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Water on the inside

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  • dick.sanford@partnerre.com
    As a general rule, I like to keep the water on the outside of my boats. I bought hull #55 last year and I am encountering a persistent problem with water on
    Message 1 of 24 , Jul 29, 2009
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      As a general rule, I like to keep the water on the outside of my boats. I
      bought hull #55 last year and I am encountering a persistent problem with
      water on the inside, a lot of water. It seems to occur on a starboard tack
      when the rail is down on the portside (heavy air). My guess is that the
      vented loop for the bilge pump is below the water line (it is mounted just
      forward of the galley sink underneath the counter top). There is what looks
      like a check valve in the bilge pump hose run just aft of where it comes
      out of the pump. I'm thinking it has failed. Has anyone else encountered
      this issue and am on the right track?

      Dick Sanford -'truant'- hull # 55, Wilton Ct



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    • Dave Moore
      Dick, sounds like you re on the right track. Consider checking your shower sump pump lines when the rail is down - another potential source of water
      Message 2 of 24 , Jul 29, 2009
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        Dick, sounds like you're on the right track. Consider checking your shower sump pump lines when the rail is down - another potential source of water siphoning on board.
        Dave

        --- On Wed, 7/29/09, dick.sanford@... <dick.sanford@...> wrote:

        From: dick.sanford@... <dick.sanford@...>
        Subject: [j4x-owners-group] Water on the inside
        To: j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com
        Date: Wednesday, July 29, 2009, 7:31 AM

         

        As a general rule, I like to keep the water on the outside of my boats. I
        bought hull #55 last year and I am encountering a persistent problem with
        water on the inside, a lot of water. It seems to occur on a starboard tack
        when the rail is down on the portside (heavy air). My guess is that the
        vented loop for the bilge pump is below the water line (it is mounted just
        forward of the galley sink underneath the counter top). There is what looks
        like a check valve in the bilge pump hose run just aft of where it comes
        out of the pump. I'm thinking it has failed. Has anyone else encountered
        this issue and am on the right track?

        Dick Sanford -'truant'- hull # 55, Wilton Ct

        DISCLAIMER: This e-mail contains information solely intended for named
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        disseminate the information in it and should notify the sender by replying
        to this message and deleting it afterwards from your mail system. Please be
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      • dick.sanford@partnerre.com
        Thanks for that Dave, I should have mentioned that I already learned that lesson the hard way very shortly after taking delivery of the boat last year and now
        Message 3 of 24 , Jul 29, 2009
        Thanks for that Dave, I should have mentioned that I already learned that
        lesson the hard way very shortly after taking delivery of the boat last
        year and now sail with the forward sink/shower sump thru hull closed. I
        have a new check valve in hand and plan on skinning my knuckles and cursing
        up a storm some time this weekend.

        Dick




        Dave Moore
        <drolfmoore@yahoo
        .com> To
        Sent by: j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com
        j4x-owners-group@ cc
        yahoogroups.com
        Subject
        Re: [j4x-owners-group] Water on the
        07/29/2009 12:34 inside
        PM


        Please respond to
        j4x-owners-group@
        yahoogroups.com















        Dick, sounds like you're on the right track. Consider checking your shower sump
        pump lines when the rail is down - another potential source of water siphoning on
        board.


        Dave

        --- On Wed, 7/29/09, dick.sanford@... <dick.sanford@...>
        wrote:

        From: dick.sanford@... <dick.sanford@...>
        Subject: [j4x-owners-group] Water on the inside
        To: j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com
        Date: Wednesday, July 29, 2009, 7:31 AM



        As a general rule, I like to keep the water on the outside of my boats. I
        bought hull #55 last year and I am encountering a persistent problem with
        water on the inside, a lot of water. It seems to occur on a starboard tack
        when the rail is down on the portside (heavy air). My guess is that the
        vented loop for the bilge pump is below the water line (it is mounted just
        forward of the galley sink underneath the counter top). There is what looks
        like a check valve in the bilge pump hose run just aft of where it comes
        out of the pump. I'm thinking it has failed. Has anyone else encountered
        this issue and am on the right track?

        Dick Sanford -'truant'- hull # 55, Wilton Ct

        DISCLAIMER: This e-mail contains information solely intended for named
        recipients and is confidential and proprietary to PartnerRe. If you are not
        one of the intended recipients of this message, you must not read, use or
        disseminate the information in it and should notify the sender by replying
        to this message and deleting it afterwards from your mail system. Please be
        aware that unauthorized reproduction or distribution of this communication
        is prohibited.








        DISCLAIMER: This e-mail contains information solely intended for named
        recipients and is confidential and proprietary to PartnerRe. If you are not
        one of the intended recipients of this message, you must not read, use or
        disseminate the information in it and should notify the sender by replying
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      • Jennifer
        Dick we have the same problem on J/42 hull #33, however we think it is a fresh water leak as the water doesn t seem salty. the area below the reefer and stove
        Message 4 of 24 , Jul 29, 2009
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          Dick we have the same problem on J/42 hull #33, however we think it is a fresh water leak as the water doesn't seem salty. the area below the reefer and stove fills up and water starts oozing up onto the galley sole. It is really quite entertaining. :p

          We have new check valves on our bilge discharge (plural as the electic and below decks manual pump tie into the same discharge). We are still trying to track down the source, but every connector on our fresh water system is loose so that is where we will start! We did have the head discharge through hulls closed both times this happened, though we now have check valves on those as well.

          Anyway, we feel your pain and will be watching this space to see what you find as the source. If we figure ours out we will post as well!

          Jennifer & Matt
          Scott & Kim
          Tiki J
          J/42 #33
          San Francisco Bay


          --- In j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com, dick.sanford@... wrote:
          >
          > Thanks for that Dave, I should have mentioned that I already learned that
          > lesson the hard way very shortly after taking delivery of the boat last
          > year and now sail with the forward sink/shower sump thru hull closed. I
          > have a new check valve in hand and plan on skinning my knuckles and cursing
          > up a storm some time this weekend.
          >
          > Dick
          >

          >
          > Dick, sounds like you're on the right track. Consider checking your shower sump
          > pump lines when the rail is down - another potential source of water siphoning on
          > board.
          >
          >
          > Dave
          >
          > --- On Wed, 7/29/09, dick.sanford@... <dick.sanford@...>

          > As a general rule, I like to keep the water on the outside of my boats. I
          > bought hull #55 last year and I am encountering a persistent problem with
          > water on the inside, a lot of water. It seems to occur on a starboard tack
          > when the rail is down on the portside (heavy air). My guess is that the
          > vented loop for the bilge pump is below the water line (it is mounted just
          > forward of the galley sink underneath the counter top). There is what looks
          > like a check valve in the bilge pump hose run just aft of where it comes
          > out of the pump. I'm thinking it has failed. Has anyone else encountered
          > this issue and am on the right track?
          >
          > Dick Sanford -'truant'- hull # 55, Wilton Ct
        • dick.sanford@partnerre.com
          Thanks Jennifer, for what it s worth, I have done the taste test (desperate times call for desperate measures) on more than one occasion and am confident that
          Message 5 of 24 , Jul 29, 2009
          Thanks Jennifer, for what it's worth, I have done the taste test (desperate
          times call for desperate measures) on more than one occasion and am
          confident that it is salt water. Also, when the carpeting on the cabin sole
          dries out, it is crusty with salt. It's collecting in the same place you
          describe and flattening the boat out takes a long time to cure this issue
          as the limber holes between the compartments in the bilge just aren't big
          enough to handle the volume.

          Dick




          "Jennifer"
          <sailsfbay@hotmai
          l.com> To
          Sent by: j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com
          j4x-owners-group@ cc
          yahoogroups.com
          Subject
          [j4x-owners-group] Re: Water on the
          07/29/2009 01:22 inside
          PM


          Please respond to
          j4x-owners-group@
          yahoogroups.com












          Dick we have the same problem on J/42 hull #33, however we think it is a fresh
          water leak as the water doesn't seem salty. the area below the reefer and stove
          fills up and water starts oozing up onto the galley sole. It is really quite
          entertaining. :p

          We have new check valves on our bilge discharge (plural as the electic and below
          decks manual pump tie into the same discharge). We are still trying to track down
          the source, but every connector on our fresh water system is loose so that is
          where we will start! We did have the head discharge through hulls closed both
          times this happened, though we now have check valves on those as well.

          Anyway, we feel your pain and will be watching this space to see what you find as
          the source. If we figure ours out we will post as well!

          Jennifer & Matt
          Scott & Kim
          Tiki J
          J/42 #33
          San Francisco Bay

          --- In j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com, dick.sanford@... wrote:
          >
          > Thanks for that Dave, I should have mentioned that I already learned that
          > lesson the hard way very shortly after taking delivery of the boat last
          > year and now sail with the forward sink/shower sump thru hull closed. I
          > have a new check valve in hand and plan on skinning my knuckles and cursing
          > up a storm some time this weekend.
          >
          > Dick
          >

          >
          > Dick, sounds like you're on the right track. Consider checking your shower sump
          > pump lines when the rail is down - another potential source of water siphoning
          on
          > board.
          >
          >
          > Dave
          >
          > --- On Wed, 7/29/09, dick.sanford@... <dick.sanford@...>

          > As a general rule, I like to keep the water on the outside of my boats. I
          > bought hull #55 last year and I am encountering a persistent problem with
          > water on the inside, a lot of water. It seems to occur on a starboard tack
          > when the rail is down on the portside (heavy air). My guess is that the
          > vented loop for the bilge pump is below the water line (it is mounted just
          > forward of the galley sink underneath the counter top). There is what looks
          > like a check valve in the bilge pump hose run just aft of where it comes
          > out of the pump. I'm thinking it has failed. Has anyone else encountered
          > this issue and am on the right track?
          >
          > Dick Sanford -'truant'- hull # 55, Wilton Ct







          DISCLAIMER: This e-mail contains information solely intended for named
          recipients and is confidential and proprietary to PartnerRe. If you are not
          one of the intended recipients of this message, you must not read, use or
          disseminate the information in it and should notify the sender by replying
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          aware that unauthorized reproduction or distribution of this communication
          is prohibited.
        • Jennifer
          VERY strange, ours sounds exactly the same but I would swear our water is fresh. It did not taste salty at all--at least two of us did the sniff and taste in
          Message 6 of 24 , Jul 29, 2009
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            VERY strange, ours sounds exactly the same but I would swear our water is fresh. It did not taste salty at all--at least two of us did the sniff and taste in that OMG we are taking on water moment. :) though it did leave a weird white film on the aluminum foil that was under the stove... hmmm, now you have me rethinking my conviction that it was fresh water. More research needed.

            So are we the only two that have experienced this?


            --- In j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com, dick.sanford@... wrote:
            >
            > Thanks Jennifer, for what it's worth, I have done the taste test (desperate
            > times call for desperate measures) on more than one occasion and am
            > confident that it is salt water. Also, when the carpeting on the cabin sole
            > dries out, it is crusty with salt. It's collecting in the same place you
            > describe and flattening the boat out takes a long time to cure this issue
            > as the limber holes between the compartments in the bilge just aren't big
            > enough to handle the volume.
            >
            > Dick
            >
            >
            >
          • newtmerrill
            Let me add a couple of sources to check: 1) both head sinks but especially the forward head. We have to close drain thru hulls when under way (starboard tack)
            Message 7 of 24 , Jul 30, 2009
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              Let me add a couple of sources to check: 1) both head sinks but especially the forward head. We have to close drain thru hulls when under way (starboard tack) to avoid sea water backing up and overflowing sink; 2)check water tightness of anchor well drain--we played submarine for 2 seasons before figuring out there was no proper thru hull in drain allowing water to flow in between well and hull. Also, when doing a rebuild we increased size of limber holes to allow faster draining of bilge water to be pumped out. Hull #20--Newt Merrill
              --- In j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com, dick.sanford@... wrote:
              >
              >
              > As a general rule, I like to keep the water on the outside of my boats. I
              > bought hull #55 last year and I am encountering a persistent problem with
              > water on the inside, a lot of water. It seems to occur on a starboard tack
              > when the rail is down on the portside (heavy air). My guess is that the
              > vented loop for the bilge pump is below the water line (it is mounted just
              > forward of the galley sink underneath the counter top). There is what looks
              > like a check valve in the bilge pump hose run just aft of where it comes
              > out of the pump. I'm thinking it has failed. Has anyone else encountered
              > this issue and am on the right track?
              >
              > Dick Sanford -'truant'- hull # 55, Wilton Ct
              >
              >
              >
              > DISCLAIMER: This e-mail contains information solely intended for named
              > recipients and is confidential and proprietary to PartnerRe. If you are not
              > one of the intended recipients of this message, you must not read, use or
              > disseminate the information in it and should notify the sender by replying
              > to this message and deleting it afterwards from your mail system. Please be
              > aware that unauthorized reproduction or distribution of this communication
              > is prohibited.
              >
            • coasttocoast@j40.org
              I have had and solved two similar cases. Check the aft cockpit scupper hose fittings, in our case it was the port side tack rail down. Also on the J4x, you
              Message 8 of 24 , Jul 30, 2009
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                I have had and solved two similar cases.  Check the aft cockpit scupper hose fittings, in our case it was the port side tack rail down.  Also on the J4x, you have to consider the rudder shaft packing.  Safe and dry sailing!
                 
                Dean Brennan
                Coast To Coast
                J40  #63
                 
                -------- Original Message --------
                Subject: [j4x-owners-group] Re: Water on the inside
                From: "Jennifer" <sailsfbay@...>
                Date: Wed, July 29, 2009 7:52 pm
                To: j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com

                 
                VERY strange, ours sounds exactly the same but I would swear our water is fresh. It did not taste salty at all--at least two of us did the sniff and taste in that OMG we are taking on water moment. :) though it did leave a weird white film on the aluminum foil that was under the stove... hmmm, now you have me rethinking my conviction that it was fresh water. More research needed.

                So are we the only two that have experienced this?

                --- In j4x-owners-group@ yahoogroups. com, dick.sanford@ ... wrote:
                >
                > Thanks Jennifer, for what it's worth, I have done the taste test (desperate
                > times call for desperate measures) on more than one occasion and am
                > confident that it is salt water. Also, when the carpeting on the cabin sole
                > dries out, it is crusty with salt. It's collecting in the same place you
                > describe and flattening the boat out takes a long time to cure this issue
                > as the limber holes between the compartments in the bilge just aren't big
                > enough to handle the volume.
                >
                > Dick
                >
                >
                >

              • mpromey
                Good catch, Dean. I have had the same experience. I replaced the scupper hoses (no easy feat getting all the way to the stern) and the water stopped showing
                Message 9 of 24 , Jul 30, 2009
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                  Good catch, Dean. I have had the same experience. I replaced the scupper hoses (no easy feat getting all the way to the stern) and the water stopped showing up in the boat. Good luck to all. Dean, nice to know you are out there still sailing (and working on)the J.
                  Mike Romey
                  Chinook
                  J40 Hull #45
                • Rob Moore
                  How about adding a one way value on the hose going from the bilge pump over board, was done on a few J42 out here on the west coast. Rob Moore
                  Message 10 of 24 , Jul 30, 2009
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                    How about adding a one way value on the hose going from the bilge
                    pump over board, was done on a few J42 out here on the west coast.



                    Rob Moore
                  • William Stellin
                    We ve had water downbelow also and it came, in our case, from a leaking packing gland for the rudder post. A new rudder bearing, described a while ago here,
                    Message 11 of 24 , Jul 30, 2009
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                      We've had water downbelow also and it came, in our case, from a leaking packing gland for the rudder post.  A new rudder bearing, described a while ago here, solved that problem.  Water will come in through the forward sink drain if the thru hull is not closed.
                      Never in two Atlantic crossings and 30,000 miles had water come in through the bilge pump outlet.  Forgot once to close the port in the forward head and probably had 200 gals come in.  Won't do that again.
                      Bill Stellin    Hull #6 Jaywalker.


                      To: j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com
                      From: rob.moore@...
                      Date: Thu, 30 Jul 2009 07:12:21 -0700
                      Subject: [j4x-owners-group] Re:Water on the inside

                       
                      How about adding a one way value on the hose going from the bilge
                      pump over board, was done on a few J42 out here on the west coast.

                      Rob Moore


                    • dick.sanford@partnerre.com
                      Jennifer, finally figured it out. My leak was coming from a short section of hose that connects the cockpit scupper drain hoses to the thru hull in the
                      Message 12 of 24 , Sep 25, 2009
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                        Jennifer, finally figured it out. My leak was coming from a short section
                        of hose that connects the cockpit scupper drain hoses to the thru hull in
                        the transom. The cockpit drain hoses come together in a plastic plumbing
                        fitting at the transom, the transom thru hull has a fiberglass flange that
                        extends inside the transom. The hose in question connects these two parts
                        and is about 5 or 6 inches long. It was shot to the point where all you
                        could see was the wire reinforcing section with some rubber hanging off it.
                        When the boat heels over, water backs up into this and if you open the aft
                        locker on the starboard side, you see the water running in. The better part
                        of a roll of rescue/atomic self amalgamating tape made for a temporary fix.
                        I also note that when taking blue water over the bow that the aft locker on
                        starboard side allows for a fair amount of water intrusion and I plan to
                        replace the seals.

                        Hope this helps,

                        Dick Sanford



                        DISCLAIMER: This e-mail contains information solely intended for named
                        recipients and is confidential and proprietary to PartnerRe. If you are not
                        one of the intended recipients of this message, you must not read, use or
                        disseminate the information in it and should notify the sender by replying
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                      • William Stellin
                        I think every J/42 has had problems with the aft starboard locker leaking. The fix is not only seals but a better fit. Get inside and look up for light and
                        Message 13 of 24 , Sep 25, 2009
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                          I think every J/42  has had problems with the aft starboard locker leaking.
                          The fix is not only seals but a better fit.  Get inside and look up for light and you will see what I mean.  I had to take the hinges off and reset them along with grinding down high spots on the lid where the pull is.
                          Jaywalker   Bill Stellin


                          To: j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com
                          From: dick.sanford@...
                          Date: Fri, 25 Sep 2009 12:36:20 -0400
                          Subject: Re: [j4x-owners-group] Re: Water on the inside

                           
                          Jennifer, finally figured it out. My leak was coming from a short section
                          of hose that connects the cockpit scupper drain hoses to the thru hull in
                          the transom. The cockpit drain hoses come together in a plastic plumbing
                          fitting at the transom, the transom thru hull has a fiberglass flange that
                          extends inside the transom. The hose in question connects these two parts
                          and is about 5 or 6 inches long. It was shot to the point where all you
                          could see was the wire reinforcing section with some rubber hanging off it.
                          When the boat heels over, water backs up into this and if you open the aft
                          locker on the starboard side, you see the water running in. The better part
                          of a roll of rescue/atomic self amalgamating tape made for a temporary fix.
                          I also note that when taking blue water over the bow that the aft locker on
                          starboard side allows for a fair amount of water intrusion and I plan to
                          replace the seals.

                          Hope this helps,

                          Dick Sanford

                          DISCLAIMER: This e-mail contains information solely intended for named
                          recipients and is confidential and proprietary to PartnerRe. If you are not
                          one of the intended recipients of this message, you must not read, use or
                          disseminate the information in it and should notify the sender by replying
                          to this message and deleting it afterwards from your mail system. Please be
                          aware that unauthorized reproduction or distribution of this communication
                          is prohibited.


                        • pineapplegirlc320
                          Well as usually our problem was unique to our boat. What for most of you is probably the forward holding tank is for us a forward water tank (to make up for
                          Message 14 of 24 , Oct 27, 2009
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                            Well as usually our problem was unique to our boat. What for most of you is probably the forward holding tank is for us a forward water tank (to make up for the starboard water tank having been replaced by a massive battery bank). Turns out the hose to the vent for the tank was never actually ATTACHED at the vent through the hull. So if the water in the tank was over the vent level (which happened when heeled to port as the vent was offset to port) water came out the hose under the sink. Thanks for all the pointers on other hoses to check for wear!

                            Jennifer
                            Tiki J
                            J/42 #33
                          • pineapplegirlc320
                            We once again our having water problems (We had water oozing out the floor boards under the nav station in our race last weekend) so I was going back through
                            Message 15 of 24 , May 14, 2010
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                              We once again our having water problems (We had water oozing out the floor boards under the nav station in our race last weekend) so I was going back through everyone's suggestions, trying to figure out where to start "this time." We'd really like to try and keep the boat relatively dry on the Pac Cup (52 more dayes)!

                              This time it look like the water is coming in somewhere from the back end--I hope it is the scuppers and not the rudder! We had the rudder checked and the yard gave it a clean bill of health. Can't wait to crawl around tomorrow looking for the leak!

                              Jennifer
                              Tiki J
                              J/42 #33
                              --- In j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com, William Stellin <wstellin@...> wrote:
                              >
                              >
                              > We've had water downbelow also and it came, in our case, from a leaking packing gland for the rudder post. A new rudder bearing, described a while ago here, solved that problem. Water will come in through the forward sink drain if the thru hull is not closed.
                              > Never in two Atlantic crossings and 30,000 miles had water come in through the bilge pump outlet. Forgot once to close the port in the forward head and probably had 200 gals come in. Won't do that again.
                              > Bill Stellin Hull #6 Jaywalker.
                              >
                              > To: j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com
                              > From: rob.moore@...
                              > Date: Thu, 30 Jul 2009 07:12:21 -0700
                              > Subject: [j4x-owners-group] Re:Water on the inside
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              > How about adding a one way value on the hose going from the bilge
                              >
                              > pump over board, was done on a few J42 out here on the west coast.
                              >
                              >
                              >
                              > Rob Moore
                              >
                            • Anthony M Iacono
                              Happens to me all the time. Stopped most all of it by closing the head through hulls on long voyages in any sea state that produces a repeated up/down motion
                              Message 16 of 24 , May 14, 2010
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                                Happens to me all the time. Stopped most all of it by closing the head through hulls on long voyages in any sea state that produces a repeated up/down motion for extended periods of time. Have you tried that? Tony Iacono. Affinity

                                Shanomet Company LLC
                                Sailing Charters
                                484 432 1171


                                From: "pineapplegirlc320" <sailsfbay@...>
                                Date: Fri, 14 May 2010 18:29:46 -0000
                                To: <j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com>
                                Subject: [j4x-owners-group] Re:Water on the inside

                                 

                                We once again our having water problems (We had water oozing out the floor boards under the nav station in our race last weekend) so I was going back through everyone's suggestions, trying to figure out where to start "this time." We'd really like to try and keep the boat relatively dry on the Pac Cup (52 more dayes)!

                                This time it look like the water is coming in somewhere from the back end--I hope it is the scuppers and not the rudder! We had the rudder checked and the yard gave it a clean bill of health. Can't wait to crawl around tomorrow looking for the leak!

                                Jennifer
                                Tiki J
                                J/42 #33

                                --- In j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com, William Stellin <wstellin@...> wrote:
                                >
                                >
                                > We've had water downbelow also and it came, in our case, from a leaking packing gland for the rudder post. A new rudder bearing, described a while ago here, solved that problem. Water will come in through the forward sink drain if the thru hull is not closed.
                                > Never in two Atlantic crossings and 30,000 miles had water come in through the bilge pump outlet. Forgot once to close the port in the forward head and probably had 200 gals come in. Won't do that again.
                                > Bill Stellin Hull #6 Jaywalker.
                                >
                                > To: j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com
                                > From: rob.moore@...
                                > Date: Thu, 30 Jul 2009 07:12:21 -0700
                                > Subject: [j4x-owners-group] Re:Water on the inside
                                >
                                >
                                >
                                >
                                >
                                >
                                >
                                >
                                >
                                >
                                >
                                >
                                >
                                >
                                >
                                >
                                >
                                >
                                >
                                >
                                >
                                > How about adding a one way value on the hose going from the bilge
                                >
                                > pump over board, was done on a few J42 out here on the west coast.
                                >
                                >
                                >
                                > Rob Moore
                                >

                              • Bernard Coyne
                                I would recommend checking the rudder seal while underway and especially going downwind when the stern tends to squat down lower. Bernie Bernie Coyne, World
                                Message 17 of 24 , May 14, 2010
                                • 0 Attachment

                                  I would recommend checking the rudder seal while underway and especially going downwind when the stern tends to squat down lower.

                                  Bernie

                                  Bernie Coyne, World Wide Marketing Manager
                                  IBM Rational Team Concert - a new agile application lifecycle management solution
                                  Download a free trial:
                                  http://jazz.net/projects/rational-team-concert/
                                  IBM Rational software,
                                  coyneb@..., 781-789-0762
                                  Notes: Bernard Coyne/Lexington/IBM@IBMUS



                                  Inactive hide details for "pineapplegirlc320" ---05/14/2010 02:34:21 PM---We once again our having water problems (We had water"pineapplegirlc320" ---05/14/2010 02:34:21 PM---We once again our having water problems (We had water oozing out the floor boards under the nav stat


                                  From:

                                  "pineapplegirlc320" <sailsfbay@...>

                                  To:

                                  j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com

                                  Date:

                                  05/14/2010 02:34 PM

                                  Subject:

                                  [j4x-owners-group] Re:Water on the inside

                                  Sent by:

                                  j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com




                                  We once again our having water problems (We had water oozing out the floor boards under the nav station in our race last weekend) so I was going back through everyone's suggestions, trying to figure out where to start "this time." We'd really like to try and keep the boat relatively dry on the Pac Cup (52 more dayes)!

                                  This time it look like the water is coming in somewhere from the back end--I hope it is the scuppers and not the rudder! We had the rudder checked and the yard gave it a clean bill of health. Can't wait to crawl around tomorrow looking for the leak!

                                  Jennifer
                                  Tiki J
                                  J/42 #33
                                  --- In
                                  j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com, William Stellin <wstellin@...> wrote:

                                  >
                                  >
                                  > We've had water downbelow also and it came, in our case, from a leaking packing gland for the rudder post. A new rudder bearing, described a while ago here, solved that problem. Water will come in through the forward sink drain if the thru hull is not closed.
                                  > Never in two Atlantic crossings and 30,000 miles had water come in through the bilge pump outlet. Forgot once to close the port in the forward head and probably had 200 gals come in. Won't do that again.
                                  > Bill Stellin Hull #6 Jaywalker.
                                  >
                                  > To:
                                  j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com
                                  > From: rob.moore@...
                                  > Date: Thu, 30 Jul 2009 07:12:21 -0700
                                  > Subject: [j4x-owners-group] Re:Water on the inside
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  > How about adding a one way value on the hose going from the bilge
                                  >
                                  > pump over board, was done on a few J42 out here on the west coast.
                                  >
                                  >
                                  >
                                  > Rob Moore
                                  >



                                • pineapplegirlc320
                                  We actually put back flow preventors on the sink drain lines after not closing the forward head sink through hull one ocean race and the joy of cleaning up
                                  Message 18 of 24 , May 14, 2010
                                  • 0 Attachment
                                    We actually put back flow preventors on the sink drain lines after not closing the forward head sink through hull one ocean race and the joy of cleaning up that mess. That is definitely not where the water is coming from. Due to where we were seeing the water (under the nav station) I looked in the back area and there was water in there.

                                    --- In j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com, "Anthony M Iacono" <tony@...> wrote:
                                    >
                                    > Happens to me all the time. Stopped most all of it by closing the head through hulls on long voyages in any sea state that produces a repeated up/down motion for extended periods of time. Have you tried that? Tony Iacono. Affinity
                                    > Shanomet Company LLC
                                    > Sailing Charters
                                    > 484 432 1171
                                    >
                                    > -----Original Message-----
                                    > From: "pineapplegirlc320" <sailsfbay@...>
                                    > Date: Fri, 14 May 2010 18:29:46
                                    > To: <j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com>
                                    > Subject: [j4x-owners-group] Re:Water on the inside
                                    >
                                    > We once again our having water problems (We had water oozing out the floor boards under the nav station in our race last weekend) so I was going back through everyone's suggestions, trying to figure out where to start "this time." We'd really like to try and keep the boat relatively dry on the Pac Cup (52 more dayes)!
                                    >
                                    > This time it look like the water is coming in somewhere from the back end--I hope it is the scuppers and not the rudder! We had the rudder checked and the yard gave it a clean bill of health. Can't wait to crawl around tomorrow looking for the leak!
                                    >
                                    > Jennifer
                                    > Tiki J
                                    > J/42 #33
                                    > --- In j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com, William Stellin <wstellin@> wrote:
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    > > We've had water downbelow also and it came, in our case, from a leaking packing gland for the rudder post. A new rudder bearing, described a while ago here, solved that problem. Water will come in through the forward sink drain if the thru hull is not closed.
                                    > > Never in two Atlantic crossings and 30,000 miles had water come in through the bilge pump outlet. Forgot once to close the port in the forward head and probably had 200 gals come in. Won't do that again.
                                    > > Bill Stellin Hull #6 Jaywalker.
                                    > >
                                    > > To: j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com
                                    > > From: rob.moore@
                                    > > Date: Thu, 30 Jul 2009 07:12:21 -0700
                                    > > Subject: [j4x-owners-group] Re:Water on the inside
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    > > How about adding a one way value on the hose going from the bilge
                                    > >
                                    > > pump over board, was done on a few J42 out here on the west coast.
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    > >
                                    > > Rob Moore
                                    > >
                                    >
                                  • pineapplegirlc320
                                    thanks Bernie. If I can t isolate the leak to the scupper drains we will investigate the rudder seal. Our leakage was when we were heeled well over to
                                    Message 19 of 24 , May 14, 2010
                                    • 0 Attachment
                                      thanks Bernie. If I can't isolate the leak to the scupper drains we will investigate the rudder seal. Our leakage was when we were heeled well over to starboard.

                                      --- In j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com, Bernard Coyne <coyneb@...> wrote:
                                      >
                                      > I would recommend checking the rudder seal while underway and especially
                                      > going downwind when the stern tends to squat down lower.
                                      >
                                      > Bernie
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      > Bernie Coyne, World Wide Marketing Manager
                                      > IBM Rational Team Concert - a new agile application lifecycle management
                                      > solution
                                      > Download a free trial: http://jazz.net/projects/rational-team-concert/
                                      > IBM Rational software, coyneb@..., 781-789-0762
                                      > Notes: Bernard Coyne/Lexington/IBM@IBMUS
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      > From: "pineapplegirlc320" <sailsfbay@...>
                                      >
                                      > To: j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com
                                      >
                                      > Date: 05/14/2010 02:34 PM
                                      >
                                      > Subject: [j4x-owners-group] Re:Water on the inside
                                      >
                                      > Sent by: j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      >
                                      > We once again our having water problems (We had water oozing out the floor
                                      > boards under the nav station in our race last weekend) so I was going back
                                      > through everyone's suggestions, trying to figure out where to start "this
                                      > time." We'd really like to try and keep the boat relatively dry on the Pac
                                      > Cup (52 more dayes)!
                                      >
                                      > This time it look like the water is coming in somewhere from the back
                                      > end--I hope it is the scuppers and not the rudder! We had the rudder
                                      > checked and the yard gave it a clean bill of health. Can't wait to crawl
                                      > around tomorrow looking for the leak!
                                      >
                                      > Jennifer
                                      > Tiki J
                                      > J/42 #33
                                      > --- In j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com, William Stellin <wstellin@>
                                      > wrote:
                                      > >
                                      > >
                                      > > We've had water downbelow also and it came, in our case, from a leaking
                                      > packing gland for the rudder post. A new rudder bearing, described a while
                                      > ago here, solved that problem. Water will come in through the forward sink
                                      > drain if the thru hull is not closed.
                                      > > Never in two Atlantic crossings and 30,000 miles had water come in
                                      > through the bilge pump outlet. Forgot once to close the port in the forward
                                      > head and probably had 200 gals come in. Won't do that again.
                                      > > Bill Stellin Hull #6 Jaywalker.
                                      > >
                                      > > To: j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com
                                      > > From: rob.moore@
                                      > > Date: Thu, 30 Jul 2009 07:12:21 -0700
                                      > > Subject: [j4x-owners-group] Re:Water on the inside
                                      > >
                                      > >
                                      > >
                                      > >
                                      > >
                                      > >
                                      > >
                                      > >
                                      > >
                                      > >
                                      > >
                                      > >
                                      > >
                                      > >
                                      > >
                                      > >
                                      > >
                                      > >
                                      > >
                                      > >
                                      > >
                                      > > How about adding a one way value on the hose going from the bilge
                                      > >
                                      > > pump over board, was done on a few J42 out here on the west coast.
                                      > >
                                      > >
                                      > >
                                      > > Rob Moore
                                      > >
                                      >
                                    • William Stellin
                                      Odd are it is your rudder post seal leaking. Also on a starboard tack lots of water may come down that side of the boat and go in through the aft deck locker
                                      Message 20 of 24 , May 16, 2010
                                      • 0 Attachment
                                        Odd are it is your rudder post seal leaking.  Also on a starboard tack lots of water may come down that side of the boat and go in through the aft deck locker lid.  Ours was not well fitted and water poured through it till I fixed it.  Also water can come in around the deck fitting at the top of the rudder post, Those lids also leak like mad.  I finally just used some silicone seal on it and don't ever open it.  I figure if I have to I can just break the seal with a good yank on the little tee handle.  Rudder post and deck lid. 99% sure its coming from one or both.
                                        Bill Stellin  Jaywalker  hull #6


                                        To: j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com
                                        From: sailsfbay@...
                                        Date: Fri, 14 May 2010 23:36:41 +0000
                                        Subject: [j4x-owners-group] Re:Water on the inside

                                         
                                        thanks Bernie. If I can't isolate the leak to the scupper drains we will investigate the rudder seal. Our leakage was when we were heeled well over to starboard.

                                        --- In j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com, Bernard Coyne <coyneb@...> wrote:
                                        >
                                        > I would recommend checking the rudder seal while underway and especially
                                        > going downwind when the stern tends to squat down lower.
                                        >
                                        > Bernie
                                        >
                                        >
                                        >
                                        > Bernie Coyne, World Wide Marketing Manager
                                        > IBM Rational Team Concert - a new agile application lifecycle management
                                        > solution
                                        > Download a free trial: http://jazz.net/projects/rational-team-concert/
                                        > IBM Rational software, coyneb@..., 781-789-0762
                                        > Notes: Bernard Coyne/Lexington/IBM@IBMUS
                                        >
                                        >
                                        >
                                        >
                                        >
                                        >
                                        >
                                        >
                                        >
                                        > From: "pineapplegirlc320" <sailsfbay@...>
                                        >
                                        > To: j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com
                                        >
                                        > Date: 05/14/2010 02:34 PM
                                        >
                                        > Subject: [j4x-owners-group] Re:Water on the inside
                                        >
                                        > Sent by: j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com
                                        >
                                        >
                                        >
                                        >
                                        >
                                        >
                                        >
                                        >
                                        >
                                        > We once again our having water problems (We had water oozing out the floor
                                        > boards under the nav station in our race last weekend) so I was going back
                                        > through everyone's suggestions, trying to figure out where to start "this
                                        > time." We'd really like to try and keep the boat relatively dry on the Pac
                                        > Cup (52 more dayes)!
                                        >
                                        > This time it look like the water is coming in somewhere from the back
                                        > end--I hope it is the scuppers and not the rudder! We had the rudder
                                        > checked and the yard gave it a clean bill of health. Can't wait to crawl
                                        > around tomorrow looking for the leak!
                                        >
                                        > Jennifer
                                        > Tiki J
                                        > J/42 #33
                                        > --- In j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com, William Stellin <wstellin@>
                                        > wrote:
                                        > >
                                        > >
                                        > > We've had water downbelow also and it came, in our case, from a leaking
                                        > packing gland for the rudder post. A new rudder bearing, described a while
                                        > ago here, solved that problem. Water will come in through the forward sink
                                        > drain if the thru hull is not closed.
                                        > > Never in two Atlantic crossings and 30,000 miles had water come in
                                        > through the bilge pump outlet. Forgot once to close the port in the forward
                                        > head and probably had 200 gals come in. Won't do that again.
                                        > > Bill Stellin Hull #6 Jaywalker.
                                        > >
                                        > > To: j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com
                                        > > From: rob.moore@
                                        > > Date: Thu, 30 Jul 2009 07:12:21 -0700
                                        > > Subject: [j4x-owners-group] Re:Water on the inside
                                        > >
                                        > >
                                        > >
                                        > >
                                        > >
                                        > >
                                        > >
                                        > >
                                        > >
                                        > >
                                        > >
                                        > >
                                        > >
                                        > >
                                        > >
                                        > >
                                        > >
                                        > >
                                        > >
                                        > >
                                        > >
                                        > > How about adding a one way value on the hose going from the bilge
                                        > >
                                        > > pump over board, was done on a few J42 out here on the west coast.
                                        > >
                                        > >
                                        > >
                                        > > Rob Moore
                                        > >
                                        >


                                      • dick.sanford@partnerre.com
                                        I had the same problem that Jennifer describes and it was driving me to distraction I finally discovered the issue on truant, hull #55. There are two inward
                                        Message 21 of 24 , May 17, 2010
                                        • 0 Attachment
                                          I had the same problem that Jennifer describes and it was driving me to
                                          distraction I finally discovered the issue on truant, hull #55. There are
                                          two inward turning flanges molded in the transom. The cockpit scuppers lead
                                          to these points and drain overboard. what I found was that the short piece
                                          of hose that connects to these flanges was done for, in fact when I got all
                                          the way down in there, I could see daylight and the wire reinforcing coil
                                          part of the hose and not much else. The better part of a roll of rescue
                                          tape provided a temporary fix. One side was worse than the other, but I
                                          replaced them both. Of course I did this during this past winter's layup
                                          and the boat has only just gone back in the water so I have yet to field
                                          test this fix.

                                          Dick
                                          _________________________
                                          Richard N. Sanford
                                          Executive Vice President
                                          Partner Reinsurance Company of the U.S.
                                          One Greenwich Plaza
                                          Greenwich, CT 06830
                                          Tel: 203-485-4279
                                          Fax: 203-485-4080
                                          dick.sanford@...




                                          William Stellin
                                          <wstellin@hotmail
                                          .com> To
                                          Sent by: <j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com>
                                          j4x-owners-group@ cc
                                          yahoogroups.com
                                          Subject
                                          RE: [j4x-owners-group] Re:Water on
                                          05/16/2010 07:36 the inside
                                          PM


                                          Please respond to
                                          j4x-owners-group@
                                          yahoogroups.com









                                          Odd are it is your rudder post seal leaking. Also on a starboard tack lots
                                          of water may come down that side of the boat and go in through the aft deck
                                          locker lid. Ours was not well fitted and water poured through it till I
                                          fixed it. Also water can come in around the deck fitting at the top of the
                                          rudder post, Those lids also leak like mad. I finally just used some
                                          silicone seal on it and don't ever open it. I figure if I have to I can
                                          just break the seal with a good yank on the little tee handle. Rudder post
                                          and deck lid. 99% sure its coming from one or both.
                                          Bill Stellin Jaywalker hull #6

                                          To: j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com
                                          From: sailsfbay@...
                                          Date: Fri, 14 May 2010 23:36:41 +0000
                                          Subject: [j4x-owners-group] Re:Water on the inside


                                          thanks Bernie. If I can't isolate the leak to the scupper drains we will
                                          investigate the rudder seal. Our leakage was when we were heeled well over
                                          to starboard.

                                          --- In j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com, Bernard Coyne <coyneb@...> wrote:
                                          >
                                          > I would recommend checking the rudder seal while underway and especially
                                          > going downwind when the stern tends to squat down lower.
                                          >
                                          > Bernie
                                          >
                                          >
                                          >
                                          > Bernie Coyne, World Wide Marketing Manager
                                          > IBM Rational Team Concert - a new agile application lifecycle management
                                          > solution
                                          > Download a free trial: http://jazz.net/projects/rational-team-concert/
                                          > IBM Rational software, coyneb@..., 781-789-0762
                                          > Notes: Bernard Coyne/Lexington/IBM@IBMUS
                                          >
                                          >
                                          >
                                          >
                                          >
                                          >
                                          >
                                          >
                                          >
                                          > From: "pineapplegirlc320" <sailsfbay@...>
                                          >
                                          > To: j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com
                                          >
                                          > Date: 05/14/2010 02:34 PM
                                          >
                                          > Subject: [j4x-owners-group] Re:Water on the inside
                                          >
                                          > Sent by: j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com
                                          >
                                          >
                                          >
                                          >
                                          >
                                          >
                                          >
                                          >
                                          >
                                          > We once again our having water problems (We had water oozing out the
                                          floor
                                          > boards under the nav station in our race last weekend) so I was going
                                          back
                                          > through everyone's suggestions, trying to figure out where to start "this
                                          > time." We'd really like to try and keep the boat relatively dry on the
                                          Pac
                                          > Cup (52 more dayes)!
                                          >
                                          > This time it look like the water is coming in somewhere from the back
                                          > end--I hope it is the scuppers and not the rudder! We had the rudder
                                          > checked and the yard gave it a clean bill of health. Can't wait to crawl
                                          > around tomorrow looking for the leak!
                                          >
                                          > Jennifer
                                          > Tiki J
                                          > J/42 #33
                                          > --- In j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com, William Stellin <wstellin@>
                                          > wrote:
                                          > >
                                          > >
                                          > > We've had water downbelow also and it came, in our case, from a leaking
                                          > packing gland for the rudder post. A new rudder bearing, described a
                                          while
                                          > ago here, solved that problem. Water will come in through the forward
                                          sink
                                          > drain if the thru hull is not closed.
                                          > > Never in two Atlantic crossings and 30,000 miles had water come in
                                          > through the bilge pump outlet. Forgot once to close the port in the
                                          forward
                                          > head and probably had 200 gals come in. Won't do that again.
                                          > > Bill Stellin Hull #6 Jaywalker.
                                          > >
                                          > > To: j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com
                                          > > From: rob.moore@
                                          > > Date: Thu, 30 Jul 2009 07:12:21 -0700
                                          > > Subject: [j4x-owners-group] Re:Water on the inside
                                          > >
                                          > >
                                          > >
                                          > >
                                          > >
                                          > >
                                          > >
                                          > >
                                          > >
                                          > >
                                          > >
                                          > >
                                          > >
                                          > >
                                          > >
                                          > >
                                          > >
                                          > >
                                          > >
                                          > >
                                          > >
                                          > > How about adding a one way value on the hose going from the bilge
                                          > >
                                          > > pump over board, was done on a few J42 out here on the west coast.
                                          > >
                                          > >
                                          > >
                                          > > Rob Moore
                                          > >
                                          >








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                                        • Wayne Cassady
                                          We have had water hide out and then when healed enough show up in the nav station area. This was with a relatively dry main bilge, but water was standing
                                          Message 22 of 24 , May 17, 2010
                                          • 0 Attachment
                                            We have had water "hide out" and then when healed enough show up in the nav station area. This was with a relatively dry main bilge, but water was standing under the cabin sole next to the nav station.

                                            On 5/14/2010 7:36 PM, pineapplegirlc320 wrote:
                                             

                                            thanks Bernie. If I can't isolate the leak to the scupper drains we will investigate the rudder seal. Our leakage was when we were heeled well over to starboard.

                                            --- In j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com, Bernard Coyne <coyneb@...> wrote:
                                            >
                                            > I would recommend checking the rudder seal while underway and especially
                                            > going downwind when the stern tends to squat down lower.
                                            >
                                            > Bernie
                                            >
                                            >
                                            >
                                            > Bernie Coyne, World Wide Marketing Manager
                                            > IBM Rational Team Concert - a new agile application lifecycle management
                                            > solution
                                            > Download a free trial: http://jazz.net/projects/rational-team-concert/
                                            > IBM Rational software, coyneb@..., 781-789-0762
                                            > Notes: Bernard Coyne/Lexington/IBM@IBMUS
                                            >
                                            >
                                            >
                                            >
                                            >
                                            >
                                            >
                                            >
                                            >
                                            > From: "pineapplegirlc320" <sailsfbay@...>
                                            >
                                            > To: j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com
                                            >
                                            > Date: 05/14/2010 02:34 PM
                                            >
                                            > Subject: [j4x-owners-group] Re:Water on the inside
                                            >
                                            > Sent by: j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com
                                            >
                                            >
                                            >
                                            >
                                            >
                                            >
                                            >
                                            >
                                            >
                                            > We once again our having water problems (We had water oozing out the floor
                                            > boards under the nav station in our race last weekend) so I was going back
                                            > through everyone's suggestions, trying to figure out where to start "this
                                            > time." We'd really like to try and keep the boat relatively dry on the Pac
                                            > Cup (52 more dayes)!
                                            >
                                            > This time it look like the water is coming in somewhere from the back
                                            > end--I hope it is the scuppers and not the rudder! We had the rudder
                                            > checked and the yard gave it a clean bill of health. Can't wait to crawl
                                            > around tomorrow looking for the leak!
                                            >
                                            > Jennifer
                                            > Tiki J
                                            > J/42 #33
                                            > --- In j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com, William Stellin <wstellin@>
                                            > wrote:
                                            > >
                                            > >
                                            > > We've had water downbelow also and it came, in our case, from a leaking
                                            > packing gland for the rudder post. A new rudder bearing, described a while
                                            > ago here, solved that problem. Water will come in through the forward sink
                                            > drain if the thru hull is not closed.
                                            > > Never in two Atlantic crossings and 30,000 miles had water come in
                                            > through the bilge pump outlet. Forgot once to close the port in the forward
                                            > head and probably had 200 gals come in. Won't do that again.
                                            > > Bill Stellin Hull #6 Jaywalker.
                                            > >
                                            > > To: j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com
                                            > > From: rob.moore@
                                            > > Date: Thu, 30 Jul 2009 07:12:21 -0700
                                            > > Subject: [j4x-owners-group] Re:Water on the inside
                                            > >
                                            > >
                                            > >
                                            > >
                                            > >
                                            > >
                                            > >
                                            > >
                                            > >
                                            > >
                                            > >
                                            > >
                                            > >
                                            > >
                                            > >
                                            > >
                                            > >
                                            > >
                                            > >
                                            > >
                                            > >
                                            > > How about adding a one way value on the hose going from the bilge
                                            > >
                                            > > pump over board, was done on a few J42 out here on the west coast.
                                            > >
                                            > >
                                            > >
                                            > > Rob Moore
                                            > >
                                            >

                                          • Bernard Coyne
                                            Funny....I just replaced that same short piece of hose this winter...for the same reasons!! Bernie... Amigo VI, hull #3 Bernie Coyne, World Wide Marketing
                                            Message 23 of 24 , May 17, 2010
                                            • 0 Attachment

                                              Funny....I just replaced that same short piece of hose this winter...for the same reasons!!

                                              Bernie
                                              Amigo VI, hull #3

                                              Bernie Coyne, World Wide Marketing Manager
                                              IBM Rational Team Concert - a new agile application lifecycle management solution
                                              Download a free trial:
                                              http://jazz.net/projects/rational-team-concert/
                                              IBM Rational software,
                                              coyneb@..., 781-789-0762
                                              Notes: Bernard Coyne/Lexington/IBM@IBMUS



                                              Inactive hide details for dick.sanford---05/17/2010 08:51:17 AM---I had the same problem that Jennifer describes and it was dridick.sanford---05/17/2010 08:51:17 AM---I had the same problem that Jennifer describes and it was driving me to distraction I finally discov


                                              From:

                                              dick.sanford@...

                                              To:

                                              j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com

                                              Date:

                                              05/17/2010 08:51 AM

                                              Subject:

                                              RE: [j4x-owners-group] Re:Water on the inside

                                              Sent by:

                                              j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com




                                              I had the same problem that Jennifer describes and it was driving me to
                                              distraction I finally discovered the issue on truant, hull #55. There are
                                              two inward turning flanges molded in the transom. The cockpit scuppers lead
                                              to these points and drain overboard. what I found was that the short piece
                                              of hose that connects to these flanges was done for, in fact when I got all
                                              the way down in there, I could see daylight and the wire reinforcing coil
                                              part of the hose and not much else. The better part of a roll of rescue
                                              tape provided a temporary fix. One side was worse than the other, but I
                                              replaced them both. Of course I did this during this past winter's layup
                                              and the boat has only just gone back in the water so I have yet to field
                                              test this fix.

                                              Dick
                                              _________________________
                                              Richard N. Sanford
                                              Executive Vice President
                                              Partner Reinsurance Company of the U.S.
                                              One Greenwich Plaza
                                              Greenwich, CT 06830
                                              Tel: 203-485-4279
                                              Fax: 203-485-4080

                                              dick.sanford@...




                                              William Stellin
                                              <wstellin@hotmail
                                              .com> To
                                              Sent by: <
                                              j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com>
                                              j4x-owners-group@ cc
                                              yahoogroups.com
                                              Subject
                                              RE: [j4x-owners-group] Re:Water on
                                              05/16/2010 07:36 the inside
                                              PM


                                              Please respond to
                                              j4x-owners-group@
                                              yahoogroups.com









                                              Odd are it is your rudder post seal leaking. Also on a starboard tack lots
                                              of water may come down that side of the boat and go in through the aft deck
                                              locker lid. Ours was not well fitted and water poured through it till I
                                              fixed it. Also water can come in around the deck fitting at the top of the
                                              rudder post, Those lids also leak like mad. I finally just used some
                                              silicone seal on it and don't ever open it. I figure if I have to I can
                                              just break the seal with a good yank on the little tee handle. Rudder post
                                              and deck lid. 99% sure its coming from one or both.
                                              Bill Stellin Jaywalker hull #6

                                              To:
                                              j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com
                                              From:
                                              sailsfbay@...
                                              Date: Fri, 14 May 2010 23:36:41 +0000
                                              Subject: [j4x-owners-group] Re:Water on the inside


                                              thanks Bernie. If I can't isolate the leak to the scupper drains we will
                                              investigate the rudder seal. Our leakage was when we were heeled well over
                                              to starboard.

                                              --- In
                                              j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com, Bernard Coyne <coyneb@...> wrote:

                                              >
                                              > I would recommend checking the rudder seal while underway and especially
                                              > going downwind when the stern tends to squat down lower.
                                              >
                                              > Bernie
                                              >
                                              >
                                              >
                                              > Bernie Coyne, World Wide Marketing Manager
                                              > IBM Rational Team Concert - a new agile application lifecycle management
                                              > solution
                                              > Download a free trial:
                                              http://jazz.net/projects/rational-team-concert/
                                              > IBM Rational software, coyneb@..., 781-789-0762
                                              > Notes: Bernard Coyne/Lexington/IBM@IBMUS
                                              >
                                              >
                                              >
                                              >
                                              >
                                              >
                                              >
                                              >
                                              >
                                              > From: "pineapplegirlc320" <sailsfbay@...>
                                              >
                                              > To:
                                              j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com
                                              >
                                              > Date: 05/14/2010 02:34 PM
                                              >
                                              > Subject: [j4x-owners-group] Re:Water on the inside
                                              >
                                              > Sent by:
                                              j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com
                                              >
                                              >
                                              >
                                              >
                                              >
                                              >
                                              >
                                              >
                                              >
                                              > We once again our having water problems (We had water oozing out the
                                              floor
                                              > boards under the nav station in our race last weekend) so I was going
                                              back
                                              > through everyone's suggestions, trying to figure out where to start "this
                                              > time." We'd really like to try and keep the boat relatively dry on the
                                              Pac
                                              > Cup (52 more dayes)!
                                              >
                                              > This time it look like the water is coming in somewhere from the back
                                              > end--I hope it is the scuppers and not the rudder! We had the rudder
                                              > checked and the yard gave it a clean bill of health. Can't wait to crawl
                                              > around tomorrow looking for the leak!
                                              >
                                              > Jennifer
                                              > Tiki J
                                              > J/42 #33
                                              > --- In
                                              j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com, William Stellin <wstellin@>
                                              > wrote:
                                              > >
                                              > >
                                              > > We've had water downbelow also and it came, in our case, from a leaking
                                              > packing gland for the rudder post. A new rudder bearing, described a
                                              while
                                              > ago here, solved that problem. Water will come in through the forward
                                              sink
                                              > drain if the thru hull is not closed.
                                              > > Never in two Atlantic crossings and 30,000 miles had water come in
                                              > through the bilge pump outlet. Forgot once to close the port in the
                                              forward
                                              > head and probably had 200 gals come in. Won't do that again.
                                              > > Bill Stellin Hull #6 Jaywalker.
                                              > >
                                              > > To:
                                              j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com
                                              > > From: rob.moore@
                                              > > Date: Thu, 30 Jul 2009 07:12:21 -0700
                                              > > Subject: [j4x-owners-group] Re:Water on the inside
                                              > >
                                              > >
                                              > >
                                              > >
                                              > >
                                              > >
                                              > >
                                              > >
                                              > >
                                              > >
                                              > >
                                              > >
                                              > >
                                              > >
                                              > >
                                              > >
                                              > >
                                              > >
                                              > >
                                              > >
                                              > >
                                              > > How about adding a one way value on the hose going from the bilge
                                              > >
                                              > > pump over board, was done on a few J42 out here on the west coast.
                                              > >
                                              > >
                                              > >
                                              > > Rob Moore
                                              > >
                                              >








                                              DISCLAIMER: This e-mail contains information solely intended for named
                                              recipients and is confidential and proprietary to PartnerRe. If you are not
                                              one of the intended recipients of this message, you must not read, use or
                                              disseminate the information in it and should notify the sender by replying
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                                            • pineapplegirlc320
                                              After much crawling around in small dark spaces and water hose testing I came up with nothing. The guys found a problem right after the race with exhaust
                                              Message 24 of 24 , May 20, 2010
                                              • 0 Attachment
                                                After much crawling around in small dark spaces and water hose testing I came up with nothing. The guys found a problem right after the race with exhaust water leaking out of a loose connection where the aqua alarm had been installed so hopefully that was where the water came from. Too bad they told me AFTER I crawled all over the boat. :) Hopefully we will find out during our next race so if there is still a leak we can fix it before the Pac Cup. If not, we have enough rescue tape to tape every tube, hatch, seam, opening, etc on the boat several times over.

                                                --- In j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com, Bernard Coyne <coyneb@...> wrote:
                                                >
                                                > Funny....I just replaced that same short piece of hose this winter...for
                                                > the same reasons!!
                                                >
                                                > Bernie...
                                                > Amigo VI, hull #3
                                                >
                                                >
                                                >
                                                > Bernie Coyne, World Wide Marketing Manager
                                                > IBM Rational Team Concert - a new agile application lifecycle management
                                                > solution
                                                > Download a free trial: http://jazz.net/projects/rational-team-concert/
                                                > IBM Rational software, coyneb@..., 781-789-0762
                                                > Notes: Bernard Coyne/Lexington/IBM@IBMUS
                                                >
                                                >
                                                >
                                                >
                                                >
                                                >
                                                >
                                                >
                                                >
                                                > From: dick.sanford@...
                                                >
                                                > To: j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com
                                                >
                                                > Date: 05/17/2010 08:51 AM
                                                >
                                                > Subject: RE: [j4x-owners-group] Re:Water on the inside
                                                >
                                                > Sent by: j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com
                                                >
                                                >
                                                >
                                                >
                                                >
                                                >
                                                >
                                                >
                                                >
                                                > I had the same problem that Jennifer describes and it was driving me to
                                                > distraction I finally discovered the issue on truant, hull #55. There are
                                                > two inward turning flanges molded in the transom. The cockpit scuppers lead
                                                >
                                                > to these points and drain overboard. what I found was that the short piece
                                                > of hose that connects to these flanges was done for, in fact when I got all
                                                >
                                                > the way down in there, I could see daylight and the wire reinforcing coil
                                                > part of the hose and not much else. The better part of a roll of rescue
                                                > tape provided a temporary fix. One side was worse than the other, but I
                                                > replaced them both. Of course I did this during this past winter's layup
                                                > and the boat has only just gone back in the water so I have yet to field
                                                > test this fix.
                                                >
                                                > Dick
                                                > _________________________
                                                > Richard N. Sanford
                                                > Executive Vice President
                                                > Partner Reinsurance Company of the U.S.
                                                > One Greenwich Plaza
                                                > Greenwich, CT 06830
                                                > Tel: 203-485-4279
                                                > Fax: 203-485-4080
                                                > dick.sanford@...
                                                >
                                                >
                                                >
                                                >
                                                > William Stellin
                                                > <wstellin@hotmail
                                                > .com> To
                                                > Sent by: <j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com>
                                                > j4x-owners-group@ cc
                                                > yahoogroups.com
                                                > Subject
                                                > RE: [j4x-owners-group] Re:Water on
                                                > 05/16/2010 07:36 the inside
                                                > PM
                                                >
                                                >
                                                > Please respond to
                                                > j4x-owners-group@
                                                > yahoogroups.com
                                                >
                                                >
                                                >
                                                >
                                                >
                                                >
                                                >
                                                >
                                                >
                                                > Odd are it is your rudder post seal leaking. Also on a starboard tack lots
                                                > of water may come down that side of the boat and go in through the aft deck
                                                >
                                                > locker lid. Ours was not well fitted and water poured through it till I
                                                > fixed it. Also water can come in around the deck fitting at the top of the
                                                > rudder post, Those lids also leak like mad. I finally just used some
                                                > silicone seal on it and don't ever open it. I figure if I have to I can
                                                > just break the seal with a good yank on the little tee handle. Rudder post
                                                > and deck lid. 99% sure its coming from one or both.
                                                > Bill Stellin Jaywalker hull #6
                                                >
                                                > To: j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com
                                                > From: sailsfbay@...
                                                > Date: Fri, 14 May 2010 23:36:41 +0000
                                                > Subject: [j4x-owners-group] Re:Water on the inside
                                                >
                                                >
                                                > thanks Bernie. If I can't isolate the leak to the scupper drains we will
                                                > investigate the rudder seal. Our leakage was when we were heeled well over
                                                > to starboard.
                                                >
                                                > --- In j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com, Bernard Coyne <coyneb@> wrote:
                                                > >
                                                > > I would recommend checking the rudder seal while underway and especially
                                                > > going downwind when the stern tends to squat down lower.
                                                > >
                                                > > Bernie
                                                > >
                                                > >
                                                > >
                                                > > Bernie Coyne, World Wide Marketing Manager
                                                > > IBM Rational Team Concert - a new agile application lifecycle management
                                                > > solution
                                                > > Download a free trial: http://jazz.net/projects/rational-team-concert/
                                                > > IBM Rational software, coyneb@, 781-789-0762
                                                > > Notes: Bernard Coyne/Lexington/IBM@IBMUS
                                                > >
                                                > >
                                                > >
                                                > >
                                                > >
                                                > >
                                                > >
                                                > >
                                                > >
                                                > > From: "pineapplegirlc320" <sailsfbay@>
                                                > >
                                                > > To: j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com
                                                > >
                                                > > Date: 05/14/2010 02:34 PM
                                                > >
                                                > > Subject: [j4x-owners-group] Re:Water on the inside
                                                > >
                                                > > Sent by: j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com
                                                > >
                                                > >
                                                > >
                                                > >
                                                > >
                                                > >
                                                > >
                                                > >
                                                > >
                                                > > We once again our having water problems (We had water oozing out the
                                                > floor
                                                > > boards under the nav station in our race last weekend) so I was going
                                                > back
                                                > > through everyone's suggestions, trying to figure out where to start "this
                                                >
                                                > > time." We'd really like to try and keep the boat relatively dry on the
                                                > Pac
                                                > > Cup (52 more dayes)!
                                                > >
                                                > > This time it look like the water is coming in somewhere from the back
                                                > > end--I hope it is the scuppers and not the rudder! We had the rudder
                                                > > checked and the yard gave it a clean bill of health. Can't wait to crawl
                                                > > around tomorrow looking for the leak!
                                                > >
                                                > > Jennifer
                                                > > Tiki J
                                                > > J/42 #33
                                                > > --- In j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com, William Stellin <wstellin@>
                                                > > wrote:
                                                > > >
                                                > > >
                                                > > > We've had water downbelow also and it came, in our case, from a leaking
                                                >
                                                > > packing gland for the rudder post. A new rudder bearing, described a
                                                > while
                                                > > ago here, solved that problem. Water will come in through the forward
                                                > sink
                                                > > drain if the thru hull is not closed.
                                                > > > Never in two Atlantic crossings and 30,000 miles had water come in
                                                > > through the bilge pump outlet. Forgot once to close the port in the
                                                > forward
                                                > > head and probably had 200 gals come in. Won't do that again.
                                                > > > Bill Stellin Hull #6 Jaywalker.
                                                > > >
                                                > > > To: j4x-owners-group@yahoogroups.com
                                                > > > From: rob.moore@
                                                > > > Date: Thu, 30 Jul 2009 07:12:21 -0700
                                                > > > Subject: [j4x-owners-group] Re:Water on the inside
                                                > > >
                                                > > >
                                                > > >
                                                > > >
                                                > > >
                                                > > >
                                                > > >
                                                > > >
                                                > > >
                                                > > >
                                                > > >
                                                > > >
                                                > > >
                                                > > >
                                                > > >
                                                > > >
                                                > > >
                                                > > >
                                                > > >
                                                > > >
                                                > > >
                                                > > > How about adding a one way value on the hose going from the bilge
                                                > > >
                                                > > > pump over board, was done on a few J42 out here on the west coast.
                                                > > >
                                                > > >
                                                > > >
                                                > > > Rob Moore
                                                > > >
                                                > >
                                                >
                                                >
                                                >
                                                >
                                                >
                                                >
                                                >
                                                >
                                                > DISCLAIMER: This e-mail contains information solely intended for named
                                                > recipients and is confidential and proprietary to PartnerRe. If you are not
                                                >
                                                > one of the intended recipients of this message, you must not read, use or
                                                > disseminate the information in it and should notify the sender by replying
                                                > to this message and deleting it afterwards from your mail system. Please be
                                                >
                                                > aware that unauthorized reproduction or distribution of this communication
                                                > is prohibited.
                                                >
                                                >
                                                > (See attached file: pic25547.gif)(See attached file:
                                                > pic27644.gif)
                                                >
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