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Re: Vanity Sink Strainer/Stopper

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  • newtmerrill
    Bill--See my email to you--sent this afternoon. Let me know if you don t receive. Regards, Newt (FINESSE #20)
    Message 1 of 17 , Jun 26, 2011
    • 0 Attachment
      Bill--See my email to you--sent this afternoon. Let me know if you don't receive. Regards, Newt (FINESSE #20)

      --- In j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com, William Stellin <wstellin@...> wrote:
      >
      > I have a starting problem that someone might be able to help with. At times, when I turn the key to start the engine, I hear a click from the magnetic ( solenoid) switch, but the starter doesn't spin or do anything. If I repeatedly turn the key the motor will eventually start. Sometimes I have to turn the key three times. This never happens when starting after disconecting the shore power, only happens after I have been sailing with nothing charging the battery. Might it be the contacts on the magnetic switch or even the brushes in the starter motor. I am reasonably sure it is not the battery as it turns over briskly when it finally decides to start.
      > Your collective thoughts would be much appreciated.
      > Bill Stellin
      > Jaywalker. 3500 hours on the engine
      >
      > Sent from my iPod
      >
      > On Jun 24, 2011, at 10:10 PM, Bernard Coyne <coyneb@...> wrote:
      >
      > > Try TPI the former Jboats builder.....they still carry or can help you. We replaced our from them albeit that was 10yrs ago :-)
      > >
      > > 401-247-1050
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > > Bernie Coyne
      > > Market Manager
      > > Change & Configuration Management Solutions
      > > IBM Software Group, Rational
      > > Phone: 720-396-6297
      > > Email: coyneb@... <mime-attachment.gif>
      > > <mime-attachment.gif>
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > > From: "E38200" <dick.sanford@...>
      > > To: j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com
      > > Date: 06/24/2011 03:01 PM
      > > Subject: [j4x-owners-group] Vanity Sink Strainer/Stopper
      > > Sent by: j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > >
      > > Does anyone know where to source the plastic strainer/stopper for the
      > > head sinks? I am trying to avoid replacing the entire drain assembly
      > > just so I can have a new strainer/stopper (the old one broke).
      > >
      > >
      > >
      >
    • William Stellin
      Thanks for your reply. Now I have the harness to worry about as well. It seems to only occur after the engine has been running, shut off and then restarted
      Message 2 of 17 , Jun 26, 2011
      • 0 Attachment
        Thanks for your reply. Now I have the harness to worry about as well. It seems to only occur after the engine has been running, shut off and then restarted while it is still warm. Batteries are all fully charged and combined at times for starting to see if extra juice might make a difference. It doesn't. I have a hard time believing it is the starter, solenoid, switch or voltage drop. When the solenoid clicks it means it is getting juice from the key switch. Some have said it is burned contacts in the solenoid which maybe it is. I hate to spend a fortune and hours chasing the wrong fix. 
        Bill

        Sent from my iPod

        On Jun 26, 2011, at 5:27 PM, "newtmerrill" <newt@...> wrote:

         

        Bill--See my email to you--sent this afternoon. Let me know if you don't receive. Regards, Newt (FINESSE #20)

        --- In j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com, William Stellin <wstellin@...> wrote:
        >
        > I have a starting problem that someone might be able to help with. At times, when I turn the key to start the engine, I hear a click from the magnetic ( solenoid) switch, but the starter doesn't spin or do anything. If I repeatedly turn the key the motor will eventually start. Sometimes I have to turn the key three times. This never happens when starting after disconecting the shore power, only happens after I have been sailing with nothing charging the battery. Might it be the contacts on the magnetic switch or even the brushes in the starter motor. I am reasonably sure it is not the battery as it turns over briskly when it finally decides to start.
        > Your collective thoughts would be much appreciated.
        > Bill Stellin
        > Jaywalker. 3500 hours on the engine
        >
        > Sent from my iPod
        >
        > On Jun 24, 2011, at 10:10 PM, Bernard Coyne <coyneb@...> wrote:
        >
        > > Try TPI the former Jboats builder.....they still carry or can help you. We replaced our from them albeit that was 10yrs ago :-)
        > >
        > > 401-247-1050
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > > Bernie Coyne
        > > Market Manager
        > > Change & Configuration Management Solutions
        > > IBM Software Group, Rational
        > > Phone: 720-396-6297
        > > Email: coyneb@... <mime-attachment.gif>
        > > <mime-attachment.gif>
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > > From: "E38200" <dick.sanford@...>
        > > To: j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com
        > > Date: 06/24/2011 03:01 PM
        > > Subject: [j4x-owners-group] Vanity Sink Strainer/Stopper
        > > Sent by: j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > >
        > > Does anyone know where to source the plastic strainer/stopper for the
        > > head sinks? I am trying to avoid replacing the entire drain assembly
        > > just so I can have a new strainer/stopper (the old one broke).
        > >
        > >
        > >
        >

      • Ivan C Getting
        Greetings all, I believe there is an easy test to see if the starting failure is caused by resistance in the starter switch/harness and the concomitant lack of
        Message 3 of 17 , Jun 26, 2011
        • 0 Attachment
          Greetings all,

          I believe there is an easy test to see if the starting failure is caused by resistance in the starter switch/harness and the concomitant lack of current through the starter solenoid. 

          Connect the battery positive directly to the solenoid positive terminal through a low resistance path:

          On the solenoid there are two large terminals with are connected together when the solenoid is energized.  Ignore these two.  Additionally there is a smaller, male spade-type connector with the wire from the starter switch attached.  Disconnect this wire. 
          Make up a wire about 1 foot length of 14 or 12 gauge insulated wire with a mating female slip-on spade connector on one end and a modest-size lug connector on the other.  Connect the spade connector end to the solenoid spade terminal and touch the other end to the large, positive terminal on the alternator, the one with the larger red cable.  Don't be "shocked".  There will be sparks when you touch the wire to the alternator terminal as the solenoid is an inductive load.  Fear not, 12 VDC is harmless, even if sparks are impressive.  If you are steadier than I am you will not jump quite as far and manage to maintain contact despite the initial sparks the first time.  I am pretty good at it the second time.  Touch the nut, not the threads of the alternator stud so as not to "burn" the threads at all.  This simply imitates the function of the starter switch and you have "hot wired" your starter.   (Now you can start anybody's diesel without the key, but behave yourself.)   I keep such a little cable next to the engine just in case...  Note - you may want to turn the engine starting switch to "run", not "start", before trying this.  That way you can see the oil pressure indication right away.  Also, this procedure defeats any interlock on the gearshift, so be sure the transmission is in neutral.

          If the motor turns over quickly and starts easily everything at that end is probably fine.  The harness/starter switch likely have developed some unacceptable resistance.  The solenoid requires considerable current to close all the way quickly.  It can "click" and not close well as I remember from my early years with cars in bad condition.  First try cleaning the spade connector on the solenoid and apply a light coat of silicone grease.  Then work the connector that goes on it on and off several times to clean any oxide or dirt from it as well.  That fixed the problem for me when it occurred.  After that chase down all the other connectors you can find in the harness.  When that fails pull the wires off the starter switch and hold them together.  The failure should eventually present itself.

          If jumping the starter fails to work it is the solenoid and/or the starter motor.

          On a previous boat it was a break in the wiring harness itself which I never could locate.  I just strung a new wire from the starter switch to the solenoid.

          Good luck.  I'd be interested to hear any results.

          Ivan Getting
          KITTIWAKE
          Hull no. 74, 2006




          On 06/26/11 4:32 PM, William Stellin wrote:
           
          Thanks for your reply. Now I have the harness to worry about as well. It seems to only occur after the engine has been running, shut off and then restarted while it is still warm. Batteries are all fully charged and combined at times for starting to see if extra juice might make a difference. It doesn't. I have a hard time believing it is the starter, solenoid, switch or voltage drop. When the solenoid clicks it means it is getting juice from the key switch. Some have said it is burned contacts in the solenoid which maybe it is. I hate to spend a fortune and hours chasing the wrong fix. 
          Bill

          Sent from my iPod

          On Jun 26, 2011, at 5:27 PM, "newtmerrill" <newt@...> wrote:

           

          Bill--See my email to you--sent this afternoon. Let me know if you don't receive. Regards, Newt (FINESSE #20)

          --- In j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com, William Stellin <wstellin@...> wrote:
          >
          > I have a starting problem that someone might be able to help with. At times, when I turn the key to start the engine, I hear a click from the magnetic ( solenoid) switch, but the starter doesn't spin or do anything. If I repeatedly turn the key the motor will eventually start. Sometimes I have to turn the key three times. This never happens when starting after disconecting the shore power, only happens after I have been sailing with nothing charging the battery. Might it be the contacts on the magnetic switch or even the brushes in the starter motor. I am reasonably sure it is not the battery as it turns over briskly when it finally decides to start.
          > Your collective thoughts would be much appreciated.
          > Bill Stellin
          > Jaywalker. 3500 hours on the engine
          >
          > Sent from my iPod
          >
          > On Jun 24, 2011, at 10:10 PM, Bernard Coyne <coyneb@...> wrote:
          >
          > > Try TPI the former Jboats builder.....they still carry or can help you. We replaced our from them albeit that was 10yrs ago :-)
          > >
          > > 401-247-1050
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > > Bernie Coyne
          > > Market Manager
          > > Change & Configuration Management Solutions
          > > IBM Software Group, Rational
          > > Phone: 720-396-6297
          > > Email: coyneb@... <mime-attachment.gif>
          > > <mime-attachment.gif>
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > > From: "E38200" <dick.sanford@...>
          > > To: j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com
          > > Date: 06/24/2011 03:01 PM
          > > Subject: [j4x-owners-group] Vanity Sink Strainer/Stopper
          > > Sent by: j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > >
          > > Does anyone know where to source the plastic strainer/stopper for the
          > > head sinks? I am trying to avoid replacing the entire drain assembly
          > > just so I can have a new strainer/stopper (the old one broke).
          > >
          > >
          > >
          >

        • William Stellin
          I have a momentary switch with alligator clips that I can attach to the solenoid and a positive battery source. When I press the button, it momentarily
          Message 4 of 17 , Jun 26, 2011
          • 0 Attachment
            I have a "momentary switch" with alligator clips that I can attach to the solenoid and a positive battery source. When I press the button, it momentarily closes the circuit and engages the starter. This should do the same thing as you suggest. Am I understanding you correctly in that just hearing the solenoid click doesn't mean it is getting full current.  If this is the case, the fix might just be installing a relay to avoid the harness resistance. What do you think? 
            Bill

            Sent from my iPod

            On Jun 26, 2011, at 8:16 PM, Ivan C Getting <getting@...> wrote:

             

            Greetings all,

            I believe there is an easy test to see if the starting failure is caused by resistance in the starter switch/harness and the concomitant lack of current through the starter solenoid. 

            Connect the battery positive directly to the solenoid positive terminal through a low resistance path:

            On the solenoid there are two large terminals with are connected together when the solenoid is energized.  Ignore these two.  Additionally there is a smaller, male spade-type connector with the wire from the starter switch attached.  Disconnect this wire. 
            Make up a wire about 1 foot length of 14 or 12 gauge insulated wire with a mating female slip-on spade connector on one end and a modest-size lug connector on the other.  Connect the spade connector end to the solenoid spade terminal and touch the other end to the large, positive terminal on the alternator, the one with the larger red cable.  Don't be "shocked".  There will be sparks when you touch the wire to the alternator terminal as the solenoid is an inductive load.  Fear not, 12 VDC is harmless, even if sparks are impressive.  If you are steadier than I am you will not jump quite as far and manage to maintain contact despite the initial sparks the first time.  I am pretty good at it the second time.  Touch the nut, not the threads of the alternator stud so as not to "burn" the threads at all.  This simply imitates the function of the starter switch and you have "hot wired" your starter.   (Now you can start anybody's diesel without the key, but behave yourself.)   I keep such a little cable next to the engine just in case...  Note - you may want to turn the engine starting switch to "run", not "start", before trying this.  That way you can see the oil pressure indication right away.  Also, this procedure defeats any interlock on the gearshift, so be sure the transmission is in neutral.

            If the motor turns over quickly and starts easily everything at that end is probably fine.  The harness/starter switch likely have developed some unacceptable resistance.  The solenoid requires considerable current to close all the way quickly.  It can "click" and not close well as I remember from my early years with cars in bad condition.  First try cleaning the spade connector on the solenoid and apply a light coat of silicone grease.  Then work the connector that goes on it on and off several times to clean any oxide or dirt from it as well.  That fixed the problem for me when it occurred.  After that chase down all the other connectors you can find in the harness.  When that fails pull the wires off the starter switch and hold them together.  The failure should eventually present itself.

            If jumping the starter fails to work it is the solenoid and/or the starter motor.

            On a previous boat it was a break in the wiring harness itself which I never could locate.  I just strung a new wire from the starter switch to the solenoid.

            Good luck.  I'd be interested to hear any results.

            Ivan Getting
            KITTIWAKE
            Hull no. 74, 2006




            On 06/26/11 4:32 PM, William Stellin wrote:

             
            Thanks for your reply. Now I have the harness to worry about as well. It seems to only occur after the engine has been running, shut off and then restarted while it is still warm. Batteries are all fully charged and combined at times for starting to see if extra juice might make a difference. It doesn't. I have a hard time believing it is the starter, solenoid, switch or voltage drop. When the solenoid clicks it means it is getting juice from the key switch. Some have said it is burned contacts in the solenoid which maybe it is. I hate to spend a fortune and hours chasing the wrong fix. 
            Bill

            Sent from my iPod

            On Jun 26, 2011, at 5:27 PM, "newtmerrill" <newt@...> wrote:

             

            Bill--See my email to you--sent this afternoon. Let me know if you don't receive. Regards, Newt (FINESSE #20)

            --- In j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com, William Stellin <wstellin@...> wrote:
            >
            > I have a starting problem that someone might be able to help with. At times, when I turn the key to start the engine, I hear a click from the magnetic ( solenoid) switch, but the starter doesn't spin or do anything. If I repeatedly turn the key the motor will eventually start. Sometimes I have to turn the key three times. This never happens when starting after disconecting the shore power, only happens after I have been sailing with nothing charging the battery. Might it be the contacts on the magnetic switch or even the brushes in the starter motor. I am reasonably sure it is not the battery as it turns over briskly when it finally decides to start.
            > Your collective thoughts would be much appreciated.
            > Bill Stellin
            > Jaywalker. 3500 hours on the engine
            >
            > Sent from my iPod
            >
            > On Jun 24, 2011, at 10:10 PM, Bernard Coyne <coyneb@...> wrote:
            >
            > > Try TPI the former Jboats builder.....they still carry or can help you. We replaced our from them albeit that was 10yrs ago :-)
            > >
            > > 401-247-1050
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > > Bernie Coyne
            > > Market Manager
            > > Change & Configuration Management Solutions
            > > IBM Software Group, Rational
            > > Phone: 720-396-6297
            > > Email: coyneb@... <mime-attachment.gif>
            > > <mime-attachment.gif>
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > > From: "E38200" <dick.sanford@...>
            > > To: j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com
            > > Date: 06/24/2011 03:01 PM
            > > Subject: [j4x-owners-group] Vanity Sink Strainer/Stopper
            > > Sent by: j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > >
            > > Does anyone know where to source the plastic strainer/stopper for the
            > > head sinks? I am trying to avoid replacing the entire drain assembly
            > > just so I can have a new strainer/stopper (the old one broke).
            > >
            > >
            > >
            >

          • William Stellin
            Bernie Thanks for your comments. I will explain all my troubleshooting to Mack Boring and my local Yanmar dealer and see if I can get some agreement on the
            Message 5 of 17 , Jun 26, 2011
            • 0 Attachment
              Bernie
              Thanks for your comments. I will explain all my troubleshooting to Mack Boring and my local Yanmar dealer and see if I can get some agreement on the cause being resistance and the relay being the fix.
              Bill

              Sent from my iPod

              On Jun 26, 2011, at 8:00 AM, Bernard Coyne <coyneb@...> wrote:

               

              Bill:   Do you have the remote starter solenoid switch installed?  I had the same problem as you when we first purchased Amigo VI back in 2001.  I contacted our mechanic and he installed the Yanmar upgradeable part which is a small solenoid attached to the engine right near the starter.  This cured the problem and I have never had the problem again.

              Bernie
              Amigo VI


              Bernie Coyne
              Market Manager
              Change & Configuration Management Solutions              
              IBM Software Group, Rational
              Phone:  720-396-6297
              Email:   coyneb@...
              <mime-attachment.gif>





              From:        William Stellin <wstellin@...>
              To:        "j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com" <j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com>
              Cc:        "j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com" <j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com>
              Date:        06/25/2011 09:58 PM
              Subject:        Re: [j4x-owners-group] Vanity Sink Strainer/Stopper
              Sent by:        j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com




               

              I have a starting problem that someone might be able to help with. At times, when I turn the key to start the engine, I hear a click from the magnetic ( solenoid) switch, but the starter doesn't spin or do anything. If I repeatedly turn the key the motor will eventually start. Sometimes I have to turn the key three times. This never happens when starting after disconecting the shore power, only happens after I have been sailing with nothing charging the battery. Might it be the contacts on the magnetic switch or even the brushes in the starter motor. I am reasonably sure it is not the battery as it turns over briskly when it finally decides to start.

              Your collective thoughts would be much appreciated.
              Bill Stellin
              Jaywalker. 3500 hours on the engine

              Sent from my iPod


              On Jun 24, 2011, at 10:10 PM, Bernard Coyne <
              coyneb@...> wrote:

               

              Try TPI the former Jboats builder.....they still carry or can help you.  We replaced our from them albeit that was 10yrs ago :-)

              401-247-1050



              Bernie Coyne
              Market Manager
              Change & Configuration Management Solutions              
              IBM Software Group, Rational
              Phone:  720-396-6297
              Email:  
              coyneb@...
              <mime-attachment.gif>






              From:        
              "E38200" <dick.sanford@...>
              To:        
              j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com
              Date:        
              06/24/2011 03:01 PM
              Subject:        
              [j4x-owners-group] Vanity Sink Strainer/Stopper
              Sent by:        
              j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com




               

              Does anyone know where to source the plastic strainer/stopper for the
              head sinks? I am trying to avoid replacing the entire drain assembly
              just so I can have a new strainer/stopper (the old one broke).


            • Ivan C Getting
              Bill, Should work to test the solenoid/starter motor.  The only problem I can think of is that the momentary switch could fuse if it does not have sufficient
              Message 6 of 17 , Jun 26, 2011
              • 0 Attachment
                Bill,

                Should work to test the solenoid/starter motor.  The only problem I can think of is that the momentary switch could fuse if it does not have sufficient current carrying capacity or one alligator clip could arc and trash the spade connector on the solenoid.  I'd prefer a proper spade connector at the solenoid end.  We know that works in general. 
                Of course let go of the switch button as soon as the engine starts.
                  If the switch should fuse just pull off the alligator clip from the positive battery source to stop cranking the engine.

                The relay idea could make sense, but, also, it is just another electromagnetic switch like the starter solenoid but with lower current.  It can also fail some day.  If the J/42 installations have a history of developing unacceptable resistance in the starter switch/harness circuit the a relay might be a good idea.  It that resistance were too large it could prevent the relay from working as well, however.

                In any case, I like having my little jumper wire by the starter.  Should the installed system ever fail again I can jump the engine very quickly if need be.

                Ivan


                On 06/26/11 7:40 PM, William Stellin wrote:
                 
                I have a "momentary switch" with alligator clips that I can attach to the solenoid and a positive battery source. When I press the button, it momentarily closes the circuit and engages the starter. This should do the same thing as you suggest. Am I understanding you correctly in that just hearing the solenoid click doesn't mean it is getting full current.  If this is the case, the fix might just be installing a relay to avoid the harness resistance. What do you think? 
                Bill

                Sent from my iPod

                On Jun 26, 2011, at 8:16 PM, Ivan C Getting <getting@...> wrote:

                 

                Greetings all,

                I believe there is an easy test to see if the starting failure is caused by resistance in the starter switch/harness and the concomitant lack of current through the starter solenoid. 

                Connect the battery positive directly to the solenoid positive terminal through a low resistance path:

                On the solenoid there are two large terminals with are connected together when the solenoid is energized.  Ignore these two.  Additionally there is a smaller, male spade-type connector with the wire from the starter switch attached.  Disconnect this wire. 
                Make up a wire about 1 foot length of 14 or 12 gauge insulated wire with a mating female slip-on spade connector on one end and a modest-size lug connector on the other.  Connect the spade connector end to the solenoid spade terminal and touch the other end to the large, positive terminal on the alternator, the one with the larger red cable.  Don't be "shocked".  There will be sparks when you touch the wire to the alternator terminal as the solenoid is an inductive load.  Fear not, 12 VDC is harmless, even if sparks are impressive.  If you are steadier than I am you will not jump quite as far and manage to maintain contact despite the initial sparks the first time.  I am pretty good at it the second time.  Touch the nut, not the threads of the alternator stud so as not to "burn" the threads at all.  This simply imitates the function of the starter switch and you have "hot wired" your starter.   (Now you can start anybody's diesel without the key, but behave yourself.)   I keep such a little cable next to the engine just in case...  Note - you may want to turn the engine starting switch to "run", not "start", before trying this.  That way you can see the oil pressure indication right away.  Also, this procedure defeats any interlock on the gearshift, so be sure the transmission is in neutral.

                If the motor turns over quickly and starts easily everything at that end is probably fine.  The harness/starter switch likely have developed some unacceptable resistance.  The solenoid requires considerable current to close all the way quickly.  It can "click" and not close well as I remember from my early years with cars in bad condition.  First try cleaning the spade connector on the solenoid and apply a light coat of silicone grease.  Then work the connector that goes on it on and off several times to clean any oxide or dirt from it as well.  That fixed the problem for me when it occurred.  After that chase down all the other connectors you can find in the harness.  When that fails pull the wires off the starter switch and hold them together.  The failure should eventually present itself.

                If jumping the starter fails to work it is the solenoid and/or the starter motor.

                On a previous boat it was a break in the wiring harness itself which I never could locate.  I just strung a new wire from the starter switch to the solenoid.

                Good luck.  I'd be interested to hear any results.

                Ivan Getting
                KITTIWAKE
                Hull no. 74, 2006




                On 06/26/11 4:32 PM, William Stellin wrote:

                 
                Thanks for your reply. Now I have the harness to worry about as well. It seems to only occur after the engine has been running, shut off and then restarted while it is still warm. Batteries are all fully charged and combined at times for starting to see if extra juice might make a difference. It doesn't. I have a hard time believing it is the starter, solenoid, switch or voltage drop. When the solenoid clicks it means it is getting juice from the key switch. Some have said it is burned contacts in the solenoid which maybe it is. I hate to spend a fortune and hours chasing the wrong fix. 
                Bill

                Sent from my iPod

                On Jun 26, 2011, at 5:27 PM, "newtmerrill" <newt@...>wrote:

                 

                Bill--See my email to you--sent this afternoon. Let me know if you don't receive. Regards, Newt (FINESSE #20)

                --- In j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com, William Stellin <wstellin@...> wrote:
                >
                > I have a starting problem that someone might be able to help with. At times, when I turn the key to start the engine, I hear a click from the magnetic ( solenoid) switch, but the starter doesn't spin or do anything. If I repeatedly turn the key the motor will eventually start. Sometimes I have to turn the key three times. This never happens when starting after disconecting the shore power, only happens after I have been sailing with nothing charging the battery. Might it be the contacts on the magnetic switch or even the brushes in the starter motor. I am reasonably sure it is not the battery as it turns over briskly when it finally decides to start.
                > Your collective thoughts would be much appreciated.
                > Bill Stellin
                > Jaywalker. 3500 hours on the engine
                >
                > Sent from my iPod
                >
                > On Jun 24, 2011, at 10:10 PM, Bernard Coyne <coyneb@...> wrote:
                >
                > > Try TPI the former Jboats builder.....they still carry or can help you. We replaced our from them albeit that was 10yrs ago :-)
                > >
                > > 401-247-1050
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > > Bernie Coyne
                > > Market Manager
                > > Change & Configuration Management Solutions
                > > IBM Software Group, Rational
                > > Phone: 720-396-6297
                > > Email: coyneb@... <mime-attachment.gif>
                > > <mime-attachment.gif>
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > > From: "E38200" <dick.sanford@...>
                > > To: j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com
                > > Date: 06/24/2011 03:01 PM
                > > Subject: [j4x-owners-group] Vanity Sink Strainer/Stopper
                > > Sent by: j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > > Does anyone know where to source the plastic strainer/stopper for the
                > > head sinks? I am trying to avoid replacing the entire drain assembly
                > > just so I can have a new strainer/stopper (the old one broke).
                > >
                > >
                > >
                >

            • Robert Thuss
              I had the same problem and used a momentary switch for awhile. It melted down at one point and almost caught fire! I’ve also used long needle nose pliers in
              Message 7 of 17 , Jun 27, 2011
              • 0 Attachment

                I had the same problem and used a momentary switch for awhile. It melted down at one point and almost caught fire! I’ve also used long needle nose pliers in a pinch.

                 

                I replaced the solenoid spade connections and that helped. I also had a problem that seemed to be based in the neutral safety switch (NSS). The shifter cables were old and it was hard to find neutral and the engine would not start. Somebody suggested disabling the NSS but I didn’t want to do that for safety reasons. So I replaced the shifter cables and haven’t had the problem since.

                 

                Robert Thuss

                J/42 Jade – USA 50777

                Atlantic Highlands, NJ

                 

                 

                From: j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com [mailto:j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ivan C Getting
                Sent: Sunday, June 26, 2011 11:34 PM
                To: j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com
                Subject: [j4x-owners-group] engine starter problems

                 

                 

                Bill,

                Should work to test the solenoid/starter motor.  The only problem I can think of is that the momentary switch could fuse if it does not have sufficient current carrying capacity or one alligator clip could arc and trash the spade connector on the solenoid.  I'd prefer a proper spade connector at the solenoid end.  We know that works in general. 
                Of course let go of the switch button as soon as the engine starts.
                  If the switch should fuse just pull off the alligator clip from the positive battery source to stop cranking the engine.

                The relay idea could make sense, but, also, it is just another electromagnetic switch like the starter solenoid but with lower current.  It can also fail some day.  If the J/42 installations have a history of developing unacceptable resistance in the starter switch/harness circuit the a relay might be a good idea.  It that resistance were too large it could prevent the relay from working as well, however.

                In any case, I like having my little jumper wire by the starter.  Should the installed system ever fail again I can jump the engine very quickly if need be.

                Ivan


                On 06/26/11 7:40 PM, William Stellin wrote:

                 

                I have a "momentary switch" with alligator clips that I can attach to the solenoid and a positive battery source. When I press the button, it momentarily closes the circuit and engages the starter. This should do the same thing as you suggest. Am I understanding you correctly in that just hearing the solenoid click doesn't mean it is getting full current.  If this is the case, the fix might just be installing a relay to avoid the harness resistance. What do you think? 

                Bill


                Sent from my iPod


                On Jun 26, 2011, at 8:16 PM, Ivan C Getting <getting@...> wrote:

                 

                Greetings all,

                I believe there is an easy test to see if the starting failure is caused by resistance in the starter switch/harness and the concomitant lack of current through the starter solenoid. 

                Connect the battery positive directly to the solenoid positive terminal through a low resistance path:

                On the solenoid there are two large terminals with are connected together when the solenoid is energized.  Ignore these two.  Additionally there is a smaller, male spade-type connector with the wire from the starter switch attached.  Disconnect this wire.  Make up a wire about 1 foot length of 14 or 12 gauge insulated wire with a mating female slip-on spade connector on one end and a modest-size lug connector on the other.  Connect the spade connector end to the solenoid spade terminal and touch the other end to the large, positive terminal on the alternator, the one with the larger red cable.  Don't be "shocked".  There will be sparks when you touch the wire to the alternator terminal as the solenoid is an inductive load.  Fear not, 12 VDC is harmless, even if sparks are impressive.  If you are steadier than I am you will not jump quite as far and manage to maintain contact despite the initial sparks the first time.  I am pretty good at it the second time.  Touch the nut, not the threads of the alternator stud so as not to "burn" the threads at all.  This simply imitates the function of the starter switch and you have "hot wired" your starter.   (Now you can start anybody's diesel without the key, but behave yourself.)   I keep such a little cable next to the engine just in case...  Note - you may want to turn the engine starting switch to "run", not "start", before trying this.  That way you can see the oil pressure indication right away.  Also, this procedure defeats any interlock on the gearshift, so be sure the transmission is in neutral.

                If the motor turns over quickly and starts easily everything at that end is probably fine.  The harness/starter switch likely have developed some unacceptable resistance.  The solenoid requires considerable current to close all the way quickly.  It can "click" and not close well as I remember from my early years with cars in bad condition.  First try cleaning the spade connector on the solenoid and apply a light coat of silicone grease.  Then work the connector that goes on it on and off several times to clean any oxide or dirt from it as well.  That fixed the problem for me when it occurred.  After that chase down all the other connectors you can find in the harness.  When that fails pull the wires off the starter switch and hold them together.  The failure should eventually present itself.

                If jumping the starter fails to work it is the solenoid and/or the starter motor.

                On a previous boat it was a break in the wiring harness itself which I never could locate.  I just strung a new wire from the starter switch to the solenoid.

                Good luck.  I'd be interested to hear any results.

                Ivan Getting
                KITTIWAKE
                Hull no. 74, 2006




                On 06/26/11 4:32 PM, William Stellin wrote:

                 

                Thanks for your reply. Now I have the harness to worry about as well. It seems to only occur after the engine has been running, shut off and then restarted while it is still warm. Batteries are all fully charged and combined at times for starting to see if extra juice might make a difference. It doesn't. I have a hard time believing it is the starter, solenoid, switch or voltage drop. When the solenoid clicks it means it is getting juice from the key switch. Some have said it is burned contacts in the solenoid which maybe it is. I hate to spend a fortune and hours chasing the wrong fix. 

                Bill


                Sent from my iPod


                On Jun 26, 2011, at 5:27 PM, "newtmerrill" <newt@...> wrote:

                 

                Bill--See my email to you--sent this afternoon. Let me know if you don't receive. Regards, Newt (FINESSE #20)

                --- In j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com, William Stellin <wstellin@...> wrote:
                >
                > I have a starting problem that someone might be able to help with. At times, when I turn the key to start the engine, I hear a click from the magnetic ( solenoid) switch, but the starter doesn't spin or do anything. If I repeatedly turn the key the motor will eventually start. Sometimes I have to turn the key three times. This never happens when starting after disconecting the shore power, only happens after I have been sailing with nothing charging the battery. Might it be the contacts on the magnetic switch or even the brushes in the starter motor. I am reasonably sure it is not the battery as it turns over briskly when it finally decides to start.
                > Your collective thoughts would be much appreciated.
                > Bill Stellin
                > Jaywalker. 3500 hours on the engine
                >
                > Sent from my iPod
                >
                > On Jun 24, 2011, at 10:10 PM, Bernard Coyne <coyneb@...> wrote:
                >
                > > Try TPI the former Jboats builder.....they still carry or can help you. We replaced our from them albeit that was 10yrs ago :-)
                > >
                > > 401-247-1050
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > > Bernie Coyne
                > > Market Manager
                > > Change & Configuration Management Solutions
                > > IBM Software Group, Rational
                > > Phone: 720-396-6297
                > > Email: coyneb@... <mime-attachment.gif>
                > > <mime-attachment.gif>
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > > From: "E38200" <dick.sanford@...>
                > > To: j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com
                > > Date: 06/24/2011 03:01 PM
                > > Subject: [j4x-owners-group] Vanity Sink Strainer/Stopper
                > > Sent by: j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > >
                > > Does anyone know where to source the plastic strainer/stopper for the
                > > head sinks? I am trying to avoid replacing the entire drain assembly
                > > just so I can have a new strainer/stopper (the old one broke).
                > >
                > >
                > >
                >

                The information contained in this communication is confidential, may be privileged and is intended for the exclusive use of the above named addressee(s). If you are not the intended recipient(s), you are expressly prohibited from copying, distributing, disseminating, or in any other way using any information contained within this communication. If you have received this communication in error please contact the sender by telephone or by response via mail.

                We have taken precautions to minimize the risk of transmitting software viruses, but we advise you to carry out your own virus checks on any attachment to this message. We cannot accept liability for any loss or damage caused by software viruses.

              • William Stellin
                Thanks for the response. My momentary switch is a heavy duty automotive type with proper gage wire and clips so I am not worried using it. I have only used it
                Message 8 of 17 , Jun 27, 2011
                • 0 Attachment
                  Thanks for the response. My momentary switch is a heavy duty automotive type with proper gage wire and clips so I am not worried using it. I have only used it once in a test. I am going to have the relay installed asap. I probably was the one that wrote about the neutral switch. I disabled mine and that seemed to have cured the problem for a while. The wire going to the neutral switch was a smaller gage than the harness wire so I felt that was the weak link. Apparently there is more to it. Do you know what the Yanmar part number is for the relay switch. 
                  Bill  

                  Sent from my iPod

                  On Jun 27, 2011, at 11:20 AM, Robert Thuss <Robert.Thuss@...> wrote:

                   

                  I had the same problem and used a momentary switch for awhile. It melted down at one point and almost caught fire! I’ve also used long needle nose pliers in a pinch.

                   

                  I replaced the solenoid spade connections and that helped. I also had a problem that seemed to be based in the neutral safety switch (NSS). The shifter cables were old and it was hard to find neutral and the engine would not start. Somebody suggested disabling the NSS but I didn’t want to do that for safety reasons. So I replaced the shifter cables and haven’t had the problem since.

                   

                  Robert Thuss

                  J/42 Jade – USA 50777

                  Atlantic Highlands, NJ

                   

                   

                  From: j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com [mailto:j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ivan C Getting
                  Sent: Sunday, June 26, 2011 11:34 PM
                  To: j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com
                  Subject: [j4x-owners-group] engine starter problems

                   

                   

                  Bill,

                  Should work to test the solenoid/starter motor.  The only problem I can think of is that the momentary switch could fuse if it does not have sufficient current carrying capacity or one alligator clip could arc and trash the spade connector on the solenoid.  I'd prefer a proper spade connector at the solenoid end.  We know that works in general. 
                  Of course let go of the switch button as soon as the engine starts.
                    If the switch should fuse just pull off the alligator clip from the positive battery source to stop cranking the engine.

                  The relay idea could make sense, but, also, it is just another electromagnetic switch like the starter solenoid but with lower current.  It can also fail some day.  If the J/42 installations have a history of developing unacceptable resistance in the starter switch/harness circuit the a relay might be a good idea.  It that resistance were too large it could prevent the relay from working as well, however.

                  In any case, I like having my little jumper wire by the starter.  Should the installed system ever fail again I can jump the engine very quickly if need be.

                  Ivan


                  On 06/26/11 7:40 PM, William Stellin wrote:

                   

                  I have a "momentary switch" with alligator clips that I can attach to the solenoid and a positive battery source. When I press the button, it momentarily closes the circuit and engages the starter. This should do the same thing as you suggest. Am I understanding you correctly in that just hearing the solenoid click doesn't mean it is getting full current.  If this is the case, the fix might just be installing a relay to avoid the harness resistance. What do you think? 

                  Bill


                  Sent from my iPod


                  On Jun 26, 2011, at 8:16 PM, Ivan C Getting <getting@...> wrote:

                   

                  Greetings all,

                  I believe there is an easy test to see if the starting failure is caused by resistance in the starter switch/harness and the concomitant lack of current through the starter solenoid. 

                  Connect the battery positive directly to the solenoid positive terminal through a low resistance path:

                  On the solenoid there are two large terminals with are connected together when the solenoid is energized.  Ignore these two.  Additionally there is a smaller, male spade-type connector with the wire from the starter switch attached.  Disconnect this wire.  Make up a wire about 1 foot length of 14 or 12 gauge insulated wire with a mating female slip-on spade connector on one end and a modest-size lug connector on the other.  Connect the spade connector end to the solenoid spade terminal and touch the other end to the large, positive terminal on the alternator, the one with the larger red cable.  Don't be "shocked".  There will be sparks when you touch the wire to the alternator terminal as the solenoid is an inductive load.  Fear not, 12 VDC is harmless, even if sparks are impressive.  If you are steadier than I am you will not jump quite as far and manage to maintain contact despite the initial sparks the first time.  I am pretty good at it the second time.  Touch the nut, not the threads of the alternator stud so as not to "burn" the threads at all.  This simply imitates the function of the starter switch and you have "hot wired" your starter.   (Now you can start anybody's diesel without the key, but behave yourself.)   I keep such a little cable next to the engine just in case...  Note - you may want to turn the engine starting switch to "run", not "start", before trying this.  That way you can see the oil pressure indication right away.  Also, this procedure defeats any interlock on the gearshift, so be sure the transmission is in neutral.

                  If the motor turns over quickly and starts easily everything at that end is probably fine.  The harness/starter switch likely have developed some unacceptable resistance.  The solenoid requires considerable current to close all the way quickly.  It can "click" and not close well as I remember from my early years with cars in bad condition.  First try cleaning the spade connector on the solenoid and apply a light coat of silicone grease.  Then work the connector that goes on it on and off several times to clean any oxide or dirt from it as well.  That fixed the problem for me when it occurred.  After that chase down all the other connectors you can find in the harness.  When that fails pull the wires off the starter switch and hold them together.  The failure should eventually present itself.

                  If jumping the starter fails to work it is the solenoid and/or the starter motor.

                  On a previous boat it was a break in the wiring harness itself which I never could locate.  I just strung a new wire from the starter switch to the solenoid.

                  Good luck.  I'd be interested to hear any results.

                  Ivan Getting
                  KITTIWAKE
                  Hull no. 74, 2006




                  On 06/26/11 4:32 PM, William Stellin wrote:

                   

                  Thanks for your reply. Now I have the harness to worry about as well. It seems to only occur after the engine has been running, shut off and then restarted while it is still warm. Batteries are all fully charged and combined at times for starting to see if extra juice might make a difference. It doesn't. I have a hard time believing it is the starter, solenoid, switch or voltage drop. When the solenoid clicks it means it is getting juice from the key switch. Some have said it is burned contacts in the solenoid which maybe it is. I hate to spend a fortune and hours chasing the wrong fix. 

                  Bill


                  Sent from my iPod


                  On Jun 26, 2011, at 5:27 PM, "newtmerrill" <newt@...> wrote:

                   

                  Bill--See my email to you--sent this afternoon. Let me know if you don't receive. Regards, Newt (FINESSE #20)

                  --- In j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com, William Stellin <wstellin@...> wrote:
                  >
                  > I have a starting problem that someone might be able to help with. At times, when I turn the key to start the engine, I hear a click from the magnetic ( solenoid) switch, but the starter doesn't spin or do anything. If I repeatedly turn the key the motor will eventually start. Sometimes I have to turn the key three times. This never happens when starting after disconecting the shore power, only happens after I have been sailing with nothing charging the battery. Might it be the contacts on the magnetic switch or even the brushes in the starter motor. I am reasonably sure it is not the battery as it turns over briskly when it finally decides to start.
                  > Your collective thoughts would be much appreciated.
                  > Bill Stellin
                  > Jaywalker. 3500 hours on the engine
                  >
                  > Sent from my iPod
                  >
                  > On Jun 24, 2011, at 10:10 PM, Bernard Coyne <coyneb@...> wrote:
                  >
                  > > Try TPI the former Jboats builder.....they still carry or can help you. We replaced our from them albeit that was 10yrs ago :-)
                  > >
                  > > 401-247-1050
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  > > Bernie Coyne
                  > > Market Manager
                  > > Change & Configuration Management Solutions
                  > > IBM Software Group, Rational
                  > > Phone: 720-396-6297
                  > > Email: coyneb@... <mime-attachment.gif>
                  > > <mime-attachment.gif>
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  > > From: "E38200" <dick.sanford@...>
                  > > To: j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com
                  > > Date: 06/24/2011 03:01 PM
                  > > Subject: [j4x-owners-group] Vanity Sink Strainer/Stopper
                  > > Sent by: j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  > > Does anyone know where to source the plastic strainer/stopper for the
                  > > head sinks? I am trying to avoid replacing the entire drain assembly
                  > > just so I can have a new strainer/stopper (the old one broke).
                  > >
                  > >
                  > >
                  >

                  The information contained in this communication is confidential, may be privileged and is intended for the exclusive use of the above named addressee(s). If you are not the intended recipient(s), you are expressly prohibited from copying, distributing, disseminating, or in any other way using any information contained within this communication. If you have received this communication in error please contact the sender by telephone or by response via mail.

                  We have taken precautions to minimize the risk of transmitting software viruses, but we advise you to carry out your own virus checks on any attachment to this message. We cannot accept liability for any loss or damage caused by software viruses.

                • newtmerrill
                  Having tried all of the referenced solutions--new ignition switch, new solenoid/rebuilt starter, installation of momentart/bypass switch and wire, installation
                  Message 9 of 17 , Jun 28, 2011
                  • 0 Attachment
                    Having tried all of the referenced solutions--new ignition switch, new solenoid/rebuilt starter, installation of momentart/bypass switch and wire, installation of separate bypass wire from ignition to starter motor (which worked but also bypasses all other functions of the wiring harness--we finally replaced wiring harness and all seems to be well. We did leave the bypass wire led but disconnected so that it can be used as a backup should the problem occur again. Newt (FINESSE#20)

                    --- In j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com, William Stellin <wstellin@...> wrote:
                    >
                    > Thanks for the response. My momentary switch is a heavy duty automotive type with proper gage wire and clips so I am not worried using it. I have only used it once in a test. I am going to have the relay installed asap. I probably was the one that wrote about the neutral switch. I disabled mine and that seemed to have cured the problem for a while. The wire going to the neutral switch was a smaller gage than the harness wire so I felt that was the weak link. Apparently there is more to it. Do you know what the Yanmar part number is for the relay switch.
                    > Bill
                    >
                    > Sent from my iPod
                    >
                    > On Jun 27, 2011, at 11:20 AM, Robert Thuss <Robert.Thuss@...> wrote:
                    >
                    > > I had the same problem and used a momentary switch for awhile. It melted down at one point and almost caught fire! I’ve also used long needle nose pliers in a pinch.
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > > I replaced the solenoid spade connections and that helped. I also had a problem that seemed to be based in the neutral safety switch (NSS). The shifter cables were old and it was hard to find neutral and the engine would not start. Somebody suggested disabling the NSS but I didn’t want to do that for safety reasons. So I replaced the shifter cables and haven’t had the problem since.
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > > Robert Thuss
                    > >
                    > > J/42 Jade â€" USA 50777
                    > >
                    > > Atlantic Highlands, NJ
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > > From: j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com [mailto:j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Ivan C Getting
                    > > Sent: Sunday, June 26, 2011 11:34 PM
                    > > To: j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com
                    > > Subject: [j4x-owners-group] engine starter problems
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > > Bill,
                    > >
                    > > Should work to test the solenoid/starter motor. The only problem I can think of is that the momentary switch could fuse if it does not have sufficient current carrying capacity or one alligator clip could arc and trash the spade connector on the solenoid. I'd prefer a proper spade connector at the solenoid end. We know that works in general.
                    > > Of course let go of the switch button as soon as the engine starts. If the switch should fuse just pull off the alligator clip from the positive battery source to stop cranking the engine.
                    > >
                    > > The relay idea could make sense, but, also, it is just another electromagnetic switch like the starter solenoid but with lower current. It can also fail some day. If the J/42 installations have a history of developing unacceptable resistance in the starter switch/harness circuit the a relay might be a good idea. It that resistance were too large it could prevent the relay from working as well, however.
                    > >
                    > > In any case, I like having my little jumper wire by the starter. Should the installed system ever fail again I can jump the engine very quickly if need be.
                    > >
                    > > Ivan
                    > >
                    > >
                    > > On 06/26/11 7:40 PM, William Stellin wrote:
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > > I have a "momentary switch" with alligator clips that I can attach to the solenoid and a positive battery source. When I press the button, it momentarily closes the circuit and engages the starter. This should do the same thing as you suggest. Am I understanding you correctly in that just hearing the solenoid click doesn't mean it is getting full current. If this is the case, the fix might just be installing a relay to avoid the harness resistance. What do you think?
                    > >
                    > > Bill
                    > >
                    > >
                    > > Sent from my iPod
                    > >
                    > >
                    > > On Jun 26, 2011, at 8:16 PM, Ivan C Getting <getting@...> wrote:
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > > Greetings all,
                    > >
                    > > I believe there is an easy test to see if the starting failure is caused by resistance in the starter switch/harness and the concomitant lack of current through the starter solenoid.
                    > >
                    > > Connect the battery positive directly to the solenoid positive terminal through a low resistance path:
                    > >
                    > > On the solenoid there are two large terminals with are connected together when the solenoid is energized. Ignore these two. Additionally there is a smaller, male spade-type connector with the wire from the starter switch attached. Disconnect this wire. Make up a wire about 1 foot length of 14 or 12 gauge insulated wire with a mating female slip-on spade connector on one end and a modest-size lug connector on the other. Connect the spade connector end to the solenoid spade terminal and touch the other end to the large, positive terminal on the alternator, the one with the larger red cable. Don't be "shocked". There will be sparks when you touch the wire to the alternator terminal as the solenoid is an inductive load. Fear not, 12 VDC is harmless, even if sparks are impressive. If you are steadier than I am you will not jump quite as far and manage to maintain contact despite the initial sparks the first time. I am pretty good at it the second time. Touch the nut, not the threads of the alternator stud so as not to "burn" the threads at all. This simply imitates the function of the starter switch and you have "hot wired" your starter. (Now you can start anybody's diesel without the key, but behave yourself.) I keep such a little cable next to the engine just in case... Note - you may want to turn the engine starting switch to "run", not "start", before trying this. That way you can see the oil pressure indication right away. Also, this procedure defeats any interlock on the gearshift, so be sure the transmission is in neutral.
                    > >
                    > > If the motor turns over quickly and starts easily everything at that end is probably fine. The harness/starter switch likely have developed some unacceptable resistance. The solenoid requires considerable current to close all the way quickly. It can "click" and not close well as I remember from my early years with cars in bad condition. First try cleaning the spade connector on the solenoid and apply a light coat of silicone grease. Then work the connector that goes on it on and off several times to clean any oxide or dirt from it as well. That fixed the problem for me when it occurred. After that chase down all the other connectors you can find in the harness. When that fails pull the wires off the starter switch and hold them together. The failure should eventually present itself.
                    > >
                    > > If jumping the starter fails to work it is the solenoid and/or the starter motor.
                    > >
                    > > On a previous boat it was a break in the wiring harness itself which I never could locate. I just strung a new wire from the starter switch to the solenoid.
                    > >
                    > > Good luck. I'd be interested to hear any results.
                    > >
                    > > Ivan Getting
                    > > KITTIWAKE
                    > > Hull no. 74, 2006
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > > On 06/26/11 4:32 PM, William Stellin wrote:
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > > Thanks for your reply. Now I have the harness to worry about as well. It seems to only occur after the engine has been running, shut off and then restarted while it is still warm. Batteries are all fully charged and combined at times for starting to see if extra juice might make a difference. It doesn't. I have a hard time believing it is the starter, solenoid, switch or voltage drop. When the solenoid clicks it means it is getting juice from the key switch. Some have said it is burned contacts in the solenoid which maybe it is. I hate to spend a fortune and hours chasing the wrong fix.
                    > >
                    > > Bill
                    > >
                    > >
                    > > Sent from my iPod
                    > >
                    > >
                    > > On Jun 26, 2011, at 5:27 PM, "newtmerrill" <newt@...> wrote:
                    > >
                    > >
                    > >
                    > > Bill--See my email to you--sent this afternoon. Let me know if you don't receive. Regards, Newt (FINESSE #20)
                    > >
                    > > --- In j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com, William Stellin <wstellin@> wrote:
                    > > >
                    > > > I have a starting problem that someone might be able to help with. At times, when I turn the key to start the engine, I hear a click from the magnetic ( solenoid) switch, but the starter doesn't spin or do anything. If I repeatedly turn the key the motor will eventually start. Sometimes I have to turn the key three times. This never happens when starting after disconecting the shore power, only happens after I have been sailing with nothing charging the battery. Might it be the contacts on the magnetic switch or even the brushes in the starter motor. I am reasonably sure it is not the battery as it turns over briskly when it finally decides to start.
                    > > > Your collective thoughts would be much appreciated.
                    > > > Bill Stellin
                    > > > Jaywalker. 3500 hours on the engine
                    > > >
                    > > > Sent from my iPod
                    > > >
                    > > > On Jun 24, 2011, at 10:10 PM, Bernard Coyne <coyneb@> wrote:
                    > > >
                    > > > > Try TPI the former Jboats builder.....they still carry or can help you. We replaced our from them albeit that was 10yrs ago :-)
                    > > > >
                    > > > > 401-247-1050
                    > > > >
                    > > > >
                    > > > >
                    > > > > Bernie Coyne
                    > > > > Market Manager
                    > > > > Change & Configuration Management Solutions
                    > > > > IBM Software Group, Rational
                    > > > > Phone: 720-396-6297
                    > > > > Email: coyneb@ <mime-attachment.gif>
                    > > > > <mime-attachment.gif>
                    > > > >
                    > > > >
                    > > > >
                    > > > >
                    > > > >
                    > > > > From: "E38200" <dick.sanford@>
                    > > > > To: j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com
                    > > > > Date: 06/24/2011 03:01 PM
                    > > > > Subject: [j4x-owners-group] Vanity Sink Strainer/Stopper
                    > > > > Sent by: j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com
                    > > > >
                    > > > >
                    > > > >
                    > > > >
                    > > > > Does anyone know where to source the plastic strainer/stopper for the
                    > > > > head sinks? I am trying to avoid replacing the entire drain assembly
                    > > > > just so I can have a new strainer/stopper (the old one broke).
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