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copy-rectangle editing "problem"

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  • Meino Christian Cramer
    Hi, I have a longish file consisting of two rows of commands, ordered like that (but a lot more entries!) a g b h c i d j e k f l Now I want to become the file
    Message 1 of 7 , Jul 8, 2005
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      Hi,

      I have a longish file consisting of two rows of commands, ordered
      like that (but a lot more entries!)

      a g
      b h
      c i
      d j
      e k
      f l

      Now I want to become the file to look as this:

      a
      b
      c
      d
      e
      f
      g
      h
      i
      j
      k
      l

      I know that all this can be done by using several tools of the UNIX
      environment (the problem is not the newest one...;) but I want to
      try to solve it by copy-rectangle.

      Unfortunately, the file filled up a lot of pages and the length of
      the entries let me struggle.....:

      first-entry later-very-long-entry-of-that-file
      <pages of entries following here>
      <pages of entries following here>
      <pages of entries following here>
      <pages of entries following here>
      <pages of entries following here>
      mid-entry last-short-one



      Hmmmm...I did a set-mark at the "l" of
      "later-very-long-entry-of-that-file", move down the pages and then
      could not go beyond the point right after the "e" of
      "last-short-one". This way I would cut all longer entries than
      "last-short-one"... ??? Isn't it ???

      Or is the problem again sitting in front of my monitor ??? ;o)

      Have a nice weekend!
      Meino
    • Thomas Hundt
      What you have to know is: the rectangle commands cut EXACTLY from the x,y of the point to the x,y of the mark. No special handling if one or the other happens
      Message 2 of 7 , Jul 8, 2005
      • 0 Attachment
        What you have to know is: the rectangle commands cut EXACTLY from the
        x,y of the point to the x,y of the mark. No special handling if one or
        the other happens to be at EOL. Also no notion of whitespace or
        anything else. Just pure x,y - x,y (with skipping of empty space).

        So. If you want to cut all of the second column here:

        > a ggggggggg
        > b h
        > c i
        > d j
        > e k
        > f lllll

        you have to put your mark on the first 'g' and the point off to the
        right of the last 'l' -- BY TYPING A BUNCH OF EXTRA SPACES. Like this
        (with <m> being the mark and <p> the cursor or point)

        > a <m>ggggggggg
        > b h
        > c i
        > d j
        > e k
        > f lllll <p>

        NOW you execute the kill-rectangle command.

        And if you want the leading spaces to be included as in your example
        below, you have to put the mark before the first space:

        > a<m> ggggggggg

        (I love the rectangle commands :-) .)

        -Th



        Meino Christian Cramer wrote:
        > Hi,
        >
        > I have a longish file consisting of two rows of commands, ordered
        > like that (but a lot more entries!)
        >
        > a g
        > b h
        > c i
        > d j
        > e k
        > f l
        >
        > Now I want to become the file to look as this:
        >
        > a
        > b
        > c
        > d
        > e
        > f
        > g
        > h
        > i
        > j
        > k
        > l
        >
        > I know that all this can be done by using several tools of the UNIX
        > environment (the problem is not the newest one...;) but I want to
        > try to solve it by copy-rectangle.
        >
        > Unfortunately, the file filled up a lot of pages and the length of
        > the entries let me struggle.....:
        >
        > first-entry later-very-long-entry-of-that-file
        > <pages of entries following here>
        > <pages of entries following here>
        > <pages of entries following here>
        > <pages of entries following here>
        > <pages of entries following here>
        > mid-entry last-short-one
        >
        >
        >
        > Hmmmm...I did a set-mark at the "l" of
        > "later-very-long-entry-of-that-file", move down the pages and then
        > could not go beyond the point right after the "e" of
        > "last-short-one". This way I would cut all longer entries than
        > "last-short-one"... ??? Isn't it ???
        >
        > Or is the problem again sitting in front of my monitor ??? ;o)
        >
        > Have a nice weekend!
        > Meino
      • Steven Phillips
        There is a new and improved solution to this problem. The mouse now supports copy and kill rectangle, see user-setup - mouse. Use one of these to do this; it
        Message 3 of 7 , Jul 8, 2005
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          There is a new and improved solution to this problem. The mouse now supports
          copy and kill rectangle, see user-setup -> mouse. Use one of these to do
          this; it is an improvement because the mouse is not constrained in the same
          way the cursor is so you do not need to insert lots of spaces first.

          Steve

          > Subject: [jasspa] copy-rectangle editing "problem"
          > From: Thomas Hundt <thundt@...>
          > Date: Friday, July 8, 2005, 7:58:52 PM
          > To: jasspa@yahoogroups.com
          > What you have to know is: the rectangle commands cut EXACTLY from the
          > x,y of the point to the x,y of the mark. No special handling if one or
          > the other happens to be at EOL. Also no notion of whitespace or
          > anything else. Just pure x,y - x,y (with skipping of empty space).

          > So. If you want to cut all of the second column here:

          >> a ggggggggg
          >> b h
          >> c i
          >> d j
          >> e k
          >> f lllll

          > you have to put your mark on the first 'g' and the point off to the
          > right of the last 'l' -- BY TYPING A BUNCH OF EXTRA SPACES. Like this
          > (with <m> being the mark and <p> the cursor or point)

          >> a <m>ggggggggg
          >> b h
          >> c i
          >> d j
          >> e k
          >> f lllll <p>

          > NOW you execute the kill-rectangle command.

          > And if you want the leading spaces to be included as in your example
          > below, you have to put the mark before the first space:

          >> a<m> ggggggggg

          > (I love the rectangle commands :-) .)

          > -Th



          > Meino Christian Cramer wrote:
          >> Hi,
          >>
          >> I have a longish file consisting of two rows of commands, ordered
          >> like that (but a lot more entries!)
          >>
          >> a g
          >> b h
          >> c i
          >> d j
          >> e k
          >> f l
          >>
          >> Now I want to become the file to look as this:
          >>
          >> a
          >> b
          >> c
          >> d
          >> e
          >> f
          >> g
          >> h
          >> i
          >> j
          >> k
          >> l
          >>
          >> I know that all this can be done by using several tools of the UNIX
          >> environment (the problem is not the newest one...;) but I want to
          >> try to solve it by copy-rectangle.
          >>
          >> Unfortunately, the file filled up a lot of pages and the length of
          >> the entries let me struggle.....:
          >>
          >> first-entry later-very-long-entry-of-that-file
          >> <pages of entries following here>
          >> <pages of entries following here>
          >> <pages of entries following here>
          >> <pages of entries following here>
          >> <pages of entries following here>
          >> mid-entry last-short-one
          >>
          >>
          >>
          >> Hmmmm...I did a set-mark at the "l" of
          >> "later-very-long-entry-of-that-file", move down the pages and then
          >> could not go beyond the point right after the "e" of
          >> "last-short-one". This way I would cut all longer entries than
          >> "last-short-one"... ??? Isn't it ???
          >>
          >> Or is the problem again sitting in front of my monitor ??? ;o)
          >>
          >> Have a nice weekend!
          >> Meino


          > __________________________________________________________________________

          > This is an unmoderated list. JASSPA is not responsible for the content of
          > any material posted to this list.

          > To unsubscribe, send a mail message to

          > mailto:jasspa-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com

          > or visit http://groups.yahoo.com/group/jasspa and
          > modify your account settings manually.



          > Yahoo! Groups Links
        • Meino Christian Cramer
          From: Steven Phillips Subject: Re[2]: [jasspa] copy-rectangle editing problem Date: Fri, 8 Jul 2005 20:22:01 +0100 Hi Steven, Hi Thomas!
          Message 4 of 7 , Jul 8, 2005
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            From: Steven Phillips <bill@...>
            Subject: Re[2]: [jasspa] copy-rectangle editing "problem"
            Date: Fri, 8 Jul 2005 20:22:01 +0100

            Hi Steven, Hi Thomas!

            There is still a little annoyence in this handling of that problem.

            Think of a file (may be something automatically generated...a log
            file...or a data dump or such) with some hundreds of lines with very
            different lengths of the entries of the last column.

            Being at the end of the file you have to decide how far you have to
            move right (inserting spaces directly or inderectly) to not to cut
            off one of the hundreds of lines above....you may end up in inserting
            A LOT unused space -- just to get sure --, which you have to remove
            later again.

            Or do I miss someting ?

            A solution (thinking of a newbie...DANGER!) may be the following
            algorithm for the rectangle commands:
            The described "problem" only appears when doing something rectanglish
            with the last column of a text.
            Currently everything from the set-mark position (upper left) to the
            position *before* the cursor (lower right) is take into account:

            P23456789 P=set-mark position
            123456789 X=actual position of the cursor
            123456789
            123456789
            123456789
            123456789
            123456X89

            Using kill-rectangle will be given you this one:

            789
            789
            789
            789
            789
            789
            789

            When this behaviour of the rectanglish commands would be changed to
            *include* the position of the cursor in determination the rectangle
            (which appears also more logical to me, since the set-mark command
            for setting the upper left corener do this the same way...) one were
            enabled to """include""" the CR/LF (or LF) as part of the
            rectangle. Doing so would *NOT* copy the EOL sign as such but
            instruct the rectanglish command automatically to copy all lines up
            to their EOL -- even if they are of different length -- OR insert the
            currect -- but not to much or too less -- ammount of spaces to
            correctly handle the rectangle.

            What do you think?

            Keep microemacsing and have a nice weekend!
            Meino



            > There is a new and improved solution to this problem. The mouse now supports
            > copy and kill rectangle, see user-setup -> mouse. Use one of these to do
            > this; it is an improvement because the mouse is not constrained in the same
            > way the cursor is so you do not need to insert lots of spaces first.
            >
            > Steve
            >
            > > Subject: [jasspa] copy-rectangle editing "problem"
            > > From: Thomas Hundt <thundt@...>
            > > Date: Friday, July 8, 2005, 7:58:52 PM
            > > To: jasspa@yahoogroups.com
            > > What you have to know is: the rectangle commands cut EXACTLY from the
            > > x,y of the point to the x,y of the mark. No special handling if one or
            > > the other happens to be at EOL. Also no notion of whitespace or
            > > anything else. Just pure x,y - x,y (with skipping of empty space).
            >
            > > So. If you want to cut all of the second column here:
            >
            > >> a ggggggggg
            > >> b h
            > >> c i
            > >> d j
            > >> e k
            > >> f lllll
            >
            > > you have to put your mark on the first 'g' and the point off to the
            > > right of the last 'l' -- BY TYPING A BUNCH OF EXTRA SPACES. Like this
            > > (with <m> being the mark and <p> the cursor or point)
            >
            > >> a <m>ggggggggg
            > >> b h
            > >> c i
            > >> d j
            > >> e k
            > >> f lllll <p>
            >
            > > NOW you execute the kill-rectangle command.
            >
            > > And if you want the leading spaces to be included as in your example
            > > below, you have to put the mark before the first space:
            >
            > >> a<m> ggggggggg
            >
            > > (I love the rectangle commands :-) .)
            >
            > > -Th
            >
            >
            >
            > > Meino Christian Cramer wrote:
            > >> Hi,
            > >>
            > >> I have a longish file consisting of two rows of commands, ordered
            > >> like that (but a lot more entries!)
            > >>
            > >> a g
            > >> b h
            > >> c i
            > >> d j
            > >> e k
            > >> f l
            > >>
            > >> Now I want to become the file to look as this:
            > >>
            > >> a
            > >> b
            > >> c
            > >> d
            > >> e
            > >> f
            > >> g
            > >> h
            > >> i
            > >> j
            > >> k
            > >> l
            > >>
            > >> I know that all this can be done by using several tools of the UNIX
            > >> environment (the problem is not the newest one...;) but I want to
            > >> try to solve it by copy-rectangle.
            > >>
            > >> Unfortunately, the file filled up a lot of pages and the length of
            > >> the entries let me struggle.....:
            > >>
            > >> first-entry later-very-long-entry-of-that-file
            > >> <pages of entries following here>
            > >> <pages of entries following here>
            > >> <pages of entries following here>
            > >> <pages of entries following here>
            > >> <pages of entries following here>
            > >> mid-entry last-short-one
            > >>
            > >>
            > >>
            > >> Hmmmm...I did a set-mark at the "l" of
            > >> "later-very-long-entry-of-that-file", move down the pages and then
            > >> could not go beyond the point right after the "e" of
            > >> "last-short-one". This way I would cut all longer entries than
            > >> "last-short-one"... ??? Isn't it ???
            > >>
            > >> Or is the problem again sitting in front of my monitor ??? ;o)
            > >>
            > >> Have a nice weekend!
            > >> Meino
            >
            >
            > > __________________________________________________________________________
            >
            > > This is an unmoderated list. JASSPA is not responsible for the content of
            > > any material posted to this list.
            >
            > > To unsubscribe, send a mail message to
            >
            > > mailto:jasspa-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
            >
            > > or visit http://groups.yahoo.com/group/jasspa and
            > > modify your account settings manually.
            >
            >
            >
            > > Yahoo! Groups Links
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            > __________________________________________________________________________
            >
            > This is an unmoderated list. JASSPA is not responsible for the content of
            > any material posted to this list.
            >
            > To unsubscribe, send a mail message to
            >
            > mailto:jasspa-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
            >
            > or visit http://groups.yahoo.com/group/jasspa and
            > modify your account settings manually.
            >
            >
            >
            > Yahoo! Groups Links
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            >
            2
          • Thomas Hundt
            ... Yes. This is logical. Please think of the cursor (and the mark) being the (zero-width!) space between chars. The box on your screen is just a way of
            Message 5 of 7 , Jul 8, 2005
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              > P23456789 P=set-mark position
              > 123456789 X=actual position of the cursor
              > 123456X89
              >
              > [After] kill-rectangle [you] will [have]:
              >
              > 789
              > 789
              > 789

              Yes. This is logical. Please think of the cursor (and the mark) being
              the (zero-width!) space between chars. The box on your screen is just a
              way of displaying that, held over from TV typewriter days. Run Word and
              look at the cursor it uses. It's more illustrative of what's really
              going on.

              (Also, if I may correct you on one thing, German "aktuell" does not mean
              the same as English "actual". Aktuell = current. Actual = wirklich. I
              see this a lot.)

              > you may end up in inserting
              > A LOT unused space -- just to get sure --, which you have to remove
              > later again.

              Yes. This is what I usually do. There's the other option of using the
              mouse as was just pointed out, which I haven't tried yet.

              Also: it's easy to insert a bunch of spaces, just type ^U^U^U and hit
              the spacebar. I have a macro that truncates EOL whitespace, so cleaning
              it up is even quicker. (Probably there's a built-in one, too.)

              -Th


              Meino Christian Cramer wrote:
              > From: Steven Phillips <bill@...>
              > Subject: Re[2]: [jasspa] copy-rectangle editing "problem"
              > Date: Fri, 8 Jul 2005 20:22:01 +0100
              >
              > Hi Steven, Hi Thomas!
              >
              > There is still a little annoyence in this handling of that problem.
              >
              > Think of a file (may be something automatically generated...a log
              > file...or a data dump or such) with some hundreds of lines with very
              > different lengths of the entries of the last column.
              >
              > Being at the end of the file you have to decide how far you have to
              > move right (inserting spaces directly or inderectly) to not to cut
              > off one of the hundreds of lines above....you may end up in inserting
              > A LOT unused space -- just to get sure --, which you have to remove
              > later again.
              >
              > Or do I miss someting ?
              >
              > A solution (thinking of a newbie...DANGER!) may be the following
              > algorithm for the rectangle commands:
              > The described "problem" only appears when doing something rectanglish
              > with the last column of a text.
              > Currently everything from the set-mark position (upper left) to the
              > position *before* the cursor (lower right) is take into account:
              >
              > P23456789 P=set-mark position
              > 123456789 X=actual position of the cursor
              > 123456789
              > 123456789
              > 123456789
              > 123456789
              > 123456X89
              >
              > Using kill-rectangle will be given you this one:
              >
              > 789
              > 789
              > 789
              > 789
              > 789
              > 789
              > 789
              >
              > When this behaviour of the rectanglish commands would be changed to
              > *include* the position of the cursor in determination the rectangle
              > (which appears also more logical to me, since the set-mark command
              > for setting the upper left corener do this the same way...) one were
              > enabled to """include""" the CR/LF (or LF) as part of the
              > rectangle. Doing so would *NOT* copy the EOL sign as such but
              > instruct the rectanglish command automatically to copy all lines up
              > to their EOL -- even if they are of different length -- OR insert the
              > currect -- but not to much or too less -- ammount of spaces to
              > correctly handle the rectangle.
              >
              > What do you think?
              >
              > Keep microemacsing and have a nice weekend!
              > Meino
              >
              >
              >
              >
              >>There is a new and improved solution to this problem. The mouse now supports
              >>copy and kill rectangle, see user-setup -> mouse. Use one of these to do
              >>this; it is an improvement because the mouse is not constrained in the same
              >>way the cursor is so you do not need to insert lots of spaces first.
              >>
              >>Steve
              >>
              >>
              >>>Subject: [jasspa] copy-rectangle editing "problem"
              >>>From: Thomas Hundt <thundt@...>
              >>>Date: Friday, July 8, 2005, 7:58:52 PM
              >>>To: jasspa@yahoogroups.com
              >>>What you have to know is: the rectangle commands cut EXACTLY from the
              >>>x,y of the point to the x,y of the mark. No special handling if one or
              >>>the other happens to be at EOL. Also no notion of whitespace or
              >>>anything else. Just pure x,y - x,y (with skipping of empty space).
              >>
              >>>So. If you want to cut all of the second column here:
              >>
              >> >> a ggggggggg
              >> >> b h
              >> >> c i
              >> >> d j
              >> >> e k
              >> >> f lllll
              >>
              >>
              >>>you have to put your mark on the first 'g' and the point off to the
              >>>right of the last 'l' -- BY TYPING A BUNCH OF EXTRA SPACES. Like this
              >>>(with <m> being the mark and <p> the cursor or point)
              >>
              >> >> a <m>ggggggggg
              >> >> b h
              >> >> c i
              >> >> d j
              >> >> e k
              >> >> f lllll <p>
              >>
              >>>NOW you execute the kill-rectangle command.
              >>
              >>>And if you want the leading spaces to be included as in your example
              >>>below, you have to put the mark before the first space:
              >>
              >> >> a<m> ggggggggg
              >>
              >>
              >>>(I love the rectangle commands :-) .)
              >>
              >>>-Th
              >>
              >>
              >>
              >>>Meino Christian Cramer wrote:
              >>>
              >>>>Hi,
              >>>>
              >>>> I have a longish file consisting of two rows of commands, ordered
              >>>> like that (but a lot more entries!)
              >>>>
              >>>> a g
              >>>> b h
              >>>> c i
              >>>> d j
              >>>> e k
              >>>> f l
              >>>>
              >>>> Now I want to become the file to look as this:
              >>>>
              >>>> a
              >>>> b
              >>>> c
              >>>> d
              >>>> e
              >>>> f
              >>>> g
              >>>> h
              >>>> i
              >>>> j
              >>>> k
              >>>> l
              >>>>
              >>>> I know that all this can be done by using several tools of the UNIX
              >>>> environment (the problem is not the newest one...;) but I want to
              >>>> try to solve it by copy-rectangle.
              >>>>
              >>>> Unfortunately, the file filled up a lot of pages and the length of
              >>>> the entries let me struggle.....:
              >>>>
              >>>> first-entry later-very-long-entry-of-that-file
              >>>> <pages of entries following here>
              >>>> <pages of entries following here>
              >>>> <pages of entries following here>
              >>>> <pages of entries following here>
              >>>> <pages of entries following here>
              >>>> mid-entry last-short-one
              >>>>
              >>>>
              >>>>
              >>>> Hmmmm...I did a set-mark at the "l" of
              >>>> "later-very-long-entry-of-that-file", move down the pages and then
              >>>> could not go beyond the point right after the "e" of
              >>>> "last-short-one". This way I would cut all longer entries than
              >>>> "last-short-one"... ??? Isn't it ???
              >>>>
              >>>> Or is the problem again sitting in front of my monitor ??? ;o)
              >>>>
              >>>> Have a nice weekend!
              >>>> Meino
              >>
              >>
            • Meino Christian Cramer
              From: Thomas Hundt Subject: Re: [jasspa] copy-rectangle editing problem Date: Fri, 08 Jul 2005 16:42:58 -0700 Hi Thomas, ... I will never
              Message 6 of 7 , Jul 8, 2005
              • 0 Attachment
                From: Thomas Hundt <thundt@...>
                Subject: Re: [jasspa] copy-rectangle editing "problem"
                Date: Fri, 08 Jul 2005 16:42:58 -0700

                Hi Thomas,

                > > P23456789 P=set-mark position
                > > 123456789 X=actual position of the cursor
                > > 123456X89
                > >
                > > [After] kill-rectangle [you] will [have]:
                > >
                > > 789
                > > 789
                > > 789
                >
                > Yes. This is logical. Please think of the cursor (and the mark) being
                > the (zero-width!) space between chars. The box on your screen is just a
                > way of displaying that, held over from TV typewriter days. Run Word

                I will never run Word ! ;)

                > and
                > look at the cursor it uses. It's more illustrative of what's really
                > going on.
                >
                > (Also, if I may correct you on one thing, German "aktuell" does not mean
                > the same as English "actual". Aktuell = current. Actual = wirklich. I
                > see this a lot.)

                Will pay attention to it, thanks.

                > > you may end up in inserting
                > > A LOT unused space -- just to get sure --, which you have to remove
                > > later again.
                >
                > Yes. This is what I usually do. There's the other option of using the
                > mouse as was just pointed out, which I haven't tried yet.
                >
                > Also: it's easy to insert a bunch of spaces, just type ^U^U^U and hit
                > the spacebar. I have a macro that truncates EOL whitespace, so cleaning
                > it up is even quicker. (Probably there's a built-in one, too.)
                >
                > -Th

                Ok, conclusion is, that inserting a lot of spaces just to cut out a
                rectanlge is the way to go. Aferwards I have to remove it again.

                Meino


                >
                > Meino Christian Cramer wrote:
                > > From: Steven Phillips <bill@...>
                > > Subject: Re[2]: [jasspa] copy-rectangle editing "problem"
                > > Date: Fri, 8 Jul 2005 20:22:01 +0100
                > >
                > > Hi Steven, Hi Thomas!
                > >
                > > There is still a little annoyence in this handling of that problem.
                > >
                > > Think of a file (may be something automatically generated...a log
                > > file...or a data dump or such) with some hundreds of lines with very
                > > different lengths of the entries of the last column.
                > >
                > > Being at the end of the file you have to decide how far you have to
                > > move right (inserting spaces directly or inderectly) to not to cut
                > > off one of the hundreds of lines above....you may end up in inserting
                > > A LOT unused space -- just to get sure --, which you have to remove
                > > later again.
                > >
                > > Or do I miss someting ?
                > >
                > > A solution (thinking of a newbie...DANGER!) may be the following
                > > algorithm for the rectangle commands:
                > > The described "problem" only appears when doing something rectanglish
                > > with the last column of a text.
                > > Currently everything from the set-mark position (upper left) to the
                > > position *before* the cursor (lower right) is take into account:
                > >
                > > P23456789 P=set-mark position
                > > 123456789 X=actual position of the cursor
                > > 123456789
                > > 123456789
                > > 123456789
                > > 123456789
                > > 123456X89
                > >
                > > Using kill-rectangle will be given you this one:
                > >
                > > 789
                > > 789
                > > 789
                > > 789
                > > 789
                > > 789
                > > 789
                > >
                > > When this behaviour of the rectanglish commands would be changed to
                > > *include* the position of the cursor in determination the rectangle
                > > (which appears also more logical to me, since the set-mark command
                > > for setting the upper left corener do this the same way...) one were
                > > enabled to """include""" the CR/LF (or LF) as part of the
                > > rectangle. Doing so would *NOT* copy the EOL sign as such but
                > > instruct the rectanglish command automatically to copy all lines up
                > > to their EOL -- even if they are of different length -- OR insert the
                > > currect -- but not to much or too less -- ammount of spaces to
                > > correctly handle the rectangle.
                > >
                > > What do you think?
                > >
                > > Keep microemacsing and have a nice weekend!
                > > Meino
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > >>There is a new and improved solution to this problem. The mouse now supports
                > >>copy and kill rectangle, see user-setup -> mouse. Use one of these to do
                > >>this; it is an improvement because the mouse is not constrained in the same
                > >>way the cursor is so you do not need to insert lots of spaces first.
                > >>
                > >>Steve
                > >>
                > >>
                > >>>Subject: [jasspa] copy-rectangle editing "problem"
                > >>>From: Thomas Hundt <thundt@...>
                > >>>Date: Friday, July 8, 2005, 7:58:52 PM
                > >>>To: jasspa@yahoogroups.com
                > >>>What you have to know is: the rectangle commands cut EXACTLY from the
                > >>>x,y of the point to the x,y of the mark. No special handling if one or
                > >>>the other happens to be at EOL. Also no notion of whitespace or
                > >>>anything else. Just pure x,y - x,y (with skipping of empty space).
                > >>
                > >>>So. If you want to cut all of the second column here:
                > >>
                > >> >> a ggggggggg
                > >> >> b h
                > >> >> c i
                > >> >> d j
                > >> >> e k
                > >> >> f lllll
                > >>
                > >>
                > >>>you have to put your mark on the first 'g' and the point off to the
                > >>>right of the last 'l' -- BY TYPING A BUNCH OF EXTRA SPACES. Like this
                > >>>(with <m> being the mark and <p> the cursor or point)
                > >>
                > >> >> a <m>ggggggggg
                > >> >> b h
                > >> >> c i
                > >> >> d j
                > >> >> e k
                > >> >> f lllll <p>
                > >>
                > >>>NOW you execute the kill-rectangle command.
                > >>
                > >>>And if you want the leading spaces to be included as in your example
                > >>>below, you have to put the mark before the first space:
                > >>
                > >> >> a<m> ggggggggg
                > >>
                > >>
                > >>>(I love the rectangle commands :-) .)
                > >>
                > >>>-Th
                > >>
                > >>
                > >>
                > >>>Meino Christian Cramer wrote:
                > >>>
                > >>>>Hi,
                > >>>>
                > >>>> I have a longish file consisting of two rows of commands, ordered
                > >>>> like that (but a lot more entries!)
                > >>>>
                > >>>> a g
                > >>>> b h
                > >>>> c i
                > >>>> d j
                > >>>> e k
                > >>>> f l
                > >>>>
                > >>>> Now I want to become the file to look as this:
                > >>>>
                > >>>> a
                > >>>> b
                > >>>> c
                > >>>> d
                > >>>> e
                > >>>> f
                > >>>> g
                > >>>> h
                > >>>> i
                > >>>> j
                > >>>> k
                > >>>> l
                > >>>>
                > >>>> I know that all this can be done by using several tools of the UNIX
                > >>>> environment (the problem is not the newest one...;) but I want to
                > >>>> try to solve it by copy-rectangle.
                > >>>>
                > >>>> Unfortunately, the file filled up a lot of pages and the length of
                > >>>> the entries let me struggle.....:
                > >>>>
                > >>>> first-entry later-very-long-entry-of-that-file
                > >>>> <pages of entries following here>
                > >>>> <pages of entries following here>
                > >>>> <pages of entries following here>
                > >>>> <pages of entries following here>
                > >>>> <pages of entries following here>
                > >>>> mid-entry last-short-one
                > >>>>
                > >>>>
                > >>>>
                > >>>> Hmmmm...I did a set-mark at the "l" of
                > >>>> "later-very-long-entry-of-that-file", move down the pages and then
                > >>>> could not go beyond the point right after the "e" of
                > >>>> "last-short-one". This way I would cut all longer entries than
                > >>>> "last-short-one"... ??? Isn't it ???
                > >>>>
                > >>>> Or is the problem again sitting in front of my monitor ??? ;o)
                > >>>>
                > >>>> Have a nice weekend!
                > >>>> Meino
                > >>
                > >>
                >
                >
                > __________________________________________________________________________
                >
                > This is an unmoderated list. JASSPA is not responsible for the content of
                > any material posted to this list.
                >
                > To unsubscribe, send a mail message to
                >
                > mailto:jasspa-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                >
                > or visit http://groups.yahoo.com/group/jasspa and
                > modify your account settings manually.
                >
                >
                >
                > Yahoo! Groups Links
                >
                >
                >
                >
                >
                >
              • Steven Phillips
                Removing is easy - see docs on the command clean Steve
                Message 7 of 7 , Jul 9, 2005
                • 0 Attachment
                  Removing is easy - see docs on the command 'clean'

                  Steve

                  > Subject: [jasspa] copy-rectangle editing "problem"
                  > From: Meino Christian Cramer <Meino.Cramer@...>
                  > Date: Saturday, July 9, 2005, 4:06:21 AM
                  > To: jasspa@yahoogroups.com, thundt@...
                  > From: Thomas Hundt <thundt@...>
                  > Subject: Re: [jasspa] copy-rectangle editing "problem"
                  > Date: Fri, 08 Jul 2005 16:42:58 -0700

                  > Hi Thomas,

                  >> > P23456789 P=set-mark position
                  >> > 123456789 X=actual position of the cursor
                  >> > 123456X89
                  >> >
                  >> > [After] kill-rectangle [you] will [have]:
                  >> >
                  >> > 789
                  >> > 789
                  >> > 789
                  >>
                  >> Yes. This is logical. Please think of the cursor (and the mark) being
                  >> the (zero-width!) space between chars. The box on your screen is just a
                  >> way of displaying that, held over from TV typewriter days. Run Word

                  > I will never run Word ! ;)

                  >> and
                  >> look at the cursor it uses. It's more illustrative of what's really
                  >> going on.
                  >>
                  >> (Also, if I may correct you on one thing, German "aktuell" does not mean
                  >> the same as English "actual". Aktuell = current. Actual = wirklich. I
                  >> see this a lot.)

                  > Will pay attention to it, thanks.

                  >> > you may end up in inserting
                  >> > A LOT unused space -- just to get sure --, which you have to remove
                  >> > later again.
                  >>
                  >> Yes. This is what I usually do. There's the other option of using the
                  >> mouse as was just pointed out, which I haven't tried yet.
                  >>
                  >> Also: it's easy to insert a bunch of spaces, just type ^U^U^U and hit
                  >> the spacebar. I have a macro that truncates EOL whitespace, so cleaning
                  >> it up is even quicker. (Probably there's a built-in one, too.)
                  >>
                  >> -Th

                  > Ok, conclusion is, that inserting a lot of spaces just to cut out a
                  > rectanlge is the way to go. Aferwards I have to remove it again.

                  > Meino


                  >>
                  >> Meino Christian Cramer wrote:
                  >> > From: Steven Phillips <bill@...>
                  >> > Subject: Re[2]: [jasspa] copy-rectangle editing "problem"
                  >> > Date: Fri, 8 Jul 2005 20:22:01 +0100
                  >> >
                  >> > Hi Steven, Hi Thomas!
                  >> >
                  >> > There is still a little annoyence in this handling of that problem.
                  >> >
                  >> > Think of a file (may be something automatically generated...a log
                  >> > file...or a data dump or such) with some hundreds of lines with very
                  >> > different lengths of the entries of the last column.
                  >> >
                  >> > Being at the end of the file you have to decide how far you have to
                  >> > move right (inserting spaces directly or inderectly) to not to cut
                  >> > off one of the hundreds of lines above....you may end up in inserting
                  >> > A LOT unused space -- just to get sure --, which you have to remove
                  >> > later again.
                  >> >
                  >> > Or do I miss someting ?
                  >> >
                  >> > A solution (thinking of a newbie...DANGER!) may be the following
                  >> > algorithm for the rectangle commands:
                  >> > The described "problem" only appears when doing something rectanglish
                  >> > with the last column of a text.
                  >> > Currently everything from the set-mark position (upper left) to the
                  >> > position *before* the cursor (lower right) is take into account:
                  >> >
                  >> > P23456789 P=set-mark position
                  >> > 123456789 X=actual position of the cursor
                  >> > 123456789
                  >> > 123456789
                  >> > 123456789
                  >> > 123456789
                  >> > 123456X89
                  >> >
                  >> > Using kill-rectangle will be given you this one:
                  >> >
                  >> > 789
                  >> > 789
                  >> > 789
                  >> > 789
                  >> > 789
                  >> > 789
                  >> > 789
                  >> >
                  >> > When this behaviour of the rectanglish commands would be changed to
                  >> > *include* the position of the cursor in determination the rectangle
                  >> > (which appears also more logical to me, since the set-mark command
                  >> > for setting the upper left corener do this the same way...) one were
                  >> > enabled to """include""" the CR/LF (or LF) as part of the
                  >> > rectangle. Doing so would *NOT* copy the EOL sign as such but
                  >> > instruct the rectanglish command automatically to copy all lines up
                  >> > to their EOL -- even if they are of different length -- OR insert the
                  >> > currect -- but not to much or too less -- ammount of spaces to
                  >> > correctly handle the rectangle.
                  >> >
                  >> > What do you think?
                  >> >
                  >> > Keep microemacsing and have a nice weekend!
                  >> > Meino
                  >> >
                  >> >
                  >> >
                  >> >
                  >> >>There is a new and improved solution to this problem. The mouse now supports
                  >> >>copy and kill rectangle, see user-setup -> mouse. Use one of these to do
                  >> >>this; it is an improvement because the mouse is not constrained in the same
                  >> >>way the cursor is so you do not need to insert lots of spaces first.
                  >> >>
                  >> >>Steve
                  >> >>
                  >> >>
                  >> >>>Subject: [jasspa] copy-rectangle editing "problem"
                  >> >>>From: Thomas Hundt <thundt@...>
                  >> >>>Date: Friday, July 8, 2005, 7:58:52 PM
                  >> >>>To: jasspa@yahoogroups.com
                  >> >>>What you have to know is: the rectangle commands cut EXACTLY from the
                  >> >>>x,y of the point to the x,y of the mark. No special handling if one or
                  >> >>>the other happens to be at EOL. Also no notion of whitespace or
                  >> >>>anything else. Just pure x,y - x,y (with skipping of empty space).
                  >> >>
                  >> >>>So. If you want to cut all of the second column here:
                  >> >>
                  >> >> >> a ggggggggg
                  >> >> >> b h
                  >> >> >> c i
                  >> >> >> d j
                  >> >> >> e k
                  >> >> >> f lllll
                  >> >>
                  >> >>
                  >> >>>you have to put your mark on the first 'g' and the point off to the
                  >> >>>right of the last 'l' -- BY TYPING A BUNCH OF EXTRA SPACES. Like this
                  >> >>>(with <m> being the mark and <p> the cursor or point)
                  >> >>
                  >> >> >> a <m>ggggggggg
                  >> >> >> b h
                  >> >> >> c i
                  >> >> >> d j
                  >> >> >> e k
                  >> >> >> f lllll <p>
                  >> >>
                  >> >>>NOW you execute the kill-rectangle command.
                  >> >>
                  >> >>>And if you want the leading spaces to be included as in your example
                  >> >>>below, you have to put the mark before the first space:
                  >> >>
                  >> >> >> a<m> ggggggggg
                  >> >>
                  >> >>
                  >> >>>(I love the rectangle commands :-) .)
                  >> >>
                  >> >>>-Th
                  >> >>
                  >> >>
                  >> >>
                  >> >>>Meino Christian Cramer wrote:
                  >> >>>
                  >> >>>>Hi,
                  >> >>>>
                  >> >>>> I have a longish file consisting of two rows of commands, ordered
                  >> >>>> like that (but a lot more entries!)
                  >> >>>>
                  >> >>>> a g
                  >> >>>> b h
                  >> >>>> c i
                  >> >>>> d j
                  >> >>>> e k
                  >> >>>> f l
                  >> >>>>
                  >> >>>> Now I want to become the file to look as this:
                  >> >>>>
                  >> >>>> a
                  >> >>>> b
                  >> >>>> c
                  >> >>>> d
                  >> >>>> e
                  >> >>>> f
                  >> >>>> g
                  >> >>>> h
                  >> >>>> i
                  >> >>>> j
                  >> >>>> k
                  >> >>>> l
                  >> >>>>
                  >> >>>> I know that all this can be done by using several tools of the UNIX
                  >> >>>> environment (the problem is not the newest one...;) but I want to
                  >> >>>> try to solve it by copy-rectangle.
                  >> >>>>
                  >> >>>> Unfortunately, the file filled up a lot of pages and the length of
                  >> >>>> the entries let me struggle.....:
                  >> >>>>
                  >> >>>> first-entry later-very-long-entry-of-that-file
                  >> >>>> <pages of entries following here>
                  >> >>>> <pages of entries following here>
                  >> >>>> <pages of entries following here>
                  >> >>>> <pages of entries following here>
                  >> >>>> <pages of entries following here>
                  >> >>>> mid-entry last-short-one
                  >> >>>>
                  >> >>>>
                  >> >>>>
                  >> >>>> Hmmmm...I did a set-mark at the "l" of
                  >> >>>> "later-very-long-entry-of-that-file", move down the pages and then
                  >> >>>> could not go beyond the point right after the "e" of
                  >> >>>> "last-short-one". This way I would cut all longer entries than
                  >> >>>> "last-short-one"... ??? Isn't it ???
                  >> >>>>
                  >> >>>> Or is the problem again sitting in front of my monitor ??? ;o)
                  >> >>>>
                  >> >>>> Have a nice weekend!
                  >> >>>> Meino
                  >> >>
                  >> >>
                  >>
                  >>
                  >> __________________________________________________________________________
                  >>
                  >> This is an unmoderated list. JASSPA is not responsible for the content of
                  >> any material posted to this list.
                  >>
                  >> To unsubscribe, send a mail message to
                  >>
                  >> mailto:jasspa-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
                  >>
                  >> or visit http://groups.yahoo.com/group/jasspa and
                  >> modify your account settings manually.
                  >>
                  >>
                  >>
                  >> Yahoo! Groups Links
                  >>
                  >>
                  >>
                  >>
                  >>
                  >>


                  > __________________________________________________________________________

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                  > To unsubscribe, send a mail message to

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