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Re[2]: [jasspa] Backup files -- MEBACKUPSUB behavior vs docs

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  • Steven Phillips
    Going back to your original drive for using this (a very bad windows crash) I have had a similar experience but with a disk drive crash. The outcome of this
    Message 1 of 9 , May 11 12:36 PM
      Going back to your original drive for using this (a very bad windows crash) I
      have had a similar experience but with a disk drive crash. The outcome of this
      was more a desire for a mirror path rather than an different backup location as
      after the crash I wanted the latest version of all files, not the previous
      one.

      I was therefore thinking of introducing a new $MEMIRRORPATH and $MEMIRRORSUB,
      which have the same behavior as the BACKUP ones. When a file is saved it is
      backed up and written out as normal and then if $MEMIRRORPATH is set it is
      also written to the MIRROR path (with no backup).

      If there is a general consensus that this would be useful then I will try to
      implement this feature.

      > You're right, I forgot the trailing slash in the MEBACKUPPATH. This is
      > very important. Also agreed that a relative backuppath is asking for
      > big trouble: What if you edit a file in the backup directory??

      A relative path should work and can be useful (for example setting
      MEBACKUPPATH to ".backup/" on unix puts all the backup files into a hidden
      directory, editing /tmp/foo.txt will be backed up to /tmp/.backup/foo.txt and
      if this is edited it will be backed up to /tmp/.backup/.backup/foo.txt etc).
      I need to fix this bug!

      > Also, another issue, the backup directories should be created with 700
      > permissions under Unix (and perhaps the equivalent under Windows). This
      > is in case an unwitting user loads your company file and your common
      > profile file with backups enabled and settings as above; all his data
      > might become world-readable by default in the backup dir. If he doesn't
      > know backups are being written and the directories are created by ME
      > automatically with 777 permission, he could leave himself wide open.

      And somebody that unaware could copy my .zshrc file which sets the umask to
      002 leaving their original files wide open. I think the user has to take the
      main responsibility for security as does the ME administrator for a sensible
      company file (which should make use of either the $home or $user-path ME
      variables which would make it equally applicable to all).

      Also if using an absolute backup path this directory must already exist in
      which case the user must have created the directory and ME should not change the
      permissions of a directory it has not created.

      Steve

      > Steven Phillips wrote:

      >> Funnily enough it does do exactly what the docs says it will do and thats the
      >> problem. For example, set MEBACKUPPATH = "C:\Backup\Jasspa_backups\" (added a
      >> trailing '\') and save "c:\foo\bar\somefile.txt", due to the MEBACKUPPATH
      >> setting the back file will be:
      >>
      >> C:\Backup\Jasspa_backups\c:\foo\bar\somefile.txt
      >>
      >> And now do the ':' to '/' replacement and you end up with:
      >>
      >> C:/Backup/Jasspa_backups/c//foo/bar/somefile.txt
      >>
      >> And the double '//' in the middle breaks everything. So changing all ':' to
      >> '/' was perhaps not the smartest thing to do. I have changed this to a '.',
      >> i.e. the above becomes:
      >>
      >> C:/Backup/Jasspa_backups/c./foo/bar/somefile.txt
      >>
      >> Which on windows has another interesting side effect as the path "c./" is the
      >> same as "c/" (windows ignores the trailing '.') so this leads to the same thing
      >> as your SUB rule.
      >>
      >> I have found a nasty problem with a relative MEBACKUPPATH while looking at
      >> this problem, so I would recommend avoiding using a relative (e.g. "backup/")
      >> value until it is patched.
      >>
      >> Talking of which I am hoping to create a patch soon, will let you all know
      >> when it becomes available (and why didn't you find these issues in the RC
      >> versions!!! Would have saved me a lot of hassle),
      >>
      >> Steve
    • first last
      Hi everyone, I have been playing around with rebinding the keys to make them CUA compliant (just like win/os2/kde and so on) and it seems to work alright for
      Message 2 of 9 , May 12 1:29 AM
        Hi everyone,

        I have been playing around with rebinding the keys to make them CUA
        compliant (just like win/os2/kde and so on) and it seems to work
        alright for most things, but when I get to C-c and C-x I get error
        messages. Is it possible to reassing those keys using macros or would
        it have to be done via the source?

        I know it is a bit of a weird idea to "de-emacs" the keybidings but I
        am spending a lot of time in CUA environments and I keep on doing the
        wrong thing, so I'd like to try to set them up the same (and windows
        does not allow you to change most of the key bindings).

        Any info will be welcome.

        Thanks

        Gabriel





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      • Jon Green
        A very sad thing to do, however... See prefix(2) in the on-line help. It will certainly de-emacs the system. To do this properly then the key bindings should
        Message 3 of 9 , May 12 1:51 AM
          A very sad thing to do, however...

          See prefix(2) in the on-line help.
          It will certainly de-emacs the system.
          To do this properly then the key bindings should
          be set up as an emulation mode.
          You might have a few problems with some of
          the macros.

          If you succeed then I know that there will
          be a few other people that would be interested
          in your results. For myself I type Emacs
          commands into Windows apps with disasterous
          effects - wish Windows would support
          Emacs key bindings not the other way around.

          If you progress to a point that it is feasible
          then you may need a little more help in trying
          to remove bindings made in the macros. We will
          need to consider how to address this issue in
          some more depth.

          Regards
          Jon.

          first last wrote:

          > Hi everyone,
          >
          > I have been playing around with rebinding the keys to make them CUA
          > compliant (just like win/os2/kde and so on) and it seems to work
          > alright for most things, but when I get to C-c and C-x I get error
          > messages. Is it possible to reassing those keys using macros or would
          > it have to be done via the source?
          >
          > I know it is a bit of a weird idea to "de-emacs" the keybidings but I
          > am spending a lot of time in CUA environments and I keep on doing the
          > wrong thing, so I'd like to try to set them up the same (and windows
          > does not allow you to change most of the key bindings).
          >
          > Any info will be welcome.
          >
          > Thanks
          >
          > Gabriel
        • Phillips, Steven
          The best starting point for this is the NEdit emulation, to create another emulation you need to: 1) Edit userstp.emf and add your new emulation to
          Message 4 of 9 , May 12 2:30 AM
            The best starting point for this is the NEdit emulation, to create another emulation you need to:

            1) Edit userstp.emf and add your new emulation to %emulate-names & %emulate-value variables.
            2) Create an 'me<emulate-name>.emf' (e.g. menedit.emf) macro file which does all the key rebindings AND sets up the buffer specific key binding by setting the .buffer-bind-key.map-from & .buffer-bind-key.map-to variables (without setting these all the file hooks (like hkc.emf) will try to bind 'C-c C-c' to comment-line etc which will go very wrong, NEdit maps this to C-b, see menedit.emf)
            3) Create an 'osd<emulate-name>.emf' (e.g. osdnedit.emf) which modifies the main menu (this should not change the main top level menu (i.e. 'File Edit Search...' but can change the rest, one of the main purposes for this is to correct the key bindings given with the menu item (e.g. Edit -> Copy claims to be bound to 'esc w' etc).

            The advantage of using the emulate interface is that it should work across different versions, the macro files get called at the right part of the initialisation process etc. which should mean less work for you.

            But this can be fairly tricky to get right, if you encounter problems then I suggest you email me directly and we'll work through the problems. As Jon suggests, I think a few users would be interested in this so if we cen get this working I'll put it into the main release.

            Steve

            -----Original Message-----
            From: Jon Green [mailto:jon@...]
            Sent: Wed 5/12/2004 4:51 AM
            To: jasspa@yahoogroups.com
            Cc:
            Subject: Re: [jasspa] Modifying key bindings
            A very sad thing to do, however...

            See prefix(2) in the on-line help.
            It will certainly de-emacs the system.
            To do this properly then the key bindings should
            be set up as an emulation mode.
            You might have a few problems with some of
            the macros.

            If you succeed then I know that there will
            be a few other people that would be interested
            in your results. For myself I type Emacs
            commands into Windows apps with disasterous
            effects - wish Windows would support
            Emacs key bindings not the other way around.

            If you progress to a point that it is feasible
            then you may need a little more help in trying
            to remove bindings made in the macros. We will
            need to consider how to address this issue in
            some more depth.

            Regards
            Jon.

            first last wrote:

            > Hi everyone,
            >
            > I have been playing around with rebinding the keys to make them CUA
            > compliant (just like win/os2/kde and so on) and it seems to work
            > alright for most things, but when I get to C-c and C-x I get error
            > messages. Is it possible to reassing those keys using macros or would
            > it have to be done via the source?
            >
            > I know it is a bit of a weird idea to "de-emacs" the keybidings but I
            > am spending a lot of time in CUA environments and I keep on doing the
            > wrong thing, so I'd like to try to set them up the same (and windows
            > does not allow you to change most of the key bindings).
            >
            > Any info will be welcome.
            >
            > Thanks
            >
            > Gabriel
          • first last
            I know it is a sad thing, I keep on C-a and C-e everywhere with some disastrous results (C-e in mysqlcc is execute SQL ), but if you can t get Mohammed to
            Message 5 of 9 , May 12 2:35 AM
              I know it is a sad thing, I keep on C-a and C-e everywhere with some
              disastrous results (C-e in mysqlcc is "execute SQL"), but if you can't
              get Mohammed to come to the Mountain....


              --- Jon Green <jon@...> wrote:
              ---------------------------------
              A very sad thing to do, however...

              See prefix(2) in the on-line help.
              It will certainly de-emacs the system.
              To do this properly then the key bindings should
              be set up as an emulation mode.
              You might have a few problems with some of
              the macros.

              If you succeed then I know that there will
              be a few other people that would be interested
              in your results. For myself I type Emacs
              commands into Windows apps with disasterous
              effects - wish Windows would support
              Emacs key bindings not the other way around.

              If you progress to a point that it is feasible
              then you may need a little more help in trying
              to remove bindings made in the macros. We will
              need to consider how to address this issue in
              some more depth.

              Regards
              Jon.

              first last wrote:

              > Hi everyone,
              >
              > I have been playing around with rebinding the keys to make them CUA
              > compliant (just like win/os2/kde and so on) and it seems to work
              > alright for most things, but when I get to C-c and C-x I get error
              > messages. Is it possible to reassing those keys using macros or would
              > it have to be done via the source?
              >
              > I know it is a bit of a weird idea to "de-emacs" the keybidings but I
              > am spending a lot of time in CUA environments and I keep on doing the
              > wrong thing, so I'd like to try to set them up the same (and windows
              > does not allow you to change most of the key bindings).
              >
              > Any info will be welcome.
              >
              > Thanks
              >
              > Gabriel




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            • Thomas Hundt
              I would not find this useful. IMO, ME is the wrong tool for this. I would use rsync and cron to set up a mirroring strategy, instead. In fact this is
              Message 6 of 9 , May 12 11:38 AM
                I would not find this useful. IMO, ME is the wrong tool for this. I
                would use 'rsync' and 'cron' to set up a mirroring strategy, instead.
                In fact this is what I'm going to implement very shortly to prevent the
                problem I had when my Windows hung and ME wrote my file with zero length
                the other day. (N.b. I don't necessarily need my files saved
                up-to-the-minute; it's enough to have them up-to-the-day.)

                -Th

                Steven Phillips wrote:

                > Going back to your original drive for using this (a very bad windows crash) I
                > have had a similar experience but with a disk drive crash. The outcome of this
                > was more a desire for a mirror path rather than an different backup location as
                > after the crash I wanted the latest version of all files, not the previous
                > one.
                >
                > I was therefore thinking of introducing a new $MEMIRRORPATH and $MEMIRRORSUB,
                > which have the same behavior as the BACKUP ones. When a file is saved it is
                > backed up and written out as normal and then if $MEMIRRORPATH is set it is
                > also written to the MIRROR path (with no backup).
                >
                > If there is a general consensus that this would be useful then I will try to
                > implement this feature.
                >

                --
                Thomas Hundt
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