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Re: [johnbarth] "Let's get this party (re)started"?

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  • M. Sedaghat Payam
    Hi Kryzsztof I have not read only few of Barth s books and I am already translating one into Persian. I am really amazed by how different each book of his,
    Message 1 of 8 , Jun 16, 2006
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      Hi Kryzsztof
      I have not read only few of Barth's books and I am already translating one into Persian. I am really amazed by how different each book of his, has been from the otherI have read Floating Opera, Lost in Funhouse,  and right now I am reading Giles Goat Boy which is really wonderful. At first it was  a bit difficult to understand the analogy that he wonderfully made between Universe and University. The idea of Universe as a University may have struck many authors, but I believe that only few can change it to a true work of art. I am in middle of the second reel, and I read one chapter everybody and enjoy it a lot.
      Currently I am working on an article about the electronic textuality and I wonder if I anyone can introduce me any of Barth's novel that can be easily changed into  a hypertext, (as one can electronically publish Late Sorrentono's Mulligan Stew and a mere shift from printed text to the electronic text will not change much of it)?

      Mehdy

      Krzysztof Majer <kmajer@...> wrote:
      This place is quiet these days, let's get some discussion going.

      Any new members? There are 113 all in all, I just looked. Amazing!
      We've never been this big before... So where are you all? :) What led
      you hither? What do you think of 3 Roads, or - for that matter - any
      other JB book? Be not afeared!

      It would be so nice to meet some of those 113 people! I can maybe
      place 20 who have posted here...?

      K



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    • Krzysztof Majer
      Hi Mehdy! Thanks for responding! ... Always a worthy and important enterprise, translation! I do remember several e-mails from you a while back, but could you
      Message 2 of 8 , Jun 16, 2006
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        Hi Mehdy! Thanks for responding!

        > I have not read only few of Barth's books and I am already
        > translating one into Persian.

        Always a worthy and important enterprise, translation! I do remember
        several e-mails from you a while back, but could you remind me if
        there have been any JB translations into Persian already? Are you a
        pioneer in the field, so to speak? I do a bit of translating myself,
        mostly academic articles, although my training is in literary
        translation and I hope to do more of it in future.

        JB is rather tough to render into another language, and he actually
        makes a point of that himself once or twice in 3 Roads (I think in the
        3rd novella, "this will be lost in transcript and translation",
        sonething like that). Back in university days we could often choose
        our own texts for translation projects, so long as they were fiction
        and short - could be stories or bits of novels - and I once did the
        opening 5 or so pages of Coming Soon!!!, probably the most challenging
        bit of translation I've ever done (and that includes the first several
        pages of Gravity's Rainbow on a similar occasion). But fortunately at
        least half of JB's catalogue is available in Polish, some of it done
        very well by experienced translators far abler than Yours Truly. Alas,
        "Giles" is still not among them...

        > I am really amazed by how different each book of his, has been from
        > the otherI have read Floating Opera, Lost in Funhouse, and right
        > now I am reading Giles Goat Boy which is really wonderful.

        True - surely my recent gibe would not apply to these three. "Giles"
        and "Sot-Weed Factor" are two of my absolute Barth favorites, so I go
        along with this heartily. Of course, we have quite a bit of dissent in
        the group here - fortunately! - as regards JB's favorites and
        most-hated. Cheers for diversity, anyhow.

        > At first it was a bit difficult to understand the analogy that he
        > wonderfully made between Universe and University.

        I had that, too, the first time around, my main problem being that it
        is specifically the American university that the Universe resembles
        (or, rather, is). Surely for someone who has been through it, the
        humor would have been still more appealing. The Polish system is in
        many ways very different and so it took a bit of learning how the
        American university actually works to clarify some aspects of the book
        for me. The second time it went much more smoothly.

        > The idea of Universe as a University may have struck many authors,
        > but I believe that only few can change it to a true work of art.

        It may have, indeed, but can we think of any? Probably no-one but the
        elegant, diligent JB would have pushed this "extended metaphor" quite
        this far and have it spawn a 600-pages-plus novel, but do other works
        which attempt at least a similar thing spring to mind? I don't of
        course mean the "university novel" done by people like Amis the Elder,
        Bradbury or Lodge. But it would have been someone endowed with a
        satirical bent, Swiftian perhaps? Or maybe Swift himself did it? I
        read "Gulliver" all too long ago to remember. Anyone?

        > Currently I am working on an article about the electronic textuality
        > and I wonder if I anyone can introduce me any of Barth's novel that
        > can be easily changed into a hypertext,

        I'm not sure about novels, since I guess that JB - despite all his
        metafictional tricks - is after all a linear writer. OK, so he did
        have "The Frame Tale" in Funhouse, but still... There's the story
        "Click!" in the recent volume of short fiction, The Book of Ten Nights
        and a Night. I rather liked the story and even assigned to students
        last year in an additional class dedicated to postmodernist writing
        (along with Coover's "Shootout at Gentry's Junction", brilliant for
        exemplifying genre parody, high/low culture mixup, etc, and extracts
        from Calvino's "If on a Winter's Night a Traveler"). It is not, I take
        it, itself a hypertext, but rather a story about hypertextuality, its
        point being that language & reality themselves are hypertextual, and
        therefore all writing must be. So since the story tries to prove, as I
        see it, that all writing is per se hypertextual, it might be just a
        tad disconcerting to transform that into an actual hypertext (?). A
        fun story to read, anyway, and it used to be available online, maybe
        still is. Surely our linkmaster Mark here has it stored somewhere? Or
        maybe Dave Edelman's site lists it?

        Once again, thanks for weighing in, Mehdy! Do tell us more about the
        reception of JB in your country or how much of his work is actually
        available. Also, which one are you working on, translation-wise?

        K
      • M. Sedaghat Payam
        Hi Krzysztof (Really a difficult name to write and pronounce, by the way I would like to ask the cliche question that you may have answered for 1000th time.
        Message 3 of 8 , Jun 17, 2006
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          Hi Krzysztof (Really a difficult name to write and pronounce, by the way I would like to ask the cliche question that you may have answered for 1000th time. So please answer it for 1001st time because there are still some people are confused whether to pronounce Kieslowski's name as Krishtof or Kristof. The question as you may have noticed is: What is the correct pronunciation of your name in English?)

          Anyway thanks for your reply. As for the translations of J.B. I am the pioneer in the field and there no other translations of J.B.'s novels into Persian. I have M.A. in English Literature and I have translated and published Kurt Vonnegut's Timequake to Persian.  The main problem for translating Barth here, in addition to his stylistical difficulties, is that some people still are reminded of Roland Barthes when I speak about Barth with them, and I have to explain them again and again that "No he is not that French critic"  The fact that only two articles of Barth, literature of exhaustion and literature of replenishment, are the only writings of Barth that are translated to Persian, adds more to this overall confusion about Barthes and Barth. On the other hand they are both pronounced as Baart in Persian. I have chosen to translate Dunyazad from Chimera and a few other stories from Lost in Funhouse. So it's gonna be a collection of his older works.

          When I said that there are many writers who have tried to make an analogy between Universe and University I had no specific novel in mind, I just tried to be on the safe side. Because there are many novels published each year and for me in Iran, which is like an Isle at the end of the world, there is a very little chance of obtaining them and checking them out.

          Finally thanks a lot for introducing Barth's story. I'll try to find it on the web. However there seems to a real craze these days to change some printed texts of fictions into hypertexts. You can find some works which are actually transformed into hypertext on the following link:
          http://www.duke.edu/~mshumate/print.html

          I intended to write to a hypertextual article about Hypertext and Barth, but it seems one can hardly find a hypertextual work by Barth other than Lost in Funhouse.

          Thanks again for your reply.
          MEhdy

          P.S. Would mind telling me which university are you teaching in?

          Krzysztof Majer <kmajer@...> wrote:
          Hi Mehdy! Thanks for responding!

          > I have not read only few of Barth's books and I am already
          > translating one into Persian.

          Always a worthy and important enterprise, translation! I do remember
          several e-mails from you a while back, but could you remind me if
          there have been any JB translations into Persian already? Are you a
          pioneer in the field, so to speak? I do a bit of translating myself,
          mostly academic articles, although my training is in literary
          translation and I hope to do more of it in future.

          JB is rather tough to render into another language, and he actually
          makes a point of that himself once or twice in 3 Roads (I think in the
          3rd novella, "this will be lost in transcript and translation" ,
          sonething like that). Back in university days we could often choose
          our own texts for translation projects, so long as they were fiction
          and short - could be stories or bits of novels - and I once did the
          opening 5 or so pages of Coming Soon!!!, probably the most challenging
          bit of translation I've ever done (and that includes the first several
          pages of Gravity's Rainbow on a similar occasion). But fortunately at
          least half of JB's catalogue is available in Polish, some of it done
          very well by experienced translators far abler than Yours Truly. Alas,
          "Giles" is still not among them...

          > I am really amazed by how different each book of his, has been from
          > the otherI have read Floating Opera, Lost in Funhouse, and right
          > now I am reading Giles Goat Boy which is really wonderful.

          True - surely my recent gibe would not apply to these three. "Giles"
          and "Sot-Weed Factor" are two of my absolute Barth favorites, so I go
          along with this heartily. Of course, we have quite a bit of dissent in
          the group here - fortunately! - as regards JB's favorites and
          most-hated. Cheers for diversity, anyhow.

          > At first it was a bit difficult to understand the analogy that he
          > wonderfully made between Universe and University.

          I had that, too, the first time around, my main problem being that it
          is specifically the American university that the Universe resembles
          (or, rather, is). Surely for someone who has been through it, the
          humor would have been still more appealing. The Polish system is in
          many ways very different and so it took a bit of learning how the
          American university actually works to clarify some aspects of the book
          for me. The second time it went much more smoothly.

          > The idea of Universe as a University may have struck many authors,
          > but I believe that only few can change it to a true work of art.

          It may have, indeed, but can we think of any? Probably no-one but the
          elegant, diligent JB would have pushed this "extended metaphor" quite
          this far and have it spawn a 600-pages-plus novel, but do other works
          which attempt at least a similar thing spring to mind? I don't of
          course mean the "university novel" done by people like Amis the Elder,
          Bradbury or Lodge. But it would have been someone endowed with a
          satirical bent, Swiftian perhaps? Or maybe Swift himself did it? I
          read "Gulliver" all too long ago to remember. Anyone?

          > Currently I am working on an article about the electronic textuality
          > and I wonder if I anyone can introduce me any of Barth's novel that
          > can be easily changed into a hypertext,

          I'm not sure about novels, since I guess that JB - despite all his
          metafictional tricks - is after all a linear writer. OK, so he did
          have "The Frame Tale" in Funhouse, but still... There's the story
          "Click!" in the recent volume of short fiction, The Book of Ten Nights
          and a Night. I rather liked the story and even assigned to students
          last year in an additional class dedicated to postmodernist writing
          (along with Coover's "Shootout at Gentry's Junction", brilliant for
          exemplifying genre parody, high/low culture mixup, etc, and extracts
          from Calvino's "If on a Winter's Night a Traveler"). It is not, I take
          it, itself a hypertext, but rather a story about hypertextuality, its
          point being that language & reality themselves are hypertextual, and
          therefore all writing must be. So since the story tries to prove, as I
          see it, that all writing is per se hypertextual, it might be just a
          tad disconcerting to transform that into an actual hypertext (?). A
          fun story to read, anyway, and it used to be available online, maybe
          still is. Surely our linkmaster Mark here has it stored somewhere? Or
          maybe Dave Edelman's site lists it?

          Once again, thanks for weighing in, Mehdy! Do tell us more about the
          reception of JB in your country or how much of his work is actually
          available. Also, which one are you working on, translation- wise?

          K



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        • Krzysztof Majer
          ... people are confused whether to pronounce Kieslowski s name as Krishtof or Kristof Neither. :) Most people get confused by the r in Krz , but in this
          Message 4 of 8 , Jun 17, 2006
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            Mehdy asks:
            > So please answer it for 1001st time because there are still some
            people are confused whether to pronounce Kieslowski's name as Krishtof
            or Kristof

            Neither. :) Most people get confused by the 'r' in 'Krz', but in this
            case both the 'rz' and 'sz' are pronounced 'sh'. So Kieslowski's name,
            and mine, is actually pronounced 'kshishtof', stress on the first
            syllable. 1001st time, I like that. :)

            > As for the translations of J.B. I am the pioneer in the field

            Three cheers, and may you persist in the effort!

            > I have translated and published Kurt Vonnegut's Timequake to
            > Persian.

            Poland's got Vonnegut pretty well covered, I think all of his books
            have been translated (possibly not "God Bless You, Mr. Rosewater", but
            can't remember now). Any reason for translating "Timequake" and not
            something else? (again, depending on what's available in Persian, of
            course?) Was it the latest at the time? I remember when it came out,
            but I wasn't that thrilled with it - possibly zoomed through it too fast.

            > The main problem for translating Barth here, in addition to his >
            stylistical difficulties, is that some people still are reminded of
            Roland Barthes when I speak about Barth with them

            Heh! We Poles also tend to pronounce both names similarly or
            identically, and yes, sometimes it's necessary to distinguish "the
            American writer" from "the French critic".

            > I have chosen to translate Dunyazad from Chimera and a few other
            > stories from Lost in Funhouse. So it's gonna be a collection of his
            older works.

            The good thing about the three Chimera novellas - among plenty other
            good things about them! - and some of the Funhouse pieces is that, fit
            though they do in the overall scheme of the whole book, they stand
            pretty well on their own (maybe not Bellerophoniad, so much - that
            probably requires the preceding two as launchpad?). Looks like an
            interesting collection! Make sure to tell us which pieces have been
            finally selected. And I assume there are opportunities to publish this?

            > When I said that there are many writers who have tried to make an
            analogy between Universe and University I had no specific novel in
            mind, I just tried to be on the safe side.

            Sure, no problem - I was just trying to rack my brains and think of
            someone else who might have done so, it was an interesting question.
            Still is! Anyone?

            > You can find some works which are actually transformed into
            hypertext on the following link:
            > http://www.duke.edu/~mshumate/print.html

            Unfortunately it seems like the site hasn't been updated in quite a
            while as hardly any link works. I browsed a few essays, but was most
            interested in the new, hypertextual garb for such warhorses as
            Melville's "Bartleby", which was linked on the page but could not be
            accessed. Come to think of it, "Moby Dick" would make a nice
            electronic version! Lots of work, of course.

            > I intended to write to a hypertextual article about Hypertext and
            Barth, but it seems one can hardly find a hypertextual work by Barth
            other than Lost in Funhouse.

            And I would argue that even Funhouse is perfectly linear. :) But then
            you could write about Barth's "rebelling along traditional lines", or
            however he called it, and why - contrary to his peers such as Robert
            Coover, who coaches young hypertextualites at Brown University - he
            shirks from the new mode altogether. And why he never did go in for
            the forking, alternative story-paths that Coover explored way before
            actual hypertext in his "Pricksongs and Descants" collection, and that
            came out more or less at the same time as Funhouse (1969 or so for
            Coover?). Barth never did write such things as "The Babysitter", "The
            Magic Poker" or "The Gingerbread House"... and always claimed he's
            interested in taking "a more scenic route", the destination being
            nonetheless fixed. Would be interesting to explore, methinks. Why does
            the old rebel draw a line where he draws it? Etc.

            > P.S. Would mind telling me which university are you teaching in?

            Uni of Lodz, Poland. I also work at a teacher's college in a nearby town.

            K
          • Krzysztof Majer
            ... is still there, there was a link on Dave s site. http://www.tnellen.com/cybereng/barth.htm K
            Message 5 of 8 , Jun 17, 2006
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              ... is still there, there was a link on Dave's site.

              http://www.tnellen.com/cybereng/barth.htm

              K
            • M. Sedaghat Payam
              Hi Krzysztof Thanks a lot for the pronunciation, but now in addition to being hard to write and pronounce, it has a bit funny meaning in Persian. Of course
              Message 6 of 8 , Jun 18, 2006
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                Hi Krzysztof

                Thanks a lot for the pronunciation, but now in addition to being hard to write and pronounce, it has a bit funny meaning in Persian. Of course with a slightly different pronunciation it sounds "Spit on the Priest." No offense intended, but it makes me like that much more because I hate them and all the clergies and all those whose profession is making money out of religion.

                I chose to translate Vonnegut's Timequake because it was (and still is) his last novel and I had just finished my M.A. thesis on Vonnegut's Breakfast of Champions and Slaughterhouse-five. Furthermore the book was offered to me by a prominent publisher and the offer was too good for me to put it down. TQ can not repeat the past successes of K.V. such as B of C, or SF5, but it is still a very good book because of its plot structure, which is highly experimental and even different from the circular narrative of SF5. It's just a hotchpotch of everything Vonnegut has experienced or still experiences in his life. I may include it in may article on Hypertext Fiction.

                I believe too that the first and second stories of Chimera can be read and enjoyed on their own, but Barth by choosing Chimera, which has, as you know, he body of a goat, the tail of a snake or dragon and the head of a lion, weaves the stories together internally. Very clever of him. Sure I will tell you about the stories which I will include. Until now I have chosen Lost in Funhouse, Title, and Night-sea Journey. And yeah there is a good chance of publishing them if the Ministry of Culture and Islamic Guidance, doesn't understand that the narrator of the Night-see Journey is a sperm. They are all the only barrier, if I can overcome that and they consider the stories as "Not Harmful for the Common Faith" Barth will be published in Persian too.

                I prefer the novels which have a "more scenic route" too, and maybe that has made me a huge fan of Barth. But I like to have a research on the hypterxtuality in literature because it has a great potential for innovation. Moreover I believe in order for a writer to be rebelious, as you put it, he mustn't be a radical or at least I prefer him not to be like that.

                Hurray for the "old rebel"

                MEhdy

                Krzysztof Majer <kmajer@...> wrote:
                Mehdy asks:
                > So please answer it for 1001st time because there are still some
                people are confused whether to pronounce Kieslowski's name as Krishtof
                or Kristof

                Neither. :) Most people get confused by the 'r' in 'Krz', but in this
                case both the 'rz' and 'sz' are pronounced 'sh'. So Kieslowski's name,
                and mine, is actually pronounced 'kshishtof', stress on the first
                syllable. 1001st time, I like that. :)

                > As for the translations of J.B. I am the pioneer in the field

                Three cheers, and may you persist in the effort!

                > I have translated and published Kurt Vonnegut's Timequake to
                > Persian.

                Poland's got Vonnegut pretty well covered, I think all of his books
                have been translated (possibly not "God Bless You, Mr. Rosewater", but
                can't remember now). Any reason for translating "Timequake" and not
                something else? (again, depending on what's available in Persian, of
                course?) Was it the latest at the time? I remember when it came out,
                but I wasn't that thrilled with it - possibly zoomed through it too fast.

                > The main problem for translating Barth here, in addition to his >
                stylistical difficulties, is that some people still are reminded of
                Roland Barthes when I speak about Barth with them

                Heh! We Poles also tend to pronounce both names similarly or
                identically, and yes, sometimes it's necessary to distinguish "the
                American writer" from "the French critic".

                > I have chosen to translate Dunyazad from Chimera and a few other
                > stories from Lost in Funhouse. So it's gonna be a collection of his
                older works.

                The good thing about the three Chimera novellas - among plenty other
                good things about them! - and some of the Funhouse pieces is that, fit
                though they do in the overall scheme of the whole book, they stand
                pretty well on their own (maybe not Bellerophoniad, so much - that
                probably requires the preceding two as launchpad?). Looks like an
                interesting collection! Make sure to tell us which pieces have been
                finally selected. And I assume there are opportunities to publish this?

                > When I said that there are many writers who have tried to make an
                analogy between Universe and University I had no specific novel in
                mind, I just tried to be on the safe side.

                Sure, no problem - I was just trying to rack my brains and think of
                someone else who might have done so, it was an interesting question.
                Still is! Anyone?

                > You can find some works which are actually transformed into
                hypertext on the following link:
                > http://www.duke. edu/~mshumate/ print.html

                Unfortunately it seems like the site hasn't been updated in quite a
                while as hardly any link works. I browsed a few essays, but was most
                interested in the new, hypertextual garb for such warhorses as
                Melville's "Bartleby", which was linked on the page but could not be
                accessed. Come to think of it, "Moby Dick" would make a nice
                electronic version! Lots of work, of course.

                > I intended to write to a hypertextual article about Hypertext and
                Barth, but it seems one can hardly find a hypertextual work by Barth
                other than Lost in Funhouse.

                And I would argue that even Funhouse is perfectly linear. :) But then
                you could write about Barth's "rebelling along traditional lines", or
                however he called it, and why - contrary to his peers such as Robert
                Coover, who coaches young hypertextualites at Brown University - he
                shirks from the new mode altogether. And why he never did go in for
                the forking, alternative story-paths that Coover explored way before
                actual hypertext in his "Pricksongs and Descants" collection, and that
                came out more or less at the same time as Funhouse (1969 or so for
                Coover?). Barth never did write such things as "The Babysitter", "The
                Magic Poker" or "The Gingerbread House"... and always claimed he's
                interested in taking "a more scenic route", the destination being
                nonetheless fixed. Would be interesting to explore, methinks. Why does
                the old rebel draw a line where he draws it? Etc.

                > P.S. Would mind telling me which university are you teaching in?

                Uni of Lodz, Poland. I also work at a teacher's college in a nearby town.

                K



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              • Krzysztof Majer
                ... Haha, well, that s just about the coolest thing I ve ever heard about my name. :)) Not that I identify with the concept, it s just hilarious. Wait till I
                Message 7 of 8 , Jun 19, 2006
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                  Mehdy sez:
                  > Of course with a slightly different pronunciation it sounds
                  > "Spit on the Priest."

                  Haha, well, that's just about the coolest thing I've ever heard about
                  my name. :)) Not that I identify with the concept, it's just
                  hilarious. Wait till I tell my friends this!

                  > I chose to translate Vonnegut's Timequake because it was (and
                  still is) his last novel and I had just finished my M.A. thesis on
                  Vonnegut's Breakfast of Champions and Slaughterhouse-five.

                  I read it in my "going off Vonnegut" phase, which possibly explains
                  why I wasn't riveted by it. Also, I wouldn't have been too familiar
                  with postmodernist tactics at the time (apart from what Vonnegut
                  himself did in his novels, but that wouldn't have been clear enough in
                  my mind either); could be I'd appreciate it much more now. I might
                  also have read too many Vonnegut novels in a row.

                  There are some I often think of revisiting - obviously "Slaughterhouse
                  5", but also "Sirens of Titan" (not a favorite among Vonnegut fans, it
                  seems, but I loved it) or "Deadeye Dick". Not sure about "Breakfast of
                  Champions", I thought it was too experimental for its own good, if one
                  may say so. Or, to put it differently, this particular kind of
                  experimentation didn't seem to me like Vonnegut's forte. But - again -
                  I think fondly about a lot of his novels, and am quite sure there were
                  tons of things I missed out on, reading them quickly in high school.

                  > Until now I have chosen Lost in Funhouse, Title, and Night-sea
                  > Journey.

                  Sounds like a fairly representative bunch. I started liking
                  "Anonymiad" very much the second time around. I had a very hard time
                  figuring it out when I first read it, not to mention - Mark just did -
                  "Menelaiad"! I was completely lost in the frames (or rather in between
                  them). My ignorance of Menelaos' story as told by the Greeks can't
                  have helped, either. "Menelaiad" I still find very patience-trying,
                  but "Anonymiad" has become one of my favorite stories in the set. At
                  the same time such pieces as "Title" have largely lost their allure
                  for me. But - as I said above - that one also is representative of his
                  ideas at the time, at least some of them. Of course, the best bet
                  would be to do the whole book... :)

                  > And yeah there is a good chance of publishing them if the Ministry
                  > of Culture and Islamic Guidance, doesn't understand that the >
                  narrator of the Night-see Journey is a sperm.

                  I think it's very likely that they will miss that. :) A lot of readers
                  do, including some critics (at least that must have been the case at
                  the time of publishing; in one of his essays JB mentions his
                  astonishment when he read that his narrator was "some kind of strange
                  fish", or somesuch). I was luckily (unluckily?) exempted from that
                  test, because the blurb of the Polish edition of Funhouse made it
                  clear that it's a sperm, who later, etc., etc. Incidentally, that's
                  how I got into Barth, having picked up "Funhouse" at a second-hand and
                  being sufficiently intrigued to give it a shot...

                  > Moreover I believe in order for a writer to be rebelious, as you
                  > put it, he mustn't be a radical or at least I prefer him not to be
                  > like that.

                  I mostly said that's JB's view, which I take to be at least slightly
                  self-serving. I think we'd mostly agree here - our liking or disliking
                  his recent pieces aside - that he hasn't been pushing any new
                  boundaries for a long while. Although he is remarkably (or, perhaps
                  frightfully?) consistent in continuing to push the ones one would have
                  thought are almost not there anymore... But there, I'll get off the
                  horse before I start ranting about "3 Roads" again. :)

                  > Hurray for the "old rebel"

                  Hurray indeed, although I can't help but see him more as a war veteran
                  than someone who is "old and still a rebel". Which is not bad, the
                  former, methinks?

                  K
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