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  • Ken D. Bueche
    I cant find my choctaw or mobilian dictionary. Any of yall know where there is one on line to view?   I need the words for   Elk Death word for killer or
    Message 1 of 10 , Dec 7, 2009
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      I cant find my choctaw or mobilian dictionary.
      Any of yall know where there is one on line to view?
       
      I need the words for
       
      Elk
      Death
      word for killer or slayer or hunter
      stick
      quick or fast
       
      Thanks
      KDB


       

    • Dudley Toelke
      Wasn t sure about elk but turned out I was right.  I checked these translations against Byington s Dictionary:   Elk-issi chito.  Litterally big deer
      Message 2 of 10 , Dec 7, 2009
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        Wasn't sure about elk but turned out I was right.  I checked these translations against Byington's Dictionary:
         
        Elk-issi chito.  Litterally big deer
        Death-illi. But can also mean to perish or to loose a bet, among several other meanings.
        Killer-ubi. Actually spelled with an "a" underscored with a period "." and pronounced as a long u (can't , as in "tub" or "rub". You see this associated with a warriors name denoting he has killed in war.  It can also be used as murderer.

        --- On Mon, 12/7/09, Ken D. Bueche <kdbueche@...> wrote:

        From: Ken D. Bueche <kdbueche@...>
        Subject: [indianmilitia] words
        To: "Indian Militia" <indianmilitia@yahoogroups.com>
        Date: Monday, December 7, 2009, 12:40 PM

         
        I cant find my choctaw or mobilian dictionary.
        Any of yall know where there is one on line to view?
         
        I need the words for
         
        Elk
        Death
        word for killer or slayer or hunter
        stick
        quick or fast
         
        Thanks
        KDB


         

      • Dudley Toelke
        Don t know how I sent the other answer so ignore it. OK, try again.   Wasn t sure about elk but turned out I was right.  I checked these translations against
        Message 3 of 10 , Dec 7, 2009
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          Don't know how I sent the other answer so ignore it. OK, try again.

           
          Wasn't sure about elk but turned out I was right.  I checked these translations against Byington's Dictionary:
           
          Elk-issi chito.  Literally big deer
           
          Death-illi. But can also mean to perish or to loose a bet, among several other meanings.
           
          Killer-ubi. Actually spelled with an "a" underscored with a period "." and pronounced as a long u (can't do it on my computer), as in "tub" or "rub". You see this associated with a warriors name denoting he has killed in war.  It can also be used as murderer.

          Stick-iti tapa.  A small wooden pole but not a war club. War club-iti tapena.

          Fast (as in speed): chali. The "l" has a slash through it that denotes it is pronounced as an aspirated "l" and not a hard "l". Palhki also means fleet or quick.
           
          Hope that helps.  Glad you asked about fast, I actually added an "n" to the Choctaw word which didn't properly translate.
           
          dud

          --- On Mon, 12/7/09, Ken D. Bueche <kdbueche@...> wrote:

          From: Ken D. Bueche <kdbueche@...>
          Subject: [indianmilitia] words
          To: "Indian Militia" <indianmilitia@yahoogroups.com>
          Date: Monday, December 7, 2009, 12:40 PM

           
          I cant find my choctaw or mobilian dictionary.
          Any of yall know where there is one on line to view?
           
          I need the words for
           
          Elk
          Death
          word for killer or slayer or hunter
          stick
          quick or fast
           
          Thanks
          KDB


           

        • Ken D. Bueche
          Thanks alot dud its been agravatin me. Im ordering two new language books. Mine have disapeared...   what about bow?   Reason. I have been working on 3 bambo
          Message 4 of 10 , Dec 7, 2009
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            Thanks alot dud its been agravatin me. Im ordering two new language books. Mine have disapeared...
             
            what about bow?
             
            Reason. I have been working on 3 bambo backed osage bows for my father and brother in law for christmas. They are both big time traditional bow hunters and i am trying to fimd good names for the bows. They have both taken elk and bear among other big game and not from some fenced in caned hunt.
            Thanks
            KD Bueche
             
            anyone with good ideas pop in :)


             


            --- On Mon, 12/7/09, Dudley Toelke <dud@...> wrote:

            From: Dudley Toelke <dud@...>
            Subject: Re: [indianmilitia] words
            To: indianmilitia@yahoogroups.com
            Date: Monday, December 7, 2009, 5:26 PM

             
            Don't know how I sent the other answer so ignore it. OK, try again.

             
            Wasn't sure about elk but turned out I was right.  I checked these translations against Byington's Dictionary:
             
            Elk-issi chito.  Literally big deer
             
            Death-illi. But can also mean to perish or to loose a bet, among several other meanings.
             
            Killer-ubi. Actually spelled with an "a" underscored with a period "." and pronounced as a long u (can't do it on my computer), as in "tub" or "rub". You see this associated with a warriors name denoting he has killed in war.  It can also be used as murderer.

            Stick-iti tapa.  A small wooden pole but not a war club. War club-iti tapena.

            Fast (as in speed): chali. The "l" has a slash through it that denotes it is pronounced as an aspirated "l" and not a hard "l". Palhki also means fleet or quick.
             
            Hope that helps.  Glad you asked about fast, I actually added an "n" to the Choctaw word which didn't properly translate.
             
            dud

            --- On Mon, 12/7/09, Ken D. Bueche <kdbueche@yahoo. com> wrote:

            From: Ken D. Bueche <kdbueche@yahoo. com>
            Subject: [indianmilitia] words
            To: "Indian Militia" <indianmilitia@ yahoogroups. com>
            Date: Monday, December 7, 2009, 12:40 PM

             
            I cant find my choctaw or mobilian dictionary.
            Any of yall know where there is one on line to view?
             
            I need the words for
             
            Elk
            Death
            word for killer or slayer or hunter
            stick
            quick or fast
             
            Thanks
            KDB


             


          • moklahuta@att.net
            I thought that Tanampo was the word for bow until guns came along. Then they had to add a qualifier words at the end of the word to differentiate between the
            Message 5 of 10 , Dec 7, 2009
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              I thought that Tanampo was the word for bow until guns came along. Then they had to add a qualifier words at the end of the word to differentiate between the two.
               
              BN
               
               
              -------------- Original message from "Ken D. Bueche" <kdbueche@...>: --------------

               

              Thanks alot dud its been agravatin me. Im ordering two new language books. Mine have disapeared.. .
               
              what about bow?
               
              Reason. I have been working on 3 bambo backed osage bows for my father and brother in law for christmas. They are both big time traditional bow hunters and i am trying to fimd good names for the bows. They have both taken elk and bear among other big game and not from some fenced in caned hunt.
              Thanks
              KD Bueche
               
              anyone with good ideas pop in :)


               


              --- On Mon, 12/7/09, Dudley Toelke <dud@...> wrote:

              From: Dudley Toelke <dud@...>
              Subject: Re: [indianmilitia] words
              To: indianmilitia@ yahoogroups. com
              Date: Monday, December 7, 2009, 5:26 PM

               
              Don't know how I sent the other answer so ignore it. OK, try again.

               
              Wasn't sure about elk but turned out I was right.  I checked these translations against Byington's Dictionary:
               
              Elk-issi chito.  Literally big deer
               
              Death-illi. But can also mean to perish or to loose a bet, among several other meanings.
               
              Killer-ubi. Actually spelled with an "a" underscored with a period "." and pronounced as a long u (can't do it on my computer), as in "tub" or "rub". You see this associated with a warriors name denoting he has killed in war.  It can also be used as murderer.

              Stick-iti tapa.  A small wooden pole but not a war club. War club-iti tapena.

              Fast (as in speed): chali. The "l" has a slash through it that denotes it is pronounced as an aspirated "l" and not a hard "l". Palhki also means fleet or quick.
               
              Hope that helps.  Glad you asked about fast, I actually added an "n" to the Choctaw word which didn't properly translate.
               
              dud

              --- On Mon, 12/7/09, Ken D. Bueche <kdbueche@yahoo. com> wrote:

              From: Ken D. Bueche <kdbueche@yahoo. com>
              Subject: [indianmilitia] words
              To: "Indian Militia" <indianmilitia@ yahoogroups. com>
              Date: Monday, December 7, 2009, 12:40 PM

               
              I cant find my choctaw or mobilian dictionary.
              Any of yall know where there is one on line to view?
               
              I need the words for
               
              Elk
              Death
              word for killer or slayer or hunter
              stick
              quick or fast
               
              Thanks
              KDB


               


            • debra
              Elk isi chito death aiilli, illi, illi atukla, nan illi killer abi, nan abi the a is pronunced as u in tub slay uski chula to slay akkakoli, abi, illichi
              Message 6 of 10 , Dec 7, 2009
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                Elk  isi chito
                 
                death aiilli, illi, illi atukla, nan illi
                 
                killer abi, nan abi   the a is pronunced as u in tub
                slay uski chula
                 
                to slay akkakoli, abi, illichi
                 
                slayer abi, nan abi
                 
                hunter hatak illi achopa, hoyo, ilhpapa, isi abi, nan hoyo, owatta, silhhi
                 
                stick  iti tapa, iti taptua
                 
                quick cheki, palhki, shinimpa, tushpa
                 
                fast (swift) chahli, palhki
                 
                fast (tight) afacha, alhkama
                 
                fast walker chahli
                 
                Thease words all vary slightly depending on how they are used. you can buy a choctaw dictionary from  http://www.choctawnation.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=home   go to the store or ed. dept.
                the bee
                ----- Original Message -----
                Sent: Monday, December 07, 2009 12:40 PM
                Subject: [indianmilitia] words

                 

                I cant find my choctaw or mobilian dictionary.
                Any of yall know where there is one on line to view?
                 
                I need the words for
                 
                Elk
                Death
                word for killer or slayer or hunter
                stick
                quick or fast
                 
                Thanks
                KDB


                 



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              • Ken D. Bueche
                Me to bob but wanted to make sure. There was tanomp and tanompo   ... From: moklahuta@att.net Subject: Re: [indianmilitia] words To:
                Message 7 of 10 , Dec 7, 2009
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                  Me to bob but wanted to make sure.
                  There was tanomp and tanompo

                   


                  --- On Mon, 12/7/09, moklahuta@... <moklahuta@...> wrote:

                  From: moklahuta@... <moklahuta@...>
                  Subject: Re: [indianmilitia] words
                  To: indianmilitia@yahoogroups.com
                  Date: Monday, December 7, 2009, 9:24 PM

                  I thought that Tanampo was the word for bow until guns came along. Then they had to add a qualifier words at the end of the word to differentiate between the two.
                   
                  BN
                   
                   
                  -------------- Original message from "Ken D. Bueche" <kdbueche@...>: --------------

                   
                  Thanks alot dud its been agravatin me. Im ordering two new language books. Mine have disapeared.. .
                   
                  what about bow?
                   
                  Reason. I have been working on 3 bambo backed osage bows for my father and brother in law for christmas. They are both big time traditional bow hunters and i am trying to fimd good names for the bows. They have both taken elk and bear among other big game and not from some fenced in caned hunt.
                  Thanks
                  KD Bueche
                   
                  anyone with good ideas pop in :)


                   


                  --- On Mon, 12/7/09, Dudley Toelke <dud@...> wrote:

                  From: Dudley Toelke <dud@...>
                  Subject: Re: [indianmilitia] words
                  To: indianmilitia@ yahoogroups. com
                  Date: Monday, December 7, 2009, 5:26 PM

                   
                  Don't know how I sent the other answer so ignore it. OK, try again.

                   
                  Wasn't sure about elk but turned out I was right.  I checked these translations against Byington's Dictionary:
                   
                  Elk-issi chito.  Literally big deer
                   
                  Death-illi. But can also mean to perish or to loose a bet, among several other meanings.
                   
                  Killer-ubi. Actually spelled with an "a" underscored with a period "." and pronounced as a long u (can't do it on my computer), as in "tub" or "rub". You see this associated with a warriors name denoting he has killed in war.  It can also be used as murderer.

                  Stick-iti tapa.  A small wooden pole but not a war club. War club-iti tapena.

                  Fast (as in speed): chali. The "l" has a slash through it that denotes it is pronounced as an aspirated "l" and not a hard "l". Palhki also means fleet or quick.
                   
                  Hope that helps.  Glad you asked about fast, I actually added an "n" to the Choctaw word which didn't properly translate.
                   
                  dud

                  --- On Mon, 12/7/09, Ken D. Bueche <kdbueche@yahoo. com> wrote:

                  From: Ken D. Bueche <kdbueche@yahoo. com>
                  Subject: [indianmilitia] words
                  To: "Indian Militia" <indianmilitia@ yahoogroups. com>
                  Date: Monday, December 7, 2009, 12:40 PM

                   
                  I cant find my choctaw or mobilian dictionary.
                  Any of yall know where there is one on line to view?
                   
                  I need the words for
                   
                  Elk
                  Death
                  word for killer or slayer or hunter
                  stick
                  quick or fast
                   
                  Thanks
                  KDB


                   



                • Dudley Toelke
                  Bow:  Tenampo iti.  It used to be just plain tenampo but when they got hold of guns, the gun became a tenampo. So to differentiate at some point, the wooden
                  Message 8 of 10 , Dec 8, 2009
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                    Bow:  Tenampo iti.  It used to be just plain tenampo but when they got hold of guns, the gun became a tenampo. So to differentiate at some point, the wooden bow became tenampo iti; litteral translation-bow wood or wooden bow.
                     
                    dud

                    --- On Mon, 12/7/09, Ken D. Bueche <kdbueche@...> wrote:

                    From: Ken D. Bueche <kdbueche@...>
                    Subject: Re: [indianmilitia] words
                    To: indianmilitia@yahoogroups.com
                    Date: Monday, December 7, 2009, 8:50 PM

                     
                    Thanks alot dud its been agravatin me. Im ordering two new language books. Mine have disapeared.. .
                     
                    what about bow?
                     
                    Reason. I have been working on 3 bambo backed osage bows for my father and brother in law for christmas. They are both big time traditional bow hunters and i am trying to fimd good names for the bows. They have both taken elk and bear among other big game and not from some fenced in caned hunt.
                    Thanks
                    KD Bueche
                     
                    anyone with good ideas pop in :)


                     


                    --- On Mon, 12/7/09, Dudley Toelke <dud@...> wrote:

                    From: Dudley Toelke <dud@...>
                    Subject: Re: [indianmilitia] words
                    To: indianmilitia@ yahoogroups. com
                    Date: Monday, December 7, 2009, 5:26 PM

                     
                    Don't know how I sent the other answer so ignore it. OK, try again.

                     
                    Wasn't sure about elk but turned out I was right.  I checked these translations against Byington's Dictionary:
                     
                    Elk-issi chito.  Literally big deer
                     
                    Death-illi. But can also mean to perish or to loose a bet, among several other meanings.
                     
                    Killer-ubi. Actually spelled with an "a" underscored with a period "." and pronounced as a long u (can't do it on my computer), as in "tub" or "rub". You see this associated with a warriors name denoting he has killed in war.  It can also be used as murderer.

                    Stick-iti tapa.  A small wooden pole but not a war club. War club-iti tapena.

                    Fast (as in speed): chali. The "l" has a slash through it that denotes it is pronounced as an aspirated "l" and not a hard "l". Palhki also means fleet or quick.
                     
                    Hope that helps.  Glad you asked about fast, I actually added an "n" to the Choctaw word which didn't properly translate.
                     
                    dud

                    --- On Mon, 12/7/09, Ken D. Bueche <kdbueche@yahoo. com> wrote:

                    From: Ken D. Bueche <kdbueche@yahoo. com>
                    Subject: [indianmilitia] words
                    To: "Indian Militia" <indianmilitia@ yahoogroups. com>
                    Date: Monday, December 7, 2009, 12:40 PM

                     
                    I cant find my choctaw or mobilian dictionary.
                    Any of yall know where there is one on line to view?
                     
                    I need the words for
                     
                    Elk
                    Death
                    word for killer or slayer or hunter
                    stick
                    quick or fast
                     
                    Thanks
                    KDB


                     


                  • Dudley Toelke
                    Didn t read your reply before I sent mine.   dud ... From: moklahuta@att.net Subject: Re: [indianmilitia] words To:
                    Message 9 of 10 , Dec 8, 2009
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                      Didn't read your reply before I sent mine.
                       
                      dud

                      --- On Mon, 12/7/09, moklahuta@... <moklahuta@...> wrote:

                      From: moklahuta@... <moklahuta@...>
                      Subject: Re: [indianmilitia] words
                      To: indianmilitia@yahoogroups.com
                      Date: Monday, December 7, 2009, 9:24 PM

                      I thought that Tanampo was the word for bow until guns came along. Then they had to add a qualifier words at the end of the word to differentiate between the two.
                       
                      BN
                       
                       
                      -------------- Original message from "Ken D. Bueche" <kdbueche@...>: --------------

                       
                      Thanks alot dud its been agravatin me. Im ordering two new language books. Mine have disapeared.. .
                       
                      what about bow?
                       
                      Reason. I have been working on 3 bambo backed osage bows for my father and brother in law for christmas. They are both big time traditional bow hunters and i am trying to fimd good names for the bows. They have both taken elk and bear among other big game and not from some fenced in caned hunt.
                      Thanks
                      KD Bueche
                       
                      anyone with good ideas pop in :)


                       


                      --- On Mon, 12/7/09, Dudley Toelke <dud@...> wrote:

                      From: Dudley Toelke <dud@...>
                      Subject: Re: [indianmilitia] words
                      To: indianmilitia@ yahoogroups. com
                      Date: Monday, December 7, 2009, 5:26 PM

                       
                      Don't know how I sent the other answer so ignore it. OK, try again.

                       
                      Wasn't sure about elk but turned out I was right.  I checked these translations against Byington's Dictionary:
                       
                      Elk-issi chito.  Literally big deer
                       
                      Death-illi. But can also mean to perish or to loose a bet, among several other meanings.
                       
                      Killer-ubi. Actually spelled with an "a" underscored with a period "." and pronounced as a long u (can't do it on my computer), as in "tub" or "rub". You see this associated with a warriors name denoting he has killed in war.  It can also be used as murderer.

                      Stick-iti tapa.  A small wooden pole but not a war club. War club-iti tapena.

                      Fast (as in speed): chali. The "l" has a slash through it that denotes it is pronounced as an aspirated "l" and not a hard "l". Palhki also means fleet or quick.
                       
                      Hope that helps.  Glad you asked about fast, I actually added an "n" to the Choctaw word which didn't properly translate.
                       
                      dud

                      --- On Mon, 12/7/09, Ken D. Bueche <kdbueche@yahoo. com> wrote:

                      From: Ken D. Bueche <kdbueche@yahoo. com>
                      Subject: [indianmilitia] words
                      To: "Indian Militia" <indianmilitia@ yahoogroups. com>
                      Date: Monday, December 7, 2009, 12:40 PM

                       
                      I cant find my choctaw or mobilian dictionary.
                      Any of yall know where there is one on line to view?
                       
                      I need the words for
                       
                      Elk
                      Death
                      word for killer or slayer or hunter
                      stick
                      quick or fast
                       
                      Thanks
                      KDB


                       


                    • Dudley Toelke
                      On the translation of elk, I think the issi chito came later and superseded the actual word the Choctaw had for elk.  I don t know what the word was. 
                      Message 10 of 10 , Dec 8, 2009
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                        On the translation of elk, I think the issi chito came later and superseded the actual word the Choctaw had for elk.  I don't know what the word was.  However, the Choctaw still carried the collective stories of their movement from the west to the east and would have encountered elk on their trek. However, as the elk became hunted out in the east, the word was lost and just became issi chito.  Since they have individual words for every animal, wild and domestic ( some domestic animal names are combined names or modified names), they must have had one for elk; the translation I have is from Byington.  I know that it is an assumption but it seems that every wild animal had an individual name.  
                         
                        Byington arrived among the Choctaw, as a missionary, in the last part of 1819. He comprised a book on grammar of the Choctaw language and later a dictionary; not published until 1915.  That is why I believe the ancient Choctaw word for elk had passed.  By the time he arrived in Mississippi, the eastern elk was pretty well gone.  However, I really like the dictionary because it still has the translations for powder horn, charger, ramrod and many other words not in general use today and probably nonexistent in the current language. It's better adapted for reenactors.
                         
                        dud

                        --- On Mon, 12/7/09, Ken D. Bueche <kdbueche@...> wrote:

                        From: Ken D. Bueche <kdbueche@...>
                        Subject: Re: [indianmilitia] words
                        To: indianmilitia@yahoogroups.com
                        Date: Monday, December 7, 2009, 10:00 PM

                         
                        Me to bob but wanted to make sure.
                        There was tanomp and tanompo

                         


                        --- On Mon, 12/7/09, moklahuta@att. net <moklahuta@att. net> wrote:

                        From: moklahuta@att. net <moklahuta@att. net>
                        Subject: Re: [indianmilitia] words
                        To: indianmilitia@ yahoogroups. com
                        Date: Monday, December 7, 2009, 9:24 PM

                        I thought that Tanampo was the word for bow until guns came along. Then they had to add a qualifier words at the end of the word to differentiate between the two.
                         
                        BN
                         
                         
                        ------------ -- Original message from "Ken D. Bueche" <kdbueche@yahoo. com>: ------------ --

                         
                        Thanks alot dud its been agravatin me. Im ordering two new language books. Mine have disapeared.. .
                         
                        what about bow?
                         
                        Reason. I have been working on 3 bambo backed osage bows for my father and brother in law for christmas. They are both big time traditional bow hunters and i am trying to fimd good names for the bows. They have both taken elk and bear among other big game and not from some fenced in caned hunt.
                        Thanks
                        KD Bueche
                         
                        anyone with good ideas pop in :)


                         


                        --- On Mon, 12/7/09, Dudley Toelke <dud@...> wrote:

                        From: Dudley Toelke <dud@...>
                        Subject: Re: [indianmilitia] words
                        To: indianmilitia@ yahoogroups. com
                        Date: Monday, December 7, 2009, 5:26 PM

                         
                        Don't know how I sent the other answer so ignore it. OK, try again.

                         
                        Wasn't sure about elk but turned out I was right.  I checked these translations against Byington's Dictionary:
                         
                        Elk-issi chito.  Literally big deer
                         
                        Death-illi. But can also mean to perish or to loose a bet, among several other meanings.
                         
                        Killer-ubi. Actually spelled with an "a" underscored with a period "." and pronounced as a long u (can't do it on my computer), as in "tub" or "rub". You see this associated with a warriors name denoting he has killed in war.  It can also be used as murderer.

                        Stick-iti tapa.  A small wooden pole but not a war club. War club-iti tapena.

                        Fast (as in speed): chali. The "l" has a slash through it that denotes it is pronounced as an aspirated "l" and not a hard "l". Palhki also means fleet or quick.
                         
                        Hope that helps.  Glad you asked about fast, I actually added an "n" to the Choctaw word which didn't properly translate.
                         
                        dud

                        --- On Mon, 12/7/09, Ken D. Bueche <kdbueche@yahoo. com> wrote:

                        From: Ken D. Bueche <kdbueche@yahoo. com>
                        Subject: [indianmilitia] words
                        To: "Indian Militia" <indianmilitia@ yahoogroups. com>
                        Date: Monday, December 7, 2009, 12:40 PM

                         
                        I cant find my choctaw or mobilian dictionary.
                        Any of yall know where there is one on line to view?
                         
                        I need the words for
                         
                        Elk
                        Death
                        word for killer or slayer or hunter
                        stick
                        quick or fast
                         
                        Thanks
                        KDB


                         



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