EVOO in
                                          > > original store container and transfer to a small nalgene at the resupply
                                          > > point. I can envision an oily mess if there's leakage -- that could ruin
                                          > > a resupply pretty quick. I'm thinking of the pressure differential
                                          > > between sea level and higher elevations. I could also be over thinking
                                          > > the issue. Thoughts? Thanks in advance.
                                          > > >
                                          > >
                                          > >
                                          > >
                                          >


                                        • Byron Nevins
                                          You must mean minimus.biz not minimus.com
                                          Message 20 of 30 , Jun 23, 2013
                                            You must mean minimus.biz not minimus.com

                                          • ravi_jmt2013
                                            Regarding olive oil leakage, I found that a 8 ounce Nalgene from REI is very solid in terms of preventing leaks. However, the weight of the Nalgene is 1.35
                                            Message 21 of 30 , Jun 23, 2013
                                              Regarding olive oil leakage, I found that a 8 ounce Nalgene from REI is very solid in terms of preventing leaks. However, the weight of the Nalgene is 1.35 ounces which reduces the calories per ounce from 250 gross to 214 net for 8 ounces of olive oil. Still not bad but for the JMT I am going to use a larger Nalgene. The 16 ounce Nalgene is probably not twice the weight of the 8 ounce so there will be less of a penalty with the added volume.

                                              To be extra safe I pack the Nalgene wrapped with absorbent paper (paper shop towels available at any auto parts store) and put it into a quart size ziplock.

                                              This is the 8 ounce I currently use:

                                              http://www.rei.com/product/402054/nalgene-polyethylene-bottle-8-fl-oz
                                            • Chris
                                              treeve17: Did you see cjoslyn99 s suggestion of using a 20oz plastic soda (Mtn Dew) bottle? Seems like the caps on those soda bottles have a better rubber
                                              Message 22 of 30 , Jun 23, 2013
                                                treeve17:

                                                Did you see cjoslyn99's suggestion of using a 20oz plastic soda (Mtn Dew) bottle? Seems like the caps on those soda bottles have a better rubber seal than what you see on a plastic water bottle... they're designed to hold pressurized carbonated beverages. Also, I think they're lighter than any bottle you'd purchase, and disposable or recyclable, which is something you wanted. I'm persuaded.

                                                Chris.

                                                --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, "treeve17" <treeve17@...> wrote:
                                                >
                                                > Thanks John and cjoslyn99 (and Wendy for off board reply). I suppose I should have worded my question a little better -- I've had chip bags and sleeves of coffee burst by driving to 9000' or above from the bay, so I was concerned about an oily mess. Also didn't want to end up lugging 3 or 4 of those 4 oz Nalgenes. I'm looking for a couple really small, recyclable bottles of EVOO that I can mail -- just wanted the reassurance that would work. As always, the JMT group comes through with timely, accurate info.
                                                >
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