Loading ...
Sorry, an error occurred while loading the content.
 

Re: [JainList] Fermented foods - anantkay ?- Clarification

Expand Messages
  • Kamal Shah
    But isn t there a difference? Water is necessary for survival but not curd. Then why is it not said that NEVER have curd? For example, it is not allowed to
    Message 1 of 8 , Jul 1, 2004
      But isn't there a difference? Water is necessary for survival but not
      curd. Then why is it not said that NEVER have curd? For example, it is
      not allowed to have potatoes after boiling them even though all the
      organisms would have been killed.

      Thanks
      Kamal


      On 29-Jun-04, at 8:15 PM, Nina Pipalia wrote:

      > Its the same principle as boiling water. Normally bacteria multiply at
      > 37 °C. Above 40 °C these type of bacterias cannot survive. Hence when
      > we boil or heat curd to 60 °C they are not alive any more. I am not
      > sure what category these bacteria falls. I would assume they are
      > ekindriya jivs.
      >
    • Pritish Shah
      Kamal, The difference is this 1) To harvest the potatoes, you have to kill the entire micro-eco-system that survives on the potato plant. This eco system
      Message 2 of 8 , Jul 2, 2004
        Kamal,

        The difference is this

        1) To harvest the potatoes, you have to "kill" the
        entire micro-eco-system that survives on the potato
        plant. This eco system includes ekendriya and
        baendriya , traendriya and chowendriya jivas.

        2) The potato plants also have what are called
        "nematodes". These are nodules in the root system that
        does have anantkay jivas in them. And uprooting the
        plant kills these nematodes.

        3) Whereas eating curd does not "kill" any life. The
        bacteria in the curd live out their normal life and
        then die but they do not die because of our actions.
        We do not kill them, our system just limits their
        ability to multiply.

        BTW, potato itself does not have anantkay jivas. For
        anyone who wants to argue against this, I would
        suggest that they look at a slice of raw or cooked
        potato under a very powerful microscope. The anantkay
        jivas are in the nematodes and not in the potato
        itself. For a closeup of a fresh potato look at
        http://www.feic.com/products/esem-div.htm

        FYI: Potato is native to South America. It came to
        India with the europeans after 1600AD maybe even as
        late as 1700s AD.

        Finally: The reason we do not eat potato after it
        "sprouts" is because at that point (the point when it
        turns green) it becomes somewhat poisonous.

        Disclaimer: I am not a proponent of potato, I am a
        seeker of knowledge. If I have given any info that is
        wrong, michaami dudkram.

        Pritish


        --- Kamal Shah <kamal@...> wrote:
        > But isn't there a difference? Water is necessary for
        > survival but not
        > curd. Then why is it not said that NEVER have curd?
        > For example, it is
        > not allowed to have potatoes after boiling them even
        > though all the
        > organisms would have been killed.
        >
        > Thanks
        > Kamal
        >
        >
        > On 29-Jun-04, at 8:15 PM, Nina Pipalia wrote:
        >
        > > Its the same principle as boiling water. Normally
        > bacteria multiply at
        > > 37 �C. Above 40 �C these type of bacterias cannot
        > survive. Hence when
        > > we boil or heat curd to 60 �C they are not alive
        > any more. I am not
        > > sure what category these bacteria falls. I would
        > assume they are
        > > ekindriya jivs.
        > >
      • Kamal Shah
        Thanks Pritish! That made sense. What about other roots like onion and garlic? Do they by themselves have anantkay or do they have something similar to the
        Message 3 of 8 , Jul 4, 2004
          Thanks Pritish! That made sense. What about other roots like onion and
          garlic? Do they by themselves have anantkay or do they have something
          similar to the potato?

          Thanks
          Kamal


          On 02-Jul-04, at 8:50 PM, Pritish Shah wrote:

          > Kamal,
          >
          > The difference is this
          >
          > 1) To harvest the potatoes, you have to "kill" the
          > entire micro-eco-system that survives on the potato
          > plant. This eco system includes ekendriya and
          > baendriya , traendriya and chowendriya jivas.
          >
          > 2) The potato plants also have what are called
          > "nematodes". These are nodules in the root system that
          > does have anantkay jivas in them. And uprooting the
          > plant kills these nematodes.
          >
          > 3) Whereas eating curd does not "kill" any life. The
          > bacteria in the curd live out their normal life and
          > then die but they do not die because of our actions.
          > We do not kill them, our system just limits their
          > ability to multiply.
          >
          > BTW, potato itself does not have anantkay jivas. For
          > anyone who wants to argue against this, I would
          > suggest that they look at a slice of raw or cooked
          > potato under a very powerful microscope. The anantkay
          > jivas are in the nematodes and not in the potato
          > itself. For a closeup of a fresh potato look at
          > http://www.feic.com/products/esem-div.htm
          >
          > FYI: Potato is native to South America. It came to
          > India with the europeans after 1600AD maybe even as
          > late as 1700s AD.
          >
          > Finally: The reason we do not eat potato after it
          > "sprouts" is because at that point (the point when it
          > turns green) it becomes somewhat poisonous.
          >
          > Disclaimer: I am not a proponent of potato, I am a
          > seeker of knowledge. If I have given any info that is
          > wrong, michaami dudkram.
          >
          > Pritish
          >
          >
        • panks jain
          jai jinendra jain upwas ( fast) also has a scientific reason in our normal routine life v eat like anything without limit to diet , some eat for living but
          Message 4 of 8 , Jul 4, 2004
            jai jinendra
             
            jain upwas ( fast) also has a scientific reason
            in our normal routine life v eat like anything without limit to diet , some eat for living
            but majority of us live for eating
            so unnecessary fats starts accumulating in our body
            so by duing jain fast actually our body maintains removing excess unnecessary fat,
            its like wen body is hungry for full day it searches each & every bowl inside our body & drinking hot water is like flushing our inner body , our inner circular system is hot , fire of body which makes it work , so wen some one drinks cold water it slows down ones internal system , to tune up one is advised to drink warm water & at same time warm water kills all bacterias present in water
             
            its advisable to do a jain fast a month not for puniya but to purify ones digestion system
             
             
            fast sud b syncronised with meditation , in jain v call it samayik ( jain meditation )purifies ones soul ones karma , it after all depends on persons dedication , sincerity , dont do for someone said u so ,
            till ones mind , heart, soul ar not receptive all vud b sheer waste
             
            better follow everything not blindly but with a logical understanding behind it, were by jainism is a science too
             
            for benifit of all living creatures
             
            in ABU ROAD RAJASTHAN  IN PAVAPURI  (A JAIN TEMPLE) COWS TOO FAST , GIVE PRADISHANA TO THE JAIN TEMPLE , & MEDITATE ON JAIN MAHAMANTRA NAVKAR MAHAMANTRA , ppl feel lot inspired seeing cows dedication , sincerity towards fasting & worship
             
            well said on question who is the biggest fool ???
            one who lies to himself
             
            listen to all but do wat ur heart says
             
            JAIN SHRAVAK
            PANKS JAIN

            Kamal Shah <kamal@...> wrote:
            <
          • Pritish Shah
            Kamal, The same reason applies to Onion/Garlic etc. To harvest the produce , we have to uproot and kill the plant. There is no escaping that. Strict Jains
            Message 5 of 8 , Jul 6, 2004
              Kamal,

              The same reason applies to Onion/Garlic etc. To
              harvest the "produce", we have to uproot and kill the
              plant. There is no escaping that. Strict Jains will
              not even eat Kohlrabi (alkul), Cilantro etc because we
              have to kill the plant to harvest the produce.

              Turmeric and Ginger are generally an exception because
              of their medicinal values but strict Jains will not
              consume even these.

              With the above philosophy, one can argue that we can
              eat "green onion" (the leaves of the onion). While
              that is true, one of the other reasons that we do not
              eat onion is because it is classified as "tamsic" food
              -- food that brings out negative emotions.

              There are three kinds of food -- Rajsic (meat and
              other foods that bring out violent thoughts), Tamsic
              (onion and other foods that bring out negative
              emotions) and Sattavic (foods that bring out positive
              emotions).

              Jains only eat Sattavic food as it helps in walking up
              the ladder of knowledge levels.

              Pritish

              --- Kamal Shah <kamal@...> wrote:
              > Thanks Pritish! That made sense. What about other
              > roots like onion and
              > garlic? Do they by themselves have anantkay or do
              > they have something
              > similar to the potato?
              >
              > Thanks
              > Kamal
              >
              >
              > On 02-Jul-04, at 8:50 PM, Pritish Shah wrote:
              >
              > > Kamal,
              > >
              > > The difference is this
              > >
              > > 1) To harvest the potatoes, you have to "kill" the
              > > entire micro-eco-system that survives on the
              > potato
              > > plant. This eco system includes ekendriya and
              > > baendriya , traendriya and chowendriya jivas.
              > >
              > > 2) The potato plants also have what are called
              > > "nematodes". These are nodules in the root system
              > that
              > > does have anantkay jivas in them. And uprooting
              > the
              > > plant kills these nematodes.
              > >
              > > 3) Whereas eating curd does not "kill" any life.
              > The
              > > bacteria in the curd live out their normal life
              > and
              > > then die but they do not die because of our
              > actions.
              > > We do not kill them, our system just limits their
              > > ability to multiply.
              > >
              > > BTW, potato itself does not have anantkay jivas.
              > For
              > > anyone who wants to argue against this, I would
              > > suggest that they look at a slice of raw or cooked
              > > potato under a very powerful microscope. The
              > anantkay
              > > jivas are in the nematodes and not in the potato
              > > itself. For a closeup of a fresh potato look at
              > > http://www.feic.com/products/esem-div.htm
              > >
              > > FYI: Potato is native to South America. It came to
              > > India with the europeans after 1600AD maybe even
              > as
              > > late as 1700s AD.
              > >
              > > Finally: The reason we do not eat potato after it
              > > "sprouts" is because at that point (the point when
              > it
              > > turns green) it becomes somewhat poisonous.
              > >
              > > Disclaimer: I am not a proponent of potato, I am a
              > > seeker of knowledge. If I have given any info that
              > is
              > > wrong, michaami dudkram.
              > >
              > > Pritish
              > >
              > >
              >
              >
            Your message has been successfully submitted and would be delivered to recipients shortly.