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Re: [infoguys-list] Not a good thing - SUE

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  • suesarkis@aol.com
    In a message dated 4/2/2009 6:51:18 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, oracleintl@aol.com writes: That wasn t my comment -- that was written by a bonehead.
    Message 1 of 9 , Apr 2, 2009
      In a message dated 4/2/2009 6:51:18 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time,
      oracleintl@... writes:

      That wasn't my comment -- that was written by a bonehead.


      ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

      I have been following the works, writings, teachings, etc. of Judge
      Napolitano for about 20 years. I find his logic and thinking quite extraordinaire in
      that he has the ability to "think outside the box" while thinking "within
      the confines of the law". I believe we should have more like him. He is a
      graduate of both Princeton and Notre Dame Law School. He's been a professor at
      Seton Hall for about a dozen years or so.
      And, it is my belief that Ron Paul was going to choose him as his running
      mate had he stayed in.

      No, I strongly disagree in that he is not a bonehead. You don't have to
      agree with him, but again, NOPE, he is not a bonehead.

      I have read all three of his books and anxiously await his next one.

      1) Constitutional Chaos: What Happens When the Government Breaks its Own
      Laws whereby he criticizes the American justice system; 2) The Constitution
      in Exile: How the Federal Government Has Seized Power by Rewriting the Supreme
      Law of the Land which speaks for itself; and, 3) A Nation of Sheep. I would
      rather he had titled that one A Nation of Lemmings but, oh well, he didn't
      ask me.

      Sue

      **************Feeling the pinch at the grocery store? Make dinner for $10 or
      less. (http://food.aol.com/frugal-feasts?ncid=emlcntusfood00000001)


      [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
    • oracleintl@aol.com
      Nonsense. If it was Judge Napolitano actually wrote that the distinction between extortion and blackmail is that extortion is a threat to do something that
      Message 2 of 9 , Apr 3, 2009
        Nonsense.

        If it was Judge Napolitano actually wrote that the distinction between
        extortion and blackmail is that extortion is a threat to do something that would
        otherwise be a lawful act, that was a completely ridiculous thing to say, and
        I defy you to find one single source anywhere that says anything like that.

        Defend whomever you happen to like, but stoopid commentaries are stoopid
        commentaries, and wrong is wrong, no matter who writes it.

        Invite him to join us and debate the point if you like. I seem to remember
        a female wannabe investigator who did that once, and as I recall that clown
        called himself a "Judge" too -- as I recall, it didn't work out so well for
        him.

        Bill E. Branscum, Investigator
        Irascible Curmudgeon,
        Contumelious Cynic,
        Inveterate Skeptic &
        Incorrigible Purveyor of Pointed Prose

        Oracle International
        Naples, FL 34101
        (239) 304-1639 V
        (239) 304-1640 F
        (239) 641-6782 C
        _www.FraudsAndScams.com_ (http://www.FraudsAndScams.com)



        In a message dated 4/3/2009 12:01:20 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
        suesarkis@... writes:





        In a message dated 4/2/2009 6:51:18 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time,
        _oracleintl@..._ (mailto:oracleintl@...) writes:

        That wasn't my comment -- that was written by a bonehead.

        ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

        I have been following the works, writings, teachings, etc. of Judge
        Napolitano for about 20 years. I find his logic and thinking quite
        extraordinaire in
        that he has the ability to "think outside the box" while thinking "within
        the confines of the law". I believe we should have more like him. He is a
        graduate of both Princeton and Notre Dame Law School. He's been a professor
        at
        Seton Hall for about a dozen years or so.
        And, it is my belief that Ron Paul was going to choose him as his running
        mate had he stayed in.

        No, I strongly disagree in that he is not a bonehead. You don't have to
        agree with him, but again, NOPE, he is not a bonehead.

        I have read all three of his books and anxiously await his next one.

        1) Constitutional Chaos: What Happens When the Government Breaks its Own
        Laws whereby he criticizes the American justice system; 2) The Constitution
        in Exile: How the Federal Government Has Seized Power by Rewriting the
        Supreme
        Law of the Land which speaks for itself; and, 3) A Nation of Sheep. I would
        rather he had titled that one A Nation of Lemmings but, oh well, he didn't
        ask me.

        Sue

        ************************<WBR>**Feeling the pinch at the grocery store? Make d
        less. (_http://food.http://food.<WBhttp://food.http://food.<WBRhttp_
        (http://food.aol.com/frugal-feasts?ncid=emlcntusfood00000001) )

        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





        **************Feeling the pinch at the grocery store? Make dinner for $10 or
        less. (http://food.aol.com/frugal-feasts?ncid=emlcntusfood00000001)


        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • greenwood152@aol.com
        Bill... I totally agree that was a ridiculous statement. I ve never read anything like that by Napolitano. That aside, the issue remains serious.? 1st Choice
        Message 3 of 9 , Apr 3, 2009
          Bill...

          I totally agree that was a ridiculous statement. I've never read anything like that by Napolitano. That aside, the issue remains serious.?


          1st Choice Investigations, Inc.
          Jeff Greenwood
          P.O. Box 895328
          Leesburg, FL 32895
          954-802-0626
          greenwood152@...
          FL Agency # A-2600445
          "Discrete, Thorough, and Cost Effective"


          -----Original Message-----
          From: oracleintl@...
          To: infoguys-list@yahoogroups.com
          Sent: Fri, 3 Apr 2009 8:18 am
          Subject: Re: [infoguys-list] Not a good thing - SUE






          Nonsense.

          If it was Judge Napolitano actually wrote that the distinction between
          extortion and blackmail is that extortion is a threat to do something that would
          otherwise be a lawful act, that was a completely ridiculous thing to say, and
          I defy you to find one single source anywhere that says anything like that.

          Defend whomever you happen to like, but stoopid commentaries are stoopid
          commentaries, and wrong is wrong, no matter who writes it.

          Invite him to join us and debate the point if you like. I seem to remember
          a female wannabe investigator who did that once, and as I recall that clown
          called himself a "Judge" too -- as I recall, it didn't work out so well for
          him.

          Bill E. Branscum, Investigator
          Irascible Curmudgeon,
          Contumelious Cynic,
          Inveterate Skeptic &
          Incorrigible Purveyor of Pointed Prose

          Oracle International
          Naples, FL 34101
          (239) 304-1639 V
          (239) 304-1640 F
          (239) 641-6782 C
          _www.FraudsAndScams.com_ (http://www.FraudsAndScams.com)

          In a message dated 4/3/2009 12:01:20 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
          suesarkis@... writes:

          In a message dated 4/2/2009 6:51:18 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time,
          _oracleintl@..._ (mailto:oracleintl@...) writes:

          That wasn't my comment -- that was written by a bonehead.

          ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

          I have been following the works, writings, teachings, etc. of Judge
          Napolitano for about 20 years. I find his logic and thinking quite
          extraordinaire in
          that he has the ability to "think outside the box" while thinking "within
          the confines of the law". I believe we should have more like him. He is a
          graduate of both Princeton and Notre Dame Law School. He's been a professor
          at
          Seton Hall for about a dozen years or so.
          And, it is my belief that Ron Paul was going to choose him as his running
          mate had he stayed in.

          No, I strongly disagree in that he is not a bonehead. You don't have to
          agree with him, but again, NOPE, he is not a bonehead.

          I have read all three of his books and anxiously await his next one.

          1) Constitutional Chaos: What Happens When the Government Breaks its Own
          Laws whereby he criticizes the American justice system; 2) The Constitution
          in Exile: How the Federal Government Has Seized Power by Rewriting the
          Supreme
          Law of the Land which speaks for itself; and, 3) A Nation of Sheep. I would
          rather he had titled that one A Nation of Lemmings but, oh well, he didn't
          ask me.

          Sue

          ************************<WBR>**Feeling the pinch at the grocery store? Make d
          less. (_http://food.http://food.<WBhttp://food.http://food.<WBRhttp_
          (http://food.aol.com/frugal-feasts?ncid=emlcntusfood00000001) )

          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

          **************Feeling the pinch at the grocery store? Make dinner for $10 or
          less. (http://food.aol.com/frugal-feasts?ncid=emlcntusfood00000001)

          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]








          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • suesarkis@aol.com
          In a message dated 4/3/2009 5:19:40 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time, oracleintl@aol.com writes: actually wrote that the distinction between extortion and blackmail
          Message 4 of 9 , Apr 3, 2009
            In a message dated 4/3/2009 5:19:40 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time,
            oracleintl@... writes:

            actually wrote that the distinction between extortion and blackmail is that
            extortion is a threat to do something that would otherwise be a lawful act,
            that was a completely ridiculous thing to say, and I defy you to find one
            single source anywhere that says anything like that.



            Bill -

            I do see a difference between 18 USC §§ 872 and 873 and I truly can see
            where he was coming from. Who knows, maybe my mind is just a stupid as his
            honor. One could only hope !!!

            Doesn't this support what he said regarding the matter that he was
            discussing?

            18 USC §872
            §872. Extortion by officers or employees of the United States
            Whoever, being an officer, or employee of the United States or any
            department or agency thereof, or representing himself to be or assuming to act as
            such, under color or pretense of office or employment commits or attempts an act
            of extortion, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than
            three years, or both; but if the amount so extorted or demanded does not exceed
            $1,000, he shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than one
            year, or both.

            18 USC §873
            §873. Blackmail
            Whoever, under a threat of informing, or as a consideration for not
            informing, against any violation of any law of the United States, demands or receives
            any money or other valuable thing, shall be fined under this title or
            imprisoned not more than one year, or both.




            Sincerely yours,
            Sue
            ________________________
            Sue Sarkis
            Sarkis Detective Agency

            (est. 1976)
            PI 6564
            _www.sarkispi.com_ (http://www.sarkispi.com/)

            1346 Ethel Street
            Glendale, CA 91207-1826
            818-242-2505
            818-246-3001 FAX

            "one Nation under God" and "in GOD we TRUST"

            If you can read this, thank a teacher. If you can read it in English, thank
            a military veteran
            **************Feeling the pinch at the grocery store? Make dinner for $10 or
            less. (http://food.aol.com/frugal-feasts?ncid=emlcntusfood00000001)


            [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
          • Lists
            I must confess I have not read the entire thread, so if this has been covered, please don t flame me into oblivion: The major difference being the color of
            Message 5 of 9 , Apr 3, 2009
              I must confess I have not read the entire thread, so if this has been
              covered, please don't flame me into oblivion:

              The major difference being the color of office.
              The judge's argument is that the officials of the government, used the power
              of their office, to obtain actions beneficial to the government. The
              problem with the statute is that it assumes that the official doing the
              "extorting" is requesting money for themselves. In the bank case, the
              officials were attempting to force money into the bank, now in exchange they
              got special issued preferred stock, only available to the U.S. Government,
              which gave the Govt a stake in the banks.
              (sounds like the mob to me).
              I don't think it will ever go anywhere because I don't think we've got a law
              on the books that covers being reverse robbed. :)
              "Stick em up and take all our money"

              :)
              Brian


              _____

              From: infoguys-list@yahoogroups.com [mailto:infoguys-list@yahoogroups.com]
              On Behalf Of suesarkis@...
              Sent: Friday, April 03, 2009 9:55 AM
              To: infoguys-list@yahoogroups.com
              Subject: Re: [infoguys-list] Not a good thing - SUE




              In a message dated 4/3/2009 5:19:40 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time,
              oracleintl@aol. <mailto:oracleintl%40aol.com> com writes:

              actually wrote that the distinction between extortion and blackmail is that
              extortion is a threat to do something that would otherwise be a lawful act,
              that was a completely ridiculous thing to say, and I defy you to find one
              single source anywhere that says anything like that.

              Bill -

              I do see a difference between 18 USC §§ 872 and 873 and I truly can see
              where he was coming from. Who knows, maybe my mind is just a stupid as his
              honor. One could only hope !!!

              Doesn't this support what he said regarding the matter that he was
              discussing?

              18 USC §872
              §872. Extortion by officers or employees of the United States
              Whoever, being an officer, or employee of the United States or any
              department or agency thereof, or representing himself to be or assuming to
              act as
              such, under color or pretense of office or employment commits or attempts an
              act
              of extortion, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than
              three years, or both; but if the amount so extorted or demanded does not
              exceed
              $1,000, he shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than one
              year, or both.

              18 USC §873
              §873. Blackmail
              Whoever, under a threat of informing, or as a consideration for not
              informing, against any violation of any law of the United States, demands or
              receives
              any money or other valuable thing, shall be fined under this title or
              imprisoned not more than one year, or both.

              Sincerely yours,
              Sue
              ________________________
              Sue Sarkis
              Sarkis Detective Agency

              (est. 1976)
              PI 6564
              _www.sarkispi.com_ (http://www.sarkispi <http://www.sarkispi.com/> .com/)

              1346 Ethel Street
              Glendale, CA 91207-1826
              818-242-2505
              818-246-3001 FAX

              "one Nation under God" and "in GOD we TRUST"

              If you can read this, thank a teacher. If you can read it in English, thank
              a military veteran
              **************Feeling the pinch at the grocery store? Make dinner for $10 or

              less. (http://food.
              <http://food.aol.com/frugal-feasts?ncid=emlcntusfood00000001>
              aol.com/frugal-feasts?ncid=emlcntusfood00000001)

              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]






              [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
            • oracleintl@aol.com
              Hi Sue, I am not sure the federal statutes would be the best place to look if you hope to find support for that argument since their is no federal extortion
              Message 6 of 9 , Apr 3, 2009
                Hi Sue,
                I am not sure the federal statutes would be the best place to look if you
                hope to find support for that argument since their is no federal extortion
                statute per se, but if you see anything in these code sections that supports the
                contention that the difference between Extortion & Blackmail is that
                Extortion relates to a threat to do something that is otherwise lawful, you are doing
                better than I am.

                § 872. Extortion by officers or employees of the United States

                Whoever, being an officer, or employee of the United States or any
                department or agency thereof, or representing himself to be or assuming to act as
                such, under color or pretense of office or employment commits or attempts an act
                of extortion, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than
                three years, or both; but if the amount so extorted or demanded does not exceed
                $1,000, he shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than one
                year, or both.



                § 873. Blackmail


                Whoever, under a threat of informing, or as a consideration for not
                informing, against any violation of any law of the United States, demands or receives
                any money or other valuable thing, shall be fined under this title or
                imprisoned not more than one year, or both.





                For those who may find the fact that there is no federal extortion statute
                confusing, the same applies to murder -- and for the same reason. Extortion
                is a state crime, as is murder, as well as most other crimes. It becomes a
                matter of federal jurisdiction when there is a federal connection such as is
                the case in Section 872 -- the extortion is by Officers of the United States,
                related to their office.

                There are numerous and various federal offenses connected to extortion, but
                in each case (the target is the President 871, the target is a foreign
                official 878, the demand is delivered by US mail 876, etc) there is some federal
                issue involved.

                If someone walks up to you in California and verbally communicates an
                extortionate threat, it is entirely possible that there is no federal offense
                involved - unless you pay them. While payment is not actually necessary to make
                the offense of extortion complete, there is a separate federal law against
                receiving the proceeds of extortion because that implicates commerce.

                I must, however, retract my prior statement to the effect that the author of
                that ridiculous assertion is a boob. I like boobs, and I have an undying
                fondness for many of the boobs with which it has been my privilege to become
                familiar, so I shall stick with "bonehead" instead.

                Bill







                In a message dated 4/3/2009 10:58:18 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
                suesarkis@... writes:




                In a message dated 4/3/2009 5:19:40 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time,
                _oracleintl@..._ (mailto:oracleintl@...) writes:

                actually wrote that the distinction between extortion and blackmail is that
                extortion is a threat to do something that would otherwise be a lawful act,
                that was a completely ridiculous thing to say, and I defy you to find one
                single source anywhere that says anything like that.

                Bill -

                I do see a difference between 18 USC §§ 872 and 873 and I truly can see
                where he was coming from. Who knows, maybe my mind is just a stupid as his
                honor. One could only hope !!!

                Doesn't this support what he said regarding the matter that he was
                discussing?

                18 USC §872
                §872. Extortion by officers or employees of the United States
                Whoever, being an officer, or employee of the United States or any
                department or agency thereof, or representing himself to be or assuming to
                act as
                such, under color or pretense of office or employment commits or attempts an
                act
                of extortion, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than
                three years, or both; but if the amount so extorted or demanded does not
                exceed
                $1,000, he shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than one
                year, or both.

                18 USC §873
                §873. Blackmail
                Whoever, under a threat of informing, or as a consideration for not
                informing, against any violation of any law of the United States, demands or
                receives
                any money or other valuable thing, shall be fined under this title or
                imprisoned not more than one year, or both.

                Sincerely yours,
                Sue
                ________________________
                Sue Sarkis
                Sarkis Detective Agency

                (est. 1976)
                PI 6564
                _www.sarkispi._www.s_http://www.sarkispihttp:_ (http://www.sarkispi.com/) )

                1346 Ethel Street
                Glendale, CA 91207-1826
                818-242-2505
                818-246-3001 FAX

                "one Nation under God" and "in GOD we TRUST"

                If you can read this, thank a teacher. If you can read it in English, thank
                a military veteran
                ************************<WBR>**Feeling the pinch at the grocery store? Make
                dinne
                less. (_http://food.http://food.<WBhttp://food.http://food.<WBRhttp_
                (http://food.aol.com/frugal-feasts?ncid=emlcntusfood00000001) )

                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





                **************Feeling the pinch at the grocery store? Make dinner for $10 or
                less. (http://food.aol.com/frugal-feasts?ncid=emlcntusfood00000001)


                [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
              • suesarkis@aol.com
                Bill - The way I understood what he was saying and I could be very wrong is that the government said - a) if you don t let us, than, - b) we will do an
                Message 7 of 9 , Apr 3, 2009
                  Bill -

                  The way I understood what he was saying and I could be very wrong is that
                  the government said -

                  a) if you don't let us, than, -

                  b) we will do an audit!

                  Although an audit is a perfectly lawful act and although the bank swears
                  they could withstand an audit as their books are in order and they are not one
                  of the banks that holds deeds, etc., the fact still remains that the bank
                  feared they could not withstand the financial penalties attached to having to have
                  their staff involved over such a long period of time.

                  In other words, you don't have to threaten to break someone's bones or kill
                  their family members, both unlawful acts, for it to be extortion. Under the
                  section he was referring to it was specifically about when the government
                  uses its color of authority to impose pressure.

                  However, you are the former fed and neither his honor nor I am so therefore,
                  I'll capitulate.

                  By the way, if I led you to believe that I personally know Judge Napolitano,
                  I do apologize as I don't. I've just read his books, reviewed his cases and
                  listened to his interviews.


                  Sue
                  **************Feeling the pinch at the grocery store? Make dinner for $10 or
                  less. (http://food.aol.com/frugal-feasts?ncid=emlcntusfood00000001)


                  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
                • Slipinn@aol.com
                  They had a saying for this back in my Police days. You might beat the rap, but you never beat the ride Chuck Chambers Co-President, Florida Association of
                  Message 8 of 9 , Apr 3, 2009
                    They had a saying for this back in my Police days.

                    "You might beat the rap, but you never beat the ride"


                    Chuck Chambers
                    Co-President, Florida Association of Private Investigators (FAPI)
                    Charter member- FAPI
                    Author- The Private Investigator's Handbook
                    Recipient of the 2007 Fapi Outstanding service award
                    State approved Instructor Class CC intern course-Manatee Community College

                    _WWW.ChambersAgency.com_ (http://www.chambersagency.com/)
                    Chambers Investigations
                    606 49th st w
                    Bradenton Florida 34209
                    Lic.# A-0001959
                    941-798-3804



                    In a message dated 4/3/2009 12:25:23 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
                    suesarkis@... writes:




                    Bill -

                    The way I understood what he was saying and I could be very wrong is that
                    the government said -

                    a) if you don't let us, than, -

                    b) we will do an audit!

                    Although an audit is a perfectly lawful act and although the bank swears
                    they could withstand an audit as their books are in order and they are not
                    one
                    of the banks that holds deeds, etc., the fact still remains that the bank
                    feared they could not withstand the financial penalties attached to having
                    to have
                    their staff involved over such a long period of time.

                    In other words, you don't have to threaten to break someone's bones or kill
                    their family members, both unlawful acts, for it to be extortion. Under the
                    section he was referring to it was specifically about when the government
                    uses its color of authority to impose pressure.

                    However, you are the former fed and neither his honor nor I am so therefore,
                    I'll capitulate.

                    By the way, if I led you to believe that I personally know Judge Napolitano,
                    I do apologize as I don't. I've just read his books, reviewed his cases and
                    listened to his interviews.


                    Sue
                    ************************<WBR>**Feeling the pinch at the grocery store? Make d
                    less. (_http://food.http://food.<WBhttp://food.http://food.<WBRhttp_
                    (http://food.aol.com/frugal-feasts?ncid=emlcntusfood00000001) )

                    [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]









                    **************Eat Great & Lose Weight FASTER! Start the South Beach Diet
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