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Re: [John Muir Trail] RE: Steripen vs. Sawyer squeeze filter

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  • Roleigh Martin
    I ve used the Steripen Adventurer Opti on 3 JMT equally successfully w/o any problems. I do bring chlorine dioxide tablets as backup though. Prefer the
    Message 1 of 21 , Sep 4, 2013
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      I've used the Steripen Adventurer Opti on 3 JMT equally successfully w/o any problems. I do bring chlorine dioxide tablets as backup though. Prefer the chemical free taste of the Steripen. 

      Sent from my iPhone
      See my Google Profile for interesting research links:
      http://tinyurl.com/3vnolh8

      On Sep 4, 2013, at 4:11 PM, <yahoo@...> wrote:

       

      I don't know about the Sawyer Squeeze specifically, but I did the JMT this summer with a Steripen and it worked out great. I have also used it on several other Sierra trips - never had a problem.  From my point of view, when your water source is already clear (like in the Sierra), all you need to do is kill the nasty microbes (like Giardia) and the Steripen is great for that - no filtering is needed.  The Steripen is fast (90 secs for a liter) and low hassle. I used only two sets of batteries for an 18-day JMT purifying about 5 liters a day.  I encountered multiple people on the JMT using pumps/filters who remarked (when they saw me pull out my Steripen) that they wanted to get a Steripen for their next trip.



      --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, <OshnNsun@...> wrote:

       Sawyer Squeeze Mini is due out this month!!  I am waiting for the release...


      http://hikelighter.com/2013/07/21/sawyer-mini-filter-announced-for-fall-2013/



      --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, <cjoslyn99@...> wrote:

      I used Sawyer Squeeze last year having previously used PUR Hiker pump/filter.  I would say it overall worked very well and was more convenient by comparison, but it's not that easy to "squeeze."  I keep my hydro-bladder in my pack and w/ an inline connector, it was very simple/easy to do a gravity drain in a few minutes.  The squeeze bottles they give you don't have handles to hang so need to hold it up or find a different kind of container.

       

      For smaller fill-ups (e.g., to fill my water bottle for drink mixes), it takes some effort to squeeze the water out.  On that point, the squeeze bottles they give you are not very sturdy.  Best bet is to roll from the end like a tube of toothpaste to avoid making creases.  There are also other brand containers you can use that are more durable.  I did get a small leak in one of my bags and was able to patch w/ duct tape.  However, I've heard others complain they split at the seams or other places you couldn't repair.

       

      You can also drink directly from the filter element if you attach to a standard screw top water bottle and can also rig a an inline filter (i.e., dirty water in your hydration bladder) but I never did that.

       

      Whatever you decide, bring an emergency backup (e.g., tabs).



      --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, <johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

      Has anyone used the Sawyer Squeeze filter on the JMT or on any other trip.  Just came across it.  I was originally looking into a steripen, but now I am comparing them.
       
      Kyle

    • Joe Johnson
      Kyle, I used the Steripen Classic in September 2012 on my HST trek, no problems at all. In fact, I ve never had any issues with the Steripen. I carry an
      Message 2 of 21 , Sep 4, 2013
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        Kyle,

        I used the Steripen Classic in September 2012 on my HST trek, no problems at all.  In fact, I’ve never had any issues with the Steripen.  I carry an Aquamira Frontier personal emergency water filter as backup but have not ever had to use it (weighs less than 1 oz.).  I also carry a few coffee filters in case I have to get water from a source that is very sediment laden.  The Steripen treats a lot of water when I use the advanced lithium batteries.  One set of new batteries should be enough for a JMT trek.

         

        Joe

        Joseph Johnson
        26175 Novak Ave
        Lindstrom, MN  55045

         

      • Jeffrey
        I can endorse this Steripen recommendation, but with a couple of caveats: - It s important to bring along a cheat sheet of the codes for the blinking lights,
        Message 3 of 21 , Sep 5, 2013
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          I can endorse this Steripen recommendation, but with a couple of caveats:

          - It's important to bring along a cheat sheet of the codes for the blinking lights, they'll explain any problems.

          - It's important to have a backup set of batteries, though a lithium set will last a long time.

          - A super lightweight backup, such as Aqua Mira (liquid or tablets) is easy and wise.

          The SteriPen works for me quickly and effortlessly, but when it stops it can be a puzzler unless the light sequence is understood. The "cheat sheet" I use is just a photocopy of the small (1" x 3"?) chart in the user manual; rtfm  In my experience almost all problems are bad batteries or wet contacts at initialization.  Too, some sort of particulate filter would be wise, even if it's just a handkerchief (though SteriPen will gladly sell you a filter for its brand 1-liter bottle), though on the JMT I've never needed such.  OTOH the SteriPen with backup batteries is a lot heavier than just the Aqua Mira bottles I used on the JMT and I found the chemical taste very faint at best.

          ~ Jeffrey


          Wed Sep 4, 2013 4:11 pm (PDT) . Posted by:


          I've used the Steripen Adventurer Opti on 3 JMT equally successfully w/o any problems.
          I do bring chlorine dioxide tablets as backup though. Prefer the chemical free taste of the Steripen.

          On Sep 4, 2013, at 4:11 PM, <yahoo@the-friend- family.com> wrote:

          > I don't know about the Sawyer Squeeze specifically, but I did
          the JMT this summer with a Steripen and it worked out great. I have also used it on several other Sierra trips - never had a problem. From my point of view, when your water source is already clear (like in the Sierra), all you need to do is kill the nasty microbes (like Giardia) and the Steripen is great for that - no filtering is needed. The Steripen is fast (90 secs for a liter) and low hassle.
          ...
          >
          > --- In johnmuirtrail@ yahoogroups. com,
          <johnmuirtrail@ yahoogroups. com> wrote:
          >
          > Has anyone used the Sawyer Squeeze filter on the JMT or on
          any other trip. Just came across it. I was originally looking into a steripen, but now I am comparing them.
          >
          > Kyle
        • Byron Nevins
          I couldn thike the JMT this year because my knee was not cooperative. I DID hike the High Sierra Camp loop in Yosemite though. As usual I had the exact same
          Message 4 of 21 , Sep 5, 2013
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            I couldn'thike the JMT this year because my knee was not cooperative. I
            DID hike the High Sierra Camp loop in Yosemite though. As usual I had
            the exact same results as the steripen, sawyer squeeze, etc., etc. users.

            Namely I drank untreated water. And had no problems at all. And no
            hassles -- just scoop the sierra cup into the stream as I went. I
            didn't even bother carrying more than a pound or two of water.

            A Sawyer Filter user that is going for a long trip (> 3 weeks) should
            religiously use it. Never back flush it. Then submit it to a
            bacteriology lab for analysis. I'm willing to chip in on the cost. No
            guessing/wondering/assuming needed. If there were bacteria or protozoan
            they will absolutely positively be inside the filter and can easily be
            counted and characterized. I'm betting that there won't be much, if
            anything, in there.
          • longritchie
            Nice to see I m not the only one who rolls his eyes when someone posts that they used a particular water treatment method and it worked . --- In
            Message 5 of 21 , Sep 5, 2013
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              Nice to see I'm not the only one who rolls his eyes when someone posts that they used a particular water treatment method and "it worked".




              --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, <johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

              I couldn'thike the JMT this year because my knee was not cooperative. I
              DID hike the High Sierra Camp loop in Yosemite though. As usual I had
              the exact same results as the steripen, sawyer squeeze, etc., etc. users.

              Namely I drank untreated water. And had no problems at all. And no
              hassles -- just scoop the sierra cup into the stream as I went. I
              didn't even bother carrying more than a pound or two of water.

              A Sawyer Filter user that is going for a long trip (> 3 weeks) should
              religiously use it. Never back flush it. Then submit it to a
              bacteriology lab for analysis. I'm willing to chip in on the cost. No
              guessing/wondering/assuming needed. If there were bacteria or protozoan
              they will absolutely positively be inside the filter and can easily be
              counted and characterized. I'm betting that there won't be much, if
              anything, in there.
            • john_friend
              I guess this a controversial topic, but I ll share my two cents on the topic. Lots of people drink untreated Sierra water successfully. The question is whether
              Message 6 of 21 , Sep 5, 2013
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                I guess this a controversial topic, but I'll share my two cents on the topic.


                Lots of people drink untreated Sierra water successfully.  The question is whether this risk is worth it or not. When eliminating the risk is so simple, I think it's a dumb risk to take, particularly when exposure to Giardia early in your trip could ruin your entire trip.  At Tuolumne Meadows (on our JMT trip), I had a long discussion with a PCT hiker who had contracted Giardia and had to be hospitalized for two weeks because he got so severely weak before he could get off the trail and to a hospital.  I was talking to him 4 weeks after he'd been sick and he was still not feeling like he was at full strength and was still not back to his previous weight.  He was multiple weeks behind the guys he intended to hike with and was realizing that maybe he wouldn't be able to finish the PCT this year.  It was very clear that this was not a good thing.


                Further, once you get Giardia, you are a carrier for life and it's in your poop.  Humans can be carriers.  Are you willing to bet that no human or animal carrier pooped near the river upstream of you?  I'm not.  There are certainly many places on the JMT where there aren't many animals or people upstream of you, but also many unavoidable places where they are upstream.  Are you going to drink from the river above Nevada Falls?  You'll probably want to, but there are all sorts of people camped upstream of there at Little Yosemite and further up the Merced River system.


                Going to drink from any of the rivers in the Mammoth area?   There are tons of backpackers camped all over that area upstream of where the JMT is.


                We camped near Shadow Lake and there were probably 50 people camped 1-2 miles upstream.


                Camped along the Kings River (and purified water from it) and then later that evening saw pack animals upstream grazing near the river (something I didn't expect).


                I've also read trip reports from fast packers/record breaking attempts on the JMT who made the decision for time reasons not to purify and some of them have contracted Giardia.  It does exist in some places on the JMT.  Why risk it?


                --John



                --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, <johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

                I couldn'thike the JMT this year because my knee was not cooperative. I
                DID hike the High Sierra Camp loop in Yosemite though. As usual I had
                the exact same results as the steripen, sawyer squeeze, etc., etc. users.

                Namely I drank untreated water. And had no problems at all. And no
                hassles -- just scoop the sierra cup into the stream as I went. I
                didn't even bother carrying more than a pound or two of water.

                A Sawyer Filter user that is going for a long trip (> 3 weeks) should
                religiously use it. Never back flush it. Then submit it to a
                bacteriology lab for analysis. I'm willing to chip in on the cost. No
                guessing/wondering/assuming needed. If there were bacteria or protozoan
                they will absolutely positively be inside the filter and can easily be
                counted and characterized. I'm betting that there won't be much, if
                anything, in there.
              • johndittli
                oh Boy, here we go again.... --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, wrote: I guess this a controversial topic, but I ll share my two cents on the
                Message 7 of 21 , Sep 6, 2013
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                  oh Boy, here we go again.... 



                  --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, <yahoo@...> wrote:

                  I guess this a controversial topic, but I'll share my two cents on the topic.


                  Lots of people drink untreated Sierra water successfully.  The question is whether this risk is worth it or not. When eliminating the risk is so simple, I think it's a dumb risk to take, particularly when exposure to Giardia early in your trip could ruin your entire trip.  At Tuolumne Meadows (on our JMT trip), I had a long discussion with a PCT hiker who had contracted Giardia and had to be hospitalized for two weeks because he got so severely weak before he could get off the trail and to a hospital.  I was talking to him 4 weeks after he'd been sick and he was still not feeling like he was at full strength and was still not back to his previous weight.  He was multiple weeks behind the guys he intended to hike with and was realizing that maybe he wouldn't be able to finish the PCT this year.  It was very clear that this was not a good thing.


                  Further, once you get Giardia, you are a carrier for life and it's in your poop.  Humans can be carriers.  Are you willing to bet that no human or animal carrier pooped near the river upstream of you?  I'm not.  There are certainly many places on the JMT where there aren't many animals or people upstream of you, but also many unavoidable places where they are upstream.  Are you going to drink from the river above Nevada Falls?  You'll probably want to, but there are all sorts of people camped upstream of there at Little Yosemite and further up the Merced River system.


                  Going to drink from any of the rivers in the Mammoth area?   There are tons of backpackers camped all over that area upstream of where the JMT is.


                  We camped near Shadow Lake and there were probably 50 people camped 1-2 miles upstream.


                  Camped along the Kings River (and purified water from it) and then later that evening saw pack animals upstream grazing near the river (something I didn't expect).


                  I've also read trip reports from fast packers/record breaking attempts on the JMT who made the decision for time reasons not to purify and some of them have contracted Giardia.  It does exist in some places on the JMT.  Why risk it?


                  --John



                  --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, <johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

                  I couldn'thike the JMT this year because my knee was not cooperative. I
                  DID hike the High Sierra Camp loop in Yosemite though. As usual I had
                  the exact same results as the steripen, sawyer squeeze, etc., etc. users.

                  Namely I drank untreated water. And had no problems at all. And no
                  hassles -- just scoop the sierra cup into the stream as I went. I
                  didn't even bother carrying more than a pound or two of water.

                  A Sawyer Filter user that is going for a long trip (> 3 weeks) should
                  religiously use it. Never back flush it. Then submit it to a
                  bacteriology lab for analysis. I'm willing to chip in on the cost. No
                  guessing/wondering/assuming needed. If there were bacteria or protozoan
                  they will absolutely positively be inside the filter and can easily be
                  counted and characterized. I'm betting that there won't be much, if
                  anything, in there.
                • kennethjessett@sbcglobal.net
                  Once again!! Micropur tablets are all you need. The real Ken.
                  Message 8 of 21 , Sep 6, 2013
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                    Once again!! Micropur tablets are all you need.

                    The real Ken.
                  • longritchie
                    Further, once you get Giardia, you are a carrier for life and it s in your poop. Can you support that assertion? If it s true I must be a rare exception. I
                    Message 9 of 21 , Sep 6, 2013
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                       "Further, once you get Giardia, you are a carrier for life and it's in your poop."


                      Can you support that assertion?


                      If it's true I must be a rare exception. I tested positive in the past. I was tested some years later and the result was negative.



                      --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, <johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

                      I guess this a controversial topic, but I'll share my two cents on the topic.


                      Lots of people drink untreated Sierra water successfully.  The question is whether this risk is worth it or not. When eliminating the risk is so simple, I think it's a dumb risk to take, particularly when exposure to Giardia early in your trip could ruin your entire trip.  At Tuolumne Meadows (on our JMT trip), I had a long discussion with a PCT hiker who had contracted Giardia and had to be hospitalized for two weeks because he got so severely weak before he could get off the trail and to a hospital.  I was talking to him 4 weeks after he'd been sick and he was still not feeling like he was at full strength and was still not back to his previous weight.  He was multiple weeks behind the guys he intended to hike with and was realizing that maybe he wouldn't be able to finish the PCT this year.  It was very clear that this was not a good thing.


                      Further, once you get Giardia, you are a carrier for life and it's in your poop.  Humans can be carriers.  Are you willing to bet that no human or animal carrier pooped near the river upstream of you?  I'm not.  There are certainly many places on the JMT where there aren't many animals or people upstream of you, but also many unavoidable places where they are upstream.  Are you going to drink from the river above Nevada Falls?  You'll probably want to, but there are all sorts of people camped upstream of there at Little Yosemite and further up the Merced River system.


                      Going to drink from any of the rivers in the Mammoth area?   There are tons of backpackers camped all over that area upstream of where the JMT is.


                      We camped near Shadow Lake and there were probably 50 people camped 1-2 miles upstream.


                      Camped along the Kings River (and purified water from it) and then later that evening saw pack animals upstream grazing near the river (something I didn't expect).


                      I've also read trip reports from fast packers/record breaking attempts on the JMT who made the decision for time reasons not to purify and some of them have contracted Giardia.  It does exist in some places on the JMT.  Why risk it?


                      --John



                      --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, <johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

                      I couldn'thike the JMT this year because my knee was not cooperative. I
                      DID hike the High Sierra Camp loop in Yosemite though. As usual I had
                      the exact same results as the steripen, sawyer squeeze, etc., etc. users.

                      Namely I drank untreated water. And had no problems at all. And no
                      hassles -- just scoop the sierra cup into the stream as I went. I
                      didn't even bother carrying more than a pound or two of water.

                      A Sawyer Filter user that is going for a long trip (> 3 weeks) should
                      religiously use it. Never back flush it. Then submit it to a
                      bacteriology lab for analysis. I'm willing to chip in on the cost. No
                      guessing/wondering/assuming needed. If there were bacteria or protozoan
                      they will absolutely positively be inside the filter and can easily be
                      counted and characterized. I'm betting that there won't be much, if
                      anything, in there.
                    • d_s93277
                      I did the JMT in May and again in Aug, I never treat or filter my water. I drink a lot of water and never had a problem.
                      Message 10 of 21 , Sep 6, 2013
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                        I did the JMT in May and again in Aug, I never treat or filter my water. I drink a lot of water and never had a problem.
                      • johndittli
                        ....or a Steripen, or a filter or... nothing at all! Choose your poison and hike your hike! John --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com,
                        Message 11 of 21 , Sep 6, 2013
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                           ....or a Steripen, or a filter or... nothing at all! Choose your poison and hike your hike!


                          John



                          --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, <johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

                          Once again!! Micropur tablets are all you need.

                          The real Ken.
                        • john_friend
                          Choose your poison is an interesting choice of words... --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, wrote: ....or a Steripen, or a
                          Message 12 of 21 , Sep 6, 2013
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                            Choose your "poison" is an interesting choice of words... 



                            --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, <johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

                             ....or a Steripen, or a filter or... nothing at all! Choose your poison and hike your hike!


                            John



                            --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, <johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

                            Once again!! Micropur tablets are all you need.

                            The real Ken.
                          • john_friend
                            I looked for where I got that information from and did not find it so perhaps that was not correct information. This is what I found on the CDC website :
                            Message 13 of 21 , Sep 7, 2013
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                              I looked for where I got that information from and did not find it so perhaps that was not correct information.  This is what I found on the CDC website:


                              People become infected with Giardia by swallowingGiardia cysts (hard shells containing Giardia) found in contaminated food or water. Cysts are instantly infectious once they leave the host through feces (poop)[2]. An infected person might shed 1-10 billion cysts daily in their feces (poop) and this might last for several months[2,6,7]. However, swallowing as few as 10 cysts might cause someone to become ill[2,6]Giardia may be passed person-to-person or even animal-to-person[2,3]. Also, oral-anal contact during sex has been known to cause infection[4,5]. Symptoms of giardiasis normally begin 1 to 3 weeks after a person has been infected[6].




                              --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, <no_reply@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

                               "Further, once you get Giardia, you are a carrier for life and it's in your poop."


                              Can you support that assertion?


                              If it's true I must be a rare exception. I tested positive in the past. I was tested some years later and the result was negative.




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