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Re: Improve AC performance

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  • tiug_common
    Mr.Shak Uddin, I am sorry if I have caused you any hurt. Please forgive me. I am also very sorry if my little education and poor english is making you feel
    Message 1 of 19 , Aug 1, 2011
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      Mr.Shak Uddin,
      I am sorry if I have caused you any hurt. Please forgive me.

      I am also very sorry if my little education and poor english is making you feel angry. I passed class 12 in 1st div. with science but could not go to college because being only daughter had to take up teaching job in academy to support my mother due to passing of my father in accident. By God's grace after 12 years of hard work and degree by distance-learning we now have own 2 room house and 3rd hand indica.I do much self study because I want to learn everything about engines.

      > I think you don't know elementary physics ie is Boyle's law which states that in a fixed container the pressure is directly proportional to the temperature.

      With respect,I think you are confusing Gay-Lussac's Law with Boyle's Law.
      Gay-Lussac's Law:
      Temperature of a gas is proportional to its pressure.
      Boyle's Law:
      Volume of a gas is inversely proportional to its pressure.
      Charles's Law:
      Volume of a gas is proportional to its temperature.

      But in car a/c when compressor is working, r134a gas is at very high pressure between output of compressor & expansion valve which is just before evaporator. This pressure must be much higher than atmosphere pressure, which is 1.01 Bar at sea level.
      So temperature of r134a gas at so high pressure must also be much higher than ambient temperature?(Guy-Lussac's law).
      You said pressure will depend on ambient temperature. That is what I do not understand because already gas temp is so high.

      Why I asked my original question is how to know when correct amount of gas is filled in the system? I think to measure pressure might be best way.

      Sadly nobody is knowing the gas pressure when a/c is working normally or is cooling less.

      From properties of r134a gas, I learnt that Critical Temp is 100.9 degrees celcius, critical pressure is 40.6 bar. I understand that at critical temp and pressure gas can be in both liquid and gaseous states. So is highest pressure in a/c system close to 40 bar?

      Meanwhile, I found easy way to check condenser fan and main fan in Indica without disturbing any wires.

      regards,
      Kiran



      > I think you don't know elementary physics ie is Boyle's law which states that in a fixed container the pressure is directly proportional to the temperature.
      > Please
      > if you don't know about what you are talking don't criticize someone who is trying to help someone .
    • Dev Abhishek
      Achin Sir, ragging session for new members? :-) dev ________________________________ From: tiug_common To:
      Message 2 of 19 , Aug 1, 2011
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        Achin Sir, ragging session for new members? :-)
        dev



        ________________________________
        From: tiug_common <tiug_common@...>
        To: indica-users@yahoogroups.com
        Sent: Monday, 1 August 2011, 12:40
        Subject: [indica-users] Re: Improve AC performance


         
        Mr.Shak Uddin,
        I am sorry if I have caused you any hurt. Please forgive me.

        I am also very sorry if my little education and poor english is making you feel angry. I passed class 12 in 1st div. with science but could not go to college because being only daughter had to take up teaching job in academy to support my mother due to passing of my father in accident. By God's grace after 12 years of hard work and degree by distance-learning we now have own 2 room house and 3rd hand indica.I do much self study because I want to learn everything about engines.

        > I think you don't know elementary physics ie is Boyle's law which states that in a fixed container the pressure is directly proportional to the temperature.

        With respect,I think you are confusing Gay-Lussac's Law with Boyle's Law.
        Gay-Lussac's Law:
        Temperature of a gas is proportional to its pressure.
        Boyle's Law:
        Volume of a gas is inversely proportional to its pressure.
        Charles's Law:
        Volume of a gas is proportional to its temperature.

        But in car a/c when compressor is working, r134a gas is at very high pressure between output of compressor & expansion valve which is just before evaporator. This pressure must be much higher than atmosphere pressure, which is 1.01 Bar at sea level.
        So temperature of r134a gas at so high pressure must also be much higher than ambient temperature?(Guy-Lussac's law).
        You said pressure will depend on ambient temperature. That is what I do not understand because already gas temp is so high.

        Why I asked my original question is how to know when correct amount of gas is filled in the system? I think to measure pressure might be best way.

        Sadly nobody is knowing the gas pressure when a/c is working normally or is cooling less.

        From properties of r134a gas, I learnt that Critical Temp is 100.9 degrees celcius, critical pressure is 40.6 bar. I understand that at critical temp and pressure gas can be in both liquid and gaseous states. So is highest pressure in a/c system close to 40 bar?

        Meanwhile, I found easy way to check condenser fan and main fan in Indica without disturbing any wires.

        regards,
        Kiran

        > I think you don't know elementary physics ie is Boyle's law which states that in a fixed container the pressure is directly proportional to the temperature.
        > Please
        > if you don't know about what you are talking don't criticize someone who is trying to help someone .




        [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
      • hemkant sharma
        pls share the the method to check condenser fan and main fan in Indica without disturbing any wires. ... From: tiug_common Subject:
        Message 3 of 19 , Aug 1, 2011
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          pls share the the method to check condenser fan and main fan in Indica without disturbing any wires.



          --- On Mon, 8/1/11, tiug_common <tiug_common@...> wrote:


          From: tiug_common <tiug_common@...>
          Subject: [indica-users] Re: Improve AC performance
          To: indica-users@yahoogroups.com
          Date: Monday, August 1, 2011, 12:40 PM


           



          Mr.Shak Uddin,
          I am sorry if I have caused you any hurt. Please forgive me.

          I am also very sorry if my little education and poor english is making you feel angry. I passed class 12 in 1st div. with science but could not go to college because being only daughter had to take up teaching job in academy to support my mother due to passing of my father in accident. By God's grace after 12 years of hard work and degree by distance-learning we now have own 2 room house and 3rd hand indica.I do much self study because I want to learn everything about engines.

          > I think you don't know elementary physics ie is Boyle's law which states that in a fixed container the pressure is directly proportional to the temperature.

          With respect,I think you are confusing Gay-Lussac's Law with Boyle's Law.
          Gay-Lussac's Law:
          Temperature of a gas is proportional to its pressure.
          Boyle's Law:
          Volume of a gas is inversely proportional to its pressure.
          Charles's Law:
          Volume of a gas is proportional to its temperature.

          But in car a/c when compressor is working, r134a gas is at very high pressure between output of compressor & expansion valve which is just before evaporator. This pressure must be much higher than atmosphere pressure, which is 1.01 Bar at sea level.
          So temperature of r134a gas at so high pressure must also be much higher than ambient temperature?(Guy-Lussac's law).
          You said pressure will depend on ambient temperature. That is what I do not understand because already gas temp is so high.

          Why I asked my original question is how to know when correct amount of gas is filled in the system? I think to measure pressure might be best way.

          Sadly nobody is knowing the gas pressure when a/c is working normally or is cooling less.

          From properties of r134a gas, I learnt that Critical Temp is 100.9 degrees celcius, critical pressure is 40.6 bar. I understand that at critical temp and pressure gas can be in both liquid and gaseous states. So is highest pressure in a/c system close to 40 bar?

          Meanwhile, I found easy way to check condenser fan and main fan in Indica without disturbing any wires.

          regards,
          Kiran

          > I think you don't know elementary physics ie is Boyle's law which states that in a fixed container the pressure is directly proportional to the temperature.
          > Please
          > if you don't know about what you are talking don't criticize someone who is trying to help someone .








          [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
        • shak.uk11
          Please forget it, and try to keep this group user friendly. Sorry ,I dint want to hurt someones feelings , Hope you don t mid it. Let me clear your doubt about
          Message 4 of 19 , Aug 1, 2011
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            Please forget it, and try to keep this group user friendly.
            Sorry ,I dint want to hurt someones feelings , Hope you don't mid it.



            Let me clear your doubt about the pressure-temperature relation in ac.

            At different ambient temperatures the gas is cooled differently by the condenser hence at higher temperatures condenser will be cooled less hence pressure will be more.

            Also , not only temperature but also humidity plays a role in different ac pressure reading.(Will explain later,currently running out of time)



            Hence As a rule of a thumb - ac pressure readings are not 100% accurate so today's modern cars using R 134a are filled by weighing them !!!!
            Indica/Indigo with behr Ac system max is 640gms.







            Also for temp- pressure chart for car ac please refer
            may vary

            http://www.csgnetwork.com/r134apresstempconv.html



            For any More Clarification Just reply!!!!!!!!!!!!!!










            --- In indica-users@yahoogroups.com, "tiug_common" <tiug_common@...> wrote:
            >
            > Mr.Shak Uddin,
            > I am sorry if I have caused you any hurt. Please forgive me.
            >
            > I am also very sorry if my little education and poor english is making you feel angry. I passed class 12 in 1st div. with science but could not go to college because being only daughter had to take up teaching job in academy to support my mother due to passing of my father in accident. By God's grace after 12 years of hard work and degree by distance-learning we now have own 2 room house and 3rd hand indica.I do much self study because I want to learn everything about engines.
            >
            > > I think you don't know elementary physics ie is Boyle's law which states that in a fixed container the pressure is directly proportional to the temperature.
            >
            > With respect,I think you are confusing Gay-Lussac's Law with Boyle's Law.
            > Gay-Lussac's Law:
            > Temperature of a gas is proportional to its pressure.
            > Boyle's Law:
            > Volume of a gas is inversely proportional to its pressure.
            > Charles's Law:
            > Volume of a gas is proportional to its temperature.
            >
            > But in car a/c when compressor is working, r134a gas is at very high pressure between output of compressor & expansion valve which is just before evaporator. This pressure must be much higher than atmosphere pressure, which is 1.01 Bar at sea level.
            > So temperature of r134a gas at so high pressure must also be much higher than ambient temperature?(Guy-Lussac's law).
            > You said pressure will depend on ambient temperature. That is what I do not understand because already gas temp is so high.
            >
            > Why I asked my original question is how to know when correct amount of gas is filled in the system? I think to measure pressure might be best way.
            >
            > Sadly nobody is knowing the gas pressure when a/c is working normally or is cooling less.
            >
            > From properties of r134a gas, I learnt that Critical Temp is 100.9 degrees celcius, critical pressure is 40.6 bar. I understand that at critical temp and pressure gas can be in both liquid and gaseous states. So is highest pressure in a/c system close to 40 bar?
            >
            > Meanwhile, I found easy way to check condenser fan and main fan in Indica without disturbing any wires.
            >
            > regards,
            > Kiran
            >
            >
            >
            > > I think you don't know elementary physics ie is Boyle's law which states that in a fixed container the pressure is directly proportional to the temperature.
            > > Please
            > > if you don't know about what you are talking don't criticize someone who is trying to help someone .
            >
          • vjn_bks2004
            --Remove the sensor wire black colored which is between battery and engine valve cover. then both the fans should run at max speed.(you can tell from loud
            Message 5 of 19 , Sep 20, 2011
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              """--Remove the sensor wire black colored which is between battery and engine valve
              cover.
              then both the fans should run at max speed.(you can tell from loud noise)."""

              Qtn: Where is the sensor wire black colored located??? I couldnt find.. Is it Engine temperature sensor???

              --- In indica-users@yahoogroups.com, "Shak Uddin" <shak.uk11@...> wrote:
              >
              >
              >
              >
              > > What should be pressure of a/c gas. When engine is stopped and when a/c is running? What is normal level and abnormal levels? Where to get the pressure gauge? There are 2 valves on the a/c pipes. On which to measure?
              > --Use a ac pressure gauge which has two gauges,one for high side and one for low side.
              > There is a chart for measuring the gas pressure .
              > the pressure is not fixed because the pressure is depended on the ambient air temperature so its better to refer the chart.
              >
              > > How to check functioning of condenser fan? What is normal fan rpm? I heard it works only with main fan? How to check fan motor if there is doubt?
              > --Remove the sensor wire black colored which is between battery and engine valve cover.
              > then both the fans should run at max speed.(you can tell from loud noise).
              >
              > > How to check if a/c gas is pure? How to know if place is trusted or not. What is damage if gas is not pure?
              >
              > -99% of time you can say if its pure by checking the gas cylinder.
              > the cylinders with don't have paint,bends,damaged etc are the cheapest one and contain compressed air.
              > Compressed air contains moisture which is harmful for compressor,ac lines ,expansion valve may freeze up ,etc.
              >
              > Trusted places where i take my car for ac repairs is TASC (not all) and in Hyderabad i know Fansa Motors who do wonderful job in ac repairs.
              > Although i suggest going to tasc for repairs,but experience is what will tell u Tasc is good or bad.
              >
              > Always ask your friends and relative where the get their cars serviced
              >
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