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Re: [John_Lit] Three times "Do you love me?" in John 21

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  • Tom Butler
    Fred, Joe, Jack, Mark, Paul, Bill, John et al... I m enjoying the exchange regarding the three times *Do you love me* inquirey and response between Jesus and
    Message 1 of 19 , Apr 24 10:33 AM
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      Fred, Joe, Jack, Mark, Paul, Bill, John et al...

      I'm enjoying the exchange regarding the three times
      *Do you love me* inquirey and response between Jesus
      and Peter in John 21: 15-17.

      Rather than seeing magic in the three-fold exchange,
      I see words of ordination.

      (1) *boske ta arnia mou* (Feed my lambs) suggests
      that Jesus is recognizing Peter as a shepherd of His
      (Jesus') flock. It recalls the symbolism Jesus uses
      in Jn. 10 in reference to Himself and *His own.*

      I see this as an ordination to the role of deacon,
      based upon the task required of Peter: feeding the
      little lambs, ie: the children. The "children" in
      Johannine literature are the members, especially the
      newest members, of the community (the household).

      (2) *poimaine ta probata mou* (Tend my sheep).

      I suggest that there is a nuance of difference here
      from the first "ordination." What Jesus is ordaining
      Peter to do here is more than delivering the food (the
      sacrament? the gospel?) to them. He is ordaining
      Peter to rule the sheep (a term that includes both the
      newest and the more *mature* members of the community)
      like a shepherd tends, guides, directs, protects *the
      flock.* I submit that this is an ordination to the
      role of elder.

      (3) *baske ta probata mou* (Feed my sheep) may imply
      a third level of ordination, though this one is harder
      to see.

      As many of you know, I see in Jn. 12: 7 Jesus'
      words of ordination of Mary of Bethany (the Beloved
      Disciple) to a role among the disciples equivalent to
      that of bishop in the first century church (See my Let
      Her Keep It: Jesus' Ordination of Mary of Bethany)

      Recognizing that Jn. 21 is an addendum to the
      gospel, and that this three-fold exchange occurs
      between Jesus and Peter just before Peter asks Jesus,
      "Lord, what about him?" (meaning the BD),
      I suggest that this third utterance by Jesus was
      intended to ordain Peter to the same level of
      authority within the Johannine community as had
      already been given to Mary of Bethany, that of Bishop.
      "Feed my sheep," may well suggest that the role
      involves offering the spiritual food given in the
      Jesus tradition, which the Bishop oversees.

      I suspect that it was necessary for the sake of
      gaining acceptance of the Gospel within the
      established *orthodox* (ie: Petrine) church, to
      acknowledge that Peter had been fully authorized by
      Jesus. Also, I suspect that this message was added to
      the Gospel to convey to the scattered members of the
      Johannine community the necessity of recognizing
      Peter's authority.

      The text (esp. Jn. 21: 20-23) makes it clear that
      Peter's ordination does not negate or supersede that
      of the Beloved Disciple.

      Yours in Christ's service,
      Tom Butler


      --- Fred Guyette <fguyette@...> wrote:

      >
      > It's been more than twenty years since I read about
      > this in Raymond
      > Brown's commentary on John in the Anchor Bible
      > series, but I do recall
      > being struck by what Brown saw as a connection
      > between the two episodes.
      > Working from memory, I would not characterize it as
      > atonement exactly,
      > but it was meant to bring Peter to a new level of
      > discipleship -- maybe
      > "restoration" would be closer to Brown's
      > interpretation. Jesus clearly
      > is recalling Peter's denials, and just as clearly
      > saying -- "Peter,
      > you're back in the game, and this is what I want you
      > to do from now on..."
      >
      > Maybe someone has read Brown more recently and can
      > comment more directly.
      >
      > Fred Guyette
      > Erskine College and Seminary
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      > John Bailey wrote:
      >
      > >Hi Jo, Tom and All,
      > >
      > >Might be worth calling to mind the post
      > resurrection
      > >scene where Jesus makes a point of asking Peter
      > >three times whether he loves him.
      > >
      > >This is a form of atonement
      > >for the the three denials?
      > >
      > >Love, John.
      > >
      > >
      > >--- In johannine_literature@yahoogroups.com, Tom
      > Butler
      > ><pastor_t@...> wrote:
      > >
      > >
      > >>Joe,
      > >> I tried to use the link you provided. It didn't
      > >>work, but referred me to fourthgospel.com. I went
      > >>there and found one paper written by you on
      > >>Witnessing. Is that the one to which you are
      > >>referring?
      > >>
      > >>Tom Butler
      > >>
      > >>--- SemioticSymphony@... wrote:
      > >>
      > >>
      > >>
      > >>>In a recent paper, I link the Joshua passage you
      > >>>site to the stone of Jesus
      > >>>tomb:
      > >>>
      > >>>_http://www.fourthgospel.com/calandrino.pdf_
      > >>>(http://www.fourthgospel.com/calandrino.pdf)
      > >>>
      > >>>Best regards,
      > >>>Joe C.
      > >>>
      > >>>Joseph Calandrino, FAAFP, DABHPM
      > >>>Assistant Professor of Medicine
      > >>>University Hospital School of Medicine
      > >>>SUNY Stony Brook
      > >>>
      > >>>
      > >><DIV><STRONG><EM><FONT face=system
      > color=#0000ff>Yours in Christ's
      > >>
      > >>
      > >service,</FONT></EM></STRONG></DIV>
      > >
      > >
      > >><DIV><STRONG><EM><FONT face=System
      > color=#0000ff>Tom
      > >>
      > >>
      > >Butler</FONT></EM></STRONG></DIV>
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > >
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      <DIV><STRONG><EM><FONT face=system color=#0000ff>Yours in Christ's service,</FONT></EM></STRONG></DIV>
      <DIV><STRONG><EM><FONT face=System color=#0000ff>Tom Butler</FONT></EM></STRONG></DIV>
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