Loading ...
Sorry, an error occurred while loading the content.

MUST SEE on the JMT

Expand Messages
  • woodyrtt
    Heidi and I are thru hiking the JMT for the first time this summer. Given that we may only get to do this once, what are the MUST SEEs on the JMT? We are not
    Message 1 of 24 , Jun 6, 2013
    • 0 Attachment
      Heidi and I are thru hiking the JMT for the first time this summer. Given that we may only get to do this once, what are the MUST SEEs on the JMT? We are not averse to day-long side trips if that's what it takes not to miss something really special. Thanks. Rod
    • cjoslyn99
      I didn t thave time to do side trips but I would have loved to have spent more time around Rae Lakes. Check the Wenk book for suggestions as well. ... Given
      Message 2 of 24 , Jun 6, 2013
      • 0 Attachment
        I didn't thave time to do side trips but I would have loved to have
        spent more time around Rae Lakes.

        Check the Wenk book for suggestions as well.

        --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, "woodyrtt" wrote:
        >
        > Heidi and I are thru hiking the JMT for the first time this summer.
        Given that we may only get to do this once, what are the MUST SEEs on
        the JMT? We are not averse to day-long side trips if that's what it
        takes not to miss something really special. Thanks. Rod
        >
      • scriv.ener
        Great question, Rod. You ll be deluged with answers. The first and most important thing is to at least have attempted the JMT. As you suggest, it may be a
        Message 3 of 24 , Jun 7, 2013
        • 0 Attachment
          Great question, Rod. You'll be deluged with answers.

          The first and most important thing is to at least have attempted the JMT. As you suggest, it may be a once-in-a-lifetime thing, and to have it on a bucket list is important.

          Some sights on or near the trail:
          Muir Hut, of course.
          South of Muir Hut, LeConte Canyon
          Thousand Island Lake
          Lyell Canyon
          Whitney Summit, also of course
          McClure Meadow
          Top of Evolution waterfall
          Bench Lake
          Vermilion Valley Resort (Lake Edison resupply)
          Reds Meadow showers

          Some sights off the trail:
          McGee Lakes, behind The Hermit
          Iva Bell hot springs (discussion here earlier about alternate route from there to VVR)
          Lake Italy
          Kern hot springs
          Cartridge Creek (the "old JMT")

          ~ Jeffrey


          --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, "woodyrtt" <rod.tayler@...> wrote:
          >
          > Heidi and I are thru hiking the JMT for the first time this summer. Given that we may only get to do this once, what are the MUST SEEs on the JMT? We are not averse to day-long side trips if that's what it takes not to miss something really special. Thanks. Rod
          >
        • Carolsteveyoung
          Must sees on the JMT my top three: The look in your partners face when u summit Whitney together and everybody else it seems has day hiked it from WP but
          Message 4 of 24 , Jun 9, 2013
          • 0 Attachment
            Must sees on the JMT my top three:

            The look in your partners face when u summit Whitney together and everybody else it seems has day hiked it from WP but you've come 200 miles. 

            The meal in your cook pot when you are so hungry you're willing to admit that the snake you noticed on the trail that afternoon looked tasty. 

            The pathetic photo you just took trying to capture what is impossible to capture in a photo but you know you'll remember it forever. 

            Have a great trip

            Steve Young
            Geneva Il



            On Jun 7, 2013, at 8:41 AM, "scriv.ener" <jeffreyz212@...> wrote:

             

            Great question, Rod. You'll be deluged with answers.

            The first and most important thing is to at least have attempted the JMT. As you suggest, it may be a once-in-a-lifetime thing, and to have it on a bucket list is important.

            Some sights on or near the trail:
            Muir Hut, of course.
            South of Muir Hut, LeConte Canyon
            Thousand Island Lake
            Lyell Canyon
            Whitney Summit, also of course
            McClure Meadow
            Top of Evolution waterfall
            Bench Lake
            Vermilion Valley Resort (Lake Edison resupply)
            Reds Meadow showers

            Some sights off the trail:
            McGee Lakes, behind The Hermit
            Iva Bell hot springs (discussion here earlier about alternate route from there to VVR)
            Lake Italy
            Kern hot springs
            Cartridge Creek (the "old JMT")

            ~ Jeffrey

            --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, "woodyrtt" <rod.tayler@...> wrote:
            >
            > Heidi and I are thru hiking the JMT for the first time this summer. Given that we may only get to do this once, what are the MUST SEEs on the JMT? We are not averse to day-long side trips if that's what it takes not to miss something really special. Thanks. Rod
            >

          • retiredhank2012
            Jeffrey, I see in your list that you included Mcgee Lakes behind The Hermit. I did the JMT last year and this year I want to check out some of the off ramps.
            Message 5 of 24 , Jun 9, 2013
            • 0 Attachment
              Jeffrey,

              I see in your list that you included Mcgee Lakes behind The Hermit. I did the JMT last year and this year I want to check out some of the off ramps. At the end of June I'm planning a North Lake South Lake Loop with the idea of trying to get some x-country experience thrown in. Mcgee lakes sound perfect for that. My question is which way is better access to the lakes, thru the canyon out of Colby Meadow or the Pass next to Sapphire Lake? Do you think for a novice that the x-country from upper lamarck lake past lamarck col to darwin bench and down to the JMT is completely unreasonable? I'd like to stretch my limits but I don't want to be an unsafe idiot either.(yes..I have a SPOT but I don't want to actually have to use it) Are there any other places along the north south loop a novice might acquire some x-country skills. I read the SHR messages and just dream.
              Hank
              --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, "scriv.ener" <jeffreyz212@...> wrote:
              >
              > Great question, Rod. You'll be deluged with answers.
              >
              > The first and most important thing is to at least have attempted the JMT. As you suggest, it may be a once-in-a-lifetime thing, and to have it on a bucket list is important.
              >
              > Some sights on or near the trail:
              > Muir Hut, of course.
              > South of Muir Hut, LeConte Canyon
              > Thousand Island Lake
              > Lyell Canyon
              > Whitney Summit, also of course
              > McClure Meadow
              > Top of Evolution waterfall
              > Bench Lake
              > Vermilion Valley Resort (Lake Edison resupply)
              > Reds Meadow showers
              >
              > Some sights off the trail:
              > McGee Lakes, behind The Hermit
              > Iva Bell hot springs (discussion here earlier about alternate route from there to VVR)
              > Lake Italy
              > Kern hot springs
              > Cartridge Creek (the "old JMT")
              >
              > ~ Jeffrey
              >
              >
              > --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, "woodyrtt" <rod.tayler@> wrote:
              > >
              > > Heidi and I are thru hiking the JMT for the first time this summer. Given that we may only get to do this once, what are the MUST SEEs on the JMT? We are not averse to day-long side trips if that's what it takes not to miss something really special. Thanks. Rod
              > >
              >
            • Joe MacLeish
              Jeffrey: The Lamarck Lakes (sort of) , Lamarck Col, Darwin Bench to Evolution Lake route is not that difficult or dangerous, it s just easy to not find it. I
              Message 6 of 24 , Jun 9, 2013
              • 0 Attachment

                Jeffrey:

                The Lamarck Lakes (sort of) , Lamarck Col, Darwin Bench to Evolution Lake route is not that difficult or dangerous, it's just easy to not find it.  I didn't find it on my second try (first year with my wife was fine)  and then remembered it thereafter.  The trail does not go out of Lamarck Lake but actually cuts across the stream well before the Lake(s) and heads up the face (don't get into the Lamarck Lakes canyon.)  Get the Mountaineers guide or other good guidance.  I just have my old scribbled notes and pencil marks on a Xeroxed map.  Maybe there is a GPS route or something else out now.  But rest assured the route is not dangerous going east to west if you are on the route.  West to East always looked more dicey to me and you could get into a dangerous situation (wrong crossing and steep drop off).

                 

                Joe

                 

                From: johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com [mailto:johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of retiredhank2012
                Sent: Sunday, June 09, 2013 4:03 PM
                To: johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com
                Subject: [John Muir Trail] Re: MUST SEE on the JMT

                 

                 

                Jeffrey,

                I see in your list that you included Mcgee Lakes behind The Hermit. I did the JMT last year and this year I want to check out some of the off ramps. At the end of June I'm planning a North Lake South Lake Loop with the idea of trying to get some x-country experience thrown in. Mcgee lakes sound perfect for that. My question is which way is better access to the lakes, thru the canyon out of Colby Meadow or the Pass next to Sapphire Lake? Do you think for a novice that the x-country from upper lamarck lake past lamarck col to darwin bench and down to the JMT is completely unreasonable? I'd like to stretch my limits but I don't want to be an unsafe idiot either.(yes..I have a SPOT but I don't want to actually have to use it) Are there any other places along the north south loop a novice might acquire some x-country skills. I read the SHR messages and just dream.
                Hank

                --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, "scriv.ener" <jeffreyz212@...> wrote:
                >
                > Great question, Rod. You'll be deluged with answers.
                >
                > The first and most important thing is to at least have attempted the JMT. As you suggest, it may be a once-in-a-lifetime thing, and to have it on a bucket list is important.
                >
                > Some sights on or near the trail:
                > Muir Hut, of course.
                > South of Muir Hut, LeConte Canyon
                > Thousand Island Lake
                > Lyell Canyon
                > Whitney Summit, also of course
                > McClure Meadow
                > Top of Evolution waterfall
                > Bench Lake
                > Vermilion Valley Resort (Lake Edison resupply)
                > Reds Meadow showers
                >
                > Some sights off the trail:
                > McGee Lakes, behind The Hermit
                > Iva Bell hot springs (discussion here earlier about alternate route from there to VVR)
                > Lake Italy
                > Kern hot springs
                > Cartridge Creek (the "old JMT")
                >
                > ~ Jeffrey
                >
                >
                > --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, "woodyrtt" <rod.tayler@> wrote:
                > >
                > > Heidi and I are thru hiking the JMT for the first time this summer. Given that we may only get to do this once, what are the MUST SEEs on the JMT? We are not averse to day-long side trips if that's what it takes not to miss something really special. Thanks. Rod
                > >
                >

              • scriv.ener
                Hank, Maybe it s just me, but following a well-trod trail is becoming a bit boring (no doubt a heresy on this forum!). OTOH off-trail carries inherent risks;
                Message 7 of 24 , Jun 9, 2013
                • 0 Attachment
                  Hank,

                  Maybe it's just me, but following a well-trod trail is becoming a bit boring (no doubt a heresy on this forum!). OTOH off-trail carries inherent risks; one of the ways I sold my then-spouse on my JMT trip was that even with a Labor Day start I was sure "not more than an hour" would go by without encountering someone else on the trail (that proved true until about mid-September). There are lots of ways and places on the JMT you'd need an emergency evacuation, but I suspect the worst risk is the drive to the trailhead. Besides, the author of one of the first JMT guides, Pete Starr, is noted even today (80 years ago this summer) for dying on vertical basalt well off the trail. If they don't find you until your bones are well bleached, well, at least they'll talk about you a lot longer.

                  But I digress.

                  When I went to McGee I approached on a contour from just between Sapphire and Wanda lakes, in other words, northbound. Once you reach the saddle east of McGee Lakes there's a well-defined use trail that descends easily to them. When you get below the lower of the cluster of lakes, though, that trail is intermittent at best; as you note, ultimately what there is of it does leave you at Colby Meadow (not at the junction shown on the 15' topo, though).

                  Since you'd be SoBo, it might make more sense to ascend to McGee Lakes, i.e., from Colby Meadow, but that would mean pushing uphill through forest with only a sketchy trail. You'll find your way (stay to the left as you reach the lakes, keep the outlet stream to your right), but it'll be frustrating. You won't get lost, you'll be in a canyon so that "up" and "down" are obvious, but you won't be on any predictable route, either.

                  OTOH, if you do McGee Canyon SoBo you'll miss the opportunity to catch the waterfall at the outlet from Evolution Lake, also on my earlier list. Perhaps you can be satisfied with standing at Colby Meadow and seeing it glisten against the rock, or perhaps you stood atop the precipice last year (it is only a few yards off the JMT, but few people take those extra steps).

                  I can't comment about the specifics of traversing Darwin Bench, never having been there. However, judging from other off-trail, high granite work I've done
                  http://www.lakeitalyloop.shutterfly.com
                  http://www.cartridgeraw.shutterfly.com
                  a map, compass and common sense should more than suffice.

                  Enjoy.

                  ~Jeffrey

                  --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, "retiredhank2012" <hank1980@...> wrote:
                  >
                  > Jeffrey,
                  >
                  > I see in your list that you included Mcgee Lakes behind The Hermit. I did the JMT last year and this year I want to check out some of the off ramps. At the end of June I'm planning a North Lake South Lake Loop with the idea of trying to get some x-country experience thrown in. Mcgee lakes sound perfect for that. My question is which way is better access to the lakes, thru the canyon out of Colby Meadow or the Pass next to Sapphire Lake? Do you think for a novice that the x-country from upper lamarck lake past lamarck col to darwin bench and down to the JMT is completely unreasonable? I'd like to stretch my limits but I don't want to be an unsafe idiot either. ....
                  > Hank
                • retiredhank2012
                  Jeffrey, Thanks for the info. It made me think about the pictures I took last year Aug. 31st when I got to the Muir Hut. When I was just below the hut and I
                  Message 8 of 24 , Jun 10, 2013
                  • 0 Attachment
                    Jeffrey,

                    Thanks for the info. It made me think about the pictures I took last year Aug. 31st when I got to the Muir Hut. When I was just below the hut and I could only see the peaked roof I took a picture but then I turned around and took a picture facing northwest, with the trail , lakes I just passed (McDermand and Wanda) and The Hermit directly behind. Between your description and this lucky picture I think I have a pretty good start on finding my way up to the pass that leads to Mcgee Lakes. I'll be bringing enough supplies for 7 nites so maybe I'll just hang around Mcgee Lakes for a couple of days and just soak it in. As far as the option to head up Mcgee canyon there's always next time.

                    Thanks again, Hank

                    P.S. at the risk of sounding stupid how does someone attach a photo to these messages. I would of sent the picture but I couldn't figure it out. duh

                    --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, "scriv.ener" <jeffreyz212@...> wrote:
                    >
                    > Hank,
                    >
                    > Maybe it's just me, but following a well-trod trail is becoming a bit boring (no doubt a heresy on this forum!). OTOH off-trail carries inherent risks; one of the ways I sold my then-spouse on my JMT trip was that even with a Labor Day start I was sure "not more than an hour" would go by without encountering someone else on the trail (that proved true until about mid-September). There are lots of ways and places on the JMT you'd need an emergency evacuation, but I suspect the worst risk is the drive to the trailhead. Besides, the author of one of the first JMT guides, Pete Starr, is noted even today (80 years ago this summer) for dying on vertical basalt well off the trail. If they don't find you until your bones are well bleached, well, at least they'll talk about you a lot longer.
                    >
                    > But I digress.
                    >
                    > When I went to McGee I approached on a contour from just between Sapphire and Wanda lakes, in other words, northbound. Once you reach the saddle east of McGee Lakes there's a well-defined use trail that descends easily to them. When you get below the lower of the cluster of lakes, though, that trail is intermittent at best; as you note, ultimately what there is of it does leave you at Colby Meadow (not at the junction shown on the 15' topo, though).
                    >
                    > Since you'd be SoBo, it might make more sense to ascend to McGee Lakes, i.e., from Colby Meadow, but that would mean pushing uphill through forest with only a sketchy trail. You'll find your way (stay to the left as you reach the lakes, keep the outlet stream to your right), but it'll be frustrating. You won't get lost, you'll be in a canyon so that "up" and "down" are obvious, but you won't be on any predictable route, either.
                    >
                    > OTOH, if you do McGee Canyon SoBo you'll miss the opportunity to catch the waterfall at the outlet from Evolution Lake, also on my earlier list. Perhaps you can be satisfied with standing at Colby Meadow and seeing it glisten against the rock, or perhaps you stood atop the precipice last year (it is only a few yards off the JMT, but few people take those extra steps).
                    >
                    > I can't comment about the specifics of traversing Darwin Bench, never having been there. However, judging from other off-trail, high granite work I've done
                    > http://www.lakeitalyloop.shutterfly.com
                    > http://www.cartridgeraw.shutterfly.com
                    > a map, compass and common sense should more than suffice.
                    >
                    > Enjoy.
                    >
                    > ~Jeffrey
                    >
                    > --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, "retiredhank2012" <hank1980@> wrote:
                    > >
                    > > Jeffrey,
                    > >
                    > > I see in your list that you included Mcgee Lakes behind The Hermit. I did the JMT last year and this year I want to check out some of the off ramps. At the end of June I'm planning a North Lake South Lake Loop with the idea of trying to get some x-country experience thrown in. Mcgee lakes sound perfect for that. My question is which way is better access to the lakes, thru the canyon out of Colby Meadow or the Pass next to Sapphire Lake? Do you think for a novice that the x-country from upper lamarck lake past lamarck col to darwin bench and down to the JMT is completely unreasonable? I'd like to stretch my limits but I don't want to be an unsafe idiot either. ....
                    > > Hank
                    >
                  • Joe MacLeish
                    Jeffrey: If you are using Outlook just go to insert picture and browse to the pic you want to insert and click insert. You may have to grab a corner (upper
                    Message 9 of 24 , Jun 10, 2013
                    • 0 Attachment

                      Jeffrey:

                      If you are using Outlook just go to insert > picture and browse to the pic you want to insert and click insert.  You may have to grab a corner (upper left) in your email and size the pic to fit the page.

                      Joe

                       

                      From: johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com [mailto:johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of retiredhank2012
                      Sent: Monday, June 10, 2013 5:48 PM
                      To: johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com
                      Subject: [John Muir Trail] Re: MUST SEE on the JMT

                       

                       



                      Jeffrey,

                      Thanks for the info. It made me think about the pictures I took last year Aug. 31st when I got to the Muir Hut. When I was just below the hut and I could only see the peaked roof I took a picture but then I turned around and took a picture facing northwest, with the trail , lakes I just passed (McDermand and Wanda) and The Hermit directly behind. Between your description and this lucky picture I think I have a pretty good start on finding my way up to the pass that leads to Mcgee Lakes. I'll be bringing enough supplies for 7 nites so maybe I'll just hang around Mcgee Lakes for a couple of days and just soak it in. As far as the option to head up Mcgee canyon there's always next time.

                      Thanks again, Hank

                      P.S. at the risk of sounding stupid how does someone attach a photo to these messages. I would of sent the picture but I couldn't figure it out. duh

                      --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, "scriv.ener" <jeffreyz212@...> wrote:
                      >
                      > Hank,
                      >
                      > Maybe it's just me, but following a well-trod trail is becoming a bit boring (no doubt a heresy on this forum!). OTOH off-trail carries inherent risks; one of the ways I sold my then-spouse on my JMT trip was that even with a Labor Day start I was sure "not more than an hour" would go by without encountering someone else on the trail (that proved true until about mid-September). There are lots of ways and places on the JMT you'd need an emergency evacuation, but I suspect the worst risk is the drive to the trailhead. Besides, the author of one of the first JMT guides, Pete Starr, is noted even today (80 years ago this summer) for dying on vertical basalt well off the trail. If they don't find you until your bones are well bleached, well, at least they'll talk about you a lot longer.
                      >
                      > But I digress.
                      >
                      > When I went to McGee I approached on a contour from just between Sapphire and Wanda lakes, in other words, northbound. Once you reach the saddle east of McGee Lakes there's a well-defined use trail that descends easily to them. When you get below the lower of the cluster of lakes, though, that trail is intermittent at best; as you note, ultimately what there is of it does leave you at Colby Meadow (not at the junction shown on the 15' topo, though).
                      >
                      > Since you'd be SoBo, it might make more sense to ascend to McGee Lakes, i.e., from Colby Meadow, but that would mean pushing uphill through forest with only a sketchy trail. You'll find your way (stay to the left as you reach the lakes, keep the outlet stream to your right), but it'll be frustrating. You won't get lost, you'll be in a canyon so that "up" and "down" are obvious, but you won't be on any predictable route, either.
                      >
                      > OTOH, if you do McGee Canyon SoBo you'll miss the opportunity to catch the waterfall at the outlet from Evolution Lake, also on my earlier list. Perhaps you can be satisfied with standing at Colby Meadow and seeing it glisten against the rock, or perhaps you stood atop the precipice last year (it is only a few yards off the JMT, but few people take those extra steps).
                      >
                      > I can't comment about the specifics of traversing Darwin Bench, never having been there. However, judging from other off-trail, high granite work I've done
                      > http://www.lakeitalyloop.shutterfly.com
                      > http://www.cartridgeraw.shutterfly.com
                      > a map, compass and common sense should more than suffice.
                      >
                      > Enjoy.
                      >
                      > ~Jeffrey
                      >
                      > --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, "retiredhank2012" <hank1980@> wrote:
                      > >
                      > > Jeffrey,
                      > >
                      > > I see in your list that you included Mcgee Lakes behind The Hermit. I did the JMT last year and this year I want to check out some of the off ramps. At the end of June I'm planning a North Lake South Lake Loop with the idea of trying to get some x-country experience thrown in. Mcgee lakes sound perfect for that. My question is which way is better access to the lakes, thru the canyon out of Colby Meadow or the Pass next to Sapphire Lake? Do you think for a novice that the x-country from upper lamarck lake past lamarck col to darwin bench and down to the JMT is completely unreasonable? I'd like to stretch my limits but I don't want to be an unsafe idiot either. ....
                      > > Hank
                      >

                    • woodyrtt
                      Thank you all for your suggestions. Rod
                      Message 10 of 24 , Jun 17, 2013
                      • 0 Attachment
                        Thank you all for your suggestions. Rod

                        --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, "woodyrtt" <rod.tayler@...> wrote:
                        >
                        > Heidi and I are thru hiking the JMT for the first time this summer. Given that we may only get to do this once, what are the MUST SEEs on the JMT? We are not averse to day-long side trips if that's what it takes not to miss something really special. Thanks. Rod
                        >
                      • krishna9012
                        The following are on my list this year, as I missed them in the past: The Muir Rock, The man eating rock monster in Le Conte Shorty s cabin near Woods Ck
                        Message 11 of 24 , Jun 17, 2013
                        • 0 Attachment
                          The following are on my list this year, as I missed them in the past:

                          The Muir Rock,
                          The man eating rock monster in Le Conte
                          Shorty's cabin near Woods Ck bridge
                          Shorty's cabin somewhere in Vedette Meadow
                          View of Kern river gorge from Tawny point near Big horn Plateau

                          Krishna

                          --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, "retiredhank2012" <hank1980@...> wrote:
                          >
                          > Jeffrey,
                          >
                          > I see in your list that you included Mcgee Lakes behind The Hermit. I did the JMT last year and this year I want to check out some of the off ramps. At the end of June I'm planning a North Lake South Lake Loop with the idea of trying to get some x-country experience thrown in. Mcgee lakes sound perfect for that. My question is which way is better access to the lakes, thru the canyon out of Colby Meadow or the Pass next to Sapphire Lake? Do you think for a novice that the x-country from upper lamarck lake past lamarck col to darwin bench and down to the JMT is completely unreasonable? I'd like to stretch my limits but I don't want to be an unsafe idiot either.(yes..I have a SPOT but I don't want to actually have to use it) Are there any other places along the north south loop a novice might acquire some x-country skills. I read the SHR messages and just dream.
                          > Hank
                          > --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, "scriv.ener" <jeffreyz212@> wrote:
                          > >
                          > > Great question, Rod. You'll be deluged with answers.
                          > >
                          > > The first and most important thing is to at least have attempted the JMT. As you suggest, it may be a once-in-a-lifetime thing, and to have it on a bucket list is important.
                          > >
                          > > Some sights on or near the trail:
                          > > Muir Hut, of course.
                          > > South of Muir Hut, LeConte Canyon
                          > > Thousand Island Lake
                          > > Lyell Canyon
                          > > Whitney Summit, also of course
                          > > McClure Meadow
                          > > Top of Evolution waterfall
                          > > Bench Lake
                          > > Vermilion Valley Resort (Lake Edison resupply)
                          > > Reds Meadow showers
                          > >
                          > > Some sights off the trail:
                          > > McGee Lakes, behind The Hermit
                          > > Iva Bell hot springs (discussion here earlier about alternate route from there to VVR)
                          > > Lake Italy
                          > > Kern hot springs
                          > > Cartridge Creek (the "old JMT")
                          > >
                          > > ~ Jeffrey
                          > >
                          > >
                          > > --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, "woodyrtt" <rod.tayler@> wrote:
                          > > >
                          > > > Heidi and I are thru hiking the JMT for the first time this summer. Given that we may only get to do this once, what are the MUST SEEs on the JMT? We are not averse to day-long side trips if that's what it takes not to miss something really special. Thanks. Rod
                          > > >
                          > >
                          >
                        • Roleigh Martin
                          Explain about Shorty s cabins. First I heard of it. I don t know how you could ever miss the man eating rock monster, one walks right by it going down into Le
                          Message 12 of 24 , Jun 17, 2013
                          • 0 Attachment
                            Explain about Shorty's cabins.  First I heard of it.

                            I don't know how you could ever miss the man eating rock monster, one walks right by it going down into Le Conte Canyon.
                            -------------------------------------------------
                            Visit my Google Profile (lots of very interesting research links)
                            _



                            On Mon, Jun 17, 2013 at 10:59 PM, krishna9012 <krishna9012@...> wrote:
                             

                            The following are on my list this year, as I missed them in the past:

                            The Muir Rock,
                            The man eating rock monster in Le Conte
                            Shorty's cabin near Woods Ck bridge
                            Shorty's cabin somewhere in Vedette Meadow
                            View of Kern river gorge from Tawny point near Big horn Plateau

                            Krishna



                            --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, "retiredhank2012" <hank1980@...> wrote:
                            >
                            > Jeffrey,
                            >
                            > I see in your list that you included Mcgee Lakes behind The Hermit. I did the JMT last year and this year I want to check out some of the off ramps. At the end of June I'm planning a North Lake South Lake Loop with the idea of trying to get some x-country experience thrown in. Mcgee lakes sound perfect for that. My question is which way is better access to the lakes, thru the canyon out of Colby Meadow or the Pass next to Sapphire Lake? Do you think for a novice that the x-country from upper lamarck lake past lamarck col to darwin bench and down to the JMT is completely unreasonable? I'd like to stretch my limits but I don't want to be an unsafe idiot either.(yes..I have a SPOT but I don't want to actually have to use it) Are there any other places along the north south loop a novice might acquire some x-country skills. I read the SHR messages and just dream.
                            > Hank
                            > --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, "scriv.ener" <jeffreyz212@> wrote:
                            > >
                            > > Great question, Rod. You'll be deluged with answers.
                            > >
                            > > The first and most important thing is to at least have attempted the JMT. As you suggest, it may be a once-in-a-lifetime thing, and to have it on a bucket list is important.
                            > >
                            > > Some sights on or near the trail:
                            > > Muir Hut, of course.
                            > > South of Muir Hut, LeConte Canyon
                            > > Thousand Island Lake
                            > > Lyell Canyon
                            > > Whitney Summit, also of course
                            > > McClure Meadow
                            > > Top of Evolution waterfall
                            > > Bench Lake
                            > > Vermilion Valley Resort (Lake Edison resupply)
                            > > Reds Meadow showers
                            > >
                            > > Some sights off the trail:
                            > > McGee Lakes, behind The Hermit
                            > > Iva Bell hot springs (discussion here earlier about alternate route from there to VVR)
                            > > Lake Italy
                            > > Kern hot springs
                            > > Cartridge Creek (the "old JMT")
                            > >
                            > > ~ Jeffrey
                            > >
                            > >
                            > > --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, "woodyrtt" <rod.tayler@> wrote:
                            > > >
                            > > > Heidi and I are thru hiking the JMT for the first time this summer. Given that we may only get to do this once, what are the MUST SEEs on the JMT? We are not averse to day-long side trips if that's what it takes not to miss something really special. Thanks. Rod
                            > > >
                            > >
                            >


                          • John
                            Shorty was a trapper, wait, I thought I already wrote about this on this forum? His cabins can be found throughout the southern Sierra. Along the JMT there is
                            Message 13 of 24 , Jun 17, 2013
                            • 0 Attachment
                              Shorty was a trapper, wait, I thought I already wrote about this on this forum?  His cabins can be found throughout the southern Sierra. Along the JMT there is one on Bubbs Creek above Woods Cr crossing, Vidette (near the mouth of Vidette Creek) and possibly the one about 2 miles down Tyndall Creek, though I have been told that wasn't built by Shorty.

                              Any who, Shorty trapped the rivers of Kings Canyon before the Park was formed. Legend has it he would trap and then trade all the furs for booze, go on binges, then head back into the mountains again. One year snow surveyors found him half dead in on of the cabins, tree feel on him and ruptured his spleen. 

                              After the Park was created they grandfathered him in for a while, but at some point shut him down. He went to the "city", drank and died....

                              JD
                              Walk the Sky: Following the John Muir Trail
                              see book here 
                              --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, Roleigh Martin wrote:
                              >
                              > Explain about Shorty's cabins. First I heard of it.
                              >
                              > I don't know how you could ever miss the man eating rock monster, one walks
                              > right by it going down into Le Conte Canyon.
                              > -------------------------------------------------
                              > Visit my Google Profile (lots of very interesting research
                              > links)
                              > _
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              > On Mon, Jun 17, 2013 at 10:59 PM, krishna9012 krishna9012@... wrote:
                              >
                              > > **
                              > >
                              > >
                              > > The following are on my list this year, as I missed them in the past:
                              > >
                              > > The Muir Rock,
                              > > The man eating rock monster in Le Conte
                              > > Shorty's cabin near Woods Ck bridge
                              > > Shorty's cabin somewhere in Vedette Meadow
                              > > View of Kern river gorge from Tawny point near Big horn Plateau
                              > >
                              > > Krishna
                              > >
                              > >
                              > > --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, "retiredhank2012" hank1980@
                              > > wrote:
                              > > >
                              > > > Jeffrey,
                              > > >
                              > > > I see in your list that you included Mcgee Lakes behind The Hermit. I
                              > > did the JMT last year and this year I want to check out some of the off
                              > > ramps. At the end of June I'm planning a North Lake South Lake Loop with
                              > > the idea of trying to get some x-country experience thrown in. Mcgee lakes
                              > > sound perfect for that. My question is which way is better access to the
                              > > lakes, thru the canyon out of Colby Meadow or the Pass next to Sapphire
                              > > Lake? Do you think for a novice that the x-country from upper lamarck lake
                              > > past lamarck col to darwin bench and down to the JMT is completely
                              > > unreasonable? I'd like to stretch my limits but I don't want to be an
                              > > unsafe idiot either.(yes..I have a SPOT but I don't want to actually have
                              > > to use it) Are there any other places along the north south loop a novice
                              > > might acquire some x-country skills. I read the SHR messages and just dream.
                              > > > Hank
                              > > > --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, "scriv.ener" wrote:
                              > > > >
                              > > > > Great question, Rod. You'll be deluged with answers.
                              > > > >
                              > > > > The first and most important thing is to at least have attempted the
                              > > JMT. As you suggest, it may be a once-in-a-lifetime thing, and to have it
                              > > on a bucket list is important.
                              > > > >
                              > > > > Some sights on or near the trail:
                              > > > > Muir Hut, of course.
                              > > > > South of Muir Hut, LeConte Canyon
                              > > > > Thousand Island Lake
                              > > > > Lyell Canyon
                              > > > > Whitney Summit, also of course
                              > > > > McClure Meadow
                              > > > > Top of Evolution waterfall
                              > > > > Bench Lake
                              > > > > Vermilion Valley Resort (Lake Edison resupply)
                              > > > > Reds Meadow showers
                              > > > >
                              > > > > Some sights off the trail:
                              > > > > McGee Lakes, behind The Hermit
                              > > > > Iva Bell hot springs (discussion here earlier about alternate route
                              > > from there to VVR)
                              > > > > Lake Italy
                              > > > > Kern hot springs
                              > > > > Cartridge Creek (the "old JMT")
                              > > > >
                              > > > > ~ Jeffrey
                              > > > >
                              > > > >
                              > > > > --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, "woodyrtt" wrote:
                              > > > > >
                              > > > > > Heidi and I are thru hiking the JMT for the first time this summer.
                              > > Given that we may only get to do this once, what are the MUST SEEs on the
                              > > JMT? We are not averse to day-long side trips if that's what it takes not
                              > > to miss something really special. Thanks. Rod
                              > > > > >
                              > > > >
                              > > >
                              > >
                              > >
                              > >
                              >
                            • Don
                              You did John, Nov 2012, but it s nice of you to go over it again. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/johnmuirtrail/message/25740
                              Message 14 of 24 , Jun 17, 2013
                              • 0 Attachment
                                You did John, Nov 2012, but it's nice of you to go over it again.

                                http://groups.yahoo.com/group/johnmuirtrail/message/25740

                                --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, "John" <johndittli@...> wrote:
                                >
                                > Shorty was a trapper, wait, I thought I already wrote about this on this
                                > forum...................
                              • hegghart
                                All of it Sent via the Samsung GALAXY S™4, an AT&T 4G LTE smartphone All of it Sent via the Samsung GALAXY S™4, an AT&T 4G LTE smartphone
                                Message 15 of 24 , Jun 18, 2013
                                • 0 Attachment
                                  All of it


                                  Sent via the Samsung GALAXY S™4, an AT&T 4G LTE smartphone
                                • John
                                  Thanks Don, it was like Deja vu all over again.... Did I contradict myself? John
                                  Message 16 of 24 , Jun 18, 2013
                                  • 0 Attachment
                                    Thanks Don, it was like Deja vu all over again.... Did I contradict myself?

                                    John
                                  • John Ladd
                                    Anybody have a GPS fix on any of his cabins? John Curran Ladd 1616 Castro Street San Francisco, CA 94114-3707 415-648-9279
                                    Message 17 of 24 , Jun 18, 2013
                                    • 0 Attachment
                                      Anybody have a GPS fix on any of his cabins?

                                      John Curran Ladd
                                      1616 Castro Street
                                      San Francisco, CA  94114-3707
                                      415-648-9279


                                      On Mon, Jun 17, 2013 at 9:15 PM, John <johndittli@...> wrote:
                                       

                                      Shorty was a trapper ...

                                    • krishna9012
                                      Roleigh: I did find one youtube video on Shorty s cabin near Bubb s Creek in Vidette meadow: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ob-vwPKlFdQ We did have a long
                                      Message 18 of 24 , Jun 18, 2013
                                      • 0 Attachment
                                        Roleigh:

                                        I did find one youtube video on Shorty's cabin near Bubb's Creek in Vidette meadow:

                                        http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ob-vwPKlFdQ

                                        We did have a long discussion in this chat room on this topic last year and noted them on my to see list. Looks like we missed another of Shorty's cabins near Colby Lake when we did Trans Sierra hike from Road end to WP via Colby pass and Kern river.

                                        Krishna

                                        --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, Roleigh Martin <roleigh@...> wrote:
                                        >
                                        > Explain about Shorty's cabins. First I heard of it.
                                        >
                                        > I don't know how you could ever miss the man eating rock monster, one walks
                                        > right by it going down into Le Conte Canyon.
                                        > -------------------------------------------------
                                        > Visit my Google Profile (lots of very interesting research
                                        > links)<https://plus.google.com/104440166440169700478/about>
                                        > _
                                        >
                                        >
                                        >
                                        > On Mon, Jun 17, 2013 at 10:59 PM, krishna9012 <krishna9012@...> wrote:
                                        >
                                        > > **
                                        > >
                                        > >
                                        > > The following are on my list this year, as I missed them in the past:
                                        > >
                                        > > The Muir Rock,
                                        > > The man eating rock monster in Le Conte
                                        > > Shorty's cabin near Woods Ck bridge
                                        > > Shorty's cabin somewhere in Vedette Meadow
                                        > > View of Kern river gorge from Tawny point near Big horn Plateau
                                        > >
                                        > > Krishna
                                        > >
                                        > >
                                        > > --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, "retiredhank2012" <hank1980@>
                                        > > wrote:
                                        > > >
                                        > > > Jeffrey,
                                        > > >
                                        > > > I see in your list that you included Mcgee Lakes behind The Hermit. I
                                        > > did the JMT last year and this year I want to check out some of the off
                                        > > ramps. At the end of June I'm planning a North Lake South Lake Loop with
                                        > > the idea of trying to get some x-country experience thrown in. Mcgee lakes
                                        > > sound perfect for that. My question is which way is better access to the
                                        > > lakes, thru the canyon out of Colby Meadow or the Pass next to Sapphire
                                        > > Lake? Do you think for a novice that the x-country from upper lamarck lake
                                        > > past lamarck col to darwin bench and down to the JMT is completely
                                        > > unreasonable? I'd like to stretch my limits but I don't want to be an
                                        > > unsafe idiot either.(yes..I have a SPOT but I don't want to actually have
                                        > > to use it) Are there any other places along the north south loop a novice
                                        > > might acquire some x-country skills. I read the SHR messages and just dream.
                                        > > > Hank
                                        > > > --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, "scriv.ener" <jeffreyz212@> wrote:
                                        > > > >
                                        > > > > Great question, Rod. You'll be deluged with answers.
                                        > > > >
                                        > > > > The first and most important thing is to at least have attempted the
                                        > > JMT. As you suggest, it may be a once-in-a-lifetime thing, and to have it
                                        > > on a bucket list is important.
                                        > > > >
                                        > > > > Some sights on or near the trail:
                                        > > > > Muir Hut, of course.
                                        > > > > South of Muir Hut, LeConte Canyon
                                        > > > > Thousand Island Lake
                                        > > > > Lyell Canyon
                                        > > > > Whitney Summit, also of course
                                        > > > > McClure Meadow
                                        > > > > Top of Evolution waterfall
                                        > > > > Bench Lake
                                        > > > > Vermilion Valley Resort (Lake Edison resupply)
                                        > > > > Reds Meadow showers
                                        > > > >
                                        > > > > Some sights off the trail:
                                        > > > > McGee Lakes, behind The Hermit
                                        > > > > Iva Bell hot springs (discussion here earlier about alternate route
                                        > > from there to VVR)
                                        > > > > Lake Italy
                                        > > > > Kern hot springs
                                        > > > > Cartridge Creek (the "old JMT")
                                        > > > >
                                        > > > > ~ Jeffrey
                                        > > > >
                                        > > > >
                                        > > > > --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, "woodyrtt" <rod.tayler@> wrote:
                                        > > > > >
                                        > > > > > Heidi and I are thru hiking the JMT for the first time this summer.
                                        > > Given that we may only get to do this once, what are the MUST SEEs on the
                                        > > JMT? We are not averse to day-long side trips if that's what it takes not
                                        > > to miss something really special. Thanks. Rod
                                        > > > > >
                                        > > > >
                                        > > >
                                        > >
                                        > >
                                        > >
                                        >
                                      • krishna9012
                                        This is what I found from an application made to the National Register of Historical places to recognize Shorty s cabins. One should be able to find the GPS
                                        Message 19 of 24 , Jun 18, 2013
                                        • 0 Attachment
                                          This is what I found from an application made to the National Register of Historical places to recognize Shorty's cabins. One should be able to find the GPS fix from the N and E coordinates. Here is the info.

                                          Source: http://pdfhost.focus.nps.gov/docs/NRHP/Text/78000293.pdf

                                          Woods Creek Crossing ;' Zone 11
                                          N 40-81-630
                                          E 3-72-270
                                          Vidette Meadow Zone,11
                                          N 40-68-250
                                          E 3-74-930
                                          fit-0
                                          Cloud Canyon *]• Zone 11
                                          N 40-56-990
                                          E 3-62-980
                                          Granite Pass 1 Zone 11,
                                          N 40-83-780
                                          E 3-56-960
                                          Garimer Basin Zone 11
                                          N 40-76-340 E 3-66-220
                                          ITEM NUMBER
                                          1Q PAGE 2
                                          ,
                                          Bubbs Creek ]; Zone 11
                                          N 40-71-330
                                          E 3-63-40
                                          Sphinx Creek ; Zone 11 ^
                                          N 40-69-660
                                          E 3-64-i380
                                          i/ A'rt
                                          Crowley Canyon Zone 11
                                          N 40-62-990 E 3-49-;
                                          Williams Meadow Zone 11
                                          N 40-67^430
                                          E 3-49-390

                                          --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, John Ladd <johnladd@...> wrote:
                                          >
                                          > Anybody have a GPS fix on any of his cabins?
                                          >
                                          > John Curran Ladd
                                          > 1616 Castro Street
                                          > San Francisco, CA 94114-3707
                                          > 415-648-9279
                                          >
                                          >
                                          > On Mon, Jun 17, 2013 at 9:15 PM, John <johndittli@...> wrote:
                                          >
                                          > > **
                                          > >
                                          > >
                                          > > Shorty was a trapper ...
                                          > >
                                          >
                                        • Don Amundson
                                          Sorry John-I m leaving the contradiction research up to you. I have enough trouble keeping track of myself.
                                          Message 20 of 24 , Jun 18, 2013
                                          • 0 Attachment
                                            Sorry John-I'm leaving the contradiction research up to you.  I have enough trouble keeping track of myself. 

                                            On Jun 18, 2013, at 6:42 AM, "John" <johndittli@...> wrote:

                                             

                                            Thanks Don, it was like Deja vu all over again.... Did I contradict myself?

                                            John

                                          • krishna9012
                                            There is another important attachment to the application, that contains photos and pieces of NG maps showing the exact location of the cabins! Here is the
                                            Message 21 of 24 , Jun 18, 2013
                                            • 0 Attachment
                                              There is another important attachment to the application, that contains photos and pieces of NG maps showing the exact location of the cabins! Here is the link:

                                              http://pdfhost.focus.nps.gov/docs/NRHP/Photos/78000293.pdf

                                              --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, "krishna9012" <krishna9012@...> wrote:
                                              >
                                              > This is what I found from an application made to the National Register of Historical places to recognize Shorty's cabins. One should be able to find the GPS fix from the N and E coordinates. Here is the info.
                                              >
                                              > Source: http://pdfhost.focus.nps.gov/docs/NRHP/Text/78000293.pdf
                                              >
                                              > Woods Creek Crossing ;' Zone 11
                                              > N 40-81-630
                                              > E 3-72-270
                                              > Vidette Meadow Zone,11
                                              > N 40-68-250
                                              > E 3-74-930
                                              > fit-0
                                              > Cloud Canyon *]• Zone 11
                                              > N 40-56-990
                                              > E 3-62-980
                                              > Granite Pass 1 Zone 11,
                                              > N 40-83-780
                                              > E 3-56-960
                                              > Garimer Basin Zone 11
                                              > N 40-76-340 E 3-66-220
                                              > ITEM NUMBER
                                              > 1Q PAGE 2
                                              > ,
                                              > Bubbs Creek ]; Zone 11
                                              > N 40-71-330
                                              > E 3-63-40
                                              > Sphinx Creek ; Zone 11 ^
                                              > N 40-69-660
                                              > E 3-64-i380
                                              > i/ A'rt
                                              > Crowley Canyon Zone 11
                                              > N 40-62-990 E 3-49-;
                                              > Williams Meadow Zone 11
                                              > N 40-67^430
                                              > E 3-49-390
                                              >
                                              > --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, John Ladd <johnladd@> wrote:
                                              > >
                                              > > Anybody have a GPS fix on any of his cabins?
                                              > >
                                              > > John Curran Ladd
                                              > > 1616 Castro Street
                                              > > San Francisco, CA 94114-3707
                                              > > 415-648-9279
                                              > >
                                              > >
                                              > > On Mon, Jun 17, 2013 at 9:15 PM, John <johndittli@> wrote:
                                              > >
                                              > > > **
                                              > > >
                                              > > >
                                              > > > Shorty was a trapper ...
                                              > > >
                                              > >
                                              >
                                            • Ned Tibbits
                                              I’m trying to pinpoint the locations of each of Shorty’s cabins on my GPS unit, but I can’t seem to find a Datum that works in both North and East. There
                                              Message 22 of 24 , Jun 18, 2013
                                              • 0 Attachment
                                                I’m trying to pinpoint the locations of each of Shorty’s cabins on my GPS unit, but I can’t seem to find a Datum that works in both North and East. There is, also, no way right at the moment that any of his cabins can be at the 40-minute, north latitude.
                                                 
                                                For example, I show that the Gardiner Basin cabin is at N36-49-28 x W118-30-05 (approx.) and not N40-76-34 x E3-66-22.
                                                 
                                                What am I doing wrong, here? (I am used to working within UTM format and not lat/long)
                                                 
                                                 
                                                Ned Tibbits, Director
                                                Mountain Education
                                                www.mountaineducation.org
                                                 
                                                Sent: Tuesday, June 18, 2013 3:55 PM
                                                Subject: [John Muir Trail] Re: Shorty Lovelace trapper Cabin GPS Fixes
                                                 
                                                 

                                                There is another important attachment to the application, that contains photos and pieces of NG maps showing the exact location of the cabins! Here is the link:

                                                http://pdfhost.focus.nps.gov/docs/NRHP/Photos/78000293.pdf

                                                --- In mailto:johnmuirtrail%40yahoogroups.com, "krishna9012" <krishna9012@...> wrote:

                                                >
                                                > This is what I
                                                found from an application made to the National Register of Historical places to recognize Shorty's cabins. One should be able to find the GPS fix from the N and E coordinates. Here is the info.
                                                >
                                                > Source:
                                                href="http://pdfhost.focus.nps.gov/docs/NRHP/Text/78000293.pdf">http://pdfhost.focus.nps.gov/docs/NRHP/Text/78000293.pdf
                                                >
                                                > Woods Creek Crossing ;' Zone 11
                                                > N 40-81-630
                                                > E
                                                3-72-270
                                                > Vidette Meadow Zone,11
                                                > N 40-68-250
                                                > E
                                                3-74-930
                                                > fit-0
                                                > Cloud Canyon *]• Zone 11
                                                > N
                                                40-56-990
                                                > E 3-62-980
                                                > Granite Pass 1 Zone 11,
                                                > N
                                                40-83-780
                                                > E 3-56-960
                                                > Garimer Basin Zone 11
                                                > N 40-76-340 E
                                                3-66-220
                                                > ITEM NUMBER
                                                > 1Q PAGE 2
                                                > ,
                                                > Bubbs Creek ];
                                                Zone 11
                                                > N 40-71-330
                                                > E 3-63-40
                                                > Sphinx Creek ; Zone 11
                                                ^
                                                > N 40-69-660
                                                > E 3-64-i380
                                                > i/ A'rt
                                                > Crowley Canyon
                                                Zone 11
                                                > N 40-62-990 E 3-49-;
                                                > Williams Meadow Zone 11
                                                > N
                                                40-67^430
                                                > E 3-49-390
                                                >
                                                > --- In
                                                href="mailto:johnmuirtrail%40yahoogroups.com">mailto:johnmuirtrail%40yahoogroups.com, John Ladd <johnladd@> wrote:
                                                > >
                                                > > Anybody have a GPS
                                                fix on any of his cabins?
                                                > >
                                                > > John Curran Ladd
                                                > > 1616 Castro Street
                                                > > San Francisco, CA 94114-3707
                                                > >
                                                415-648-9279
                                                > >
                                                > >
                                                > > On Mon, Jun 17, 2013 at
                                                9:15 PM, John <johndittli@> wrote:
                                                > >
                                                > > >
                                                **
                                                > > >
                                                > > >
                                                > > > Shorty was a trapper
                                                ...
                                                > > >
                                                > >
                                                >

                                              • krishna9012
                                                Ned: If it is in ddmmssN and dddmmssE format, where dd in degrees, mm in minutes and ss in seconds, it would be easy to convert into GPS fix. I am struggling
                                                Message 23 of 24 , Jun 19, 2013
                                                • 0 Attachment
                                                  Ned:

                                                  If it is in ddmmssN and dddmmssE format, where dd in degrees, mm in minutes and ss in seconds, it would be easy to convert into GPS fix. I am struggling with the Vidette meadow cabin coords. It may be a lot easier to just look at the old map enclosed at the end of the photos and identify the location in the new NG map. Thats what I am doing for the Woods Ck and Vidette meadow cabins.

                                                  Krishna

                                                  --- In johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com, "Ned Tibbits" <ned@...> wrote:
                                                  >
                                                  > I’m trying to pinpoint the locations of each of Shorty’s cabins on my GPS unit, but I can’t seem to find a Datum that works in both North and East. There is, also, no way right at the moment that any of his cabins can be at the 40-minute, north latitude.
                                                  >
                                                  > For example, I show that the Gardiner Basin cabin is at N36-49-28 x W118-30-05 (approx.) and not N40-76-34 x E3-66-22.
                                                  >
                                                  > What am I doing wrong, here? (I am used to working within UTM format and not lat/long)
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  > Ned Tibbits, Director
                                                  > Mountain Education
                                                  > www.mountaineducation.org
                                                  >
                                                  > From: krishna9012
                                                  > Sent: Tuesday, June 18, 2013 3:55 PM
                                                  > To: johnmuirtrail@yahoogroups.com
                                                  > Subject: [John Muir Trail] Re: Shorty Lovelace trapper Cabin GPS Fixes
                                                  >
                                                  >
                                                  > There is another important attachment to the application, that contains photos and pieces of NG maps showing the exact location of the cabins! Here is the link:
                                                  >
                                                  > http://pdfhost.focus.nps.gov/docs/NRHP/Photos/78000293.pdf
                                                  >
                                                  > --- In mailto:johnmuirtrail%40yahoogroups.com, "krishna9012" <krishna9012@> wrote:
                                                  > >
                                                  > > This is what I found from an application made to the National Register of Historical places to recognize Shorty's cabins. One should be able to find the GPS fix from the N and E coordinates. Here is the info.
                                                  > >
                                                  > > Source: http://pdfhost.focus.nps.gov/docs/NRHP/Text/78000293.pdf
                                                  > >
                                                  > > Woods Creek Crossing ;' Zone 11
                                                  > > N 40-81-630
                                                  > > E 3-72-270
                                                  > > Vidette Meadow Zone,11
                                                  > > N 40-68-250
                                                  > > E 3-74-930
                                                  > > fit-0
                                                  > > Cloud Canyon *]• Zone 11
                                                  > > N 40-56-990
                                                  > > E 3-62-980
                                                  > > Granite Pass 1 Zone 11,
                                                  > > N 40-83-780
                                                  > > E 3-56-960
                                                  > > Garimer Basin Zone 11
                                                  > > N 40-76-340 E 3-66-220
                                                  > > ITEM NUMBER
                                                  > > 1Q PAGE 2
                                                  > > ,
                                                  > > Bubbs Creek ]; Zone 11
                                                  > > N 40-71-330
                                                  > > E 3-63-40
                                                  > > Sphinx Creek ; Zone 11 ^
                                                  > > N 40-69-660
                                                  > > E 3-64-i380
                                                  > > i/ A'rt
                                                  > > Crowley Canyon Zone 11
                                                  > > N 40-62-990 E 3-49-;
                                                  > > Williams Meadow Zone 11
                                                  > > N 40-67^430
                                                  > > E 3-49-390
                                                  > >
                                                  > > --- In mailto:johnmuirtrail%40yahoogroups.com, John Ladd <johnladd@> wrote:
                                                  > > >
                                                  > > > Anybody have a GPS fix on any of his cabins?
                                                  > > >
                                                  > > > John Curran Ladd
                                                  > > > 1616 Castro Street
                                                  > > > San Francisco, CA 94114-3707
                                                  > > > 415-648-9279
                                                  > > >
                                                  > > >
                                                  > > > On Mon, Jun 17, 2013 at 9:15 PM, John <johndittli@> wrote:
                                                  > > >
                                                  > > > > **
                                                  > > > >
                                                  > > > >
                                                  > > > > Shorty was a trapper ...
                                                  > > > >
                                                  > > >
                                                  > >
                                                  >
                                                • John Ladd
                                                  I think the GPS locations for the cabins reported at the reference Krishna located are all given using the NAD72 datum and giving a northing and an easting in
                                                  Message 24 of 24 , Jun 23, 2013
                                                  • 0 Attachment
                                                    I think the GPS locations for the cabins reported at the reference Krishna located are all given using the NAD72 datum and giving a northing and an easting in a somewhat unconventional format apparently used by the NPS in the 1970's

                                                    The source of the locations was a 1977 document so WGS84 would not yet have been available. Since locations was probably just read off of a map, I suspect the locations are approximate only 

                                                    I reformatted them to the more usual way of UTM expression, and incorporating the handwritten notations on the document that Krishna found, supplemented by some notations on a map, linked below

                                                    All  in Zone 11 North 
                                                    identified by Easting and then Northing on the NAD27 datum

                                                    On the JMT

                                                    Woods Creek Crossing 372270E 4081630N 

                                                    Note: turn left after crossing Woods Creek Bridge if southbound and head ENE - hidden behind some foliage - based on the co-ordinates above and several guidebooks I found online

                                                    Vidette Meadow 374700E 4068250N 

                                                    Note: downstream of intersection of Vidette and Bubbs Creeks per the video linked below and apparently confirmed by the waypoint given

                                                    Off the JMT

                                                    Cloud Canyon 362980E 4056990N
                                                    Granite Pass 356960E 4083780N
                                                    Gardiner Basin 366220E 4076340N
                                                    Bubbs Creek 363040E 4071330N (Easting corrected using source linked below)
                                                    Sphinx Creek 364400E 4069650N
                                                    Crowley Canyon 349780E 4062990N 
                                                    Williams Meadow 349390E 4067430N

                                                    Only the Vidette and Woods Creek sites would be particularly near the JMT. The Bubbs Creek one, for example, is almost all the way down to Roads End in Kings Canyon.

                                                    There are photos of the cabins, taken in the 1960's and 1970's at this link


                                                    The last 3 pages of the document linked above has the locations roughly marked on maps 

                                                    Video of the pretty well-preserved Vidette cabin (which  I think someone else mentioned)


                                                    Video also reports that the cabin was just downstream of the intersection of Bubbs and Vidette Creeks. (Vidette Creek flows into Bubbs on the side of Bubbs away from the JMT)

                                                    There's not much left of the Woods Creek cabin - see photo on this page


                                                    Inline image 1

                                                    I added the approximate locations to my waterfalls, etc. Google map


                                                  Your message has been successfully submitted and would be delivered to recipients shortly.