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RE: Steripen vs. Sawyer squeeze filter

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  • johndittli
    oh Boy, here we go again.... --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, wrote: I guess this a controversial topic, but I ll share my two cents on the
    Message 1 of 21 , Sep 6, 2013
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      oh Boy, here we go again.... 



      --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, <yahoo@...> wrote:

      I guess this a controversial topic, but I'll share my two cents on the topic.


      Lots of people drink untreated Sierra water successfully.  The question is whether this risk is worth it or not. When eliminating the risk is so simple, I think it's a dumb risk to take, particularly when exposure to Giardia early in your trip could ruin your entire trip.  At Tuolumne Meadows (on our JMT trip), I had a long discussion with a PCT hiker who had contracted Giardia and had to be hospitalized for two weeks because he got so severely weak before he could get off the trail and to a hospital.  I was talking to him 4 weeks after he'd been sick and he was still not feeling like he was at full strength and was still not back to his previous weight.  He was multiple weeks behind the guys he intended to hike with and was realizing that maybe he wouldn't be able to finish the PCT this year.  It was very clear that this was not a good thing.


      Further, once you get Giardia, you are a carrier for life and it's in your poop.  Humans can be carriers.  Are you willing to bet that no human or animal carrier pooped near the river upstream of you?  I'm not.  There are certainly many places on the JMT where there aren't many animals or people upstream of you, but also many unavoidable places where they are upstream.  Are you going to drink from the river above Nevada Falls?  You'll probably want to, but there are all sorts of people camped upstream of there at Little Yosemite and further up the Merced River system.


      Going to drink from any of the rivers in the Mammoth area?   There are tons of backpackers camped all over that area upstream of where the JMT is.


      We camped near Shadow Lake and there were probably 50 people camped 1-2 miles upstream.


      Camped along the Kings River (and purified water from it) and then later that evening saw pack animals upstream grazing near the river (something I didn't expect).


      I've also read trip reports from fast packers/record breaking attempts on the JMT who made the decision for time reasons not to purify and some of them have contracted Giardia.  It does exist in some places on the JMT.  Why risk it?


      --John



      --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, <johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

      I couldn'thike the JMT this year because my knee was not cooperative. I
      DID hike the High Sierra Camp loop in Yosemite though. As usual I had
      the exact same results as the steripen, sawyer squeeze, etc., etc. users.

      Namely I drank untreated water. And had no problems at all. And no
      hassles -- just scoop the sierra cup into the stream as I went. I
      didn't even bother carrying more than a pound or two of water.

      A Sawyer Filter user that is going for a long trip (> 3 weeks) should
      religiously use it. Never back flush it. Then submit it to a
      bacteriology lab for analysis. I'm willing to chip in on the cost. No
      guessing/wondering/assuming needed. If there were bacteria or protozoan
      they will absolutely positively be inside the filter and can easily be
      counted and characterized. I'm betting that there won't be much, if
      anything, in there.
    • kennethjessett@sbcglobal.net
      Once again!! Micropur tablets are all you need. The real Ken.
      Message 2 of 21 , Sep 6, 2013
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        Once again!! Micropur tablets are all you need.

        The real Ken.
      • longritchie
        Further, once you get Giardia, you are a carrier for life and it s in your poop. Can you support that assertion? If it s true I must be a rare exception. I
        Message 3 of 21 , Sep 6, 2013
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           "Further, once you get Giardia, you are a carrier for life and it's in your poop."


          Can you support that assertion?


          If it's true I must be a rare exception. I tested positive in the past. I was tested some years later and the result was negative.



          --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, <johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

          I guess this a controversial topic, but I'll share my two cents on the topic.


          Lots of people drink untreated Sierra water successfully.  The question is whether this risk is worth it or not. When eliminating the risk is so simple, I think it's a dumb risk to take, particularly when exposure to Giardia early in your trip could ruin your entire trip.  At Tuolumne Meadows (on our JMT trip), I had a long discussion with a PCT hiker who had contracted Giardia and had to be hospitalized for two weeks because he got so severely weak before he could get off the trail and to a hospital.  I was talking to him 4 weeks after he'd been sick and he was still not feeling like he was at full strength and was still not back to his previous weight.  He was multiple weeks behind the guys he intended to hike with and was realizing that maybe he wouldn't be able to finish the PCT this year.  It was very clear that this was not a good thing.


          Further, once you get Giardia, you are a carrier for life and it's in your poop.  Humans can be carriers.  Are you willing to bet that no human or animal carrier pooped near the river upstream of you?  I'm not.  There are certainly many places on the JMT where there aren't many animals or people upstream of you, but also many unavoidable places where they are upstream.  Are you going to drink from the river above Nevada Falls?  You'll probably want to, but there are all sorts of people camped upstream of there at Little Yosemite and further up the Merced River system.


          Going to drink from any of the rivers in the Mammoth area?   There are tons of backpackers camped all over that area upstream of where the JMT is.


          We camped near Shadow Lake and there were probably 50 people camped 1-2 miles upstream.


          Camped along the Kings River (and purified water from it) and then later that evening saw pack animals upstream grazing near the river (something I didn't expect).


          I've also read trip reports from fast packers/record breaking attempts on the JMT who made the decision for time reasons not to purify and some of them have contracted Giardia.  It does exist in some places on the JMT.  Why risk it?


          --John



          --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, <johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

          I couldn'thike the JMT this year because my knee was not cooperative. I
          DID hike the High Sierra Camp loop in Yosemite though. As usual I had
          the exact same results as the steripen, sawyer squeeze, etc., etc. users.

          Namely I drank untreated water. And had no problems at all. And no
          hassles -- just scoop the sierra cup into the stream as I went. I
          didn't even bother carrying more than a pound or two of water.

          A Sawyer Filter user that is going for a long trip (> 3 weeks) should
          religiously use it. Never back flush it. Then submit it to a
          bacteriology lab for analysis. I'm willing to chip in on the cost. No
          guessing/wondering/assuming needed. If there were bacteria or protozoan
          they will absolutely positively be inside the filter and can easily be
          counted and characterized. I'm betting that there won't be much, if
          anything, in there.
        • d_s93277
          I did the JMT in May and again in Aug, I never treat or filter my water. I drink a lot of water and never had a problem.
          Message 4 of 21 , Sep 6, 2013
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            I did the JMT in May and again in Aug, I never treat or filter my water. I drink a lot of water and never had a problem.
          • johndittli
            ....or a Steripen, or a filter or... nothing at all! Choose your poison and hike your hike! John --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com,
            Message 5 of 21 , Sep 6, 2013
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               ....or a Steripen, or a filter or... nothing at all! Choose your poison and hike your hike!


              John



              --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, <johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

              Once again!! Micropur tablets are all you need.

              The real Ken.
            • john_friend
              Choose your poison is an interesting choice of words... --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, wrote: ....or a Steripen, or a
              Message 6 of 21 , Sep 6, 2013
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                Choose your "poison" is an interesting choice of words... 



                --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, <johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

                 ....or a Steripen, or a filter or... nothing at all! Choose your poison and hike your hike!


                John



                --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, <johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

                Once again!! Micropur tablets are all you need.

                The real Ken.
              • john_friend
                I looked for where I got that information from and did not find it so perhaps that was not correct information. This is what I found on the CDC website :
                Message 7 of 21 , Sep 7, 2013
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                  I looked for where I got that information from and did not find it so perhaps that was not correct information.  This is what I found on the CDC website:


                  People become infected with Giardia by swallowingGiardia cysts (hard shells containing Giardia) found in contaminated food or water. Cysts are instantly infectious once they leave the host through feces (poop)[2]. An infected person might shed 1-10 billion cysts daily in their feces (poop) and this might last for several months[2,6,7]. However, swallowing as few as 10 cysts might cause someone to become ill[2,6]Giardia may be passed person-to-person or even animal-to-person[2,3]. Also, oral-anal contact during sex has been known to cause infection[4,5]. Symptoms of giardiasis normally begin 1 to 3 weeks after a person has been infected[6].




                  --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, <no_reply@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

                   "Further, once you get Giardia, you are a carrier for life and it's in your poop."


                  Can you support that assertion?


                  If it's true I must be a rare exception. I tested positive in the past. I was tested some years later and the result was negative.




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