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5980Re: [John_Lit] Re: Echoes between Jn 1-2 and Passion Narrative?

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  • Jack Kilmon
    Nov 28, 2011
    • 0 Attachment
      That's interesting but I have a problem with mixing what may be a legend and
      what seems to be historical. The description of the crucifixion in the
      gospels is of a severe concussive beating with a Roman flagrum which almost
      certainly would cause a hemothorax which in 6 hours (a very short time to
      die by crucifixion standards) would settle as serum and RBCs. A puncture of
      the chest wall by a Lancea would cause blood and "water" to issue. Its one
      of the few things that makes non-supernatural sense, ergo historical.

      Please sign your posts, Steve.

      Jack Kilmon

      -----Original Message-----
      From: steve levine
      Sent: Sunday, November 27, 2011 3:15 PM
      To: johannine_literature@yahoogroups.com
      Subject: Re: [John_Lit] Re: Echoes between Jn 1-2 and Passion Narrative?

      I see the connection between Cana and Cross - Mary asked to see water turned
      to wine and she later saw blood turned to water (it is not yet my time).


      ________________________________
      From: Matthew Miller <logosmadeflesh@...>
      To: "johannine_literature@yahoogroups.com"
      <johannine_literature@yahoogroups.com>
      Sent: Saturday, November 26, 2011 7:05 AM
      Subject: [John_Lit] Re: Echoes between Jn 1-2 and Passion Narrative?



      I too have been looking into the links between the Passion Narrative and
      John 1-2 and I'm surprised at how little I've found. Mark Stibb makes a
      few passing connections in Reading John and in the Genius of John, Peter
      Ellis suggests more. I'd be grateful for any additional resources that you
      find.

      The prominent and unique appearances of Jesus' mother at the wedding of
      Cana and the crucifixion stand as the clearest indicator that the author
      intended a link between them. But other less apparent parallels only
      strengthen such a proposal as you make mention.

      I think you're on the right track but let me turn your attention if I may
      to a slightly different set of connections. I believe more specifically
      that John 20:1-31 echoes John 1:35-51. Both accounts relate the story of
      the disciples finding Jesus. Note the following progression and parallels.

      John sees Jesus and tells his two disciples. (1:35-36)
      Mary can't find Jesus and tells two disciples. (20:1-3)

      Two disciples respond by following Jesus (1:37 <x-apple-data-detectors://2>)
      Two disciples respond by running to look for Jesus. (20:3-4)

      Jesus *Turns* to see Disciples (1:38 <x-apple-data-detectors://4>)
      She (Mary) *Turns* to see Jesus (20:14 <x-apple-data-detectors://5>)

      Jesus asks Disciples, "What do you seek?"� (1:38<x-apple-data-detectors://6>
      )
      Jesus asks Mary, "Whom are you seeking?" �(1:15 <x-apple-data-detectors://7>
      )

      Disciples addresses Jesus: "Rabbi (Which translated means Teacher)"
      (1:38<x-apple-data-detectors://8>
      )
      Mary addresses Jesus: "Rabboni (Which means, Teacher)"�
      (1:16<x-apple-data-detectors://9>
      )

      Disciples ask Jesus,"Where are you (Jesus) staying?"
      (1:38<x-apple-data-detectors://10>
      )
      Mary says to Jesus, "Tell me where you have laid Him.
      (1:15<x-apple-data-detectors://11>
      )

      Andrew tells Peter, "We have found the Messiah"
      (1:41<x-apple-data-detectors://12>
      )
      Mary tells Disciples, "I have seen the Lord"
      (20:18<x-apple-data-detectors://13>
      )

      Philip tells Nathaniel : "We have found Him..."
      (1:45<x-apple-data-detectors://14>
      )
      Disciples tells Thomas: "We have seen the Lord"
      (20:25<x-apple-data-detectors://15>
      )

      Nathaniel expresses doubt, "Nazareth! Can anything good come from there?"
      (1:46 <x-apple-data-detectors://16>)
      Thomas expresses doubt, "Unless I see... I will not believe"
      (20:25<x-apple-data-detectors://17>
      )

      Jesus grants evidence: "I saw you under the fig tree" (1:47-48)
      Jesus grants evidence: "Put your finger here...
      (20:27<x-apple-data-detectors://18>
      )

      Nathaniel declares his belief in Jesus,"Rabbi, you are the Son of God; you
      are
      the King of Israel." (1:49 <x-apple-data-detectors://19>)
      Thomas declares his belief in Jesus,"My Lord and my God!"
      (20:28<x-apple-data-detectors://20>
      )

      Jesus: "You believe because I told you I saw you under the fig tree. You
      shall
      see greater things than these." (1:50 <x-apple-data-detectors://21>)
      Jesus: "Because you have seen me, you have believed; blessed are those who
      have
      not seen and yet have believed." (20:29 <x-apple-data-detectors://22>)

      Though there are a few unique, near verbatim agreements, overall it's the
      similarities of character and plot confined within such a short space which
      makes this connection most compelling.

      I've found such connections repeated throughout John. It's not just the
      Passion Narrative and John 1-2. I believe John does indeed posses an
      overarching unity. I offer the following structure for consideration.

      A) Seeing and Believing (1:35-51)
      B) Wedding of Cana (2:1-12)
      C) Foreshadowing and Meeting 2:13-3:21 <x-apple-data-detectors://24>)
      D) John the Baptist and a Woman (3:23-4:54 <x-apple-data-detectors://25>)
      E) Voice of Life (5:1-54)
      G) Call to Discipleship (6:1-79)
      E') Voice of Life (7:1-10:41 <x-apple-data-detectors://26>)
      D') Two Women and Caiaphas (11:1-57)
      C') Foreshadowing and Meeting (12:1-50)
      B') Crucifixion (19:25-30)
      A') Seeing and Believing (20:1-29)

      Epilogue
      G') Call to Discipleship (21:1-25)

      God Bless
      Matthew Miller
      Canby Bible College
      Logosmadeflesh@...<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/johannine_literature/post?postID=uYJNR7tsKaqi57OGJUpVQlaAFDbacZISWBS4GLoN8leyt7Ov7r5xaFuWoP3TTsMoCJLfJ7GbYvroCK99GomoYsHiSw>

      Matt

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