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Re: [jasspa] me -n ?

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  • Meino Christian Cramer
    From: Thomas Hundt Subject: Re: [jasspa] me -n ? Date: Sat, 12 Nov 2005 00:11:25 -0800 Just to clearify... Your suggested C-h k command
    Message 1 of 10 , Nov 12, 2005
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      From: Thomas Hundt <thundt@...>
      Subject: Re: [jasspa] me -n ?
      Date: Sat, 12 Nov 2005 00:11:25 -0800

      Just to clearify...

      Your suggested "C-h k" command does nothing at least with my ME
      started as "me -n".

      And for me as a non-native English speaker (as you have already
      noticed, while correcting my English and my helpless attempts to be a
      little humorous by comparing the ME macro files with "firmware") it
      is not that simple to find words matching technical problems I have
      with this or that. That's why I had hoped to meet people here with
      more feel for language than a simple search engine.

      If I would know the answer, I would not ask.

      But your knowledge of links is impressive!

      It does not disturb me, that you're handling me like a computer kid, but
      the IQ you conced to me is a shame.

      Have a nicer weekend!
      Kind regards,
      Meino






      > You say the query-replace-string is "heavy". ("Schwer"? You mean
      > "difficult". See http://dict.leo.org/ )
      >
      > I don't see what the problem is. Are you aware of the '!' key which
      > means "replace all the rest of them"? It is documented. If you want an
      > industrial-strength solution, I'd recommend Perl.
      >
      > "Official version" = currently released version. I.e., you have the
      > correct code. There is no other I'm aware of.
      >
      > I don't think you know what firmware is.
      > http://www.google.com/search?q=define%3A+firmware

      > You are doing a C-h k to find out what ME is seeing the key as, right?
      >
      > And you've done a search for likely keywords like "keysym" and
      > "mapping" and "map" in the ME yahoo group archive, right?
      >
      > -Th
      >
      >
      > Meino Christian Cramer wrote:
      > > Hi,
      > >
      > > Sometimes I like to use "me -n" instead of "me". Unfortunately some
      > > keys behaves oddly like "Del", "Home", "End" and such. Instead of
      > > moving around in the text they do insert a control-character into the
      > > sourcecode I am writing.
      > >
      > > TERM is set to "xterm".
      > >
      > > I fear, when tweaking any setting and "me -n" will run, I will
      > > confuse the "pure me" instead.
      > >
      > > What can I do to circumvent the problem ?
      > >
      > > Does "me -n" behaves ok when using together with "screen" ?
      > >
      > > Keep microemacsing!
      > > Meino
      >
      >
      >
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    • Jon Green
      ... What is C-h in a termcap terminal? It happens to be BACKSPACE . So there is no such key visible to ME in this environment so the binding will never work.
      Message 2 of 10 , Nov 12, 2005
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        Meino Christian Cramer wrote:
        > From: Thomas Hundt <thundt@...>
        > Subject: Re: [jasspa] me -n ?
        > Date: Sat, 12 Nov 2005 00:11:25 -0800
        >
        > Just to clearify...
        >
        > Your suggested "C-h k" command does nothing at least with my ME
        > started as "me -n".
        >

        What is C-h in a termcap terminal?
        It happens to be "BACKSPACE".

        So there is no such key visible to ME in this environment so the binding
        will never work. termcap honours the keys that it can, there are some
        that you just cannot do and have to use the "M-x name" combination.

        Jon.
      • Meino Christian Cramer
        From: Jon Green Subject: Re: [jasspa] me -n ? Date: Sat, 12 Nov 2005 20:16:56 +0000 Hi, I did a describe-key in a me -n started ME and
        Message 3 of 10 , Nov 12, 2005
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          From: Jon Green <jon@...>
          Subject: Re: [jasspa] me -n ?
          Date: Sat, 12 Nov 2005 20:16:56 +0000

          Hi,

          I did a describe-key in a "me -n" started ME and pressed
          "HOME".

          The minibuffer does show nothing special ( a "normally" started ME
          shows '"home" beginning-of-buffer instead ) and I got a "1~" into
          the (main) buffer as mentioned in my first mail.

          Kind regards,
          Meino

          > Meino Christian Cramer wrote:
          > > From: Thomas Hundt <thundt@...>
          > > Subject: Re: [jasspa] me -n ?
          > > Date: Sat, 12 Nov 2005 00:11:25 -0800
          > >
          > > Just to clearify...
          > >
          > > Your suggested "C-h k" command does nothing at least with my ME
          > > started as "me -n".
          > >
          >
          > What is C-h in a termcap terminal?
          > It happens to be "BACKSPACE".
          >
          > So there is no such key visible to ME in this environment so the binding
          > will never work. termcap honours the keys that it can, there are some
          > that you just cannot do and have to use the "M-x name" combination.
          >
          > Jon.
          >
          >
          >
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          >
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        • Thomas Hundt
          See if any of these help or give you ideas. (Code from my company file.) I use various different xterms, ssh clients (e.g., putty), etc. and the kinds of
          Message 4 of 10 , Nov 12, 2005
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            See if any of these help or give you ideas. (Code from my company
            file.) I use various different xterms, ssh clients (e.g., putty), etc.
            and the kinds of problems you are having are not unusual.


            ; fix Backspace using Putty
            -1 translate-key "C-h" ; remove translation to "backspace"
            translate-key "\x7F" "backspace" ; Backspace key

            ; fix del, home keys termcap/Putty/Solaris ME20040403
            translate-key "C-[ [ 3 ~" "delete" ; ^[[3~ ('cat' output)
            translate-key "C-[ [ 1 ~" "home" ; ^[[1~

            ; add support for termcap/Putty/Solaris
            translate-key "C-[ O A" "C-up" ; ctrl up ^[OA
            translate-key "C-[ O B" "C-down" ; ctrl down ^[OB
            translate-key "C-[ O D" "C-left" ; ctrl left ^[OD
            translate-key "C-[ O C" "C-right" ; ctrl right ^[OC




            Meino Christian Cramer wrote:
            > From: Jon Green <jon@...>
            > Subject: Re: [jasspa] me -n ?
            > Date: Sat, 12 Nov 2005 20:16:56 +0000
            >
            > Hi,
            >
            > I did a describe-key in a "me -n" started ME and pressed
            > "HOME".
            >
            > The minibuffer does show nothing special ( a "normally" started ME
            > shows '"home" beginning-of-buffer instead ) and I got a "1~" into
            > the (main) buffer as mentioned in my first mail.
            >
            > Kind regards,
            > Meino
            >
            >> Meino Christian Cramer wrote:
            >>> From: Thomas Hundt <thundt@...>
            >>> Subject: Re: [jasspa] me -n ?
            >>> Date: Sat, 12 Nov 2005 00:11:25 -0800
            >>>
            >>> Just to clearify...
            >>>
            >>> Your suggested "C-h k" command does nothing at least with my ME
            >>> started as "me -n".
            >>>
            >> What is C-h in a termcap terminal?
            >> It happens to be "BACKSPACE".
            >>
            >> So there is no such key visible to ME in this environment so the binding
            >> will never work. termcap honours the keys that it can, there are some
            >> that you just cannot do and have to use the "M-x name" combination.
            >>
            >> Jon.
            >>
          • Meino Christian Cramer
            From: Thomas Hundt Subject: Re: [jasspa] me -n ? Date: Sat, 12 Nov 2005 21:29:03 -0800 Yes, one of those lines have fixed my problems with
            Message 5 of 10 , Nov 12, 2005
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              From: Thomas Hundt <thundt@...>
              Subject: Re: [jasspa] me -n ?
              Date: Sat, 12 Nov 2005 21:29:03 -0800

              Yes, one of those lines have fixed my problems with the HOME key (and
              others). There is only one thing remaining: How cxan I identify the
              lines from below, which I really need? I dont want to add things,
              which may lead to confusion in the near future...

              Is the assumption correct, that any line, which translate-key a key, which
              works right now and is listed below as the second argument to
              "translate-key" is needed? Or are there any "side effects" or
              assembled key sequences?

              > See if any of these help or give you ideas. (Code from my company
              > file.) I use various different xterms, ssh clients (e.g., putty), etc.
              > and the kinds of problems you are having are not unusual.
              >
              >
              > ; fix Backspace using Putty
              > -1 translate-key "C-h" ; remove translation to "backspace"
              > translate-key "\x7F" "backspace" ; Backspace key
              >
              > ; fix del, home keys termcap/Putty/Solaris ME20040403
              > translate-key "C-[ [ 3 ~" "delete" ; ^[[3~ ('cat' output)
              > translate-key "C-[ [ 1 ~" "home" ; ^[[1~
              >
              > ; add support for termcap/Putty/Solaris
              > translate-key "C-[ O A" "C-up" ; ctrl up ^[OA
              > translate-key "C-[ O B" "C-down" ; ctrl down ^[OB
              > translate-key "C-[ O D" "C-left" ; ctrl left ^[OD
              > translate-key "C-[ O C" "C-right" ; ctrl right ^[OC
              >
              >
              >
              >
              > Meino Christian Cramer wrote:
              > > From: Jon Green <jon@...>
              > > Subject: Re: [jasspa] me -n ?
              > > Date: Sat, 12 Nov 2005 20:16:56 +0000
              > >
              > > Hi,
              > >
              > > I did a describe-key in a "me -n" started ME and pressed
              > > "HOME".
              > >
              > > The minibuffer does show nothing special ( a "normally" started ME
              > > shows '"home" beginning-of-buffer instead ) and I got a "1~" into
              > > the (main) buffer as mentioned in my first mail.
              > >
              > > Kind regards,
              > > Meino
              > >
              > >> Meino Christian Cramer wrote:
              > >>> From: Thomas Hundt <thundt@...>
              > >>> Subject: Re: [jasspa] me -n ?
              > >>> Date: Sat, 12 Nov 2005 00:11:25 -0800
              > >>>
              > >>> Just to clearify...
              > >>>
              > >>> Your suggested "C-h k" command does nothing at least with my ME
              > >>> started as "me -n".
              > >>>
              > >> What is C-h in a termcap terminal?
              > >> It happens to be "BACKSPACE".
              > >>
              > >> So there is no such key visible to ME in this environment so the binding
              > >> will never work. termcap honours the keys that it can, there are some
              > >> that you just cannot do and have to use the "M-x name" combination.
              > >>
              > >> Jon.
              > >>
              >
              >
              >
              > __________________________________________________________________________
              >
              > This is an unmoderated list. JASSPA is not responsible for the content of
              > any material posted to this list.
              >
              > To unsubscribe, send a mail message to
              >
              > mailto:jasspa-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
              >
              > or visit http://groups.yahoo.com/group/jasspa and
              > modify your account settings manually.
              >
              >
              >
              > Yahoo! Groups Links
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >
            • Thomas Hundt
              ... Great! Glad to have helped. ... Add them one at a time? ... I suggest you not add anything that you do not understand. Have you read everything in the
              Message 6 of 10 , Nov 13, 2005
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                Meino Christian Cramer wrote:
                > Yes, one of those lines have fixed my problems with the HOME key (and
                > others).

                Great! Glad to have helped.

                > There is only one thing remaining: How can I identify the
                > lines from below, which I really need?

                Add them one at a time?


                > I don't want to add things,
                > which may lead to confusion in the near future...

                I suggest you not add anything that you do not understand.

                Have you read everything in the archive related to this?
                http://groups.yahoo.com/group/jasspa/messagesearch?query=translate-key



                >> See if any of these help or give you ideas. (Code from my company
                >> file.) I use various different xterms, ssh clients (e.g., putty), etc.
                >> and the kinds of problems you are having are not unusual.
                >>
                >>
                >> ; fix Backspace using Putty
                >> -1 translate-key "C-h" ; remove translation to "backspace"
                >> translate-key "\x7F" "backspace" ; Backspace key
                >>
                >> ; fix del, home keys termcap/Putty/Solaris ME20040403
                >> translate-key "C-[ [ 3 ~" "delete" ; ^[[3~ ('cat' output)
                >> translate-key "C-[ [ 1 ~" "home" ; ^[[1~
                >>
                >> ; add support for termcap/Putty/Solaris
                >> translate-key "C-[ O A" "C-up" ; ctrl up ^[OA
                >> translate-key "C-[ O B" "C-down" ; ctrl down ^[OB
                >> translate-key "C-[ O D" "C-left" ; ctrl left ^[OD
                >> translate-key "C-[ O C" "C-right" ; ctrl right ^[OC
                >>
                >>
                >>
                >>
                >> Meino Christian Cramer wrote:
                >>> From: Jon Green <jon@...>
                >>> Subject: Re: [jasspa] me -n ?
                >>> Date: Sat, 12 Nov 2005 20:16:56 +0000
                >>>
                >>> Hi,
                >>>
                >>> I did a describe-key in a "me -n" started ME and pressed
                >>> "HOME".
                >>>
                >>> The minibuffer does show nothing special ( a "normally" started ME
                >>> shows '"home" beginning-of-buffer instead ) and I got a "1~" into
                >>> the (main) buffer as mentioned in my first mail.
                >>>
                >>> Kind regards,
                >>> Meino
                >>>
                >>>> Meino Christian Cramer wrote:
                >>>>> From: Thomas Hundt <thundt@...>
                >>>>> Subject: Re: [jasspa] me -n ?
                >>>>> Date: Sat, 12 Nov 2005 00:11:25 -0800
                >>>>>
                >>>>> Just to clearify...
                >>>>>
                >>>>> Your suggested "C-h k" command does nothing at least with my ME
                >>>>> started as "me -n".
                >>>>>
                >>>> What is C-h in a termcap terminal?
                >>>> It happens to be "BACKSPACE".
                >>>>
                >>>> So there is no such key visible to ME in this environment so the binding
                >>>> will never work. termcap honours the keys that it can, there are some
                >>>> that you just cannot do and have to use the "M-x name" combination.
                >>>>
                >>>> Jon.
                >>
              • Meino Christian Cramer
                From: Thomas Hundt Subject: Re: [jasspa] me -n ? Date: Sun, 13 Nov 2005 09:44:22 -0800 I gave it up... Meino
                Message 7 of 10 , Nov 13, 2005
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                  From: Thomas Hundt <thundt@...>
                  Subject: Re: [jasspa] me -n ?
                  Date: Sun, 13 Nov 2005 09:44:22 -0800

                  I gave it up...

                  Meino


                  >
                  >
                  > Meino Christian Cramer wrote:
                  > > Yes, one of those lines have fixed my problems with the HOME key (and
                  > > others).
                  >
                  > Great! Glad to have helped.
                  >
                  > > There is only one thing remaining: How can I identify the
                  > > lines from below, which I really need?
                  >
                  > Add them one at a time?
                  >
                  >
                  > > I don't want to add things,
                  > > which may lead to confusion in the near future...
                  >
                  > I suggest you not add anything that you do not understand.
                  >
                  > Have you read everything in the archive related to this?
                  > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/jasspa/messagesearch?query=translate-key
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > >> See if any of these help or give you ideas. (Code from my company
                  > >> file.) I use various different xterms, ssh clients (e.g., putty), etc.
                  > >> and the kinds of problems you are having are not unusual.
                  > >>
                  > >>
                  > >> ; fix Backspace using Putty
                  > >> -1 translate-key "C-h" ; remove translation to "backspace"
                  > >> translate-key "\x7F" "backspace" ; Backspace key
                  > >>
                  > >> ; fix del, home keys termcap/Putty/Solaris ME20040403
                  > >> translate-key "C-[ [ 3 ~" "delete" ; ^[[3~ ('cat' output)
                  > >> translate-key "C-[ [ 1 ~" "home" ; ^[[1~
                  > >>
                  > >> ; add support for termcap/Putty/Solaris
                  > >> translate-key "C-[ O A" "C-up" ; ctrl up ^[OA
                  > >> translate-key "C-[ O B" "C-down" ; ctrl down ^[OB
                  > >> translate-key "C-[ O D" "C-left" ; ctrl left ^[OD
                  > >> translate-key "C-[ O C" "C-right" ; ctrl right ^[OC
                  > >>
                  > >>
                  > >>
                  > >>
                  > >> Meino Christian Cramer wrote:
                  > >>> From: Jon Green <jon@...>
                  > >>> Subject: Re: [jasspa] me -n ?
                  > >>> Date: Sat, 12 Nov 2005 20:16:56 +0000
                  > >>>
                  > >>> Hi,
                  > >>>
                  > >>> I did a describe-key in a "me -n" started ME and pressed
                  > >>> "HOME".
                  > >>>
                  > >>> The minibuffer does show nothing special ( a "normally" started ME
                  > >>> shows '"home" beginning-of-buffer instead ) and I got a "1~" into
                  > >>> the (main) buffer as mentioned in my first mail.
                  > >>>
                  > >>> Kind regards,
                  > >>> Meino
                  > >>>
                  > >>>> Meino Christian Cramer wrote:
                  > >>>>> From: Thomas Hundt <thundt@...>
                  > >>>>> Subject: Re: [jasspa] me -n ?
                  > >>>>> Date: Sat, 12 Nov 2005 00:11:25 -0800
                  > >>>>>
                  > >>>>> Just to clearify...
                  > >>>>>
                  > >>>>> Your suggested "C-h k" command does nothing at least with my ME
                  > >>>>> started as "me -n".
                  > >>>>>
                  > >>>> What is C-h in a termcap terminal?
                  > >>>> It happens to be "BACKSPACE".
                  > >>>>
                  > >>>> So there is no such key visible to ME in this environment so the binding
                  > >>>> will never work. termcap honours the keys that it can, there are some
                  > >>>> that you just cannot do and have to use the "M-x name" combination.
                  > >>>>
                  > >>>> Jon.
                  > >>
                  >
                  >
                  >
                  > __________________________________________________________________________
                  >
                  > This is an unmoderated list. JASSPA is not responsible for the content of
                  > any material posted to this list.
                  >
                  > To unsubscribe, send a mail message to
                  >
                  > mailto:jasspa-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                  >
                  > or visit http://groups.yahoo.com/group/jasspa and
                  > modify your account settings manually.
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                  >
                  >
                  > Yahoo! Groups Links
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                • Phillips, Steven
                  The use of C-h k for this type of problem has limited use. The problem is that these keys events send multiple key sequences and unless you have already
                  Message 8 of 10 , Nov 14, 2005
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                    The use of 'C-h k' for this type of problem has limited use. The problem
                    is that these keys events send multiple key sequences and unless you
                    have already setup the translation correctly ME will generate several
                    input key events for that single key press.

                    For example, if the Home key generates "^[ [ 1 ~", without the correct
                    translation this will be broken down to:

                    "esc [" - '^[' is an escape char, this is bound to backward-paragraph
                    "1" - Insert a '1'
                    "~" - Insert a '~'

                    Doing a describe-key before pressing this key would report 'esc-[
                    backward-paragraph' but you would not see this as ME then immediately
                    receives a '1' and '~' key event. ME tends to go ballistic if you press
                    these extended keys without the correct translation because they all
                    tend to start with '^['.

                    So how do you fix this? As already discussed, it is through the use of
                    translate-key, previous posting
                    http://groups.yahoo.com/group/jasspa/message/928 covers most of this.

                    I would however like to add 2 suggestions on how to get the required key
                    translation sequence:

                    1) Run 'sh' (the most basic shell), press the problematic key and then
                    return (enter). As sh does not usually handle these keys either it will
                    usually print something like:

                    ~[[1~: Not found

                    2) A simpler way of using ME's $recent-keys is to run:

                    me -n @a

                    Because 'a.emf' does not exist ME effectively starts up with no
                    configuration, i.e. no translate-key settings that can cause confusion.
                    This is easier that trying to find and comment out all the existing
                    'translate-keys'.

                    Steve



                    > -----Original Message-----
                    > From: jasspa@yahoogroups.com [mailto:jasspa@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf
                    Of
                    > Thomas Hundt
                    > Sent: Saturday, November 12, 2005 8:11 AM
                    > To: jasspa@yahoogroups.com
                    > Subject: Re: [jasspa] me -n ?
                    >
                    > You are doing a C-h k to find out what ME is seeing the key as, right?
                    >
                    > And you've done a search for likely keywords like "keysym" and
                    > "mapping" and "map" in the ME yahoo group archive, right?
                    >
                    > -Th
                    >
                    >
                    > Meino Christian Cramer wrote:
                    > > Hi,
                    > >
                    > > Sometimes I like to use "me -n" instead of "me". Unfortunately some
                    > > keys behaves oddly like "Del", "Home", "End" and such. Instead of
                    > > moving around in the text they do insert a control-character into
                    the
                    > > sourcecode I am writing.
                    > >
                    > > TERM is set to "xterm".
                    > >
                    > > I fear, when tweaking any setting and "me -n" will run, I will
                    > > confuse the "pure me" instead.
                    > >
                    > > What can I do to circumvent the problem ?
                    > >
                    > > Does "me -n" behaves ok when using together with "screen" ?
                    > >
                    > > Keep microemacsing!
                    > > Meino
                    >
                    >
                    > ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
                    >
                    >
                    ________________________________________________________________________
                    __
                    >
                    > This is an unmoderated list. JASSPA is not responsible for the content
                    of
                    > any material posted to this list.
                    >
                    > To unsubscribe, send a mail message to
                    >
                    > mailto:jasspa-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                    >
                    > or visit http://groups.yahoo.com/group/jasspa and
                    > modify your account settings manually.
                    >
                    >
                    >
                    > Yahoo! Groups Links
                    >
                    >
                    >
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