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Re: [Joe Cell Free Energy Device] Re: Un canny resemblance to the JC

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  • Bernie
    ... From: sco0212 To: joecellfreeenergydevice@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, March 04, 2008 4:07 AM Subject: [Joe Cell Free Energy Device] Re: Un canny
    Message 1 of 32 , Mar 4, 2008
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      ----- Original Message -----
      From: sco0212
      To: joecellfreeenergydevice@yahoogroups.com
      Sent: Tuesday, March 04, 2008 4:07 AM
      Subject: [Joe Cell Free Energy Device] Re: Un canny resemblance to the JC


      Bernie,

      Hi. If I use a 316L SS plate, do I still have to passivate it?
      My feeling of your answer is probably yes. If so, how often do I
      need to do the passivation? Should I do the passivation before I
      assembled it together with the nylon bolt/nut/washer?
       
      Either way will work. The passivation builds up over time, so typicly when we think it's breaking down we wind up redoing it, and each time it gets better.

      Also, should the plate be flat all over? The 1 gang swith plate is
      not totally flat. There's a little bent on the sides. Is the
      distance of 1/8" to 1/4" based on the outside or the middle if the
      plate is not flat? I saw some type of swith plate that are totally
      flat but there seems to be a big hole in the center. Anyway, let me
      hear your answer before I decide which ones I will get.
      The plates are fine. I just don't think we should use a tubular electrolysis cell for this, as we don't want to introduce spin into the water until we put it in the actual cell. It would introduce an uncertainty in the process. I've found that it's difficult to reverse the spin once it's introduced. (The spin is at the molecular level and not necessarily visible)
       
      Bernie

      Thanks,
      Sonny

      --- In joecellfreeenergydevice@yahoogroups.com, "Bernie"
      <bernieheere@...> wrote:
      >
      > 302 should be fine. It does need top be passivated
      though!
      >
      > Benrie
      > ----- Original Message -----
      >
      From: sco0212
      > To: joecellfreeenergydevice@yahoogroups.com
      >
      Sent: Monday, March 03, 2008 6:48 PM
      > Subject: [Joe Cell Free Energy
      Device] Re: Un canny resemblance
      to the JC
      >
      >
      >
      Bernie,
      >
      > Thanks for mentioning your experience with the 1" pipe.
      I
      beleive I
      > read it somewhere also to start with 2" dia. for the
      center pipe.
      >
      > I want to start with the flat plate while waiting
      for the tubes
      for
      > the cell. The SS switch plate cover I have seen
      such as the 1
      gang
      > switch are 302 SS. Do I need 316L SS plate or
      302 SS plate will
      be
      > fine?
      >
      > Sonny
      >
      >
      --- In joecellfreeenergydevice@yahoogroups.com, "Bernie"
      >
      <bernieheere@> wrote:
      > >
      > > Sonny,
      > >
      > > I have mixed emotions about whether to bother with the 1" pipe
      or
      > not. The cell that I'm playing with seemd to be better without
      it,
      > which was the initial configuration. When I added it, the cell
      seems
      > a little less stable. Also, I originally wanted to stay with
      a
      Bill
      > Williams style cell with a flat top.
      > >
      > > Yes, all tubes need to be the same length. It seems to be a
      good
      > match to the wally canister.
      > >
      > > There will
      probably be a whole new document detailing the
      length
      > information,
      when we've done more testing to be comfortable with
      it.
      > >
      > > The spacing on the cell is to big for water prepping, you
      should
      > make a small electrolysis cell for that. Use SS wire to
      connect
      > power to the end plates of that cell. You don't want to use a
      > tubular electrolysis cell - stick with flat plates.
      > >
      > > Bernie
      > > ----- Original Message -----
      > >
      From: sco0212
      > > To: joecellfreeenergydevice@yahoogroups.com
      > > Sent: Sunday, March 02, 2008 12:19 PM
      > > Subject: [Joe Cell Free
      Energy Device] Re: Un canny
      resemblance
      > to the JC
      > >
      > >
      > > Bernie,
      > >
      > > Thanks
      again.
      > >
      > > I am discussing with Dan Voss about making me
      the Gold 2x
      length
      > > pipes set. I have asked to get the 1", 2",
      3" and 4" diameter
      > pipes.
      > > He said the custom cut will
      cost more but the cost may be a
      > little
      > > less if the order
      qty is more. I guess once I get the price,
      > I'll
      > > let
      everyone know. Maybe, many of us can order to get a better
      > > price.
      > >
      > > I need to confirm, should all pipes be 316L SS pipes
      and have
      > the
      > > same exact length which in this case is
      3.795"?
      > >
      > > I have read the document file, "Assembling
      and Charging a Joe
      > Cell".
      > > Will this document be updated
      with the new lengths (gold or
      > blue)?
      > >
      > > Can I
      use the same joe cell (gold 2x length) for water
      charging?
      > Or
      > > should I make one SS flat plate electrode (should this be 316L
      > SS?).
      > > I believe this is the B-Charging.
      > >
      > > BTW, do you think using the h2extreme 6 series SS elctrode is
      > good
      > > for water charging or better make my own? If I have
      to make my
      > own,
      > > do you have a more detail on how this can
      be done. Based on
      the
      > > doucment, I can use 4 to 6 SS wall
      switch cover and nylon bolt
      > to
      > > hold these and nylon nuts
      to space the plate. how do I connect
      > the
      > > wire? which one
      goes to positive and negative?
      > >
      > > On the power supply
      section, what is FWBR? What voltage and
      > current
      > > is
      required or best for water charging?
      > >
      > > How often is SS
      passivation needed?
      > >
      > > Looking to hear back from
      you.
      > >
      > > Sonny
      > >
      > > --- In
      joecellfreeenergydevice@yahoogroups.com, "Bernie"
      > >
      <bernieheere@> wrote:
      > > >
      > > >
      > > > ----- Original Message -----
      > > > From: sco0212
      > > > To: joecellfreeenergydevice@yahoogroups.com
      > > > Sent:
      Friday, February 29, 2008 9:05 PM
      > > > Subject: [Joe Cell Free
      Energy Device] Re: Un canny
      > resemblance to
      > > the JC
      > > >
      > > >
      > > > Thanks to all who
      responded.
      > > >
      > > > Bernie,
      > > >
      > > > Thanks. Based on what you suggested, I think I will try the
      > Gold
      > > 2x
      > > > since the 5" cannister is
      readily available from Wal-mart.
      So,
      > > will
      > > >
      the tubes be .5" from the bottom of the cannister using the
      > same
      > > > spacer material (like ebonite or other suggestion?) used
      > between
      > > the
      > > > tubes?
      > > >
      > > > I use nylon bushings (spacers) in .5"OD that are sold at
      most
      > > hardware store. They come in 1" lengths, so cut them in
      half
      for
      > > normal spacers, and leave them full length on the
      bottom
      between
      > the
      > > 3" and 4" tubes for legs with .5"
      protruding.
      > > >
      > > > BTW, doesn't the cannister
      comes with flat cover? Will this
      > cover
      > > > work or do I
      need to find a cone top and in some kind of
      > material?
      > > >
      > > > It comes with a glass dome type cover with a removeable
      knob.
      > One
      > > option for a top is a 5" round disc, that
      can slide down onto
      > the
      > > ridge inside the container and
      seal with sikaflex. Or simply
      use
      > the
      > > glass top and
      bring the - lead out through the hole in it and
      > > through plastic
      tubing to the block.
      > > >
      > > > Without the bottom
      bolt setup, so do we charge the cell from
      > the
      > > top
      > > > (negative on the cathode (2" tube) and positive on container
      > which
      > > > in this case is the cannister)?
      > > >
      > > > Run an SS wire down through the center tube and bend it
      at
      the
      > > bottom over to the outside of the center tube and up a
      bit.
      > Press it
      > > against the tube with a wedge of nylon or a
      spacer. Put shrink
      > > sleeveing over the wire at least where it's in
      the water.
      > > >
      > > > In terms of the water. Do you
      think adding baking soda (I
      read
      > > from
      > > >
      somewhere) to real distilled water (those used in car
      battery)
      > >
      will
      > > > help?
      > > >
      > > > I think
      you'll be happier using spring water rather than
      > distilled
      > > water, and don't add anything to it!
      > > >
      > > >
      > > > BTW, Does the B-charging Adrian is referring to is the pulse
      > > > charging? If so, looks like it will not do what we want if
      it
      > > > doesn't make it to spin to stage 3.
      > > >
      > > > The B-charger is a simple flat plate electrolysis cell. It
      can
      > be
      > > made cheaply using the SS switch plate covers
      sold in the
      major
      > home
      > > improvement stores, and some
      nylon bolts, nuts and washers.
      > Plate
      > > spacing should be
      around 1/8".
      > > >
      > > > You mentioned that you do
      straight (regular) charging and
      with
      > > that
      > > >
      do you get the same unpleasant thing Adrian is mentioning?
      > > >
      > > > Not sure what unpleasant thing you mean. After the water is
      > > prepped and put in the cell, stage 3 occurs in minutes, after
      > the
      > > power is applied.
      > > >
      > > >
      > > > Under what product do I search for to find Dan Voss in
      Ebay?
      I
      > > can't
      > > > seem to find his product. I
      would like to contact him to see
      > if he
      > > > can cut to
      the gold 2x length the tube set he sells. If
      > there's
      > > >
      enough people willing to order this length maybe he might do
      > it
      for
      > > > us (I hope).
      > > >
      > > > Just
      search for "Joe Cell"
      > > >
      > > > Have you read the
      document in the files section "Assembling
      > and
      > > Charging a
      Joe Cell"? It covers most of this, as well as
      > > passivation, which
      you'll need to do as well.
      > > >
      > > > Bernie
      > > >
      > > >
      > > >
      > > > Sonny
      > > >
      > > > --- In
      joecellfreeenergydevice@yahoogroups.com, "Bernie"
      > > >
      <bernieheere@> wrote:
      > > > >
      > > > >
      Actually, it does energize the water, but does not have
      the
      > > > geometry to spin it up to stage 3. It takes the cell
      geometry
      >
      and
      > > > some current voltage to direct the energy to do what we
      want.
      > > > >
      > > > > Bernie
      > > > >
      > > > > ----- Original Message -----
      > > > > From: Adrian
      > > > > To:
      joecellfreeenergydevice@yahoogroups.com
      > > > > Sent: Thursday,
      February 28, 2008 1:27 AM
      > > > > Subject: [Joe Cell Free Energy
      Device] Re: Un canny
      > resemblance
      > > > to the JC
      > > > >
      > > > >
      > > > > Sonny, I don't
      know if Bernie would agree with this but I
      > think
      > > >
      that,
      > > > > in addition to the cleaning, the B-charging adds
      somehting
      > else
      > > > to
      > > > > the water.
      It adds a bit of chrome, but that is not what I
      > am
      > > >
      getting
      > > > > at - there is something else. When you have
      charged the
      > water it
      > > > > feels different; it has a
      silky feel to it that is not
      > pleasant,
      > > > to
      > > > > me, but which seems to help it go in the cell. When you
      dump
      > in
      > > > a
      > > > > load of B-charged water
      you have thr sense that it is a
      > little
      > > > bit
      > > > > away from going S3, and then in the cell it does -
      usually -
      > > > > sometimes it doesn't, just to wind you up.
      > > > >
      > > > > Regards
      > > > >
      > > > > Adrian
      > > > > --- In
      joecellfreeenergydevice@yahoogroups.com,
      pjstockemer@
      > > >
      wrote:
      > > > > >
      > > > > >
      > > > > > Sonny, Bernie,
      > > > > > I go along with
      Sonny's idea and would be another
      > potential
      > > > >
      customer.
      > > > > > From Texas,
      > > > > >
      PJS
      > > > > >
      > > > > > Bernie,
      > > > > >
      > > > > > Sorry I am not nearby Oregon. I
      am in NY. So, I guess
      all
      > I
      > > > can do
      > > > > > for now is to build one as per your specified lengths.
      Do
      > you
      > > > mind
      > > > > > telling me
      again the lengths of those tubes and what
      > diameter.
      > > > > Also,
      > > > > > should I make one with the inner most
      tube (negative)
      with
      > the
      > > > > > flange ring
      and screw welded just like the one Peter has
      > in
      > > > one
      of
      > > > > > his videos? Basically the whole cell including
      the
      > container?
      > > > > >
      > > > > >
      Another thing, since I don't have a tool/machine shop,
      > instead
      > > > of
      > > > > > having me have to purchase the 316L SS
      tubes and go to a
      > > > machine
      > > > > > shop
      to have the tubes cut, weld, heat treated, etc, Is
      > there
      > > > > anyway
      > > > > > I can buy those heat treated tubes
      pre-cut and welded?
      Can
      > > > anyone
      > > > > in
      > > > > > this group be able to do this and sell to us
      members?
      > > > > >
      > > > > > I am willing
      to do the tests and provide feedback on the
      > test.
      > > > I
      > > > > can
      > > > > > do the pulse charging
      test as well as long as I know
      what
      > I
      > > > need
      > > > > to
      > > > > > get and do.
      > > > > >
      > > > > > BTW, I am just curious, why
      don't you use distilled
      water
      > > > (should
      > > > > be
      > > > > > free from impurities) instead of unprep
      water?
      > > > > >
      > > > > > Thanks,
      > > > > > Sonny
      > > > > >
      > > > >
      > > >
      > >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
      >
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      -----------
      >
      >
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      > Checked by
      AVG Free Edition.
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      >


    • Bernie
      Sonny, The variac needs to be able to handle 2 amps or more. The FWBR should be rated at 400V, 4Amps. The resistor connects to the FWBR + terminal. The other
      Message 32 of 32 , Mar 7, 2008
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        Sonny,
         
        The variac needs to be able to handle 2 amps or more. The FWBR should be rated at 400V, 4Amps.
         
        The resistor connects to the FWBR + terminal. The other end connects to the Cap + and the other end of the cap goes to the FWBR - terminal. The cell is than connected in parallel with the Cap.
         
        Bernie
        ----- Original Message -----
        From: sco0212
        Sent: Friday, March 07, 2008 8:36 PM
        Subject: [Joe Cell Free Energy Device] Re: Un canny resemblance to the JC

        Bernie,

        I want to get the parts to build the power supply. What variac and
        FWBR size do I need (V and amp)? In the assembling document file,
        you mentioned adding a 1 ohm 10 watt resistor after the FWBR and a
        100uF capacitor to provide some ripple filtering. Do you have the
        circuit diagram that shows all these?

        Thanks,
        Sonny

        --- In joecellfreeenergyde vice@yahoogroups .com, "Bernie"
        <bernieheere@ ...> wrote:
        >
        > Sonny,
        >
        > It doesn't really matter how many plates you use. All you're doing
        is producing some pure oxygen which will oxidize the iron and other
        imputities in the water, so they can be filtered off. So any set of
        plates will work for this. The same for the power connection. I just
        connect to the end plates. Keeps it simple!
        >
        > You won't get much electrolysis with only 12 volts, as there's no
        real electrolyte involved in JC work. You really need to get up over
        100 volts to do this and to use with the cell. A simple full wave
        bridge rectifier across the power line works fine. A variac with the
        FWBR is better as it allows you to control the amount of current by
        adjusting the voltage. I like to work with about 1 amp in both
        cells, but it's not critical. With less current things just take a
        little longer to happen. With more current, you have to be careful
        about water heating. The 1 amp is just a good compromise.
        >
        > Be careful around the higher voltages - they can bite!
        >
        > Bernie
        >
        > ----- Original Message -----
        > From: sco0212
        > To: joecellfreeenergyde vice@yahoogroups .com
        > Sent: Wednesday, March 05, 2008 7:19 PM
        > Subject: [Joe Cell Free Energy Device] Re: Un canny resemblance
        to the JC
        >
        >
        > Bernie,
        >
        > I read from a number of sites on making flat SS plate cell to do
        > electrolysis or basically creating HHO.
        >
        > I am getting confused about where to put the positive and
        negative
        > to power this. I want to make sure I am doing this right.
        >
        > Can you please tell me which one is a good setup.
        > I will use nylon bolt/nut and washers to hold these plates.
        >
        > 1. 7 plates - N N + N N -
        > With this, I connect the 2 both end plates to negative and the
        > middle plate on to positive. I read that the more neutral plate
        (N)
        > the less voltage and heat it produce and prevent sludge on the
        > electrodes.
        >
        > 2. 6 plates - N N N N +
        > Is this the setup your saying connect power to end plates?
        >
        > For water prep, do we care how much and fast the production of
        hho
        > or electrolysis?
        >
        > BTW, is a regular 12V battery charger good enough for water
        charging
        > and to charge the Joe cell?
        >
        > Thanks,
        > Sonny
        >
        > --- In joecellfreeenergyde vice@yahoogroups .com, "Bernie"
        > <bernieheere@ > wrote:
        > >
        > >
        > > ----- Original Message -----
        > > From: sco0212
        > > To: joecellfreeenergyde vice@yahoogroups .com
        > > Sent: Tuesday, March 04, 2008 4:07 AM
        > > Subject: [Joe Cell Free Energy Device] Re: Un canny
        resemblance to
        > the JC
        > >
        > >
        > > Bernie,
        > >
        > > Hi. If I use a 316L SS plate, do I still have to passivate it?
        > > My feeling of your answer is probably yes. If so, how often do
        I
        > > need to do the passivation? Should I do the passivation before
        I
        > > assembled it together with the nylon bolt/nut/washer?
        > >
        > > Either way will work. The passivation builds up over time, so
        > typicly when we think it's breaking down we wind up redoing it,
        and
        > each time it gets better.
        > >
        > > Also, should the plate be flat all over? The 1 gang swith
        plate is
        > > not totally flat. There's a little bent on the sides. Is the
        > > distance of 1/8" to 1/4" based on the outside or the middle if
        the
        > > plate is not flat? I saw some type of swith plate that are
        totally
        > > flat but there seems to be a big hole in the center. Anyway,
        let
        > me
        > > hear your answer before I decide which ones I will get.
        > >
        > > The plates are fine. I just don't think we should use a
        tubular
        > electrolysis cell for this, as we don't want to introduce spin
        into
        > the water until we put it in the actual cell. It would introduce
        an
        > uncertainty in the process. I've found that it's difficult to
        > reverse the spin once it's introduced. (The spin is at the
        molecular
        > level and not necessarily visible)
        > >
        > > Bernie
        > >
        > > Thanks,
        > > Sonny
        > >
        > > --- In joecellfreeenergyde vice@yahoogroups .com, "Bernie"
        > > <bernieheere@ > wrote:
        > > >
        > > > 302 should be fine. It does need top be passivated though!
        > > >
        > > > Benrie
        > > > ----- Original Message -----
        > > > From: sco0212
        > > > To: joecellfreeenergyde vice@yahoogroups .com
        > > > Sent: Monday, March 03, 2008 6:48 PM
        > > > Subject: [Joe Cell Free Energy Device] Re: Un canny
        resemblance
        > > to the JC
        > > >
        > > >
        > > > Bernie,
        > > >
        > > > Thanks for mentioning your experience with the 1" pipe. I
        > > beleive I
        > > > read it somewhere also to start with 2" dia. for the center
        pipe.
        > > >
        > > > I want to start with the flat plate while waiting for the
        tubes
        > > for
        > > > the cell. The SS switch plate cover I have seen such as the
        1
        > > gang
        > > > switch are 302 SS. Do I need 316L SS plate or 302 SS plate
        will
        > > be
        > > > fine?
        > > >
        > > > Sonny
        > > >
        > > > --- In joecellfreeenergyde vice@yahoogroups .com, "Bernie"
        > > > <bernieheere@ > wrote:
        > > > >
        > > > > Sonny,
        > > > >
        > > > > I have mixed emotions about whether to bother with the 1"
        pipe
        > > or
        > > > not. The cell that I'm playing with seemd to be better
        without
        > > it,
        > > > which was the initial configuration. When I added it, the
        cell
        > > seems
        > > > a little less stable. Also, I originally wanted to stay with
        a
        > > Bill
        > > > Williams style cell with a flat top.
        > > > >
        > > > > Yes, all tubes need to be the same length. It seems to be
        a
        > > good
        > > > match to the wally canister.
        > > > >
        > > > > There will probably be a whole new document detailing the
        > > length
        > > > information, when we've done more testing to be comfortable
        with
        > > it.
        > > > >
        > > > > The spacing on the cell is to big for water prepping, you
        > > should
        > > > make a small electrolysis cell for that. Use SS wire to
        connect
        > > > power to the end plates of that cell. You don't want to use
        a
        > > > tubular electrolysis cell - stick with flat plates.
        > > > >
        > > > > Bernie
        > > > > ----- Original Message -----
        > > > > From: sco0212
        > > > > To: joecellfreeenergyde vice@yahoogroups .com
        > > > > Sent: Sunday, March 02, 2008 12:19 PM
        > > > > Subject: [Joe Cell Free Energy Device] Re: Un canny
        > > resemblance
        > > > to the JC
        > > > >
        > > > >
        > > > > Bernie,
        > > > >
        > > > > Thanks again.
        > > > >
        > > > > I am discussing with Dan Voss about making me the Gold 2x
        > > length
        > > > > pipes set. I have asked to get the 1", 2", 3" and 4"
        diameter
        > > > pipes.
        > > > > He said the custom cut will cost more but the cost may be
        a
        > > > little
        > > > > less if the order qty is more. I guess once I get the
        price,
        > > > I'll
        > > > > let everyone know. Maybe, many of us can order to get a
        better
        > > > > price.
        > > > >
        > > > > I need to confirm, should all pipes be 316L SS pipes and
        have
        > > > the
        > > > > same exact length which in this case is 3.795"?
        > > > >
        > > > > I have read the document file, "Assembling and Charging a
        Joe
        > > > Cell".
        > > > > Will this document be updated with the new lengths (gold
        or
        > > > blue)?
        > > > >
        > > > > Can I use the same joe cell (gold 2x length) for water
        > > charging?
        > > > Or
        > > > > should I make one SS flat plate electrode (should this be
        316L
        > > > SS?).
        > > > > I believe this is the B-Charging.
        > > > >
        > > > > BTW, do you think using the h2extreme 6 series SS elctrode
        is
        > > > good
        > > > > for water charging or better make my own? If I have to
        make my
        > > > own,
        > > > > do you have a more detail on how this can be done. Based
        on
        > > the
        > > > > doucment, I can use 4 to 6 SS wall switch cover and nylon
        bolt
        > > > to
        > > > > hold these and nylon nuts to space the plate. how do I
        connect
        > > > the
        > > > > wire? which one goes to positive and negative?
        > > > >
        > > > > On the power supply section, what is FWBR? What voltage
        and
        > > > current
        > > > > is required or best for water charging?
        > > > >
        > > > > How often is SS passivation needed?
        > > > >
        > > > > Looking to hear back from you.
        > > > >
        > > > > Sonny
        > > > >
        > > > > --- In joecellfreeenergyde vice@yahoogroups .com, "Bernie"
        > > > > <bernieheere@ > wrote:
        > > > > >
        > > > > >
        > > > > > ----- Original Message -----
        > > > > > From: sco0212
        > > > > > To: joecellfreeenergyde vice@yahoogroups .com
        > > > > > Sent: Friday, February 29, 2008 9:05 PM
        > > > > > Subject: [Joe Cell Free Energy Device] Re: Un canny
        > > > resemblance to
        > > > > the JC
        > > > > >
        > > > > >
        > > > > > Thanks to all who responded.
        > > > > >
        > > > > > Bernie,
        > > > > >
        > > > > > Thanks. Based on what you suggested, I think I will try
        the
        > > > Gold
        > > > > 2x
        > > > > > since the 5" cannister is readily available from Wal-
        mart.
        > > So,
        > > > > will
        > > > > > the tubes be .5" from the bottom of the cannister using
        the
        > > > same
        > > > > > spacer material (like ebonite or other suggestion?) used
        > > > between
        > > > > the
        > > > > > tubes?
        > > > > >
        > > > > > I use nylon bushings (spacers) in .5"OD that are sold at
        > > most
        > > > > hardware store. They come in 1" lengths, so cut them in
        half
        > > for
        > > > > normal spacers, and leave them full length on the bottom
        > > between
        > > > the
        > > > > 3" and 4" tubes for legs with .5" protruding.
        > > > > >
        > > > > > BTW, doesn't the cannister comes with flat cover? Will
        this
        > > > cover
        > > > > > work or do I need to find a cone top and in some kind of
        > > > material?
        > > > > >
        > > > > > It comes with a glass dome type cover with a removeable
        > > knob.
        > > > One
        > > > > option for a top is a 5" round disc, that can slide down
        onto
        > > > the
        > > > > ridge inside the container and seal with sikaflex. Or
        simply
        > > use
        > > > the
        > > > > glass top and bring the - lead out through the hole in it
        and
        > > > > through plastic tubing to the block.
        > > > > >
        > > > > > Without the bottom bolt setup, so do we charge the cell
        from
        > > > the
        > > > > top
        > > > > > (negative on the cathode (2" tube) and positive on
        container
        > > > which
        > > > > > in this case is the cannister)?
        > > > > >
        > > > > > Run an SS wire down through the center tube and bend it
        at
        > > the
        > > > > bottom over to the outside of the center tube and up a
        bit.
        > > > Press it
        > > > > against the tube with a wedge of nylon or a spacer. Put
        shrink
        > > > > sleeveing over the wire at least where it's in the water.
        > > > > >
        > > > > > In terms of the water. Do you think adding baking soda
        (I
        > > read
        > > > > from
        > > > > > somewhere) to real distilled water (those used in car
        > > battery)
        > > > > will
        > > > > > help?
        > > > > >
        > > > > > I think you'll be happier using spring water rather than
        > > > distilled
        > > > > water, and don't add anything to it!
        > > > > >
        > > > > >
        > > > > > BTW, Does the B-charging Adrian is referring to is the
        pulse
        > > > > > charging? If so, looks like it will not do what we want
        if
        > > it
        > > > > > doesn't make it to spin to stage 3.
        > > > > >
        > > > > > The B-charger is a simple flat plate electrolysis cell.
        It
        > > can
        > > > be
        > > > > made cheaply using the SS switch plate covers sold in the
        > > major
        > > > home
        > > > > improvement stores, and some nylon bolts, nuts and
        washers.
        > > > Plate
        > > > > spacing should be around 1/8".
        > > > > >
        > > > > > You mentioned that you do straight (regular) charging
        and
        > > with
        > > > > that
        > > > > > do you get the same unpleasant thing Adrian is
        mentioning?
        > > > > >
        > > > > > Not sure what unpleasant thing you mean. After the water
        is
        > > > > prepped and put in the cell, stage 3 occurs in minutes,
        after
        > > > the
        > > > > power is applied.
        > > > > >
        > > > > >
        > > > > > Under what product do I search for to find Dan Voss in
        Ebay?
        > > I
        > > > > can't
        > > > > > seem to find his product. I would like to contact him to
        see
        > > > if he
        > > > > > can cut to the gold 2x length the tube set he sells. If
        > > > there's
        > > > > > enough people willing to order this length maybe he
        might do
        > > > it for
        > > > > > us (I hope).
        > > > > >
        > > > > > Just search for "Joe Cell"
        > > > > >
        > > > > > Have you read the document in the files
        section "Assembling
        > > > and
        > > > > Charging a Joe Cell"? It covers most of this, as well as
        > > > > passivation, which you'll need to do as well.
        > > > > >
        > > > > > Bernie
        > > > > >
        > > > > >
        > > > > >
        > > > > > Sonny
        > > > > >
        > > > > > --- In joecellfreeenergyde vice@yahoogroups .com, "Bernie"
        > > > > > <bernieheere@ > wrote:
        > > > > > >
        > > > > > > Actually, it does energize the water, but does not
        have
        > > the
        > > > > > geometry to spin it up to stage 3. It takes the cell
        > > geometry
        > > > and
        > > > > > some current voltage to direct the energy to do what we
        want.
        > > > > > >
        > > > > > > Bernie
        > > > > > >
        > > > > > > ----- Original Message -----
        > > > > > > From: Adrian
        > > > > > > To: joecellfreeenergyde vice@yahoogroups .com
        > > > > > > Sent: Thursday, February 28, 2008 1:27 AM
        > > > > > > Subject: [Joe Cell Free Energy Device] Re: Un canny
        > > > resemblance
        > > > > > to the JC
        > > > > > >
        > > > > > >
        > > > > > > Sonny, I don't know if Bernie would agree with this
        but I
        > > > think
        > > > > > that,
        > > > > > > in addition to the cleaning, the B-charging adds
        somehting
        > > > else
        > > > > > to
        > > > > > > the water. It adds a bit of chrome, but that is not
        what I
        > > > am
        > > > > > getting
        > > > > > > at - there is something else. When you have charged
        the
        > > > water it
        > > > > > > feels different; it has a silky feel to it that is not
        > > > pleasant,
        > > > > > to
        > > > > > > me, but which seems to help it go in the cell. When
        you
        > > dump
        > > > in
        > > > > > a
        > > > > > > load of B-charged water you have thr sense that it is
        a
        > > > little
        > > > > > bit
        > > > > > > away from going S3, and then in the cell it does -
        > > usually -
        > > > > > > sometimes it doesn't, just to wind you up.
        > > > > > >
        > > > > > > Regards
        > > > > > >
        > > > > > > Adrian
        > > > > > > --- In joecellfreeenergyde vice@yahoogroups .com,
        > > pjstockemer@
        > > > > > wrote:
        > > > > > > >
        > > > > > > >
        > > > > > > > Sonny, Bernie,
        > > > > > > > I go along with Sonny's idea and would be another
        > > > potential
        > > > > > > customer.
        > > > > > > > From Texas,
        > > > > > > > PJS
        > > > > > > >
        > > > > > > > Bernie,
        > > > > > > >
        > > > > > > > Sorry I am not nearby Oregon. I am in NY. So, I
        guess
        > > all
        > > > I
        > > > > > can do
        > > > > > > > for now is to build one as per your specified
        lengths.
        > > Do
        > > > you
        > > > > > mind
        > > > > > > > telling me again the lengths of those tubes and what
        > > > diameter.
        > > > > > > Also,
        > > > > > > > should I make one with the inner most tube
        (negative)
        > > with
        > > > the
        > > > > > > > flange ring and screw welded just like the one Peter
        has
        > > > in
        > > > > > one of
        > > > > > > > his videos? Basically the whole cell including the
        > > > container?
        > > > > > > >
        > > > > > > > Another thing, since I don't have a tool/machine
        shop,
        > > > instead
        > > > > > of
        > > > > > > > having me have to purchase the 316L SS tubes and go
        to a
        > > > > > machine
        > > > > > > > shop to have the tubes cut, weld, heat treated, etc,
        Is
        > > > there
        > > > > > > anyway
        > > > > > > > I can buy those heat treated tubes pre-cut and
        welded?
        > > Can
        > > > > > anyone
        > > > > > > in
        > > > > > > > this group be able to do this and sell to us members?
        > > > > > > >
        > > > > > > > I am willing to do the tests and provide feedback on
        the
        > > > test.
        > > > > > I
        > > > > > > can
        > > > > > > > do the pulse charging test as well as long as I know
        > > what
        > > > I
        > > > > > need
        > > > > > > to
        > > > > > > > get and do.
        > > > > > > >
        > > > > > > > BTW, I am just curious, why don't you use distilled
        > > water
        > > > > > (should
        > > > > > > be
        > > > > > > > free from impurities) instead of unprep water?
        > > > > > > >
        > > > > > > > Thanks,
        > > > > > > > Sonny
        > > > > > > >
        > > > > > >
        > > > > >
        > > > >
        > > >
        > > >
        > > >
        > > >
        > > >
        > > >
        > > > ------------ --------- --------- --------- --------- --------- -
        > > -----------
        > > >
        > > >
        > > > No virus found in this incoming message.
        > > > Checked by AVG Free Edition.
        > > > Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.21.3/1308 - Release
        Date:
        > > 3/3/2008 10:01 AM
        > > >
        > >
        >

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