## Re: diesel or petrol car

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• Hi, Here s me doing my stuck record performance! What about the extra Rs. 18000 that you pay up front for the diesel? Taking this into account along with all
Message 1 of 30 , Nov 1, 2004
Hi,

Here's me doing my 'stuck record' performance!

What about the extra Rs. 18000 that you pay up front for the diesel?
Taking this into account along with all your other assumptions, you
will break even in 18 months. Even earlier if you happen to drive
more.

I'm not trying to add to your confusion - just supplying more data :-
)

Cheers,
Hrishi
LSi, March 2003, 26143 km, 11 kmpl, Chennai TN 07 AA 1669

--- In indica-users@yahoogroups.com, "Jaswinder Singh"
<Jaswinder.Singh@i...> wrote:
> Let us assume the following:-
> 1) Car running of about 800 Kms a month.
> 2) Mileage given by a Petrol car = 12 Km / litre and Average
mileage given by a Diesel car = 16 Km / litre.
> 3) By next year (2005 end) Petrol will cost about Rs. 45 per litre
while Diesel will cost about Rs. 40 per litre. (Diesel price will
increase MORE than Petrol price).
>
> Amount of fuel required for a Petrol car will be 800/12 = approx.
67 litres.
> Therefore cost of fuel per month for a Petrol car will be 67 * 45
= 3000 Rs. (approx.)
>
> Similarly, Amount of fuel required for a Diesel car will be 800/16
= 50 litres.
> Therefore cost of fuel per month for a Diesel car will be 50 * 40
= 2000 Rs. (approx.)
>
> This shows that even by using a car for as less as 800 Kms a
month, a Diesel car can save us Rs. 1000/- a month i.e. Rs. 12000/-
a year.
>
> In the above calculations, I have assumed a very nominal mileage
of 16 Kms per litre for a diesel car and also assumed Diesel cost to
be Rs. 45 per litre (i.e. just a difference of just Rs. 5/- wrt
Petrol cost). If the car gives a mileage of more than 16 Km/litre OR
the difference in petrol and diesel cost is more than Rs. 5/litre,
then the savings will be more than the calculated amount of Rs.
1000/- a month.
>
> Now, I really do not think that Maintenance cost of Indica DLS
will be more than 12000/- Rs. per annum wrt a Petrol car. Hence DLS
seems to be a good buy even at lower expected running.
>
> Please let me know if there is any mistake in these calculations /
my assumptions. For me, it is End of all Arguments.
>
> Regards
> Jaswinder Singh
• No Hrishi, Indica Petrol is out of question because of it s lowest mileage and not-so-good performance and reliability vis-a-vis Santro. The choice boils down
Message 2 of 30 , Nov 1, 2004
No Hrishi,
Indica Petrol is out of question because of it's lowest mileage and not-so-good performance and reliability vis-a-vis Santro.

The choice boils down the following models having AC and Power Steering:-
1) Indica DLS (Pune On-Road Price: Rs. 3,84,000/-). Minus Discount: Rs. 7000/-
2) Santro Zing XP (Pune On-Road Price: Rs. 3,85,000/-). Minus Discount Rs. 16000/-

Hence the only additional upfront cost which we need to give for a Diesel car is Rs. 9000/- (minus additional finance costs).

I have negotiated with dealers and finance guys of both Tata and Hyundai and got these rates. (Confirmed with at least 2 dealers each of TATA and HYUNDAI).
For financing 3 lakh rupees for 3 years, EMI for Indica is Rs. 8880/- and EMI for Santro it's slightly higher Rs. 9030/-. Considering the horizon of 3 years (loan tenure), the net INTEREST to be shelled out for an Indica is Rs. 19680/- and for Santro, it's Rs. 25080/-.

Hence the effective *upfront* costs for comparable Diesel car is Rs. 4000/- (Next-to-nothing for a car costing about 4 Lakhs). This is what went in my mind when I said that Diesel car will suffix even when running is as low as 800 Kms a month (or even lesser).

Regards
Jaswinder Singh

-----Original Message-----
From: Hrishikesh Raghavan [mailto:raghavan_h@...]
Sent: Monday, November 01, 2004 2:33 PM
To: indica-users@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [indica-users] Re: diesel or petrol car

Hi,

Here's me doing my 'stuck record' performance!

What about the extra Rs. 18000 that you pay up front for the diesel?
Taking this into account along with all your other assumptions, you
will break even in 18 months. Even earlier if you happen to drive
more.

I'm not trying to add to your confusion - just supplying more data :-
)

Cheers,
Hrishi
LSi, March 2003, 26143 km, 11 kmpl, Chennai TN 07 AA 1669

--- In indica-users@yahoogroups.com, "Jaswinder Singh"
<Jaswinder.Singh@i...> wrote:
> Let us assume the following:-
> 1) Car running of about 800 Kms a month.
> 2) Mileage given by a Petrol car = 12 Km / litre and Average
mileage given by a Diesel car = 16 Km / litre.
> 3) By next year (2005 end) Petrol will cost about Rs. 45 per litre
while Diesel will cost about Rs. 40 per litre. (Diesel price will
increase MORE than Petrol price).
>
> Amount of fuel required for a Petrol car will be 800/12 = approx.
67 litres.
> Therefore cost of fuel per month for a Petrol car will be 67 * 45
= 3000 Rs. (approx.)
>
> Similarly, Amount of fuel required for a Diesel car will be 800/16
= 50 litres.
> Therefore cost of fuel per month for a Diesel car will be 50 * 40
= 2000 Rs. (approx.)
>
> This shows that even by using a car for as less as 800 Kms a
month, a Diesel car can save us Rs. 1000/- a month i.e. Rs. 12000/-
a year.
>
> In the above calculations, I have assumed a very nominal mileage
of 16 Kms per litre for a diesel car and also assumed Diesel cost to
be Rs. 45 per litre (i.e. just a difference of just Rs. 5/- wrt
Petrol cost). If the car gives a mileage of more than 16 Km/litre OR
the difference in petrol and diesel cost is more than Rs. 5/litre,
then the savings will be more than the calculated amount of Rs.
1000/- a month.
>
> Now, I really do not think that Maintenance cost of Indica DLS
will be more than 12000/- Rs. per annum wrt a Petrol car. Hence DLS
seems to be a good buy even at lower expected running.
>
> Please let me know if there is any mistake in these calculations /
my assumptions. For me, it is End of all Arguments.
>
> Regards
> Jaswinder Singh

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
• Hi Jaswinder, Just in case you misunderstood - I was never trying to market the Indica Petrol. I merely recommended it initially since you were in favour of
Message 3 of 30 , Nov 1, 2004
Hi Jaswinder,

Just in case you misunderstood - I was never trying to market the
Indica Petrol. I merely 'recommended' it initially since you were in
favour of the Indica.

Of course, going by pure financials, the DLS makes the most sense to

Cheers,
Hrishi
LSi, March 2003, 26143 km, 11 kmpl, Chennai TN 07 AA 1669

--- In indica-users@yahoogroups.com, "Jaswinder Singh"
<Jaswinder.Singh@i...> wrote:
> No Hrishi,
> Indica Petrol is out of question because of it's lowest mileage
and not-so-good performance and reliability vis-a-vis Santro.
>
• Details: Pune - Pali Ashtavinayak - Alibaag - Nagaaon Beach - Panvel - Pune. Distance Covered : 380 Km, Fuel Consumed: 20 litres Route: Mix of Expressway ,
Message 4 of 30 , Nov 1, 2004
Details:

Pune - Pali Ashtavinayak - Alibaag - Nagaaon Beach - Panvel - Pune.

Distance Covered : 380 Km,

Fuel Consumed: 20 litres

Route: Mix of Expressway , Good State Highway, Horrible Interior Konkan roads (at times 2nd gear crawl for 3 kms). bit of a ghaat ... but nothing unachievable in 4th gear w/o AC. AC usage 45-50%

Expressway Speeds avg: 100+ Kph Top Speed attained 137 Kph. dunno what this translates to actual. Ne body know what the actual to metered conversion is ?

I guess I would have pulled out a better average if I had stuck to about 90 Kph on the expressway.

Thanks

Umesh Awasarikar.

(Mar 04 DLS, 4500 Km, 16.6 Km pl, Pune)

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• yes, these financials make sense, as long as your car is in prime working condition. but if you happen to run into a tank full of adulterated diesel, and if
Message 5 of 30 , Nov 1, 2004
yes, these financials make sense, as long as your car is in prime
working condition. but if you happen to run into a tank full of
adulterated diesel, and if the diesel pump starts to choke up, that's
where the maintenance costs will begin to empty your wallet.

besides, at marginal savings, also consider, whether you would enjoy
driving a diesel indica or a petrol santro. also consider the
equipment and quality of the car - for example, interior quality,
switches and electricals are better on a santro as compared to the
indica DLS. maybe the indica scores higher when it comes to interior
space, but then the santro carries other additionals such a heater and
a temperature control for the airconditioner.

in my opinion, it is more fun to drive a petrol car, especially if you
are owner driven, even if it is marginally more expensive to run.

On Mon, 01 Nov 2004 09:42:22 -0000, Hrishikesh Raghavan
<raghavan_h@...> wrote:
>
> Hi Jaswinder,
>
> Just in case you misunderstood - I was never trying to market the
> Indica Petrol. I merely 'recommended' it initially since you were in
> favour of the Indica.
>
> Of course, going by pure financials, the DLS makes the most sense to
>
>
>
> Cheers,
> Hrishi
> LSi, March 2003, 26143 km, 11 kmpl, Chennai TN 07 AA 1669
>
> --- In indica-users@yahoogroups.com, "Jaswinder Singh"
> <Jaswinder.Singh@i...> wrote:
> > No Hrishi,
> > Indica Petrol is out of question because of it's lowest mileage
> and not-so-good performance and reliability vis-a-vis Santro.
> >
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> To UNsubscribe, send a blank email to the address:
> indica-users-unsubscribe@egroups.com.
> http://www.egroups.com/files/indica-users/IndicaUsersFeedback.html
>
>
>
>
>
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>
>
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accuracy or reliability of any information contained on any of these
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or any of the individual contributors accept any liability for the
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Any action performed by you, is at your personal discretion. You are
advised to take all necessary precaution.

Belt yourself before the drive! Safety - The First Priority
• Guys, I have a little different feeling here. Diesel prices should not exceed the Petrol prices or even the price will not come this closer as you guys have
Message 6 of 30 , Nov 1, 2004
Guys,

I have a little different feeling here. Diesel prices should not exceed
the Petrol prices or even the price will not come this closer as you
guys have been saying. I remember around 3+ years back, the price of
diesel was Rs16-Rs17 in delhi and petrol was Rs 24-Rs26. Today in
Bangalore the price of diesel is Rs 28-Rs29 and petrol is Rs 44 - Rs 46.
So, I don't think the difference is going down.

Also, think of it that diesel is not only being used by Tata guys
(indica, indigo) but also by Trukers and buses. I feel those guys still
use more diesel than passenger cars. If that is the case, then Govt
cannot blindly keep increasing diesel prices to make them at par with
petrol.

Even in the recent news there was a suggestion to increase diesel prices
by Rs0.65 and Petrol by Rs. 1.65

My 2 cents,

-munish

________________________________

From: Jaswinder Singh [mailto:Jaswinder.Singh@...]
Sent: Monday, November 01, 2004 11:40 AM
To: indica-users@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [indica-users] diesel or petrol car

Let us assume the following:-
1) Car running of about 800 Kms a month.
2) Mileage given by a Petrol car = 12 Km / litre and Average mileage
given by a Diesel car = 16 Km / litre.
3) By next year (2005 end) Petrol will cost about Rs. 45 per litre while
Diesel will cost about Rs. 40 per litre. (Diesel price will increase
MORE than Petrol price).

Amount of fuel required for a Petrol car will be 800/12 = approx. 67
litres.
Therefore cost of fuel per month for a Petrol car will be 67 * 45 = 3000
Rs. (approx.)

Similarly, Amount of fuel required for a Diesel car will be 800/16 = 50
litres.
Therefore cost of fuel per month for a Diesel car will be 50 * 40 = 2000
Rs. (approx.)

This shows that even by using a car for as less as 800 Kms a month, a
Diesel car can save us Rs. 1000/- a month i.e. Rs. 12000/- a year.

In the above calculations, I have assumed a very nominal mileage of 16
Kms per litre for a diesel car and also assumed Diesel cost to be Rs. 45
per litre (i.e. just a difference of just Rs. 5/- wrt Petrol cost). If
the car gives a mileage of more than 16 Km/litre OR the difference in
petrol and diesel cost is more than Rs. 5/litre, then the savings will
be more than the calculated amount of Rs. 1000/- a month.

Now, I really do not think that Maintenance cost of Indica DLS will be
more than 12000/- Rs. per annum wrt a Petrol car. Hence DLS seems to be
a good buy even at lower expected running.

Please let me know if there is any mistake in these calculations / my
assumptions. For me, it is End of all Arguments.

Regards
Jaswinder Singh

-----Original Message-----
From: Arjun <Auto World India> [mailto:autoworld@...]
Sent: Sunday, October 31, 2004 1:59 AM
To: indica-users@yahoogroups.com
Cc: AutoWorldIndia
Subject: Re: [indica-users] diesel or petrol car

I agree with you. I would though like to push the 1500 km per month
mark to about 2000 km per month, as diesel costs are likely to go up
as they have in the last two years - the gap between petrol and diesel
is going to narrow down and the saving per unit of fuel will be
minimal. The only evident advantage would be the fuel efficiency of
diesel over petrol.

On Fri, 29 Oct 2004 17:06:30 +0530, mehta anil
<mehtaan@...> wrote:
> Hi Jasvinder & all
>
> Diesel OR Petrol Car - the eternal million dollar question !!
>
> Financial Aspects
> A diesel car is financially worth if your driving is ideally AT LEAST
1000
> to 1500 km pm. The more km pm, the merrier. Especially highway
driving.
>
> Driving Comfort
> A diesel car is a driver driven car, not a owner driven car, unless
it is a
> car like Indigo LS with power steering & turbo.
>
> Petrol or Diesel Costs
> For your 500 to 800 km pm, buy a good petrol car and be done with it.
> I had a Zen at a usage of 40 km per week day, say an average of 800
to 1000
> km pm. But puchased an Indica DLE when I was to shift from Delhi to
Gurgaon,
> with office at Noida - a usage of around 90 km per week day, say an
average
> of 2000 km pm.
>
> Which Petrol Car
> Consider a hassle - free low maintenance car with good mileage. There
is no
> dearth of them.
>
> all the best.
>
> Regards
>
> Anil

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• Hi Dr. Rajesh, This is just a little curious question. Why shop for a car now when new Euro III norm comes into effect in April 2005? It is another matter if
Message 7 of 30 , Nov 1, 2004
Hi Dr. Rajesh,

This is just a little curious question. Why shop for a car now when
new Euro III norm comes into effect in April 2005? It is another
matter if you're looking for year-end discounts and, of course, the
Indigo family is Euro III compliant (at least going by their sales
spiel).

You're a veteran of cars. I thought you'd wait to see how the
competition spruces up for Euro III before you take a decision. I
guess most car makers would announce their new upgraded engines with
the new year. Frankly, I don't know how many cars need engine
upgradation for the new norms. It is pretty chaotic in this country
with very few car makers announcing their plans in advance or the new
engine configurations. It's pretty much a wait and watch situation.

With plenty of competition, I guess every car maker is cagey about
the details. Recently, when I went to Concorde, I asked them about
the turbo version of Indica, and when it is due. They just cold
shouldered me. An insider told me that everything is under wraps; in
fact, even the Marina launch dates were unknown to them.

Regards,

--- In indica-users@yahoogroups.com, "dr_trrk" <dr_trrk@y...> wrote:
>
> Hi anil,
>
> I was thinking of upgrading from my Indica DLE. My interest was in
Marina.

> Rajesh
> (V2 DLE, Feb 2001, 63250kms, 16kpl, Alleppey, Kerala, KL 04 J 0914)
• Munish Dear, Ref.: Even in the recent news there was a suggestion to increase diesel prices by Rs 0.65 and Petrol by Rs. 1.65 While you said it correctly
Message 8 of 30 , Nov 2, 2004
Munish Dear,
Ref.: "Even in the recent news there was a suggestion to increase diesel prices by Rs 0.65 and Petrol by Rs. 1.65"

While you said it correctly that Diesel cost might not increase too much vis-a-vis Petrol, but the news is that the Diesel prices will go up by Rs. 1.65 while Petrol will go up by Rs. 0.65.

Regards
Jaswinder Singh

-----Original Message-----
From: ARORA, MUNISH DEV (STSD) [mailto:munish.arora@...]
Sent: Tuesday, November 02, 2004 10:56 AM
To: indica-users@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [indica-users] diesel or petrol car

Guys,

I have a little different feeling here. Diesel prices should not exceed
the Petrol prices or even the price will not come this closer as you
guys have been saying. I remember around 3+ years back, the price of
diesel was Rs16-Rs17 in delhi and petrol was Rs 24-Rs26. Today in
Bangalore the price of diesel is Rs 28-Rs29 and petrol is Rs 44 - Rs 46.
So, I don't think the difference is going down.

Also, think of it that diesel is not only being used by Tata guys
(indica, indigo) but also by Trukers and buses. I feel those guys still
use more diesel than passenger cars. If that is the case, then Govt
cannot blindly keep increasing diesel prices to make them at par with
petrol.

Even in the recent news there was a suggestion to increase diesel prices
by Rs0.65 and Petrol by Rs. 1.65

My 2 cents,

-munish

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
• I am sorry. Yes you are right here! -munish ... From: Jaswinder Singh [mailto:Jaswinder.Singh@ideas.com] Sent: Tuesday, November 02, 2004 3:01 PM To:
Message 9 of 30 , Nov 2, 2004
I am sorry. Yes you are right here!

-munish

-----Original Message-----
From: Jaswinder Singh [mailto:Jaswinder.Singh@...]
Sent: Tuesday, November 02, 2004 3:01 PM
To: indica-users@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [indica-users] diesel or petrol car

Munish Dear,
Ref.: "Even in the recent news there was a suggestion to increase diesel prices by Rs 0.65 and Petrol by Rs. 1.65"

While you said it correctly that Diesel cost might not increase too much vis-a-vis Petrol, but the news is that the Diesel prices will go up by Rs. 1.65 while Petrol will go up by Rs. 0.65.

Regards
Jaswinder Singh

-----Original Message-----
From: ARORA, MUNISH DEV (STSD) [mailto:munish.arora@...]
Sent: Tuesday, November 02, 2004 10:56 AM
To: indica-users@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [indica-users] diesel or petrol car

Guys,

I have a little different feeling here. Diesel prices should not exceed
the Petrol prices or even the price will not come this closer as you
guys have been saying. I remember around 3+ years back, the price of
diesel was Rs16-Rs17 in delhi and petrol was Rs 24-Rs26. Today in
Bangalore the price of diesel is Rs 28-Rs29 and petrol is Rs 44 - Rs 46.
So, I don't think the difference is going down.

Also, think of it that diesel is not only being used by Tata guys
(indica, indigo) but also by Trukers and buses. I feel those guys still
use more diesel than passenger cars. If that is the case, then Govt
cannot blindly keep increasing diesel prices to make them at par with
petrol.

Even in the recent news there was a suggestion to increase diesel prices
by Rs0.65 and Petrol by Rs. 1.65

My 2 cents,

-munish

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

To UNsubscribe, send a blank email to the address:
indica-users-unsubscribe@egroups.com.
• In western countries, there is not much difference in the price of diesel and petrol. The difference lies only in their application, and that is what will
Message 10 of 30 , Nov 2, 2004
In western countries, there is not much difference in the price of
diesel and petrol. The difference lies only in their application, and
that is what will ultimately bear the difference between petrol cars
and diesel cars.

I also feel, that once this happens, Tata's will dramatically upgrade
their diesel technology for passenger cars, and provide turbo charges,
intercoolers, and CRDi or other comparable technology to deliver a
refined product to the customer - something like the Skoda Octavia or
even the Mercedes C200 CDi

Even though the Mercedes C200 CDi may be very good with fuel economy,
I perceive that buyers opt for one, primarily because it performs
better or atleast equally well with its petrol counterparts.

On the other hand, if one compares the driving experience of a diesel
indica with that of a petrol santro/getz/zen/wagon r.... there is
little that i need to say...

On Tue, 2 Nov 2004 15:45:58 +0530, ARORA, MUNISH DEV (STSD)
<munish.arora@...> wrote:
> I am sorry. Yes you are right here!
>
> -munish
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Jaswinder Singh [mailto:Jaswinder.Singh@...]
> Sent: Tuesday, November 02, 2004 3:01 PM
> To: indica-users@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: RE: [indica-users] diesel or petrol car
>
>
> Munish Dear,
> Ref.: "Even in the recent news there was a suggestion to increase diesel
> prices by Rs 0.65 and Petrol by Rs. 1.65"
>
> While you said it correctly that Diesel cost might not increase too much
> vis-a-vis Petrol, but the news is that the Diesel prices will go up by Rs.
> 1.65 while Petrol will go up by Rs. 0.65.
>
> Regards
> Jaswinder Singh
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: ARORA, MUNISH DEV (STSD) [mailto:munish.arora@...]
> Sent: Tuesday, November 02, 2004 10:56 AM
> To: indica-users@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: RE: [indica-users] diesel or petrol car
>
>
> Guys,
>
>
>
> I have a little different feeling here. Diesel prices should not exceed
> the Petrol prices or even the price will not come this closer as you
> guys have been saying. I remember around 3+ years back, the price of
> diesel was Rs16-Rs17 in delhi and petrol was Rs 24-Rs26. Today in
> Bangalore the price of diesel is Rs 28-Rs29 and petrol is Rs 44 - Rs 46.
> So, I don't think the difference is going down.
>
>
>
> Also, think of it that diesel is not only being used by Tata guys
> (indica, indigo) but also by Trukers and buses. I feel those guys still
> use more diesel than passenger cars. If that is the case, then Govt
> cannot blindly keep increasing diesel prices to make them at par with
> petrol.
>
>
>
> Even in the recent news there was a suggestion to increase diesel prices
> by Rs0.65 and Petrol by Rs. 1.65
>
>
>
> My 2 cents,
>
> -munish
>
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
>
> To UNsubscribe, send a blank email to the address:
> indica-users-unsubscribe@egroups.com.
> http://www.egroups.com/files/indica-users/IndicaUsersFeedback.html
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> To UNsubscribe, send a blank email to the address:
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>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
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>
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the individual contributors. No representation is made regarding the
accuracy or reliability of any information contained on any of these
page(s)/message(s)/message archive(s).

or any of the individual contributors accept any liability for the
consequences of using the information presented on these pages.

Any action performed by you, is at your personal discretion. You are
advised to take all necessary precaution.

Belt yourself before the drive! Safety - The First Priority
• You re right to a great extent. But, April is still 5 more months to go. That adds up to about 10,000 kilometers for someone who will use his car, if he is
Message 11 of 30 , Nov 2, 2004
You're right to a great extent. But, April is still 5 more months to
go. That adds up to about 10,000 kilometers for someone who will use
his car, if he is going in for a diesel. If one needs a vehicle, and
cannot wait, he/she would really have no choice.

In fact, I hate the fact that auto manufacturers in India wait for
laws to come into action, then ask for extensions, before they release
new technology onto the streets. I still remember the year 2000, when
for a long period of time, Maruti was not able to register the Zen in
metros, until they came out with an MPFi version (apart from the top
of the line VXi which was MPFi from the very beginning)

it would indeed be a pleasure, if auto manufacturers would take the
initiative, to atleast, if not switch in entirety, give buyers the
option to buy the lower-polluting variant, perhaps even at a premium -
like Hyundai did with the Santro, back in 2000. Both the Euro I and
Euro II variants were available for some months, till it became
mandatory by law to sell only Euro II in April 2000.

>
> Hi Dr. Rajesh,
>
> This is just a little curious question. Why shop for a car now when
> new Euro III norm comes into effect in April 2005? It is another
> matter if you're looking for year-end discounts and, of course, the
> Indigo family is Euro III compliant (at least going by their sales
> spiel).
>
> You're a veteran of cars. I thought you'd wait to see how the
> competition spruces up for Euro III before you take a decision. I
> guess most car makers would announce their new upgraded engines with
> the new year. Frankly, I don't know how many cars need engine
> upgradation for the new norms. It is pretty chaotic in this country
> with very few car makers announcing their plans in advance or the new
> engine configurations. It's pretty much a wait and watch situation.
>
> With plenty of competition, I guess every car maker is cagey about
> the details. Recently, when I went to Concorde, I asked them about
> the turbo version of Indica, and when it is due. They just cold
> shouldered me. An insider told me that everything is under wraps; in
> fact, even the Marina launch dates were unknown to them.
>
> Regards,
>
>
>
>
> --- In indica-users@yahoogroups.com, "dr_trrk" <dr_trrk@y...> wrote:
> >
> > Hi anil,
> >
> > I was thinking of upgrading from my Indica DLE. My interest was in
> Marina.
>
> > Rajesh
> > (V2 DLE, Feb 2001, 63250kms, 16kpl, Alleppey, Kerala, KL 04 J 0914)
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> To UNsubscribe, send a blank email to the address:
> indica-users-unsubscribe@egroups.com.
> http://www.egroups.com/files/indica-users/IndicaUsersFeedback.html
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ________________________________
>
> To visit your group on the web, go to:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/indica-users/
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> indica-users-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>

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or any of the individual contributors accept any liability for the
consequences of using the information presented on these pages.

Any action performed by you, is at your personal discretion. You are
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Belt yourself before the drive! Safety - The First Priority
• Manufacturing cost of Diesel is only 50 paisa less than Petrol. Petrol is generally in band C9 and its derivatives ( boiling point between 90 to 205 degC )
Message 12 of 30 , Nov 3, 2004
Manufacturing cost of Diesel is only 50 paisa less than Petrol.
Petrol is generally in band C9 and its derivatives ( boiling point between
90 to 205 degC ) where Diesel is C14 and its derivatives ( boiling point
between 250 to 350 degC ) both comes out as a draw in fractional
distillation process of crude oil in Petroleum Refinery Process.

Pricing of these hydrocarbon comodities is now flexible and depends on
crude oil market, oil pool account and many other parameters. However
because of strategic reason, Diesel enjoys a very high subsidy in Indian
scenerio since long.

It is likely that in future Diesel will not have sudsidy but to my
understanding that day is too far as compared to the lifetime of our
existing diesel vehicle. Because, at present, Govt. neither have control
mechanism on pricing of essential comodities once diesel price is hiked,
nor the political leaders are ready to disturb their available vote banks.

So let us be among those privileged to get govt. subsidy for long.

Secondly, the benifit of diesel vehicle and petrol vehicle should be seen
with a broader view of LifeCycle Costing (LCC), i.e. cost of ownership of a
vehicle for entire period, which is,
1. Cost of acquisition (money you spent in buying vehicle)
2. Cost of running ( fuel cost + maintenance + insurance + road tax etc.)
3. Cost of disposal ( in reverse, the money you get in hand when you sell
it off ).
In effect you spend (1+2-3) over the lifetime of vehicle you own.
However calculating LCC is not a simple task, as you will appreciate that
fuel cost, maintenance cost etc are suppose to escalate over a period of
time where some may be driven only by inflation rate where others by some
other complex mechanism.

To simplify the process let us try to compare cost of ownership on todays
valuation with certain basic assumptions,
1. Life of diesel & petrol vehicle is same (However, we may debate on it
!!)
2. Life of vehicle is 7 years. ( As per standard depreciation guidelines,
even followed by banks )

Now you are ready for calculation,
1. Get the acquisition cost. Amount you spent (without accessories), to put
2. Identify how many km is your average run/month.
3. Know efficiency of your car , the design data supplied by manufacturer
in km/ltr. (Which is more or less expected if car is mantained as per
manufacturer guidelines)
4. Calculate required fuel and multiply by todays price.
5. Multiply the monthly fuel bill by 84 to get fuel cost over seven years
to todays context.
6. Identify all replacement parts as identified in user manual. You can
identify the required changes in 7 years based on frequency given in user
manual either in time or km.
This covers material cost of oils, filters etc., even tyres and all labour
cost associated with replacement or preventive maintenance.
7. Insurance cost depends on CC of vehicle. If you are interested you may
capture it for 7 years with no-claim bonus effective through out. Calculate
8. So your running cost is (5+ 6+7) on todays context.
9. Estimate resale value of the car in your locality after 7 years.(Indica
has not lived for 7 years !!).

Your cost of ownership on todays valuation is (1+8-9).
Once you calculate ,this comparison result may tell you where you stand
with reference to,
1. Diesel vs. Pertol vehicle.
2. Manufacturer A vs Manufacturer B.

This comparision assumes that both vehicle will run properly in its
lifetime and will not incurred accidental expenses. This is the basis for
an apple to apple comparison. Though it is not perfect but fairly
indicative to help you decide, if cost plays important role in your
selection process.

Even if you decide to keep your new vehicle for only three years, you may
follow same calculation to find you where you stand in comparing two
vehicles.

Regards.

Abhijit
• Hi Abhijit That was very scientific way to analize car ownership and Life time cost cycle. Do you have some comparitive that you have done on differnt
Message 13 of 30 , Nov 4, 2004
Hi Abhijit
That was very scientific way to analize car ownership and Life time cost cycle. Do you have some comparitive that you have done on differnt cars.
By
deepak

Somarao.Dronumraju@... wrote:

Manufacturing cost of Diesel is only 50 paisa less than Petrol.
Petrol is generally in band C9 and its derivatives ( boiling point between
90 to 205 degC ) where Diesel is C14 and its derivatives ( boiling point
between 250 to 350 degC ) both comes out as a draw in fractional
distillation process of crude oil in Petroleum Refinery Process.

Pricing of these hydrocarbon comodities is now flexible and depends on
crude oil market, oil pool account and many other parameters. However
because of strategic reason, Diesel enjoys a very high subsidy in Indian
scenerio since long.

It is likely that in future Diesel will not have sudsidy but to my
understanding that day is too far as compared to the lifetime of our
existing diesel vehicle. Because, at present, Govt. neither have control
mechanism on pricing of essential comodities once diesel price is hiked,
nor the political leaders are ready to disturb their available vote banks.

So let us be among those privileged to get govt. subsidy for long.

Secondly, the benifit of diesel vehicle and petrol vehicle should be seen
with a broader view of LifeCycle Costing (LCC), i.e. cost of ownership of a
vehicle for entire period, which is,
1. Cost of acquisition (money you spent in buying vehicle)
2. Cost of running ( fuel cost + maintenance + insurance + road tax etc.)
3. Cost of disposal ( in reverse, the money you get in hand when you sell
it off ).
In effect you spend (1+2-3) over the lifetime of vehicle you own.
However calculating LCC is not a simple task, as you will appreciate that
fuel cost, maintenance cost etc are suppose to escalate over a period of
time where some may be driven only by inflation rate where others by some
other complex mechanism.

To simplify the process let us try to compare cost of ownership on todays
valuation with certain basic assumptions,
1. Life of diesel & petrol vehicle is same (However, we may debate on it
!!)
2. Life of vehicle is 7 years. ( As per standard depreciation guidelines,
even followed by banks )

Now you are ready for calculation,
1. Get the acquisition cost. Amount you spent (without accessories), to put
2. Identify how many km is your average run/month.
3. Know efficiency of your car , the design data supplied by manufacturer
in km/ltr. (Which is more or less expected if car is mantained as per
manufacturer guidelines)
4. Calculate required fuel and multiply by todays price.
5. Multiply the monthly fuel bill by 84 to get fuel cost over seven years
to todays context.
6. Identify all replacement parts as identified in user manual. You can
identify the required changes in 7 years based on frequency given in user
manual either in time or km.
This covers material cost of oils, filters etc., even tyres and all labour
cost associated with replacement or preventive maintenance.
7. Insurance cost depends on CC of vehicle. If you are interested you may
capture it for 7 years with no-claim bonus effective through out. Calculate
8. So your running cost is (5+ 6+7) on todays context.
9. Estimate resale value of the car in your locality after 7 years.(Indica
has not lived for 7 years !!).

Your cost of ownership on todays valuation is (1+8-9).
Once you calculate ,this comparison result may tell you where you stand
with reference to,
1. Diesel vs. Pertol vehicle.
2. Manufacturer A vs Manufacturer B.

This comparision assumes that both vehicle will run properly in its
lifetime and will not incurred accidental expenses. This is the basis for
an apple to apple comparison. Though it is not perfect but fairly
indicative to help you decide, if cost plays important role in your
selection process.

Even if you decide to keep your new vehicle for only three years, you may
follow same calculation to find you where you stand in comparing two
vehicles.

Regards.

Abhijit

To UNsubscribe, send a blank email to the address:
indica-users-unsubscribe@egroups.com.

---------------------------------

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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
• This is a very good way to arouse an insight in the prospective car buyer s mind. Though, I would also like to add, that because of the baggage we all carry
Message 14 of 30 , Nov 4, 2004
This is a very good way to arouse an insight in the prospective car
buyer's mind. Though, I would also like to add, that because of the
baggage we all carry about diesel cars requiring more maintenance in
later years of life, the resale value of diesel cars is also lower
than that of comparable petrol ones. This means, that there is added
expenditure in terms of depreciation during the use-life of the
vehicle.

Essentially, we should calculate the cost incurred in terms of cash
flow - the cash outflow at the time of purchase, and the cash inflow
at time of resale.

Arjun

On Wed, 03 Nov 2004 17:32:28 +0530, somarao.dronumraju@...
<somarao.dronumraju@...> wrote:
>
> Manufacturing cost of Diesel is only 50 paisa less than Petrol.
> Petrol is generally in band C9 and its derivatives ( boiling point between
> 90 to 205 degC ) where Diesel is C14 and its derivatives ( boiling point
> between 250 to 350 degC ) both comes out as a draw in fractional
> distillation process of crude oil in Petroleum Refinery Process.
>
> Pricing of these hydrocarbon comodities is now flexible and depends on
> crude oil market, oil pool account and many other parameters. However
> because of strategic reason, Diesel enjoys a very high subsidy in Indian
> scenerio since long.
>
> It is likely that in future Diesel will not have sudsidy but to my
> understanding that day is too far as compared to the lifetime of our
> existing diesel vehicle. Because, at present, Govt. neither have control
> mechanism on pricing of essential comodities once diesel price is hiked,
> nor the political leaders are ready to disturb their available vote banks.
>
> So let us be among those privileged to get govt. subsidy for long.
>
>
> Secondly, the benifit of diesel vehicle and petrol vehicle should be seen
> with a broader view of LifeCycle Costing (LCC), i.e. cost of ownership of a
> vehicle for entire period, which is,
> 1. Cost of acquisition (money you spent in buying vehicle)
> 2. Cost of running ( fuel cost + maintenance + insurance + road tax etc.)
> 3. Cost of disposal ( in reverse, the money you get in hand when you sell
> it off ).
> In effect you spend (1+2-3) over the lifetime of vehicle you own.
> However calculating LCC is not a simple task, as you will appreciate that
> fuel cost, maintenance cost etc are suppose to escalate over a period of
> time where some may be driven only by inflation rate where others by some
> other complex mechanism.
>
> To simplify the process let us try to compare cost of ownership on todays
> valuation with certain basic assumptions,
> 1. Life of diesel & petrol vehicle is same (However, we may debate on it
> !!)
> 2. Life of vehicle is 7 years. ( As per standard depreciation guidelines,
> even followed by banks )
>
> Now you are ready for calculation,
> 1. Get the acquisition cost. Amount you spent (without accessories), to put
> 2. Identify how many km is your average run/month.
> 3. Know efficiency of your car , the design data supplied by manufacturer
> in km/ltr. (Which is more or less expected if car is mantained as per
> manufacturer guidelines)
> 4. Calculate required fuel and multiply by todays price.
> 5. Multiply the monthly fuel bill by 84 to get fuel cost over seven years
> to todays context.
> 6. Identify all replacement parts as identified in user manual. You can
> identify the required changes in 7 years based on frequency given in user
> manual either in time or km.
> This covers material cost of oils, filters etc., even tyres and all labour
> cost associated with replacement or preventive maintenance.
> 7. Insurance cost depends on CC of vehicle. If you are interested you may
> capture it for 7 years with no-claim bonus effective through out. Calculate
> 8. So your running cost is (5+ 6+7) on todays context.
> 9. Estimate resale value of the car in your locality after 7 years.(Indica
> has not lived for 7 years !!).
>
> Your cost of ownership on todays valuation is (1+8-9).
> Once you calculate ,this comparison result may tell you where you stand
> with reference to,
> 1. Diesel vs. Pertol vehicle.
> 2. Manufacturer A vs Manufacturer B.
>
> This comparision assumes that both vehicle will run properly in its
> lifetime and will not incurred accidental expenses. This is the basis for
> an apple to apple comparison. Though it is not perfect but fairly
> indicative to help you decide, if cost plays important role in your
> selection process.
>
> Even if you decide to keep your new vehicle for only three years, you may
> follow same calculation to find you where you stand in comparing two
> vehicles.
>
> Regards.
>
> Abhijit
>
>
>
>
>
> To UNsubscribe, send a blank email to the address:
> indica-users-unsubscribe@egroups.com.
> http://www.egroups.com/files/indica-users/IndicaUsersFeedback.html
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ________________________________
>
> To visit your group on the web, go to:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/indica-users/
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> indica-users-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>

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accuracy or reliability of any information contained on any of these
page(s)/message(s)/message archive(s).

or any of the individual contributors accept any liability for the
consequences of using the information presented on these pages.

Any action performed by you, is at your personal discretion. You are
advised to take all necessary precaution.

Belt yourself before the drive! Safety - The First Priority
• Hi, ... The wieght difference is about 35 kgs. Should not make that much of a difference. ... I totally agree with you on this. Other than this, it was not in
Message 15 of 30 , Nov 7, 2004
Hi,

> The Marina is bigger and has more weight than the Indigo. Also the
> weight is tilted towards the rear with the bigger hatch and you're

The wieght difference is about 35 kgs. Should not make that much of a
difference.

> Also, if the engine was cold during the initial minutes of the test

I totally agree with you on this. Other than this, it was not in its
good self. I could not try it for a longer distance as it had hardly
any diesel and I did not want to get stranded on the road.

Rajesh
(V2 DLE, Feb 2001, 64000kms, 16kpl, Alleppey, Kerala, KL 04 J 0914)
• Hi All, I have done my cars fourth(20,000) service on Nov 4th 2004. After that I have noticed Engine Oil leakage. I have informed about it to the concerned
Message 16 of 30 , Nov 7, 2004
Hi All,

I have done my cars fourth(20,000) service on Nov 4th
2004. After that I have noticed Engine Oil leakage. I
have informed about it to the concerned person who did
servicing. He told me to bring the car tomm to
KOYENCO.

Looking from beneath the car I can notice that the
whole engine compartment is wet, within 15 mn a single
drop gets leaked out.

Can any one tell me what may be the reson for this.
What might have gone wrong while refilling the Engine
oil...

Thanks and Regards

Sunil S.
(V2 DLS, April 11th 2003, 19996 kms, 13 kpl min , 27.2
max, Kochi, Kerala, KL04 M 5400)
Sunil S.

__________________________________
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• The 35kg difference is in kerb weight of the car. Add to it the balance being shifted to the rear, which is like driving with a boot-full of load. It matters
Message 17 of 30 , Nov 7, 2004
The 35kg difference is in kerb weight of the car. Add to it the
balance being shifted to the rear, which is like driving with a
car.

You can probably appreciate such a difference if you compare the
handling of a small car like the Zen with a bigger variant, like the
Esteem - which have similar designing. The added weight behind the
rear wheel adds bulk to handling. If you've driven the Indica and
Indigo, you would find a similar difference in handling as well. And
thus, the difference between the Indigo and the Marina.

On Sun, 07 Nov 2004 13:50:12 -0000, dr_trrk <dr_trrk@...> wrote:
>
> Hi,
>
> > The Marina is bigger and has more weight than the Indigo. Also the
> > weight is tilted towards the rear with the bigger hatch and you're
>
> The wieght difference is about 35 kgs. Should not make that much of a
> difference.
>
> > Also, if the engine was cold during the initial minutes of the test
>
> I totally agree with you on this. Other than this, it was not in its
> good self. I could not try it for a longer distance as it had hardly
> any diesel and I did not want to get stranded on the road.
>
> Rajesh
> (V2 DLE, Feb 2001, 64000kms, 16kpl, Alleppey, Kerala, KL 04 J 0914)
>
>
>
>
>
>
> To UNsubscribe, send a blank email to the address:
> indica-users-unsubscribe@egroups.com.
> http://www.egroups.com/files/indica-users/IndicaUsersFeedback.html
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ________________________________
>
> To visit your group on the web, go to:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/indica-users/
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> indica-users-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>

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accuracy or reliability of any information contained on any of these
page(s)/message(s)/message archive(s).

or any of the individual contributors accept any liability for the
consequences of using the information presented on these pages.

Any action performed by you, is at your personal discretion. You are
advised to take all necessary precaution.

Belt yourself before the drive! Safety - The First Priority
• From your description, it would be advisable to check if the leak comes from damage to the oil chamber that has been physically hit, or whether the leak comes
Message 18 of 30 , Nov 7, 2004
From your description, it would be advisable to check if the leak
comes from damage to the oil chamber that has been physically hit, or
whether the leak comes from the oil drain stopper and the oil filter.
If the latter components are in place, replace the oil chamber
immediately. Do not drive the car with low engine oil - it will lead
to engine seizure.

On Sun, 7 Nov 2004 20:15:40 -0800 (PST), sunil S <sunil_exor@...> wrote:
> Hi All,
>
> I have done my cars fourth(20,000) service on Nov 4th
> 2004. After that I have noticed Engine Oil leakage. I
> have informed about it to the concerned person who did
> servicing. He told me to bring the car tomm to
> KOYENCO.
>
> Looking from beneath the car I can notice that the
> whole engine compartment is wet, within 15 mn a single
> drop gets leaked out.
>
> Can any one tell me what may be the reson for this.
> What might have gone wrong while refilling the Engine
> oil...
>
> Thanks and Regards
>
> Sunil S.
> (V2 DLS, April 11th 2003, 19996 kms, 13 kpl min , 27.2
> max, Kochi, Kerala, KL04 M 5400)
> Sunil S.
>
>
>
> __________________________________
> Do you Yahoo!?
> Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page.
> www.yahoo.com
>
>
>
>
> To UNsubscribe, send a blank email to the address:
> indica-users-unsubscribe@egroups.com.
> http://www.egroups.com/files/indica-users/IndicaUsersFeedback.html
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ________________________________
>
> To visit your group on the web, go to:
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>
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accuracy or reliability of any information contained on any of these
page(s)/message(s)/message archive(s).

or any of the individual contributors accept any liability for the
consequences of using the information presented on these pages.

Any action performed by you, is at your personal discretion. You are
advised to take all necessary precaution.

Belt yourself before the drive! Safety - The First Priority
• Hi, ... Doesn t that sound too formal? ... OK. I am in a place where these norms would be implemented the last. So I necessarily don t have to worry about the
Message 19 of 30 , Nov 9, 2004
Hi,

> Hi Dr. Rajesh,

Doesn't that sound too formal?

> This is just a little curious question. Why shop for a car now when
> new Euro III norm comes into effect in April 2005? It is another

OK. I am in a place where these norms would be implemented the last.
So I necessarily don't have to worry about the norms as such. Then
again, the Viva CRDi is Euro III.

> matter if you're looking for year-end discounts and,

I actually chose a model for which there is a waiting list over here
and hardly any discounts. All discounts and freebies are restricted to
the petrol models.

> You're a veteran of cars. I thought you'd wait to see how the
> competition spruces up for Euro III before you take a decision. I

Over the years, I have grown to love cars. I love all of them from the
Premier Padminis to all the new cars. But I am not in a position to
buy any car that I would like.

Then I chose a car which has the versatilty to carry some bigger loads
too. My family ( wife and daughter) makes the decision collectively.
Then the all important budget. Since the family decision was to
replace the Indica (the grouse being the AC, after being spoilt by the
Versa), so the budget was low and we were looking to a B/C segemnt.
The running dictated a diesel. I have local serivce for Maruti, Tata
and Hyundai. Usually I never repeat my vehicles.

Here is something which may not be liked by everybody. In our parts,
before the photo along with pollution certificate system was enforced,
we did not even have to have the car to get a pollution certificate.
Now as the photo is needed, you have to get the car to the checking
station. I know, the situation is not at all credit worthy, but the
fact remains so.

Rajesh
(V2 DLE, Feb 2001, 64200kms, 16kpl, Alleppey, Kerala, KL 04 J 0914)
• Hi, ... The most likely oil leak post service may be a improperly tightened oil filter or a loose engine oil drain plug. Check it out immediately. Rajesh (V2
Message 20 of 30 , Nov 9, 2004
Hi,

> I have done my cars fourth(20,000) service on Nov 4th
> 2004. After that I have noticed Engine Oil leakage. I

The most likely oil leak post service may be a improperly tightened
oil filter or a loose engine oil drain plug.

Check it out immediately.

Rajesh
(V2 DLE, Feb 2001, 64200kms, 16kpl, Alleppey, Kerala, KL 04 J 0914)
• Hi, ... All that would matter only when high speeds are involved. Our state has a 65 kph speed limit and I stick to that. Even out side our state I have made a
Message 21 of 30 , Nov 9, 2004
Hi,

> The 35kg difference is in kerb weight of the car. Add to it the
> balance being shifted to the rear, which is like driving with a

All that would matter only when high speeds are involved. Our state
has a 65 kph speed limit and I stick to that. Even out side our state
I have made a habit of keeping my speeds at that level or at the
maximum 80 kph.

Rajesh
(V2 DLE, Feb 2001, 64200kms, 16kpl, Alleppey, Kerala, KL 04 J 0914)
• Hi All, I have taken the car to Koyenco today. I told the person in charge who did the 4th service regarding the leakage. He called me after two hour and told
Message 22 of 30 , Nov 9, 2004
Hi All,

I have taken the car to Koyenco today. I told the
person in charge who did the 4th service regarding the
leakage.

He called me after two hour and told that it was Power
Steering Oil that was leaking. I was also having a
doubt today morning. When I checked the level of
Engine oil it was ok and was almost dark in color and
the leaking oil was having a different color,but was
leaking from the engine compartment,when looking from
bottom part.

High Pressure hose was repalced(realted with power
steering). Hose was having minute crack on both the
sides, from which the oil was leaking. It costs about
Rs 1022.

Before the fourth service there was no leaking, After
the 4th service the leaking started. The person in
charge Mr Biju told me that they didnt touch the power
steering part during the 4th service.

Regards
Sunil S.
(V2 DLS, April 11th 2003, 19950 kms, 13 kpl min , 27.2
max, Kochi, Kerala, KL04 M 5400)

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• Hi All, My car was having Power steering oil leakage after 20k service. It was rectified yesterday after replacing the High Pressure hose (Rs 1022)(From
Message 23 of 30 , Nov 9, 2004
Hi All,

My car was having Power steering oil leakage after 20k
service. It was rectified yesterday after replacing
the High Pressure hose (Rs 1022)(From KOYENCO Kochi.).
Today morning when I checked for any leakage, I could
notice the same leakage under the Engine compartment.
Now the leaking was more than earlier :(

Can any one pls explain what can be went wrong during
the 4th service that might have caused this power
steering leakage.

Today morning I have given the car again to KOYENCO
Motors.

Regards
Sunil S.
(V2 DLS, April 11th 2003, 19975 kms, 13 kpl min ,
27.2max, Kochi, Kerala, KL04 M 5400)

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• Rajesh: 1) Why haven t you even got an Santro car? 2) Won t you go for a Santro Xing even if it would be offered to you at a discount of Rs. 40,000/- ? Just
Message 24 of 30 , Nov 9, 2004
Rajesh:
1) Why haven't you even got an Santro car?
2) Won't you go for a Santro Xing even if it would be offered to you at a discount of Rs. 40,000/- ?

Just Wondering...
Jaswinder Singh

-----Original Message-----
From: dr_trrk [mailto:dr_trrk@...]
Sent: Tuesday, November 09, 2004 2:43 PM
To: indica-users@yahoogroups.com

Hi,

> Hi Dr. Rajesh,

Doesn't that sound too formal?

> This is just a little curious question. Why shop for a car now when
> new Euro III norm comes into effect in April 2005? It is another

OK. I am in a place where these norms would be implemented the last.
So I necessarily don't have to worry about the norms as such. Then
again, the Viva CRDi is Euro III.

> matter if you're looking for year-end discounts and,

I actually chose a model for which there is a waiting list over here
and hardly any discounts. All discounts and freebies are restricted to
the petrol models.

> You're a veteran of cars. I thought you'd wait to see how the
> competition spruces up for Euro III before you take a decision. I

Over the years, I have grown to love cars. I love all of them from the
Premier Padminis to all the new cars. But I am not in a position to
buy any car that I would like.

Then I chose a car which has the versatilty to carry some bigger loads
too. My family ( wife and daughter) makes the decision collectively.
Then the all important budget. Since the family decision was to
replace the Indica (the grouse being the AC, after being spoilt by the
Versa), so the budget was low and we were looking to a B/C segemnt.
The running dictated a diesel. I have local serivce for Maruti, Tata
and Hyundai. Usually I never repeat my vehicles.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
• Hi, ... In 1996 I had a Cielo Automatic and a Sumo. By 1998, my Cielo was being used for school runs and was giving a low mileage in town use. So I went in for
Message 25 of 30 , Nov 10, 2004
Hi,

> 1) Why haven't you even got an Santro car?

In 1996 I had a Cielo Automatic and a Sumo. By 1998, my Cielo was
being used for school runs and was giving a low mileage in town use.
So I went in for the Uno diesel. I doubt Santro was in the market
then. Even then I would not have gone for a petrol as my use for a
small car is essentially short runs and in congested not very good
road and always with AC. This is the worst scenario for fule
consumption. My running is also high, so I will be better off with a
diesel in terms of expense.

The Uno was not giving me very good mileage in the above use, just 9
kpl. It was there for 27 months and 31000 kms and due to the
indifferent attitude of the desler here reagarding a service issue
prompted me for a change in vehicle. I bought my Indica then. The only
petrol car in the run up for decision was the Matiz.

> 2) Won't you go for a Santro Xing even if it would be offered to you
> at a discount of Rs. 40,000/- ?

The Santro has a very bad back seat ride. The roads that we use
regularly are not at all good at any time of the year. So ride is
important. So Santro was never in the wish list. I did take a test
drive of the Santro recently. In the butter smooth highway byepass
road, the ride was good. I considered it for a moment (wanted the
automatic version) to be used exclusively by me. But then I thought I
would not make that mistake and regret later.

So, the answer to your question no. 2 is a no. This is purely personal
as the same raods are flocked with Santros of all shapes and hues.

Rajesh
(V2 DLE, Feb 2001, 64145 kms, 15 kpl, Alleppey, Kerala, KL04 J0914)
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