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Re: [infoguys-list] the monopoly game

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  • Will Ray
    To save a lot of time and get right down to the nitty gritty, cut through all the bullshit thrown at you from both companies. Only one thing to
    Message 1 of 3 , Mar 29, 2004
      To save a lot of time and get right down to the nitty gritty, cut through
      all the bullshit thrown at you from both companies.
      Only one thing to do............Have a complete audit, everything from a to
      z of both companies, take no ones word for anything.
      This audit would cost in the range of $400,000.00 to a $1,000,000.00 for
      fool proof guaranteed audit.

      Then you have no doubt who is growing, and who has the income.

      Will Ray
      "IN GOD WE TRUST"
      "THE LAND OF THE FREE, HOME OF THE BRAVE"
      "When you have a lot to lose it makes sense to trust the best"
      E-Mail: willraypi@... http://www.willraypi.cjb.net
      "For what ever is hidden is meant to be disclosed, and what ever is
      concealed is meant to be brought out into the open" (Mark 4:22 NIV).
      Wilburn "Will" Ray CMI State of Oregon License No. 071
      Legal Investigator
      POB 547
      Sutherlin, Oregon 97479-0547
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      ----- Original Message -----
      From: <Jurydoctor@...>
      To: <2debate@egroups.com>; <paradigms@yahoogroups.com>;
      <courttv_2@yahoogroups.com>; <Cyber_Chat@yahoogroups.com>;
      <infoguys-list@yahoogroups.com>
      Sent: Sunday, March 28, 2004 12:49 PM
      Subject: [infoguys-list] the monopoly game


      see my comments and questions below:


      Let's play monopoly!!

      There are 2 things I need your help with..
      the first is what evidence would you need to see in order to determine who
      is
      right.
      the second thing is your opinion on what is presented..
      Thanks in advance...
      all opinions will go towards fundraising.. (will give 10 dollars per
      response
      to justice for juvenilles)
      thanks,
      Amy
      Both BigCo. and LittleCo. conduct market research. BigCo. was the leading
      company for many years, but LittleCo. developed a new software and, by the
      early
      1990s, controlled about 55% of the business in the United States, posing a
      real threat to BigCo.'s established business.

      .......
      What would you like to see (documents, memos, reports, testimony)?
      1.what type of marketing research?
      2. how many market research firms were there in the past? (leading company
      of
      how many)
      3. what did the software do? why did it pose a threat?
      4. would like to see the financials to determine threat.
      5. what do you mean by threat? stock prices? decreasing workforce? list of
      customers that went to Littleco?
      6. Describe in detail what "threat" means?
      Is competition a threat?



      -...............................................................

      What do you think so far? I think that BigCo. probably enjoyed being the
      only
      game in town and was afraid of competition

      -------------------------_____________________________-


      Littleco's argument:

      In this lawsuit, LittleCo. alleges that, in response to this threat, BigCo.
      tried to gain a monopoly and drive LittleCo. out of business. LittleCo.
      says
      that BigCo. priced its own software at such low prices that it expected to
      lose
      money until it could drive LittleCo. out of business, and then raise prices.
      LittleCo. says it has proof that BigCo. tried to drive it out of business
      because BigCo.'s files have lots of documents that talk about war, and that
      say
      they wanted to kill and annihilate LittleCo. LittleCo. also complains that
      BigCo. unfairly hired a successful executive from LittleCo. to run Big Co.s
      U.S.
      business.

      ............
      What would you like to see (documents, memos, reports, testimony)?
      1. What was the price of the software? (both companies)
      2. Show me Bigco's financials when they offered the software at a low price.
      3. Did Bigco raise the price? when?
      4.Show me the memos
      5. Tell me about this executive (resume, job function etc)

      What do you think so far?
      The memos are damning. The focus was on getting rid of the competition not
      on
      improving the product.

      LittleCo. also says that BigCo. dominated the market in Asia.
      LittleCo. didn't have any market share there until it started to buy up
      existing
      Asian companies in the same business in 1994. LittleCo. says that BigCo.
      took steps to prevent LittleCo. from successfully expanding into Asia.
      Among
      other things, LittleCo. says that BigCo. offered packages of services from
      many
      Asian countries to its customers that LittleCo. couldn't possibly compete
      with
      because it didn't yet have business in most Asian countries.

      What would you like to see (documents, memos, reports, testimony)?
      1. history of business ($) in Asian market
      2. what companies did Littleco buy? why didn't bigco try to buy these
      businesses.
      3. I really just want to see customer list and money trail.
      What do you think so far?
      I think Bigco was keeping their eye on Littleco and tried to keep them down

      BigCo. knew that LittleCo. was using its stock as currency to compete for
      acquisitions. LittleCo. alleges that part of Big Co.'s strategy in
      competing on
      price was to attack LittleCo.'s stock price by causing it to miss its target
      revenue numbers. One effect of LittleCo.'s reduced stock price was that
      LittleCo. was unable to complete the acquisition of X Co. that it had
      planned. In
      addition, Little Co. says X Co. agreed not to speak with BigCo. but Big Co.
      spoke with it anyway and bought X Co. out from under LittleCo.'s feet.

      What would you like to see (documents, memos, reports, testimony)?
      documents having to do with acquisition of X co.
      how long and who was negotiating
      proof that Bigco was not supposed to speak to X co.. (was this Russia?)
      What do you think so far?
      Big co is trying to knock Little co out of the market and is succeeding

      LittleCo. says that it would have gone out of business if Asian antitrust
      officials hadn't stepped in and stopped Big Co. from acting illegally. The
      Asian
      antitrust officials issued a complaint against Big Co. which found that Big
      Co. used its market power in an illegal way designed to keep Little Co. from
      successfully entering the Asian market.

      What would you like to see (documents, memos, reports, testimony)?
      Asian antitrust officials reports, findings, lawsuit documents
      What do you think so far?
      same


      Bigco's defense:
      BigCo. says that it didn't compete unfairly or illegally. When
      BigCo. saw what was happening to its business, it realized that it would
      have
      to develop a similar software. In the meantime, it began to compete
      vigorously
      against LittleCo. by lowering the prices it charged to its existing and
      potential (LittleCo.'s) customers. BigCo. says it was prepared to lose
      money on
      some key contracts in order to stay in business until it developed its new
      software.

      What would you like to see (documents, memos, reports, testimony)?
      1.customer list of Bigco before during and after Littleco's competition
      2.customer list of Littleco before during and after Bigco's (alleged)
      competition
      What do you think so far?
      I think Bigco has a right to survive, but not to kill off the competition

      BigCo. says that it had to compete vigorously with LittleCo. in order to
      survive. It was losing business to Little Co. throughout the United States
      and was
      in such trouble that it only had two choices: try and keep its customers
      until it could develop the new software or go out of business. It chose to
      fight.
      BigCo. says that the fighting tactics it used were no different than the
      tactics used by LittleCo. Documents from LittleCo.'s files show that
      LittleCo.
      also used warfare language, language which is typical (Bigco claims) in
      competitive business environments.

      What would you like to see (documents, memos, reports, testimony)?
      1.in order to survive. It was losing business to Little Co. (show me what
      biz
      they lost (to who and how much it cost them)
      2. survive or make a killing? show me the $
      3. until it could develop the new software (show me the memos documents
      resources in developing new software.. effort to develop software as great
      as
      effort to kill Littleco?
      4. show me Little co's warfare documents


      What do you think so far?
      If only Little co and Big co are in this market.. Bigco is in real trouble


      Although BigCo. says it offered customers services at low and unprofitable
      prices on a few contracts to a few customers, BigCo. also says that overall
      its
      business was profitable and LittleCo. also could have made a profit if it
      had
      chosen to match or beat BigCo.'s prices. BigCo. says low prices benefited
      customers and was good for competition, not bad.

      What would you like to see (documents, memos, reports, testimony)?
      show me profit statements of Big and Little Co/ and customer
      lists..depositions from customers.. why did they switch?

      What do you think so far?
      I do not buy this. how could Littleco beat Bigco by matching prices, if the
      prices were loss leaders for bigco?

      Big Co. says that Little Co.'s stock price fell but it fell because the
      stock
      market realized Big Co. would now survive, and the drop in stock price was
      an
      incidental effect of Big Co.'s own business improvements rather than part of
      any concerted plan to drive down Little Co.'s stock price. Big Co. says
      that
      it was entitled to talk to X Co. at all times and only acquired X Co. after
      Little Co.'s agreement with X Co. had expired.

      What would you like to see (documents, memos, reports, testimony)?
      Proof of why stock shares went south for Littleco..
      show me stock prices over time
      What do you think so far?
      I think Big co's profits are correlated with Littleco's losses.. how
      convenient is that?

      BigCo. agrees that it did offer some discounts to customers in
      Asia if the customers took services from more than one country. But BigCo.
      says
      that these customers were multinational companies that demanded contracts
      that included many countries. In any event, BigCo. says the discounts were
      small. BigCo. also says these contracts had no effect on LittleCo.'s
      efforts to
      enter Asia. LittleCo. successfully entered the Asian market and gained
      business
      quickly in all the countries it entered.

      What would you like to see (documents, memos, reports, testimony)?
      info about the multinational companies, their needs etc.
      which companies Big/Little co were taliking to

      What do you think so far?
      If that is the case, these companies were not Little co's and were not going
      to be until Little co established an "in" in this market, which obviously
      Bigco was holding the keys to the gate and not letting Little co in.


      BigCo. says that the Asian antitrust officials investigated
      BigCo. at the request of LittleCo. and its lawyers. The whole inquiry was
      resolved
      without any decision by any court or tribunal, without any admission of
      liability by BigCo, and without any fines or penalties. BigCo. said that it
      didn't
      do anything wrong in Asia and is prepared to prove that. The United States
      antitrust officials investigated Big Co. but never said that it did anything
      wrong.


      What would you like to see (documents, memos, reports, testimony)?
      inquiry report/findings
      What do you think so far?
      I think Bigco probably backed down real fast. If I were Little co I would
      bring in officials as well... and I'd be frustrated as hell


      what is your overall impression of this case?

      Little Co is right.. Bigco had and wants a monopoly.

      The case also hinges on the software.. Did Bigco develop a better mouse
      trap?
      why did comapnies go back/ with Bigco? because of the software? the
      bundling?
      the no other competitor after Little co started bleeding money?


      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





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