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High tech sails

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  • wayne.cassady
    We have a J40 with a Dacron main and a Norlam 155%. They and our other dacron headsails are in good shape but I am starting to look into getting some lighter
    Message 1 of 9 , Oct 1, 2010
      We have a J40 with a Dacron main and a Norlam 155%. They and our other dacron headsails are in good shape but I am starting to look into getting some lighter weight racing sails for the boat. May go new or used if that choice could be made to work. We've almost always gone with North but I am looking for all advice on good sailmaker experiences and sail materials. Also wondering if used J42 sails can be suited down to a J40. Thanks for any advice.
    • William Stellin
      I have just ordered a new main and a 155% genoa, both from Doyle Sails. They are Mylar/Kevlar with carbon tapes. I will race with these sails and cruise with
      Message 2 of 9 , Oct 1, 2010
        I have just ordered a new main and a 155% genoa, both from Doyle Sails. They are Mylar/Kevlar with carbon tapes. I will race with these sails and cruise with our present sails. Both new sails will be built to the full PERF allowances. I got quotes from UK
        Halsey and Quantum. Doyle got the nod due to experience of the actual guy in Detroit who will build the sails and their price which was much better than the others. Comparisons were made using the same materials (Mylar Kevlar carbon) and same features. 
        Bill Stellin
        Jaywalker

        Sent from my iPod

        On Oct 1, 2010, at 4:27 PM, "wayne.cassady" <wcassady@...> wrote:

         

        We have a J40 with a Dacron main and a Norlam 155%. They and our other dacron headsails are in good shape but I am starting to look into getting some lighter weight racing sails for the boat. May go new or used if that choice could be made to work. We've almost always gone with North but I am looking for all advice on good sailmaker experiences and sail materials. Also wondering if used J42 sails can be suited down to a J40. Thanks for any advice.

      • Tom Keffer
        For calibration: I m a racer/cruiser, about 20% the former, 80% the latter. If you re looking for pure racing sails, then perhaps this info is not terribly
        Message 3 of 9 , Oct 1, 2010
          For calibration: I'm a racer/cruiser, about 20% the former, 80% the latter. If you're looking for pure racing sails, then perhaps this info is not terribly useful.

          About 2 years ago I bought a 100% North 3DL jib. It's been great! While it's probably not as bulletproof as a Dacron sail, it weighs about half and holds its shape much longer.

          I've also bought a North G-0 (Norlam version) on a Facnor furler. This sail has been most useful for tight reaching. (I suspect their nylon version would be more of a pure reaching sail.) I like it because it's easy to hoist, easy to furl when not in use.

          Finally, I have a Hood 155% MAXX Carbon 14 sail that I have not been impressed with. The 100% frequently outperforms it when beating, even in light wind. It seems to be most useful on a tight reach, but it's much more of a hassle to set than the G-0.

          I think the I and P measurements are slightly smaller on a J/40 than a J/42.

          Cheers,

          -tk


          --- In j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com, "wayne.cassady" <wcassady@...> wrote:
          >
          > We have a J40 with a Dacron main and a Norlam 155%. They and our other dacron headsails are in good shape but I am starting to look into getting some lighter weight racing sails for the boat. May go new or used if that choice could be made to work. We've almost always gone with North but I am looking for all advice on good sailmaker experiences and sail materials. Also wondering if used J42 sails can be suited down to a J40. Thanks for any advice.
          >
        • Bob Fox
          I had North Marathon 3DL sails. I would strongly urge you stay away from them. My #3 totally delaminated in less than 20 knots. That sail was only 7 years
          Message 4 of 9 , Oct 1, 2010
            I had North Marathon 3DL sails. I would strongly urge you stay away from them.   My #3 totally delaminated in less than 20 knots. That sail was only 7 years old. I bought a new main in Jan 07. I did not use it until June. The sail had 3 years use less than 5000 miles on it. Now that sail has delaminated. North would not stand behind their product. The loft was great, but I have absolutely no confidence in their sails. They even admitted the problem, but since the sails were just out of warranty would not do anything. That was a $7500 sail that right now is worthless. I've heard they have lots of problems with their glue and lamination process. 

            I just bought a Quantum main and two jibs. :)

            Bob Fox
            J/42
            Schematic


            On Oct 1, 2010, at 16:27, "wayne.cassady" <wcassady@...> wrote:

             

            We have a J40 with a Dacron main and a Norlam 155%. They and our other dacron headsails are in good shape but I am starting to look into getting some lighter weight racing sails for the boat. May go new or used if that choice could be made to work. We've almost always gone with North but I am looking for all advice on good sailmaker experiences and sail materials. Also wondering if used J42 sails can be suited down to a J40. Thanks for any advice.

          • Wayne Cassady
            Thanks Bill. That s good information--so many choices out there, I need to narrow it down and that helps.
            Message 5 of 9 , Oct 4, 2010
              Thanks Bill. That's good information--so many choices out there, I need to narrow it down and that helps.

              On 10/1/2010 4:57 PM, William Stellin wrote:
               
              I have just ordered a new main and a 155% genoa, both from Doyle Sails. They are Mylar/Kevlar with carbon tapes. I will race with these sails and cruise with our present sails. Both new sails will be built to the full PERF allowances. I got quotes from UK
              Halsey and Quantum. Doyle got the nod due to experience of the actual guy in Detroit who will build the sails and their price which was much better than the others. Comparisons were made using the same materials (Mylar Kevlar carbon) and same features. 
              Bill Stellin
              Jaywalker

              Sent from my iPod

              On Oct 1, 2010, at 4:27 PM, "wayne.cassady" <wcassady@...> wrote:

               

              We have a J40 with a Dacron main and a Norlam 155%. They and our other dacron headsails are in good shape but I am starting to look into getting some lighter weight racing sails for the boat. May go new or used if that choice could be made to work. We've almost always gone with North but I am looking for all advice on good sailmaker experiences and sail materials. Also wondering if used J42 sails can be suited down to a J40. Thanks for any advice.

            • Wayne Cassady
              Thanks Tom. I am interested in the 3DLs especially. Will need to save up but hope to add one to the inventory.
              Message 6 of 9 , Oct 4, 2010
                Thanks Tom. I am interested in the 3DLs especially. Will need to save up but hope to add one to the inventory.

                On 10/1/2010 6:23 PM, Tom Keffer wrote:
                 



                For calibration: I'm a racer/cruiser, about 20% the former, 80% the latter. If you're looking for pure racing sails, then perhaps this info is not terribly useful.

                About 2 years ago I bought a 100% North 3DL jib. It's been great! While it's probably not as bulletproof as a Dacron sail, it weighs about half and holds its shape much longer.

                I've also bought a North G-0 (Norlam version) on a Facnor furler. This sail has been most useful for tight reaching. (I suspect their nylon version would be more of a pure reaching sail.) I like it because it's easy to hoist, easy to furl when not in use.

                Finally, I have a Hood 155% MAXX Carbon 14 sail that I have not been impressed with. The 100% frequently outperforms it when beating, even in light wind. It seems to be most useful on a tight reach, but it's much more of a hassle to set than the G-0.

                I think the I and P measurements are slightly smaller on a J/40 than a J/42.

                Cheers,

                -tk

                --- In j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com, "wayne.cassady" <wcassady@...> wrote:
                >
                > We have a J40 with a Dacron main and a Norlam 155%. They and our other dacron headsails are in good shape but I am starting to look into getting some lighter weight racing sails for the boat. May go new or used if that choice could be made to work. We've almost always gone with North but I am looking for all advice on good sailmaker experiences and sail materials. Also wondering if used J42 sails can be suited down to a J40. Thanks for any advice.
                >

              • Wayne Cassady
                Sorry to hear about the problems. That is my concern is that this is a bug purchase and the sails need to last a long time. I have always liked and dealt with
                Message 7 of 9 , Oct 4, 2010
                  Sorry to hear about the problems. That is my concern is that this is a bug purchase and the sails need to last a long time. I have always liked and dealt with North but will be cautious on our choice.

                  On 10/2/2010 12:09 AM, Bob Fox wrote:
                   
                  I had North Marathon 3DL sails. I would strongly urge you stay away from them.   My #3 totally delaminated in less than 20 knots. That sail was only 7 years old. I bought a new main in Jan 07. I did not use it until June. The sail had 3 years use less than 5000 miles on it. Now that sail has delaminated. North would not stand behind their product. The loft was great, but I have absolutely no confidence in their sails. They even admitted the problem, but since the sails were just out of warranty would not do anything. That was a $7500 sail that right now is worthless. I've heard they have lots of problems with their glue and lamination process. 

                  I just bought a Quantum main and two jibs. :)

                  Bob Fox
                  J/42
                  Schematic


                  On Oct 1, 2010, at 16:27, "wayne.cassady" <wcassady@...> wrote:

                   

                  We have a J40 with a Dacron main and a Norlam 155%. They and our other dacron headsails are in good shape but I am starting to look into getting some lighter weight racing sails for the boat. May go new or used if that choice could be made to work. We've almost always gone with North but I am looking for all advice on good sailmaker experiences and sail materials. Also wondering if used J42 sails can be suited down to a J40. Thanks for any advice.

                • cdsail@ameritech.net
                  I have quotes for genoa from doyle, UK and Quantum on their (each has a slightly different name) Doyle Stratis Quicksilver (GPC), Fusion MX Poly Double Taffeta
                  Message 8 of 9 , Dec 27, 2010
                    I have quotes for genoa from doyle, UK and Quantum on their (each has a slightly different name) Doyle Stratis Quicksilver (GPC), Fusion MX Poly Double Taffeta and similar from UK. Doyle and UK were ~ 25% higher with a discount from Quantum. Was your pricing pretty close from all? I was planning to call Evolution (i think that is Halsey now) also but the sailmaker is in Mystic so I am hestitant to have the sailmaker that far.

                    Also, I see that you selected at 155% vs 140%. do you use a furling 155%?

                    Thanks, a little early to think about but I have an # of things to upgrade for this season.

                    thanks,
                    conrad

                    --- In j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com, William Stellin <wstellin@...> wrote:
                    >
                    > I have just ordered a new main and a 155% genoa, both from Doyle Sails. They are Mylar/Kevlar with carbon tapes. I will race with these sails and cruise with our present sails. Both new sails will be built to the full PERF allowances. I got quotes from UK
                    > Halsey and Quantum. Doyle got the nod due to experience of the actual guy in Detroit who will build the sails and their price which was much better than the others. Comparisons were made using the same materials (Mylar Kevlar carbon) and same features.
                    > Bill Stellin
                    > Jaywalker
                    >
                    > Sent from my iPod
                    >
                    > On Oct 1, 2010, at 4:27 PM, "wayne.cassady" <wcassady@...> wrote:
                    >
                    > > We have a J40 with a Dacron main and a Norlam 155%. They and our other dacron headsails are in good shape but I am starting to look into getting some lighter weight racing sails for the boat. May go new or used if that choice could be made to work. We've almost always gone with North but I am looking for all advice on good sailmaker experiences and sail materials. Also wondering if used J42 sails can be suited down to a J40. Thanks for any advice.
                    > >
                    > >
                    >
                  • William Stellin
                    My new genoa Doyle describes as : 155% AP #1 LPT fiberlay, kevlar mylar laminate with carbon fiber load path tapes. The price was a little lower than the
                    Message 9 of 9 , Dec 27, 2010
                      My new genoa  Doyle describes as : 155% AP #1 LPT fiberlay, kevlar mylar laminate with carbon fiber load path tapes.  The price was a little lower than the same sail size and construction from UK Halsey and quite a bit lower than from Quantum.
                      I chose Doyle because I know the sailmaker who used to be the owner of the UK loft in Detroit where we bought our first suit of sails back in 1996. (We've had new mains and genoa's from other since then as well).

                      Have you or others had any trouble with the paint peeling from the Bomar portlight window frames.  Some of mine have peeled badly and others are fine.   This year we are storing inside heated and I have removed all the cabin windows, stripped them and I am having them AllGriped.  In stripping them, I found half, the ones whose paint failed, had no etch primer applied to the raw aluminum before they were powder coated.  Also on those, the paint came off very easy.  On the other half, after stripping them I found etc primer and the paint was very hard to remove with stripper.   I called Bomar and wondered if they would re paint them for me if I paid shipping both ways.  They told me in no uncertain terms it was not their problem and no they would not help in any way, even if I paid for the paint, labor and shipping.   Basically, I got the "go to h---" treatment.  There is no question, some of the windows were not painted correctly, but Bomar would not own up to it.  I know it was years ago, but the failure started years ago as well.  I have just been touching them up until even that would not work any longer and I was in a spot that had inside heated storage so I could do the job right.
                      Bill Stellin    Jaywalker hull # 6

                      To: j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com
                      From: cdsail@...
                      Date: Mon, 27 Dec 2010 14:40:23 +0000
                      Subject: [j4x-owners-group] Re: High tech sails

                       
                      I have quotes for genoa from doyle, UK and Quantum on their (each has a slightly different name) Doyle Stratis Quicksilver (GPC), Fusion MX Poly Double Taffeta and similar from UK. Doyle and UK were ~ 25% higher with a discount from Quantum. Was your pricing pretty close from all? I was planning to call Evolution (i think that is Halsey now) also but the sailmaker is in Mystic so I am hestitant to have the sailmaker that far.

                      Also, I see that you selected at 155% vs 140%. do you use a furling 155%?

                      Thanks, a little early to think about but I have an # of things to upgrade for this season.

                      thanks,
                      conrad

                      --- In j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com, William Stellin <wstellin@...> wrote:
                      >
                      > I have just ordered a new main and a 155% genoa, both from Doyle Sails. They are Mylar/Kevlar with carbon tapes. I will race with these sails and cruise with our present sails. Both new sails will be built to the full PERF allowances. I got quotes from UK
                      > Halsey and Quantum. Doyle got the nod due to experience of the actual guy in Detroit who will build the sails and their price which was much better than the others. Comparisons were made using the same materials (Mylar Kevlar carbon) and same features.
                      > Bill Stellin
                      > Jaywalker
                      >
                      > Sent from my iPod
                      >
                      > On Oct 1, 2010, at 4:27 PM, "wayne.cassady" <wcassady@...> wrote:
                      >
                      > > We have a J40 with a Dacron main and a Norlam 155%. They and our other dacron headsails are in good shape but I am starting to look into getting some lighter weight racing sails for the boat. May go new or used if that choice could be made to work. We've almost always gone with North but I am looking for all advice on good sailmaker experiences and sail materials. Also wondering if used J42 sails can be suited down to a J40. Thanks for any advice.
                      > >
                      > >
                      >


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