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Re: [infoguys-list] Not a good thing - SUE

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  • oracleintl@aol.com
    Hi Sue, I am not sure the federal statutes would be the best place to look if you hope to find support for that argument since their is no federal extortion
    Message 1 of 9 , Apr 3, 2009
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      Hi Sue,
      I am not sure the federal statutes would be the best place to look if you
      hope to find support for that argument since their is no federal extortion
      statute per se, but if you see anything in these code sections that supports the
      contention that the difference between Extortion & Blackmail is that
      Extortion relates to a threat to do something that is otherwise lawful, you are doing
      better than I am.

      § 872. Extortion by officers or employees of the United States

      Whoever, being an officer, or employee of the United States or any
      department or agency thereof, or representing himself to be or assuming to act as
      such, under color or pretense of office or employment commits or attempts an act
      of extortion, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than
      three years, or both; but if the amount so extorted or demanded does not exceed
      $1,000, he shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than one
      year, or both.



      § 873. Blackmail


      Whoever, under a threat of informing, or as a consideration for not
      informing, against any violation of any law of the United States, demands or receives
      any money or other valuable thing, shall be fined under this title or
      imprisoned not more than one year, or both.





      For those who may find the fact that there is no federal extortion statute
      confusing, the same applies to murder -- and for the same reason. Extortion
      is a state crime, as is murder, as well as most other crimes. It becomes a
      matter of federal jurisdiction when there is a federal connection such as is
      the case in Section 872 -- the extortion is by Officers of the United States,
      related to their office.

      There are numerous and various federal offenses connected to extortion, but
      in each case (the target is the President 871, the target is a foreign
      official 878, the demand is delivered by US mail 876, etc) there is some federal
      issue involved.

      If someone walks up to you in California and verbally communicates an
      extortionate threat, it is entirely possible that there is no federal offense
      involved - unless you pay them. While payment is not actually necessary to make
      the offense of extortion complete, there is a separate federal law against
      receiving the proceeds of extortion because that implicates commerce.

      I must, however, retract my prior statement to the effect that the author of
      that ridiculous assertion is a boob. I like boobs, and I have an undying
      fondness for many of the boobs with which it has been my privilege to become
      familiar, so I shall stick with "bonehead" instead.

      Bill







      In a message dated 4/3/2009 10:58:18 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
      suesarkis@... writes:




      In a message dated 4/3/2009 5:19:40 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time,
      _oracleintl@..._ (mailto:oracleintl@...) writes:

      actually wrote that the distinction between extortion and blackmail is that
      extortion is a threat to do something that would otherwise be a lawful act,
      that was a completely ridiculous thing to say, and I defy you to find one
      single source anywhere that says anything like that.

      Bill -

      I do see a difference between 18 USC §§ 872 and 873 and I truly can see
      where he was coming from. Who knows, maybe my mind is just a stupid as his
      honor. One could only hope !!!

      Doesn't this support what he said regarding the matter that he was
      discussing?

      18 USC §872
      §872. Extortion by officers or employees of the United States
      Whoever, being an officer, or employee of the United States or any
      department or agency thereof, or representing himself to be or assuming to
      act as
      such, under color or pretense of office or employment commits or attempts an
      act
      of extortion, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than
      three years, or both; but if the amount so extorted or demanded does not
      exceed
      $1,000, he shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than one
      year, or both.

      18 USC §873
      §873. Blackmail
      Whoever, under a threat of informing, or as a consideration for not
      informing, against any violation of any law of the United States, demands or
      receives
      any money or other valuable thing, shall be fined under this title or
      imprisoned not more than one year, or both.

      Sincerely yours,
      Sue
      ________________________
      Sue Sarkis
      Sarkis Detective Agency

      (est. 1976)
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    • suesarkis@aol.com
      Bill - The way I understood what he was saying and I could be very wrong is that the government said - a) if you don t let us, than, - b) we will do an
      Message 2 of 9 , Apr 3, 2009
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        Bill -

        The way I understood what he was saying and I could be very wrong is that
        the government said -

        a) if you don't let us, than, -

        b) we will do an audit!

        Although an audit is a perfectly lawful act and although the bank swears
        they could withstand an audit as their books are in order and they are not one
        of the banks that holds deeds, etc., the fact still remains that the bank
        feared they could not withstand the financial penalties attached to having to have
        their staff involved over such a long period of time.

        In other words, you don't have to threaten to break someone's bones or kill
        their family members, both unlawful acts, for it to be extortion. Under the
        section he was referring to it was specifically about when the government
        uses its color of authority to impose pressure.

        However, you are the former fed and neither his honor nor I am so therefore,
        I'll capitulate.

        By the way, if I led you to believe that I personally know Judge Napolitano,
        I do apologize as I don't. I've just read his books, reviewed his cases and
        listened to his interviews.


        Sue
        **************Feeling the pinch at the grocery store? Make dinner for $10 or
        less. (http://food.aol.com/frugal-feasts?ncid=emlcntusfood00000001)


        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • Slipinn@aol.com
        They had a saying for this back in my Police days. You might beat the rap, but you never beat the ride Chuck Chambers Co-President, Florida Association of
        Message 3 of 9 , Apr 3, 2009
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          They had a saying for this back in my Police days.

          "You might beat the rap, but you never beat the ride"


          Chuck Chambers
          Co-President, Florida Association of Private Investigators (FAPI)
          Charter member- FAPI
          Author- The Private Investigator's Handbook
          Recipient of the 2007 Fapi Outstanding service award
          State approved Instructor Class CC intern course-Manatee Community College

          _WWW.ChambersAgency.com_ (http://www.chambersagency.com/)
          Chambers Investigations
          606 49th st w
          Bradenton Florida 34209
          Lic.# A-0001959
          941-798-3804



          In a message dated 4/3/2009 12:25:23 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
          suesarkis@... writes:




          Bill -

          The way I understood what he was saying and I could be very wrong is that
          the government said -

          a) if you don't let us, than, -

          b) we will do an audit!

          Although an audit is a perfectly lawful act and although the bank swears
          they could withstand an audit as their books are in order and they are not
          one
          of the banks that holds deeds, etc., the fact still remains that the bank
          feared they could not withstand the financial penalties attached to having
          to have
          their staff involved over such a long period of time.

          In other words, you don't have to threaten to break someone's bones or kill
          their family members, both unlawful acts, for it to be extortion. Under the
          section he was referring to it was specifically about when the government
          uses its color of authority to impose pressure.

          However, you are the former fed and neither his honor nor I am so therefore,
          I'll capitulate.

          By the way, if I led you to believe that I personally know Judge Napolitano,
          I do apologize as I don't. I've just read his books, reviewed his cases and
          listened to his interviews.


          Sue
          ************************<WBR>**Feeling the pinch at the grocery store? Make d
          less. (_http://food.http://food.<WBhttp://food.http://food.<WBRhttp_
          (http://food.aol.com/frugal-feasts?ncid=emlcntusfood00000001) )

          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]









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