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We Remember

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  • Jack
    Hi guys. I know I have been a mostly silent member. My 40 hour work week and 15 credit school schedule doesn t leave me much time for recreational reading
    Message 1 of 9 , Sep 11, 2002
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      Hi guys. I know I have been a mostly silent member. My 40 hour work
      week and 15 credit school schedule doesn't leave me much time for
      recreational reading right now. I do enjoy all your postings
      though. No matter how busy, I feel I need to say something for my
      own sanity.
      I lost a dear dear friend one year ago today. The anniversary
      celebrations, while necessary, meaningful, and beautiful, recreate
      the loss and frustration in all of us. I found myself in tears this
      morning on the way to work, listening to the president speak,
      listening to the survivors speak. My point in writing this is not to
      beat a dead horse. Rather, I hope to revive the fading comradery
      that has kept my great nation together in the last 12 months. Our
      help is still needed, our blood, our money, and most
      importantly...our prayers. Please at some point today, say a prayer
      with me... if you don't pray, take a moment to reflect. Keep in your
      prayers my dear friend Michael, his family, and all the victims and
      survivors alike. For all of us, something changed. But to those who
      insist it was the world that changed, I say no! The evil that was at
      work on 9-11-01 could not change us; they could only make us more
      aware. Flights stopped, commercials stopped, music stopped, life
      stopped... or did it? Didn't it really only pause? They couldn't
      stop us. They can never change us. Through hell or high water, all
      they can do is make us stronger.

      To those who were heroes: we thank you.
      To those who were victims: we miss you.
      To a nation standing strong 1 year later: God Bless the USA

      -Thanks friends........Jack
    • Mark Brawner
      ... listening to the president speak, listening to the survivors speak. Me too. My condolences for the loss of your friend, Jack. I ve not suffered that
      Message 2 of 9 , Sep 11, 2002
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        >I found myself in tears this morning on the way to work,
        listening to the president speak, listening to the
        survivors speak.

        Me too.

        My condolences for the loss of your friend, Jack. I've not
        suffered that misfortune, except indirectly: a few
        friends, acquaintances, and colleagues lost loved ones
        last year - in one case, the guy basically vanished in the
        tower wreckage. It makes me wonder how many bodies were
        unrecoverable like that. Very sad.

        I happened to be thumbing through _On With the Story_ last
        night in bed and, while its subject matter (especially the
        frame story) is no diversionary walk in the park,
        something about it was comforting to me. Barth strikes me
        as having a kind of quiet wisdom about mortality -
        unblinking yet not resentful. Not sentimental, but not
        depressing either. Hard to describe. Anyhow, very moving
        indeed and I take such comfort where I can find it.

        Regards,
        Mark

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      • Jack
        ... Mark, Thank you for your condolences. We all lost something that day, even if it was nothing more than security. Through all the destruction and well,
        Message 3 of 9 , Sep 11, 2002
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          --- In johnbarth@y..., "Mark Brawner" <markbrawner@z...> wrote:
          > >I found myself in tears this morning on the way to work,
          > listening to the president speak, listening to the
          > survivors speak.
          >
          > Me too.
          >
          > My condolences for the loss of your friend, Jack. I've not
          > suffered that misfortune, except indirectly: a few
          > friends, acquaintances, and colleagues lost loved ones
          > last year - in one case, the guy basically vanished in the
          > tower wreckage. It makes me wonder how many bodies were
          > unrecoverable like that. Very sad.
          >
          > I happened to be thumbing through _On With the Story_ last
          > night in bed and, while its subject matter (especially the
          > frame story) is no diversionary walk in the park,
          > something about it was comforting to me. Barth strikes me
          > as having a kind of quiet wisdom about mortality -
          > unblinking yet not resentful. Not sentimental, but not
          > depressing either. Hard to describe. Anyhow, very moving
          > indeed and I take such comfort where I can find it.
          >
          > Regards,
          > Mark
          >

          Mark,

          Thank you for your condolences. We all lost something that day,
          even if it was nothing more than security. Through all the
          destruction and well, terror, there were and are definately some
          positives to come out of that. We all realize our mortality with a
          little more clearity I think post 9-11. You spoke of "On With the
          Story." That is far and away my favorite Barth work. Many of the
          stories in that collection leave me with a similar feeling to the one
          you described in your post... Ad Infinitum and Waiting for the Storm
          for example. One story that reflects your sentiments exactly I
          think, is not Barthian at all, however. That acceptance of
          mortality, the realization of one's humanness is the very theme of
          the Story "The Dead" from James Joyce's book, Dubliners. If you
          haven't read it, I reccommend you do.
          By the way, is the whole group from the USA?

          Jack
          > ________________________________________________
          > Don't E-Mail, ZipMail! http://www.zipmail.com/
        • Mark Brawner
          ... favorite Barth work. It s up there high on the list for me, no question. Floored me when I first read it. Could barely get any work done for thinking
          Message 4 of 9 , Sep 11, 2002
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            >You spoke of "On With the Story." That is far and away my
            favorite Barth work.

            It's up there high on the list for me, no question.
            Floored me when I first read it. Could barely get any
            work done for thinking about it so much.

            >That acceptance of mortality, the realization of one's
            humanness is the very theme of the Story "The Dead" from
            James Joyce's book, Dubliners.

            Interesting. I always read it as first and foremost an
            indictment of the shallowness of life in Dublin at that
            time. Which is not to say that the idea of mortality
            doesn't have something to say about that, etc. But then
            again, this notion was probably spoon fed to me when I was
            an undergrad...

            >By the way, is the whole group from the USA?

            No, we're quite a cosmopolitan bunch. Mal is in Australia,
            Kris is in Poland, Rick (though American, I believe) is in
            Prague, j.m. is in Germany, Martin is in the UK. . .

            ...who am I forgetting?
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          • Barbara Schmidt
            I was recently trying to formulate what I have been finding so attractive about Barth s writing. Since this attraction goes back close to 40 years, I guess
            Message 5 of 9 , Sep 11, 2002
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              I was recently trying to formulate what I have been finding so attractive
              about Barth's writing. Since this attraction goes back close to 40 years, I
              guess it's not infatuation! Must have to do with the sense of comfort in
              who he is, coupled with the willingness to toy with alien notions. In due
              course the destroyer of delights will find me.... but the course isn't
              always a predictable path through space/time. JB's tactic of giving much
              context for/in his writing has always been intriguing; he was worried about
              Osama Bin Laden in CS. He seems a wise person. Don't know why it should,
              but that matters to making him readable.

              -----Original Message-----
              From: Mark Brawner [mailto:markbrawner@...]
              Sent: September 11, 2002 10:41 AM
              To: johnbarth@yahoogroups.com
              Subject: Re: [johnbarth] Re: We Remember


              >You spoke of "On With the Story." That is far and away my
              favorite Barth work.

              It's up there high on the list for me, no question.
              Floored me when I first read it. Could barely get any
              work done for thinking about it so much.

              >That acceptance of mortality, the realization of one's
              humanness is the very theme of the Story "The Dead" from
              James Joyce's book, Dubliners.

              Interesting. I always read it as first and foremost an
              indictment of the shallowness of life in Dublin at that
              time. Which is not to say that the idea of mortality
              doesn't have something to say about that, etc. But then
              again, this notion was probably spoon fed to me when I was
              an undergrad...

              >By the way, is the whole group from the USA?

              No, we're quite a cosmopolitan bunch. Mal is in Australia,
              Kris is in Poland, Rick (though American, I believe) is in
              Prague, j.m. is in Germany, Martin is in the UK. . .

              ...who am I forgetting?
              ________________________________________________
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            • Jack
              ... That isn t an uncommon interpretation of The Dead... and yes, most of the time it is spoonfed to us all in undergrad. For the rest of the stories in
              Message 6 of 9 , Sep 11, 2002
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                --- In johnbarth@y..., "Mark Brawner" <markbrawner@z...> wrote:
                > >You spoke of "On With the Story." That is far and away my
                > favorite Barth work.
                >
                > It's up there high on the list for me, no question.
                > Floored me when I first read it. Could barely get any
                > work done for thinking about it so much.
                >
                > >That acceptance of mortality, the realization of one's
                > humanness is the very theme of the Story "The Dead" from
                > James Joyce's book, Dubliners.
                >
                > Interesting. I always read it as first and foremost an
                > indictment of the shallowness of life in Dublin at that
                > time. Which is not to say that the idea of mortality
                > doesn't have something to say about that, etc. But then
                > again, this notion was probably spoon fed to me when I was
                > an undergrad...
                >
                > >By the way, is the whole group from the USA?
                >
                > No, we're quite a cosmopolitan bunch. Mal is in Australia,
                > Kris is in Poland, Rick (though American, I believe) is in
                > Prague, j.m. is in Germany, Martin is in the UK. . .
                >
                > ...who am I forgetting?


                That isn't an uncommon interpretation of The Dead... and yes, most of
                the time it is spoonfed to us all in undergrad. For the rest of the
                stories in Dubliners, I agree with you. Joyce is easily labled a
                Naturalist, and therefore, was very deterministic. His characters
                had no choices. Their lives were all predetermined, and they were
                caged in by obligations to family, country, and not to any lesser
                degree, religion. Gabriel Conroy (I believe was his name) from the
                dead, is not like the other characters, just as The Dead is not like
                any of the other stories. Unlike in the rest of the stories, the
                characters in the dead were very round. They had depressing, hard
                times just like the rest of the stories, but unique to the dead was
                the fact that they had good times as well. They found happiness
                also. Most unique to The Dead, they were a family and friends that
                wanted and did indeed help one another. Gabriel's final thoughts in
                the story point out that this story offered more than the "indictment
                of the shallowness of life in Dublin at that
                > time." He realized that, yes, life would end for him, just as it
                did for all life, but instead of letting it grab him from his
                colorless existence, he would make death take him from an actual
                life. He hurt over his wife's feelings for that boy (Michael I
                believe) but he was not angry or jealous...he felt bad for her. He
                was glad that she knew what it was to love, and to live, and he felt
                he strangled that out of her. At the end he decides to begin his
                hourney westward (obviously into the setting sun...death) but it is a
                journey. He knows that life will end, but that it is not yet over.
                Like Barth's sentiment...Gabriel becomes suddenly aware of the
                limitations of his humanness, but in a way that allows him to
                appreciate his mortality, again, like Barth.
                > ________________________________________________
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              • Richard Stock
                I haven t read On With the Story . Next group read? Rick ... -- ... Richard Stock Prague, Czech Republic
                Message 7 of 9 , Sep 12, 2002
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                  I haven't read "On With the Story". Next group read?

                  Rick

                  Mark Brawner wrote:

                  > >You spoke of "On With the Story." That is far and away my
                  > favorite Barth work.
                  >
                  > It's up there high on the list for me, no question.
                  > Floored me when I first read it. Could barely get any
                  > work done for thinking about it so much.
                  >

                  --
                  ----------------------------
                  Richard Stock
                  Prague, Czech Republic
                  ----------------------------
                • Mark Brawner
                  I m game. On Thu, 12 Sep 2002 09:58:31 +0200 ... Mark ~ ________________________________________________ Don t E-Mail, ZipMail! http://www.zipmail.com/
                  Message 8 of 9 , Sep 12, 2002
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                    I'm game.

                    On Thu, 12 Sep 2002 09:58:31 +0200
                    Richard Stock <rstock@...> wrote:
                    >I haven't read "On With the Story". Next group read?
                    >
                    >Rick
                    >
                    >Mark Brawner wrote:
                    >
                    >> >You spoke of "On With the Story." That is far and away
                    > my
                    >> favorite Barth work.
                    >>
                    >> It's up there high on the list for me, no question.
                    >> Floored me when I first read it. Could barely get any
                    >> work done for thinking about it so much.
                    >>
                    >
                    >--
                    >----------------------------
                    >Richard Stock
                    >Prague, Czech Republic
                    >----------------------------
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    >
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                    >
                    >

                    Mark
                    ~
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                  • Matthew Barbee
                    let s do it! Mark Brawner wrote:I m game. On Thu, 12 Sep 2002 09:58:31 +0200 ... Mark ~ ________________________________________________ Don t E-Mail, ZipMail!
                    Message 9 of 9 , Sep 12, 2002
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                      let's do it!

                       Mark Brawner wrote:

                      I'm game.

                      On Thu, 12 Sep 2002 09:58:31 +0200
                      Richard Stock <rstock@...> wrote:
                      >I haven't read "On With the Story". Next group read?
                      >
                      >Rick
                      >
                      >Mark Brawner wrote:
                      >
                      >> >You spoke of "On With the Story."  That is far and away
                      > my
                      >> favorite Barth work.
                      >>
                      >> It's up there high on the list for me, no question.
                      >>   Floored me when I first read it.  Could barely get any
                      >> work done for thinking about it so much.
                      >>
                      >
                      >--
                      >----------------------------
                      >Richard Stock
                      >Prague, Czech Republic
                      >----------------------------
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
                      >
                      >To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
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                      >
                      >
                      >
                      >Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
                      > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
                      >
                      >

                      Mark
                      ~
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